The Day Has arrived for The UK

[Janek12]

Merkel had nothing to do with this development as the UK never took substantially more refugees than in any other years. She made the right decision to help people in need, it was only the execution which lacked.

She only helped the richest immigrants - those represented the overwhelming majority who were able to make it to the EU because the fees of the human smugglers were in the thousands or tens of thousands of Euro. The millions of people who are in much greater need are still stuck in horrible conditions in refugee camps in Turkey, Jordan, etc., etc.

This is a very complex issue and I could not help but to respond to your over-simplifying comment.

 

[Harry_BKK]

She only helped the richest immigrants - those represented the overwhelming majority who were able to make it to the EU because the fees of the human smugglers were in the thousands or tens of thousands of Euro. The millions of people who are in much greater need are still stuck in horrible conditions in refugee camps in Turkey, Jordan, etc., etc.

This is a very complex issue and I could not help but to respond to your over-simplifying comment.

Oh yes, you are absolutely right....those who made it to Europe were to a great extent well off, certainly well enough to pay the smugglers. The poorer once collected money in the whole family and only sent one person, mostly a male, which explains the high percentage of young males among the refugees in Europe.

Very complex indeed, i did not try to simplify it though, i just wanted to point out that Merkel's decision to let refugees in has little to do with the current anti-migrant sentiment in the UK. That sentiment is to a great extent against the EU migrants who moved in the last years to the UK for work, e.g. Poles, Czechs, Hungarians etc.

Nobody complained as long as they broke their backs in the fields harvesting vegetables and fruits for a salary of GBP2-4/hour but now the more educated young generation started to take the higher paid jobs and the outrage of the UK citizens is heard on every corner. But they are not different to any other nations, in every country where you have these kind of migrant waves you have the locals fearing for all sorts of "status quo 's".

 

[labrat]

Best thing to ever happen. I envy you Britain. The left cant accept a demochratic vote though so they wont make it easy for britain.

 

[zebedy]

If you read all the comments of this petition all the people that voted to leave are racists and bigots and It's not fair that the rest of the UK benefits from the wealth and intelligence of London. .

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[labrat]

If you read all the comments of this petition all the people that voted to leave are racists and bigots and It's not fair that the rest of the UK benefits from the wealth and intelligence of London. .

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It's so funny. Japan doesn't let a single f**k into Japan, and yet they're looked upon as a strong and admirable nation. But god forbid Britain ever said enough, then they're all racist. I don't get it. Look at what happened in former Yugoslavia. Trust me, people in other parts of Europe have different experiences of multi culturalism than the naive people of the north.

EU will fall flat on it's ass and it's a good thing. Why should those rich asshole pigs in Brussels decide for other nations. Britain was doing well without EU and they will do good now. Besides, neither Norway nor Switzerland needs EU and still they're one of the strongest nations in Europe. The EU is the socialists way to control the people of Europe. But as I said before, socialists don't accept a democratic vote. They're not going to let Britain go.

 

[dunover]

Oh yes, you are absolutely right....those who made it to Europe were to a great extent well off, certainly well enough to pay the smugglers. The poorer once collected money in the whole family and only sent one person, mostly a male, which explains the high percentage of young males among the refugees in Europe.

Very complex indeed, i did not try to simplify it though, i just wanted to point out that Merkel's decision to let refugees in has little to do with the current anti-migrant sentiment in the UK. That sentiment is to a great extent against the EU migrants who moved in the last years to the UK for work, e.g. Poles, Czechs, Hungarians etc.

Nobody complained as long as they broke their backs in the fields harvesting vegetables and fruits for a salary of GBP2-4/hour but now the more educated young generation started to take the higher paid jobs and the outrage of the UK citizens is heard on every corner. But they are not different to any other nations, in every country where you have these kind of migrant waves you have the locals fearing for all sorts of "status quo 's".

Yes, it has -you couldn't be more wrong. People were shocked by the behaviour of them in Germany and the stories from Sweden, Norway and Holland, so are concerned EU will pressurize us into accepting more non-aligned 'refugees' from M.East, Africa, Afghanistan etc. They saw the vile behaviour of them in Germany plus we've had organized muslim paedophilia/rape to deal with from those already 'naturalized' from our own Commonwealth. Then there was a fear the German lot would be given citizenship and head here. Plus the potential for more poor countries like Albania and further down the line, especially Turkey being allowed to join. The E.Europeans are a fraction of the issue.

We saw Camoron and Gordon Brown lie about the amount that would come here from E.Europe "Don't worry, 15-30,000 probably" and millions turned up when the last tranche of E.European nations joined. So can you blame people for the final straw?

Harry - you seem to be making opinions sound like facts based on the filtered news and social media you read. Ask those whom live here what they privately feel, and could express in the ballot box without being labelled 'far right' or 'racist'. Your statements echo the lines we were fed before the referendum, and explain why people did vote to leave.

 

[Harry_BKK]

It's so funny. Japan doesn't let a single f**k into Japan, and yet they're looked upon as a strong and admirable nation. But god forbid Britain ever said enough, then they're all racist. I don't get it. Look at what happened in former Yugoslavia. Trust me, people in other parts of Europe have different experiences of multi culturalism than the naive people of the north.

EU will fall flat on it's ass and it's a good thing. Why should those rich asshole pigs in Brussels decide for other nations. Britain was doing well without EU and they will do good now. Besides, neither Norway nor Switzerland needs EU and still they're one of the strongest nations in Europe. The EU is the socialists way to control the people of Europe. But as I said before, socialists don't accept a democratic vote. They're not going to let Britain go.

We can start now to recall history if you bring Japan into this. Admirable??? How many countries did they invade just in the past 200 years and slaughtered whole generations in some, e.g. Singapore. Did they ever ask if they were allowed to enter the country?

How many countries did the UK invade in their history? Did they care if the locals wanted them...certainly not. In contrary they would be added to the British Empire and British rule was imposed onto them, no chance for a referendum.

