Dead or Alive statistics

[Wild Reels]

its all good stuff , just out interest as 0.45 is a common bet, if the game was being true to its rtp how many spins should you get from £200 before busting out, is there a simple formula for calculating it ?

by that i mean for every spin im getting flat out rtp at 96 ish %

 

[kktmd]

its all good stuff , just out interest as 0.45 is a common bet, if the game was being true to its rtp how many spins should you get from £200 before busting out, is there a simple formula for calculating it ?

by that i mean for every spin im getting flat out rtp at 96 ish %

If variance was 0, you would lose 0,45*(1-0,96) each spin:

200/(0,45*0,04)=11.111 spins

EDIT:

(200-0,45)/(0,45*0,04)=11.086 spins, leaving you with 0,43£

 

[kktmd]

Or possibly a graph of all the features, assuming you have logged them in sequence?.

2.292.127 spins. Wins over 200 x bet. X-axis not to scale.

 

[dunover]

I will post my final results in list form soon.

Right, I'm still running this tedious experiment, and sometime this evening should hit my 500k spins. I'm then stopping because the thing's driving me crazy. I have had a couple more good wins since the 200k spins I reported after last time. I am on 485k so should be done around 10pm.

 

[kktmd]

Thats hard work when you have to do it manually! Do your stats look similar?

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Right, I'm still running this tedious experiment, and sometime this evening should hit my 500k spins. I'm then stopping because the thing's driving me crazy. I have had a couple more good wins since the 200k spins I reported after last time. I am on 485k so should be done around 10pm.

Bloody hell man you've got far more determination than me, I burned out around the 175K mark, never once hit the full line of wilds in free spins, which given kktmd's numbers is certainly 'very bad luck', but well within the bounds of possibility.

I've gone back to playing non-shit slots for real at other casinos

 

[Wild Reels]

Without derailing the thread from doa, I'm wondering how kktmd did his recording of numbers of spins and wins, the main reason being id like too see some stats for other net ent games, primarily creature from the black lagoon, as I've had some awesome wins in the base game and bonus rounds, but I'm sure 1.5 millions spins might turn up some great info on what it's possible of paying.

 

[dunover]

2.292.127 spins. Wins over 200 x bet. X-axis not to scale.

View attachment 44414

I'm still collating my final figures, but what I will say (and I have just noticed) is that you had the LOWEST proportion of 200+ X wins in your first 500k spins!!! Your graph is similarly bad to my experience; you made up for it later on. The DEPRESSING thing is that most players will never see out 2.2 million spins on the bloody game at any one casino to achieve the 96% RTP, let alone my 500k. Before foil-hat accusations I know there's only 3 experiments, but they ALL show players getting hammered and making up a bit later, as if you are 'buying' the wins or getting a dip on the RTP curve from the start and this doesn't get levelled until later. It's essential on this slot to hit big early - if not you'll be chasing forever.

 

[Balthazar]

Before foil-hat accusations I know there's only 3 experiments, but they ALL show players getting hammered and making up a bit later, as if you are 'buying' the wins or getting a dip on the RTP curve from the start

The slot isn't compensated on a personal level and that's a fact since I hit my 3000x with very little DoA experience and was far ahead on this slot at the time. Other people are ahead too so no, no one is "buying the wins".

If anything, kktmd' stats are the proof that the slot is legit and will find its TRTP over time. I originally had doubts but I'm satisfied with the results.

 

[kktmd]

Free play. Bet: 9 x 1.

x-Axis to scale.

If the network connection is interrupted more than 2 minutes, the balance resets to 500.000. Last reset was at 1.255.826. Since then, its the same game (RTP about 0.98). The last 750k spins, RTP has been about 100%. Brutal period from 1.550.000 to 1.750.000 (no really big wins, RTP about 0.87). Not sure that free play=real play.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Netent slots have always made me feel a bit 'funny', which I realise is the most non-scientific statement in the history of the world and will probably get me a tinfoil hat, but I'm going with it anyway.

I've often wondered how their low variance slots can eat so much cash despite the high RTP and relatively small max wins, Starburst being a good example but there are many others in there as well. (I mean, just about any of their recent output really, where it's damn near impossible to hit more than maybe 300-400x stake.)

I dug out the results of my Starburst experiment (over 300K spins in free play) and in 315,000 spins my biggest single win was 270x stake, and this is on a slot with a 500x stake jackpot, the full screen of BARS. AFAIK in the entire time that slot has been on release, no one's posted a screenshot of the full screen of BARS, I honestly don't think it's on the fucking paytable.

Over at Videoslots I've put maybe 3000-4000 spins through a slot called Ninja Fruits, a low variance slot with a 1000x stake jackpot, in that small number of spins I've hit as big as 462x stake, and over 300x stake a couple of times, with multiple wins in the 200-300x stake category - that's how you design a low variance slot's paytable. Low variance doesn't have to mean 'you can't win', which is how Netent seem to interpret the category.

Looking back over my Starburst records there were multiple blocks of 10,000 spins where it didn't hit over 100x stake. When I increased the stop trigger to 200x stake there was a block of 60,000 SPINS where it didn't hit over 200x stake, that's just awful.

