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Finsoft/Spielo G2 Games Issue Update?

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Did you seriously think this would be thoroughly pursued by the GRA?

The reaction of the chief regulator over there appeared to me to be one of irritation that this issue had been raised, and rather aggressive pro-operator proclivities.

Looks like another "under the carpet" exercise to me.
 
Forgive me for even thinking of asking the quesiton.

Just a bystander here but maybe a little less tetchiness might be in order?

And, FYI, Bryan has many things on his plate. I'm sure responding to your post is important to him though you may have to accept that it might not be first and foremost of his things to have done in the last FIVE hours. Contemplate the Zenness and give the man a chance:

5855_tibetan_singing_bowl_LRG.webp
 
Did you seriously think this would be thoroughly pursued by the GRA?

The reaction of the chief regulator over there appeared to me to be one of irritation that this issue had been raised, and rather aggressive pro-operator proclivities.

Looks like another "under the carpet" exercise to me.

I don't know enough about the GRA but apparently you didn't. I would have thought an appropriate response from Bryan would have been made since he read the post concerning my question. Forgive me for even thinking of asking the quesiton.

Redbush: he wasn't having a go at you, he was having a go at the GRA ;)
 
My apologies to jetset....apparently I took that the wrong way.

And thank you Mousey. I knew where the original thread was and because of this post

Just another update as promised.

Max and I spoke with Aaron for about an hour on Tuesday during the ICE and pretty much cleared this up. This issue is very complex, and due to the complexities, it will take a while for a complete resolution.

Before Betfred can make any statements, they need to wait for the GRA to review and reply to any statements made by Finsoft. Once the GRA has determined whether or not the software is in compliance with their regulations then Betfred will be able to take further actions. Due diligence is required by everyone involved.

And the player accounts affected will be sorted out once they all have been audited. Simply put, it will all come out in the wash, but it will still take some time.

is why I ask the question to begin with. I wasn't sure how long "it will take a while for complete resolution" meant. I merely ask was there an update.
 
My apologies to jetset....apparently I took that the wrong way.

And thank you Mousey. I knew where the original thread was and because of this post



is why I ask the question to begin with. I wasn't sure how long "it will take a while for complete resolution" meant. I merely ask was there an update.

But we've got noobs and some others may have missed the original. Not targeted at you. As I said... just a link for easy reference. :)
 
I would have thought an appropriate response from Bryan would have been made since he read the post concerning my question. Forgive me for even thinking of asking the quesiton.
I was busy today finishing the webcast, writing three newsletters, catching up with a few people before heading out to London on Monday - made lunch for one of my kids, and had to read up on sushi a little bit since I'm responsible for dinner tonight. I'm still not done yet. :rolleyes:

I may have read your post this morning - but I figured you'd get a few responses from others since they are awaiting results just like I am.

I emailed the GRA today to see if there is anything yet on their findings. As soon as I hear of something, I'll let you know.
 
And the GRA got back to me. :D

Looks like everything is being finalized at the moment - re: statements coming from the GRA. Admittedly, this has taken a lot of time - but with the number of companies involved, this is what happens.

More later - I'll use this thread to post the info when I get it.
 
And the GRA got back to me. :D

Looks like everything is being finalized at the moment - re: statements coming from the GRA. Admittedly, this has taken a lot of time - but with the number of companies involved, this is what happens.

More later - I'll use this thread to post the info when I get it.

Hi,

is this forthcoming GRA statement going to cover the separate (but related) Playtech issue too?

Monstrous thread link for newbs:
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/playtech-rigged-slots.55080/

If anyone is interested Finsoft's website is still not compliant with the UKGC rules re linking to the Gambling Commission, including their UKGC licence number and giving clarity on which products are compliant with the UKGC technical standards and which are not supplied under the software licence.

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Can I be so bold as to ask, if the result of the GRA isnt yet known, what was the reasoning behind them returning to the accredited list?

What has changed significantly for them to be allowed back on? It may be on other threads but I have missed it if so.
 

