Microgaming Softare 100% CPU Utilization??

[chalupa]

I just ran into this today, I don't know if it was a result of recent changes to MG software or some side effect of something else, but thought I'd post it to warn others and/or see if anyone else was having this problem.

When running Microgaming Viper software, the software is completely hogging CPU usage when idle. If I click on the title bar of the window (or of course quit the software), CPU usage immediately drops to normal.

Luckily I have alert software on my computer that let me know my system was overheating... just what I need, my gambling activity to burn the house down!

Can anyone else verify this on their system?

To see CPU usage, right click the in a blank space in the start menu bar area in Windows, choose "Task Manager" and click on the "Performance" tab. Then run the Microgaming software.

 

[winbig]

I've had it happen with the poker software before, and believe there's been other threads about it too....never seen it on the casino side of things though.

 

[BradyCU]

mg makes my computer run at 100% as well, it'll automatically restart my computer after it gets too hot...say 10min. I can't do anything else if i have it running, it sucks.

 

[spearmaster]

MGS software apparently sucks up idle CPU cycles. Right now, it sucks up way too much - so I have been told that this issue is being addressed and hopefully a fix to make it less "greedy" is due shortly.

 

[Vesuvio]

This is a really serious problem. I've downloaded two MG casinos today - Bella Vegas and Jupiter Club - and both of them start a process called "casinogame.new" that takes over 90% of the CPU - the overall usage is a steady 100%. My laptop's fan spins non-stop and despite that the computer's still dangerously hot (incidentally I had to replace the fan and hard drive before christmas and I'm sure it was a direct result of leaving MG casinos running for hours at a time).

I think some of the operators make this problem much worse by choosing to have the casino download every last game while you're playing. As well as making things run slowly & taking up unnecessary space (BellaVegas ends up at 303Mb for me, so I always remove it & have to go through this cycle again) it seems to put a dangerous load on the computer. I don't know if it's a factor, but I've got an extremely fast internet connection, so maybe it downloads more at a time than it can properly deal with!?

Microgaming really need to come up with a solution to this quickly as it will result in damaged computers. A simple stop-gap measure would be to give the player the option of whether they want to pre-download every single game at the casino. An option not to load the "movie" whenever the casino loads up would also help a lot of players, as mentioned before.

 

[caruso]

I lost a couple of hard drives in mega-quick time, and apparently totally inexplicably according to my computer bloke, over period of a few months. If it turns out it was related to MG casinos overheating my machine, I will be mega pissed off.

In fact, I lost my last one WHILST running an MG casino, now I think of it. F***ing brilliant.

 

[Tdoggy]

happened to me also

I also had a hard drive burnt out thanks to a microgaming casino. Not fun having that happen. That was it for me. I will not download microgaming casinos and have this happen again. They need to fix this problem.

 

[tim5ny]

My puter's set up for hardcore gaming, so the MG software's a walk in the park for it. I have tried running it on a decent laptop before, and it lagged so bad that I had to run very low resolution at lowest color quality. These changes made an immense difference. Maybe you guys should try that route.

 

[chalupa]

I think some of the operators make this problem much worse by choosing to have the casino download every last game while you're playing.

While annoying, I doubt that is much of a factor... downloading shouldn't really cause much problem other than taking up hard drive space. The extra load on the processor is temporary during downloading, and on a modern processor should be relatively minimal. (Only an educated guess... I haven't tried it.)

There really is no excuse why casino software is taking up that much CPU time. It has to be some sort of bug or sloppy programming. Modern processors are powerful and casino software is pretty simpleminded stuff.

Regarding hard-drive failures... CPU overloading is a separate issue but I can see how it could lead to premature hard-drive (or other system components) failure in an enclosed system. Electronics don't like to run hot. Manufacturer's MTBF (mean-time between failures) ratings are typically worse at higher temperatures.

I have a nearly-silent PC which is more susceptible to overheating due to lower airflow. And of course laptops like Vesuvio's would be another likely victim with the components all crammed in there.

It's certainly something Microgaming should fix... fast.

 

[Vesuvio]

While annoying, I doubt that is much of a factor... downloading shouldn't really cause much problem other than taking up hard drive space. The extra load on the processor is temporary during downloading, and on a modern processor should be relatively minimal.