In fact coming back to my original statement, maybe Netent's slots aren't 'funny' in the sense of there being something 'wrong' (i.e. dodgy) with them, but I think their paytables are designed in a most pernicious manner so that players are basically almost never ahead, and are always left chasing a VERY RARE decent hit to even get back to their starting balance, let alone win anything.

For my money something changed after the Evolution/Beach era, arguably Elements was the first slot using the 'new design', and they are intended to do one thing only, destroy players' bankrolls and almost never give them a chance to win, constantly feeding back pitiful multiplies of stake.

Where they do release a slot with decent hit potential (CFTBL being the obvious recent example), the ability for them to deliver horrendous dead patches is damn near scary, and once again it seems to be loaded towards early losses and then chasing much-needed bigger wins to recover.

On top of all that, we've now got this DoA experiment where something is looking fishy between real play and free play, and we're not looking at a statistically insignificant number of spins now either. I still don't understand where rolastan was pulling all those screenshots from, and TBH the number of spins he said he was doing most certainly didn't explain it.

In all honesty I haven't really touched Netent slots in real money play for months now, and apart from their admittedly lovely graphics and sound and music, I can't say I've much missed them. Overall I think I'm happy to leave them on the Chopley's Not Recommended List.

 

[gagamel]

Netent slots have always made me feel a bit 'funny', which I realise is the most non-scientific statement in the history of the world and will probably get me a tinfoil hat, but I'm going with it anyway.

I've often wondered how their low variance slots can eat so much cash despite the high RTP and relatively small max wins, Starburst being a good example but there are many others in there as well. (I mean, just about any of their recent output really, where it's damn near impossible to hit more than maybe 300-400x stake.)

I dug out the results of my Starburst experiment (over 300K spins in free play) and in 315,000 spins my biggest single win was 270x stake, and this is on a slot with a 500x stake jackpot, the full screen of BARS. AFAIK in the entire time that slot has been on release, no one's posted a screenshot of the full screen of BARS, I honestly don't think it's on the fucking paytable.

Over at Videoslots I've put maybe 3000-4000 spins through a slot called Ninja Fruits, a low variance slot with a 1000x stake jackpot, in that small number of spins I've hit as big as 462x stake, and over 300x stake a couple of times, with multiple wins in the 200-300x stake category - that's how you design a low variance slot's paytable. Low variance doesn't have to mean 'you can't win', which is how Netent seem to interpret the category.

Looking back over my Starburst records there were multiple blocks of 10,000 spins where it didn't hit over 100x stake. When I increased the stop trigger to 200x stake there was a block of 60,000 SPINS where it didn't hit over 200x stake, that's just awful.

In fact coming back to my original statement, maybe Netent's slots aren't 'funny' in the sense of there being something 'wrong' (i.e. dodgy) with them, but I think their paytables are designed in a most pernicious manner so that players are basically almost never ahead, and are always left chasing a VERY RARE decent hit to even get back to their starting balance, let alone win anything.

For my money something changed after the Evolution/Beach era, arguably Elements was the first slot using the 'new design', and they are intended to do one thing only, destroy players' bankrolls and almost never give them a chance to win, constantly feeding back pitiful multiplies of stake.

Where they do release a slot with decent hit potential (CFTBL being the obvious recent example), the ability for them to deliver horrendous dead patches is damn near scary, and once again it seems to be loaded towards early losses and then chasing much-needed bigger wins to recover.

On top of all that, we've now got this DoA experiment where something is looking fishy between real play and free play, and we're not looking at a statistically insignificant number of spins now either. I still don't understand where rolastan was pulling all those screenshots from, and TBH the number of spins he said he was doing most certainly didn't explain it.

In all honesty I haven't really touched Netent slots in real money play for months now, and apart from their admittedly lovely graphics and sound and music, I can't say I've much missed them. Overall I think I'm happy to leave them on the Chopley's Not Recommended List.

I have exactly the same game experience with Microgaming slots.
I play mostly DoA, Gonzo and Piggy Riches and my playtime is much better than with any other game provider (MG, PT, IGT,RTG)

Yesterday, for example, I hit 1685x my 0.09 bet. Then I had another good hit and left with 190 (start balance was 31).
Next I tried Piggy with 0.90/bet, went down to 150 and cashed out with 325. This sort of gameplay is typical when I`m playing Netent.
When I look back to the times I only played MG I have to say I can remember only one time I made a good withdrawal with a 30 start deposit. Yesterday played TS (100 deposit, 0.45 bet per spin) and busted in half an hour.

Even when I bust the playtime is longer with Netent. But that is only my experience.

Long story short, Netent is the only platform my RTP is equal or a little better than the TRTP.

 

[dunover]

Netent slots have always made me feel a bit 'funny', which I realise is the most non-scientific statement in the history of the world and will probably get me a tinfoil hat, but I'm going with it anyway.

