susanjbo VS RiverBelle

[susanjbo]

Decided it was time to visit some of the old haunts and wondered over to good old RiverBell casino. Been a few years, started up a chat session on their web page and asked them some questions as i realised it had been a few years.
1) Do i still have an account?
2) Can you forward my login details to my email please, But i Dont require the password thanks?
3) May i update my details with you, like email and mobile phone? Answer - (Yes you sure can)
4) How long has it been since i last visited? Answer - (3 years)
5) Seems my account is locked when i try to login, is there an issue with it? Answer - No issue, would you like me to unlock it!
6) Can you please confirm that my account is in good order and without issue with administration as i am now a little concerned that the account had been locked? Answer - I assure you your account is fine as i have gone over it and was locked due to inactivity.
7)Ok, so your sure. im not going to get any nasty surprizes now am i, - Answer - No Would you like me to unlock your account.


Made one deposit $140, played basicly what i always play, mega moola, major millions and that santa game. - No card games, no poker, no roulete, no table games, just a couple slots. Lost all that , but i did have some game achievements i wanted to at least claim by a few more spins which would have netted me $500 to continue to play with.

Anyway, go make a coffee, come back and try to log in and the casino has locked me out.

Straight onto new chat session, after 15 mins of blah blah and finally getting the responce of " You will need to contact the day staff as i am unable to unlock your account." And the reason he gave was vauge, "Negative activity detected" And no answer as to what that comment actually meant.
I Suggested that he refund my initial deposit and to leave the account locked as after this i had no intention of playing here again. The fact that there was no clear answer as to why, nor was there a person with the ability to resolve the issue at that time so they say, made me even more suspicious of what was going on at Riverbell. I conclude, too many differing storys and restricting players from finishing their free games is the same as with holding cash.


(CHAT SESSION 1 2, and 3) with RIVERBELL WAS SAVED)


Heres a snippett of chat session 3, or my last convo............

Welcome to Casino Support, MarleM will be right with you.

MarleM
Hi, thank you for contacting Casino Support and welcome to Live Help Facility. My name is Marlé,how may I assist you today?

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Me
Hi Marie.

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Me
As my account was locked this morning without notice and straight after i deposited, can u arrange for my deposit to be refunded please and close any accounts i have with these casinos. As i have already had a long drawn out convo previously and i assume he noted it down in my account.

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MarleM
Let me have a look for you. For security reasons, please can you confirm your date of birth, email address and your telephone number?

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14 mins later.


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MarleM
Thank you for your details.

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me
Is there a problem?

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MarleM
I wont be much longer

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MarleM
Thank you for waiting, your patience is appreciated.

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MarleM
Regrettably i cannot refund any funds to your account as you have played it all out and there is a zero balance in your casino account ******** .

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MarleM
As for your accounts that were locked , i will look into why they were locked and if they will remain locked. We will notify you on any changes if there are any.

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Me
But its acceptable to lock an account after a deposit was made ? thats not the main issue, the fact that i missed out on claiming my game achievements is even worse and of far more value. Far as im concerned i expect a refund as i believe you purposely locked my account and hindering my ability to claim moneys that are not wins but earnt on some games. . And i make this claim in reference to my previous conversation with a staff member here. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

MarleM
@@@ you have played out the deposit and the bonus, i cannot refund you for anything as there was nothing taken from you. We are looking into the reason behind your accounts being locked as there was negative activity detected. We will inform you of any changes if there are any. Sorry if this is upsetting but we value security.

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Me
what is negative activity? because i decided not to play with u guys for several years? May I suggest you read prior chat sessions from today, or i can paste them here for you, i asked very clear and direct questions to a staff member prior to reopening and depositing to make sure my account was in good sted, and not flagged after i asked why it was locked. . We made the required adjustments, i was given a very clear assurrance everything was good PRIOR, during and after conversation ended.. The casino then locks me out and prevented to continue on with the games i had intended to play.
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Me
i really suggest you take note of my first chat session, because it is appearing the casinos actions were intentional.




MarleM
please allow me a moment , i wont be long

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ten mins later

MarleM
There is no direct intention regarding locking accounts, if there is negative activity that is picked up we lock accounts. In cannot advise you on any more information regarding this .

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me
Explain negative activity in its context please! Are you infering to my absence or you suggesting negative conduct towards the casino? If so, why was my account allowed to be reopened, why was my deposit accepted, why was i not informed prior to placing funds with riverbell. With what your saying now it is very clear the casinos intention was to take deposits from me and lock my account and should i have won, refused to pay out. You can state what ever you wish, fact is, with the chat sessions i hold and the deceitfull tactics used, the the different excuses i have on hard copy, I do believe i i am in my rights to question the casinos conduct. Its was very brave i must admit. when can i expect my deposit returned to my account or deposited into my moneybookers account? That is the only outcome im going to agree too. Your casinos cannot be trusted.

