Casino Complaint This is Vegas flags my account

[heidisue76]

Hi everyone!!
Sorry, I just had to share this e-mail from this is vegas casino, because I almost can't believe it.

About 3 weeks ago, I spent $3200 in one night betting pennies on Scary Rich. I finally woke up and cashed out $1100 of my money. I still lost $2200. Since then, I haven't heard a word from you, and you took all of my player loyalties away. I don't have a single promotion, and haven't in weeks. Please tell me what's going on.

Dear Heidi,

Regrettably, a number of factors have led to our automated security system flagging your account as bonus ineligible.

I am sorry to inform you but the casino reserves the right to deny promotions to anyone, without disclosing the reason why.

You May still play for Fun or Real without promotions. Continous play can result in your account becoming eligible for promotions again.

Sincerely,
Tyrone
thisisvegas customer support



My response was:
Are you serious? I have been a loyal player here for 3 years! I have never abused promotions or given you any reason to flag my account. You wait until I've lost $3200 at your casino, and then another $2200 in one night, and after 3 years of playing, you flag my account, and tell me that you can't give me an explanation? That's not a great way to run a company. You would have owed me 10% of my losses on the first of the month, which would have amounted to about $300, so you flag my account? As a loyal customer, I would really hope that you believe that I deserve a better explanation than that.

Heidi Wickham

I just e-mailed this, and haven't heard back yet. Rival casinos have always been my favorite, but this is nuts. I have never had an account flagged anywhere! Has anyone had a similar situation? I honestly can't believe this. I have never had a problem with any rival casino flagging me, or not being generous with bonuses.
Heidi

 

[maxd]

I've sent a heads-up message to John, the casino rep. He may reply here or contact you directly via PM.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Hi everyone!!
Sorry, I just had to share this e-mail from this is vegas casino, because I almost can't believe it.

About 3 weeks ago, I spent $3200 in one night betting pennies on Scary Rich. I finally woke up and cashed out $1100 of my money. I still lost $2200. Since then, I haven't heard a word from you, and you took all of my player loyalties away. I don't have a single promotion, and haven't in weeks. Please tell me what's going on.

Dear Heidi,

Regrettably, a number of factors have led to our automated security system flagging your account as bonus ineligible.

I am sorry to inform you but the casino reserves the right to deny promotions to anyone, without disclosing the reason why.

You May still play for Fun or Real without promotions. Continous play can result in your account becoming eligible for promotions again.

Sincerely,
Tyrone
thisisvegas customer support



My response was:
Are you serious? I have been a loyal player here for 3 years! I have never abused promotions or given you any reason to flag my account. You wait until I've lost $3200 at your casino, and then another $2200 in one night, and after 3 years of playing, you flag my account, and tell me that you can't give me an explanation? That's not a great way to run a company. You would have owed me 10% of my losses on the first of the month, which would have amounted to about $300, so you flag my account? As a loyal customer, I would really hope that you believe that I deserve a better explanation than that.

Heidi Wickham

I just e-mailed this, and haven't heard back yet. Rival casinos have always been my favorite, but this is nuts. I have never had an account flagged anywhere! Has anyone had a similar situation? I honestly can't believe this. I have never had a problem with any rival casino flagging me, or not being generous with bonuses.
Heidi

Well, if this is the whole story, it is utter nonsense. How on earth can losing $2200 in one night be "promotional abuse". Bonus abuse tends to result in players winning regularly from generous bonuses, but somehow they flag your account for playing Scary Rich on low stakes and losing a fortune. To make things worse, they are not even prepared to give you the 10% rebate that was due BEFORE your account was flagged.

Casino Rewards once tried an "interesting" excuse though. A player, worried about getting flagged for "bonus abuse", played the bonus with a view to having a bit of high rolling fun, rather than grinding out a cash-out. They LOST all the bonus money, but was then told they had "abused the promotion".

There is something very odd going on with Rival at present, these bonus bans are flying out, and there is no real evidence these are down to actual "bonus abuse".

Another thing, you are in New York, a "banned" state. Perhaps this has something to do with it, and the MG mass IP blocking farce is going to hit Rival soon, and they don't want arguments about unwagered bonuses.
This is what happened at Intercasino. US players were trying to claim the monthly reload over the weekend, and were told US players were no longer eligible for bonuses, but could still play. Monday came, and players found their accounts LOCKED, and they had to contact CS for manual payments, with up to a month wait, AND they lost out on any unwagered bonuses they have still in the account.