I've often wondered how their low variance slots can eat so much cash despite the high RTP and relatively small max wins, Starburst being a good example but there are many others in there as well. (I mean, just about any of their recent output really, where it's damn near impossible to hit more than maybe 300-400x stake.)

I dug out the results of my Starburst experiment (over 300K spins in free play) and in 315,000 spins my biggest single win was 270x stake, and this is on a slot with a 500x stake jackpot, the full screen of BARS. AFAIK in the entire time that slot has been on release, no one's posted a screenshot of the full screen of BARS, I honestly don't think it's on the fucking paytable.

Over at Videoslots I've put maybe 3000-4000 spins through a slot called Ninja Fruits, a low variance slot with a 1000x stake jackpot, in that small number of spins I've hit as big as 462x stake, and over 300x stake a couple of times, with multiple wins in the 200-300x stake category - that's how you design a low variance slot's paytable. Low variance doesn't have to mean 'you can't win', which is how Netent seem to interpret the category.

Looking back over my Starburst records there were multiple blocks of 10,000 spins where it didn't hit over 100x stake. When I increased the stop trigger to 200x stake there was a block of 60,000 SPINS where it didn't hit over 200x stake, that's just awful.

In fact coming back to my original statement, maybe Netent's slots aren't 'funny' in the sense of there being something 'wrong' (i.e. dodgy) with them, but I think their paytables are designed in a most pernicious manner so that players are basically almost never ahead, and are always left chasing a VERY RARE decent hit to even get back to their starting balance, let alone win anything.

For my money something changed after the Evolution/Beach era, arguably Elements was the first slot using the 'new design', and they are intended to do one thing only, destroy players' bankrolls and almost never give them a chance to win, constantly feeding back pitiful multiplies of stake.

Where they do release a slot with decent hit potential (CFTBL being the obvious recent example), the ability for them to deliver horrendous dead patches is damn near scary, and once again it seems to be loaded towards early losses and then chasing much-needed bigger wins to recover.

On top of all that, we've now got this DoA experiment where something is looking fishy between real play and free play, and we're not looking at a statistically insignificant number of spins now either. I still don't understand where rolastan was pulling all those screenshots from, and TBH the number of spins he said he was doing most certainly didn't explain it.

In all honesty I haven't really touched Netent slots in real money play for months now, and apart from their admittedly lovely graphics and sound and music, I can't say I've much missed them. Overall I think I'm happy to leave them on the Chopley's Not Recommended List.

That bolded paragraph succinctly sums up my experience of DeadEnt slots. I have not had a profit on ANY Netent-only casino I've ever joined for that reason. You are playing 'catchup' from almost the first spin. If you compare say TSII on MG, yes you can lose too but you get frequent 5-lines of say 10's/9's etc. with a wild paying 10-20 x stake to keep you going as it were, in addition to the annoying fraction-of-a-credit wins such as 3 9's etc. On DeadEnt you seem to get fraction-credit wins with little relief unless lucky enough to hit a 200x + which is rare. The irony is that a supposedly crazy-HV slot like DoA seems to provide more 'ticking-over' wins than the supposedly lower-variance games. I have now closed all my Netent-only sites down bar one.

 

[wobble33]

guys

these stats are all brilliant and thank you. BUT without giving anything away. no way will you ever win at this slot machine flat betting. you have to up your bets at certain stages.

rolastan wins the 5 extra free spins regular. says he flat bets 0.45p at every casino he plays. quite frankly I don't believe a word of it.

you HAVE to have a stratergy to play this slot, and flat betting is definitely not it..if you notice you can go 1k spins without a bonus round, but to compensate that, it gives out 2 or 3 five of a kinds to boost your balance back up.

on the stratergy. your just hoping you hit the 5 extra wilds when you have upped your bet, and not decreased it!

I have played this slot a lot. and on my stratergy I am a lot of money up off it. and this is not 100 casinos, its just 2 -3 casinos I play it at. of course you will bust out a lot of times, but the longer you play it with a bonus, you get the big hit and all your money back and a big % of interest...

good luck all, but NEVER just flat bet this game...

 

[biemme]

you HAVE to have a stratergy to play this slot, and flat betting is definitely not it..if you notice you can go 1k spins without a bonus round, but to compensate that, it gives out 2 or 3 five of a kinds to boost your balance back up.
on the stratergy. your just hoping you hit the 5 extra wilds when you have upped your bet, and not decreased it!
I have played this slot a lot. and on my stratergy I am a lot of money up off it. and this is not 100 casinos, its just 2 -3 casinos I play it at. of course you will bust out a lot of times, but the longer you play it with a bonus, you get the big hit and all your money back and a big % of interest...
good luck all, but NEVER just flat bet this game...

Totally agree with these words (even if i cannot forget the idea of a general compensated pot).
If it's not a secret, supposing a 100€ deposit with a standard 100€ bonus, how many spins do you wait to increase your bet? or do you increase it only sometimes (like following wins in a row when the first small combo appears and for a certain spin number, like 2-3-4-5 spins)?

 

[dunover]

MY FINAL DoA Results 500k spins:

Right, here are my 500k DoA Final Results:

(500k plus or minus about 12 spins for disconnects.)