You, the French, were not much better as any other nation that was in the race to colonize as much as possible of the then "new world". Did anybody ask the native people if they wanted immigrants?

Part of the immigrant problems go back to that colonial history. The UK allowing Commonwealth citizens into the UK, the French from their African and Caribbean colonies, hell, you even invited them to come if they fought on your side in the last African war which saw Algeria declaring independence.

Germany created its own problem as they needed labor after WWII and invited Jugoslaws, Turks and Italians, initially for 5 years, but in the end hardly anybody returned.

Common to the above is that people will always migrate if they think/believe that going to a different country/part of the world will give them a better life.

 

[labrat]

We can start now to recall history if you bring Japan into this. Admirable??? How many countries did they invade just in the past 200 years and slaughtered whole generations in some, e.g. Singapore. Did they ever ask if they were allowed to enter the country?

How many countries did the UK invade in their history? Did they care if the locals wanted them...certainly not. In contrary they would be added to the British Empire and British rule was imposed onto them, no chance for a referendum.

You, the French, were not much better as any other nation that was in the race to colonize as much as possible of the then "new world". Did anybody ask the native people if they wanted immigrants?

Part of the immigrant problems go back to that colonial history. The UK allowing Commonwealth citizens into the UK, the French from their African and Caribbean colonies, hell, you even invited them to come if they fought on your side in the last African war which saw Algeria declaring independence.

Germany created its own problem as they needed labor after WWII and invited Jugoslaws, Turks and Italians, initially for 5 years, but in the end hardly anybody returned.

Common to the above is that people will always migrate if they think/believe that going to a different country/part of the world will give them a better life.

So, what is your point? If your agenda is to wave the racist card around then I'm not really interested. Your side usually never have any better arguments.

The Brits have every democratic right to decide for themselves and so they have done. I see absolutely nothing positive about the current development of Europe. The socialists are so fast with pointing their fingers at the eastern Europeans, calling them racists and biggots, still you have no idea what they've been through historically when it comes to muslims and multi cultural differences. You just sit on your high horses in your pretty neighbourhoods far from reality and dream about your pretty multicultural worlds while in reality you dont want your kids to grow up in these ethnic suburbs, no go zones, where islamists have their own rules. It's crap. I see nothing positive about it in any way so neither does a majority of the brittish people obviously. I think the time has come when people are saying enough. The majority have never agreed to this! They were sheeped to accept it because of pressure from social media and the political correct assholes.

It's funny that the socialists and feminists who claim to stand on the barricades for women and gay rights also defend a culture and ideology that hates the very same thing. You people are so confused it's not even funny anymore.

And to be honest, I don't give a rats ass if you call me racist. I know where I stand. I don't care if you are red, black or blue, but if you come here, you assimilate and adapt. If not, well f**k off.

 

[Harry_BKK]

Yes, it has -you couldn't be more wrong. People were shocked by the behaviour of them in Germany and the stories from Sweden, Norway and Holland, so are concerned EU will pressurize us into accepting more non-aligned 'refugees' from M.East, Africa, Afghanistan etc. They saw the vile behaviour of them in Germany plus we've had organized muslim paedophilia/rape to deal with from those already 'naturalized' from our own Commonwealth. Then there was a fear the German lot would be given citizenship and head here. Plus the potential for more poor countries like Albania and further down the line, especially Turkey being allowed to join. The E.Europeans are a fraction of the issue.

We saw Camoron and Gordon Brown lie about the amount that would come here from E.Europe "Don't worry, 15-30,000 probably" and millions turned up when the last tranche of E.European nations joined. So can you blame people for the final straw?

Harry - you seem to be making opinions sound like facts based on the filtered news and social media you read. Ask those whom live here what they privately feel, and could express in the ballot box without being labelled 'far right' or 'racist'. Your statements echo the lines we were fed before the referendum, and explain why people did vote to leave.

Sorry, but you couldn't be more wrong. I am merely an observer from far far away and do like to have good political and controversial discussions.

I was born in Romania as part of the German minority, emigrated to Germany at 15, since then lived for longer periods in the UK, France and Spain and more recently in some Asian countries. Especially in the UK and France i made big efforts to study the history, learn the language, went to evening courses on colleges, etc etc., hence, i think i can say that i experienced first hand what you think are, i quote "opinions sound like facts based on the filtered news and social media you read".

People will always vote against something when they fear that their "status quo" is in danger.

And please lets not forget that the UK happily followed their big brother into the latest wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, which at the end of the day made the rise of ISIL possible which in itself then led to the current refugee crisis. Hence, if anybody is to blame for the wave of refugees and subsequent problems a good part has to go to the UK, whereas Merkel's part is rather small.

 

[labrat]

Sorry, but you couldn't be more wrong. I am merely an observer from far far away and do like to have good political and controversial discussions.

I was born in Romania as part of the German minority, emigrated to Germany at 15, since then lived for longer periods in the UK, France and Spain and more recently in some Asian countries. Especially in the UK and France i made big efforts to study the history, learn the language, went to evening courses on colleges, etc etc., hence, i think i can say that i experienced first hand what you think are, i quote "opinions sound like facts based on the filtered news and social media you read".

People will always vote against something when they fear that their "status quo" is in danger.

And please lets not forget that the UK happily followed their big brother into the latest wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, which at the end of the day made the rise of ISIL possible which in itself then led to the current refugee crisis. Hence, if anybody is to blame for the wave of refugees and subsequent problems a good part has to go to the UK, whereas Merkel's part is rather small.

So what has countries like Sweden done to be shat on by the muslims? Yeah right. I see you try your very best to find excuses to why Britain and other countries must accept thousands and thousands of muslims. They don't and that's the thing. They have no obligation to do so whatsoever. Not even their own arab neighbours takes a single refugee. We all know why most of them come here, it is pretty obvious it's about trying to get to the welfare nations. Ooooo no I said something politically incorrect. Scary.