This is a moot point - one CM stalwart got moderated for 48 hours because he was angry at that fact, so best not go there. My analysis of the original thread was the accredited casino DID pay refunds to those who had lost on the games, and whatever their motives did so reasonably promptly as they did when pulling the games. Obviously some believe despite this that ultimately they've behaved in a rogue fashion by having the games in the first place despite the games being supplied by a third party and were responsible by not making sufficient checks. AFAIK the casino in question is justifiably accredited by all other criteria though.
I think it's best we all wait for the official CM statement on this matter when resolution has been reached by all parties concerned.
Be patient - CM will give us the outcome(s) when appropriate.
 
Can I be so bold as to ask, if the result of the GRA isnt yet known, what was the reasoning behind them returning to the accredited list?

What has changed significantly for them to be allowed back on? It may be on other threads but I have missed it if so.

Betfred did everything that was expected of them. This is an outstanding company and to punish them because of human error - after they admitted this and tried to pay their players back - was a bit rich. At first they were removed with the condition that once affected players be paid they would be reinstated. After meeting them and finding out that the GRA was preventing them from doing this (pending an audit of affected accounts), it was clearly out of Betfred's hands and there was no justification to continue suspending their accreditation. People make mistakes - they did what they could to fix it. Anyone thinking that this was intentional on Betfred's part has a screw loose.

I'm still waiting for the findings to be published. Once they are, Betfred, Finsoft/Spielo G2 will be making whatever ammends that the GRA dictates.
 
Betfred did everything that was expected of them. This is an outstanding company and to punish them because of human error - after they admitted this and tried to pay their players back - was a bit rich. At first they were removed with the condition that once affected players be paid they would be reinstated. After meeting them and finding out that the GRA was preventing them from doing this (pending an audit of affected accounts), it was clearly out of Betfred's hands and there was no justification to continue suspending their accreditation. People make mistakes - they did what they could to fix it. Anyone thinking that this was intentional on Betfred's part has a screw loose.

I'm still waiting for the findings to be published. Once they are, Betfred, Finsoft/Spielo G2 will be making whatever ammends that the GRA dictates.

Thanks for this. I would hope that some important lessons will be learnt. This is not just about the accounts affected but the failure to monitor/control/check/regulate/comply and the way that the real supplier, the software firm, is not licenced by the GRA.

I would hope that firms across the industry will be doing more than just the minimum ordered by the GRA in the way of ammends but rather look at greater transparency and clarity on how the games work and the expected return and better quality control and monitoring.

Meeting the regulatory minimum should not be the goal for an outstanding firm, they should be doing more than that especially when it has become clear that the certification leaves out some important bits of the regulation.
 
Betfred did everything that was expected of them. This is an outstanding company and to punish them because of human error - after they admitted this and tried to pay their players back - was a bit rich. At first they were removed with the condition that once affected players be paid they would be reinstated. After meeting them and finding out that the GRA was preventing them from doing this (pending an audit of affected accounts), it was clearly out of Betfred's hands and there was no justification to continue suspending their accreditation. People make mistakes - they did what they could to fix it. Anyone thinking that this was intentional on Betfred's part has a screw loose.

I'm still waiting for the findings to be published. Once they are, Betfred, Finsoft/Spielo G2 will be making whatever ammends that the GRA dictates.

So Betfred claim they can't pay back the affected cheated punters because the GRA won't let them?! Why on earth would the GRA stop them issuing refunds?

So does this mean no gambling website is allowed to issue refunds to their customers unless they get permission from their regulator? What arrant nonsense!
 
And the GRA got back to me. :D

Looks like everything is being finalized at the moment - re: statements coming from the GRA. Admittedly, this has taken a lot of time - but with the number of companies involved, this is what happens.

More later - I'll use this thread to post the info when I get it.

Two weeks since "everything is being finalized at the moment - re: statements coming from the GRA" but still no statements forthcoming.

This is either one of the biggest cover-ups ever or the GRA are one of the slowest / laziest / most unorganised "organisations" ever.
 
Two weeks since "everything is being finalized at the moment - re: statements coming from the GRA" but still no statements forthcoming.

This is either one of the biggest cover-ups ever or the GRA are one of the slowest / laziest / most unorganised "organisations" ever.

Yeah, whatever. I'm the messanger, don't forget.

As for the GRA not letting Betfred pay back its players, all player accounts need to be audited before they can pay back anyone. I beleive this can't be done until everything is finalized. I'm sure this has been explained several times.