 

[chuchu59]

This is one of the reasons I am pissed off with TIV. I was due to get a promo in their birthday month when they suddenly cut off my promos. I lost nothing then but felt sour. In Heidisue's case, they cannot act retroactively and deny her the cashback when she wagered freely in the knowledge that she would get back 10% of whatever she lost. They are free to deny future promos but they cant undo what has been done without telling the player in advance.

 

[vinylweatherman]

This is one of the reasons I am pissed off with TIV. I was due to get a promo in their birthday month when they suddenly cut off my promos. I lost nothing then but felt sour. In Heidisue's case, they cannot act retroactively and deny her the cashback when she wagered freely in the knowledge that she would get back 10% of whatever she lost. They are free to deny future promos but they cant undo what has been done without telling the player in advance.

Perhaps this is the "abuse", DELIBERATELY losing in order to inflate the amount of cashback, THEN "abusing" the cashback by playing to WIN.

IF the games ARE NOT RANDOM, but set to balance out for a particular player, then yes, this could be "abuse" in the RTG "Frozen Assets" sense, where deliberately playing Frozen Assets to build up a big payout but holding just short until the account is unencumbered by WR can provide an advantage.

Many questions have been asked about supposed non-randomness, and this is NOT the first casino to have claimed that DELIBERATELY playing to LOSE is a form of promotional abuse.

At least one operator is on record here for putting forward this argument that a game will "balance out" if players deliberately lose on it with a bonus, and then play WITHOUT a bonus. I believe it was Virtual, who justified their odd rule about a max cashout on a bonus being applied even after zeroing out and the player then depositing again and winning back the losses. Maybe they were thinking of Frozen Assets, but did not want to say, but in general, this is nonsense. In the case of Rival, this SHOULD also be utter nonsense, however, they are able to continually change the variance of EXISTING games in response to business needs, so maybe they are not as "random" as say, the MG slots, whose parameters are fixed from launch.

 

[GrandMaster]

The most likely explanation is still that casino managers and employees don't understand the mathematics of casino games and may believe in the gambler's fallacy, there is plenty of evidence for this.

 

[heidisue76]

Thank you guys! The only thing that I can say is beware of This is Vegas. I asked them how I could possibly have abused bonuses when the last time I played, I used every bonus that they offered me, and then played without using any bonuses. Believe me, I did not try to lose $3000 on purpose, just to receive $300 of it back. So, my account was eligible and receiving bonuses, I played them, lost $3000 in 5 hours, decided to stop playing at this is vegas for while, and then find out after 3 years of playing, with no problems at all, they flag my account.
Anyway, they have responded to me 3 times. Their response is always: The computer system generates who is flagged. We do not know why you're account is flagged, but it is. The casino can flag anyone's account, without letting them know why. Sorry.
They might as well say: "Thanks for being a loyal customer for three years. Thanks for giving us a fortune. We would rather you didn't play at our casino anymore, we really don't have a reason. Sorry about your damn luck.

I feel like I'm beating a dead horse, but this is just ridiculous. I really can't believe that they would flag my account after so many years, and not even give me an explanation why. That's what really makes me angry.

 

[chuchu59]

They can flag you for whatever reason in the book but they must give you the 10% cashback becasue they did not inform you that you are no longer eligible for it.

Heidisue, has John replied to you via pm?

 

[refre]

Lmao, couldn't help it
Sorry for your troubles though Heidi!

Freddy

 

[vinylweatherman]

Computer says F*** off!

What a feeble excuse, since when did computers have more say than MANAGERS, and then held to be infallible in their decisions.

A player of 3 years, who plays both with, and without bonuses, plays slots, and is prepared to lose $3000 in a day is suddenly flagged as an "abuser", and the only thing is that they didn't play for a while after some bad luck.

Perhaps the PROGRAMMER believed in the "gambler's fallacy", and programmed this into the computer.

There are many other casinos who would be overjoyed to have such a level of action, and such a lengthy period of loyalty. Since you would be a new player to them, you should be treated like royalty, it seems businesses do not value loyal customers, but prefer to chase after new ones. This is endemic in the business world, and is not confined to online casinos.

