Resolved 32red VS Rado16 (2100 Euro dispute)

what 32 red is doing is a forgery! first they tried to amend their TC. Now they do something even worse- they forge my gameplay! I realy need help on this one.
 
32Red is a well-established online casino reviewed by Casinomeister
I repeat- I one that hand. It was a big hand- 2100 eu. So I was all attention when I bet it. i remember all the cards which the dealer dealt.
And the hand that 32red presented - it is a totally different hand. They lie!

:rolleyes:

Maybe if you took a civil approach to this you might make faster (and better) progress? Calling people liars and accusing them of forgery isn't helping your case any.

If you really think you have a case, then by all means PAB: https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/help/pab-rules/ and let Bryan/Max look into this themselves. To be honest, I'm not sure if they'll even take the case now because of the way you've presented yourself here in this thread out in the public...

Q: I have already, or would like to, post about my complaint on the message boards. Is that a good idea?
A: Generally speaking, no, it is not a good idea. It's a long story but it boils down to this: a PAB is a private negotiation process and it works because it gives the casino people the best possible opportunity to resolve your issue calmly and fairly in talks with professional industry people without the burden of external pressures or influence.

A message posted on the boards is quite the opposite situation in that it creates a very public public-relations issue that the casino people generally feel forced to contain, or ignore, as best they can.

Because of the pressures involved a forum post on a given issue will usually derail any PABs that are in progress on that issue, and this is why we advise that forum posts be withheld until the PAB process has had a chance to run it's course.

We reserve the right to discard any PAB that where that same issue has been posted to the boards. This relates to threads started by, or contributions to other threads by, the person who filed the PAB. This applies equally to posts made before or after the PAB was filed.

In other words in the case where the material was posted before the PAB was filed we will determine whether those posts would damage or thwart the PAB process before we decide if we will proceed with the PAB. In the case where the material was posted after the PAB was filed there is a very high probability that we will suspend or discard the PAB at that point.

Once we indicate that we are finished with a PAB the person who filed it is free to post about the issue as they see fit (all the usual Casinomeister Forum Rules are applicable).

But anyways, 32Red is a publicly traded company with shareholders...do you really think they're going to jeopardize that over a measly (to them) 2100?
 
That all said, we will now take the time to resolve what is an unacceptable situation (given not only the above but the errors and time taken in getting to this stage) and I will back in contact before the end of the day with our solution.

Kind regards

Pat Harrison
Operations Director

32Red

Pat will be here to reply before the end of the day. I would hazard a guess that his reply will be a public one this time.

Good advice Winbig....bad situation, but let's see what he says, and give the guy a chance first. JMO.
 
Hi Radovan,

Thanks for your patience while I have been reviewing the various gaming server logs and video clips as supplied by our software providers.

According to the records on the gaming servers you connected to hand ID 2841 on 13th May 2009 at 13:15:27.207 and placed a bet of 2,100 on player to win. At this point, the connection between the bar code reader on the table and the gaming server has been dropped for whatever reason (this could be for a number of things; ISP issues, cabling problems, hardware problems, etc.). So, as far as the gaming server is concerned, it didnt generate any cards for that hand.

The video clip of this hand (attached for your reference) shows that the hand then played out to a TIE with both the Dealer and Player scoring 4. Obviously if the hand had played out without problem then you would have actually lost this bet. Under our rules the hand was made void owing to this technical fault and the stake for your losing bet was refunded. The details of the log on the gaming server can be seen in the attached word document

I know that this is completely at odds with the way that you believe that this hand played out but we have to rely on the integrity of the data that has been supplied by our software providers. The important and critical part of this data is that which is recorded by the gaming server, namely (in this case) that no cards were generated owing to the disconnection as previously explained.

That all said, we will now take the time to resolve what is an unacceptable situation (given not only the above but the errors and time taken in getting to this stage) and I will back in contact before the end of the day with our solution.

Kind regards

Pat Harrison
Operations Director

32Red
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Guys, here is the reply from Pat I received today. The is only one and the most important thing which I
want to say now: they say that that problem hand was finished as a TIE. THIS IS NOT TRUE ! I don't want
to discuss the other parts of Pat's email now but only this one because this is where the misinformation is.
It was not a TIE hand!!! The cards were this: for player King and 9, for banker 10 and 7. The video
which they attached is not the right video. Please, advise me what to do now!!!