My mother is from the former Yugoslavia. They know all about multiculturalism. Nothing positive to say at all. Not even the immigrants think it's a good thing anymore. The only ones that think it's a good thing is the ones living far away from the problem.

 

[Harry_BKK]

So, what is your point? If your agenda is to wave the racist card around then I'm not really interested. Your side usually never have any better arguments.

The Brits have every democratic right to decide for themselves and so they have done. I see absolutely nothing positive about the current development of Europe. The socialists are so fast with pointing their fingers at the eastern Europeans, calling them racists and biggots, still you have no idea what they've been through historically when it comes to muslims and multi cultural differences. You just sit on your high horses in your pretty neighbourhoods far from reality and dream about your pretty multicultural worlds while in reality you dont want your kids to grow up in these ethnic suburbs, no go zones, where islamists have their own rules. It's crap. I see nothing positive about it in any way so neither does a majority of the brittish people obviously. I think the time has come when people are saying enough. The majority have never agreed to this! They were sheeped to accept it because of pressure from social media and the political correct assholes.

It's funny that the socialists and feminists who claim to stand on the barricades for women and gay rights also defend a culture and ideology that hates the very same thing. You people are so confused it's not even funny anymore.

And to be honest, I don't give a rats ass if you call me racist. I know where I stand. I don't care if you are red, black or blue, but if you come here, you assimilate and adapt. If not, well f**k off.

So what has countries like Sweden done to be shat on by the muslims? Yeah right. I see you try your very best to find excuses to why Britain and other countries must accept thousands and thousands of muslims. They don't and that's the thing. They have no obligation to do so whatsoever. Not even their own arab neighbours takes a single refugee. We all know why most of them come here, it is pretty obvious it's about trying to get to the welfare nations. Ooooo no I said something politically incorrect. Scary.

My mother is from the former Yugoslavia. They know all about multiculturalism. Nothing positive to say at all. Not even the immigrants think it's a good thing anymore. The only ones that think it's a good thing is the ones living far away from the problem.

Why this toxic and hostile tone??? FYI, using swearwords on CasinoMeister is not part of the posting etiquette!

And why would i wave the racist card?

I lived in Montpellier for 3 years and experienced myself the ghetto like suburbs. They certainly are not a pleasant part of the city. But you have to ask why has it come to that? Immigrants had it always difficult to find their place in France, no matter which part. The government build quickly some cheap housing blocks, rushed them all in there and happily forgot about them and let them to their own peril. When CDG signed the laws off to let them in, he did not sign a single law or regulation on how to deal with the massive wave of immigrants.

Hence, the younger generation is paying the price for the failures of past generations.

I never said Britain or anybody else has to accept anybody. Please do not twist my words to fit your rant. I merely pointed out that regarding the migrant influx Merkel's part of the blame is rather small when we look at the events in the ME region over the past 15 years.

 

[goatwack]

To be fair I don't think your average Brit gives a flying monkey about what led to this current immigrant surge in the last couple of decades, that was more of the same where inept politicians paved the way for our current predicament whilst ignoring the serfs' outcries.

No different to now, we are left to accept a way of life that was not of our own choosing, it's as if we're being made to accomodate people that have very little desire to truly integrate and mostly despise the country that has taken them in.

Far easier is it to deconstruct the events from an outside perspective as one is not busy treading on social and political eggshells in their own land

 

[labrat]

The political media elite and socialists have never missed an opportunity to call its own people nazis, racist, neonazis. The political correctness is tearing Europe apart. The word "racist" is a tool used against anyone who dares critize immigration.

Brexit happened because the EU byrocrats cant do their job and because they are anti democratic.

I'm pretty sure that people can see for themselves what is going on and how things have developed in recent years. Not even the massive propaganda from the leftist media can save you now. Either we leave the EU and close the borders to take control again, or we will have a massive war between cultures in Europe in the future. There is no other way around it. What Merkel and people such as yourself have done in order to win kindness points and likes on Facebook is to put us all in danger. Even the christian arabs are worried about it all voting for right wing politicians.

I don't understand why Britain would want to be EU:s bitch anyway. Britain is a proud and strong nation, one of the strongest economics in the world. They need EU just as little as Norway and Switzerland does. And if the Scots wants to leave Britain to remain with EU, then go ahead. I'm sure Germany would willingly send them a few hundred thousand muslims.

 

[Harry_BKK]

The political media elite and socialists have never missed an opportunity to call its own people nazis, racist, neonazis. The political correctness is tearing Europe apart. The word "racist" is a tool used against anyone who dares critize immigration.

Brexit happened because the EU byrocrats cant do their job and because they are anti democratic.

I'm pretty sure that people can see for themselves what is going on and how things have developed in recent years. Not even the massive propaganda from the leftist media can save you now. Either we leave the EU and close the borders to take control again, or we will have a massive war between cultures in Europe in the future. There is no other way around it. What Merkel*** and people such as yourself have done in order to win kindness points and likes on Facebook is to put us all in danger. Even the christian arabs are worried about it all voting for right wing politicians.

I don't understand why Britain would want to be EU:s bitch anyway. Britain is a proud and strong nation, one of the strongest economics in the world. They need EU just as little as Norway and Switzerland does. And if the Scots wants to leave Britain to remain with EU, then go ahead. I'm sure Germany would willingly send them a few hundred thousand muslims.

Geez, you are a bitter soul. Why are you so angry? Have you signed up to this forum just to post your rants?

*** Are you for real? You don't even know me and what i do. And what danger are you in?

FYI, Norway and Switzerland are members of the EEA, suggesting they DO need the EU for their prosperity.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Yes, it has -you couldn't be more wrong. People were shocked by the behaviour of them in Germany and the stories from Sweden, Norway and Holland, so are concerned EU will pressurize us into accepting more non-aligned 'refugees' from M.East, Africa, Afghanistan etc. They saw the vile behaviour of them in Germany plus we've had organized muslim paedophilia/rape to deal with from those already 'naturalized' from our own Commonwealth. Then there was a fear the German lot would be given citizenship and head here. Plus the potential for more poor countries like Albania and further down the line, especially Turkey being allowed to join. The E.Europeans are a fraction of the issue.