Sure it's been a hell of a long time, but there are several companies involved to include two licensing jurisdictions - there are enough formalties and legal dealings that need to be taken into account before the fat lady sings.
 
Yeah, whatever. I'm the messanger, don't forget.

As for the GRA not letting Betfred pay back its players, all player accounts need to be audited before they can pay back anyone. I beleive this can't be done until everything is finalized. I'm sure this has been explained several times.

Sure it's been a hell of a long time, but there are several companies involved to include two licensing jurisdictions - there are enough formalties and legal dealings that need to be taken into account before the fat lady sings.

I can understand the complexity but what amuses (and annoys) me is that Finsoft are still not complying with their UKGC licence on their website (they need to link to the Gambling Commission, to show their licence number and to make clear what software they supply is to UKGC technical standards).

They are still in breech of their licence, it makes me wonder just how close we are to wrapping this up.
 
Yeah, whatever. I'm the messanger, don't forget.

As for the GRA not letting Betfred pay back its players, all player accounts need to be audited before they can pay back anyone. I beleive this can't be done until everything is finalized. I'm sure this has been explained several times.
Why can't Betfred make preliminary payments pending a full audit?
 
Why can't Betfred make preliminary payments pending a full audit?

Because all they could do is put money in players account and not allow players to use them because they dont know exactly how much each player is entitled to in refunds.

This will accomplish nothing but add more confusion to entire situation and potentially create new problems, imagine having one balance showing at the bottom while different balance is available to play with. Best they could do is to begin emailing players affected by this issue that they will get reimbursed but exact amount will be determined after investigation is over.

Something pokerstars did when they busted chinese sng collusion ring.
 
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Wait, I thought the casinos were back accredited because they did indeed pay back all the players, I know I read this. (it's somewhere in this thread)Now, the GRA isn't letting them pay back players? This makes no sense. Either they paid back players or they didn't, there's no grey area here.
 
Wait, I thought the casinos were back accredited because they did indeed pay back all the players, I know I read this. (it's somewhere in this thread)Now, the GRA isn't letting them pay back players? This makes no sense. Either they paid back players or they didn't, there's no grey area here.

Posted by Casinomeister in other Finsoft thread...

I've reinstated Betfred, Bet365, and NordicBet positions on the site. They've all done the right thing by removing the games and squaring away their players - I hope that these operators, and their brethren, will remain adamant on ensuring that the games they are presenting to their customers are fair and have been properly tested.
 
Now I gotta go back and look again :laugh:

What do you mean "provide a clue"?

Hang on...be right back.....


I just saw this one looking for Bryans post...from Nordicbet on January 12, 2013 (page 30)

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/finsoft-spielo-g2-games-issue.54475/

Hello everyone,

I'm sorry for the delay. We have now completed our internal investigation and just as already concluded by many others - it was obvious that the game was not acting as it should have. We have reimbursed all losses on HiLo Gambler to all players since we launched the game, on all of our brands.

Page 33, January 14, 2013 is when Bryan posted that....

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/finsoft-spielo-g2-games-issue.54475/


Sorry, don't know how to bring up an individual post.

Now tell me...what do you mean by clue? I sometimes miss things, maybe that's what happened? Pleaseeeee don't make me read that entire thread again!!!! Just point me in right direction please.
 
The game was rigged it cheated players.
Betfred has been removed from and returned to the "List" several times.
Other than players no one else cares. JMO.
 
Over two weeks ago the GRA told CM that it was in the final stages of compiling its report, so presumably the publication of that report is now imminent?

I'm sure that Betfred will welcome publication and an end to this affair, enabling them to settle up with prejudiced players.

Time tends to dim memory, but my recollection is that Spielo-Finsoft were principally at fault here, changing the Realistic Games original offering and then distributing it to various licensees, who were then pinned centre stage facing the player backlash when the wrongdoing was uncovered. Betfred et al were at fault through some negligence, that is true, but to my mind the real 'villain in the piece' was the distributor, and I hope that they will be singled out in the GRA report for that, and possibly censured.

This whole affair has been dragging on for far too long and is a cause for wide player concern that those responsible not be allowed to escape the consequences without learning and making the necessary arrangements to prevent a reoccurrence.

