PlumGaming withholding payments while inquiring into supposed 'bot' play.

[evoid]

I received this from PlumGaming on Sept. 26 :

Dear Player

Sadly the Plum Gaming casino has been subjected to some unscrupulous play by what we believe to be a small number of players.

It has come to our attention that a number of casino bots have been available for some time which not only enable enhanced play on such games as blackjack and jacks or better video poker, but their continued usage, if allowed, could well affect fairness to other, bona fide players.

It has always been made quite clear in our terms and conditions that any enhanced play by external software will not be tolerated on the Plum Gaming site and we now have to undertake an audit over the past few months of all players, not only those whose play is glaringly suspicious.

To that end it has become necessary to check all the hands played by any player who has used primarily the Jacks or Better video poker game within the casino. If you are awaiting a payout having played this game it may take a little longer than usual but please understand that to ensure our ethos of 'fair play for all' we have to make the checks. Unfortunately, as ever, it is a case of the few making problems for the many.

We have contacted a number of casino forums including Casinomeister and the Lotteries and Gaming Authority of Malta, who are our regulators, with a copy of this email and a detailed indication of our preliminary findings.

We would like to assure you that in the event you have been playing fairly and with no external software enhancements you should have nothing to worry about, your funds are safe and any outstanding withdrawal requests will be processed as soon as possible.

If you have any queries about this email please contact us at [email protected].

Yours sincerely

As a player affected by the payout delay, I have already emailed the casino stating that, although I played some JoB videopoker (I played primarily Texas Hold'em Pro), I did so without the use of a bot or any form of software assistance.
The problem is that even though they say players who played fairly should no worry, I cannot help worrying. For instance, I ask myself if this isn't just an excuse to delay/deny payouts. I also ask myself what method they will use to determine who, if anyone, has been using a bot. I remember that one of the high points of the 'pirate' case came when RTG people revealed that
their software cannot track mouse movements. If this is also true of the NetEntertainment software, that leaves as possible telltales : time intervals between clicks (a bot would presumably click at more regular time intervals than a human) and (that's where it gets scary) perfect strategy. It strikes me that these 'bot indicators' are all at least somewhat problematic which is why I believe this whole 'witholding payments during our bot inquiry' thing to be problematic itself.

 

[winbig]

This is ridiculous. For them to assume that a bot will simply play in a patternable fashion just shows that they don't know wtf they're talking about. IF I were to program a bot for the sole purpose of playing casino games for cash, I would certainly program it so that EVERY step is 100% random, including times between clicks. Hell, it might even be worthwhile to throw in a random "double" every now and then for good measure as well as a 'trip to the bathroom' break. Therefore, there would be NO trace that would leave them to believe it wasn't a human playing the game.

 

[vinylweatherman]

I received this from PlumGaming on Sept. 26 :


As a player affected by the payout delay, I have already emailed the casino stating that, although I played some JoB videopoker (I played primarily Texas Hold'em Pro), I did so without the use of a bot or any form of software assistance.
The problem is that even though they say players who played fairly should no worry, I cannot help worrying. For instance, I ask myself if this isn't just an excuse to delay/deny payouts. I also ask myself what method they will use to determine who, if anyone, has been using a bot. I remember that one of the high points of the 'pirate' case came when RTG people revealed that
their software cannot track mouse movements. If this is also true of the NetEntertainment software, that leaves as possible telltales : time intervals between clicks (a bot would presumably click at more regular time intervals than a human) and (that's where it gets scary) perfect strategy. It strikes me that these 'bot indicators' are all at least somewhat problematic which is why I believe this whole 'witholding payments during our bot inquiry' thing to be problematic itself.

VERY scary indeed! It seems they are using this as a reason for a GLOBAL suspension of payments, even though only a few players are thought to be using bots. This is a CASINO, not a POKER site, so there can be NO EFFECT on OTHER PLAYERS unless they have some multi-player games. I do not believe that Jacks or Better is played against another player, and that ONLY leaves the possibility of bot play on a multi-player Blackjack table.

Perfect strategy alone is NOT EVIDENCE of bot play, it can indicate an experienced player who has played the game for a LONG time, OR simply someone who has printed out a strategy table from somewhere, and is using it.

IF they are looking at hand histories as they state, the ONLY indicator they can be looking for is sustained perfect play over a prolonged period, with no "hand stretching" or "piss breaks" interrupting the regular clicking of the controls.
Where the games have a natural house edge, bot play will only be an advantage to THE CASINO, as players will play more, and thus stand to LOSE MORE over the long term, even though perfect play reduces the RATE PER $ of that loss.

