slotocash voided 12,400 win

[LaHutti]

This is not the same complaint, and in my opinion, the complaint at Gambling Grumbles is far worse as there no rules were broke but sloto is applying the spirit of the bonus to a player who deposited $400, took 400% then (according to sloto, not the OP) bet the max of $50 on a slot (still only 3% of the bonus), hit big, then bet the max on 20 line games and "grinded it out" at $20 per spin and is having his money confiscated. Not only was he within the rules completely, but the "advantage play" element is extremely doubtful as well.

Yes, no one is taking sloto to task on that one, but slamming sloto for a case where the rules were clearly broken.

So if you bet big .... in one case big is 6.75 ... you're wrong, and won't get paid, and if you bet low ... in this case $20 you're also wrong, and "grinding"... wow, I wish I could "grind" at $20 a pop....LOL
This is all complete and utter bs in my opinion, and only a matter of Sloto not wanting to pay winnings.... and other players SHOULD be warned about outfits like this, the more the better.

 

[Nifty29]

So if you bet big .... in one case big is 6.75 ... you're wrong, and won't get paid, and if you bet low ... in this case $20 you're also wrong, and "grinding"... wow, I wish I could "grind" at $20 a pop....LOL
This is all complete and utter bs in my opinion, and only a matter of Sloto not wanting to pay winnings.... and other players SHOULD be warned about outfits like this, the more the better.

Please provide examples of players who were denied winnings even though no.terms were broken. The one at grumbling grumbles can't be counted because we dont know the full story...that MAY be a case of spirit of the bonus and therefore would be one such example.

Good luck with finding the others.

It would also be interesting to start a thread asking.if members have ever had winnings confiscated...by whom and why. You will find its not a common occurrence for the average player.

Follow the rules and you'll get paid. It's pretty simple really.

 

[Przecinek]

I have to agree that having to refrain yourself from expressing empathy towards someone who had thought they have won 12.000 seems a bit strange.

In the last few years, I can see less and less polite comments from different posters towards people who inadvertently broke the terms.
More and more often they're along the lines "You're still here?", "Give it a break already", "what part of t&c you don't get" etc...

Not sure what amounts of money this (seemingly) professional player operates with, but if I had won a random jackpot (never happed yet) and then made a mistake that would cost me all of it I'd be depressed for at least a month, and would probably contemplate quitting online gambling altogether.

The case is closed anyway, and OP doesn't have a leg to stand on - so this is a general remark. I'm not aiming at anyone in particular, so if anyone feels offended I guess it's a case of - "if the cap fits wear it", and those people should take a more tactful approach/attitude.

 

[slotjunkie]

I have to agree that having to refrain yourself from expressing empathy towards someone who had thought they have won 12.000 seems a bit strange.

In the last few years, I can see less and less polite comments from different posters towards people who inadvertently broke the terms.
More and more often they're along the lines "You're still here?", "Give it a break already", "what part of t&c you don't get" etc...

Not sure what amounts of money this (seemingly) professional player operates with, but if I had won a random jackpot (never happed yet) and then made a mistake that would cost me all of it I'd be depressed for at least a month, and would probably contemplate quitting online gambling altogether.

The case is closed anyway, and OP doesn't have a leg to stand on - so this is a general remark. I'm not aiming at anyone in particular, so if anyone feels offended I guess it's a case of - "if the cap fits wear it", and those people should take a more tactful approach/attitude.

No human should be talked to like they are a piece of garbage regardless of the situation. Even if they have clearly committed fraud, yes I said it. Their actions will catch up to them and they will get what they deserve.
There is entirely too much judgement of people on this forum. Who they h*ll gave some of you the right in your mind to talk to another human in such demeaning and degrading ways.
How about taping a mirror on the screen of your laptop/pc, so you can take a look at yourself and especially before you start typing ugly words towards another.

 

[funeral979]

Not sure if this has been brought up yet, but what happened to the winnings from the random jackpot?

Were the funds replaced? Did the office have a pizza party?

Im sure the public would like to know since many have contributed to this jackpot....

 

[Nifty29]

No human should be talked to like they are a piece of garbage regardless of the situation. Even if they have clearly committed fraud, yes I said it. Their actions will catch up to them and they will get what they deserve.
There is entirely too much judgement of people on this forum. Who they h*ll gave some of you the right in your mind to talk to another human in such demeaning and degrading ways.
How about taping a mirror on the screen of your laptop/pc, so you can take a look at yourself and especially before you start typing ugly words towards another.