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MarleM
I cannot explain anything to you or provide you with any more informations "@@@". I cannot refund a deposit which you have played out already.

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me
Ok, as this happend over ten hours ago, why was i instructed to wait untill now to have the issue resolved and assured that it would be resolved by day staff, only too be now told you dont have the ability or willing to provide satisfactory explaination ? Arnt you, "Day Staff" are you not the correct people to speak too?? Was i informed incorrectly by a previous staff member here? Or was that also just policy of casino to avoid dealing with members. I was told twice that your depsrtment would have an answer and solution, can u please provide me with one or find someone who can!

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MarleM
"@@@", your account is locked due to negative activity your account is being reviewed and looked at. If your account will be re-opened we will notify you. As the account is locked and closed I cannot provide you with any information at this time.

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me
ok, well refund my deposit, you should never have accepted it. why was it accepted if u knew my account was to be locked?

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MarleM
AS i have mentioned previously i cannot refund anything as you have played it out. Our system picks up negativity on activity on account not on opening an account.

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me
So let me get this straight, after one deposit of $140 that was matched, and after playing only slots, and after losing it all in 15 mins, and after a playthrough return of around 54%, your system picked up on negative activity. Yes it was negative activity, its was me losing and it was very negative. im astonished that 54% player return is cause for concern with you guys?? Never heard such rubbish . Anyway, you dont make the policys so ill go onto my next question.


What juristriction governs your company can i ask? Can u please provide me with the details . Thankyou.

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me
u can email me the details if thats easier for you.


MarleM
We are governed by ECOGRA, you are more than welcome to check out the website and also email support@playersupportcentre.com if you have any more questions. I cannot provide you with any more information at this time.

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Me
Ok, one final thing, Your stance and conduct is in the giudelines of the casino and you speak officially on its behalf with your statement?

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ten mins later
MarleM
yes .

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MarleM
Is there anything else I can assist you with?

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Me
No , but thank u for your assistance.













CONCLUSION - I finally got it out of her that it wasnt because i was a industry banned player or some sort of casino scammer or card counter, It was due to my playing methods on slots. But what exactly is wrong with playing full bet on mega moola or major millions i ask?

I now dont regret playing there past 3 years and with the method in which they conducted themselves and the inconsitent answers and then finally the reluctance to give a clearer answer and she didnt bother correcting me when i assumed that the casinos accusations where because i concluded and incorrectly assumed i had a industry ban against me but was not the case should be a concern for anyone else who intends to play there. She could have at least been more clear on the offence it is claimed i committed. That being said, the offence is i now have no way to claim or continue on with free games i left and claim achievments that on average give me $500 win.


** I wont be progressing with this any further here, RiverBell i vote should be removed from the accredited listing and its subsidarys, i will just go back to my old haunts and stay there, its safer at 32 and dash i tell ya. **


** Acheivements = free games won and not completed or started **

 

[zap987]

What game achievements are you talking about that would give you $500? Story doesn't make sense without this piece of information.

 

[susanjbo]

** Acheivements = free games won and not completed or started **

prior post now edited to reflect.

 

[KasinoKing]

** Acheivements = free games won and not completed or started **

prior post now edited to reflect.

That doesn't make any sense to me...
Are you saying you played one or more slots until you got the bonus feature (free-spins) and then left the game(s) without playing them, went to another game and carried on doing this until you completely bust out?

If so, why???
If not - please can you explain more clearly what exactly you did?

KK

 

[akrus88]

Can not really understand those unplayed freespins?

 

[FAZI1]

Player make deposit example 140€ Recived some massive bonus example 100% 140€ player start with 280€ - ( Have some wagering to meet of corse becose recived bonus so must meet wagering) - Then player go to some slots make bet example 3-5€ Hit bonus runds -and dont start bonus or dont start free spins and exit from games.

Player open other slots - make same things set up bet 2-3- or 5€ finnaly hit bonus runds or free spins and again dont push start button but exit from games open other slots - and dont hit bonus runds and lose. Lose money - to 0.00 and lose wagering requements.


Next player make another deposit - Without bonus only real money - he go to this slots where colect bonus runds open this slots And Bonus rund or free spins waiting ( system remember last transanctions in this game ) -> So he collect this winings( From 10 free spins or bonus round) next he make same with secund slots where waiting free spins or bonus open this slots push Start and again collect winings.. - And He have winings without Wagering Requements - Becose his secund deposit was only real money without bonuses. ( Achivements collect in first deposit with bonus money)..... This is popular use bad practice for players who dont play clear - example in casino rewards microgamings casinos - where from (freeplay promotions player can collect 100€ bonus money for deposit 20€ and set up bet example 2€ hit free spins in 2 slots and exit from slots- lose bonus money -make deposit without wagering - colect achivements - and Have clear real money winings. In this case casinos after check game style often can void winnigs - block accont- or add bonus banned.

