Roulette69 issue - PAB rejected - player upset

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LonelyHearts

Banned User - racist bastard
Joined
Oct 18, 2009
Location
Mobile, AL
:eek:
I have not been a member here long but just my 2 cents.

Who gives a rats nannies if they are making money from being an affiliate or from advertising. This website does more for the casino players as a hole, i mean seriously bryan lets all you other webmasters and affiliates be known to us other users and have your websites listed here. NOT to mention all the bullshit affiliates out there who do crap for the people that sign up thru there websites let alone advertise rougue casino's willingly. Also who do you think pays for he pabs etc :p and if maxd or bryan where to be biased towards any casino here im sure it would be noticed in a heart beat and this place would be deserted.



Cheers
matt

YEP! Who gives a rats nannies. If my congressman is getting money for X company, Y company, and Z company as long as he still serves the public. Makes one wonder why the public didn't want the health care plan. But Congress passed it anyways. I guess XYZ has more pull then US. Not saying my congressman don't serve us at times. Just sometimes he has to serve XYZ also.
 

Nifty29

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2001
Location
Turn right, then right. then right again
In my experience, when a PAB or complaint is rejected due to alleged fraud it usually turns out to be justified.

Ive also found that the complainant tries to deflect attention away from what they probably did by getting stuck into Bryan, Max, the Casino, and anyone else who gets in the way.

Where there is smoke their is almost always fire.

Of course, Im also open-minded enough to believe there is a first time for everything.

P.S. Ive played numerous times at R69 with and without bonuses, with big and small bets, and big and small deposits and WON - and was paid every time most promptly. So what is the difference between you and I ???
 

sally_bairnish

Banned User
Joined
Jul 6, 2009
Location
London
In my experience, when a PAB or complaint is rejected due to alleged fraud it usually turns out to be justified.

Ive also found that the complainant tries to deflect attention away from what they probably did by getting stuck into Bryan, Max, the Casino, and anyone else who gets in the way.

Where there is smoke their is almost always fire.

Of course, Im also open-minded enough to believe there is a first time for everything.

P.S. Ive played numerous times at R69 with and without bonuses, with big and small bets, and big and small deposits and WON - and was paid every time most promptly. So what is the difference between you and I ???

Sorry, I shouldn't come accross as having a go at Bryan and Max so much, just that I don't like being called a fraudster and being barred from telling the public about my experience.

Maybe the difference between us is that I got lucky enough to win quite big quite early on, so they weren't 100% sure if they would recoup the money from me later on, whereas with you maybe it's different.

I just want the public to decide and see what goes on behind the scences with some of these places. I've presented everything I know of the situation, If I've done bad, then please let me know what it is. I'm being honest when I say I don't have duplicate accounts.... and I don't see what advantage I could have had by having them either, seeing as I'm just playing their slots.
 

BLUEWATER

Dormant account
Joined
Jan 20, 2006
Location
NoWhere
Seem like you not going to get your winning. You are lucky you even got all of your deposit back. Just be thankful and move on.
 

Nifty29

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2001
Location
Turn right, then right. then right again
Maybe the difference between us is that I got lucky enough to win quite big quite early on, so they weren't 100% sure if they would recoup the money from me later on, whereas with you maybe it's different.

As I recall, I cashed out about $1000 from a $50 deposit on the signup bonus- so they didnt really know if I would be back, but they paid me nonetheless. No problems at all.

One thing I CAN gaurantee is that Max and Bryan will ALWAYS treat each PAB fairly and take the players' claim at face value, until such time as evidence appears to the contrary.

If Max banned you for a fraudulent claim, then I would have to say there must be something you're not telling us.....and maybe you know that Max can't tell us for security reasons (i.e. it may reveal how the casinos detect fraud etc)....so he cant really provide all the necessary evidence.

I can't remember a member being re-instated after being banned for a dodgy PAB with a "sorry we got it all wrong" from CM. Why? Because CM doesnt take this decision lightly and he must have been VERY sure of what happened.

If you ARE telling the FULL story, and you are proven right and your membership is re-instated, I will donate $50 to your favorite charity.
 

jetset

RIP Brian
Joined
Feb 22, 2001
Location
Earth
We're going off at something of a tangent here, and in any case I seem to recall that Bryan has in the past made it clear that the bulk of his income from this website is from 'real estate' as opposed to affiliate deal advertising.

But I'll leave that to him to address.

Back on topic. If there's one thing I've learned from many years of frequenting Casinomeister, it's that the PAB system is honest and it works. For both sides, because balance is what this site is all about.