I agree it shouldn't be a problem, but seeing as the CPU runs at 100% even when you're not playing a game I guess it doesn't help! It may be temporary, but as I often install MG casinos each time I use them temporary gets close to being 100% of the time - 300Mb+ isn't that quick to download. If the casino insists on the whole package being downloaded I'd prefer the option to do it all at once from the website instead of in the background while the casino's running. A few MG casinos now seem to let you do that (or to download an 80Mb+ package, at least).

 

[KasinoKing]

I've had it happen with the poker software before, and believe there's been other threads about it too....never seen it on the casino side of things though.

Ditto to that. I've complained several times to ChatMaster about this problem while running Piggs Peak Poker - but never noticed it during casino play.
But at last Sunday's Casinomeister freeroll it seemed much better - so I assumed Microrigging had done something about it.
They certainly MUST sort this out - it's potentially very serious.
I also agree how darned annoying it is that MG's download the full package. That wants to be stopped as well.

 

[Simmo!]

Yes I get the same thing. My CPU alarm goes off after an hour or so following the load of an MG casino - any one. First time it happened was after the introduction of the Mermaids Millions games release.

 

[DealerBusts]

Interesting point raised regarding MG software. I can't say I've noticed the 100% CPU usage but MG software is always rather sluggish unless on my fastest PC.

Just a few tips for you PC owners, ideally your computer should be stable even with 100% CPU usage. Extra power is drawn when the CPU runs at maximum (producing more heat and puts strain on power supply) so you should ensure:

i) The room is not overly hot
ii) There are adequate cooling fans in your case and on top of the CPU
iii) The PC has a quality power supply unit (at least 300w, preferably more)
iv) Opt for an AMD CPU which run cooler. Intel Pentium 4 CPUs are noctoriously hot.

 

[KasinoKing]

i) The room is not overly hot
ii) There are adequate cooling fans in your case and on top of the CPU
iii) The PC has a quality power supply unit (at least 300w, preferably more)
iv) Opt for an AMD CPU which run cooler. Intel Pentium 4 CPUs are notoriously hot.

So the best thing to do is cram your PC into the fridge/freezer?

Seriously though - very good advice.
But at the end of the day, this is down to Microgaming. They should be sorting this out, or at least warning players of the dangers. (e.g. Replace the intro movies in casinos with a flashing sign: 'Warning - using this casino may cause your computer to explode!')

 

[tunisianswife]

I'm so glad that I read this post. I have recently stopped playing MG because the games seem to run so slow and I always think that it seems like my computer is working overtime to try to play the games. Now I know why. Thanks for the tip, TIMNY, maybe I'll give that a try since I have a b'day bonus coming from Maple and do want to play it but don't want the hassle.

 

[DealerBusts]

So the best thing to do is cram your PC into the fridge/freezer?

Seriously though - very good advice.
But at the end of the day, this is down to Microgaming. They should be sorting this out, or at least warning players of the dangers. (e.g. Replace the intro movies in casinos with a flashing sign: 'Warning - using this casino may cause your computer to explode!')

Hehe.....some people do the equivilant of that but we're talking about serious PC enthusiasts. Ideally PCs should be stable at 100% CPU usage but many PCs are not built with quality components and cooling in mind.

I agree that MG should be sorting it out, after all we're only running a casino application, not trying to predict the weather. Our PCs shouldn't be stressed out so badly.

 

[Thakid2u]

Jupiter Casino just redid their casino Lobby. Since then all hell has broke loose. The games run slow as hell, to the point where you wait a min or 2 for the slots to stop. Tried playing VP...LMAO...it wasnt even fun, (although I did hit my first RF on my second dealt hand.) It seems since the lobby changed, (more graphics, and anims.) It has been running crappier (if that's a word) then before.

Ok, you may say....It's the time you are playing....Nope, Tried about every hour you could play. Although about 5am to about 8am est. does seem to run a bit better. NOT MUCH THOUGH.

 

[KasinoKing]

It has been running crappier (if that's a word) than before.

Crappier sure is a word - so is Microrigging!

On my PC some MG's run real bad, while others work brilliantly.
I believe this is down to server congestion, rather than CPU usage - so to anyone having problems, it might NOT be down to this.

 

[Agamemnon]

Interesting posts.

What kind of CPU's are we talking about?
My own PC is quite powerful (6 month old, latest games optimised apparently),
and I although I've noticed high usage, it's never been complete 100%.