Pitch a bitch and under NO circumstances shut your mouth when this is settled. Enquiring minds want to know!
 
Of course we all want to give Pat a chance to present their side of things...but TBH I seriously doubt that the OP will listen to a word of what he has to say and this thread will continue to go nowhere. :p

You must be psycho....ooops, psychic Winbig, lol. Just to clarify, I sympathize with the OP as far as the situation itself. It should never have dragged on like this. However, just as you stated Win.....he's not helping himself by posting PM's, and calling people liars, etc. I also think MG should get just as much heat as 32Red. If they can't keep these games working as they should, and these are the types of issues we end up with....then yank em til they DO work properly.

That being said, I'm still waiting to see what Pat has to say, and what type of resolution is being offered....before I roast anyone over the spit. Sorry, but this casino (and Pat) deserve a tiny bit of leeway here, given their track record.
 
Of course we all want to give Pat a chance to present their side of things...but TBH I seriously doubt that the OP will listen to a word of what he has to say and this thread will continue to go nowhere. :p


Why would this thread go nowhere? 32Red changed their TC and no one said anything about that....now they give Rado a hand dealt, but no time or date on it? Other people have posted the same "technical error".

No one else thinks this is fishy?

Just because it's 32Red, doesn't mean they don't make mistakes. In my eyes they are trying to get out of something anyway they can. If it was a different casino, everyone would be going mad, it's not fair.
 
:rolleyes:
To be honest, I'm not sure if they'll even take the case now because of the way you've presented yourself here in this thread out in the public...
Right or wrong this needs addressed? Everyone at the table doesn't have manners. It needs looking at without killing the messenger.
 
Why would this thread go nowhere? 32Red changed their TC and no one said anything about that....now they give Rado a hand dealt, but no time or date on it? Other people have posted the same "technical error".

No one else thinks this is fishy?

Just because it's 32Red, doesn't mean they don't make mistakes. In my eyes they are trying to get out of something anyway they can. If it was a different casino, everyone would be going mad, it's not fair.

The T&C's were changed to match up with the $32 signup bonus JP, not to pull a fast one on the player. They weren't changed to retroactively apply that term to this player....they were changed because paragraph #9 was missing. Obviously Pat had been under the impression that the term WAS there, or else he wouldn't have quoted it. They corrected their own oversight/error, nothing more.

The player won't be held to any terms that weren't in place when he signed up and played (my understanding). Should they have left the terms as they were.....even though they were incorrect?

I don't think 32Red is trying to get out of anything. They haven't even posted their resolution, or potential resolution, so how can we know what they're offering to do?

And of course everyone makes mistakes...even the very best casinos out there make mistakes. It's how they resolve those mistakes that shows us what they're all about.
 
Why would this thread go nowhere? 32Red changed their TC and no one said anything about that....now they give Rado a hand dealt, but no time or date on it? Other people have posted the same "technical error".

No one else thinks this is fishy?

Just because it's 32Red, doesn't mean they don't make mistakes. In my eyes they are trying to get out of something anyway they can. If it was a different casino, everyone would be going mad, it's not fair.

As I stated in another thread, I could care less about 32Red, as I can't play there anymore, and therefore I have no vested interest in them.

The issue here is the hand in question, not the T&C change....maybe that could be brought up in the subsequent PAB, but I don't think that it has anything to do with the 2100 issue..
 
After reading Pat's indication that a tie produces a losing result for the Player wager, two things come to mind. First, I have trouble with the fact that the casino representative doesn't know how the game is played. Second, telling the player the bet would have lost and they're doing him a favour by refunding the wager would be a good plan IF (and that's a big IF) 32Red/MG/LiveDealer was trying to avoid paying the bet.

As for who is actually telling the truth here, I believe we will never know. Without seeing a video of the actual hand (with some sort of time stamp) that the OP will confirm is the actual hand, all of us 'third parties' can only form an opinion, not a conclusion.

I would like to know (but won't find out) several more bits of information:

How much of the OP's play is on baccarat?
What is the OP's average wager?
Was this way out of his normal range?
If so, I would start suspecting some sort of advantage play/bonus abuse scheme.

