Resolved A Rival Casino, very strange decision to confiscate winnings.

ergopro

Experienced Member
PABnononaccred
Joined
Apr 29, 2004
Hi!
Before posting the whole story, I'd like you intake on one simple question.
A Rival casino decided to confiscate the winnings of one player of ours.
The reason for it was, that his language on the live chat was abusive after the player contacted them after waiting a few days for his winnings.
The winnings were 1000 euros.
Sounds kinda ridiculous- but I'd like to hear your opinions.
 

love2winalot

Dormant account
Joined
Feb 10, 2009
Location
Philippines/Visiting Las vegas
Hiya: Sorry to hear that. It all comes down to their Terms & Conditions. Usually this will say, "Under what circumstances" the casino can do this. Sometimes they will just say, "We can do it for any reason we feel like".

Unless there is something like that, then this is what they should have done.
Paid his winnings. Paid any leftover balance he may have had. Bann him after that, or at lest give him a stern warning not be abusing their employees.
 

ergopro

Experienced Member
PABnononaccred
Joined
Apr 29, 2004
Hiya: Sorry to hear that. It all comes down to their Terms & Conditions. Usually this will say, "Under what circumstances" the casino can do this. Sometimes they will just say, "We can do it for any reason we feel like".

Unless there is something like that, then this is what they should have done.
Paid his winnings. Paid any leftover balance he may have had. Bann him after that, or at lest give him a stern warning not be abusing their employees.

Thanks for a quick reply. Yes, I totally agree.
Casino is entitled to ban the player (and should). But confiscating winnings cause of the language used and things said like taking this further to a 3rd party, will make sure their banners are removed etc.
Winnings that were won earlier and already being processed were returned to his account and the account locked.
Casino manager has decided not to pay the player because of his behavior. Which was abusive. I do see their point but is bad behavior on live chat a reason to confiscate the winnings, that is the question :D
 

Tengil

Senior Member
Joined
May 4, 2006
Location
Finland
Its Alway Vegas amirite? seems to be a very roguish craphole.

Some of the most ridiculous reasons to confiscate winnings I have heard of. Plus they have nothing in their T&Cs (which BTW has a big contradiction) that would support their decision.

What you win at Always Vegas stays at Always Vegas.
 

ergopro

Experienced Member
PABnononaccred
Joined
Apr 29, 2004
Its Alway Vegas amirite? seems to be a very roguish craphole.

Some of the most ridiculous reasons to confiscate winnings I have heard of. Plus they have nothing in their T&Cs (which BTW has a big contradiction) that would support their decision.

What you win at Always Vegas stays at Always Vegas.

Yep. Always Vegas.
 

Nate

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
webmeister
CAG
Joined
Feb 14, 2007
Location
Cyberspace
Hi!
Before posting the whole story, I'd like you intake on one simple question.
A Rival casino decided to confiscate the winnings of one player of ours.
The reason for it was, that his language on the live chat was abusive after the player contacted them after waiting a few days for his winnings.
The winnings were 1000 euros.
Sounds kinda ridiculous- but I'd like to hear your opinions.

Plain and simple ROGUE behavior. A rude client, no matter what the circumstances should be banned AFTER his winnings are processed. They have no right to withold legitimate winnings.

If your post above is actually the case, it would seem that the scum involved will take ANY given opportunity to confiscate winnings for ANY reason they deem appropriate. Id stay as far away as possible and not even infect my computer with their ROGUE Name... Seriously... is this the desperation that some outfits go to in order to :xxx the customer? ...

Nate
 

ergopro

Experienced Member
PABnononaccred
Joined
Apr 29, 2004
If your post above is actually the case, it would seem that the scum involved will take ANY given opportunity to confiscate winnings for ANY reason they deem appropriate. Id stay as far away as possible and not even infect my computer with their ROGUE Name... Seriously... is this the desperation that some outfits go to in order to :xxx the customer? ...

Nate

To make the whole story short(ish).

A player of our forum deposited a few times, got lucky and won 1000 euros.
He then requested a withdrawal and sent in his documents.
His withdrawal was returned back to his account about a day later as the documents hadn't been approved yet.

He then submitted a new withdrawal and waited for the withdrawal to clear from pending status.

After a day or two, he went to live chat to inquire about his withdrawal and was given the regular 2-5 days etc. He expressed his opinions quite strongly and was quite impatient regarding his withdrawal. Made accusations of Always Vegas not being fair towards their customers as others got their withdrawals faster than others.

As the withdrawal still wasn't processed after a day or two later, he got frustrated and started bashing the casino's behavior and telling them that he'd contact 3rd parties so everyone would know what kinda place they are, and that he'd make sure their banners would be removed from sites etc.
He repeated this behavior and verbal abuse a few times over the live chat.
After another day, he went to check his account and it was locked.
He also received an email from casino saying that his withdrawal was reversed back to his account. And he couldn't access it anymore to submit a new withdrawal.
At this point we contacted their affiliate department / manager and enquired about the situation. Got a reply today that their manager had decided not to pay the player because of his abusive behavior / threats to damage their reputation.
I think Always Vegas did right by blocking the player from further play, but confiscating the winnings without a valid reason is absolutely ridiculous.
 

Nate

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
webmeister
CAG
Joined
Feb 14, 2007
Location
Cyberspace
To make the whole story short(ish).

A player of our forum deposited a few times, got lucky and won 1000 euros.
He then requested a withdrawal and sent in his documents.
His withdrawal was returned back to his account about a day later as the documents hadn't been approved yet.

He then submitted a new withdrawal and waited for the withdrawal to clear from pending status.

After a day or two, he went to live chat to inquire about his withdrawal and was given the regular 2-5 days etc. He expressed his opinions quite strongly and was quite impatient regarding his withdrawal. Made accusations of Always Vegas not being fair towards their customers as others got their withdrawals faster than others.