There is one Rival that is NOT run under the Bonne Chance umbrella, and it is Slot O Cash. If playing the Rival software is important, try this one out, they have Scary Rich, and you could lose another $3000 on it if you like

After a while, TIV will come to their senses, see that you have defected to a direct competitor, and may well start offering you incentives to come back and lose on THEIR Scary Rich game

IF I was to try Rival, I would avoid all the Bonne Chance ones that seem to have this "stupid" attitude with their loyal players, and try Slot O Cash, where these flagging games do not seem to be such an issue.

Maybe TIV has one of those nasty "hidden rules" that players break simply by playing on what they are offered, no question of "abuse", but simply a hard wired set of criteria in a computer system.

There is a hint of this in Tyrone's reply:-

Continous play can result in your account becoming eligible for promotions again.

This is the "Casino Rewards Trick", and may well be a scam to get you to chase the reinstatement of eligibility when perhaps there is no way the decision would EVER be reversed. Players sometimes fell for this with CR, and lost thousands hoping to get their account eligible again, only to find it just never happened, and they would have been better off starting over with a new MG casino group.

 

[heidisue76]

John has not messaged me. I haven't heard anything.

 

[KasinoKing]

John has not messaged me. I haven't heard anything.

It's the weekend - computers have the weekends off...

KK

 

[thisisvegas]

I really don't want to make any comments here on the forum because the information about the player I believe should be confidential. Sure if they are not happy they can simply not play at the casino anymore but I will not disclose any of the reasons behind the decision to not award promotions. There are 2 sides to the story, anyone can PAB and I would be happy to help get this resolved behind closed doors and let someone at CM have the final say on it.

John

 

[RobWin]

Hmmm......maybe a mystery is about to unfold

 

[kavaman]

Basic rival bs. They do not disclose anything, and basically have the right to do whatever they want...

The player should definately be eligible for the 10% BEFORE being bonus banned, if he didnt do anything wrong. Also did i misunderstand something , but didn't this player say that he didnt use much promotions...

 

[chuchu59]

I really don't want to make any comments here on the forum because the information about the player I believe should be confidential. Sure if they are not happy they can simply not play at the casino anymore but I will not disclose any of the reasons behind the decision to not award promotions. There are 2 sides to the story, anyone can PAB and I would be happy to help get this resolved behind closed doors and let someone at CM have the final say on it.

John

I believe TIV has all the right in the world not to award promotions but if a player had deposited such a substantial amount as heidisue and lost it surely it wouldnt be right to deny her the cashback as she was never told that she was ineligible for this. Other promotions are easily visible and if they are not in the cashier you are not eligible for them. I think we need to differentiate between offering promotions and denying cashback awards on money already lost. The former is future tense while the other is past tense.

 

[Casinomeister]

Like John stated, the player can PAB if she wants since there is more to this than she has posted.

Obviously, some players feel that bonuses are obligatory - they are not, and casinos have every right to deny these for whatever reasons. It's their business. If you don't like it, then move on.

I have been playing online for ten years and have NEVER had an issue about bonuses. Why? Because I know that they are not obligatory, thus I seldom use them. I have better things to do with my time than worrying about wagering requirements and playing the right games. But this is just a personal thing.

Back to the player: I don't know what you are trying to get at. Are you simply upset that the casino exercised their right to bonus ban you? If this is so - not much of a complaint IMO.

 

[Pinababy69]

Back to the player: I don't know what you are trying to get at. Are you simply upset that the casino exercised their right to bonus ban you? If this is so - not much of a complaint IMO.

What about a bonus that she WAS eligible for prior to being bonus banned? Obviously, I guess there's more to this, but going on what's been posted here....why was she not eligible for the 10% cashback, when she deposited 3K? As Chuchu said, they are totally within their rights to ban her from any subsequent bonuses, but if she deposited that 3K while still being eligible for the 10%, why is she not entitled to it?

Heidisue, please PAB, so that we can get the full story.

 

[maxd]

Just so there's no confusion:

- required reading: Pitch-A-Bitch FAQ

- when you're ready to actually do it: Pitch-A-Bitch application

Regards,
Max Drayman
Casinomeister.com, Player Grievance Manager