Total wagered 450k = 500k spins at 0.90.

End balance 421020 = 93.56% RTP

Total Bonus Rounds = 2994 (1 in each 167 spins).

(BTW I am NOT counting the scatter awards in the freespin yields.)

5-scatters twice. First time yielded 343 x stake. Second time 16 x stake.
4-scatters 122 times.

37 bonus rounds paid absolutely zero.

On 13 occasions I had bonus rounds on 2 consecutive spins.
On 1 occasion 3 consecutive bonus rounds which all paid <50x stake.

At NO stage was I ever 'ahead' on the game whereby I could quit with a profit overall.

I had 5 extra spins 61 times.

My highest bonus win was 3271 x stake.
2nd. 2245 X stake.
3rd. 2176 X stake.

Most wilds in view at end of ANY feature = 9.
Quickest time to hit a line of 5 wilds. (3271 x stake 11th. spin of the first 12 spins).

Of the 61 retriggers, 17 yielded 5-wild pay lines.

WIN SPREAD:

19 wins were over 1k x (2 of those achieved WITHOUT a line of 5 wilds).
33 wins were between 500-999 x
241 wins were between 100-499 x
727 wins between 50-99x
1974 wins 0-49 x.

Did NOT hit a line of 5-wilds once in 'normal' play.
Spins taken from start until FIRST Retrigger/1k+ Win 106234
Max spins between 1k x stake or more features - 106,893
Lowest spins between 1k x stake or more features - 7,334
Lowest spins between bonus rounds - 0 (14 occasions)
Most spins between bonus rounds 1213.


SUMMARY - What a load of dog-dirt this game is.

 

[tinybettor]

A bit unrelated but Netent is absolutely driving me NUTS! I'm a lowroller and normally deposit $100-$200 per week but this past week I tilted like crazy and lost 2.5k so betting 0.8-1.2 a spin over multiple deposits at various casinos with and without bonuses. This was all played mainly on SOTS, CFTBL and JATBS. I know it's my fault but I just cannot fathom such bad luck. I just don't know how one can win on this software. I mean I'm sure there are a few winners which the Winners Screenshots thread proves but I'm just not feeling it with these slots. It's miracle if I can even complete 50% of a 40x bonus. I don't what's everyone's experience with Netent but I've never witnessed such a cold run where you get multiple deposits with 30% RTP, average bonuses hitting at ~300 over several thousand spins (most of them paying peanuts), with the rare 100x that might bring you back to starting balance whilst the base game just bleeds you dry. My last deposit was at the AllAustralianCasino playing their 100% welcome bonus. With a generous wagering of only 20x Bonus, what seemed like a an achievable task, was met with the same slow demise of non-paying bonus rounds and empty spins. Needless to say after this frustrating experience I've closed a dozen accounts with a few months break and leaving one open for the odd occasion. I think if and when I ever do decide to take a punt at Netent again, I'll probably stick with DOA, as that seems to be where all the winners are on.

Edit: Or maybe not given my luck and dunover's horrifying stats above.

 

[Greigssy]

A few nights ago I had a weird experience playing Netent slots.

I had £100 start balance and decided to play 50 spins on all the most popular slots betting higher than normal for me, bets £0.90(9 and 15 lines),£1(20 lines and 243ways),£1.25(25 lines).

So 20 different slots in all I played and every one, except South park, I got one or two bonuses within 50 spins. My total bonus rounds was 30 in 3 hours, my biggest win was 50xbet and this was on the base game of CFBL .I never got my balance over £130

I could have played these slots all night and never won anything over 100x bet, never mind 1000x+. That's where Netent its different is to MG and even Playtech ,30 bonus rounds at a high variance slots I would expect to see higher than 100x a few times at least.

 

[dunover]

A few nights ago I had a weird experience playing Netent slots.

I had £100 start balance and decided to play 50 spins on all the most popular slots betting higher than normal for me, bets £0.90(9 and 15 lines),£1(20 lines and 243ways),£1.25(25 lines).

So 20 different slots in all I played and every one, except South park, I got one or two bonuses within 50 spins. My total bonus rounds was 30 in 3 hours, my biggest win was 50xbet and this was on the base game of CFBL .I never got my balance over £130

I could have played these slots all night and never won anything over 100x bet, never mind 1000x+. That's where Netent its different is to MG and even Playtech ,30 bonus rounds at a high variance slots I would expect to see higher than 100x a few times at least.

Yes, that's my experience too, just nothing to get you excited or even optimistic. Flat-profile games. No wonder casinos are springing up with DeadEnt games everywhere, or adding them to their portfolios. They've finally found the holy grail with DeadEnt - slots that actually DO pay 95% but in such a way that almost ensures depositors don't make any substantial withdrawals or profits. I'm done with them as I said. So's Chopley and a few others by the sound of it.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Yes, that's my experience too, just nothing to get you excited or even optimistic. Flat-profile games. No wonder casinos are springing up with DeadEnt games everywhere, or adding them to their portfolios. They've finally found the holy grail with DeadEnt - slots that actually DO pay 95% but in such a way that almost ensures depositors don't make any substantial withdrawals or profits. I'm done with them as I said. So's Chopley and a few others by the sound of it.