As the withdrawal still wasn't processed after a day or two later, he got frustrated and started bashing the casino's behavior and telling them that he'd contact 3rd parties so everyone would know what kinda place they are, and that he'd make sure their banners would be removed from sites etc.
He repeated this behavior and verbal abuse a few times over the live chat.
After another day, he went to check his account and it was locked.
He also received an email from casino saying that his withdrawal was reversed back to his account. And he couldn't access it anymore to submit a new withdrawal.
At this point we contacted their affiliate department / manager and enquired about the situation. Got a reply today that their manager had decided not to pay the player because of his abusive behavior / threats to damage their reputation.
I think Always Vegas did right by blocking the player from further play, but confiscating the winnings without a valid reason is absolutely ridiculous.

Indeed, my comment still stands on the matter... Pay the player THEN BAN HIM... Citing abuse to withhold a withdrawal is what cheats do:rolleyes:

It's actually sad that 90% of the online industry are wolves waiting to pounce at ANY given opporunity ... I blame the software providers for selling their software to insolvent crooks.
 

Deeplay

New World Order
webmeister
CAG
mm1
Joined
Aug 27, 2008
Location
The biG Eu
Our support team get abuse almost daily. If it goes beyond what we call reasonable then we do NOT withhold the product. We just blacklist the user from ever using any of our sevices in the future. To do so would be absolute folly as it could result in a charge back. To withold winnings becuase of some effin n blindin is bad no matter what terms the punter used. Hell these days you need the skin of rhino to get though some C/S chats n emails!
Even when we have had threats of " I will charge back " from irate customers we dont refund or block service / nothing. But all future attempted transactions are blocked where ever they can. Ok its different with a casino as they are talking hard cash - but actually makes the situ more dire as the money if it was won without breaking terms n cons should be paid no matter what.
 

tonzza

Dormant account
PABnononaccred
Joined
Feb 21, 2008
Location
vantaa
hellou, yep i am that player and that happened to me :( of course it was allso my fault, i just wondering if i havent used abuse language in chat, what would happened:what: would i got those winnings? but any way hope i still get my money, i understand, they can close my acount but no reason to take my winnings. I understand ergo try to do best what he can and lets see what happen, i havent got any emails from vegas after my acount closed, i have this manager on skype he havent answered to me and and havent got any mails from him, so not really nice from alwaysvegas, well played.
 

nisosbar

Ueber Meister
PABnonaccred
Joined
Aug 28, 2009
Location
Right here
Thanks for a quick reply. Yes, I totally agree.
Casino is entitled to ban the player (and should). But confiscating winnings cause of the language used and things said like taking this further to a 3rd party, will make sure their banners are removed etc.
Winnings that were won earlier and already being processed were returned to his account and the account locked.
Casino manager has decided not to pay the player because of his behavior. Which was abusive. I do see their point but is bad behavior on live chat a reason to confiscate the winnings, that is the question :D

Absolutely totally not acceptable. Ever.
 

Jasminebed

Game old gal
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Location
Ontario
While there is little excuse for a player being abusive to CS, there is none whatsoever for confiscating winnings. Pay their funds and ban them from your casino if it you deem it necessary.
 

all4greed

Now we can do business.
Joined
Jul 18, 2004
Location
Pacific NW
Have them point out in their T&C where they can confiscate winnings due to verbal/written abuse from a player.
 

HadEnouth

Dormant account
Joined
May 23, 2010
Location
England
Have them point out in their T&C where they can confiscate winnings due to verbal/written abuse from a player.

They will probley read that here and go and add it to there T&C...

I really think it is time someone takes legal action against these rogue casino's. If i stole £1.000 from you, I be arrested and charged for thieft. So how is it these cunts can get away with it, There T&C dont put them above the LAW. When will people realise that.

If a casino ever tried to void my winnings, I would do everything in my power to get the winnings, I would use all legal means first and if that failed, Then I would use other means, One way or another, They would not get away with trying to screw me over.

Ive been lucky so far, Ive always been paid my winnings.

I always research the background of any casino I think about playing at. That is important. I check all blacklist sites and google the casinos names. I also check to see were they get there licence and if it real or fake.
 

maxd

Complaints (PAB) Manager
Staff member
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Location
Saltirelandia

ergopro

Experienced Member
PABnononaccred
Joined
Apr 29, 2004
Now that you saw the thread, thought I'd ask.
Unless I hear back from Always Vegas before next Tuesday or so, should I advice the player to PAB? You think there's a slightest chance of getting the issue resolved with this particular Rival white label?
 

maphesto

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 5, 2009
Location
Sweden
See the Casinomeister Warning: Rival White Labels.

That wasn't fair, Max! An old and not updated warning. They were removed from the pit only 8 days later.

To be fair you should provide that info together with the other:

Old URL

If you didn't know about the withdrawn warning or the last link I understand why you provided the first link. In that case I apologize for calling your post unfair.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
That thread says all White Labels were put in the rogue pit - but they are not in there now.
Presumably that means they were removed and a PAB can be filed...?

KK

What happened about the CEO of Rival and his "word" that Rival would undertake to pay players screwed over by badly run white labels. It seems Rival have turned a blind eye to the bad behaviour of THIS particular white label, so surely the warning should be PUT BACK, since the promises are NOT being kept, and the original warning is STILL valid for those white labels NOT taken back by Rival themselves.

Whilst the customer was abusive, HE WAS RIGHT, he WAS being screwed around with, the proof is that they WERE able to confiscate his payment, which SHOULD HAVE ALREADY BEEN PROCESSED by the time he lost his cool with CS about it not having appeared.
 
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