Mathematical Proof that English Harbour is cheating

[spearmaster]

Actually, Playcheck now shows 21 days. A month has passed, this should have been enough time to dig out and analyze the logs. The full logs are obviously too big and contain commercially sensitive information, but a trusted 3rd party could analyze them and produce a report.

Just goes to show you how long it's been since I've looked at my own logs... LOL...

I'm only speculating at this point, but I don't think they exactly jumped to get out all the logs when the issue happened. If they had decided to do an internal audit, obviously they would have had all this information available by now - so I'm presuming they don't believe there's a problem from the past.

Nevertheless, this is something they can consider if they wish - I assume that they would ask the Wiz to do that analysis.

 

[nektar4d]

How long will it take?

to reach a conclusion?
It's been more than a month from the initial post and still at the same point...
This thread has become enormous and probably difficult to follow, especially if someone reads it for the 1st time. I haven't myself read the last 10 days posts, but I remember there was supposed to be a decisive meeting in Montreal in mid-May...
If it's going to take months, we may lose the forest and find just one analysis-tree

 

[thelawnet]

Just goes to show you how long it's been since I've looked at my own logs... LOL...

I'm only speculating at this point, but I don't think they exactly jumped to get out all the logs when the issue happened. If they had decided to do an internal audit, obviously they would have had all this information available by now - so I'm presuming they don't believe there's a problem from the past.

Nevertheless, this is something they can consider if they wish - I assume that they would ask the Wiz to do that analysis.

have you finished with EH now?

Is this it?

Or can we expect another statement?

 

[kengam]

This isn't it from me. English Harbour is just hoping this is forgotten. I still can't believe they didn't even issue a statement. We will not forget that is for sure.

 

[suzecat]

Spear, hope you are well.

Been toe-tapping for weeks now, being cool and waiting for some revelation from EH/Oddson that would sum up the problem and/or assure players that the casino was safe/fair. All I can take from this thread is that EH/Oddson thinks it is ok to remain silent and just weather the storm. "Do as I say, not as I do." Just deposit and lose and all is fine, no mea culpas are needed.

Spear I appreciate all your efforts to bring something to the forum by way of explanation. That was the human reaction when you knew that more info was needed. I find it regrettable that EH/Oddson hung you out to dry instead of stepping up to the plate and taking some freakin' rersponsibility for the mess that THEY CREATED.

And life goes on............will I ever play again at EH/Oddson? Probably not, well, actually, a resounding NO. Too many fair groups out there to play at one that has proven its ability to cheat/stack the odds/diss me/give me the cold shoulder/think I am stoopid/etc. etc. ad nauseum............

 

[spearmaster]

I have not been hung out to dry. But since everyone has already assumed what my findings would be, and there are more important things happening at present, I simply put everything on the back burner. And to be dead honest I'm not particularly enthused about finishing it up either since no one seems to care about the code.

So I will finish it when I finish it. I'm a bit more concerned about Jackpot Factory at the moment, along with a few other things.

And thanks for asking about me

 

[kengam]

I guess your time was wasted as I predicted. I don't see how you can say they didn't hang you out to dry. They allowed you to look helpless and come across as the lone defender of a caught cheat. This has done nothing for your credibility and nothing for EH and Odds ON's credibility. The only thing you managed to accomplish was to give them a reason to stay quiet. I am beginning to think that was your intention.

 

[Pinababy69]

They allowed you to look helpless

Spearmaster helpless? Okay.....

 

[soflat]

Now that it is all done, isn't it time for that poll?

I don't think Spearmaster's credibility was damaged.

I can't say the same for the Wizard of Odds though. I love his site, but he should stop certifying results because it was proven to be a total crock. I know he has the excuse that he would not have viewed the logs from April until May. But his statement indicated that EH and him agreed that earlier logs should be analyzed, and they both failed to follow through on that. I hate to criticize him like this because like I said I love his site (still do) and I respected his certification before this.

 

[Linus]

Spear - thanks for the work you've put into this case. While I did disagree with you - and do disagree with you - about the reliability & significance of the code they sent you, I do think you're genuinely interested in making things safer for the player.

It's just that English Harbour violated the first commandment of online gaming - it failed to provide a fair game to players. Perhaps they could have regained players' trust. But, from my point of view, they've barely made an effort.


Soflat - yeah, I have to admit, this hasn't reflected well on The Wizard. I will probably always suspect that - had EH not been one of his clients - he would have reacted differently. I suspect English Harbour would have joined the other casinos on his blacklist.

 

[spearmaster]

It's just that English Harbour violated the first commandment of online gaming - it failed to provide a fair game to players. Perhaps they could have regained players' trust. But, from my point of view, they've barely made an effort.

Naturally, I believe all games should be fair. But I also recognize the fact that shit happens - and as they provided compensation to all affected players quite quickly (unlike a couple of other casinos recently discussed) I don't think any player ended up disadvantaged by the situation.

Effort - well, I'm not going to make a call on that. Some people will say that their second statement was enough, and some people won't. And ultimately they will decide for themselves what they need to do to regain player confidence.

 

[derelict]

and as they provided compensation to all affected players quite quickly (unlike a couple of other casinos recently discussed) I don't think any player ended up disadvantaged by the situation.

After some prodding, they've dealt with the issue in April, I agree. But to me one of the most serious issues has still not been addressed at all. That is whether or not the game was fair in the past. To highlight some previous posts:

I myself about 6 months ago had a very bad loosing streak doubling in VP (but only 1 to 15000 I think, so possible).

bad enough to be 95% confident that the results were not within reasonable range. (3.5 standard deviations)

I too would have liked to see more of a response from EH/OddsOn and Mr. Shackleford. Considering the uproar over SEO tactics, I would have expected allegations of unfair gaming to be taken more seriously.

