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Royal Vegas doesn't pay

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by mccelik85, Jan 4, 2009.

    Jan 4, 2009
  1. mccelik85

    mccelik85 Banned User

    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Ankara
    Royal Vegas Casino (a member of Fortune Lounge) didn't pay my withdrawal
    (605,05 Euros) to my registered (I made deposit) EcoCard account.After that my casino account has been locked yesterday.

    I asked to them the reason.They said "Your account was locked by the Player Security Company due to discrepancies found on the account."

    After that I asked to them what are those discrepancies and I added "if you want some identity proofs from me,I can send relevant documents to you."

    But they denied to give a detailed information and they said "The nature of the said discrepancies are not available and will not be advised on." You can see that it is a usurpation obviously.

    You can look one of relevant screenshots.

    HELP ME , PLEASE.
     
  2. Jan 4, 2009
  3. catrina m

    catrina m Senior Member PABaccred

    Occupation:
    service
    Location:
    US of A
    Rogue casinos answer only to themselves

    At least you found out with a small deposit,

    hope it works out, good luck

    :edit:

    After looking around this casino is in the accredited list isn't it?
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2009
  4. Jan 4, 2009
  5. jas2587

    jas2587 Ueber Meister

    Occupation:
    none
    Location:
    FL
    Royal Vegas is a part of the Fortune Lounge Group they are not rogue
    why dont you start your own post instead of digging up post that are 2 to 4 yrs old

    just a thought

    Cindy
     
    1 person likes this.
  6. Jan 4, 2009
  7. ainse55

    ainse55 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    homemaker
    Location:
    canada
    FORTUNE LOUNGE

    I too have never had an issue with FL. I am a VIP and have been paid out everytime quickly and hassle free, i most recently won 21,000.00 which i recieved in one day into my moneybookers account. this win wasnt at royal vegas, i havent played there in a while, i do most depositing into vegas palms
     
    1 person likes this.
  8. Jan 4, 2009
  9. jetset

    jetset Ueber Meister CAG

    Occupation:
    Senior Partner, InfoPowa News Service
    Location:
    Earth
    I agree it's confusing when a thread several years old is resurrected without any indication that this is an old issue that may have since been resolved.

    I need to train myself to always look first at the date on these phoenix-posts!
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. Jan 4, 2009
  11. KasinoKing

    KasinoKing WebMeister & Slotaholic.. CAG MM PABnonaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    House-Husband and Casino Advisor
    Location:
    Bexhill on sea, England
    1. Have they said your account is permanently locked - end of story. Or have they indicated that it is closed while they do further investigations?
    You may need to give them a few days.

    2. Once you are sure you have got as far as you can with the people you have already been dealing with, contact the rep at this forum:-
    http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/fortunelounge.html

    3. If it is still not resolved (after a reasonable amount of time), and you are 100% sure you have not broken any of the casino's T&C's, then Pitch a Bitch with Max.

    Good luck.
    KK
     
    1 person likes this.
  12. Jan 4, 2009
  13. KasinoKing

    KasinoKing WebMeister & Slotaholic.. CAG MM PABnonaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    House-Husband and Casino Advisor
    Location:
    Bexhill on sea, England
    You dig up 2 threads; one 2 years old & one 4 years old & make the exact same posts.
    {edit} and I just noticed you started a brand new thread with the same post - that's 3 now!
    You might be new here, but surely you can see that is not a wise thing to do?
    I hope the mods are in a good mood today! :p

    KK
     
    1 person likes this.
  14. Jan 4, 2009
  15. drk

    drk Meister Member

    Occupation:
    atc
    Location:
    rome
    Vip in FL and playing royal vegas since years.

    Always been paid the day after, have been to 2 cruises paid by this group.
    Periodically a vip guy came to pay me a dinner and always have 20 to 40% back on my loss.

    This is no rogue, this is best online... and i play a lot online :p
     
  16. Jan 6, 2009
  17. mccelik85

    mccelik85 Banned User

    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Ankara
    Yes,they said "your account is permanently locked".Yes,I am %100 sure I haven't broken any of the casino's T&C's.
    Also,I am sorry for writing the same post 3 times.I didn't know that was a mistake.
     