Operators will not divulge publicly the anti-fraud measures they take against online gamblers because they believe - rightly or wrongly - that this merely educates fraudsters in how to get around them.

That means that a trusted person like Bryan acting as an intermediary (and that sort of independent integrity takes years to build up) is given the facts and confirms whether the operator was within his rights to take the action complained about.

If it isn't, you can be sure that Casinomeister will speak out, and it would be unwise for any operator to persist if CM opined that he was being unfair.

Regrettably, there are a helluva lot of fraudulent folks out there, and oft-times there is a genuine case for stopping their nonsense.

Unfortunately, this free [PAB] public service that Casinomeister renders also lays Bryan and Max open to the sort of attacks we see in this thread, because, as we have seen here frequently, there are those fraudsters who will persevere despite being caught out.

I know who I would rather trust.
 

baabaa006

Experienced Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2008
Location
Australia
I am really intrigued by this.

Can't wait for Max or Bryan's response.

I'd love to know the full story of this one.

Is the OP telling the whole truth????
 

jas2587

Ueber Meister
Joined
Apr 25, 2006
Location
FL
I personally dont think it is any of our biz to know how an what Bryan makes his living by be it affilates buying banners shipping beer selling his autograph
thats his info dont know why it keeps being brought up its a great site every one gets to say nearly pretty much what they want so let it be

Cindy:)
 

spearmaster

RIP Ted
Joined
Jan 12, 2001
Location
Heaven
I'm sure Max has all the relevant details and made the call he thought was correct.

I do, however, want to point out one thing - if the winnings were made off that last deposit, without a bonus - then it is completely irrelevant whether or not the person is linked to other accounts because he/she gained no advantage by making a deposit without receiving a bonus.

If this is the case, then in my lowly opinion the player should be paid.
 

Nifty29

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2001
Location
Turn right, then right. then right again
I'm sure Max has all the relevant details and made the call he thought was correct.

I do, however, want to point out one thing - if the winnings were made off that last deposit, without a bonus - then it is completely irrelevant whether or not the person is linked to other accounts because he/she gained no advantage by making a deposit without receiving a bonus.

If this is the case, then in my lowly opinion the player should be paid.

I can see that point Spear, but the question to be answered first is the whole 'chicken or the egg' thing. If they opened another account, or claimed first deposit bonuses on a computer or site etc where someone else has claimed a bonus BEFORE they made other deposits, then the account is effectively fraudulent before any subsequent deposits are made so there couldnt actually be any legitimate winnings beyond the first deposit. In other words, the 'fruit of the poisonous tree' if you like.

If casinos asked for docs upon the first deposit, then these situations could be avoided and its good to see that some are starting to do this.

At least R69 refunded the deposits, which some operators wouldn't.

I would be surprised if more information doesnt come to light in the near future.....
 

RobWin

closed account
Joined
Apr 24, 2004
Location
A Vault!
I can see that point Spear, but the question to be answered first is the whole 'chicken or the egg' thing. If they opened another account, or claimed first deposit bonuses on a computer or site etc where someone else has claimed a bonus BEFORE they made other deposits, then the account is effectively fraudulent
.....

What if they were using the computer that they bought second hand from the neighbor down the street? And just by coincidence that neighbor had also had an account at the casino unannounced to the new owner of said computer...:D
____
____
 

Casinomeister

Forum Cheermeister
Staff member
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
This whole thread is such bullshit.

@ the OP - I searched for your PAB and couldn't find one. Your first post discusses whether or not you should (or if your friend should) try Roulette69.

Eh? was that you or your "friend". I spent a bit of time this morning being rather confused.

But this is besides the point. The account for dannyg86 was closed due to a bogus PAB. It's bogus. We don't make these decisions unless we are satisfied with either what the casino provides, or what we have on our own.

Sorry, I shouldn't come accross as having a go at Bryan and Max so much, just that I don't like being called a fraudster and being barred from telling the public about my experience....

This is such bullshit - you are having a go at us, dragging our names through the mud, making unfounded and untrue accusations. What a dick!

You could have simply emailed me and asked me what was up - that we were mistaken - that there was nothing funky going on with you and the other accounts you are connected with. I would have been more than pleased to help you out. But you decide to post a bunch of bullshit at 5 in the morning through your "friend's" account. :rolleyes:

As for how this site generates income - this is always been made clear that it is a combination of different models of income, (media buys, aff, CPA, etc.,). Obviously, this is totally irrelevant and is just a means for the OP to make more bogus accusations. I don't know what the overhanging issue of this is. BTW - affiliate is synonymous with webmaster for many people, that's how it was implied at the Awards ceremony in London 2008. People liked my website, they voted for me - simple as that. It has nothing to do with how one is generating income.
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
As I recall, I cashed out about $1000 from a $50 deposit on the signup bonus- so they didnt really know if I would be back, but they paid me nonetheless. No problems at all.

