Hi I'm new online casino gambling and I Love it, but it killed...

[Casinoheist1978]

Hi, my name is Michael, im 40years old, I have joined the forum to hopefully get some help and some answers through talking to people in a gambling community. Much like most people, I have not had much success in gambling online but played more than most as I have been fortunate to have access to funds recently.

I'm keen to speak to speak to people and get there view on these new television based casinos that are using amazing new technology and have a stranglehold on the market, the gameplay is amazing but statistically, I'm losing much more than I have ever lost in any physical brick casino in Vegas, UK or Europe...I pay the same strategy but it strange...

I work in IT and understand that the latest software and technology used to collect, harvest and utilise data in split seconds for a casino is Gold... especially on a regular player. For example, Roullete is an incredibly luck orientated game but the house is always looking for an edge, maybe this online casino crazy is the gold rush...

My company hires the brightest data Scientists and AI whiz kids to programm all kinds of whizzed. So I realized quickly it is very plausible, and in fact obvious that after a lengthy review of online tables that things have evolved beyond the capabilities of any gambling commisions ability to inspect for corruption....it very possible in this day an age for every spin or role of the dice to be controlled, or prefigured for the best outcome for the house. Utlising sophisticated, software, computers and machinery it is not a stretch at all in fact way too tempting to the house to not consider.

We live in this world, the technology and software code is used all around us in some form or another the technology and software are being used in other everyday things, so this would be a piece of cake to do, but ethical, moral, lethal...

So should we enjoy the game for what it is or throw our toys out of the pram and request a forensic analysis of these hidden gambling techniques if they even exist or is our minds playing games as we have chased the dragon for too long?

I personally love the whole sci-fi aspect unless people are getting hurt...

Speaking of which I want to Submit a PAB...hopefully they will allow me to do so and be fair as I'm truly interested in speaking with someone articulate in the industry captains on this matter.


I've spent hundreds of thousand on the biggest sites, I've been mistreated at times and pressure sold to with enticements and all sorts, Id likes to raise some concerns.

Please reach out and talk to me and lets chat about this...


Thanks and Be Safe
Michael




.

 

[pereblue]

Hey Michael a pleasure to get you on board. Enjoy and share your knowledge with Casinomeister community too.

 

[Casinoheist1978]

Thx Pereblue.... hopefully you guys will find some of what I share interesting and enlightening in coming days, months
Regards
MB

 

[goatwack]

Ahh, a fellow 40 year-old. I feel validated

 

[Borgie]

Ahh, a fellow 40 year-old. I feel validated

He's not a goat though . A 40 year old goat

 

[Casinoheist1978]

A 40 year old goat :0 - Cheers guys!

 

[Casinoheist1978]

Hi Guys, please see the link below - I get a lot of stuff hit my desk, has anyone seen some of this guys equipment, here is one post they did on youtube some time ago.... what do you think of the movement its very impressive and looks awfully strange if your used to brick casino in London, vegas but very familiar in terms of what I've seen online, over the last year not naming anybody but the big two-game hosts especially ???/

Please comment with your thoughts I'm interested in your thoughts...Physics laws are being rewritten on some tables and if we are to accept this as a natural momentum it would mean science and gravity is wrong. Therefore we are human curious beasts seeking answers so let's discuss this as a possibility to increase the house edge....I for one recall betting 5000 in one spin on an online casino with Richard Bransons compnay name attached to them. AT this point I was flush so I covered every number after, but after the ball had spun part from 0 and 8.. two numbers... I swear it was the most amazing thing I have witnessed the ball made a fascinating journey to another side of the table to land in the uncovered number and the movement was like this video it generating moment after it had slowed down.

This could some freaky science, spooky theory atoms at work but why always when I bet big...and guess what you do it again and it happens again...as long as bet big money on the table the ball will dance away to the lowest winning number or empty.

Its quite impressive stuff, I'm keen to see the engineering aspect of this sophisticated or not software and the technology working together with the human dealer as over. The link below is one of many you can find on the darknet if you know where to look and have the money...

What do you think are we all going mad, I've been playing online for over a year now and it's definitely spooky, what do you guys think could this be happening?

 

[neilw]

Hi Michael, Welcome aboard.

There's been a thread running for the past 3 years about whether Live Roulette is fixed. Evolution Live Roulette - stay away- huge scam

I suggest you take a look. There's 45 pages of speculation, but not one post with any concrete or credible evidence. Sure the technology exists to scam players, but I find it incredible that if scamming is at the level some people would have me believe, that no one, not anyone can provide the evidence. (I'm talking here about online live casinos), not B&M or RNG.