  18. Jan 6, 2009
  19. jerrylee

    jerrylee Dormant account

    Occupation:
    policymaker
    Location:
    Playa del Vaquero (I wish)
    may I suggest the OP edit the screen shot covering their username?

    edit: about, "your account is permanently locked"

    My guess? Fraud of some sort, possibly a Turkish fraud group. I dunno what kind, but a new member posting from that country about getting their account locked is mighty suspicious. Turkish players are barred from many casino groups and for good reason.

    and to quote their terms:
    You must register/login in order to see the link.

    1.3. Refusal to Register, Deregistration, Exclusion & Suspension


    1.3.1. We may refuse to register you as a Player or elect to deregister and exclude you or suspend you as a Player from the Casino at any time if we deem that your participation at the Casino is, shall be or has been previously, in anyway fraudulent, illegal or that your participation is or has been abusive or irregular in any way.

    1.3.2. You acknowledge hereby that the Casino is not obliged to give you prior notice of its decision to refuse, deregister or exclude or suspend you, nor to furnish you with any reasons for such decision.
     
  20. Jan 6, 2009
  21. chuchu59

    chuchu59 gambling addict CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    EXECUTIVE
    Location:
    SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
    Interesting. However, the FL group must do better than this to deny winnings. What are the discrepancies mentioned? Multiple accounts? Links with a fraud ring? The fact is the player deposited $20 and cashed out $605 risking his own money in the process. If what he said is true, he also offered identification proof. I have had something similar happening to me with both the FL Group and Riverbelle in the past. They cited identifiers to security risks (something like that) and locked all my accounts. Only after protesting here were the accounts unlocked.

    I agree that certain details should not be divulged especially those related to security issues. However, the casinos should at least give a brief outline on what the problem is. Citing that there are discrepancies certainly does not make the picture any clearer and will only give the player a valid case to pursue.
     
  22. Jan 6, 2009
  23. kauphy

    kauphy Meister Member

    Occupation:
    mom
    Location:
    az
    hi

    yes it is and all of the fl casino r very good i have been playing at these casino for about 6 years and have never had any prombles with them. they always pay on time and when i cash-out i always have my money by ach within 2 days. i,m sure this will be worked out in no time at all. u really should look before calling a casino rogue.
     
  24. Jan 6, 2009
  25. mccelik85

    mccelik85 Banned User

    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Ankara
    This account is my "unique" account at all of Fortune Lounge Group Casinos.
    I have't got multiple accounts.Also I didn't understand be member of a fraud group.I am not a member of any organization or group.On the assumption that what can I do to system.It is not a game playing with people like poker.

    I earned money from system.I think casinos never says anything about it.Because there is no cheating probability.

    Other issue,Turkish players are accepted at Royal Vegas Casino.This casino denied my withdrawal because of discrepancies lie.I can send every proof about my details to them,if they want.Also they denied to say which are these discrepancies.
     
  26. Jan 6, 2009
  27. ether

    ether Banned User

    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Europe
    If the casino accepts players from Turkey, then it has no relevance that the player comes from Turkey.
     
    1 person likes this.
  28. Jan 6, 2009
  29. KasinoKing

    KasinoKing WebMeister & Slotaholic.. CAG MM PABnonaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    House-Husband and Casino Advisor
    Location:
    Bexhill on sea, England
    Thanks for coming back on this. :thumbsup:

    Have you tried step 2 yet?:
    2. Once you are sure you have got as far as you can with the people you have already been dealing with, contact the rep at this forum:-
    http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/fortunelounge.html


    If so, it's time to go to step 3:
    3. If it is still not resolved (after a reasonable amount of time), and you are 100% sure you have not broken any of the casino's T&C's, then Pitch a Bitch with Max.

    Please let us know the outcome, but it is wise for you not to post any personal or anti-casino statements before Max has finished fully investigating this case for you - he hates that!

    Good luck!
    KK
     
  30. Jan 6, 2009
  31. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    This will probably be the "discrepancy" they are quoting. They may have seen a large number of players suddenly appear, all play this very same "system", and attempt to withdraw winnings.

    This "system" may well be against the terms and conditions FOR BONUSES, which specify certain play patterns that are forbidden, ones that often appear as "systems" for beating bonuses.

    If you have not created multiple accounts, nor breached bonus terms where bonuses have been taken (including limitations relating to the group as a whole), it might help to proceed to the next stage of contacting the FL rep, or indeed submitting a PAB.

    It might help if you could give some details on this "system", so that it becomes a matter of public record on a given date, and others can check whether there has indeed been a breach of T & C as they stood on that date should the outcome prove to be confiscation for "bonus abuse" under the general "F U Clause", rather than fraud proper (multiple accounts, fake ID, "stolen" deposit method - which also means ANY deposit that does not come from a source that DIRECTLY belongs to you).
     
