Baptism by Fire - success Guts.com is giving it a go

[vinylweatherman]

Hi,

Sorry, won't add the quote here will just address the questions/concerns.

Games have been listed by me, right or wrong in your view and our bonus terms and conditions reflect the game categories as a whole rather than listing specific games in the terms which can be confusing for players. I believe that the terms and conditions are clear and have had them checked by other members whom all believe the same. We also removed wagering on free spin winnings as we thought that was not fair to the player.

The bonus terms and conditions can be accessed from a link in the footer and from a link on the promotions page for each specific promotion. The bonus terms are the exact same all through the site and we wanted to have links to the bonus terms in as many places as possible to be 100% transparent as one of the things that came up in the forum a lot were people confused by non clear bonus terms or bonus terms that are hard to find.

We removed all deposit fees at Guts, we have a flat withdrawal fee. If we were to remove the fee then we would need to raise the withdrawal minimum. Even if we process in batches we still have the same cost and even with the fee we do not cover our costs and bear all of the costs from deposit which is the way I think it should be. Perhaps down the track we will change this policy but this is what it is for now.

Regarding the UKGC we will look into this when the "time comes" just as we will with every new licencing authority.

The discussion about why "Scrooge" weights different at Guts than other places I am not even going to enter into, perhaps you should revert to your statement: This would be a far better innovation in the industry if they did LESS of "what everybody else does".

Ben

They are clear, but WHY?

It seems a few casinos have ring fenced some of their slots so that they have higher WR, but getting them to say WHY is like getting blood out of a stone. So, what's the big deal, the underlying commonality, that isn't obvious to the player when they open, say, a slot game weighted at 100%, and then another one that seems the same type of game, yet weights at only 75%.

A slot is a slot, they are all the real "cash cows" of any casino, and cater to the players who just want a simple bet and result game, rather than have to learn things like "best strategy" as is often the case with table games.

Their clearly IS a reason, and it is big enough so that "keep it simple" just will not do.

In this respect, Guts ARE "doing what everybody else does" in making something simple into something more complicated.

What is so wrong about having a very simple:-

35x WR
All slots count 100%
All other games count 0%

All the slots player then has to do is multiply their bonus by 35, and they have the total amount they need to wager.

If things were kept simple players would not need legal advice, whether that is from a lawyer, or some untrained wannabe paralegal in an internet forum.

My worry about the new UK regime is that whilst operators might feel they can wait until the time comes, it seems their software providers can't, and in the case of the new Spanish regime the operators who thought they could get their Spanish license sorted out "in their own time" discovered retrospectively that Microgaming had pulled the plug overnight on all their Spanish players, leaving them to deal with Spanish players who had suddenly lost access to their accounts and their money, coupled with front line CS who didn't have a clue what had happened for a couple of days.

What we REALLY need to know is what the PROVIDERS of the games are going to do in the run up to the new UK regime, and how much time THEY will grant their licensees to get the relevant license before the plug is pulled as it was in Spain.

For UK players at the moment, this creates uncertainty, and may act as a deterrent to opening new casino accounts until the secondary licensing is in place.

 

[Balthazar]

cad for cad...no loss

Cool! I didn't know. Thought it would take longer than that to fix this.

 

[Nifty29]

They are clear, but WHY?

It seems a few casinos have ring fenced some of their slots so that they have higher WRreasonableing them to say WHY is like getting blood out of a stone. So, what's the big deal, the underlying commonality, that isn't obvious to the player when they open, say, a slot game weighted at 100%, and then another one that seems the same type of game, yet weights at only 75%.

A slot is a slot, they are all the real "cash cows" of any casino, and cater to the players who just want a simple bet and result game, rather than have to learn things like "best strategy" as is often the case with table games.

Their clearly IS a reason, and it is big enough so that "keep it simple" just will not do.

In this respect, Guts ARE "doing what everybody else does" in making something simple into something more complicated.

What is so wrong about having a very simple:-

35x WR
All slots count 100%
All other games count 0%

All the slots player then has to do is multiply their bonus by 35, and they have the total amount they need to wager.

If things were kept simple players would not need legal advice, whether that is from a lawyer, or some untrained wannabe paralegal in an internet forum.