Is this a case of
1) Some CPU's not being up to the task?
or
2) Taking up all CPU space on principle.
My own take is that it's probably the former case, bit I'd appreciate some feedback.
Either way,
1 is a bad design decision.
2 is a really really bad design decision

I realise that ovehauling your software can't be done quickly,
but the next version should take these complaints into consideration.
If nothing else, shoddy software tends to be shoddy down the line.
Just my two cents

 

[chalupa]

My system is a 1.8Ghz Pentium 4 with 1GB RAM running Windows XP Pro, a bit out of date by today's standards but certainly it shouldn't be stressed by a simpleminded 2-D graphics casino client.

On my system the Microgaming Viper software runs without any sluggishness, but the CPU utilization is 100% even when the software is idle.

So there is clearly some sort of bug and/or really poorly designed code in there somewhere. You don't need 100% of a Pentium 4 while just waiting around for a mouse click.

 

[DealerBusts]

Interesting posts.

What kind of CPU's are we talking about?
My own PC is quite powerful (6 month old, latest games optimised apparently),
and I although I've noticed high usage, it's never been complete 100%.

Is this a case of
1) Some CPU's not being up to the task?
or
2) Taking up all CPU space on principle.
My own take is that it's probably the former case, bit I'd appreciate some feedback.
Either way,
1 is a bad design decision.
2 is a really really bad design decision

I realise that ovehauling your software can't be done quickly,
but the next version should take these complaints into consideration.
If nothing else, shoddy software tends to be shoddy down the line.
Just my two cents

Its probably a combination of 1) and 2). The software may be too CPU intensive due to poor programming and its effect will be magnified on older computer with slower CPUs. The vast majority of PCs out there are probably at least 2 years old so the program writers should definitely cater for everyone.

Maybe the same approach should be taken as computer games where the user can select a 'low detail setting' with fewer flashy graphics and sounds so it at least runs at a respectable speed.

 

[spearmaster]

This is a problem which will be fixed in an update soon. It has nothing to do with your computer - the software is using up too many spare cycles, thus causing the CPU to be overutilized.

It appears to be more a problem of "in order to get the best speed, claim all available remaining cycles" than "software can't operate without 100% CPU utilization". The result just wasn't as expected.

 

[Oebro]

This is a problem which will be fixed in an update soon.

How soon? This really bugs me. I've had my CPU overheat a couple of times now.

It's a little better in flash versions, but still not good.

 

[chalupa]

It appears to be more a problem of "in order to get the best speed, claim all available remaining cycles"

I hope the programming geniuses who thought this up weren't the guys who wrote the random number generator!

 

[Oebro]

I hope the programming geniuses who thought this up weren't the guys who wrote the random number generator!

Good one!

 

[tim5ny]

I'm so glad that I read this post. I have recently stopped playing MG because the games seem to run so slow and I always think that it seems like my computer is working overtime to try to play the games. Now I know why. Thanks for the tip, TIMNY, maybe I'll give that a try since I have a b'day bonus coming from Maple and do want to play it but don't want the hassle.

You're welcome! Lowering the screen resolution and the color quality is the only answer for some people to be able to run the software smoothly.

 

[Vesuvio]

You're welcome! Lowering the screen resolution and the color quality is the only answer for some people to be able to run the software smoothly.

It doesn't look like an issue with computer specs, except that some computers will obviously have better cooling systems or architecture to cope with excessive CPU usage. This occurs when you're not even playing a game, so there's clearly no technical justification.

Spearmaster, seeing as MG are aware of this problem shouldn't they actually be obliged to warn players about the risks? I love KK's suggestion, neatly killing two birds with one stone: "Replace the intro movies in casinos with a flashing sign: 'Warning - using this casino may cause your computer to explode!'"

Ok, it's not going to happen, but if anyone's computer's damaged by this MG will be morally liable for the damage. I'm sure their terms are full of get-out clauses so there won't be any legal remedy, but they can expect a very rough ride on the message boards

 

[spearmaster]

Spearmaster, seeing as MG are aware of this problem shouldn't they actually be obliged to warn players about the risks? I love KK's suggestion, neatly killing two birds with one stone: "Replace the intro movies in casinos with a flashing sign: 'Warning - using this casino may cause your computer to explode!'"

Ok, it's not going to happen, but if anyone's computer's damaged by this MG will be morally liable for the damage. I'm sure their terms are full of get-out clauses so there won't be any legal remedy, but they can expect a very rough ride on the message boards

LOL.

