Corona virus - Covid 19 discussion

[colinsunderland]

haha I was expecting you to say that, find the only thing you can attack about it and ignore the actual point that the test is flawed, so the test is perfectly fine and not flawed because it's from 2020 gotcha, there is a post I made a few posts ago where in court at the beginning of April when a judge ruled masks out in Germany 2 experts in the medical field said the same thing about the test cannot say if it is remnants of an old infection or a new infection, the inventor of the PCR test Karry Mullis said many years ago it cannot and should not be used for virus diagnostic purposes, but despite the fact he is the inventor of the PCR test itself because he said this many years ago then I guess his opinion doesn't count because it was years ago when he said, toddle off to Snopes, I am sure they will say just because he invented PCR it doesn't mean he knows what he is talking about.

I'm not attacking anything in the report, the PCR test is unreliable, it's not a secret. I'm asking why he is presenting it today as if it's new information, when it's 9 months old?

 

[electronictonic]

I'm not attacking anything in the report, the PCR test is unreliable, it's not a secret. I'm asking why he is presenting it today as if it's new information, when it's 9 months old?

He posted the reason why "Updated on 19th April in light of new variants ... same conclusion = the test is useless to detect infection."
it says this further down that that they had a meeting on April 19 I thought it was self evident in light of the recent meeting they had.

 

[colinsunderland]

He posted the reason why "Updated on 19th April in light of new variants ... same conclusion = the test is useless to detect infection."
it says this further down that that they had a meeting on April 19 I thought it was self evident in light of the recent meeting they had.

It wasn't anything of the sort, it said 'The assessment was that no update was needed'
So exactly the same as it was 9 months ago, not new news, no new information. If it was that important why didn't you post it back in July?
I think everyone knows the tests aren't 100% accurate. My friend who had it back in around August was told that if she had another test within the next 6 months it would most likely return positive as it picks up previous infections within at least that time frame, so it isn't exactly a secret.

 

[mack341]

 

[mack341]

However would we cope without the Tony Blair institute for global change, we were so lucky to have had him as prime minister for all those years, and now he's still willing to provide free advice...

Lifting of last lockdown restrictions on 21 June should be in doubt, Tony Blair Institute suggests​

Plans to scrap all limits on social contact in June should be delayed for a month until the summer school holidays, when transmission rates are expected to be lower, the TBI warns.

The delay is necessary unless ministers can return the pace of the vaccination programme to where it was in mid-March, the report says.

The TBI’s proposed package of measures also includes offering Covid-19 vaccines to teenagers, subject to regulatory approval, and achieving a 65:35 split in use between the AstraZeneca and Pfizer/Moderna jabs.

Ian Mulheirn, UK policy director at the TBI, said: “Despite the success of the vaccine rollout we’re not out of the woods yet. But the government has the power to stop a deadly third wave of the virus by expanding the vaccination programme to adolescents and bringing the final step of the easing roadmap into line with the vaccine rollout timetable.

The stance was backed by Martin Mckee, professor of European public health at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine, who said: “The authors of the report make a compelling case for caution, based on a thorough analysis of the data. The experience of Chile should serve as a warning of the risk of relaxing restrictions too soon. The vaccination programme is very important but it is only one part of a comprehensive response to this virus.”

 

[colinsunderland]

Blair's an absolute muppet, how many vaccinations were getting done in March? We've done 3.6 million in the past week ffs

34,094,048 (134,140) people have received 1st dose of vaccination in the UK. +836,397
14,043,961 (462,885) people have received 2nd dose of vaccination in the UK. +2,851,360

The figures are dropping daily too

2,445 cases in the UK. -284
22 deaths in the UK. +4
134 patients admitted to hospital in the UK. -6
1,553 patients in hospital in the UK. -362
208 patients on ventilation in the UK. -68

We were at 1300 deaths a couple of months back, and he wants to delay it month!

 

[geordiecolin]

However would we cope without the Tony Blair institute for global change, we were so lucky to have had him as prime minister for all those years, and now he's still willing to provide free advice...

Lifting of last lockdown restrictions on 21 June should be in doubt, Tony Blair Institute suggests​

Plans to scrap all limits on social contact in June should be delayed for a month until the summer school holidays, when transmission rates are expected to be lower, the TBI warns.

The delay is necessary unless ministers can return the pace of the vaccination programme to where it was in mid-March, the report says.

The TBI’s proposed package of measures also includes offering Covid-19 vaccines to teenagers, subject to regulatory approval, and achieving a 65:35 split in use between the AstraZeneca and Pfizer/Moderna jabs.