 

[chuchu59]

If I recall correctly the OP did have issues with a couple of casinos in the past and was not necessarily in the right. I am not sure whether this was the 'negative activity' mentioned though. Actually, I do not understand why to necessary to be hasty in retrieving the deposit and not allow things to pan out. Give them a couple of weeks to investigate unless you are in dire need of the money. Frankly, while I do not like the casino's actions ie locking the account without providing a plausible explanation they should be given some time to investigate. Is there something fishy going on?

 

[susanjbo]

I do not understand why to necessary to be hasty in retrieving the deposit and not allow things to pan out.

Simple really, if they had of bothered to email me with an explaination i may have just let it go 24 hours, but as u can see, they are very quiet on all fronts.

That doesn't make any sense to me...
Are you saying you played one or more slots until you got the bonus feature (free-spins) and then left the game(s) without playing them, went to another game and carried on doing this until you completely bust out?

If so, why???
If not - please can you explain more clearly what exactly you did?



KK

Yes, thats exactly how i play. but i didnt have the luck to get free spins on several games i might add, just one. and why u ask? Its great knowing that u have a stash waiting in case ya lose.

Player make deposit example 140€ Recived some massive bonus example 100% 140€ player start with 280€ - ( Have some wagering to meet of corse becose recived bonus so must meet wagering) - Then player go to some slots make bet example 3-5€ Hit bonus runds -and dont start bonus or dont start free spins .

Nope, i had a 100% match given too me without playthrough condition as a welcome back bonus of upto 500 in which i only used 140. And no, i was not entitled to the remaining $360 , so my intention was not to gain through bonus abuse , also received 30 free spins on thunderstruck i think.

I knocked on Riverbells front door , i was given royal treatment untill i entered the building then i got the royal shafting.

 

[Nifty29]

Player make deposit example 140€ Recived some massive bonus example 100% 140€ player start with 280€ - ( Have some wagering to meet of corse becose recived bonus so must meet wagering) - Then player go to some slots make bet example 3-5€ Hit bonus runds -and dont start bonus or dont start free spins and exit from games.

Player open other slots - make same things set up bet 2-3- or 5€ finnaly hit bonus runds or free spins and again dont push start button but exit from games open other slots - and dont hit bonus runds and lose. Lose money - to 0.00 and lose wagering requements.


Next player make another deposit - Without bonus only real money - he go to this slots where colect bonus runds open this slots And Bonus rund or free spins waiting ( system remember last transanctions in this game ) -> So he collect this winings( From 10 free spins or bonus round) next he make same with secund slots where waiting free spins or bonus open this slots push Start and again collect winings.. - And He have winings without Wagering Requements - Becose his secund deposit was only real money without bonuses. ( Achivements collect in first deposit with bonus money)..... This is popular use bad practice for players who dont play clear - example in casino rewards microgamings casinos - where from (freeplay promotions player can collect 100€ bonus money for deposit 20€ and set up bet example 2€ hit free spins in 2 slots and exit from slots- lose bonus money -make deposit without wagering - colect achivements - and Have clear real money winings. In this case casinos after check game style often can void winnigs - block accont- or add bonus banned.

IMO this is the only possible explanation.

I've seen this trick done before and it is specifically banned in the terms of many casinos as a result. Basically, you use bonus money to hit features/free spins, then don't play them out. You go to another game, rinse and repeat. When your bonus money is gone, you make a fresh bonus-free deposit and go play all the features and suddenly you have a nice chunk of change with no WR (although IIRC MGS put a fix in where such winnings would be credited as bonus money but might be wrong).

Its a ploy to scam the casino. Ever wonder why bonus terms are a mile long and quite ridiculous these days?....well that's a great example.

The OP said they were offered 100% bonus up to $500 with NO WR? Errrmm...what? Doesn't sound right to me. If it was the case, why would the OP need to stack up all their feature games until they make a new deposit? I think the OP is being economical with the truth.

Also, if there were no WR on the bonus, why would the casino lock the account for "negative activity/play"? Again, doesn't make sense.

Perhaps the bellerock rep could shed some light?

I also find the following things odd:

1. OP doesn't want to PAB. If I had feature games waiting to play I would be filing a PAB for sure....unless of course I knew exactly why my account was locked and knew it would all come out in the wash.

2. How does the OP KNOW they're going to win $500 from their feature game/s? Treasure Ireland or another AWP perhaps? I can't see how else one could predict feature winnings.