I hope that the GRA has that objective front-of-mind and is not going to deliver a whitewash - that would serve no-one, including the regulator.

We'll soon see, I guess.
 
Complaint from 2008?

... Betfred et al were at fault through some negligence, that is true, but to my mind the real 'villain in the piece' was the distributor, and I hope that they will be singled out in the GRA report for that, and possibly censured.

Hasnt someone posted on GPWA or somewhere a link to complaint against BetFred from 2008 about the exactly the same thing and was told by BetFred then, in 2008, that this is just a typo in help file and that game should pay some percentage other than 100%.

This was 5 years ago and they were aware then that game is not offering 100% and that it is not zero odd game but AWP instead, yet they continued to promote the game as such.

From my perspective this opens up entirely different box of cookies but I dont want to derail this thread.
 
Hasnt someone posted on GPWA or somewhere a link to complaint against BetFred from 2008 about the exactly the same thing and was told by BetFred then, in 2008, that this is just a typo in help file and that game should pay some percentage other than 100%.

This was 5 years ago and they were aware then that game is not offering 100% and that it is not zero odd game but AWP instead, yet they continued to promote the game as such.

From my perspective this opens up entirely different box of cookies but I dont want to derail this thread.

I've already mentioned this few posts back.

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/finsoft-spielo-g2-games-issue-update.56468/

I do hope that whatever concoction it's taken the GRA fifty millennia to come up with, they are taking into account the fact that there's another whammy waiting out there which says Betfred knew about this issue five years ago, otherwise they're going to look really stupid.

Also as was pointed out here, Finsoft are still in breach of their licence anyway - https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/finsoft-spielo-g2-games-issue-update.56468/
 
Hasnt someone posted on GPWA or somewhere a link to complaint against BetFred from 2008 about the exactly the same thing and was told by BetFred then, in 2008, that this is just a typo in help file and that game should pay some percentage other than 100%.

This was 5 years ago and they were aware then that game is not offering 100% and that it is not zero odd game but AWP instead, yet they continued to promote the game as such.

From my perspective this opens up entirely different box of cookies but I dont want to derail this thread.

A cover up that bought them a few years. Had they taken it seriously, they would have corrected the typo. Instead, they decided not to bother as the complainant had been knocked back with this excuse, and so they thought the issue to be buried. It turns out that this was a misjudgement, because THIS time around the same whitewash excuse did not silence the critics. Instead, a player lead investigation just uncovered even further evidence, including the 2008 rebuttal and whitewash.

It could mean that other old issues of a similar nature are waiting in the wings to bite other industry players in the butt.

Unlike 2008, I expect some players are actively looking for further game inconsistencies that might show up such an issue.
 
Because all they could do is put money in players account and not allow players to use them because they dont know exactly how much each player is entitled to in refunds. [\Quote]
Why? What's wrong with this: "Based on your wagering on the affected games, we estimate you were paid £100 less than you should have. Here is £50 as a preliminary payment, the rest will be paid after we have conducted a full audit. If it turns out that we owed you less than £50, you do not have to pay back the difference."
 
I read this post on another forum. Didn't want to link to another site since last time I was reprimanded for that. So just made a copy of it.

Jan. 4th Bedford makes this statement…”Analysis has revealed that Reel Deal was indeed returning at 96%, despite being advertised at 100%....actively compensate players on losses derived from the game over the last 6 months. The amounts should be in accounts by next Tuesday. Claims beyond 6 months will be accepted and honored, too, but must be submitted individually.”

Jan. 7th Bedfred makes this statement... “Betfred Games has been running two versions of the same game for free and money play respectively and that is simply not acceptable. Based on that we will be refunding all losses on the game from when the game was introduced to Betfred, and will be removing other Realistic Games provided by SPIELO G2. Compensation payments will be issued within 7 working days.”

Jan. 12th NordicBet makes this statement... “it was obvious that the game was not acting as it should have. We have reimbursed all losses on HiLo Gambler to all players since we launched the game, on all of our brands."