You mean like you're doing right now? If I want a sermon I'll go to church.

I didn't see anyone "degrading" or "demeaning" the OP here. Could you provide some examples please?

I can certainly understand some members being pissed at the OP though, given they found it "difficult to recall the facts" (for want of a better phrase that we have been asked not to use)

Not sure if this has been brought up yet, but what happened to the winnings from the random jackpot?

Were the funds replaced? Did the office have a pizza party?

Im sure the public would like to know since many have contributed to this jackpot....

Good question.

It should be answered.

If the RJ was not replaced, then we have an entirely different situation in which Sloto's integrity would be brought into question.

 

[chuchu59]

Not sure if this has been brought up yet, but what happened to the winnings from the random jackpot?

Were the funds replaced? Did the office have a pizza party?

Im sure the public would like to know since many have contributed to this jackpot....

Ms Sloto should be monitoring this thread so I expect her to provide us with an answer pretty soon.

 

[slotjunkie]

You mean like you're doing right now? If I want a sermon I'll go to church.

I didn't see anyone "degrading" or "demeaning" the OP here. Could you provide some examples please?

I can certainly understand some members being pissed at the OP though, given they found it "difficult to recall the facts" (for want of a better phrase that we have been asked not to use)




Good question.

It should be answered.

If the RJ was not replaced, then we have an entirely different situation in which Sloto's integrity would be brought into question.

You can call it what you want, it doesn't matter to me, nor do you.

Perhaps this is precisely where you need to be

 

[Nifty29]

You can call it what you want, it doesn't matter to me, nor do you.

Perhaps this is precisely where you need to be

If I could find a church where the congregation didn't pontificate to others about how they should live their lives, I probably would. I've yet to find one.

I know where I need to be, and it isn't amongst a group of hypocrites.

 

[chuchu59]

C'mon the two of you. I dont want this thread to be closed before ms sloto answers funeral's question.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Not sure if this has been brought up yet, but what happened to the winnings from the random jackpot?

Were the funds replaced? Did the office have a pizza party?

Im sure the public would like to know since many have contributed to this jackpot....

I was wondering this, and was going to bring it up now that it appears Sloto have made their decision final in this case.

We don't need a reply, just a player with a Sloto account who can open the game in question and take a reading of the current RJ level. 12K doesn't grow overnight. The only other piece of information we need was when the OP hit the 12K RJ.

These RJs are casino specific, so only other Sloto players would have contributed. They will also have a seed supplied by the casino, which would not need to be returned as it has already been replaced when the RJ reset after the hit. If the seed was the standard 1K, it means only 11.4K needs returning, not the full 12.4K. If a higher seed is used (Rushmore for example use 5K, and have very large RJ totals), less needs to be returned.

Take too long, and it will hit again, and then it gets more complicated because that player should have hit an amount including the confiscated earlier pool.

This matter could quickly overtake the discussion over the confiscation of the OP's win, and have almost ALL players in agreement that Sloto should be replacing the RJ as soon as possible.

 

[Nifty29]

C'mon the two of you. I dont want this thread to be closed before ms sloto answers funeral's question.

Fair enough. . Sorry for the derail.

Has anyone pmed ms sloto re the question?

 

[Slotster!]

This latest development/question sort of illustrates my point perfectly.

A proper outfit would have contingency/process in place to deal with this. Appropriate and proper procedure would be followed and there would be no room (or time) for debate.

It's like the sort of emailed logs and the judgement call and the lack of transparency with the rest of it.

Regardless of whether or not Slotocash decide to put the money back in (which they clearly will unless they have properly lost the plot and/or are about to go tits up) - why hasn't it either a) Happened already or b) There been sufficient explanation of the process that is invoked under these circumstances?

 

[Nifty29]

This latest development/question sort of illustrates my point perfectly.

A proper outfit would have contingency/process in place to deal with this. Appropriate and proper procedure would be followed and there would be no room (or time) for debate.

It's like the sort of emailed logs and the judgement call and the lack of transparency with the rest of it.

Regardless of whether or not Slotocash decide to put the money back in (which they clearly will unless they have properly lost the plot and/or are about to go tits up) - why hasn't it either a) Happened already or b) There been sufficient explanation of the process that is invoked under these circumstances?