Perhaps the casino are now going to use this inquiry as a means to bring about claims of "bonus abuse" against players who used bonuses, and played a bit of Blackjack or VP.

They may never be able to PROVE bot use, yet will seek to confiscate money based on what will probably be a "secret" set of criteria used to determine whether bots were used or not.

 

[RobWin]

I received this from PlumGaming on Sept. 26 :


As a player affected by the payout delay, I have already emailed the casino stating that, although I played some JoB videopoker (I played primarily Texas Hold'em Pro), I did so without the use of a bot or any form of software assistance.
The problem is that even though they say players who played fairly should no worry, I cannot help worrying. For instance, I ask myself if this isn't just an excuse to delay/deny payouts. I also ask myself what method they will use to determine who, if anyone, has been using a bot. I remember that one of the high points of the 'pirate' case came when RTG people revealed that
their software cannot track mouse movements. If this is also true of the NetEntertainment software, that leaves as possible telltales : time intervals between clicks (a bot would presumably click at more regular time intervals than a human) and (that's where it gets scary) perfect strategy. It strikes me that these 'bot indicators' are all at least somewhat problematic which is why I believe this whole 'witholding payments during our bot inquiry' thing to be problematic itself.

Could be a stall tactic I imagine...have you received your payouts in the past in a timely manner ?? This is the first story I have heard about a casino using the "Bot" trump card in quite some time now...

The 'pirate' case...what a classic that was !!

 

[evoid]

They may never be able to PROVE bot use, yet will seek to confiscate money based on what will probably be a "secret" set of criteria used to determine whether bots were used or not.

They say they emailed CasinoMeister with their 'preliminary findings'.
Can this be validated?

 

[winbig]

They say they emailed CasinoMeister with their 'preliminary findings'.
Can this be validated?

If I were you, I'd go ahead and PM Max and/or Bryan to confirm this. It'd be quicker

 

[sdaddy]

I suppose that PlumGaming has every right to enforce a strict policy against "bot" play. But with all the audits and payment delays required, one wonders whether this is a worthwhile use of their time and resources.

The bottom-line is that bots do not do anything to "enhance" the game by lowering the house advantage.

 

[winbig]

The bottom-line is that bots do not do anything to "enhance" the game by lowering the house advantage.

Great point. Every single casino online or off, love when players do NOT play 100% perfect strategy. Why else would offline casinos give you free drinks until you're falling off the stool at a VP machine or at a Blackjack table? Or online casinos, for example, playing blackjack...This is EXACTLY why not one casino (other than 3Dice, sorry for the plug, but it's true) WARNS you when you attempt to hit/double any hand 17 or above. Their bread and butter comes from misclicks, and they love every one of them.

 

[chuchu59]

This is ridiculous. What does the casino mean by saying the use of bots by some will affect bona fide players. Unless the overall payback is fixed at a certain % and the bot users win more resulting in a loss for others, this doesnt make sense at all.

MG has expert mode on both BJ and JOB VP. Wouldnt that be tantamount to having a bot play for you. So why should it not be the same for Netentertainment?

 

[maxd]

They say they emailed CasinoMeister with their 'preliminary findings'.
Can this be validated?

I received an email on this from them over the weekend, haven't yet had time to look into it in detail.

 

[The Dude]

... I remember that one of the high points of the 'pirate' case came when RTG people revealed that
their software cannot track mouse movements. If this is also true of the NetEntertainment software, that leaves as possible telltales : time intervals between clicks (a bot would presumably click at more regular time intervals than a human) and (that's where it gets scary) perfect strategy. It strikes me that these 'bot indicators' are all at least somewhat problematic which is why I believe this whole 'witholding payments during our bot inquiry' thing to be problematic itself.

Actually bot use is easy to detect, and when compared to regular player playing habits, it sticks out like a sore thumb.

I'll check out what they sent to Max.

 

[evoid]

Well, as I said earlier, I believe Plum will need to be transparent about their methodology. People should have a chance to judge for themselves if it's sound.

In the meantime I verified that on the two sessions for which they are withholding my payouts, I played only about 10% JoB (10% of total bet amount, that is) and no blackjack.

According to their email, my payouts shouldn't even be withheld as I haven't played primarily JoB, not by a long shot.

 

[The Dude]

I think what's happening is this website is offering bots for sale (casibot.com), and it lists the casinos and names the games that the bot supports. These casinos are probably scrutinizing the gameplay that these games.