Jan.14th Casinomeister makes this statement... "I've reinstated Betfred, Bet365, and NordicBet positions on the site. They've all done the right thing by removing the games and SQUARING AWAY THEIR PLAYERS"

Jan. 24th Casinomeister bans Opening Poster for fraud, yet, Bedfred on Jan. 7th made this statement... “We would like to take this opportunity to apologize to our players and to thank the OP and the Casinomeister forum as a whole for bringing this to our attention.”

April 24th Casinomeister makes this statement... “after they (Bedfred) admitted this and TRIED to pay their players back....After meeting them (Bedfred) and finding out that the GRA was PREVENTING them from doing this (pending an audit of affected accounts), it was clearly out of Betfred's hands and there was no justification to continue suspending their accreditation."


So, Bedfred announced On Jan. 4th that wronged players would be paid within 4 days. Then on the 7th that additional wronged players would be paid within 7 days. Then on Jan. 12th NordicBet announced they already paid all affected players back. Four months later we’re now told the Regulators prevented any refunds till audits are complete. Yet, on JAN.14th Casinomeister put them back on the accredited list because they squared away all the wronged players.

Four fxxken months later the only known person paid back was the fraudulent and banned OP and all along we were told that everyone was paid back and how honorable the casinos behaved. After all, this is why they got put back on CM's money tree list.

I'm not even touching on the fraud behavior of the casinos offering rigged games. This is only about showing how much bullshit is being shoved up everyone's ass by the casinos, alleged regulators, and the person that's suppose to be protecting everyone.

This is what happens when someone keeps lying. You eventually forget your past bullshit and stick your own foot up your own ass. What makes it even worse is that everything said in the past is actually documented for all to read.
 
I read this post on another forum. Didn't want to link to another site since last time I was reprimanded for that. So just made a copy of it.

Jan. 4th Bedford makes this statement…”Analysis has revealed that Reel Deal was indeed returning at 96%, despite being advertised at 100%....actively compensate players on losses derived from the game over the last 6 months. The amounts should be in accounts by next Tuesday. Claims beyond 6 months will be accepted and honored, too, but must be submitted individually.”

Jan. 7th Bedfred makes this statement... “Betfred Games has been running two versions of the same game for free and money play respectively and that is simply not acceptable. Based on that we will be refunding all losses on the game from when the game was introduced to Betfred, and will be removing other Realistic Games provided by SPIELO G2. Compensation payments will be issued within 7 working days.”

Jan. 12th NordicBet makes this statement... “it was obvious that the game was not acting as it should have. We have reimbursed all losses on HiLo Gambler to all players since we launched the game, on all of our brands."

Jan.14th Casinomeister makes this statement... "I've reinstated Betfred, Bet365, and NordicBet positions on the site. They've all done the right thing by removing the games and SQUARING AWAY THEIR PLAYERS"

Jan. 24th Casinomeister bans Opening Poster for fraud, yet, Bedfred on Jan. 7th made this statement... “We would like to take this opportunity to apologize to our players and to thank the OP and the Casinomeister forum as a whole for bringing this to our attention.”

April 24th Casinomeister makes this statement... “after they (Bedfred) admitted this and TRIED to pay their players back....After meeting them (Bedfred) and finding out that the GRA was PREVENTING them from doing this (pending an audit of affected accounts), it was clearly out of Betfred's hands and there was no justification to continue suspending their accreditation."


So, Bedfred announced On Jan. 4th that wronged players would be paid within 4 days. Then on the 7th that additional wronged players would be paid within 7 days. Then on Jan. 12th NordicBet announced they already paid all affected players back. Four months later we’re now told the Regulators prevented any refunds till audits are complete. Yet, on JAN.14th Casinomeister put them back on the accredited list because they squared away all the wronged players.

Four fxxken months later the only known person paid back was the fraudulent and banned OP and all along we were told that everyone was paid back and how honorable the casinos behaved. After all, this is why they got put back on CM's money tree list.

I'm not even touching on the fraud behavior of the casinos offering rigged games. This is only about showing how much bullshit is being shoved up everyone's ass by the casinos, alleged regulators, and the person that's suppose to be protecting everyone.