Lots of things don't smell right here.

Also, its a good example of why it is a complete waste of time expecting issues like this to be resolved live chat.

 

[mattsgame]

IMO this is the only possible explanation.

I've seen this trick done before and it is specifically banned in the terms of many casinos as a result. Basically, you use bonus money to hit features/free spins, then don't play them out. You go to another game, rinse and repeat. When your bonus money is gone, you make a fresh bonus-free deposit and go play all the features and suddenly you have a nice chunk of change with no WR (although IIRC MGS put a fix in where such winnings would be credited as bonus money but might be wrong).

That is correct, on your next deposit, what ever $ amount you still have in play will be added to your bonus balance. Once those games are played out it will still remain as bonus funds along with winnings.

As for the OP you said you had one bonus round not played out but in your opening post you said

"just a couple slots. Lost all that , but i did have some game achievements i wanted to at least claim by a few more spins which would have netted me $500 to continue to play with. "

This will always bring up red flags to the casino, but you said the bonus had no wagering? so the casino couldn't really be claiming bonus abuse? if this is indeed the case of course.

 

[chuchu59]

IMO this is the only possible explanation.

I've seen this trick done before and it is specifically banned in the terms of many casinos as a result. Basically, you use bonus money to hit features/free spins, then don't play them out. You go to another game, rinse and repeat. When your bonus money is gone, you make a fresh bonus-free deposit and go play all the features and suddenly you have a nice chunk of change with no WR (although IIRC MGS put a fix in where such winnings would be credited as bonus money but might be wrong).

Its a ploy to scam the casino. Ever wonder why bonus terms are a mile long and quite ridiculous these days?....well that's a great example.

The OP said they were offered 100% bonus up to $500 with NO WR? Errrmm...what? Doesn't sound right to me. If it was the case, why would the OP need to stack up all their feature games until they make a new deposit? I think the OP is being economical with the truth.

Also, if there were no WR on the bonus, why would the casino lock the account for "negative activity/play"? Again, doesn't make sense.

Perhaps the bellerock rep could shed some light?

I also find the following things odd:

1. OP doesn't want to PAB. If I had feature games waiting to play I would be filing a PAB for sure....unless of course I knew exactly why my account was locked and knew it would all come out in the wash.

2. How does the OP KNOW they're going to win $500 from their feature game/s? Treasure Ireland or another AWP perhaps? I can't see how else one could predict feature winnings.

Lots of things don't smell right here.

Also, its a good example of why it is a complete waste of time expecting issues like this to be resolved live chat.

While this is the likely explanation I am at a loss as to why MG allows this to happen. New players may believe its permissible though veteran players are obviously trying to take advantage. RTG, for example, does not allow this and would force you to play out the bonus round before turning to another slot/game.

Should this be an honest mistake I feel the casino should show more flexibility and not treat the player as a criminal but for players who have tried this trick over and over again well I cant fault the casino as the OP made a deposit and lost.

 

[Nifty29]

While this is the likely explanation I am at a loss as to why MG allows this to happen. New players may believe its permissible though veteran players are obviously trying to take advantage. RTG, for example, does not allow this and would force you to play out the bonus round before turning to another slot/game.

Should this be an honest mistake I feel the casino should show more flexibility and not treat the player as a criminal but for players who have tried this trick over and over again well I cant fault the casino as the OP made a deposit and lost.

susanjbo
Join Date:Sep 2007Location:australia
Posts:64
Thanks:1
Thanked 20 Times in 10 PostsRep Power:25
Reputation Points: 282

I know you're pretty biased against casinos these days chu, but I hardly think the OP qualifies as a "new player".

As Matt said, and I alluded to, the winnings would be credited as bonus money even when played out after a fresh deposit, so MGS have taken steps to combat the problem.

@susanjbo

So is this you or "your husband" posting? Just so I know who I am addressing.

The majority of your posts in this forum since you joined are about account and/or bonus problems and red flags etc. Where there's smoke, there's fire.

I also found this little gem, which I have duly brought to the attention of the moderators:

My responce was swift, rang my bank and placed a stop on my card.,..... I used a rule i never knew i had. Australian residents are not permitted to play online, so my bank tells me. All in all this would never have happend should they have honoured there bonus, Now i dont care. They can keep there bonus, ill be spending my returned funds once they are procssed elsewhere.

Chargebacks are a huge blight on this industry and people like you who use them make me want to vomit.

I'll also draw the attention of some casino reps to this thread to protect themselves against you.

N.B. The bank was totally incorrect. It is not illegal for Australians to play online, nor is it illegal for banks to process such transactions. Only the providers and advertisers of gambling services (including Australian-based affiliates so my legal source tells me) are subject to the provisions of the relevant Act. No provisions are made for the charging nor punishment of any players.