Computers are supposed to be built to handle 100% CPU usage without having any problems. If the CPU overheats, your cooling fan (or even the other fans on the computer) are either poorly designed, improperly seated or simply clogged with dust - or the silicone grease/gel has dried up.

If you have a brand name computer and you are experiencing these problems, demand that the manufacturer repair or replace the equipment. If you have a generic system, you may have a tougher time getting any help because they will tell you your computer was never designed to run at that capacity over long stretches of time.

That doesn't excuse Microgaming from using up 100% of idle CPU cycles, but if a computer fails it will not be because of the software.

 

[Vesuvio]

LOL.

Computers are supposed to be built to handle 100% CPU usage without having any problems. If the CPU overheats, your cooling fan (or even the other fans on the computer) are either poorly designed, improperly seated or simply clogged with dust - or the silicone grease/gel has dried up.

I've got a laptop built by a well-known brand (laptops are of course more susceptible). The cooling fan and hard drive were replaced late last year, so it's unlikely that the fan's malfunctioning again yet. I'm not sure what technically constitutes overheating (the CPU keeps going), but the fan runs permanently and vents out extremely hot air.

I'm not expecting MG to do anything, though I do think a simple warning tucked somewhere among all the weird and wonderful terms and conditions their casinos come up with would be in place. You say "if a computer fails it will not be because of the software", but whatever the arguments about causality/liability, you can't deny this software flaw will shorten the lives of components, even if things don't run dangerously on most systems.

I agree in a way with your "LOL" - it is an absurd situation. I actually find myself limiting play to avoid damaging my computer! Maybe the money saved will eventually pay for a new computer

 

[winbig]

Also keep in mind certain computers will shut themselves down if the CPU reaches a certain temp to avoid burning it out.

 

[Tdoggy]

wish I had one

Also keep in mind certain computers will shut themselves down if the CPU reaches a certain temp to avoid burning it out.



Wish I had one. Because mine was burnt out do to a microgaming casino running for to long. I had no idea until I brought it to a computer tech. Couldn't believe I had to replace my hard drive because of a microgaming casino. Good lord! They should warn people, but wont.

 

[winbig]

Also keep in mind certain computers will shut themselves down if the CPU reaches a certain temp to avoid burning it out.


Good lord! They should warn people, but wont.

Or actually hire some programmers that know what they're doing instead of releasing software that utilizes so much CPU time

What gets me is why in the world would it even need to be using so much CPU time when it's idle? Definately a glitch (a stupid one) that should have been caught well before the last update was released to the public.

 

[trade]

100% Cpu

I have never had this problem with MG but did have it happen once with Playtech at USA casino. I have played at other playtech without this problem, until yesterday, where same thing happened when I tried out Kiwi. I was able to play initially, and then when I went back, it wouldn't let me past the log on. I realized when things froze up, that the CPU was at 100% on the casino exe. process, and 0% on all the other applications. They did not provide me with any viable solutions, so I blew the $40 I had left on the Flash version which has lousy choices of games and bet denominations.

 

[caruso]

Because mine was burnt out do to a microgaming casino running for to long. I had no idea until I brought it to a computer tech. Couldn't believe I had to replace my hard drive because of a microgaming casino.

Do you know this for certain? How?

As I said earlier, I've had two inexplicable hard disc failures, and this may be the first realistic explanation.

If Microgaming are burning out customers' computers, this matter needs some serious coverage. I lost data in my last crash I could well have done without losing. I wasn't fully backed up, since I was hardly expecting a failure just five months into my new disc.

I don't even know how to monitor "CPU usage" or whatever it is. Are there any quick ways to get a handle on it?

 

[Macgyver]

I don't even know how to monitor "CPU usage" or whatever it is. Are there any quick ways to get a handle on it?

If you're using Windows, you can hit "Ctrl-Alt-Del" (just once) and go to Task Manager or the task manager window will popup. From there, just click on the "Performance" tab and it'll show the CPU usage.

 

[trade]

Cpu

The only way I could exit out of the casino was doing the ctrl alt/ delete command and then going to processes, then choosing the casino.exe thing, and "end process"... nothing short of shutting down otherwise worked.

 

[caruso]

Thanks, Macgyver, perfect.

I just tested Microgaming, followed by Crupto, RTG and Playtech.

RTG has no effect at all.
Crypto has no effect.
Playtech fluctautes between 8% and 20%.
Microgaming is flat out, solid, on 100%.

Can anyone confirm that 100% CPU usage can possibly result in hard disc burnout?