And yes, to answer VWM's query in the Betfair bot thread, Betfair is mentioned as a targeted casino. So bots can be used at Chartwell casinos.

LOL - the FAQ on the bot site doesn't warn it's customers that bot use is strictly prohibited at most casinos.

 

[Slotster!]

The bottom-line is that bots do not do anything to "enhance" the game by lowering the house advantage.

Thank-you.

Casino's clearly don't like it when the 'human element' is removed... Otherwise known as 'tilt'... otherwise known as 'the biggest money makers in the casino'.

I've not a fan/in favour of anything that enhances your play or bots or whatever (what's the point!?? I'm in this for the fun/gambling experience) -- but I can't really see the problem with something like video poker.

Edit:

website is offering bots for sale (casibot.com), and it lists the casinos and names the games that the bot supports. .

They've obviously been busy updating the site too.

 

[vinylweatherman]

I think what's happening is this website is offering bots for sale (casibot.com), and it lists the casinos and names the games that the bot supports. These casinos are probably scrutinizing the gameplay that these games.

And yes, to answer VWM's query in the Betfair bot thread, Betfair is mentioned as a targeted casino. So bots can be used at Chartwell casinos.

LOL - the FAQ on the bot site doesn't warn it's customers that bot use is strictly prohibited at most casinos.

Well, they have certainly moved on since they were "casinorobots.com". The bot is specifically advertised for "bonus bagging" rather than simply making play easier for such things as wagering tournaments. The original bot only worked at Cassava software blackjack (and still does), but has expanded to include RTG and Microgaming, as well as Chartwell. The MG bot targets All Aces VP rather than Blackjack, but this is mis-selling, the VARIANCE is huge at All Aces, and the bot will NOT necessarily yield the expected value listed.
Casino Hold-em is also included, and it seems they have a link to "beatingbonuses.com", making it likely these bots are being widely used - more so than I (and probably many of us) had expected. They are dirt cheap too, $150 for the ultimate, with an advertised "yield" of some 10K, so no wonder they are being snapped up.

Perhaps the targeted casinos have invested $150 in one, taken it apart, and worked out how to detect it. The creators have ALREADY MADE THEIR MONEY, and they are now knocking them out cheaply to get as much as they can because the casinos are on to this, and are detecting them.

They provide a convenient list of targeted casinos, silly really, as if I can read it, so can the operators of said targets. For anyone thinking of bagging boni with this bot, don't bother, IT'S OVER - don't be "sheep", be original.

 

[quber]

This is EXACTLY why not one casino (other than 3Dice, sorry for the plug, but it's true) WARNS you when you attempt to hit/double any hand 17 or above. Their bread and butter comes from misclicks, and they love every one of them.

Chartwell also warn if you try to take a card on 17 or above, including soft hands.

 

[Slotster!]

Do MG not warn you about this? I'm sure I've seen it and I can't think why I would play BJ at another software provider... Maybe I did, but it definitely wouldn't have been 3Dice or Chartwell???

 

[Squish]

Well, they have certainly moved on since they were "casinorobots.com". The bot is specifically advertised for "bonus bagging" rather than simply making play easier for such things as wagering tournaments. The original bot only worked at Cassava software blackjack (and still does), but has expanded to include RTG and Microgaming, as well as Chartwell. The MG bot targets All Aces VP rather than Blackjack, but this is mis-selling, the VARIANCE is huge at All Aces, and the bot will NOT necessarily yield the expected value listed.

Just to clear up a few issues casinorobots and casibot are two completely separate companies/products. Casinorobots was a scam and their products didn't exist/didn't work. Casibot has been going for a long time and has a client base of ~1000 customers (it is widely regarded as the leading bonus hustling bot).

This is not the first time Plum Gaming have tried to ban bot players. Last time it happened they confiscated funds from many players who were not using bots. As a result Plum Gaming has one of the worst reputations of any casino among advantage players and very few bonus hunters will go near it nowadays (that includes those with a bot).

 

[DiamondGeezer]

I last played at Plum about 6 months ago and I had great difficulty in getting paid. I eventually got my money after about a month and it was a real nightmare. Emails were all totally ignored but whenever I would threaten to post on public forums/report to LGA they would pay within 2 hours - but never with a reply! I would advise anyone to avoid this place as they don't appear to be well funded.

 

[maxd]

... Emails were all totally ignored but whenever I would threaten to post on public forums/report to LGA they would pay ....

Unfortunately what you've experienced seems to be "business as usual" with them.