What is the frequency of technical errors for this live dealing house?
How often does it happen?
What size bets happen to be on the table when there is an error?
What were the answers to and resolutions of other, similar issues?
If the same video claiming a tie and inaccurate story about refunding what should have been a loss has been repeatedly offered, that would push me towards the OP's side of the story.
 
I would like to know (but won't find out) several more bits of information:

.

Why not? I have read this board for years from several conitnents and have never seen it so weak. ASK, 32red will reply but so far it stinks and is down to the program.

they need to take the system to task ovr this I have never seen a 32red issue linger so long, I'll shut up now
 
:mad:again excuse me for my emotionality. As I told before it is a big money for me. If it was let's say 100 eu- may be
I would behave different. But, winbig, if somebody tries to steal something from you, will you try to be
as polite as possible with that person? Don't think so. And even if that person is Bill Gates or Barak Obama- your
reaction will be the same. Now I also don't care if my money is stolen by the company trading in the Wallstreet
or by just some small and uknown online casino. No difference.


What I wonder is how can I get to the fair treatment now? Is there a chance to find an independent expert at this forum
who will directly contact Microgaming with all the necessary information from me and the casino and will get the certain
answers about this bet? I am afraid that there is some management decision at 32red not to pay me in any case. So now the guys like
Pat are trying their best not to pay me. Accusing me of terms violation, amending the terms immediately, prolonging the time without
definite solution (almost 20 days), then presenting a forged gameplay video which, if true, makes all the previous discussion about
technical problems and discrepancies unneccessary. If there was a TIE- that should have been THE FIRST argument for 32red against
my claim of missing winnings. But somehow-
this was the last argument- after all others did not work.
 
what 32 red is doing is a forgery! first they tried to amend their TC. Now they do something even worse- they forge my gameplay! I realy need help on this one.

:rolleyes: Maybe if you took a civil approach to this you might make faster (and better) progress? Calling people liars and accusing them of forgery isn't helping your case any.

Winbig took the words right out of my mouth.

How would you like it if people here started calling you a sniveling, cowardly liar? Probably not much, right? Well show a little respect! :mad:

32 Red has earned the right to be treated with some consideration here and you would be well advised to start doing so. I'm not saying that your issue isn't a worthy one but I am saying that by presenting yourself this way, by making sweeping accusations and insults like this, you are putting yourself in the position of being the problem instead of soliciting help with the problem.

Respectful persistence with your issue will get you a lot more of the 'help' you claim to seek than this name-calling and slander.
 
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:mad:again excuse me for my emotionality. As I told before it is a big money for me. If it was let's say 100 eu- may be
I would behave different. But, winbig, if somebody tries to steal something from you, will you try to be
as polite as possible with that person? Don't think so. And even if that person is Bill Gates or Barak Obama- your
reaction will be the same. Now I also don't care if my money is stolen by the company trading in the Wallstreet
or by just some small and uknown online casino. No difference.

Of course I'm going to be pi$$ed off if someone tried to screw me, but I've learned from life experience that I'm only going to make matters worse if I bring my personal feelings and emotions into the equation when I'm trying to get any issue resolved - gambling or otherwise.

If you had done some research, you'll see a pattern. One of which is that 32Red is a stand-up group and have been doing the right thing for many years now; and I'm confident that they'll do the right thing in regards to this issue..
 
I am afraid that there is some management decision at 32red not to pay me in any case. So now the guys like
Pat are trying their best not to pay me.

Has Pat or anyone from 32Red come right out and said they're not going to pay you? I have no idea what they're going to do, that's why I'm waiting to see what they DO say.

The terms were changed because they were incorrect, and I would be shellshocked if they tried to hold you to any term not in place when you signed up and played. The timing of the change in terms looks horrible, but given the fact they didn't realize they were incorrect until this issue was brought up, they didn't really have a choice. They needed to be changed. It shouldn't affect your case one way or another.