If yes, this looks very bad. I've had some heavy Microgaming sessions this weekend, and now I'm afraid I'm wrecking my hard drive.

What a neat piece of ammo for the US anti-gambling lobby: leading online casino software provider is burning out customers' computers.

WTG, Microgaming. I hope you get stuck for a load of bills. Thanks a bunch.

 

[winbig]

Theoretically, it could burn up a hard drive &/or other components inside your case if your cooling fans weren't enough protection and the computer didn't automatically shut itself off after reaching a certain temp.

For those that don't automatically shut down, here's a great utility to use that *will* do this for you. You can set your own temps to warn/shutdown at and everything. It's at

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

, and called "motherboard monitor". Great program that will run in the background and leave an icon in your system tray displaying the current temp.


PS: This is freeware, not shareware. You'll never have to pay a dime for it.

 

[nafanny29]

I dont know if MG causes a hard disc to fail but their poker and casinos caused my pc to malfunction. During a 2 table session on Bet365 poker my PC froze so badly that it would not re-boot I had to re-install my OS from scratch due to god knows what. I was seriously pissed off believe me. (and I know it was MG poker because that was the ONLY thing running at the time)
Luckily I had everything important backed up on a USB "stick" but it was still 3 hours out of my day

 

[spearmaster]

Excessive heat is the fault of the COMPUTER MANUFACTURER, not the software, so you'd be hanging the blame on the wrong people. You should thank them for exposing the shoddy quality of your computers instead.

Notebooks excepted, of course.

But no desktop computer should have component failure because of the inability of the design to expel heat, no CPU should ever burn out unless the heatsink/fan combo is improperly seated or of poor quality, and no hard drive should fail due to a heat situation because they themselves generate the most heat in the system and they are built to withstand fairly high temperatures.

Plus, as winbig said, computers are designed to safely shut down when excessive tempertures are detected in the system or the CPU - and if this is not happening, the fault lies with - you guessed it, the MANUFACTURER.

 

[chalupa]

Excessive heat is the fault of the COMPUTER MANUFACTURER, not the software, so you'd be hanging the blame on the wrong people. You should thank them for exposing the shoddy quality of your computers instead.

So... if someone wrote some software that:
- Ran the CPU at max capacity
- Thrashed your hard drive around by perform strenuous seeks
- Cycled your CD-ROM tray in and out
- Repeatedly dialed your modem and hung up
- Flashed your monitor between black and white 10 times a second

All of which led to premature system failure... then that would be the fault of the computer manufacturer, and you should thank the software writer?

Look, the average guy isn't running mil-spec hardware. Running a CPU at max capacity WILL shorten your system life, even if you have adaptive fan speeds, if for no other reason than extra dust will be sucked into your system.

And certainly your electric bill will be higher -- think of all the extra oil/gas/uranium burnt up with autoplay every time a Microgaming progressive slot jackpot gets way up there!

People should not reasonably expect a simple 2-D graphics game like a casino client to suck up 100% of the CPU time on a modern processor.

It's really lame that Microgaming unleashed such a blatant flaw onto a very wide audience. It gets more lame every day that goes by without them fixing it, or at least warning their users.

 

[spearmaster]

So... if someone wrote some software that:
- Ran the CPU at max capacity
- Thrashed your hard drive around by perform strenuous seeks
- Cycled your CD-ROM tray in and out
- Repeatedly dialed your modem and hung up
- Flashed your monitor between black and white 10 times a second

All of which led to premature system failure... then that would be the fault of the computer manufacturer, and you should thank the software writer?

Look, the average guy isn't running mil-spec hardware. Running a CPU at max capacity WILL shorten your system life, even if you have adaptive fan speeds, if for no other reason than extra dust will be sucked into your system.

And certainly your electric bill will be higher -- think of all the extra oil/gas/uranium burnt up with autoplay every time a Microgaming progressive slot jackpot gets way up there!

People should not reasonably expect a simple 2-D graphics game like a casino client to suck up 100% of the CPU time on a modern processor.

It's really lame that Microgaming unleashed such a blatant flaw onto a very wide audience. It gets more lame every day that goes by without them fixing it, or at least warning their users.

It's a flaw, to be sure. It will be addressed in a future update, perhaps with the next release of new games later this month.

However, we're not talking mil-spec equipment. All computers are supposed to be designed to protect themselves. Mil-spec equipment has even higher levels of fault tolerance, and cooling systems like a freezer in clean rooms.

