Rizk Source of Wealth Bullshit!

[SpinUk]

Redacted

 

[Casinomeister]

The sad thing is that inexperienced regulators don't understand the gambler. Many if not most gamblers just want to play, and if they get turned down from one property they will move on to the next regardless of its licensing. The non-regulated (or weak regulated) casinos will welcome these players with open arms. And what the UKGC, MGA and {enter any government control center} are trying to do will only backfire. Hardcore gamblers will always be playing - hell, that's why it's called gambling.

Intentions may be good - but it's shortsighted, poorly advised, and driven by politics. Regulators need to work with their licensees. I don't see this happening in Europe - or have I missed these seminars?

 

[brianmon]

The problems don't seem to come from the regulations themselves.
But from the misinterpretation/misuse of those regulations.
Why don't there seem to be many other threads about problems with other casino groups?
Is everyone else doing it wrong and heading for huge fines?

 

[vinylweatherman]

As mentioned a number of times, you need to bring the fight to the UKGC and the MGA. But these decisions have been made - and you'll be told that it's for your own good.


I think I mentioned this in a newsletter from a few years ago.



In the same newsletter I made this observance:


Meister Mail ~ 25 November 2015 - EIG, BAC, MiGS Report

This isn't a practical option for players. The best way a player can fight to get their money is to use the small claims court where a judge will decide whether or not the casino should pay out the player's balance. If a few of these cases are brought, it will force the hand of the UKGC and the government with regard to AML.

There was a case with the financial ombudsman regarding a bank customer and SoW, and the customer was told they would have to use the courts to force the bank to release their funds.

A player can't use the small claims court to challenge the UKGC, it would be a very expensive legal case in higher courts against a government quango with very deep pockets. It would also take years.

However, the casinos could pool together and launch a legal action against the UKGC based on the view that the current rules are impractical, don't work anyway, and will cripple the UK side of the industry leaving UK players as prey for unlicensed offshore operations.

 

[pinnit2014]

Incase of any interest.

Went to login to Highroller, a week after the tick box exercise, and met with a document request: Letter from organisation, Certificate of Winning, Bank Statement and Media Coverage. Really, for 3k deposits since Jan-18?

They don't even tell you what these mean - like, what's media coverage? If i won a progressive?

Who knows - needless to say they're getting nothing.

On the plus side - you can't deposit.

 

[interlog]

In the meantime whilst Joe Average is being screwed over by the casinos and/or is asked for sensitive documents, Mr Money Launderer will continue to do their business washing their ill gotten dosh clean.

This and slots just not paying anymore resulted in a self enforced ban for me.

I work hard for my money and if some want to put obstacles in the way how I decide to spend it, they can do one.

 

[mimi26]

Received the dreaded request from videoslots, sent my wage slips and bank statement just showing what was paid in, all rejected, they said they needed a more recent payslip so now sent them this, but my statement with payments going in was rejected also, so sorry thats all there getting from me, I dont need to gamble that much that I am willing to throw all my private documents at a casino. I get money from 4 other sources all cash but cant prove that so they will just have to jog on.

 

[Borgie]

Received the dreaded request from videoslots, sent my wage slips and bank statement just showing what was paid in, all rejected, they said they needed a more recent payslip so now sent them this, but my statement with payments going in was rejected also, so sorry thats all there getting from me, I dont need to gamble that much that I am willing to throw all my private documents at a casino. I get money from 4 other sources all cash but cant prove that so they will just have to jog on.

This is the problem not all monies we get can fit in a nice little box that casinos can tick. I give money to my children all the time there's no record if it as it's cash but why shouldn't they gamble it if they want to . They are over 18. I didn't launder it but when you give someone cash they have no audit trail. Really this is the beginning of the end.

 

[pinnit2014]

What's amusing is that, in terms of certificate of winning, they are the casino that i got a few wildlines in DOA at 90p. So I've told them that's the only thing they'll get as they already have it

Oh i forgot (and to get a little shilly), another plus point, is that it's a secure upload portal

Just going to shut down all my accounts within the group. Tis a shame cause i quite liked HR.