 

[lotusch]

Hi Michael,

Welcome to Casinomeister and I am sure you will get some decent feedback here as there are loads of experienced players, casino reps and people that work within the industry here.
And as Neil already highlighted in his previous reply, we have a huge thread going about Evolution Live Roulette.
Very interesting thread with a lot of opinions from members here.

Cheers,

Mark. (A 40+ dude also)

 

[Casinoheist1978]

Hi Neil,

Thanks for the kind welcome - I will definitely check out the thread, I'm still finding my way around the site.

I agree with you hard evidence is difficult to come by but that's the point, if this exists it has to be stealthy right and if you're a company with extensive capital, money is surely no object ...

So the question is define evidence that will convince you? - because what is hard evidence in such a thing....being caught in the act is the only true evidence or finding a string of code in the software, back door, a physical rig, ball remote or dissecting a ball or table as it is happening?

But surely that's the point Neilw, if something like this exists, you would start your plan to build this by having these main criteria 1) accuracy and control 2) make it work as natural as possible 3) make sure it is stealthy, mobile, easil deployed and used remotely 4 ) Don't get caught - So when you have the inspectors coming, usually on an agreed date (thers plenty of time to turn on the stealth mode or remove all signs and still make a good days profit)

To properly investigate you need experts in the areas of software, technology, science, and forensics. Then you need the law on your side to allow, unfettered access at any time or day and to establish warrants and give them the authority to full access to all data video and infrastructure unrestricted access. This to our knowledge is not even close to what happens as you can easily interniew a retired inspector find out for your selves. This industry is run on money, and greasing palms, fancy dinners, client entertainment and so forth....corruption can possibly be playing a part.

So you need a shed load of cash - all of which the casinos have and regularly set aside to fund legal battles 24/7.

So what do we need, the punters? we need a Hedge Fund or maybe two, that are willing to sponsor the legal team, and who might have something to gain in the win or loss or bad press....failing that, crowdfund the legal fight ... Get all the gamblers who ever lost money to Chip in (excuse the pun), and put together a team of lawyers, scientists, computer scientists, and programmers and take on the digital casino studios and companies head-on with science facts and plenty of people willing to testify

Because to me and lots of others by all account its looks very spooky, darn right strange even. I have gambled plenty in B&M casino sand ever felts so compelled as I do raise this as a topic. Where there smoke there is usually fire.

But I agree that's still not enough...

But on serious note gambling is fun when you're in control but on the other hand, people have lost control and millions of lives have bee ruined and some have even taken their own lives due to the loses. If a compnay is taking advantage through cheating techniques then it becomes a very serious matter...

So naturally, companies bosses will contest this and spend millions making sure they nip things like this in the bud early, carefully managing all media, forums, and news to ensure they protect their investment because it is the golden goose.

This would be the biggest case of its kind in the world if it got the right traction at best it would be a great documentary

So in summary, you can, for example, conduct all the analysis on roulette wheels in a controlled environment. Run multiple live tests with experienced staff, constantly changing the variables for better broader data with thousands of spins. You can then run thousands of data points using software, and video capture techniques to compare in real time the physics and probability. This software will be able to predict the true moment and position of the ball taking into account every single obstacle it faces on the wheel and predict quite accurately where the ball should end up.

Now, this already exists, in fact, this is already built into some wheels they use online and companies are selling such wheels with this tech to map what is happening and collect data for the sole purpose so the casino can do there own in-house analysis. this is very detailed and sophisticated stuff that even analysis the person throwing the ball, the balls trajectory, velocity, the revolutions of the wheel, how hard it is spun and ultimately what the outcome will be.

I have bet big and won big in B&M but online with live roulette it is another beast completely.

All this is readily available from the large firms that build and test wheels professionally and provide them to these companies. So it's not hard to create or buy one of these for a test and you will start painting a picture of what is a standard result and what is not, from there you can expand the software into collecting data from live games and scenarios.

From that dataset, you can start to build up a picture of what is possible in actual gameplay. By reapplying this system back to the games in question online if the cameras were static an without delay, good latency, you can easily predict where the ball will end up. If the ball continues to not end up in the pocket that is predicted by the software, time and time again, you can argue the game is being adjusted or tampered with.

The more sophisticated these studios are becoming it should make it easier to regulate a system, that is constantly collecting data, a simple black box, that sits on each table and records and collects data in real time that can be sent to the regulators and correlate against the live stream will do the trick. the problem is the regulators need to be able to interrogate such sophisticated systems and techniques and are they fit for purpose to do that unbiasedly ??

