Advice needed

MrWolf

Dormant account
Joined
May 7, 2005
Location
London
I'm currently in a dispute with one of the accredited casinos on this site. I won't say which yet, since I've contacted the rep. here. But I would like some advice.

Here's the probem. When I joined in January, I provided my UK driver's licence, utility bill, copy of cc for verification, and had my first small cashin paid.

I then went onto deposit, play and cashin four more times using another debit card.

You'd assume the only thing required would be a copy of the new debit card.

Unfortunately, not so. Copy of new debit card, bank statement showing payments to the casino (even though you can only deposit thru verified by visa), bank statement for the account winnings are to be paid to, and another form of ID which needs to have a photo were all requested.

I've supplied all but there's a sticking point over the ID. My drivers' licence is an old style UK one, with no photo, which is clearly a problem for the casino. The only photo ID I have is my passport. So I very reluctantly sent a copy of my passport, but with thin strips of paper blocking out my passport number, place of birth, exact date passport was issued and exact date it expires. My name, nationality, date of birth, sex, year the passport expires, and signature are all visible.

The reason I blocked out some sensitive information is that I'm wary of the threat of ID theft. However, this is not good enough for said casino, who I have found have now locked my account and stolen my winnings until I send them a copy of my passport with all the sensitive information visible.

Personally I consider this totally irresponsible behaviour for a casino to lay their customers open to the possibility of ID theft (I note that Casinomeister himself deals with the topic in his latest broadcast). No casino demands copies of credit cards with the full cc number and security showing. Why is a passport any different?

I've just spoken to a customer services rep from the casino who informs me the reason they need a photo ID is because it's a requirement of the regulatory authorities in Malta. However, he was not able to provide me any links to back this up. He then told me it was in the casino's rules and pointed me to this section:

"Request documents to verify identity, authorisation to use a specific Credit Card and/or other facts provided by the Account Holder, before expediting deposits and/or withdrawals."

Nothing there about the ID having to have a photo. Personally I think with the amount of documentation they already have it's obvious to even a moron that I'm genuine.

My question is am I being unreasonable with regards to the passport? Are other people happy to hand out copies of their passport to online casinos, even if they are on CM's accredited list?
 

RobWin

closed account
Joined
Apr 24, 2004
Location
A Vault!
MrWolf, with all of this going on with the ID and the fact that you had already sent them your drivers license ID and they had paid you previously but now they are requesting the same again and more, I would go ahead and get either Bryan or Max involved with this one, especially since they are an accredited casino here.
 

BingoT

Nurses love to give shots
Joined
Dec 16, 2004
Location
Palm Bay Florida
Dose the UK have an expiration on the Driver License?
If so I would say it's time for a new one.
And after you get it send it.
And you can trust Bryan or Max to back you on this if you don't get a new license.
B-T
 

MrWolf

Dormant account
Joined
May 7, 2005
Location
London
Dose the UK have an expiration on the Driver License?
If so I would say it's time for a new one.
And after you get it send it.
And you can trust Bryan or Max to back you on this if you don't get a new license.
B-T

There's no expiration date on the licence BingoT. I think it's valid till I'm 65, so still a way to go!

I didn't want to pitch a bitch without first speaking to the casino rep here. I know he did communicate with the casino, which is Malta-based. Unfortunately, the fact that they've now locked my account speaks volumes and I may have no alternative but to pitch a bitch.

What is really annoying is that there was no bonus money involved, so at the moment they are not releasing either me deposits or winnings. These guys should really take a lesson from the likes of Red Flush.
 

Gogo

Dormant account
Joined
Feb 15, 2009
Location
Croatia
When I was requested withdraw with one of casino I send them all documents, include my passport (Did not block any number) and also I send them copy of my visa electron include all numbers, even cvv.
I was very worried and afraid. They asure me that this data will be on secure file and not share to anyone, but.. I am still woried.
BTW I get my withdraw, thats fine.
In other casinos I blocked numbers no relevant to the casino.
So, what I can do? I can replace visa and with this I will stop any fraud from use of my old card.
For passport numbers I am not so afraid because, if someone want to steal someone indetity there are many way to do so. Copy of varius docs exist in agency, hotels, motels and everywhere.
And what someone can gain if have my passport number? Nothing.
 

dynamitewoman

Dormant account
Joined
Sep 12, 2006
Location
roswell,n.m
identity theft

Numbers and personal information such as drivers lcense, passport numbers,social security numbers, credit card numbers are all sold, often in lots to the highest bidder, using telephone transactions. What the buyer does with them is their business once they own them. A valid passport number can be attached to any individual with a "created" passport document to authenticate it. We are all identified with numbers, codes and symbols that are personal to us because they have been issued to us. That is who we are, and if someone else gains access to that information, that is who they can become.
The internet is not a place to trust anyones security measures to the point of not protecting yourself with common sense and precautions.
Maybe someone will come up with the bright idea of establishing a secure government sanctioned and insured site where you can submit all necessary documents and , in return, you get an authorized and secure virtual card to use as absolute identity verification across the internet,including gaming sites. That way, you do not have to keep resubmitting and hoping you will be accepted as a real person in order to get cash winnings or be verified at every site you visit.
 