You know I'd honestly rather risk my money playing Jackpot Party's slots at 92% RTP than any of Netent's recent garbage at 96% or higher, which is what most of them run at.

 

[wobble33]

Totally agree with these words (even if i cannot forget the idea of a general compensated pot).
If it's not a secret, supposing a 100€ deposit with a standard 100€ bonus, how many spins do you wait to increase your bet? or do you increase it only sometimes (like following wins in a row when the first small combo appears and for a certain spin number, like 2-3-4-5 spins)?

do 50 spins then 25 then 25 and so on... up your bet each time to limit say 0.90p. you will get a lot of dead bonus rounds, but then you will actually get the big one.

just want to hope the big one hits on the increase of your bet.

I understand why the guys have ran many hundred thousands of spins of this game, the betsize is the problem, I could of told you average spins for bonus round etc etc, all slots have a quirk.

immortal romance

when you get wild desire feature, take note each time how many spins you have done to get the scatters or big win after the wild desire feature..
I can almost tell when they coming in, but the same the bonus round might be the terrible one. its the change of stake that determents if you have been lucky and changed it at the right time....

real time gaming...

bonus banned at two sites, and was top vip..

x30wr deposit and bonus, almost impossible to beat. both casinos I won a lot, same formula always the bet size, and hope it is at the right time..anyways guys, good luck on your slotting whatever you do. I just tell you here my formula, and it works for me.

 

[xxshepxx]

I personally think netent slots (especially) doa are questionable.

For the Nordic regeions to be getting so so many large wins, with next to no UK users getting them, I find it strange.

Does it play better if your from a Nordic country?

I've pretty much nearly ruined myself on DOA on o.36p spins, I dont even want to see the slot anymore, Ive banned myself from everywhere I can play it at.

Last Sunday, I played at BGO, had a balance of £50, went for 0.27p spins, left it running untill bank was £0 highest bonus round I got was £3.26 not a sight of 5 wilds.

But I can play it on fun play, and hit decent bonus rounds all the time.

Either way, me and DOA are finished, MAybe it's sour grapes as I havent had a 5 wild hit or even the extra 5 spins before, but I think there is something fishy going on.

 

[Finn]

I made this comment on where the Netent progressive jackpots fall, but this also kinda applies to this, for whatever reason, based on where from Betsson's profits come, huge majority of NetEnt players are Nordic.

2012 geographic regions' share of Betsson's profits from business-to-consumer related activities (includes casino, poker, sportsbook, etc, everything except profits from licensing stuff to other casinos)

81.5% Nordic Countries
16.9% EU, outside of Nordic Region
0.5% Rest of Europe
1.2% Rest of the World

So the pattern of most of Netent jackpots going to Nordic Countries, and occasionally to EU countries outside of Nordic Region, usually Great Britain or Netherlands, and never to any country outside of EU+Norway, that pattern is pretty logical considering these numbers.

 

[aceking123]

ok my real stats which isnt alot but this after over a year & a half of playing at redbet , 32,500 spins played at various stakes from 9p upto £1.80 never any higher than that , scatters in those spins i did get 4 scatters three times paid crap as normal i did get 5 scatters once at 27p bet paid 2500x bet feature rounds over 120

now as for the so called line up i had 5 wilds three times, none of them lined up on a single line even with ten wilds . but the most interesting part as ive played at different stakes im on about 101.2 Rtp% so im not losing )

i can see why people are sniffing around about this slot mine nothing to gone on, but dunovers free play stats are alarming

i do think it plays differently in real games than free play

this is subject to the pool ,but tbh roloastans luck is too common for anyone to hit this often on a video slot which is random , im not knocking the guy good luck to him , but as a few have said it just doesnt seem right

 

[Wild Reels]

ive been hammering the game this year, no idea on number of spins, joining new casinos and taking match up bonuses at 100% or 50% reloads, i wouldnt touch doa without a bonus as it can eat through £100 at 0.45 spins without seeing a 1 bonus round, on the flipside ive has it running in auto spin mode for 10 hours with the same amount (and then bust out)

my rationale being if im going to hit a 1k win ill grind out the wagering somehow on other games, ive had 5 scatters, and 2 - 5 wilds wins, my balance for this year is +2.2k , should have been higher but ive had a blip or two on IR and CFTBL

never changed stake, once you start chasing wins its a downward spiral long term, so 2014 on doa is amazing, but in 2013 i played it alot also and never had the 5 wilds - but some very good wins, but overall i'd estimate doa won in 2013.

Thats why ive taken 2k from neteller and its getting shifted to somewhere safer

 

[Balthazar]

it seems to be loaded towards early losses and then chasing much-needed bigger wins to recover.

That would imply that the slots have some sort of memory. They honestly don't need to do that, they just have to make sure that the RTP is spread the "correct" way. NetEnt has mastered that part in the last year or so; it's like world class mathematicians worked together and came back with the "perfect" paytables after a couple of months.