One thing I CAN gaurantee is that Max and Bryan will ALWAYS treat each PAB fairly and take the players' claim at face value, until such time as evidence appears to the contrary.

If Max banned you for a fraudulent claim, then I would have to say there must be something you're not telling us.....and maybe you know that Max can't tell us for security reasons (i.e. it may reveal how the casinos detect fraud etc)....so he cant really provide all the necessary evidence.

I can't remember a member being re-instated after being banned for a dodgy PAB with a "sorry we got it all wrong" from CM. Why? Because CM doesnt take this decision lightly and he must have been VERY sure of what happened.

If you ARE telling the FULL story, and you are proven right and your membership is re-instated, I will donate $50 to your favorite charity.

I am also game. Make it $100 buddy.
 

Casinomeister

Forum Cheermeister
Staff member
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
@ dannyg86

Are you going to hand over the sally_bairnish account back to your "friend" and stay out of the forum, or do I have to close this account as well? :rolleyes:
 

Nifty29

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2001
Location
Turn right, then right. then right again
But this is besides the point. The account for dannyg86 was closed due to a bogus PAB. It's bogus. We don't make these decisions unless we are satisfied with either what the casino provides, or what we have on our own.

Well I trust Bryan 100% so I think we can accept that the OP was up to no good at Roulette69. It doesnt matter what it was exactly - the PAB process is above reproach IMO.

Fraudsters make it more difficult for players like me to enjoy reasonable promotions and hassle-free withdrawals, so HANG 'EM ALL I say!!

BTW - the fact that the OP was happy to use someone elses account to post here when they KNEW they were personally banned probably sheds some light on who we are dealing with, and just makes the whole fraud thing even more believable.
 

Tengil

Senior Member
Joined
May 4, 2006
Location
Finland
Personally being a "victim" of false accusations of being linked to other accounts I have a hard time believing any casinos accusations of that. And in my case they seemed to be sure about it. Until I see any proof myself Im always going to be sceptic.

And in the OPs case it involved slots play without a bonus which is the most -EV thing you can do at a casino. So there would have been no advantage whatsoever to deliberately brake any T&Cs.

And finally posters and casinos alike should refrain in using the term "fraudster" as they currently do. Having multiple accounts for example or making chargebacks is not fraud.

Edit: I dont think a casino deliberately makes false accusations. They make mistakes all the time.
 

Nifty29

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2001
Location
Turn right, then right. then right again
Having multiple accounts for example or making chargebacks is not fraud.

Multiple accounts = breaks Terms and Conditions so you're right it isnt really fraud. If you claim a signup bonus on all of them, then you are deliberately claiming what you are not entitled to so that is fraud from the casino's point of view.

Chargebacks = can be fraudulent, depending on why they are initiated. If you receive the service you paid for, and then chargeback, its fraud.

Im not a legal expert, but it seems common sense to me.
 

jetset

RIP Brian
Joined
Feb 22, 2001
Location
Earth
I disagree with Spiderlegz, and especially the comment regarding fraudsters.

For my money, when anyone uses deception or dishonesty to obtain an advantage that is not due it is fraud. And regardless of whether it's a player, an affiliate or a casino operator, such a person may rightfully be labelled - in my opinion - "fraudster."
 

Casinomeister

Forum Cheermeister
Staff member
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
...BTW - the fact that the OP was happy to use someone elses account to post here when they KNEW they were personally banned probably sheds some light on who we are dealing with, and just makes the whole fraud thing even more believable.
Now how odd is that? How many people here know other people in the real world that have accounts in this forum?

Comparing the OP's post with the original PAB, the "Here's the story;" section is a copy and paste job. It has the same punctuation errors, same misspellings, most of it is verbatim sans a couple of improvements.

So either dannyg86 and sally_bairnish are on the same computer, or they are privy to this text posted elsewhere on the Internet and making copy and paste jobs with that.

"The customer claimed explicitly that he came to our site because he was speaking to some people at CasinoMeister about our bonuses. He signed up and played with us in August..."

Funny how dannyg86 signed up here in October only to PAB, yet he signed up at Roulette69 in August. So this is more bullshit from the player. Who was he talking to here? Perhaps it was via sally_bairnish's account who made an inquiry about Roulette69 here:
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/hey-people.32191/
 
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