 

[chuchu59]

I know you're pretty biased against casinos these days chu, but I hardly think the OP qualifies as a "new player".

As Matt said, and I alluded to, the winnings would be credited as bonus money even when played out after a fresh deposit, so MGS have taken steps to combat the problem.

@susanjbo

So is this you or "your husband" posting? Just so I know who I am addressing.

The majority of your posts in this forum since you joined are about account and/or bonus problems and red flags etc. Where there's smoke, there's fire.

I also found this little gem, which I have duly brought to the attention of the moderators:



Chargebacks are a huge blight on this industry and people like you who use them make me want to vomit.

I'll also draw the attention of some casino reps to this thread to protect themselves against you.

N.B. The bank was totally incorrect. It is not illegal for Australians to play online, nor is it illegal for banks to process such transactions. Only the providers and advertisers of gambling services (including Australian-based affiliates so my legal source tells me) are subject to the provisions of the relevant Act. No provisions are made for the charging nor punishment of any players.

That's a pretty biased statement.

 

[mattsgame]

I also found this little gem, which I have duly brought to the attention of the moderators:

*Originally Posted by susnjbo
My responce was swift, rang my bank and placed a stop on my card.,..... I used a rule i never knew i had. Australian residents are not permitted to play online, so my bank tells me. All in all this would never have happend should they have honoured there bonus, Now i dont care. They can keep there bonus, ill be spending my returned funds once they are procssed elsewhere.

Chargebacks are a huge blight on this industry and people like you who use them make me want to vomit.

I'll also draw the attention of some casino reps to this thread to protect themselves against you.

N.B. The bank was totally incorrect. It is not illegal for Australians to play online, nor is it illegal for banks to process such transactions. Only the providers and advertisers of gambling services (including Australian-based affiliates so my legal source tells me) are subject to the provisions of the relevant Act. No provisions are made for the charging nor punishment of any players.

Nice find, I am surprised that if they did do a chargeback that even 32Red would let them stay on. It will catch up with them eventually.

 

[Webzcas]

As has already been mentioned in the thread, this type of gameplay, leaving the bonus games awarded, only to come back to play the free spins or bonus feature once the bonus amount has been played through and therefore no WR, is a known method by advantage players.

Additionally, the info that Nifty posted, quoting this poster describing making a charge back is yet another big red flag. I will be keeping an eye on this thread and will wait for any action if any is to be taken by Bryan or Max.

 

[chayton]

But if you're playing with a bonus and you bust out with a feature round unplayed you'll still be stuck with the bonus, even on your next deposit. Wealth Spa used to catch me all the time because I'd want to save the coins to get a massage and then forget about any I had saved.

Once I even had wagering stuck from multiplayer Isis because I had gotten a couple of markers once while playing with bonus funds. I had to open the game and sit there til someone hit something. It paid me next to nothing, but once I'd played it, then it finally cleared the bonus and I could deposit with no WR.

So personally I don't know how saving up features could be of any advantage to anyone. If the OP made a chargeback that's probably the issue.

It might be interesting if the OP did a PAB just to see what turns up.

 

[Webzcas]

But if you're playing with a bonus and you bust out with a feature round unplayed you'll still be stuck with the bonus,

Not if you hit the bonus feature, leave the game without playing it, then play out your balance on other games, leaving your balance at zero. Then you deposit and go to the games where you have the free spins/bonus features waiting to be played.

 

[chayton]

Not if you hit the bonus feature, leave the game without playing it, then play out your balance on other games, leaving your balance at zero. Then you deposit and go to the games where you have the free spins/bonus features waiting to be played.

That's never happened to me, several times I've had my account at zero and as soon as I make a fresh deposit and get a little ahead, suddenly it's going into bonus funds - when I checked with support, that's when they told me about the unplayed feature. In the one case where it was multiplayer Isis, I was stuck with bonus wagering on a feature that hadn't even been triggered yet! I went into the game and there was nothing there and I asked chat again, "Are you sure it was this game?" and they told me to just stay in the game until the feature was triggered - sure enough it was triggered and the $ I won was put into my bonus funds.

I thought all the Microgaming casinos were the same? Or maybe they're just the same for me!

 

[Webzcas]

I've tested it and this happens or did happen at the MGS casino I tested it at and wagering requirement was 0. BTW didn't withdraw and played through my balance to zero.

 

[susanjbo]

Im no Julia Gillard fan thats for sure.

Let me clear some things up. 1) I wasnt a new or newish member to Riverbell, prior to 3 years ago i was a very frequent player and would drop a fair load in the place and i will also add i have never in 8 years made a withdrawl from Riverbell. So i dispute the assumption i was a newish player trying to beat the system for a pissy $500. And yes, there are some games that you can with some accurracy work out what the free spin feature may pay, between $250 and $500 is the average, but remember, getting the free features on those games dont come often.