We saw Camoron and Gordon Brown lie about the amount that would come here from E.Europe "Don't worry, 15-30,000 probably" and millions turned up when the last tranche of E.European nations joined. So can you blame people for the final straw?

Harry - you seem to be making opinions sound like facts based on the filtered news and social media you read. Ask those whom live here what they privately feel, and could express in the ballot box without being labelled 'far right' or 'racist'. Your statements echo the lines we were fed before the referendum, and explain why people did vote to leave.

This is where political correctness got in the way of common sense and respect for law and order, let alone respect for the country in which you are a guest until you meet the criteria for citizenship. What was even worse than the bad behaviour was the unwillingness of the authorities to deal with it robustly purely because the perpetrators were from a "protected minority". The Rotherham scandal revealed that police were trying to airbrush the truth that was emerging, that the majority of offenders appeared to be young Asian men, but they couldn't bring themselves to say this because of political correctness. Instead, they blamed the children who were victims for allowing themselves to be drawn into it. Britain wasn't alone either, a lack of willingness to police large numbers of young males who had come over with none of their own women lead to their behaviour becoming ever more arrogant and extreme, sometimes even by the standards of their own culture, let alone ours.

These were not seen as migrants coming here to contribute, they were seen as migrants coming here to run amok and try to destroy our way of life and replace it with theirs. Of course, when Merkel said even more were welcome, many other countries in the EU were just as unhappy as the UK, and a few went to some real extremes that the UK would not even consider. Some built fences with razor wire and shut refugees out, others confiscated everything but the shirts off the backs of arrivals to pay for their keep, and probably intended to send a message that would deter others from coming. In Germany and France, where the culture is long term rental rather than home ownership, locals were being kicked out of the homes they had been in for decades in order for them to be given to arriving migrants. This of course played right into the hands of the far right, even though actual instances of this were pretty rare.

The backlash may not necessarily die down as people in other countries might see leaving the EU as a way to deal with their own migrant problems, and it will be the far right groups that will lead the fight, which isn't going to be pleasant.

 

[Dinahnana]

This is where political correctness got in the way of common sense and respect for law and order, let alone respect for the country in which you are a guest until you meet the criteria for citizenship. What was even worse than the bad behaviour was the unwillingness of the authorities to deal with it robustly purely because the perpetrators were from a "protected minority". The Rotherham scandal revealed that police were trying to airbrush the truth that was emerging, that the majority of offenders appeared to be young Asian men, but they couldn't bring themselves to say this because of political correctness. Instead, they blamed the children who were victims for allowing themselves to be drawn into it. Britain wasn't alone either, a lack of willingness to police large numbers of young males who had come over with none of their own women lead to their behaviour becoming ever more arrogant and extreme, sometimes even by the standards of their own culture, let alone ours.

These were not seen as migrants coming here to contribute, they were seen as migrants coming here to run amok and try to destroy our way of life and replace it with theirs. Of course, when Merkel said even more were welcome, many other countries in the EU were just as unhappy as the UK, and a few went to some real extremes that the UK would not even consider. Some built fences with razor wire and shut refugees out, others confiscated everything but the shirts off the backs of arrivals to pay for their keep, and probably intended to send a message that would deter others from coming. In Germany and France, where the culture is long term rental rather than home ownership, locals were being kicked out of the homes they had been in for decades in order for them to be given to arriving migrants. This of course played right into the hands of the far right, even though actual instances of this were pretty rare.

The backlash may not necessarily die down as people in other countries might see leaving the EU as a way to deal with their own migrant problems, and it will be the far right groups that will lead the fight, which isn't going to be pleasant.

The irony in all of this is the negative attitude (rightly in some instances I might add) leads to more immigrants to become radicalized which leads to even more violence. I don't think shutting the borders is going to help with this at this point in time.

So what will the future of Europe be? Each country closing its border and becoming suspicious and hostile of minorities? This is a dangerous slippery slope and I am reminded by the quote

Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.

So lets pray that the far right does not gain power otherwise we could be looking at a very bleak future for everybody.

 

[labrat]

So what will the future of Europe be? Each country closing its border and becoming suspicious and hostile of minorities? This is a dangerous slippery slope and I am reminded by the quote So lets pray that the far right does not gain power otherwise we could be looking at a very bleak future for everybody.

There you go again with your boring racist card. So just because countries want to decide their own immigration politics and control their borders to prevent millions of muslims who dont have a single intention of integrating and who without any control pass border after border while islamists pose a very real and serious threat and while the political correct (like in Germany) try to cover up the crimes of the muslims, it will turn Europe into supernazieurope? The only sane thing to do here is to say stop, this isn't working. Close the borders, take control and make sure those who are already here assimilate and integrate. Not to stay on the same stupid road while the ghettos grow and cultures become even more divided and suspicious against each other.

 

[ternur]

Some how this thread has turned its focus mainly on immigration (again).

Folks should keep in mind, that blaming immigration and/or EU is really not the problem. The problem are national, democratically elected parliaments, and their failures. The EU did not pop out from the vacuum. National parliaments gave it all its power.

Evil EU? Bad policies? I don't like immigration?

Rather than blaming EU and its actions, and seeing immigration as a reason for your own problems, take a look at the bigger picture. No nation on earth has born out of empty space.

Sure the immigration has its problems, no one can deny that. But the comments on it often come out looking like generalisations. And that's just intellectually poor.

 

[labrat]

Geez, you are a bitter soul. Why are you so angry? Have you signed up to this forum just to post your rants?

*** Are you for real? You don't even know me and what i do. And what danger are you in?

FYI, Norway and Switzerland are members of the EEA, suggesting they DO need the EU for their prosperity.