We've handled a number of Plum Gaming complaints over the last few months and it's always the same story: player gets no response from casino, player posts PAB, PAB is submitted to casino, problem solved!

I was hoping that they would see the light and clean up their MO but it doesn't sound like that is happening.

 

[winbig]

Casibot has been going for a long time and has a client base of ~1000 customers (it is widely regarded as the leading bonus hustling bot).

How in the world would you know how big their customer base is??????????????

Apparently you use these "bots," and I hope you realize that casino reps/managers do read this forum, and I'm sure they're paying close attention to this thread.

 

[Squish]

How in the world would you know how big their customer base is??????????????

Apparently you use these "bots," and I hope you realize that casino reps/managers do read this forum, and I'm sure they're paying close attention to this thread.

There is little reason for me to purchase these products as I did all the signups a long time ago. However, I am a regular at Beating Bonuses and this topic is frequently discussed so I am well aware that many people do use this product.

As for the client base - they have a forum which has a member count. The forum is for paying subscribers only. I do not need to be a member to view the count and it is just under 1000.

 

[evoid]

I hadn't realized Plum had such a bad rep. I am usually careful where I play and I had been successful so far in avoiding problems. I thought all Net Entertainment casinos could be trusted.

I think it's time I pitch a bitch.

 

[maxd]

PAB received.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Just to clear up a few issues casinorobots and casibot are two completely separate companies/products. Casinorobots was a scam and their products didn't exist/didn't work. Casibot has been going for a long time and has a client base of ~1000 customers (it is widely regarded as the leading bonus hustling bot).

This is not the first time Plum Gaming have tried to ban bot players. Last time it happened they confiscated funds from many players who were not using bots. As a result Plum Gaming has one of the worst reputations of any casino among advantage players and very few bonus hunters will go near it nowadays (that includes those with a bot).

The Cassava bot from casinorobots DID work

I didn't use it for hustling a bonus though, but I was interested because of the super high scores suddenly appearing in their regular Blackjack tournaments, with a score based on HANDS played. I couldn't figure out how on earth the leaders were scoring so high, and came upon this free bot. They then went on to giving it away to players who signed up to casinos through them, and this might have been the scam - the bot was the original, and didn't work on the newer Cassava software.

If so many are using the casibot, then there will be many more complaints, as it seems pretty easy to detect because the programming options seem rather simple. All an operator has to do is download it, and try it out on their software, and thus figure out what to look for, and automate it.

The PlumGaming issue looks like a stalling tactic, as they have stopped ALL payments, not just for those accounts requiring investigation. The lack of communication and prompt payment upon threat to go to LGA and arrival of a PAB through Max strengthens my view this is a stalling tactic used to help with a temporary cashflow problem (it could be worse though, trying to trade out of insolvency, paying withdrawals with incoming new deposits but not having the funds to cover the overall risk).

 

[RobWin]

It seems like they have been severely underfunded ever since they first came on the scene as the complaints started coming in as soon as players started playing and cashing out there...

 

[blizeH]

Just a suggestion, but do you guys think it could be a good idea to remove all links (and refences) to the various bot providers? It's probably not a big deal, but I think only bad things can come from it; whether it's random users checking them out, or more importantly, casino reps seeing it and removing their bonuses (so everyone loses out).

Cheers

 

[Bindiana_Jones]

This seems like just another excuse to try to slow play players to me. I played at them a while back and they ended up taking months to pay.

I'm glad I never got tempted back with all the offers they've been emailing me.

Also just been reading over their terms and can't see anywere where they say 'bot' play isn't allowed:
Link Removed ( Old/Invalid)

Surely they can't just decide to refuse to pay players that have used bots when they don't dissalow it in their terms?

 

[evoid]

Bindy Jones, you got me confused for a minute because last night I asked myself the same question and checked this really quickly and I found , without surprise, a part of their terms where they disallow bots. After reading your post tonight I checked again and I couldn't find it. I had time to ask myself : 'Why on Earth would they have removed this at this point?' before finally finding the quote from last night. It's here (Link Removed ( Old/Invalid) ), under 'GENERAL POKER RULES'.

I must thank you for bringing forward the point that their terms, as of today, don't even disallow bots for casino play.

 

[homerj]

Just thought i'd chip in with a programming viewpoint on the bots currently on the market.

They all work in the same manner and simply copy an area of the screen where the cards appear and compare the image with a stored version.

This has 2 major faults.