Their slogan should be "who needs to win when you can have a good time?".

NetEnt must be a real money printing machine for those running multi-platforms casinos. I'd be very interested to see the numbers.

 

[dunover]

That would imply that the slots have some sort of memory. They honestly don't need to do that, they just have to make sure that the RTP is spread the "correct" way. NetEnt has mastered that part in the last year or so; it's like world class mathematicians worked together and came back with the "perfect" paytables after a couple of months.

Their slogan should be "who needs to win when you can have a good time?".

NetEnt must be a real money printing machine for those running multi-platforms casinos. I'd be very interested to see the numbers.

That's almost exactly what I said in another post. Today, but I can't remember which one.

 

[dusky]

Those 500k results are staggering to read dunover thanks for posting them.

So a 5 wild result is about once in every 8000 :O. Shocked to see the highest distance between bonus rounds being 1200+ spins as well.

I can see the attraction with this game and play it myself but those figures are incredible.

 

[Nate]

Having played this game for ages I can put most of your experiences down to the insane variance of this game. There is nothing sinister to be honest.

Some days Im lucky - I get 5 wilds in the first 100 spins, other days I lose tons without even seeing a 100x bet. I suppose its all down to the high and lows of the variance in play.

In any event, i am NOT a fan of the win distribution on NetEnt's newer slots. I would agree that they have mastered the way a slot can suck, low, medium or high variance.

Do yourself a favour and steer clear from CFTBL - You might get lucky on occasion but on quick spin, you will HATE the way it spits out nothing time after time. Most times you will be lucky to get your triggering bet back.

Insane variance and the pays don't match in the slightest.

Nate

 

[Balthazar]

What's with CFTBL? I can't play the slot so I don't know but people are talking like its variance is on par with DoA while the videos and screenshots suggest otherwise.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

That would imply that the slots have some sort of memory. They honestly don't need to do that, they just have to make sure that the RTP is spread the "correct" way. NetEnt has mastered that part in the last year or so; it's like world class mathematicians worked together and came back with the "perfect" paytables after a couple of months.

Sorry Balth maybe I didn't quite word that right, as that's exactly what I'm saying

There are very few medium-big wins on the paytable, so almost inevitably you start to get badly into negative territory right from the start, and you're then left needing one of those rare bigger wins to even get back to your starting position most of the time.

I thrashed CFTBL quite a bit in free play when it was released and it works on exactly that model, far more than you'd expect given the fact it's not insanely high variance or apparently capable of much in the way of mega-hits.

It'll scythe through 200-300x (and more!) of your stake without a sniff of anything decent, then you'll most likely land 150-200x to get a chunk of it back, or even back to your starting position if you're lucky, and then it'll just do the same again, except of course there's no guarantee of the 'recovery' win. I realise all random slots are kind of like that, but Netent really do have it down to a fine art.

You're basically just paying to play a video game with Netent IMO, not a slot that you can have any reasonable expectation of winning on.

 

[Balthazar]

You're basically just paying to play a video game with Netent IMO

That's exactly what it is. Just like MGS' "Max Damage and the Alien Attack".

 

[dunover]

What's with CFTBL? I can't play the slot so I don't know but people are talking like its variance is on par with DoA while the videos and screenshots suggest otherwise.

Put it this way, low-roll both slots, say DoA at 27c and CFTBL at 20c, and see which busts you first from say a 50$ start.....The 'tick over' wins seem far more prolific on DoA.

CFTBL = Creature From The Black Lagoon????

No, Casino F*cking Taking Big Lolly.............

 

[gagamel]

Hello Chopley
I never had such bad experiences with NETENT slots. Mostly I had a big hit in the beginning, sometimes they are streaky as hell and you will lose a lot of money.
But I only play older slots from NETENT like DoA, Piggy Riches and such slots.
Today I tried Starburst for the very first time for more than 75 spins. And I trippled my deposit within 250 spins. I had a megawin or whatever they call a decent win. Just one time, but after hitting I was in good luck.

Maybe you need another gameplay with NETENT slots, like I need maybe another gameplay with MG slots. I`m lucky with NETENT and have a lot of fun.

I don`t believe that these slots have a memory or are rigged.

The NETENT slots where I am ahead are DoA, Gonzo and Piggy Riches. But you are right, it`s hard to win on some other NETENT slots like COTBL, Twinspin and some other new slots. But you have the chance for a decent win with all of them in your first spins.

Dunover told that his RTP with DoA is 93%, that`s great.

My RTP with MG slots in a casino where I was able to make a payout is 88%.

 

[gagamel]

Put it this way, low-roll both slots, say DoA at 27c and CFTBL at 20c, and see which busts you first from say a 50$ start.....The 'tick over' wins seem far more prolific on DoA.

CFTBL = Creature From The Black Lagoon????

No, Casino F*cking Taking Big Lolly.............

With all respect

this is not a DoA or NETENT bashing thread, or am I totally wrong

 

[ChillBill]

I might have missed it (if that's the case sorry) or it hasn't been put forward. DoA and BDBA, which of these two slots are in people's opinion, give a better chance of huge wins, more often? Not unusual for me to play full tilt on BDBA. What's the max bet on DoA?