Gogo

Dormant account
Joined
Feb 15, 2009
Location
Croatia
I can agree with you. I wonder what we can do to prevent steal indetity.
(I apoligize for english).
If we suspect we can report that in Police and thats it. Nothing more.
If someone do something wrong and ilegall with my indetity, I supose can easily prove that I did not do such thing and that is "stolen indetity issue"
 

KasinoKing

WebMeister & Slotaholic..
webmeister
PABnonaccred
CAG
MM
Joined
Aug 25, 2004
Location
Bexhill on sea, England
My question is am I being unreasonable with regards to the passport? Are other people happy to hand out copies of their passport to online casinos, even if they are on CM's accredited list?
1) No, I think the casino is being unreasonable in this particular case since you have already proved you are you once & they've paid you. I see no reason why you should do it all again.
I'm not sure this is PAB material though - why not just PM MaxD and ask for advice?
BTW, I still have the old UK pink driving license too (no photo) - valid until I'm 70 I think...

2) Yes, I have sent scans of my whole passport with nothing blanked to several casinos.
But only those I think are trustworthy. I recognise there is a very small risk in doing this - but I don't mind taking a little gamble from time to time! :p

KK
 

RoyallyFlushed

Banned User
Joined
Jan 31, 2009
Location
somewhere in NJ
What I don't understand is why they paid you before and now they wont. I get what your problem is but I don't get what this casino's problem is. Can you take a picture of yourself with a digital camera while holding up your drivers' license?

They locked your account too boot? That would really pizz me off!! Im sure someone here can help you, good luck
 

MrWolf

Dormant account
Joined
May 7, 2005
Location
London
What I don't understand is why they paid you before and now they wont. I get what your problem is but I don't get what this casino's problem is. Can you take a picture of yourself with a digital camera while holding up your drivers' license?

They locked your account too boot? That would really pizz me off!! Im sure someone here can help you, good luck

I must admit I'm completely baffled about why my original documents were OK in January, and then in February they get really heavy handed about demanding loads more. If I were being cynical I'd say it's because there's a bigger win involved this time and they don't want to pay.
 

MrWolf

Dormant account
Joined
May 7, 2005
Location
London
it wouldnt be a casino from the vegas partner lounge group would it ?


No it's not. Sorry to be so cryptic about it, but I'm really hoping to get this sorted amicably. I've contacted the casino rep here, but unfortunately since then they've locked my account. So at the moment they are being pretty intransigent about the whole thing.

I've sent a final email today, stating my position, and asked for it be forwarded to a supervisor. If I have no joy from that, then I think I'm either going to have to file a formal complaint with the Lottery and Gaming Authority in Malta or pitch a bitch here.
 

Stovetopp

Senior Member
MM
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Location
On the Beach
I must admit I'm completely baffled about why my original documents were OK in January, and then in February they get really heavy handed about demanding loads more. If I were being cynical I'd say it's because there's a bigger win involved this time and they don't want to pay.

If the facts are as stated , then I agree that it must have been a huge win!
Good for you! Go get em!!
 

MrWolf

Dormant account
Joined
May 7, 2005
Location
London
If the facts are as stated , then I agree that it must have been a huge win!
Good for you! Go get em!!


Yes, the facts are as stated. And we're talking just over 2.5k, including deposits. It does make you wonder why they are so reluctant to pay...
 

Rusty

Banned User - repetitive flaming
Joined
Jul 23, 2006
Location
Manchester UK
Yes, the facts are as stated. And we're talking just over 2.5k, including deposits. It does make you wonder why they are so reluctant to pay...

Trusting what you say is fact then I would say this is absolutely PAB material.

The Casino are being completely unreasonable and One of the only reasons I can see for such behaviour is a cynical attempt to avoid paying a legitimate win.
It is very typical of a rogue site to pull such stunts but surprising to find a site accredited here employing such tactics.

The only other reason could be that your account has raised a red flag for some reason and the CS is just incredibly inept.

I respect and understand your decision not to out this Casino and try to have the situation resolved amicably and admire your patience and fortitude in the face of such belligerence.