*soon to be seen propping up a B&M casino in a town near you at this rate.

I know I'm a low roller gambler but this makes me feel like a low roller launderer

 

[mimi26]

This is the problem not all monies we get can fit in a nice little box that casinos can tick. I give money to my children all the time there's no record if it as it's cash but why shouldn't they gamble it if they want to . They are over 18. I didn't launder it but when you give someone cash they have no audit trail. Really this is the beginning of the end.

yes its a big problem, buts its one I am not going to bend over backwards to rectify, I honestly dont need to gamble that much, I find the whole process intrusive

 

[goatwack]

yes its a big problem, buts its one I am not going to bend over backwards to rectify, I honestly dont need to gamble that much, I find the whole process intrusive

Well for them it's 'Job well-done' and they're probably backslapping each other as we speak.

You have been proven to be, infact, a money- launderer with something to hide

 

[slotter999]

Well for them it's 'Job well-done' and they're probably backslapping each other as we speak.

You have been proven to be, infact, a money- launderer with something to hide

Who is likely to be backslapping and saying job well done....the casinos?

If you look at the response from @mimi26 and countless others it's clear that SOW is going to cost the casinos more than it's going to cost the players as players will simply move on. My guess is the good casinos not looking to fleece players will eventually 'reconsider' the robustness of their checks if their income starts to fall off a cliff.

 

[goatwack]

Who is likely to be backslapping and saying job well done....the casinos?

If you look at the response from @mimi26 and countless others it's clear that SOW is going to cost the casinos more than it's going to cost the players as players will simply move on. My guess is the good casinos not looking to fleece players will eventually 'reconsider' the robustness of their checks if their income starts to fall off a cliff.

......or they'll just ramp up the SoW inquisitions in hopes of avoiding crippling fines, and cut the losses of a few players defecting?

 

[pinnit2014]

Is it strict liability anyhow? There's no way any business can say they're 100% certain they have no illegal activity in their business. Rather, what they can do, is stand over their risk assessments of players/customers and point to a robust procedure they have in place. In many walks of life that's the common sense approach (same reason as why, for example, most council's never pay out on pothole claims - their inspection regime etc). Off to buy a new Macbook next week - will i need to prove where the money's come from? (clue, it's Mrs P as she earns more than me )

 

[slotter999]

......or they'll just ramp up the SoW inquisitions in hopes of avoiding crippling fines, and cut the losses of a few players defecting?

I get the impression this whole SOW thing might just be a step too far for a lot of people. I think this is particularly true for innocent players being put through the SOW wringer for £10 deposits or being asked to produce documentation which has no real legal definition (cert of winnings) etc.

Can I ask what you will do once you get SOW requests? Comply or walk?

 

[mack341]

If I were a customer of one of the casinos that is keen to SOW everybody, and I sent in the docs with great reluctantance, feeling it was simply wrong to be sending a copy of my bank statement to a online casino; afterwards I don't think I would have any peace of mind that 6 months down the road, at point of withdrawal, they won't want to do another SOW.

Has anybody who has completed a SOW process felt afterwards 'everything is back to normal now, I've done what they want and can get back to playing slots without this intrusion' or do they fear the process will have to be repeated like KYC is at some casinos.

 

[goatwack]

I get the impression this whole SOW thing might just be a step too far for a lot of people. I think this is particularly true for innocent players being put through the SOW wringer for £10 deposits or being asked to produce documentation which has no real legal definition (cert of winnings) etc.

Can I ask what you will do once you get SOW requests? Comply or walk?

I'd imagine it depends on their request, whether it be a pop up questionnaire that verifies me on the spot or if it is indeed the dreaded "Please provide us with your financial history from the last six months", whether it is done pre- or post- withdrawal, and whether it is worth pursuing in regards to monies 'won'.

I don't think people object to SoW in its stripped- down format, problem is every casino is taking a different angle on it, whilst using it as a pretext to withhold legitimate winnings. Once you get an idea of how they want to play it should be enough reason to decide whether to bin them off or not.....