I don't understand this obsession with the incorrect log thing. Assuming that they would have to run a query in their database to get the info, they could well have typed the query incorrectly and therefore received the wrong information.

I haven't seen anyone raise an objection to the actual content of the correct logs posted, so what's the issue? If they wanted to pull the wool over everyone's eyes they would have just made them up in the first place or refused to provide them to anyone except via the PAB process. It's also interesting to note that the OP seems unwilling to submit a (free) PAB. I find that very odd indeed.

 

[Slotster!]

I don't understand this obsession with the incorrect log thing. Assuming that they would have to run a query in their database to get the info, they could well have typed the query incorrectly and therefore received the wrong information.

I haven't seen anyone raise an objection to the actual content of the correct logs posted, so what's the issue? If they wanted to pull the wool over everyone's eyes they would have just made them up in the first place or refused to provide them to anyone except via the PAB process. It's also interesting to note that the OP seems unwilling to submit a (free) PAB. I find that very odd indeed.

It's not an obsession, it's important. In conjunction with everything else - it contributes to a whole picture that doesn't look very good.

Firstly, the fact that you can't get that information automatically from RTG casinos is shocking and dubious to say the least, no wonder they have such a bad reputation and are hosts of so many rogues. Like I said up there though - if I was a casino about to deny someone just over $12k with absolute proof - why on earth wouldn't they provide the information they've based their decision on immediately? See, the thing is, they denied the withdrawal - so they must have had access to the information at that point for the story to stack up. They didn't though. Some time later, they sent something different and then something again.

So they either based their decision on the wrong information or intentionally withheld it from the player for a period of time.

Why?

 

[Nifty29]

It's not an obsession, it's important. In conjunction with everything else - it contributes to a whole picture that doesn't look very good.

Firstly, the fact that you can't get that information automatically from RTG casinos is shocking and dubious to say the least, no wonder they have such a bad reputation and are hosts of so many rogues. Like I said up there though - if I was a casino about to deny someone just over $12k with absolute proof - why on earth wouldn't they provide the information they've based their decision on immediately? See, the thing is, they denied the withdrawal - so they must have had access to the information at that point for the story to stack up. They didn't though. Some time later, they sent something different and then something again.

So they either based their decision on the wrong information or intentionally withheld it from the player for a period of time.

Why?

My understanding is that either report shows the same thing....the player broke the rule.

So, the whole discussion is pointless.

People are just using this ridiculously minute detail to make the casino look bad, and the player seem better. Deflecting attention away from the basic facts is a common.practice employed when someone cannot dispute those facts. It's the old "us vs them",with them being the "big bad casino", and the same people back the player almost every time regardless of what they did. People have accused me of the opposite in the past, but have ended up looking pretty silly when actually checking my posting history.

 

[Slotster!]

My understanding is that either report shows the same thing....the player broke the rule.

So, the whole discussion is pointless.

People are just using this ridiculously minute detail to make the casino look bad, and the player seem better. Deflecting attention away from the basic facts is a common.practice employed when someone cannot dispute those facts. It's the old "us vs them",with them being the "big bad casino", and the same people back the player every time regardless of what they did. People have accused me of the opposite in the past, but have ended up looking pretty silly when actually checking my posting history.

Ha ha! Ridiculous. Give me strength!!!

It's not big bad casino versus anyone, and the same people don't back the player every time - and it IS concentrating on the facts as we know them.

Come off it, you can't just keep ignoring salient points and sticking to an agenda.

Just park the fact that the player broke the rules for a minute - does that make all the rest of the behaviour from the casino ok? Should we not talk about it? Should the way rule breaking/dispute resolution is dealt with by a casino not form a valid part of how they are perceived in the future?

Incidentally, from an actual perspective, I could dispute that the player broke the rules because we don't actually know -- and I personally believe the source to be less than trustworthy in this instance (not the rep before anyone gets on their high horse, the manner and method in which the 'proof' has been delivered and the subsequent silence). HOWEVER, I also don't know anything about the OP as it goes, so I don't neccesarily trust them either. See?

That's just opinion though.

Here is an actual, undeniable, proveable fact seeing as that's what you asked for but conveniently skipped over in the previous post:

"they denied the withdrawal - so they must have had access to the information at that point for the story to stack up. They didn't though."

Why?

 

[Nifty29]

Ha ha! Ridiculous. Give me strength!!!

It's not big bad casino versus anyone, and the same people don't back the player every time - and it IS concentrating on the facts as we know them.