 

[Balthazar]

Put it this way, low-roll both slots, say DoA at 27c and CFTBL at 20c, and see which busts you first from say a 50$ start.....The 'tick over' wins seem far more prolific on DoA.

That says nothing about the variance though. Games like Starburst or Space Wars can (and usually will) eat your bankroll faster than DoA or Reel Steal. From what I've seen the "big wins" on CFTBL are more in the 100x to 1000x range than in the 1000x to 7000x range.

 

[gagamel]

I prefer DoA because you have the chance to win really big but the dead, and I mean really dead streaks, are not as common as with BDBA. I had with BDBA more than 1500 spins without a trigger and then it payed like, well 20x my bet. I never had this with Doa. Even when I didn`t hit scatters I didn`t lost my money in such a short time.

But that`s my experience.

 

[dunover]

I might have missed it (if that's the case sorry) or it hasn't been put forward. DoA and BDBA, which of these two slots are in people's opinion, give a better chance of huge wins, more often? Not unusual for me to play full tilt on BDBA. What's the max bet on DoA?

I believe DoA is 18.0 per spin. BDBA is usually 22.50. BDBA's max win is 3750 x stake (5 sapphires on freespins with wild) on 22.50 a spin would yield 84375.
DoA has yielded thus far (as far as we are aware on the screenies page) circa 8450 x stake as it's biggest recorded win which would have yielded on 18.0 stake about 152000.
DoA Could theoretically yield about 48000xstake but we haven't seen evidence of anything over 17% of that yet.

DoA seems set to pay frequent 0.2-3 x stake wins, but hard to hit 1k+. BDBA pays less winning spins than DoA but pays mid-range wins of say 5-50x stake far more often. Average freespins yields are better on BDBA usually. BDAB very high variance, DoA insanely high...

 

[dunover]

Hello Chopley
I never had such bad experiences with NETENT slots. Mostly I had a big hit in the beginning, sometimes they are streaky as hell and you will lose a lot of money.
But I only play older slots from NETENT like DoA, Piggy Riches and such slots.
Today I tried Starburst for the very first time for more than 75 spins. And I trippled my deposit within 250 spins. I had a megawin or whatever they call a decent win. Just one time, but after hitting I was in good luck.

Maybe you need another gameplay with NETENT slots, like I need maybe another gameplay with MG slots. I`m lucky with NETENT and have a lot of fun.

I don`t believe that these slots have a memory or are rigged.

The NETENT slots where I am ahead are DoA, Gonzo and Piggy Riches. But you are right, it`s hard to win on some other NETENT slots like COTBL, Twinspin and some other new slots. But you have the chance for a decent win with all of them in your first spins.

Dunover told that his RTP with DoA is 93%, that`s great.

My RTP with MG slots in a casino where I was able to make a payout is 88%.

No, we're not saying you can't make a profit on Netent, but the way the paytables are constructed has resulted in us, over time, observing the fact that it is far easier to redeem a SUB at MG casinos, or to have a profitable deposit. Netent, to paraphrase Chopley, are very frequently 'death by a thousand cuts'. You just don't seem to hit the comfort zone of a quick profit which you can either cash, or use to extend your gameplay.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Excellent summary there dunover.

Personally I much prefer BDBA, for starters it's just a nicer, crisper slot IMO. Decent graphics and sound with no silly frills, and calming music in the background rather than that horrible fucking jangling cowboy mess that DoA assaults your ears with all the time.

The bonus round is much better on BDBA, you can tell you're onto a shitter with DoA once you get past the first few spins with no wilds or few wilds, whereas BDBA can drop a monster in on any single spin.

The variance with BDBA is more sensible, it's very high variance, but not stupid crazy high like DoA is.

I like the way BDBA drops in decent wins on the base game fairly regularly, rather than DoA which is mostly just dead and/or very low paying spins until the bonus round is triggered.

I also like the way BDBA is far more capable of kicking out 'good' bonus rounds without having to rely on a monster.

BDBA isn't perfect, all those extra free spins from the scatters in the bonus round when the bonus round itself is still paying knack all are annoying for sure.

Overall though total no-brainer for me, even though BDBA has the lower RTP of the two slots, it's the one I'd choose to play for real money.

 

[dunover]

Excellent summary there dunover.

Personally I much prefer BDBA, for starters it's just a nicer, crisper slot IMO. Decent graphics and sound with no silly frills, and calming music in the background rather than that horrible fucking jangling cowboy mess that DoA assaults your ears with all the time.

The bonus round is much better on BDBA, you can tell you're onto a shitter with DoA once you get past the first few spins with no wilds or few wilds, whereas BDBA can drop a monster in on any single spin.

The variance with BDBA is more sensible, it's very high variance, but not stupid crazy high like DoA is.

I like the way BDBA drops in decent wins on the base game fairly regularly, rather than DoA which is mostly just dead and/or very low paying spins until the bonus round is triggered.