And im not going to go over older posts and issues regarding Australian laws in any great detail. But charge backs in Australia dont effect the merchant, the banks here dont do charge backs as described in lets say USA. It all goes through visa/master insurance and is only payable should the service or product be against the law to either use or provide. If you consider that federal legislation has restrictions on outsiders destributing gaming content, then banks here would have to honour transactions for purchasing lets say a gun, or child porn. I doubt any bank would honour those examples, and they are just examples.

And lets get one thing straight, i posted this for everyones consideration, i dont remember asking for this issue too be placed in a claim box. One thing ive learnt is its all a great waste of time, if it helps someone down the track, great!, if not, then its up to them.



The remarks regarding playing methods and that microgaming should stop the ability of players to close off games when they like just so new players cant go back to their games later is utter nonsense. And your assuming this is the case as to why my account was locked without notice.
If this is or was an issue for casinos then every casino would have it in their terms and conditions and put in place software restrictions and limits.
I find it amusing that its always assumed that something is done , not for entertainment by a player , but instead for their gain.




@ Nifty29

First of all, i suggest you get yourself a better lawyer, because the info you provide from your legal buddy is wrong. With that in mind, if i was to purchase a Gun, or child porn picks and the bank was notified, are you really telling me that they would allow the processing of transactions, what makes one more illegal than the other. Heres a insight for u, if its illegal, its illegal. And like i said, banks here dont do charge backs, they do insurance claims and merchant most times gets their money and wouldnt even know what processes were going on.

Im sorry if my post doesnt fit into your narrow, restricted, Stalin like thinking. Maybe you work for our first female prime minister, her comments seem similar too yours. Mind you, im not sure you are that bad, as she has become the official worst Prime minister in the history of Australian federation. Im not sure what your member level entitles you to view and see in my account, ill know shortly after i do a web site rib and match it too user levels, but id be pretty sure that sending or disclosing of any members personal details from this site isnt going to sit well with other members or even the powers too be. I also didnt know that your way of playing was gods way of playing. And you must have the updated handbook on correct methods and what constitutes a complaint reason. Maybe that booklet can teach me how to deal with complaints that are suitable to your way of thinking.

And your comment has just given weight to the reasons why we, my husband and i dont disclose too many details on any web site, because people like you just need to know everything about everyone! And really, u go ahead and spread the post around to the casino reps and go get that pat on ya back you yearn for so much. The feeling or need of exceptence can be a lonely journey hey! In fact ive wasted way too much time just on your stupid comments and hope to hear from others who , by majority given some great feedback!

 

[Nifty29]

Let me clear some things up. 1) I wasnt a new or newish member to Riverbell, prior to 3 years ago i was a very frequent player and would drop a fair load in the place and i will also add i have never in 8 years made a withdrawl from Riverbell. So i dispute the assumption i was a newish player trying to beat the system for a pissy $500. And yes, there are some games that you can with some accurracy work out what the free spin feature may pay, between $250 and $500 is the average, but remember, getting the free features on those games dont come often.

And im not going to go over older posts and issues regarding Australian laws in any great detail. But charge backs in Australia dont effect the merchant, the banks here dont do charge backs as described in lets say USA. It all goes through visa/master insurance and is only payable should the service or product be against the law to either use or provide. If you consider that federal legislation has restrictions on outsiders destributing gaming content, then banks here would have to honour transactions for purchasing lets say a gun, or child porn. I doubt any bank would honour those examples, and they are just examples.

And lets get one thing straight, i posted this for everyones consideration, i dont remember asking for this issue too be placed in a claim box. One thing ive learnt is its all a great waste of time, if it helps someone down the track, great!, if not, then its up to them.



The remarks regarding playing methods and that microgaming should stop the ability of players to close off games when they like just so new players cant go back to their games later is utter nonsense. And your assuming this is the case as to why my account was locked without notice.
If this is or was an issue for casinos then every casino would have it in their terms and conditions and put in place software restrictions and limits.
I find it amusing that its always assumed that something is done , not for entertainment by a player , but instead for their gain.




@ Nifty29

First of all, i suggest you get yourself a better lawyer, because the info you provide from your legal buddy is wrong. With that in mind, if i was to purchase a Gun, or child porn picks and the bank was notified, are you really telling me that they would allow the processing of transactions, what makes one more illegal than the other. Heres a insight for u, if its illegal, its illegal. And like i said, banks here dont do charge backs, they do insurance claims and merchant most times gets their money and wouldnt even know what processes were going on.