If you are having problems with CD-ROM, flashing monitors, modem redialing, etc. then the software is not at fault, and neither is the CPU usage. Those are signs of a likely problem in the motherboard or video card.

Trust me. I used to build high-end computers for a living. I overclocked CPUs well beyond their specs and then thrashed them for testing.

A chain is only as good as its weakest link. In most cases, it's the cooling system. It's like having a Ferrari with a broken motor fan - no matter how good the engine, it will overheat and possibly fail, and it has nothing to do with the driver putting the pedal to the metal.

 

[chalupa]

I think you misread my post... my computer isn't doing those funky things, however I could write software that WOULD make it do that, and when the hardware failed prematurely (as it surely would), it would be the software's fault.

The Ferrari analogy would be sending your dear old mom to the grocery store (well, maybe just out for a burger, not much trunk space)... a simple task, sorta like a modern computer running 2-D casino software. You would reasonably expect your high-performance car to come back barely warmed up.

If, on the other hand, your mom redlines it to the store and back, leaving a trail of smoking rubber from door-to-door... your Ferrari's life WILL be shortened, despite the fact that it has a big ol' motor fan.

 

[Vesuvio]

For those that don't automatically shut down, here's a great utility to use that *will* do this for you. You can set your own temps to warn/shutdown at and everything. It's at

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

, and called "motherboard monitor". Great program that will run in the background and leave an icon in your system tray displaying the current temp.

Cheers, winbig72. I just installed that and tried opening an MG casino as an experiment. It took about 20 seconds to set off the default alarm for the CPU reaching 70 degrees C & finally settled on 88. I'd hate to think what might happen if I actually start gambling instead of just staying in the lobby!

Still, it's probably my fault. I should have realised MG casinos weren't designed to be run on laptops

 

[caruso]

Ditto - thanks, Winbig. This is turning into a useful thread.

Crypto and RTG get by on barely any CPU usage.
Playtech push it up to 20%

Microgaming max it out constantly at 100%.

It should NOT be a tacit requirement that I have a "quality X" PC setup to run the software supplied by the number one casino software supplier. Nobody else is causing this overheating. That Microgaming are allowing this to happen demonstrates an extraordinary level of contempt for their customers. They know the danger, that potentially sub-standard setups may fail, and ALL setups are going to have their longevity reduced - yet they allow it to continue unchecked.

Maybe my two hard drives failed because my fan wasn't big enough to control the Microgaming onslaught. The fact remains that with RTG, Crypto and Playtech this has never happened, and with Microgaming it HAS happened and IS happening. This remains indefensible.

 

[spearmaster]

It should NOT be a tacit requirement that I have a "quality X" PC setup to run the software supplied by the number one casino software supplier. Nobody else is causing this overheating. That Microgaming are allowing this to happen demonstrates an extraordinary level of contempt for their customers. They know the danger, that potentially sub-standard setups may fail, and ALL setups are going to have their longevity reduced - yet they allow it to continue unchecked.

Maybe my two hard drives failed because my fan wasn't big enough to control the Microgaming onslaught. The fact remains that with RTG, Crypto and Playtech this has never happened, and with Microgaming it HAS happened and IS happening. This remains indefensible.

This is irrelevant. You could just as well be playing Doom V or running some other program (ie. Photoshop and large graphics) which would cause the exact same symptoms. As I said before, I built computers for a living in the past, and while I don't think Microgaming software should require 100% CPU usage under any circumstances, it cannot be blamed for indirectly being the source of a problem caused by a computer which does not meet certain minimum quality standards.

You guys can argue about this all you like. I am telling you what the possible causes are and what to blame it on but if you don't agree, that's life. I certainly will not agree that Microgaming is the cause of this problem under any circumstances, however. I do agree, however, that they need to make modifications to the software in order to reduce unnecessary CPU usage. The fact that other software does NOT cause this problem does not mean that Microgaming software is the cause of the problem.

Keep in mind that you are still running under an O/S - which delivers what it is asked to by other software, not by what the machine dictates - and the machine itself is supposed to take action when certain limits are exceeded, and if you are overheating then your computer is not properly configured or is faulty. *ALL* PC-compatible computers built after 1994 have these capabilities in their BIOS.

Just because you drive a car at 55 kph and never test the limits does not mean that the car should not operate properly at 200kph. THAT is the correct relationship between the different softwares - Microgaming is trying to push the limit and the car does not operate correctly. You can't blame them for that - but you can ask them to make it so that it does not test the limits of the machine - ie regulate CPU (engine) usage.