Come off it, you can't just keep ignoring salient points and sticking to an agenda.

Just park the fact that the player broke the rules for a minute - does that make all the rest of the behaviour from the casino ok? Should we not talk about it? Should the way rule breaking/dispute resolution is dealt with by a casino not form a valid part of how they are perceived in the future?

Incidentally, from an actual perspective, I could dispute that the player broke the rules because we don't actually know -- and I personally believe the source to be less than trustworthy in this instance (not the rep before anyone gets on their high horse, the manner and method in which the 'proof' has been delivered and the subsequent silence). HOWEVER, I also don't know anything about the OP as it goes, so I don't neccesarily trust them either. See?

That's just opinion though.

Here is an actual, undeniable, proveable fact seeing as that's what you asked for but conveniently skipped over in the previous post:

"they denied the withdrawal - so they must have had access to the information at that point for the story to stack up. They didn't though."

Why?

I didn't realize you had access to the casino backend and have spoken to the cashiers about how they audit playlogs and cashins. You must have, as there's no way you would know WHAT information they based their report on at the time. Perhaps they have auditing processes that are all onscreen and/or only report suspicious play? The rep would most likely have requested the information from others rather than get it themselves, so it is very likely that these people handed her the wrong stats/report, or that one of the fields was incorrect etc. To say the first logs were deliberately falsified, which is tantamount to what you're saying, is bordering on libelous.

The cashier obviously used the playlogs to deny the winnings. Just because something different was sent IN ERROR, doesn't change any of the facts. The OP didn't dispute them, so complaining about sending the wrong info is, as I said, pointless and has no bearing on the issue at all.

I think I addressed that point now. Happy?

 

[Slotster!]

You must have, as there's no way you would know WHAT information they based their report on at the time.

True

Perhaps they have auditing processes that are all onscreen and/or only report suspicious play? The rep would most likely have requested the information from others rather than get it themselves, so it is very likely that these people handed her the wrong stats/report, or that one of the fields was incorrect etc.

Yes. Very likely. I agree. So how do we know the information on which $12,400 was denied is correct?

To say the first logs were deliberately falsified, which is tantamount to what you're saying

I'm not. But they could easily have been based on the timeline/process in which they were supplied.

is bordering on libelous.

It isn't.

The cashier obviously used the playlogs to deny the winnings. Just because something different was sent IN ERROR, doesn't change any of the facts.

If they are to be accepted as facts. Which ones?

This is the crux of the matter.

The OP didn't dispute them, so complaining about sending the wrong info is, as I said, pointless and has no bearing on the issue at all.

The poor OP would have no idea. I wouldn't either - I can't remember what I did five minutes ago. Admittedly, this is clearly an RTG issue overall however as opposed to Slotocash specifically.

Ms Sloto is, by their own admission, the casino owner - we're not talking about some far flung support guy needing to work up the chain.

A player is down 12.4K and Slotocash have had a nightmare.

 

[Tengil]

Have seen that some have mentioned the complaint over at Gambling Grumbles, the same at Askgamblers gives a better idea:

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The reply from Slotocash was following:
"Player sets autoplay with $50 a spin on a Very High Variance game from the very first spin, setting the autoplay to stop as soon as a significant win is given. After a big hit, player moves on to lower variance game and sets autoplay with $20 a spin in order to grind out the playthrough.
This clearly demonstrates that player is trying to systematically profit from the casino in a professional sense. Player was employing a strategy to take advantage of promotional money.
Finally, SlotoCash management has become aware of irregular behavior by this player on other RTG casinos. Given the aforementioned facts, SlotoCash reserves the right to void all winnings as per terms 10.8, 10.9, 10.10 and 10.11."


Note that the player says he played with $25 and $20 bets, altough thats irrelevant as they didnt have any max bet restrictions back then.

Also note the bolded terms:

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10.8 If you have not played at the Casino on an individual basis for personal entertainment only (that is, you have played in a professional sense or in concert with other player(s) as part of a club, group, etc.);
10.9 If you are found cheating or if it is determined by the Company that you have employed or made use of a system (including machines, computers, software or other automated systems) designed specifically to defeat the Casino;
10.10 If you have been designated as a bonus abuser, playing no or low-risk strategies in order to withdraw promotional money;
10.11 If the Company should become aware that you have played at any other on-line casino under any of the circumstances set out at 10.1 to 10.10 above

All the classical rogue terms and actions. LOL at term 10.9, he used the softwares own autoplay.