  32. Jan 7, 2009
  33. jerrylee

    jerrylee Dormant account

    Occupation:
    policymaker
    Location:
    Playa del Vaquero (I wish)
    so are you saying if a casino accepts UK players, then it has no relevance that the player comes from the UK (if that were the case), despite the UK (and Turkey) being well known in the industry to harbor fraud? I'm telling you guys, there's something fishy with the OP's situation. It would be a shame if the casino were pushed into a corner and blackmailed with this thread into paying out to a fraudster just to save their reputation. It's happened before..
     
  34. Jan 7, 2009
  35. fortunelounge

    fortunelounge I-Gaming Industry Representative

    Occupation:
    Operations Manager
    Location:
    South Africa
    Hi everyone

    Firstly, our best wishes for a fantastic 2009 to all.

    mccelik 85's account was locked due to being part of a syndicate from Turkey.

    Although I am not at liberty to disclose the full details of how this syndicate operates, mccelik85 shares identifiers with these players, he has also not met any playthrough requirements.

    Wim
    VP Operations
    Fortune Lounge
     
    3 people like this.
  36. Jan 7, 2009
  37. chuchu59

    chuchu59 gambling addict CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    EXECUTIVE
    Location:
    SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
    Fair enough and I also understand why it is difficult to explain to the player. However, I encountered the same thing twice at 2 different MG ups and I am a lone gambler with no links whatsoever. It is possible that the detection was loose and that Turkish players with say similar surnames was regarded as being part of a group.

    If we look closer at this, why is the association with a group/syndicate a reason for voiding winnings and/or even confiscation of deposits. What advantage did they have even if they played with bonuses. So if I am linked with player A and then player B does that mean that I am part of a syndicate and just because they both won, I shouldnt.

    Is it possible, without divulging too many personal details, to give an outline as to what constitutes a syndicate and why they are deemed to hold an an unfair advantage over the casinos. Meanwhile, as it is, whether the player had completed the whole playthrough is irrelevant at this stage.
     
    2 people like this.
  38. Jan 7, 2009
  39. fortunelounge

    fortunelounge I-Gaming Industry Representative

    Occupation:
    Operations Manager
    Location:
    South Africa
    Hi chuchu

    Thank you for the post and the relevant questions.

    I think it is important to understand that, for economic reasons in a tough environment, no casino would lock player accounts unless they have very good reason to do so... or if their intention is to deliberately withold payouts to players..... in which case no-one should even be playing with them.

    Most casinos have very stringent security measures in place to protect themselves (and their players) from abuse and fraud. These measures, however, should also be commercial and we, in the majority of cases, still give the player the benefit of doubt. As these processes are often subject to human intervention and decisionmaking it is possible that mistakes could be made and we have always rectified matters where this has occurred. I am pleased to say that these cases are scarce as we have continuously improved and refined our assessment processes in the 10 years+ of our existence to the level where the sophistication eliminates most errors.

    There is also a very good reason why casinos do not divulge all the details regarding why an account is locked as it may educate fraudsters on how to side-step the system.

    When someone is identified as being part of a "syndicate" (as in this case) it is because of a number of issues, including sharing technology identifiers, identical purchase and play patterns, etc, etc. In a good number of cases it actually has nothing to do with the identity of that particular player (we often find that only one or none of the players from a "syndicate" would return verification documents)

    It is also important to note that, although we classify something like this as a "syndicate" we may also be incorrect as it may be the same player opening several accounts with different details. The fact still remains that it is a player / a group of players who attempt to defraud the casino.

    You are right about the fact that the playthrough requirements have nothing to do with the issue. Unfortunately I failed to complete my sentence in which wanted to add the fact that he has not met the playthrough requirements like every other person from that "syndicate".

    Interestingly, only some 3% of players whose accounts are locked actually dispute the locking. All of these cases involve cash-ins. Of the 3% who dispute their locked accounts only 1% will dispute it more than once.

    After more than 10 years, I think the Fortune Lounge Group has proved that we do not withold payments without very good reason and, on occasion where we made mistakes we rectified them as soon as possible.

    I hope this sheds some light within the constraints I have to divulge more details.

    Regards

    Wim
    VP Operations
    Fortune Lounge
     
    12 people like this.

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