My worry about the new UK regime is that whilst operators might feel they can wait until the time comes, it seems their software providers can't, and in the case of the new Spanish regime the operators who thought they could get their Spanish license sorted out "in their own time" discovered retrospectively that Microgaming had pulled the plug overnight on all their Spanish players, leaving them to deal with Spanish players who had suddenly lost access to their accounts and their money, coupled with front line CS who didn't have a clue what had happened for a couple of days.

What we REALLY need to know is what the PROVIDERS of the games are going to do in the run up to the new UK regime, and how much time THEY will grant their licensees to get the relevant license before the plug is pulled as it was in Spain.

For UK players at the moment, this creates uncertainty, and may act as a deterrent to opening new casino accounts until the secondary licensing is in place.

Why do you keep harping on about this stuff?

The terms are clear. If you don't like the terms, then don't play. Having slightly different terms than another casino is a commercial choice.

You're making this into a huge issue when pretty much nobody here in this thread is really bothered about it.

Instead of giving kudos for what they DO have that is really innovative (like no WR on free spins) or player friendly (like cashable bonuses with reasonable low WR), you're just nit picking about stuff that really comes down to personal preference.

Also, WTH has Spanish gaming laws etc got to do with anything? Honestly, some times I think you just make stuff up to say that's totally irrelevant just to make your posts longer.

"Wannabe paralegals on internet forums" do not provide legal advice at all....they provide an ill-informed personal opinion which is almost certainly not the actual legal position. People like this actually provide a DISservice IMO.

 

[dionysus]

a comp point system would still be nice though

 

[Nifty29]

a comp point system would still be nice though

AFAIK its not far away.

Its not unusual these days for casinos not to have comp points in the beginning.

IMO, no WR on free spins winnings and low WR cashable bonuses are far better than comps. At the end of the day, unless you play large volumes, comps aren't worth very much at all, which is why I'd rather have other stuff. Still, its a personal preference thing I guess.

 

[dionysus]

if i have free spins sure...but not taking bonuses and doing straight up deps, the low WR bonus doesnt do me much good..least the comp points give me something to redeem if i bust out frequently

 

[same_old]

G'day Ben,
May I ask a question please.
Can you possibly ask accounts if they would take on POLI as a deposit option for the Aussies?
I usually use that method for depositing if its there and I know a lot of other Aussies do aswell.

Thanking you in advance,

Same_old

 

[Wild Reels]

Its free spin wednesday (ive actually rememered this week) spotted a slight typo on the website

1000'S OF FREE SPINS GIVEN AWAY EVERY WEDNESDAY

The last next draw is June 13th and the featured game is Fruit Shop

I make it the 12th here at least

anyway hopefully fruit shop will be nice in a few hours

 

[CasinoBen]

Its free spin wednesday (ive actually rememered this week) spotted a slight typo on the website



I make it the 12th here at least

anyway hopefully fruit shop will be nice in a few hours

LOL, I just noticed that. But yes, Free Spins in an hour or so.

Thanks, for pointing the typo out.

Ben

 

[CasinoBen]

G'day Ben,
May I ask a question please.
Can you possibly ask accounts if they would take on POLI as a deposit option for the Aussies?
I usually use that method for depositing if its there and I know a lot of other Aussies do aswell.

Thanking you in advance,

Same_old

Hey Mate,

Yes, have asked them and it should be up by the end of day today .

Let me know if you have any issues with it and thank you very much for letting me know about this payment option.

Cheers,
Ben

 

[vinylweatherman]

Why do you keep harping on about this stuff?

The terms are clear. If you don't like the terms, then don't play. Having slightly different terms than another casino is a commercial choice.

You're making this into a huge issue when pretty much nobody here in this thread is really bothered about it.

Instead of giving kudos for what they DO have that is really innovative (like no WR on free spins) or player friendly (like cashable bonuses with reasonable low WR), you're just nit picking about stuff that really comes down to personal preference.

Also, WTH has Spanish gaming laws etc got to do with anything? Honestly, some times I think you just make stuff up to say that's totally irrelevant just to make your posts longer.

"Wannabe paralegals on internet forums" do not provide legal advice at all....they provide an ill-informed personal opinion which is almost certainly not the actual legal position. People like this actually provide a DISservice IMO.

Are you not curious?