If you seriously have to ask why I am angry then you are just as big of a problem as the politicians who hide away and live in their fairy tale world while the people have to deal with the real world.

And I signed up to this forum for the same reason as most here. It's not your business what I want to discuss or not I think, or are you the moderator?

FYI, Norway and Switzerland are still not a part of the EU and neither has it cause them any problems. And from what I can see, countries like Croatia and Slovenia or Greece haven't profited very much by joining EU. They were doing just as good without it. Today economy and unemplyment is even worse then ever. Britain was doing good without EU, I'm pretty sure they will do well without it. It's unfortunate that the mainstream media propaganda has managed to scare you into thinking it's the end of the world

 

[The Dude]

If you seriously have to ask why I am angry then you are just as big of a problem as the politicians who hide away and live in their fairy tale world while the people have to deal with the real world.

And I signed up to this forum for the same reason as most here. It's not your business what I want to discuss or not I think, or are you the moderator?

FYI, Norway and Switzerland are still not a part of the EU and neither has it cause them any problems. And from what I can see, countries like Croatia and Slovenia or Greece haven't profited very much by joining EU. They were doing just as good without it. Today economy and unemplyment is even worse then ever. Britain was doing good without EU, I'm pretty sure they will do well without it. It's unfortunate that the mainstream media propaganda has managed to scare you into thinking it's the end of the world

This guy is nothing but a troll. Hes has another account which has a PAB in process - a PAB where he's being accused of having multiple accounts.

In case you were wondering who the jerk-off was, this is him:
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/41312/

 

[Harry_BKK]

This guy is nothing but a troll. Hes has another account which has a PAB in process - a PAB where he's being accused of having multiple accounts.

Expert in multiple accounts eh?!

 

[Harry_BKK]

Some how this thread has turned its focus mainly on immigration (again).

Folks should keep in mind, that blaming immigration and/or EU is really not the problem. The problem are national, democratically elected parliaments, and their failures. The EU did not pop out from the vacuum. National parliaments gave it all its power.

Evil EU? Bad policies? I don't like immigration?

Rather than blaming EU and its actions, and seeing immigration as a reason for your own problems, take a look at the bigger picture. No nation on earth has born out of empty space.

Sure the immigration has its problems, no one can deny that. But the comments on it often come out looking like generalisations. And that's just intellectually poor.

Very well said!

 

[Tirilej]

This guy is nothing but a troll. Hes has another account which has a PAB in process - a PAB where he's being accused of having multiple accounts.

In case you were wondering who the jerk-off was, this is him:
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/41312/

I thought I recongnized his way of writing.
That was a Swedish guy I had a lot of discussions with. I'm not surprized with him being a racist either.
Thought he was a little smarter though since he claimed to be working within the police

 

[Dinahnana]

I just read an article on the Irish Independent about the possibility of the EU forcing higher corporation tax. At the moment Ireland has a 12.5% corporation tax which is vital to our economy's recovery (we have to attract and keep businesses here). Well a few Irish officials state that this is a red line issue and if pushed by the EU to change this we might be out of the EU too. Holy crap See this quote from this mornings paper

I am very pro EU but this knee jerk reaction by Brussels may even make me re-think the European Union. What a mess!

Plus the Asian and Australian markets are taking a beating with declines in companies that have UK exposure. I predict many angry bankers in the coming days. Good lord I hope Trump doesn't get voted into the White House come November because that would make everything worse.

Our regime is expected to come under renewed scrutiny in the wake of Britain's exit as they were our strongest ally in fending off demands for tax harmonisation.
But Fine Gael MEP Brian Hayes told the Irish Independent: "That is the absolute red line issue. Any attempt made to cajole us [on corporation tax], as far as I'm concerned, we're out the door.

"We cannot be tied into an anti-business, anti-growth pact while the Brits are allowed to move on.

"We have a lot more to lose than anybody else."

Ireland holds a veto over any changes to our tax system, but sources said the current turmoil will see everything put on the table as EU leaders struggle to deal with the fallout from a Brexit.

 

[Harry_BKK]

I just read an article on the Irish Independent about the possibility of the EU forcing higher corporation tax. At the moment Ireland has a 12.5% corporation tax which is vital to our economy's recovery (we have to attract and keep businesses here). Well a few Irish officials state that this is a red line issue and if pushed by the EU to change this we might be out of the EU too. Holy crap See this quote from this mornings paper

I am very pro EU but this knee jerk reaction by Brussels may even make me re-think the European Union. What a mess!

Plus the Asian and Australian markets are taking a beating with declines in companies that have UK exposure. I predict many angry bankers in the coming days. Good lord I hope Trump doesn't get voted into the White House come November because that would make everything worse.

To be honest, any news, scaremongering, announcements, the never missing confidential leaks from someone allegedly closely involved etc etc..... i would all take with a large grain of salt.

There will be huge amounts of nonsense published in all media, scaring the people for the only reason that is to present the next bombshell.

Once the dust settles after another few trillion are wiped off on the share markets and more senseless discussions/interviews in the media, common sense will prevail and some way forward/compromise will be found.

 

[KasinoKing]

I just read an article on the Irish Independent about the possibility of the EU forcing higher corporation tax. At the moment Ireland has a 12.5% corporation tax which is vital to our economy's recovery (we have to attract and keep businesses here). Well a few Irish officials state that this is a red line issue and if pushed by the EU to change this we might be out of the EU too. Holy crap See this quote from this mornings paper

I am very pro EU but this knee jerk reaction by Brussels may even make me re-think the European Union. What a mess!

Well the EU will be £350 million a week poorer after we leave - they have to make up that money somewhere

To be honest, any news, scaremongering, announcements, the never missing confidential leaks from someone allegedly closely involved etc etc..... i would all take with a large grain of salt.

There will be huge amounts of nonsense published in all media, scaring the people for the only reason that is to present the next bombshell.