This is what happens when someone keeps lying. You eventually forget your past bullshit and stick your own foot up your own ass. What makes it even worse is that everything said in the past is actually documented for all to read.
Just to remind you: Nordicbet is regulated by Malta - they were able to square away their players since obviously there is a difference between Maltese licensing and Gibraltar's. The GRA stopped Betfred from paying back all of the accounts pre-auditing. I assumed you had the brains to figure this out.

Like I mentioned, I am the messenger - and I have been forthright in what has been reported to me. I have spoken face-to-face with the Betfred rep about this, and Bet365's as well. I have also been away taking care of personal business - and have not requested another update from Gibraltar since I have been busy with more pressing matters.

Nice try with the trollish remarks - fool. Permanent ban for being a douche. 4ofakind? Loser.

@everyday - "thanks" button disabled for thanking a troll post that disses the administrator.
 
I read this post on another forum. Didn't want to link to another site since last time I was reprimanded for that. So just made a copy of it.

Jan. 4th Bedford makes this statement…”Analysis has revealed that Reel Deal was indeed returning at 96%, despite being advertised at 100%....actively compensate players on losses derived from the game over the last 6 months. The amounts should be in accounts by next Tuesday. Claims beyond 6 months will be accepted and honored, too, but must be submitted individually.”

Jan. 7th Bedfred makes this statement... “Betfred Games has been running two versions of the same game for free and money play respectively and that is simply not acceptable. Based on that we will be refunding all losses on the game from when the game was introduced to Betfred, and will be removing other Realistic Games provided by SPIELO G2. Compensation payments will be issued within 7 working days.”

Jan. 12th NordicBet makes this statement... “it was obvious that the game was not acting as it should have. We have reimbursed all losses on HiLo Gambler to all players since we launched the game, on all of our brands."

Jan.14th Casinomeister makes this statement... "I've reinstated Betfred, Bet365, and NordicBet positions on the site. They've all done the right thing by removing the games and SQUARING AWAY THEIR PLAYERS"

Jan. 24th Casinomeister bans Opening Poster for fraud, yet, Bedfred on Jan. 7th made this statement... “We would like to take this opportunity to apologize to our players and to thank the OP and the Casinomeister forum as a whole for bringing this to our attention.”

April 24th Casinomeister makes this statement... “after they (Bedfred) admitted this and TRIED to pay their players back....After meeting them (Bedfred) and finding out that the GRA was PREVENTING them from doing this (pending an audit of affected accounts), it was clearly out of Betfred's hands and there was no justification to continue suspending their accreditation."


So, Bedfred announced On Jan. 4th that wronged players would be paid within 4 days. Then on the 7th that additional wronged players would be paid within 7 days. Then on Jan. 12th NordicBet announced they already paid all affected players back. Four months later we’re now told the Regulators prevented any refunds till audits are complete. Yet, on JAN.14th Casinomeister put them back on the accredited list because they squared away all the wronged players.

Four fxxken months later the only known person paid back was the fraudulent and banned OP and all along we were told that everyone was paid back and how honorable the casinos behaved. After all, this is why they got put back on CM's money tree list.

I'm not even touching on the fraud behavior of the casinos offering rigged games. This is only about showing how much bullshit is being shoved up everyone's ass by the casinos, alleged regulators, and the person that's suppose to be protecting everyone.

This is what happens when someone keeps lying. You eventually forget your past bullshit and stick your own foot up your own ass. What makes it even worse is that everything said in the past is actually documented for all to read.



If the above is completely factual then it reinforces my beliefs as written on another thread regarding "Has too much info changed the way you think". I did mention that wouldn't it possible for manipulated games to appear in even accredited casinos and this seems to answer that question. So now I hope someone can explain how this could have happened without anyone "supposedly" being aware of it until it was brought to their attention by a player.

Yes, too much info can bring out the tin foil hatters and this situation surely doesn't help.
 
Just to remind you: Nordicbet is regulated by Malta - they were able to square away their players since obviously there is a difference between Maltese licensing and Gibraltar's. The GRA stopped Betfred from paying back all of the accounts pre-auditing. I assumed you had the brains to figure this out.

Like I mentioned, I am the messenger - and I have been forthright in what has been reported to me. I have spoken face-to-face with the Betfred rep about this, and Bet365's as well. I have also been away taking care of personal business - and have not requested another update from Gibraltar since I have been busy with more pressing matters.