Questioning the "why" is well worth doing, it keeps the industry on it's toes.

Just look at what has come out of the woodwork recently through asking "why", rather than taking things for granted.

In this case, the "why" could be very important for players who do NOT take bonuses, since pretty much everything online has been tuned to the industry wide bonus culture.

We already know that RTG casinos who offer huge bonuses "tune" the slots to 91.5% to compensate. This is VERY useful information to those few players who don't want to touch bonuses, who can then look for an RTG casino that offers much lower bonuses, where there is a good chance that this is coupled with slots set to the standard 95% setting, or even the higher one.

With Microgaming, we know that the games' RTP cannot be altered by operators, at least not the traditional Viper and Flash one provider ones, but these differential slot weightings seem only to be cropping up on the multi provider platforms, including the splitting of "set in stone" MGS games into different weighting categories. The "why" here would answer questions like "is there a difference between the MGS games on multi platform providers and the Viper and Flash MGS offerings". In the case of some other games, as revealed by recent events, the answer is YES, there IS a difference, and even worse, the regulator doesn't give a damn, so clearly are not protecting the player.

Operators (and regulators) don't think they are doing anything wrong, but recent events have shown that in the view of players, they are actually doing something SERIOUSLY wrong.

You may think that Microgaming are squeaky clean, but they are not. Some while ago it was discovered that the oldest video slots such as 5 reel drive did NOT follow the rules, and were in fact weighted slots where the probabilities of outcomes did NOT match the reelstrips. Before that, we all thought MGS slots followed the Vegas and Aussie models for random and unweighted reel stops. In the case of 5 reel drive, this information was important for players who played fewer lines, as this could bring the RTP right down to 88% due to the weighting. The conclusion was that to get a fair game, max lines had to be played on these older video slots.

These questions are likely to get answered once the new UK regime comes into force, as it will involve their games having to be properly categorised according to the underlying logic being used. Any game where the odds of outcomes are not "natural" will have to be marked as such, and the RTP will have to be made available to players who want to know.

In a few cases, this could come as a shock to players who thought they understood how the games worked. It is also likely to come as a shock to me, as it would prove which of my theories are right, and which are wrong. I can then place the necessary orders for tin foil hats if appropriate.

 

[Tirilej]

@ VWM
I love it when you are fighting evil operators or those that don't listen to us.
But for you to start a fight questioning everything, and some more, in the way you do now here doesn't feel right at least to me.
We are creating the casino we want here by giving feedback, but as with everything else we can make it the nice way

 

[CasinoBen]

Are you not curious?

Questioning the "why" is well worth doing, it keeps the industry on it's toes.

Just look at what has come out of the woodwork recently through asking "why", rather than taking things for granted.

In this case, the "why" could be very important for players who do NOT take bonuses, since pretty much everything online has been tuned to the industry wide bonus culture.

We already know that RTG casinos who offer huge bonuses "tune" the slots to 91.5% to compensate. This is VERY useful information to those few players who don't want to touch bonuses, who can then look for an RTG casino that offers much lower bonuses, where there is a good chance that this is coupled with slots set to the standard 95% setting, or even the higher one.

With Microgaming, we know that the games' RTP cannot be altered by operators, at least not the traditional Viper and Flash one provider ones, but these differential slot weightings seem only to be cropping up on the multi provider platforms, including the splitting of "set in stone" MGS games into different weighting categories. The "why" here would answer questions like "is there a difference between the MGS games on multi platform providers and the Viper and Flash MGS offerings". In the case of some other games, as revealed by recent events, the answer is YES, there IS a difference, and even worse, the regulator doesn't give a damn, so clearly are not protecting the player.

Operators (and regulators) don't think they are doing anything wrong, but recent events have shown that in the view of players, they are actually doing something SERIOUSLY wrong.

You may think that Microgaming are squeaky clean, but they are not. Some while ago it was discovered that the oldest video slots such as 5 reel drive did NOT follow the rules, and were in fact weighted slots where the probabilities of outcomes did NOT match the reelstrips. Before that, we all thought MGS slots followed the Vegas and Aussie models for random and unweighted reel stops. In the case of 5 reel drive, this information was important for players who played fewer lines, as this could bring the RTP right down to 88% due to the weighting. The conclusion was that to get a fair game, max lines had to be played on these older video slots.