 

[Vesuvio]

This is irrelevant. You could just as well be playing Doom V or running some other program (ie. Photoshop and large graphics) which would cause the exact same symptoms.

I've been playing around with this new temperature gauge. When it's idle my computer runs at about 50 degrees. Loading up lots of different software (photoshop, games, media player) I can get it up to about 60 degrees. Only if I load up an MG casino does it suddenly climb above 80 at which point I should probably close the software as soon as possible to avoid permanent damage.

My computer may very well be badly designed, but I'm not trying to run state of the art games or graphics software, I'm just trying to run a simplistic 2D on-line casino.

Just because you drive a car at 55 kph and never test the limits does not mean that the car should not operate properly at 200kph. THAT is the correct relationship between the different softwares - Microgaming is trying to push the limit and the car does not operate correctly. You can't blame them for that - but you can ask them to make it so that it does not test the limits of the machine - ie regulate CPU (engine) usage.

If you drive a car at 55kph and it uses as much fuel and causes as much wear and tear as if you were driving at 200kph you'd be pretty annoyed with the manufacturers though, wouldn't you!?

I'm not saying you can directly hold MG responsible for damage done to computers, but at the moment prolonged use will completely unnecessarily reduce the lifespan of your computer. Players should be aware of that and act accordingly.

 

[spearmaster]

Vesuvio, I noted your comment on notebooks.. LOL... tried to edit my last reply but it went sort of haywire so I let it go. Notebooks are built to a different set of specs, and many include a warning that the notebook will not stand sustained high CPU usage and may attempt to shut down. But they all have the same monitoring systems in the BIOS as standard desktops.

I've been playing around with this new temperature gauge. When it's idle my computer runs at about 50 degrees. Loading up lots of different software (photoshop, games, media player) I can get it up to about 60 degrees. Only if I load up an MG casino does it suddenly climb above 80 at which point I should probably close the software as soon as possible to avoid permanent damage.

If your computer was properly built, there should be no problem. That temperature thing is kind of cool, if I'm not mistaken it actually monitors the numbers reported by the BIOS. Thus, if your BIOS has set a level at which it will shut down, it should automatically happen, and if your O/S is relatively modern this will even cause the software to shut down properly before the machine goes off.

80 degrees is hot for a CPU, no doubt about it. When I tested I watched for the same things - especially CPU over 80 degrees, but even with only standard cooling I could never make it hit 80.

Assuming you are using a notebook, of course, 80 is actually not as uncommon as one might think, since there is very little ventilation in a notebook, and all the components which might get hot are positioned very close to each other (hard disk, graphics card, CPU) - and a tiny little fan has to try and suck out this hot air as fast as it can. The problem is basically unavoidable for any notebook under stress and that's why notebooks often come with warnings if they are not designed for high-end applications.

The casino software should under no circumstances be a high-end application - unfortunately, right now it is acting like one, I swear I can even see the software competing with itself to gain additional cycles, especially when I am playing slots - the last of five reels stutters noticeably if more than one win line is activated.

My computer may very well be badly designed, but I'm not trying to run state of the art games or graphics software, I'm just trying to run a simplistic 2D on-line casino.

Agreed. But you still can't place the blame on the software for causing a malfunction. You can blame it for causing your computer to shut down, though... LOL...

Also, it's not necessarily the design, again if you are using a notebook there is only so much creativity one can use. It's the actual capability of the cooling equipment to do it's job, as well as the functionality of the BIOS to detect a potentially dangerous situation and shut the computer down.

If you drive a car at 55kph and it uses as much fuel and causes as much wear and tear as if you were driving at 200kph you'd be pretty annoyed with the manufacturers though, wouldn't you!?

Annoyed indeed. Absolutely no argument here. But CPUs and memory are solid-state components - they either work or they don't, there should NOT be any such thing as wear and tear. If anything, old RAM is more valuable than new RAM because it's already been proven reliable. Wish I could say the same about CPUs but advances in speed and technology simply make this impossible.

Hard drives will not be subject to any additional wear and tear no matter how hard the CPU is working, though obviously high heat situations (usually over 100) can cause an early failure.

Graphic cards are also solid-state, and should fall under the same conditions as CPU and memory. Most modern graphics cards have their own heatsinks and fans on the graphics processor.