Nice try with the trollish remarks - fool. Permanent ban for being a douche. 4ofakind? Loser.

@everyday - "thanks" button disabled for thanking a troll post that disses the administrator.

My apologies Bryan. I wasn't thanking him for dissing you, not at all. I respect you too much for that. My focus was on the possibility of "bad" games making their way into casinos if what he stated was true. Wasn't giving any thought to the rest of it. My trigger finger apologizes as well.
 
My apologies Bryan. I wasn't thanking him for dissing you, not at all. I respect you too much for that. My focus was on the possibility of "bad" games making their way into casinos if what he stated was true. Wasn't giving any thought to the rest of it. My trigger finger apologizes as well.
Apology accepted.
 
It is a shame that we have trolling and bans flying.

It seems entirely consistent to keep a casino accredited if they are acting honourably regarding a mistake. The information Casinomeister has is greater than that in the public domain to date so trusting him seems like the only sensible option.

This still leaves us with some serious issues though.
1) This really is taking far too long to sort out
2) The GRA have been entirely silent to date
3) The GRA do not seem to have been effective in their regulation (though a final judgment should be reserved until we get to hear their side).
4) We still have the GRA rules saying that how games work and how they pay out must be explained clearly but we have many games where optimal play is not even hinted at never mind described and the payout is undisclosed and or unclear.
5) Finsoft, the software firm that made the error have remained silent
6) Finsoft is still - 5 months later - in breech of their UKGC licence, a licence that has a pretty pitiful minimum of rules for a firm supplying software outside of the UK.
7) Certification that does not cover the play games is clearly not right
8) Changes to game payout and gameplay seem to be being made post certification without any new certification process. This is clearly not right.

I mean seriously - why hasn't the GRA shifted on this yet? Why haven't the audits of existing games that were talked about made more public/explicit? My anger on this is focussed on Finsoft and the GRA rather than the casinos that took the games in good faith (and failed to check them well enough as they are required to do). They seem to have made public statements, promised to pay back and conducted new checks of the software. Those accredited casinos seem to be the only ones to have done anything to communicate with players or bring the matter to a conclusion......accreditation for the GRA and Finsoft does not exist, if it did there might be a case for a warning flag or two.
 
And the GRA got back to me. :D

Looks like everything is being finalized at the moment - re: statements coming from the GRA. Admittedly, this has taken a lot of time - but with the number of companies involved, this is what happens.

More later - I'll use this thread to post the info when I get it.

This was the situation as of the 12th April, nearly a month ago. Anyone offering odds on the GRA announcing something by 12th May? Maybe odds on GRA news by the 27th May which would be 5 months since this started.

PS Finsoft are still in breech of their UKGC licence rules re their website content. The list of operators getting ruled against was updated by the UKGC on 7th May and had three ne entries from Feb/March but not Finsoft.

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Does anyone know if the GRA have a similar list of who they have taken actions against, what those actions were and when they happened?
 
You must get frustrated with the GRA, another week and still nothing from them.

Understatement of the year.

I've been discussing this with Aaron, and this whole process has been very disappointing. I'm considering knocking the GRA down to the level of Malta and Curacao in the CM rating system. Which most of the GRA licensees I'm sure would think is nuts because there is no comparison between the LGA and the GRA. I don't think it's an account of being ineffective - it may be a case of being overwhelmed with due-diligence protocols and other obligatory processes. The GRA may be too busy dotting their "i"s and crossing their "t"s so to speak to worry about any website or forum that has any interest in this. It's not reflecting well on what importance they hold towards player communities.
 
I have to say.....I'm surprised it is taking this long.

I'm sure there are complex issues, but at the end of the day, the questions to be answered are pretty darn simple really.

It leads one to suspect that maybe the GRA aren't going to come out of this smelling like roses, hence the delay.

It would be nice if they at least kept people like Bryan up to speed regularly, and it might well have stopped any conjecture or suspicion.
 
I have to say.....I'm surprised it is taking this long.

I'm sure there are complex issues, but at the end of the day, the questions to be answered are pretty darn simple really.

I'm not holding my breath. I'm expecting a very unsatisfying vague statement.
 
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