 

[ksech]

Hmmm, suffice it to say, the OP hasn't stepped back in since he posted the correct logs sent by Ms Sloto. He knew what he was doing when he had to reset to 6 lines each time he/she changed games, so the 'I didn't know it reset when I returned from the cashier" excuse doesn't fly. The OP changed games at least 4 times and had to reset the line settings at least 4 times. No sympathy from this corner, sorry. They tried to cheat and got caught. And to say the casino sent bogus logs (would you really want to go through and try to retype all that stuff to change a play log?), is there a possiblity that POSSIBLY someone typed in a wrong keystroke and got a wrong player log on the first try (I think I've already made at least a dozen typos just typing this short post)? To err is human...

Now, for a stupid question, please be kind ...
I thought (somewhere in the back of my jumbled brain) that Random Jackpots were universal throughout the RTG casinos. Meaning if one was hit at one casino, say playing Red Sands, then it was reset at all RTG casinos. I didnt realize each casino had their own RJ for each game? (Feeling a bit stupid and embarrassed for not knowing this)

 

[Slotster!]

Those terms and conditions are hilarious.

Why don't they just change 10.9 to "you must not use a computer when playing at Slotocash" - that way noone gets paid! Wahoooooo!!!

As for

They tried to cheat and got caught.

Oooh... Yes, those damn cheats RAISING the bets (accidentally or otherwise) after they've ALREADY hit a Random Jackpot. I.e - Making sure the casino probably get more of it back than if they'd stuck at $6 or whatever,

SCUM OF THE EARTH!!!

Then there's that other scoundrel that LOWERED the bets to ''grind out" the winnings.

DISGRACEFUL!!!

Lock them up and throw away the key...

Hilarious and tragic.

P.S - "To err is human" - It seems lots of people have sympathy for the casino 'mistake', but none for the player 'mistake'. Bit mean

 

[chuchu59]

Hmmm, suffice it to say, the OP hasn't stepped back in since he posted the correct logs sent by Ms Sloto. He knew what he was doing when he had to reset to 6 lines each time he/she changed games, so the 'I didn't know it reset when I returned from the cashier" excuse doesn't fly. The OP changed games at least 4 times and had to reset the line settings at least 4 times. No sympathy from this corner, sorry. They tried to cheat and got caught. And to say the casino sent bogus logs (would you really want to go through and try to retype all that stuff to change a play log?), is there a possiblity that POSSIBLY someone typed in a wrong keystroke and got a wrong player log on the first try (I think I've already made at least a dozen typos just typing this short post)? To err is human...

Now, for a stupid question, please be kind ...
I thought (somewhere in the back of my jumbled brain) that Random Jackpots were universal throughout the RTG casinos. Meaning if one was hit at one casino, say playing Red Sands, then it was reset at all RTG casinos. I didnt realize each casino had their own RJ for each game? (Feeling a bit stupid and embarrassed for not knowing this)

Now that isnt a stupid question by any stretch of the imagination especially since you havent played for some time and unlike some you werent aiming for the RJs. Progessives are universal I believe throughout RTG casinos.

As for the OP, I think facts speak for themselves. The game logs are here for everyone to see. He is definitely monitoring this thread in the hope that there will be sympathy for his plight and hopefully for someone to spot an error on the casino's part. He himself has nothing more to add in his defence and we are just arguing among ourselves based on pure speculation. IMO we might as well let the thread die though the OP could well come back and present his case if he has something concrete to say. Of course Ms sloto can always chime in on the restoration of the confiscated RJ amount though I expect that as a reputable outfit this should already have been done.

Meanwhile, I just logged into Slotocash and about the only slot that the OP played and had a sizable RJ was Medal Tally at $15K. The others ie T-rex, Red Sands and Wok & Roll had at most a $4K RJ. That doesnt mean anything as there could be other possibilities such as the RJ being restored but was just won by another player.

 

[bpb]

They tried to cheat and got caught.

This is probably the stupidest thing I've read in this thread. Slotster summarizes why.

Nobody can possibly argue that the OP's actions were an attempt to "cheat" anybody.

 

[chuchu59]

This is probably the stupidest thing I've read in this thread. Slotster summarizes why.

Nobody can possibly argue that the OP's actions were an attempt to "cheat" anybody.

While 'cheat' is possibly too strong a word I do not concur with your comment either.Kim, please dont be offended.