However it would be proper to have this Casino named and shamed so the rest of us can show our displeasure and support for you by closing our accounts or avoiding this pit in the future should they not see sense and pay you what they owe.

Good luck.
 

MrWolf

Dormant account
Joined
May 7, 2005
Location
London
Trusting what you say is fact then I would say this is absolutely PAB material.

The Casino are being completely unreasonable and One of the only reasons I can see for such behaviour is a cynical attempt to avoid paying a legitimate win.
It is very typical of a rogue site to pull such stunts but surprising to find a site accredited here employing such tactics.

The only other reason could be that your account has raised a red flag for some reason and the CS is just incredibly inept.

I respect and understand your decision not to out this Casino and try to have the situation resolved amicably and admire your patience and fortitude in the face of such belligerence.

However it would be proper to have this Casino named and shamed so the rest of us can show our displeasure and support for you by closing our accounts or avoiding this pit in the future should they not see sense and pay you what they owe.

Good luck.

Thanks for the support Rusty. I'm not naming them just yet because I want to give them a chance to right the situation. If I've not heard anything by Tuesday (I emailed them today asking for a supervisor/manager to address my concerns) I think I'll pitch a bitch here.

I'm hoping since the casino is CM approved that this is a one-off situation, and a manager with a brain can finally sort it.

Rest assured though that if these guys continue to steal my deposits and legitimate winnings (no hint of a bonus involved) then I'll be shouting about their fraudulent behaviour from the rooftops.
 

MrWolf

Dormant account
Joined
May 7, 2005
Location
London
OK so I've been told this evening by a customer services rep I spoke to after he wrote refusing to pass on an email I'd sent about this matter to a superior:

"No pay outs" and "Your account will stay locked" unless I send a copy of my passport with all information showing. He also added: "Send us the documents otherwise nothing's going to happen."

Highly unsatisfactory for a "reputable" casino. Time to escalate the matter.
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Location
Pennsylvania
OK so I've been told this evening by a customer services rep I spoke to after he wrote refusing to pass on an email I'd sent about this matter to a superior:

"No pay outs" and "Your account will stay locked" unless I send a copy of my passport with all information showing. He also added: "Send us the documents otherwise nothing's going to happen."

Highly unsatisfactory for a "reputable" casino. Time to escalate the matter.

It makes no sense that they would have paid you several times before without a photo ID, but yet now make it seem as if they're required to have it, by their licensing authority.

I'm in the USA, but every time I send in documents, I've always blacked out any information they don't need - such as license #, account numbers, non-casino related transactions, etc. - and never had any problems.

Definitely time to PAB.
 

hobobiker

Dormant account
Joined
May 4, 2007
Location
Manchester UK
My drivers' licence is an old style UK one, with no photo,

1)BTW, I still have the old UK pink driving license too (no photo) - valid until I'm 70 I think...
KK

photo license been around 10+ years now .... no convictions or endorsments in that time , I am very Impressed, its pretty hard nowdays with all the cams around.
you still riding KK ?. .... maybe i should switch to 4 wheels , might keep my lic more than six months ( get mine back in Aug after another 18 months for totting up) but then again ..... nah,
 

RobWin

closed account
Joined
Apr 24, 2004
Location
A Vault!
MrWolf, is this Unibet you are dealing with here since you have brought up a few other threads now asking if the issue was ever resolved ??
 

MrWolf

Dormant account
Joined
May 7, 2005
Location
London
MrWolf, is this Unibet you are dealing with here since you have brought up a few other threads now asking if the issue was ever resolved ??

Sorry RobWin, I don't want to name the casino for now since I'm considering PAB in a day or two.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
OK so I've been told this evening by a customer services rep I spoke to after he wrote refusing to pass on an email I'd sent about this matter to a superior:

"No pay outs" and "Your account will stay locked" unless I send a copy of my passport with all information showing. He also added: "Send us the documents otherwise nothing's going to happen."

Highly unsatisfactory for a "reputable" casino. Time to escalate the matter.

Time to escalate right now, do not wait 2 days. This is your proof of a situation of deadlock. Since CS are blocking access to a higher level, forget the rep, this is a stage of non-cooperation too far, and you are only going to waste time giving them any more chances.

While you may be going a little over the top with the passport issue, this really does the casino no favours at all. You at least HAVE a passport to argue over, what about the vast majority of UK players who have still not moved house since photo licences were introduced (the ONLY way most have the right to a free upgrade). The reason for this government stance, simple, IT'S NOT A FRIGGIN' ID DOCUMENT, IT'S A LICENCE TO DRIVE A VEHICLE.
If the goddam GOVERNMENT feels it is good enough that we citizens can be told apart from terrorists without making photo cards universal, than it should be good enough for these arrogant casinos who are really only looking after their businesses. If casinos were PROPERLY regulated, this would NEVER happen, and if it did, the CASINO could be charged with theft once you could demonstrate you were the beneficial owner of the funds deposited.