Once the dust settles after another few trillion are wiped off on the share markets and more senseless discussions/interviews in the media, common sense will prevail and some way forward/compromise will be found.

Ditto

There was a load of old bollocks spoken before the vote, and there will be a load of old bollocks spoken after the vote.
I'm just going to sit back, wait & see...
Que sera, sera.

KK

 

[Harry_BKK]

Well the EU will be £350 million a week poorer after we leave - they have to make up that money somewhere

Ditto

There was a load of old bollocks spoken before the vote, and there will be a load of old bollocks spoken after the vote.
I'm just going to sit back, wait & see...
**Que sera, sera.

KK

Geez that number just won't go away .....especially because it is completely exaggerated. UK's net contributions varied in the past decade between £110-190Mio weekly.

**Great quote KK

 

[aceking123]

Geez that number just won't go away .....especially because it is completely exaggerated. UK's net contributions varied in the past decade between £110-190Mio weekly.

**Great quote KK

case is after refunds etc etc the figure is around 185 million per week , still charity should start from home

 

[Harry_BKK]

case is after refunds etc etc the figure is around 185 million per week , still charity should start from home

Currently it is roughly that amount, haven't made the effort to check the exact number, sorry

Since the contributions are a percentage of the GDP though, that number fluctuated over the years, hence why my numbers.

 

[aceking123]

Currently it is roughly that amount, haven't made the effort to check the exact number, sorry

Since the contributions are a percentage of the GDP though, that number fluctuated over the years, hence why my numbers.

yep no problem these numbers have been crunched in every way this is a average on weekly , so your high end in spot on. this was made available two weeks before the vote cant recall where i got it , but it was a good source.

 

[thebigs]

I was told that the Scots where all conceived via anal sex,but personally I think that is very harsh

Just wondering if your English players tonight were conceived by some weird way.

 

[geordiecolin]

Just wondering if your English players tonight were conceived by some weird way.

Ha ha

I am now formulation a petition to hand in to the government for a replay of the England/Iceland game

 

[jetset]

Gibraltar talking with Scotland re staying in the EU....

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[vinylweatherman]

I wonder if those UK business leaders who wanted us to remain would hold the same view if the EU does now forge ahead with a higher rate of corporation tax as standard for all member countries. If they do, it would be suicide as the UK could see a sudden surge of inward investment as companies consider a lower corporation tax rate as worth the hassle of trading from a newly non EU country. Of course, this would then lead to a new wave of immigration, albeit on the new points based system, and those who voted for Brexit purely for racist reasons will end up even worse off. Even more reports coming in of racist aggression as people are being told "we voted for Brexit, now go home", this being based largely on skin colour, rather than any knowledge of their status in the UK.

 

[Dinahnana]

Gibraltar talking with Scotland re staying in the EU....

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Interesting I wonder if it's still possible to be part of the UK and still be in the EU? That potentially could be the answer to NI, Scotland and Gibraltar without going through even more political turmoil. That option could bring unity back to the UK. It will be interesting to see what occurs. Although being in the EU means open borders so I am not sure that would work. It would be a good resolution though in my opinion.

 

[Dinahnana]

I wonder if those UK business leaders who wanted us to remain would hold the same view if the EU does now forge ahead with a higher rate of corporation tax as standard for all member countries. If they do, it would be suicide as the UK could see a sudden surge of inward investment as companies consider a lower corporation tax rate as worth the hassle of trading from a newly non EU country. Of course, this would then lead to a new wave of immigration, albeit on the new points based system, and those who voted for Brexit purely for racist reasons will end up even worse off. Even more reports coming in of racist aggression as people are being told "we voted for Brexit, now go home", this being based largely on skin colour, rather than any knowledge of their status in the UK.

Who knows what is in the head of Brussels but I doubt many EU countries would go for that higher corporation rate as it would decrease growth in their countries. I know my country will definitely not go for that neither will it go for a creation of a so called Superstate giving more power to Brussels. I know the Irish will not stand for that, not sure about our politicians though.

 

[geordiecolin]

I wonder if those UK business leaders who wanted us to remain would hold the same view if the EU does now forge ahead with a higher rate of corporation tax as standard for all member countries. If they do, it would be suicide as the UK could see a sudden surge of inward investment as companies consider a lower corporation tax rate as worth the hassle of trading from a newly non EU country. Of course, this would then lead to a new wave of immigration, albeit on the new points based system, and those who voted for Brexit purely for racist reasons will end up even worse off. Even more reports coming in of racist aggression as people are being told "we voted for Brexit, now go home", this being based largely on skin colour, rather than any knowledge of their status in the UK.

I do not trust reports of who are behind these racist attacks one jot.

 

[Dinahnana]

I do not trust reports of who are behind these racist attacks one jot.

Not sure what you mean? Are you saying that they are made up?

 

[geordiecolin]

Not sure what you mean? Are you saying that they are made up?

It would not be the first time that organisations,institutions or political parties have orchestrated events to advance their cause or arguments.

How often are a few isolated incidents of fairly minor events highlighted by politicians and broadcast in the media while big newsworthy events are utterly ignored?
When it suits them.
Its all spin and manipulation with a very sinister aim

 

[Dinahnana]

It would not be the first time that organisations,institutions or political parties have orchestrated events to advance their cause or arguments

I don't think they are making it up. I saw a few interviews with a small amount of people giving the reason why they voted to leave because they are sick of the migrants taking over or something to that effect. These people seemed very hostile to me. Just because you yourself would conduct yourself in a civilized manner doesn't mean everybody does.

I lived in the UK in the early 90's for a short period and although I found the English as a whole to be lovely people I did come across anti-Irish sentiment and was on the receiving end of some very nasty comments.


Edit: It only takes a few people getting away with racist actions for the situation to become out of control. So bringing these few incidents out into the light so to speak will hopefully prevent more serious problems

 

[geordiecolin]

I don't think they are making it up. I saw a few interviews with a small amount of people giving the reason why they voted to leave because they are sick of the migrants taking over or something to that effect. These people seemed very hostile to me. Just because you yourself would conduct yourself in a civilized manner doesn't mean everybody does.