These questions are likely to get answered once the new UK regime comes into force, as it will involve their games having to be properly categorised according to the underlying logic being used. Any game where the odds of outcomes are not "natural" will have to be marked as such, and the RTP will have to be made available to players who want to know.

In a few cases, this could come as a shock to players who thought they understood how the games worked. It is also likely to come as a shock to me, as it would prove which of my theories are right, and which are wrong. I can then place the necessary orders for tin foil hats if appropriate.

Setting the payout at 91.5% does not fully compensate for the huge 800% bonuses that the RTG casinos offer, just do the math. The RTG's that offer these unrealistic bonuses compensate by putting in unrealistic wagering requirements and a cap on the winnings.

There is no difference between the Viper content and what we get via Quickfire, and there is no way that we can change the RTP on any of the games from any of the suppliers that we have. The only provider that I have ever seem the ability to do this on is RTG, and we all know that.

Regarding weighting of the games across different operators, this is up to the operator and it is up to the player if they want to take a bonus and play on a site with that specific weighting. It seems that you hinting that this should be regulated so it is the same everywhere, and I think it would be a very sad day if that happens.

I hope that your not disappointed when the UKGC comes into force. Also I would be happier if they invested more time into the security of the player funds rather than if the game is in the right category, I hope you asking for the right things.

Ben

 

[Wild Reels]

25 free spins on fruit shop got me £28 , swapped to gonzos and withdrew £75, im sure it will go back in, but i was adamant on making a withdrawal even if it costs money

 

[Tirilej]

25 free spins on fruit shop got me £28 , swapped to gonzos and withdrew £75, im sure it will go back in, but i was adamant on making a withdrawal even if it costs money

Sorry for being a little lazy reading for myself, but who gets those free spins and what do you need to do to get them?

 

[Blathaon]

Sorry for being a little lazy reading for myself, but who gets those free spins and what do you need to do to get them?

From the promotions page www.guts.com/en/page/promotions
To take part just follow these simple steps:

Step 1: Make a real money deposit into your Guts.com account within 30 days of the latest draw.

Step 2: Log into your account after the draw has taken place on Wednesday at 11am CET.

Step 3: Open the featured game for that week and you will be able to see how many Free Spins you have won; it might be 5, 10, 25 or even 50 Free Spins.

 

[Tirilej]

From the promotions page www.guts.com/en/page/promotions
To take part just follow these simple steps:

Step 1: Make a real money deposit into your Guts.com account within 30 days of the latest draw.

Step 2: Log into your account after the draw has taken place on Wednesday at 11am CET.

Step 3: Open the featured game for that week and you will be able to see how many Free Spins you have won; it might be 5, 10, 25 or even 50 Free Spins.

Thanks I found 10 spins on the game too. Gave me 30cents
It's not so much me being lazy but since I don't use any bonuses I rarily expect anything but bonusoffers.
So far I don't think I have been getting any of those either after the first offers.

 

[De Beuker]

Thanks I found 10 spins on the game too. Gave me 30cents
It's not so much me being lazy but since I don't use any bonuses I rarily expect anything but bonusoffers.
So far I don't think I have been getting any of those either after the first offers.

30 cents is one spin on 0.27 on DOA.
Should be enough for you to trigger free spins and hit 5 wilds on a payline.

 

[Tirilej]

30 cents is one spin on 0.27 on DOA.
Should be enough for you to trigger free spins and hit 5 wilds on a payline.

You crazy boy
It could have been but not this time. Still got 5c left though

 

[PCJACKPOT2008]

Can it be on any NetEnt-slot? I didn't have any on Fruit Shop and have made a deposit in the last 30 days.

 

[dionysus]

tx for the heads up, got the spins...a buck, 15

 

[Wild Reels]

the mrs had to contact support as she had no free spins in the game either, and support credited the account with the equivalent cash instead

which was subsequently lost

 

[Balthazar]

cad for cad...no loss

Well....

 

[dionysus]

Weird. I used Skrill, and there was no flipping from CAD to GBP and back...remained CAD. As for CC, I dunno - didn't use one

 

[Sovietsky]

At first glance I thought they took 10,52€ fee for a withdraw.