Ian Mulheirn, UK policy director at the TBI, said: “Despite the success of the vaccine rollout we’re not out of the woods yet. But the government has the power to stop a deadly third wave of the virus by expanding the vaccination programme to adolescents and bringing the final step of the easing roadmap into line with the vaccine rollout timetable.

The stance was backed by Martin Mckee, professor of European public health at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine, who said: “The authors of the report make a compelling case for caution, based on a thorough analysis of the data. The experience of Chile should serve as a warning of the risk of relaxing restrictions too soon. The vaccination programme is very important but it is only one part of a comprehensive response to this virus.”

Ignore Tony Blair at your peril.

 

[shadow123]

no just ignore Tony Blair

 

[mack341]

Need a better breakdown of the ages and any pre-existing health issues, but 41 dead is pretty bad for a 'super safe' vaccine where people stated categorically no shortcuts had been taken, I wonder how many people have died from an equivalent number of flu jabs which is given to a lot of elderly people.

Still statistically these are rare events, however that's 41 people who have got through the lockdown, with all that that entailed, and then looking forward to getting the vax to protect themselves [and others around them] but then dying shortly afterwards due to a serious reaction.

 

[colinsunderland]

Have they actually proven the vaccine is causing these clots, or is it just some people got clots after having the vaccine?

 

[mack341]

Have they actually proven the vaccine is causing these clots, or is it just some people got clots after having the vaccine?

At this stage not enough is known why the clots are occurring to be 'proven' beyond all doubt, but statistically they are now happening more than the numbers typically recorded [average incidences per million], and most of the vaccinated so far in the uk are in the 60+ group whereas the dangerous clots that have occurred seem to affect the younger age groups [and more females].


telegraph:

A review by EMA safety committee concluded on Apr 7 that "unusual blood clots with low blood platelets should be listed as very rare side effects" of the AstraZeneca vaccine.

The MHRA said there were still huge benefits of the vaccine in preventing Covid-19 and serious disease but added that due to a very small number of blood clots in younger people, those under the age of 30 will be offered Pfizer or Moderna jabs instead.

David Werring, professor of clinical neurology at the UCL Institute of Neurology, said: "The EMA and MHRA statements are helpful in providing further clarity about the very rare blood clots with low blood platelet counts - mainly in the brain (cerebral venous sinus thrombosis) but also in other parts of the body - that have occurred after the AstraZeneca vaccine.

"We still urgently need more research to first understand which individuals are at highest risk of these unusual blood clots in the brain, which although very rare, can often be serious or fatal."

 

[colinsunderland]

Thanks, I knew they did seem to be affecting younger people, which would suggest the vaccine was at least in some part responsible, but didn't know if they had proven it yet,

 

[paul7388]

Yeah seems to be actually quite a few cases of blood clots now.

Although numbers in grand scheme of things are very low still too many cases of serious side effects in young healthy people who would probably be unscathed by actual virus itself.

More worrying for me would be will there be even more cases long term as remember this is a rushed vaccine that noone can actually say that it is 100% safe long term.

Was meant to be safe and fully tested in first place. Now after using it there is enough concern to stop using it on certain groups. So how will anyone know in years to come if it will cause clots etc. In people that have had the vaccine but had no ill effects at the time.

 

[mack341]

I think most of the unvaccinated groups of the original trials have also now been vaccinated, so that could make it harder to detect an unusual occurrence/pattern of long term effects, as there is no control group with which to directly compare in the trial.

Detecting serious reactions statistically, [looking for anomalies compared to the population ] like they did with the clots initially which made them realise we may have a problem, could be impossible if everyone is vaccinated. They would have to go on historical occurrence before mass covid vaccination took place.

 

[mack341]

bill and melinda are getting divorced, not sure if it relates to covid and bill's 'work' in any way but didn't see this coming, going from their interviews etc..

 

[geordiecolin]

I think most of the unvaccinated groups of the original trials have also now been vaccinated, so that could make it harder to detect an unusual occurrence/pattern of long term effects, as there is no control group with which to directly compare in the trial.

Detecting serious reactions statistically, [looking for anomalies compared to the population ] like they did with the clots initially which made them realise we may have a problem, could be impossible if everyone is vaccinated. They would have to go on historical occurrence before mass covid vaccination took place.

If anyone thinks that this is over then consider the fact that the UK and Oz governments have just issued a contract to one Ad company alone. The UK have just paid £130 million to them which was more than last year. The Oz also. April to April. It covers the entire financial year. And that is not for TV adverts.
The next year?
It is just dangling carrots in front of people now. It is not going away.