I lived in the UK in the early 90's for a short period and although I found the English as a whole to be lovely people I did come across anti-Irish sentiment and was on the receiving end of some very nasty comments.


Edit: It only takes a few people getting away with racist actions for the situation to become out of control. So bringing these few incidents out into the light so to speak will hopefully prevent more serious problems

They will always be able to find knuckleheads to spout their bile when they want too. A few incidents can be handled a number of ways. Highlighting them adds fuel to a tiny spark. Governments and institutions use such events for their own purposes and can suppress them too.
We have protest marches from what many may feel are very worthy causes which never get an inch of coverage in the papers or a mention on tv yet a few incidents are mentioned repeatedly by politicians as if all those who voted leave are Racist xenophobes.
I do not buy it 

 

[Dinahnana]

They will always be able to find knuckleheads to spout their bile when they want too. A few incidents can be handled a number of ways. Highlighting them adds fuel to a tiny spark. Governments and institutions use such events for their own purposes and can suppress them too.
We have protest marches from what many may feel are very worthy causes which never get an inch of coverage in the papers or a mention on tv yet a few incidents are mentioned repeatedly by politicians as if all those who voted leave are Racist xenophobes.
I do not buy it 

That is your right to disagree.

 

[goatwack]

Can we just undo the last week and un-Brexit ourselves? Maybe UEFA will also let us replay the Iceland game as the players were under emotional duress and couldn't concentrate an' that.

We're not out of Europe, we're not of Europe, we're not out of Europe la la la la la la la (covers ears)

 

[Jd666]

Can we just undo the last week and un-Brexit ourselves? Maybe UEFA will also let us replay the Iceland game as the players were under emotional duress and couldn't concentrate an' that.

We're not out of Europe, we're not of Europe, we're not out of Europe la la la la la la la (covers ears)

The England team didnt vote in the Referendum.
Not because they were in France.
It was because they dont know how to put a cross in the box.

* Nicked off Facebook

 

[goatwack]

The England team didnt vote in the Referendum.
Not because they were in France.
It was because they dont know how to put a cross in the box.

* Nicked off Facebook

Ba-dum tish

-Also the sound of Joe Hart, dropping yet another clanger

 

[maxd]

xenophobia - n, an abnormal fear or hatred of foreigners and strange things.

racism - n
1. (Sociology) the belief that races have distinctive cultural characteristics determined by hereditary factors and that this endows some races with an intrinsic superiority over others.
2. (Sociology) abusive or aggressive behaviour towards members of another race on the basis of such a belief.

My point being that they're not the same thing.

Judging from the reports that I've seen -- local and abroad -- there's good evidence to indicate that the primary issue for many Leave voters was, in fact, immigration and the need to "stem the tide". Time and again the "immigrants have ruined this country", or "stop immigration and we'll have our country back" lines are repeated ad nauseum. This is xenophobia, the fear or hatred of foreigners, not racism.

The problem is that there really is no "tide" of immigrants in the UK. The figure of 350,000+ immigrants to the UK is often cited and for the sake of argument let's take it as a baseline. The commentary coming from the Brexit campaign and echoed by many Leave voters is that that rate is "completely unsustainable". Ball-parking the UK population at roughly 60 million this number then represents an immigration rate of roughly 0.6%.

The fact is that the UK immigration rate of 0.6% should not really be a problem. For instance Canada, with roughly half the population of the UK, has a perfectly sustainable rate of net immigration at approximately 250,000 per year, or about 0.8%. No significant reports of overwhelming "tides of immigrants" there. I've seen references to economic studies into immigration and fiscal stability and it seems to be generally agreed that anything up to about 1% population increase via immigration year-on-year should be no problem for a healthy Western economy.

And yet I hear senior UK politicians repeat time and again that they're shooting for immigration "in the 10s of thousands". Let's say they mean 50,000, for the sake of discussion. That's 0.08%, one tenth of what Canada sustains year on year! Not only is that a ridiculously low number it's not even considered healthy because Western economies need population growth for sustained economic health and the birth rates are way too low by far.

Want to say "but there is no room for them"? Sorry, not true. Back to Canada for example: almost everyone in Canada lives within a few of the major cities, especially the new immigrants. Same in Australia and many other countries. Sure, London is ridiculously crowded but that's because so many people want to be there, not because there is "no room."

So, is the UK different in some way such that a modest rate of immigration is not sustainable? Or is it something in the character of the people that makes the current rate appear unsustainable.

Coming from a country (Canada) where immigration is generally accepted as a completely normal and necessary part of the country's character I'd have to say that the hew and cry I hear about immigrants here in the UK is a little puzzling. I currently live in Scotland and TBH it feels rather like Canada in some ways: lots of people from lots of places speaking their languages and getting on about their business. No major upset here afaict so ... where's the beef?

I've heard it said more than once by English and Scottish observers -- sorry, don't spend much time elsewhere in the UK -- that the "real" issue is that "people don't like to hear foreign languages on their High Streets." Maybe that's a fair description of the situation, maybe it isn't, but it is a fine example of xenophobia. And I'd say that if that's how you or the folks you call your fellow citizens feel then guess what, you're xenophobic! That certainly doesn't mean your are racist but it is a big step in that direction. And if xenophobic attitudes are accepted as the norm in your neck of the woods then you can bet that some percentage of your lovely neighbours will take that and run with it straight into full-blown racism. It's human nature as we all know: there are always a certain percentage who will push things too far.

Elsewhere in these discussions some have said things like "ban the Muslims, they'll never fit in" and so forth. Yeah, that's definitely xenophobic, however strongly or genuinely you may believe it. Tired of being called xenophobic? Great, don't be. Not likely to change your feelings about these things? Fair enough, your call, but if the shoe fits ...