1) Computers are dumb ! a subtle undetectable to the human eye change in the image will confuse the bot. Screen reading is known as OCR (optical character recognition) and is not 100% reliable. check it out on google.

2) They employ no anti-detection code. They are very easy to detect. Anyone who thinks randomising mouse clicks avoids detection but still lists the bot in task manager clearly has no idea what they are talking about. Its only a matter of time before you find casino providers detecting these, they probably already have and are compiling data. And will they alert you ? No they'll just refuse to pay you for cheating.

Bots are good long term for the bonus hunters. Bots attract mainly multi accounters who play for bonuses for 24hrs a day. Get rid of these and bonuses will return.

 

[Przecinek]

I don't belive in their "Bot" excuse - it's just another attempt to justify longer and longer delays in payment.

Some time ago I have requested a withdrawal from Plum, and had to wait for ages. Only after complaining on CM forum did I get my winnings credited.

 

[thelawnet]

Just thought i'd chip in with a programming viewpoint on the bots currently on the market.

They all work in the same manner and simply copy an area of the screen where the cards appear and compare the image with a stored version.

How would you know?

This has 2 major faults.

1) Computers are dumb ! a subtle undetectable to the human eye change in the image will confuse the bot. Screen reading is known as OCR (optical character recognition) and is not 100% reliable. check it out on google.

What you are describing is not OCR, it is just comparing pixels in images.

OCR actually attempts to recognise a collection of pixels as a letter or number. OCR is more sophisticated and more computationally intensive than just pixel comparison, whereas the latter would be defeated by changing the font, the former would not.

The bottom line, to actually defeat a computer, the only reliable technique is to use a captcha, i.e. one of those very difficult to read images with lots of dots or squiggly lines over it. This is obviously a non-starter, as it would put off the existing players.

The other approach would be to try and mimic MMO games, and make the game much more 'invasive' of the user's sytem, but again, this is counterproductive.

2) They employ no anti-detection code. They are very easy to detect. Anyone who thinks randomising mouse clicks avoids detection but still lists the bot in task manager clearly has no idea what they are talking about. Its only a matter of time before you find casino providers detecting these, they probably already have and are compiling data. And will they alert you ? No they'll just refuse to pay you for cheating.

How is a casino running inside a sandbox in an Internet Explorer window going to check what processes are running? Besides which the bots could be camoflagued if need be, much like a virus would be, disguised as system process or something like that.

 

[homerj]

A simple screen read and copy is not sufficient. I was merely explaining the screen reading principle. All of the major software providers require some degree of OCR due to frequent software updates which would make static bots constantly in need of updates.

I have reverse engineered the popular bots on sale and confirmed they all take screen shots - this is very easy to identify and detect.

I agree that bots can be obscured like virus's but the bots currently on sale do not use these techniques, nor even claim to do so !

I'd be careful if relying on a sandbox for protection. their aim is to protect from malicious updates of info but reads are normally permitted otherwise functionality would be lost.

Interesting article :

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

 

[Squish]

I am not a computer/programming expert such as yourself. If as you say this method is "not 100% reliable" then I don't see why there is a problem. I thought the claim was that they "enhanced play" rather than "pissed money away too quickly". This would make Plum Gaming's complaint sound even more like a money-snatching attempt.

Also, surely any other method would be prone to similar flaws. The two I have heard of are intercepting packets and hunting in memory. Ignoring the fact that both of these are probably illegal in a gambling context, what would happen if I encoded the ace of clubs as Kh? Same problem except this time the bot would have no hope of telling.

 

[homerj]

For me the main issues are :

Casino software providers will always want to ban bot users. They will always want to stop something that claims an advantage even if that is spurious. They make the rules, this is not negotiable.

Casino software can employ a number of techniques to identify bots

Current bots on the market take no precautions to avoid detection

Current bots employ techniques which are not reliable while claiming they are (OCR)

if you've paid for a bot offering no defence along with 1000 other people expect to get banned at some point

 

[evoid]

On October 9, I received the following message :

Dear Player

Just a quick email to thank you for your continued patience and understanding during this security procedure.

We have almost completed the process now and okayed and paid out to just short of 200 accounts. We only have a few more left and we hope to have everything resolved within the next 10 days.

If you are still awaiting a payout we understand that your patience may well be wearing thin but we are moving as fast as we can.

Once again, thank you very much.

Kind regards

THE PLUM GAMING TEAM

It's been twelve days now and I haven't heard any more from them. This is dragging...

 

[maxd]

... I haven't heard any more from them. This is dragging...