I also like the way BDBA is far more capable of kicking out 'good' bonus rounds without having to rely on a monster.

BDBA isn't perfect, all those extra free spins from the scatters in the bonus round when the bonus round itself is still paying knack all are annoying for sure.

Overall though total no-brainer for me, even though BDBA has the lower RTP of the two slots, it's the one I'd choose to play for real money.

How true, how true.

 

[gagamel]

No, we're not saying you can't make a profit on Netent, but the way the paytables are constructed has resulted in us, over time, observing the fact that it is far easier to redeem a SUB at MG casinos, or to have a profitable deposit. Netent, to paraphrase Chopley, are very frequently 'death by a thousand cuts'. You just don't seem to hit the comfort zone of a quick profit which you can either cash, or use to extend your gameplay.

I understand your words very well.
But this experience is not mine. I have to say that the paytables works for me. Of course not all the time, but they work. Like for a lot of other players here. Nordic players and of course me
It seems like there is a little crusade in this thread. I hope I`m totally wrong.
I believe in all the guys here playing DoA and have good wins. I also have good wins with DoA and other Netent slots.

 

[Balthazar]

It's funny that you guys talk about that because the BDBA background sounds are very creepy if you pay attention to them. The kind of things I'd wouldn't like to hear if I were schizophrenic!

 

[ChillBill]

to paraphrase Chopley, are very frequently 'death by a thousand cuts'. You just don't seem to hit the comfort zone of a quick profit which you can either cash, or use to extend your gameplay.

I've given Netent a bit of shake but it really comes down to, if luck is with you or not. Though, while the pay-tables aren't anywhere near as horrid as Rival (played scary rich 3 the other day @ $25 per spin, got 5 camcorders and paid $4), I just can't seem to get a break at Netent. Lots of little wins but nothing substantial. Not to cash out mind you but just to increase game play some on the hope I'll hit something worth cashing out.

It's funny that you guys talk about that because the BDBA background sounds are very creepy if you pay attention to them. The kind of things I'd wouldn't like to hear if I were schizophrenic!

Yes those faint, almost inaudible whispers. Very creepy indeed

 

[gagamel]

Dear dunover, dear Chopley
I`m a little bit disappointed now.
DoA is shit, NETENT is shit, the music in DoA is shit, all is shit with this slot and with NETENT.
Why do you play NETENT slots?
If I would be a newbie and would read your statements I would never try these slots because you make us believe something is fishy.
Is that the meaning of a thread called "Dead or Alive statistics"?
I don`t think so.
DoA has a unbelievable high variance. You lost a lot of money in fun play, that`s ok.
But... a lot of people here had winnings with this game.
And I would bet that a lot of gamers here lost money with slots you made some profit with. And I don`t believe that they shout out how bad these providers are.
You made an experiment and it failed for both of you. That`s all, nothing more, nothing less.
I will play DoA and all the other shitty NETENT games further and will avoid all the games I never had luck with.

Thank you for listening.

 

[Balthazar]

Yes those faint, almost inaudible whispers. Very creepy indeed

If I start paying attention to them that's all I hear so I've to turn it off. I'm not sure what they were thinking!

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Then again BDBA does do stuff like this ALL THE TIME

The worst one is the winline that really looks like a winline even on a 9-liner, but isn't. (Paylines 6 and 7 but moving the 1 and 5 stops to upper and bottom, and 2-3-4 down the middle instead of the edges, took me an awful lot of spins to instinctively realise that isn't a paying line.)

 

[ChillBill]

Then again BDBA does do stuff like this ALL THE TIME

The worst one is the winline that really looks like a winline even on a 9-liner, but isn't. (Paylines 6 and 7 but moving the 1 and 5 stops to upper and bottom, and 2-3-4 down the middle instead of the edges, took me an awful lot of spins to instinctively realise that isn't a paying line.)

Try playing max bet and watching as the wild, followed by 2 emeralds hit, another slides past to next line and the last hits either with a wild or another emerald. See that happen multiple x in a session, along with other near misses, at that stake and it's frustrating and very depressing :sob:

But that's gambling on slots for ya!

 

[dunover]

Dear dunover, dear Chopley
I`m a little bit disappointed now.
DoA is shit, NETENT is shit, the music in DoA is shit, all is shit with this slot and with NETENT.
Why do you play NETENT slots?
If I would be a newbie and would read your statements I would never try these slots because you make us believe something is fishy.
Is that the meaning of a thread called "Dead or Alive statistics"?
I don`t think so.
DoA has a unbelievable high variance. You lost a lot of money in fun play, that`s ok.
But... a lot of people here had winnings with this game.
And I would bet that a lot of gamers here lost money with slots you made some profit with. And I don`t believe that they shout out how bad these providers are.
You made an experiment and it failed for both of you. That`s all, nothing more, nothing less.
I will play DoA and all the other shitty NETENT games further and will avoid all the games I never had luck with.

Thank you for listening.

We don't any more. I thought that was clear. Before you go off on one, we've made every effort, along with others, to explain WHY.
We pays our money and takes our choice, the same as you do. One man's meat is another man's poison and all that...