This is the only way to regulate properly otherwise you have given companies access to Pandora's box with little to no vetting, who have the latest technology, knowing the inspectors don't have the tools and acumen to properly investigate, hold them accountable or really ever catch them in the act.

The technology is not a stretch at all to what is capable - catching them in the act is tough, even though you see it in videos you need hard evidence as you say, or accurate reliable datasets or the next best thing WHISTLEBLOWERS who have grown a conscience and want to make amends.

its fundamentally hard to prove unless you can have an expert inspect the equipment immediately as the incident occurs, not the next day, on an agreed appointment with the inspectors at any time they wish.

Or

Yo campaign to change the industry where all online tables must have a black box that tracks the tables and results monitors irregularities, technologies, magnetic waves and so on that gets download by authorities weekly and monthly using sophisticated software that quickly analysis irregularities in play that is then correlated against video footage.


Maybe its time to go after the regulators, not the casinos ??

 

[Casinoheist1978]

Hi Michael,

Welcome to Casinomeister and I am sure you will get some decent feedback here as there are loads of experienced players, casino reps and people that work within the industry here.
And as Neil already highlighted in his previous reply, we have a huge thread going about Evolution Live Roulette.
Very interesting thread with a lot of opinions from members here.

Cheers,

Mark. (A 40+ dude also)

 

[Casinoheist1978]

Hi Mark - I will take a look now and possibly repost my last note on there to get some chatter going on the subject,

 

[Jono777]

But surely that's the point Neilw, if something like this exists, you would start your plan to build this by having these main criteria 1) accuracy and control 2) make it work as natural as possible 3) make sure it is stealthy, mobile, easil deployed and used remotely 4 ) Don't get caught - So when you have the inspectors coming, usually on an agreed date (thers plenty of time to turn on the stealth mode or remove all signs and still make a good days profit) *i)

The technology is not a stretch at all to what is capable - catching them in the act is tough, even though you see it in videos you need hard evidence as you say, or accurate reliable datasets or the next best thing WHISTLEBLOWERS who have grown a conscience *ii) and want to make amends.

i) Why rig if they can still HONESTLY make, as you say a good days profit?

ii) Not ONE in all these years?

Talking about honest and accredited casinos and bookmakers here, what goes on at the counterfeit and 'clip' joints is none of my business nor concern and never will be.

 

[neilw]

Very eloquently put. I can't disagree with you. Your logic is sound. BUT.

The only thing players can do if they believe games are cheating them is to stop playing. That's the sensible thing to do. But they don't.

I don't understand why you'd build a company or product that is based on cheating. It make absolutely no sense, for stock listed companies to behave in that manner. Casinos already have a built in edge so why other than short term greed would someone do that? I think the answer is they would not. Their businesses would be destroyed overnight.

I advocate whistleblowers, there are plenty in the industry that would know if that sort of thing goes on. People move around between companies all the time. If it's as you say then someone would step up, but no-one has.

I'd like to think that you're going to get a rational debate going, but from what I've seen so far that's not going to happen.

I try to refrain from commenting on threads like these as they serve no real purpose other than create an environment where people are arguing about speculation and feelings.

This achieves nothing but provides entertainment to the popcorn eaters which I'm desperately trying to become lol.

 

[Casinoheist1978]

Valid argument but why make a good days profit when you can take as much as you want and build an empire on the stock market ?

I can in a normal casino watch a dealer throw a ball over the 1 hour or two hours, and roughly read the hot spots, against there varied throw cycles...then I can play neighbors, odd, middle dozens and hit some big winnings. Now I do this on the right table and the right dealer I'm usually always walking away with some good profit (at B&M Casinos)

Online it's different, players can sit and observe for hours, very sober, in a quiet environment, make careful notes, even record and playback the dealer throwing the ball. If they catch it right they can bet once, bet big bet and then away very happy. if this happens enough it would be tragic for the business and in a very short space of time, the company will suffer huge losses.
They will need to ensure the dealers are the best throwers of the ball around and are constantly analyzing the bets on the table....

The problem I have is when I place big bets online placed usually on tables that allow this to happen after the dealer has already thrown the ball, there is nothing more they can do...these tables mistify me and draw me to the conclusion there is more than meets the eye because it will always avoid the huge bets on the table even if I covered all but one-

One company that promotes Speed Roulette allows you to bet after the ball has been thrown. I have bet 25 chips on half the table after observing the throwers technique for 30 minutes before betting, but I could not win once after four big -bets all very large. I changed my bet size and bet with 1 pound chips, guess what, I won every time with the exact same technique.