 

[pinnit2014]

It probably won't be a one off process as i don't think a defence of 'well they weren't a ML at the start' will cut it

The AML regulations talk of continuous due diligence on customers so they'll need a system of monitoring changes in behaviour/periodic checks, I'd imagine.

Moving house this year so I may just get all the casinos and my mortgage lender in the room at the same time. 250 birds with one stone.

 

[SpinUk]

Incase of any interest.

Went to login to Highroller, a week after the tick box exercise, and met with a document request: Letter from organisation, Certificate of Winning, Bank Statement and Media Coverage. Really, for 3k deposits since Jan-18?

They don't even tell you what these mean - like, what's media coverage? If i won a progressive?

Who knows - needless to say they're getting nothing.

On the plus side - you can't deposit.

Been waiting 5 days for mine there...still waiting after my deposit was locked. Fyi deposited about half that.

 

[mimi26]

I got the stripped down format at videoslots, but now got the full hit one, TBH as I stated earlier it does not bother me much I was simply close and move on, its really no skin of my nose, I will keep a few casinos where I just deposit £10 every few weeks and I will just stick at that, and if they feel the need to SOW me then I will just close those accounts.

To prove my full source of wealth I would have to send other persons personal info in, such as my joint account and I will NEVER do that

 

[colinsunderland]

There is no way on earth any GIG casino will ever get a single bit of information from me considering how terrible their data protection security is.

Seriously, I would really advise anyone not to give them any sensitive information at all. The whole company right to the top seems to be inept.

Giving me another persons full information is terrible, and it could have been yours I got, in fact it may have been seeing as I don't know anyones full name on here! How many other people have been given third party information. No matter what Captain Rizk says about how strong their data storage is, when staff just send out information like they clearly do, then security is non existent.

 

[dealer wins]

Well im 2 weekends dry now due to this shit, and I can honestly say it feels great. I do miss my Rhinos and Wild Desires, but I am not prepared to put up with what is an invasion of my privacy to basically piss my money away anyway lol Im saving my £150 a week up for high rolling sessions on my 2 or 3 cruise hols a year. £300 now in the pot!!! And as a side bonus with my high roller action I will likely get every cruise free from now on lol.

 

[goatwack]

Well im 2 weekends dry now due to this shit, and I can honestly say it feels great. I do miss my Rhinos and Wild Desires, but I am not prepared to put up with what is an invasion of my privacy to basically piss my money away anyway lol Im saving my £150 a week up for high rolling sessions on my 2 or 3 cruise hols a year. £300 now in the pot!!! And as a side bonus with my high roller action I will likely get every cruise free from now on lol.

Good stuff. This of course ties in with AML masquerades being responsible for driving a few punters away and indirectly ensuring Responsible Gambling into the mix. Something the UKGC will no doubt take enormous credit for

 

[Deeplay]

Playing back at VideoSlots, after they opened my account again after a break. Before I could deposit they requested a SOW. It was an easy secure way to give them the information they needed. All online, nothing through email and it was processed and verified within 4 hours. Only after then could I deposit. Now that in my view is how to handle this. Support even explained to me before the account was reopened what would be required before I could deposit so they were no surprises. Sure I dont like it, but they did handle it in the best way they could. A painless process. As it should be. Video Slots again lead the way in customer care and service!

Unlike the ridiculously messy and insecure system Rizk have. And the fact the rep is having to speak out here on this thread shows how badly it has all been handled by MT Secure Trade sites. But thats not a concern of mine now as MT secure trade sites will never see another penny from me ever again.

 

[goatwack]

Playing back at VideoSlots, they opened my account again. Before I could deposit they requested a SOW. It was an easy secure way to give them the information they needed. All online, nothing through email and it was processed and verified within 4 hours. Only after then could I deposit. Now that in my view is how to handle this. Support even explained to me before the account was open, what would be required before I could deposit so they were no surprises. Sure I dont like it, but they did handle it in the best way they could. Painless process. As it should be. Video Slots again lead the way in customer care and service!

Well someone has to be the fall guy, with some luck others will see how Rizk handled it and go "Nah", whilst keeping it as streamlined and painless for the customer. Whether they all choose to do that remains to be seen. But kudos to VS (again)