It is no good for casinos to insist players produce something that does not even exist - it is not going to happen, and all that WILL happen is that the casino involved will be dragged through the mire (even if not publically at first), since this would be the player's only alternative. IF casinos have a very narrow range of ID documents they will accept, and this range is one that some players will not possess an item from, then this MUST be spelled out CLEARLY in the terms BEFORE the player plays - from what has been quoted, this casino has failed to spell out this in sufficient detail, in particular failing to mention that the legacy standard UK Drivers licence is an exception to the rule that a drivers licence will suffice, and that it has to be a recently issued or reissued photo variant.

This casino is asking for a DANGEROUS amount of your personal details, and if they fell into the wrong hands, it wouild be so VERY easy for your identity to be stolen, and damn thoroughly too. It is about time this was brought to a stop. It has become clear to me that casino CS do NOT handle all this information with the necessary levels of security. If it were, we would NEVER hear of players being told by CS to "resend your documents, we didn't receive them, we have lost them, etc"

Casinos DO NOT NEED all that information on the passport. They need a proof of name and address to compare with what you have registered with them, and they need two independent, but corobberating, documents that prove you have current access to the address (usually a recent utility bill, or bank statement).

Since this argument involves a UK Passport, it could be worth contacting the home office about this, since this has supposedly come about through a Malteze regulatory rule. The home office may well be VERY unhappy with the sheer level of personal information these sites are requesting and can do something about it since malta is a member of the EU. The home office are not going to buy into the argument the casino NEEDS this level of detail, and that this requirement overrides the REAL need to frustrate those who seek to misuse the data to enter the country illegally. THIS is why recent advice has gone out to travellers about the common practice of hotels insisting on holding passports as "security" against guests not paying any bar bills or room service before they leave. The advice is that this is NOT ACCEPTABLE, and if the home office does not trust HOTELS, you can bet they don't trust online casinos to hold through an image, which is, in effect, the same thing.

Normally, when a new card is used a casino will ask for an image of that card to prove it is yours. They may well also ask for a deposit declaration form listing all deposits made, which you sign to state you authorised them. They believe this protects them from chargebacks, however, they may be mistaken since the documents are always presented to be signed "under duress" with the threat of non-payment if you do not sign.
The bank statements showing the deposits may be in lieu of this deposit declaration form, so serves the same purpose. Wanting a statement for the bank they are being asked to pay into may be an indication that they smell a rat. Why, after all, not have the winnings paid into the bank account linked to the debit card - this starts to look too complicated an arrangement for Mr Average, so they start to let their imaginations run wild and see conspiracies. Funnily enough, the very thing casinos accuse us players of, and assure us it is all OUR imaginations, and not any "rigged games".
 

GrandMaster

Dormant account
Joined
Jan 21, 2004
Location
UK
If the goddam GOVERNMENT feels it is good enough that we citizens can be told apart from terrorists without making photo cards universal, than it should be good enough for these arrogant casinos who are really only looking after their businesses.
Actually, if you have been following the news, the government policy is for everyone to have a biometric ID card containing fingerprints and there will be a massive database waiting to be lost on a memory stick by some civil servant.
 

KasinoKing

WebMeister & Slotaholic..
webmeister
PABnonaccred
CAG
MM
Joined
Aug 25, 2004
Location
Bexhill on sea, England
photo license been around 10+ years now .... no convictions or endorsments in that time , I am very Impressed, its pretty hard nowdays with all the cams around.
you still riding KK ?. .... maybe i should switch to 4 wheels , might keep my lic more than six months ( get mine back in Aug after another 18 months for totting up) but then again ..... nah,
Yep... well in the summer! :p
My XS750SE is still rusting away in the corner of my garage, but last year I bought a DT125R for nipping here & there - much more fun!
What are you riding again?

Actually I have 2 speeding endorsements on my licence - one while driving the car, and one on the DT last year! Both bloody speed camera's :mad: I expected them to ask me to upgrade my licence to a photo one, but all they did was write the endorsements on by hand!

Sorry for the derail! :oops:
KK
 

Gogo

Dormant account
Joined
Feb 15, 2009
Location
Croatia
So, if someone is unhappy or have samo reason to cancel deposit to casino (if he/she made deposit by visa el) he can do that? How?
 
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