I'm not saying you can directly hold MG responsible for damage done to computers, but at the moment prolonged use will completely unnecessarily reduce the lifespan of your computer. Players should be aware of that and act accordingly.

This is not correct. If your computer was properly built, even with the most basic standard components, 100% CPU usage will not cause any damage whatsoever to any component - the only thing that should happen is that other software may act more sluggishly.

Notebooks excepted. No way I can get around that design issue LOL.

 

[Vesuvio]

But CPUs and memory are solid-state components - they either work or they don't, there should NOT be any such thing as wear and tear. If anything, old RAM is more valuable than new RAM because it's already been proven reliable. Wish I could say the same about CPUs but advances in speed and technology simply make this impossible.

Hard drives will not be subject to any additional wear and tear no matter how hard the CPU is working, though obviously high heat situations (usually over 100) can cause an early failure.

You might well be right about how CPUs fail (all at once or not at all), though I'm sure I read that they can be damaged gradually.

I guess the much more likely scenario is that the fan fails first. Its lifespan definitely is dependent on how hard it has to work, so the current MG software will reduce it more than it should. If anyone finds themselves in the same position I did late last year of the fan gradually becoming noisier I'd strongly advise you to have the computer checked out. I didn't and though the fan never entirely stopped working my hard drive gradually developed read errors before packing in completely (perhaps from overheating - it gets to be a vicious circle as the fan failing lets the computer get hotter so the fan tries to work harder...). Luckily it was under warranty & I got the drive and fan replaced, but just getting the fan cleaned or fixed (or giving up gambling )would have saved an awful lot of hassle!

 

[spearmaster]

You might well be right about how CPUs fail (all at once or not at all), though I'm sure I read that they can be damaged gradually.

Theoretically, yes, but only under very extreme conditions, usually caused by the failure of the cooling system. Won't happen at 80 degrees.

I guess the much more likely scenario is that the fan fails first. Its lifespan definitely is dependent on how hard it has to work, so the current MG software will reduce it more than it should.

Not really. The fan spins at a constant speed no matter how hard the CPU is utilized. The reason a CPU heats up is because the fan/heatsink is naturally able to dissipate heat less efficiently when the CPU is being heavily used. But its efforts are still plenty sufficient if it is keeping your CPU at 80, though I would call that a bit hot.

If your CPU hits 100, or perhaps even 90, then I'd start to worry a bit. But 80, while not ideal, is still within normal specifications.

If anyone finds themselves in the same position I did late last year of the fan gradually becoming noisier I'd strongly advise you to have the computer checked out. I didn't and though the fan never entirely stopped working my hard drive gradually developed read errors before packing in completely (perhaps from overheating - it gets to be a vicious circle as the fan failing lets the computer get hotter so the fan tries to work harder...). Luckily it was under warranty & I got the drive and fan replaced, but just getting the fan cleaned or fixed (or giving up gambling )would have saved an awful lot of hassle!

Exactly - you hit it on the head here. The fan may still operate, but if it is not operating within its normal speed range, it will definitely become a big problem, unless you are in constantly cold climates. Here in Thailand it is a sure sign of trouble no matter what time of year it is, though I suppose in Scandinavia it is far less of a worry unless the computer is sitting near the heater! Though the fan won't work any harder, it can only get worse, not better - fans in computers are not normally variable speed, though perhaps the main system fan(s) could be variable speed. Again, notebooks excepted - they actually do have variable speed fans in order to reduce battery drain.

More tips for desktops:

* Don't open the cover of the computer to dissipate heat, as this actually disturbs the air flow and may actually cause various components to overheat! If you have excessive build-up of heat, you can open the cover temporarily to let out excess heat, but make sure to close it up again quickly so that proper airflow will evenly cool the components.

* Many computers have their air intake, with or without fan, at the base of the computer - so if you have a carpet, rug, or potentially dirty floor, do NOT set the computer on the floor!

* If your computer has available space, don't stack all the drives up as close as possible - space them out evenly to get better air flow. And if you have drives that you don't use very often, take them out, no sense in heating up the computer with a drive you won't be using, not to mention using more power.

* If possible, route your cables around the edges of the computer, preferably with some sort of cable gather, making sure not to block any vents.

* Make sure the power plugs are seated FIRMLY in the hard drive sockets - believe it or not, this is the #1 cause of a hard drive failure.

* Lastly, the obvious thing - make sure there is space around the computer so that air can flow around all sides.