I don't think anyone has. We're all waiting for them to finish whatever it is they have to do and return to doing business.

 

[evoid]

I emailed Plum for an update. They replied that unfortunately my account is among those about which they still have 'reservations'. I hope this isn't retribution for having posted here. They said they'll have either paid me or explained why not in seven days.

In the light of this I requested them to email me my full detailed Play History for the dates concerned but they haven't replied to that.

I will email them again, asking them to send my play history to Max.
I am confident that my play history is evidence that I haven't used a bot.

I believe that I am entitled to my full detailed play history and that an inquiry cannot be fair unless my play history is submitted for review.

 

[maxd]

IMO, it's time for Plum to wrap up their "investigation" and start addressing these outstanding issues. These have dragged on for well over a month now and that's enough to test anyone's patience.

(Sorry, just assumed that others knew: there are several PABs backed up pending their "investigation". None of these have moved in weeks.)

 

[evoid]

I just spoke on the phone with Net Entertainement's CEO assistant, Oscar Lundquist.

He seemed to take interest in the matter. He promised to refer the case to the person in charge of Plum Gaming. I told him that I initially felt safe playing at Plum because in my mind NetEnt implies a fair gaming experience. He seemed to value the importance of maintaining Netentertainment's good track record.

If Netentertainment can help this inquiry process to be fair and square, they will have done all that is needed for me to get paid.

I gave Oscar my contact details as well as a link to this thread, so that they can get a better feel of what is at stake, from other points of view than my own.

 

[Pinababy69]

If I'm not mistaken, NetEntertainment (the software provider itself), has recently been given eCOGRA certification. Should the PAB process fail, it would be well worth your while to file a formal complaint with them.

At the very least, NetEnt will be compelled to provide you (and eCOGRA) with the game logs which you have requested.

Another one to watch for me.....as I'm curious what route eCOGRA will take on this one.

Edited to add link to relevant eCOGRA thread:

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/ecogra-accreditation-for-netentertainment.27482/

 

[maxd]

I just spoke on the phone with Net Entertainement's CEO assistant, Oscar Lundquist.

Good on ya! Excellent initiative there!

Should the PAB process fail, it would be well worth your while to file a formal complaint with them.

Quite so, but there's no reason to fear at this point. Plum has put every PAB I have filed with them over the last month or six weeks on hold pending their 'investigation'. I think we've got three or four of them backed up now.

 

[Pinababy69]

Quite so, but there's no reason to fear at this point. Plum has put every PAB I have filed with them over the last month or six weeks on hold pending their 'investigation'. I think we've got three or four of them backed up now.

Fair enough Max, not trying to butt in. I just wanted to provide another route for the OP should your efforts not prove fruitful.

 

[maxd]

... not trying to butt in. I just wanted to provide another route for the OP ....

No worries, didn't see any problem at all with the eCOGRA mention. As you say, good for the OP to know.

 

[evoid]

Plum emailed me to say they are making arrangements to pay my two pending withdrawals in full. They requested my bank information in order to set up a bank transfer.

They made no mention of the inquiry.

I will update when I receive the money.

 

[winbig]

Plum emailed me to say they are making arrangements to pay my two pending withdrawals in full. They requested my bank information in order to set up a bank transfer.

They made no mention of the inquiry.

I will update when I receive the money.

wow, not even a "we're sorry" from them for falsely accusing you? That would definitely seal the deal if it were me - that they'd never see another penny from me again.

Thanks for the update, and glad you're getting paid!

 

[evoid]

By saying, after many weeks of inquiry, that they still had reservations about my account, they were getting scarily close of a clear cut accusation, but they never went that far.

Still, I agree that a simple word of excuse would have been appropriate.

That said, I can confirm that I am now paid in full!

Thanks to everyone for their support.

 

[maxd]

FWIW, it sounds like you were lucky. There are other outstanding issues that they have not moved on in spite of claiming having done so.

 

[evoid]

I just realized that I haven't heard a peep from the good people at NetEntertainment either. Perhaps they learned that I had gotten paid and didn't feel the need to follow up on it. Perhaps it's their involvement that got me paid. Or perhaps they just never cared enough to move finger. Sadly I can't tell and I'm not curious enough to invest more time and energy into trying to find out.

Any new development with the other PaBs?

 

[maxd]

Any new development with the other PaBs?

Some yes, some no. I'm still not convinced these guys are taking their responsibilities seriously, at least not insofar as the players are concerned.

Later: To be fair I should mention that they've promised payment on some of these issues by the end of the week.