 

[kengam]

about that poll....can it be put back up?

 

[thelawnet]

Naturally, I believe all games should be fair. But I also recognize the fact that shit happens - and as they provided compensation to all affected players quite quickly (unlike a couple of other casinos recently discussed) I don't think any player ended up disadvantaged by the situation.

Effort - well, I'm not going to make a call on that. Some people will say that their second statement was enough, and some people won't. And ultimately they will decide for themselves what they need to do to regain player confidence.

The problem is that it looks like they had faulty code in place, realised, and scheduled a replacement.

This in itself is not so bad, but the fact is that they then went on to lie and say that there was nothing wrong, said that their tests showed it was fair (a false claim). It was only when they realised that the people observing would not be dazzled by their pseudo-mathematical lies that they put out the second statement.

Most people would forgive them the faulty code. Lying about there ever having been a problem, and trying to put in what was clearly a completely fabricated bullshit PR statement as coverup is absolutely not acceptable.

There is no question that their behaviour in lying about the problems with their game (which I can accept may have been accidental) should have them firmly listed as a rogue casino.

It beggars belief that other casinos, from 888.com to Grand Prive, to Jackpot Factory are listed there, whereas a casino who lied about their games being faulty is not.

As has been pointed out elsewhere, this shows that payout reports from the likes of Pricewaterhouse Coopers or Michael Shackelford's auditing service do not provide any guarantee of a true and fair game. I do not believe that the video poker doubling game was ever specifically audited, as the fact that Mr. Shackelford did not already have at his disposal logs for the previous 12 months or so shows this. The 'guarantee' is little different from a celebrity endorsement of a running shoe, and really guarantees nothing.

The only thing that can be said for them is that they did not want to go out of business by going 'underground', and just refusing to do anything or answering complaints - once they had been caught red handed and after their initial attempt at a cover-up, they did pay everyone back. The best you can say of this episode is that if you play at a mainstream casino like this, if you can prove the casino is ripping you off, you will get paid back. Those who can't prove it, you get nothing. But that's at least better than the likes of Casino Bar, where they just say 'up yours'.

Hardly an endorsement for a casino however, and I doubt that we will see this lot being endorsed by upstanding affiliates again.

 

[kengam]

It was easy to pay back the players from April when they have been using that cheat for years. They got 40k of my money prior to that and much more from others.

 

[soflat]

I do not believe that the video poker doubling game was ever specifically audited, as the fact that Mr. Shackelford did not already have at his disposal logs for the previous 12 months or so shows this. The 'guarantee' is little different from a celebrity endorsement of a running shoe, and really guarantees nothing.

I agree. I don't understand why Mr Shackleford said that he would have caught the problem in June (when he normally looks at the logs). If that were true (that he normally looks at thedouble-up) then how come he would need to go back over the old logs to see if it were unfair earlier. There is a contradiction there.

I'm guessing that he only looks at the rng and maybe overall payout percentages like Price Waterhouse. Which is totally worthless. I feel it was deceptive to say the games are fair if he never looked.

Your post pretty much summarizes how I feel about the whole situation.

 

[kengam]

vote on this issue in the new poll that is up. I assume we are allowed to have a poll now.

 

[spearmaster]

It was easy to pay back the players from April when they have been using that cheat for years. They got 40k of my money prior to that and much more from others.

Here you go spewing your nonsense again. You do NOT provide any proof that you were cheated in the first place, and you could hardly know that they have been using that cheat for years. Otherwise you might have said something YEARS ago... but no... you didn't want to expose yourself... so why are you exposing yourself now?

Is it me or is everything you are saying self-contradictory?

 

[kengam]

you may think it is nonsense. I think you are defending a lost cause. All you have to do is get hold of the past logs and you will see. I do not have them and they have refused to provide them. I am not the one who was caught cheating here. Let's just let the players decide for themselves rather than take their (your) word about it just being a bug.

 

[dirk_dangerous]

Is it me or is everything you are saying self-contradictory?

IMO, it's you Spear. You should probably drop the subject as you're looking a bit silly with your continued defense of this group of casinos.

Really, why do you continue to defend them when it is a known fact that the game was gaffed?

My advice: be silent on the issue, and let this group live or die by its own actions.

At present, there really isn't any good reason for any player to ever trust this group of casinos, or the software. There are far too many good casinos and software providers out there.

 

[henryVIII]

So, we can now say EH were cheating and effectively issued a statement which was a huge lie, on this very forum.

So what happens to casinos that are caught cheating and dont even offer any denial themselves (except the discredited 'audit' one)?

 

[kengam]

has EH been blacklisted or rogued anywhere? Bryan has tarred others for much less. If EH isn't rogued then I guess we shouldn't take any stock in that section of this forum.

 

[Casinomeister]

has EH been blacklisted or rogued anywhere? Bryan has tarred others for much less. If EH isn't rogued then I guess we shouldn't take any stock in that section of this forum.

Give me a friggin' break will ya. I was on leave for for two and a half weeks. I got back late Sunday eve, and I have a ton of crap to take care of.

I'll deal with this when I get to it if you don't mind. I have a number of other things to deal with that take precedence over this believe it or not.

By the way, the "Rogue Secction" is not a part of the forum.

 

[kengam]

sheesh. relax man. This is not a new event that happened only while you were gone. Whatever

 

[henryVIII]

It definately happened sometime this year because i remember reading it on the first sunny day of the year. I had to rearrange my monitor for the first time because of glare through the window.

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