Im sorry if my post doesnt fit into your narrow, restricted, Stalin like thinking. Maybe you work for our first female prime minister, her comments seem similar too yours. Mind you, im not sure you are that bad, as she has become the official worst Prime minister in the history of Australian federation. Im not sure what your member level entitles you to view and see in my account, ill know shortly after i do a web site rib and match it too user levels, but id be pretty sure that sending or disclosing of any members personal details from this site isnt going to sit well with other members or even the powers too be.

And your comment has just given weight to the reasons why we, my husband and i dont disclose too many details on any web site, because people like you just need to know everything about everyone! And really, u go ahead and spread the post around to the casino reps and go get that pat on ya back you yearn for so much. The feeling or need of exceptence can be a lonely journey hey! In fact ive wasted way too much time just on your stupid comments and hope to hear from others who , by majority given some great feedback!

"Chargebacks don't affect the merchant in Australia".

Well, I nominate that for "ill-considered quote of the millenium".....although about half a dozen of your other statements are right in the mix.

You are passing off what you THINK should be the law/the case as FACT. Unfortunately, by doing so, you're showing that you know nothing at all about any of it.

I'll just say it one more time and type nice and slow.....playing online casino games in Australia is NOT ILLEGAL. Transferring funds to and from online casinos via Australian banks is NOT ILLEGAL. You're only insisting it is to excuse your disgraceful behavior in charging back because you lost.

Assuming the sentences aren't too long for you, you can find all this out from the Australian Government here:

Outdated URL (Invalid)

The vast majority of your post is complete nonsense and the rest is highly inaccurate.

I think everyone now knows where you're coming from, and what kind of person you/your husband/whoever is typing this time really is.

 

[susanjbo]

@ Nifty29 - when you repost a quote, next time leave it in the context in which i wrote it and not twisted and changed to suit your own argument.

THIS IS WHAT I WROTE "But charge backs in Australia dont effect the merchant, the banks here dont do charge backs as described in lets say USA."

But you quoted " Chargebacks don't affect the merchant in Australia".

Well, I nominate that for "ill-considered quote of the millenium".....although about half a dozen of your other statements are right in the mix.

Really, pretty poor effort .


And please, you dont need to direct me to the legislation, you forget we were the ones that introduced it to meister. But as a refresher i provided you a snippet once again. And ill state it for the millionth time, and i must add this was current at the time and has changed since. But what part of this dont u understand, a casino, from overseas, transmits into australia, a player uses the transmission, but is protected by the law, but the merchant has illegaly sent his/her transmission into the county knowing its illegal. Now, what bank will honour these transactions?? Well most of them do, but in reallity if push comes to shove, they (the banks) should they once informed allow the process of transaction are then knowingly facilitating and assisting the company to breach the law.

But as ive gone over it a million times, try this, i goto england, i know its illegal to kill someone, but my mate in england knows im going to kill someone and hands me a pistol. Now after i kill someone and go back home to australia you say what i did and my mate did wasnt illegal! i came into a country and did an illegal act and was facilitated my mate (lets call him the bank) and i bet u a billion, he aint sitting pretty with the law. Now u tell me that my example above is clear enough for even u to digest.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SNIPPET OF OZ LEGISLATIONThe offence
The IGA targets the providers of interactive gambling services, not their potential or actual customers. The IGA makes it an offence to provide an interactive gambling service to a customer physically present in Australia.

This offence applies to all interactive gambling service providers, whether based in Australia or offshore, whether Australian or foreign owned.
This offence carries a maximum penalty of $220 000 per day for individuals and $1.1 million per day for bodies corporate.
Interactive gambling services include those that are often described as 'online casinos' and usually involve using the internet to play games of chance, or games of mixed chance and skill. Examples include roulette, poker, craps, online 'pokies' and blackjack. 'Interactive gambling services' are defined in section 5 of the IGA.

The IGA also makes it an offence to provide such services to people in a 'designated country'. This offence is discussed in more detail below.

Reasonable diligence by interactive gambling service providers
The offence will not apply if an interactive gambling service provider did not know and could not, with reasonable diligence, have ascertained that its service had Australian customers. Therefore, interactive gambling service providers that can show they have exercised reasonable diligence in ensuring that Australian customers are prevented from using their service will have a defence against the offence provision. The IGA provides that elements of a reasonable diligence defence can include, for example:

whether prospective customers were informed that Australian law prohibits the provision of the service to customers who are physically present in Australia
whether customers were required to enter into contracts that were subject to an express condition that the customer was not to use the service if the customer was physically present in Australia
whether the person required customers to provide personal details and, if so, whether those details suggested that the customer was not physically present in Australia
whether the person has network data that indicates that customers were physically present outside Australia when the relevant customer account was opened and throughout the period when the service was provided to the customer, and
any other relevant matters.