If your the lowest unique bet you will land the win, but whats against you is you can't see other players bets and so you might be placed where the other big bets are.

So In short if left just to physics and probability people will play the maths and physics and some of us who have lots of surplus money can ruin a casino in a good weekend.

So the question is why would all these businesses have so much faith in trusting there banks accounts to companies such as the Evilolution and so on and so forth. You must trust that these high roller wins are not going to happen too often.... Despite what they might want you to believe when they broadcast the phony winners on the side of the screen I'm sure high rollers tend to do what I do and make big bets in B&M casinos. On one site one evening I counted 3 guys who one close to 7 million not including the other smaller wins...maybe they're the lucky few or possibly have some inside info, to wash money --- Just kidding, unless its true of course we need to prove it

So, in short, why wouldn't you if you have the technology, the skill, and freedom to know that you untouchable- there is lots of money in the world these days high rollers can easily break a casino- there have to be some safeguards...maybe these started as safeguards and now its just printing money....

One thing I have learned in business is money makes people greedy and change and I know developers and hackers all too well, if there is way they will invent it just because they can and if you add money to the equation....this exists and I will bet right here and right now it will all soon come to light, it just needs little push from some deep-pocketed 40-year-olds

 

[goatwack]

Count me out on the last part

 

[Mouche12]

Welcome to the forum Michael!

I don't know about live roulette, but all other games are subjected to test lab reviews and certified, so that would prove their payout is fair and random, no?

To me it's important to watch out for rogue casinos with pirated games, predatory bonus terms, super-slow withdrawals, lengthy KYC procedures, etc.

 

[Casinoheist1978]

Thanks Mouch,

But what are the test conditions and what do they test for, how do they test and are they disclosed and fit for purpose. Are there ongoing checks and are these regulatory bodies suspectable to manipulation of bribery...even the banks I have spent a decades working for have been caught out many times dipping their hands into the cooky Jar, bascile sent the world into a credit crunch through sheer greed and manipulation are these casino owners more morally superior?

 

[goatwack]

It's naive or just plain ignorant to assume every member of every casino is squeaky-clean and above board, it's simply human repetition to see a few suspect industry types do nefarious deeds, even I'm sure in heavily-regulated, fully-licensed establishments.

By and large though one would think these cases are extremely rare and probably dealt with in-house, one can hope

Conversely, never had as much spam emails as when joining numerous casinos, being told personal details aren't sold en-masse despite heavy evidence to the contrary. Been getting ones from 'Tom Selleck' even recently for lord's sake!

 

[dionysus]

I'm not stressed about the validity of slots but im with you goaty on the spam/email
A new casino sign up always seems to lead directly into an influx of new spam mails

 

[neilw]

Just for information really. There is a huge difference between the way a B&M Casino & an Live Casino like Evolution controls and monitors their game. This may go some way to explain the difference in tolerances you experience between playing the two.

The live casinos can and do monitor every aspect of the game in real time. They can tell if the dealer is spinning predictably, the can tell as soon as the wheel goes out of balance, they can detect changes in spin speed by the dealer. Because they can detect it they can react to it, to make sure that the game remains random so it can't be exploited either way. B&M casinos can't do that yet, they are not using the technology. You could of course argue that they use the information to influence the outcome of the game - and that's where we are, we just don't know.

I like to believe it's not, but will change my view when I'm proved wrong. I bet small and still lose in the long run. My view is I'm playing random games that have an edge for the house, so I will sometimes win but overall i wont. That's gambling.

I'll watch the thread unfold. Good luck.

 

[TheAddict]

that guy near the end of the vid must suffer from some pretty painful pebble stool on that diet

 

[TheAddict]

It's naive or just plain ignorant to assume every member of every casino is squeaky-clean and above board, it's simply human repetition to see a few suspect industry types do nefarious deeds, even I'm sure in heavily-regulated, fully-licensed establishments.

By and large though one would think these cases are extremely rare and probably dealt with in-house, one can hope

Conversely, never had as much spam emails as when joining numerous casinos, being told personal details aren't sold en-masse despite heavy evidence to the contrary. Been getting ones from 'Tom Selleck' even recently for lord's sake!

Hes a persistent bugger that tom aint he. Also Sent me one today. 25 on the house at superior casino apparantly. Such a great bloke.

 

[goatwack]

Hes a persistent bugger that tom aint he. Also Sent me one today. 25 on the house at superior casino apparantly. Such a great bloke.

 

[TheAddict]

Lmfao