 

[mack341]

If anyone thinks that this is over then consider the fact that the UK and Oz governments have just issued a contract to one Ad company alone. The UK have just payed £130 million to them which was more than last year. The Oz also. April to April. It covers the entire financial year.
The next year?
It is just dangling carrots in front of people now. It is not going away.

putting aside the morality of spending that money to brainwash people, they could get the bbc, dailymail, google, twitter etc.. to do it for free!

 

[geordiecolin]

putting aside the morality of spending that money to brainwash people, they could get the bbc, dailymail, google, twitter etc.. to do it for free!

Who owns and or funds most media?

Who pays for the fact checking sites? They do not advertise in order to fund their sites. Who works for free?

 

[mack341]

Who owns and or funds most media?

Who pays for the fact checking sites? They do not advertise in order to fund their sites. Who works for free?

There used to be many more individual and independent firms, now it's all huge conglomerates.

I think I read most news and opinion shows in the US are paid for by big pharma's adverts, I find it a bit cringe in the uk with the number of male impotence adverts popping up, even around dinner time now

 

[colinsunderland]

If anyone thinks that this is over then consider the fact that the UK and Oz governments have just issued a contract to one Ad company alone. The UK have just paid £130 million to them which was more than last year. The Oz also. April to April. It covers the entire financial year. And that is not for TV adverts.
The next year?
It is just dangling carrots in front of people now. It is not going away.

I'm guessing this is the latest thing to be all over social media considering how many times I've seen it today?
I know someone who works for a company supplying PPE and they have just been awarded a 2 year extension.
I'm not sure why people are making a big deal of it. The contract is for advertising April - April. The virus didn't die out on the 31st March, so why wouldn't they extend the contract?
Who are the people who think it's over? Stupid people? There are still thousands of cases every day, people in hospital and people dying. The 'experts' have constantly warned theres likely to be a surge next winter. I don't personally know a single person who thinks its over. Plenty, including myself, think it's getting better, and even if there is a surge next winter, it won't be as bad as this year, but certainly wouldn't say it's over, unfortunately.

 

[colinsunderland]

Who owns and or funds most media?

Who pays for the fact checking sites? They do not advertise in order to fund their sites. Who works for free?

Not being funny mate, but the main ones have a dedicated page to it with details of all the funding.

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Not really hard to find?

 

[geordiecolin]

Not being funny mate, but the main ones have a dedicated page to it with details of all the funding.

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Not really hard to find?

I had never heard of either of those fact checking sites but just an initial read of both of their funding brings up what and who?

Edit. And an initial dig brings up funding by Bill Gates.
Yep. Not really hard to find

 

[geordiecolin]

I'm guessing this is the latest thing to be all over social media considering how many times I've seen it today?
I know someone who works for a company supplying PPE and they have just been awarded a 2 year extension.
I'm not sure why people are making a big deal of it. The contract is for advertising April - April. The virus didn't die out on the 31st March, so why wouldn't they extend the contract?
Who are the people who think it's over? Stupid people? There are still thousands of cases every day, people in hospital and people dying. The 'experts' have constantly warned theres likely to be a surge next winter. I don't personally know a single person who thinks its over. Plenty, including myself, think it's getting better, and even if there is a surge next winter, it won't be as bad as this year, but certainly wouldn't say it's over, unfortunately.

I presume you are comfortable about how this drama is playing out?
From just a few weeks to flatten the curve and help out the NHS to wait until the vaccine is available. I wish I had your optimism.

 

[colinsunderland]

Not being funny mate, but the main ones have a dedicated page to it with details of all the funding.

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Not really hard to find?

Both have been posted in this thread numerous times and they seem to be used by some media outlets, and see them on twitter, other forums, which ones were you talking about?

I presume you are comfortable about how this drama is playing out?
From just a few weeks to flatten the curve and help out the NHS to wait until the vaccine is available. I wish I had your optimism.

I think it's a deadly virus that no one has had to deal with before, and things happens that make initial predictions turn out wrong.
So far the roadmap BJ set out at the start of the year has been followed, and the final part In June seems to be getting better as we get closer, it was announced over the weekend they will also remove social distancing then too. I don't understand what you think is going to happen instead?

 

[geordiecolin]

Something that I have found very interesting lately is about how things may progress/regress in the future. It is worth while at least taking in the three interviewees explanation of what they are working on. They give away much more than they intend too during what they claim to be an advert for new recruits.
At about 31 minutes in they totally dismiss PCR testing when talking about amplification as a thing while knowing that they should shut up about the subject