 

[Nifty29]

@ Nifty29 - when you repost a quote, next time leave it in the context in which i wrote it and not twisted and changed to suit your own argument.

THIS IS WHAT I WROTE "But charge backs in Australia dont effect the merchant, the banks here dont do charge backs as described in lets say USA."

But you quoted " Chargebacks don't affect the merchant in Australia".

Well, I nominate that for "ill-considered quote of the millenium".....although about half a dozen of your other statements are right in the mix.

Really, pretty poor effort .


And please, you dont need to direct me to the legislation, you forget we were the ones that introduced it to meister. But as a refresher i provided you a snippet once again. And ill state it for the millionth time, and i must add this was current at the time and has changed since. But what part of this dont u understand, a casino, from overseas, transmits into australia, a player uses the transmission, but is protected by the law, but the merchant has illegaly sent his/her transmission into the county knowing its illegal. Now, what bank will honour these transactions?? Well most of them do, but in reallity if push comes to shove, they (the banks) should they once informed allow the process of transaction are then knowingly facilitating and assisting the company to breach the law.

But as ive gone over it a million times, try this, i goto england, i know its illegal to kill someone, but my mate in england knows im going to kill someone and hands me a pistol. Now after i kill someone and go back home to australia you say what i did and my mate did wasnt illegal! i came into a country and did an illegal act and was facilitated my mate (lets call him the bank) and i bet u a billion, he aint sitting pretty with the law. Now u tell me that my example above is clear enough for even u to digest.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SNIPPET OF OZ LEGISLATIONThe offence
The IGA targets the providers of interactive gambling services, not their potential or actual customers. The IGA makes it an offence to provide an interactive gambling service to a customer physically present in Australia.

This offence applies to all interactive gambling service providers, whether based in Australia or offshore, whether Australian or foreign owned.
This offence carries a maximum penalty of $220 000 per day for individuals and $1.1 million per day for bodies corporate.
Interactive gambling services include those that are often described as 'online casinos' and usually involve using the internet to play games of chance, or games of mixed chance and skill. Examples include roulette, poker, craps, online 'pokies' and blackjack. 'Interactive gambling services' are defined in section 5 of the IGA.

The IGA also makes it an offence to provide such services to people in a 'designated country'. This offence is discussed in more detail below.

Reasonable diligence by interactive gambling service providers
The offence will not apply if an interactive gambling service provider did not know and could not, with reasonable diligence, have ascertained that its service had Australian customers. Therefore, interactive gambling service providers that can show they have exercised reasonable diligence in ensuring that Australian customers are prevented from using their service will have a defence against the offence provision. The IGA provides that elements of a reasonable diligence defence can include, for example:

whether prospective customers were informed that Australian law prohibits the provision of the service to customers who are physically present in Australia
whether customers were required to enter into contracts that were subject to an express condition that the customer was not to use the service if the customer was physically present in Australia
whether the person required customers to provide personal details and, if so, whether those details suggested that the customer was not physically present in Australia
whether the person has network data that indicates that customers were physically present outside Australia when the relevant customer account was opened and throughout the period when the service was provided to the customer, and
any other relevant matters.

I'm going to buy you a clue from eBay, as you clearly don't have one.

A BANK is NOT a Gambling Service Provider.

The Act ONLY applies to providers of gambling services.

It is NOT illegal for a BANK to facilitate transfers of funds between online casinos and players (in Australia). Come back when you find the relevant section of the Act that states that such transfers are illegal. Good luck with that.

You are clearly one of those people who don't bother researching the facts, but "invent" facts to suit their OPINION of how they THINK it is. I feel embarrassed for you.

You're providing examples that are totally irrelevant and inapplicable. You're comparing someone providing a weapon to you to kill someone in the UK with a BANK allowing you to transmit funds to a casino. Here's an extra clue for you....now you will have two....internet gambling is NOT illegal. Murder IS illegal. Honestly.....debating you is a waste of time, as you argue against what you posted as evidence and nothing you say has any substance in fact nor logic.

I'll let someone else takeover at this point....if they can be bothered.

Oh....one more thing....chargebacks are chargebacks....they all cost merchants money to deal with, regardless of whether they are proven right. AFAIK they work the same in a backend sense anywhere in the world I.e. they go through the provider e.g. VISA, MC, AMEX. The chargeback that YOU made would have cost the casino a minimum of $100 in fees, plus of course the money that you reversed.

 

[MisterBJ]

Request Thread Title Change to "Susanjbo - Deceitful, Vague, Suspicious conduct and without an explaination." BANNED!

 

[Jasminebed]

I find it incredible this player not only has no shame, seems to feel her behaviour is acceptable and that we should support her against Riverbelle.