 

[dunover]

xenophobia - n, an abnormal fear or hatred of foreigners and strange things.

racism - n
1. (Sociology) the belief that races have distinctive cultural characteristics determined by hereditary factors and that this endows some races with an intrinsic superiority over others.
2. (Sociology) abusive or aggressive behaviour towards members of another race on the basis of such a belief.

My point being that they're not the same thing.

Judging from the reports that I've seen -- local and abroad -- there's good evidence to indicate that the primary issue for many Leave voters was, in fact, immigration and the need to "stem the tide". Time and again the "immigrants have ruined this country", or "stop immigration and we'll have our country back" lines are repeated ad nauseum. This is xenophobia, the fear or hatred of foreigners, not racism.

The problem is that there really is no "tide" of immigrants in the UK. The figure of 350,000+ immigrants to the UK is often cited and for the sake of argument let's take it as a baseline. The commentary coming from the Brexit campaign and echoed by many Leave voters is that that rate is "completely unsustainable". Ball-parking the UK population at roughly 60 million this number then represents an immigration rate of roughly 0.6%.

The fact is that the UK immigration rate of 0.6% should not really be a problem. For instance Canada, with roughly half the population of the UK, has a perfectly sustainable rate of net immigration at approximately 250,000 per year, or about 0.8%. No significant reports of overwhelming "tides of immigrants" there. I've seen references to economic studies into immigration and fiscal stability and it seems to be generally agreed that anything up to about 1% population increase via immigration year-on-year should be no problem for a healthy Western economy.

And yet I hear senior UK politicians repeat time and again that they're shooting for immigration "in the 10s of thousands". Let's say they mean 50,000, for the sake of discussion. That's 0.08%, one tenth of what Canada sustains year on year! Not only is that a ridiculously low number it's not even considered healthy because Western economies need population growth for sustained economic health and the birth rates are way too low by far.

So, is the UK different in some way such that a modest rate of immigration is not sustainable? Or is it something in the character of the people that makes the current rate appear unsustainable.

Coming from a country (Canada) where immigration is generally accepted as a completely normal and necessary part of the country's character I'd have to say that the hew and cry I hear about immigrants here in the UK is a little puzzling. I currently live in Scotland and TBH it feels rather like Canada in some ways: lots of people from lots of places speaking their languages and getting on about their business. No major upset here afaict so ... where's the beef?

I've heard it said more than once by English and Scottish observers -- sorry, don't spend much time elsewhere in the UK -- that the "real" issue is that "people don't like to hear foreign languages on their High Streets." Maybe that's a fair description of the situation, maybe it isn't, but it is a fine example of xenophobia. And I'd say that if that's how you or the folks you call your fellow citizens feel then guess what, you're xenophobic! That certainly doesn't mean your are racist but it is a big step in that direction. And if xenophobic attitudes are accepted as the norm in your neck of the woods then you can bet that some percentage of your lovely neighbours will take that and run with it straight into full-blown racism. It's human nature as we all know: there are always a certain percentage who will push things too far.

Elsewhere in these discussions some have said things like "ban the Muslims, they'll never fit in" and so forth. Yeah, that's definitely xenophobic, however strongly or genuinely you may believe it. Tired of being called xenophobic? Great, don't be. Not likely to change your feelings about these things? Fair enough, your call, but if the shoe fits ...

Lies, damn lies and statistics Max.

Canada is an enormous country with mineral wealth and some forests bigger than the whole UK. The UK is the most densely populated nation in Europe. This leads to stress and deterioration of the quality of life - regardless of where the immigrants appear from.

0.6% of your population supplanted annually is a colossal amount. Net migration of 350,000 is huge, literally an 'Iceland' turning up every year. It also fails to mention that this net figure consists of more than 350,000 arrivals as many UK people have ironically fled overseas because of it, so the replacement of the British population is higher than 350,000.

0.6% over 20 years is another 'London' being brought in in ONE single generation. Plus this new London will breed rapidly and double in size in 10 years. So in a third of your lifetime you have seen 25% of your population changed. This change, ironically, further down the line will so erode our native people and traditions that the 'Free Welcoming Britain' once seen from the outside and the character of it will be lost forever. Max, you moved to a very homogenous region having left a multiculti hellhole - can't the rest of us have that chance?

 

[Dinahnana]

Lies, damn lies and statistics Max.

Canada is an enormous country with mineral wealth and some forests bigger than the whole UK. The UK is the most densely populated nation in Europe. This leads to stress and deterioration of the quality of life - regardless of where the immigrants appear from.

0.6% of your population supplanted annually is a colossal amount. Net migration of 350,000 is huge, literally an 'Iceland' turning up every year. It also fails to mention that this net figure consists of more than 350,000 arrivals as many UK people have ironically fled overseas because of it, so the replacement of the British population is higher than 350,000.

0.6% over 20 years is another 'London' being brought in in ONE single generation. Plus this new London will breed rapidly and double in size in 10 years. So in a third of your lifetime you have seen 25% of your population changed. This change, ironically, further down the line will so erode our native people and traditions that the 'Free Welcoming Britain' once seen from the outside and the character of it will be lost forever. Max, you moved to a very homogenous region having left a multiculti hellhole - can't the rest of us have that chance?

Dunover you will find that Malta is technically the most densely populated country in Europe along with Belgium and The Netherlands I believe that the UK is the fourth most densely populated country in Europe.

 

[dunover]

Dunover you will find that Malta is technically the most densely populated country in Europe along with Belgium and The Netherlands I believe that the UK is the fourth most densely populated country in Europe.

Nope. UK overtook Netherlands. Technically Gibraltar is, but regardless the more people you cram into each square mile, the worse life gets.

 

[Dinahnana]

Nope. UK overtook Netherlands. Technically Gibraltar is, but regardless the more people you cram into each square mile, the worse life gets.

That was according to the Daily Mail Uk. I would actually like to see the official figures before I agree with you. Besides that was England not the entire UK.