As others have stated here, if you are not satisfied when a resolution is posted, you will be free to PAB with Max. Check out the links in his signature. But you are not helping yourself right now. You have to understand that many of us here are familiar with 32Red, and the people behind the casino. It is NOT their style to pull fast ones on players, or attempt to cheat anyone. Exactly the opposite as a matter of fact. That is why many of us are giving them a wider berth to resolve this, and not jumping all over them. I do understand that nearly three weeks is way too long...and as a player, I too would be none too happy at the delay.
 
:mad:again excuse me for my emotionality. As I told before it is a big money for me.

I don't care if it is your life savings! That's not an excuse.

Every time you've posted here you've gone out of your way to be abusive. That's not 'emotionality', that's being an a-hole. If you behave like that you'll get treated like that.

Shape up, be an adult! State your case, of course, but do it without the BS.
 
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are you trying to provoke me with insult and then to ban me from posting?

Why do you discuss my personality and my posting style and not the issue itself? Not a one useful posting
from you at this thread till now.
 
are you trying to provoke me with insult and then to ban me from posting?

No, if I wanted to ban you you'd be gone already.

Read what I have said: post like a responsible adult and you're welcome to do so. I think I've stated the case clearly and simply.

Why do you discuss my personality and my posting style and not the issue itself?

Because I am a moderator. It's my job to see that the membership conduct themselves appropriately, regardless of how pressing they may feel their issue is.

If you can't post without the abusive crap then your issue is _never_ going to get addressed to your satisfaction. Like I've said, at a certain point your 'personality and posting style' become the problem.

And again, to reiterate, being an a-hole is not a 'posting style'. It is inappropriate and unacceptable behaviour that will not be tolerated. Clean up your act and no one has a problem with what you are posting.

I promise you that if the casino behaved toward you the way you are behaving toward them then (a) everyone would be on them like a ton of bricks, and (b) they'd already have been banned for abusive and disrespectful behaviour. It wouldn't matter how distraught they were.

If you need further clarification of what is expected of you I invite you to read our Forum Rules wherein you will find the following:
1.6 - No "Libelous" Posts. Do not make posts that could be considered libelous, defamatory, or posting merely to cause harm to another's business. Opinions are expected, but do not attack others with accusations of criminal activity unless this has been proven in a court of law.

I think the situation is very clear at this point: stop with the "fraud" this and "criminal" that and get on with your issue. It's as simple as that.
 
I agree with 32red's solution. Again I am sorry for being abusive.

You've shared all other correspondence from them....are you allowed to tell us what the resolution is? If not, that's fine too. Just wondering.
 
I'm glad the case was resolved. But one has to wonder, what if the player didn't know about casinomeister, and was stuck with the first answear he got from the casino?
 
I've often thought I want to have a go at the live dealer games; there are three reasons why I've not:

a) The screenshots always look a bit 'seedy'
b) I don't really play much table games anymore
c) I've usually drained my balance on the slots and am looking at "00.00" by the time I remember I was going to give the live dealer games a go.

Maybe they should have a 'Live Slot-Jockey' bit, where you see a live web feed of someone stood at a slot machine pulling the handle for you.

Or not.

Hey, glad the guy got everything sorted/resolved to his satisfaction or whatever. Great news!
 
32Red

Just to give you all a short overview of our resolution here.

1) Bet that Rado16 believed had won has been paid in full and added to his account balance.

2) As the money was won using our Slots Welcome Bonus, these winnings will need to be wagered according to the Terms and Conditions that were in place(and being displayed) at the time that the bonus was credited. We will not retrospectively apply the corrected Terms and Conditions that are effective from 28th May.

3) We are now in the process of removing all Live Dealer games from our Casino offerings.

I think that this solution is a fair one given the difficulties that we faced in proving our case beyond reasonable doubt.
Rado16 can now enjoy a much more reliable gaming experience at the hands of our RNG powered Slots games and I hope that he doesnt have too long to wait to experience our fast payouts!

Cheers for now
Pat
 
Obviously there is a serious issue with the live dealer games and I think the fact 32Red have taken the decision to remove these games both shows this to be the case and that they are a Casino that cares about their reputation and will do the right thing in order to protect it.

I think VWM is probably right when he stated most of the blame for this mess probably lies with MGS.

So fair play to 32Red and good luck Rado16.
 
Just to give you all a short overview of our resolution here.

1) Bet that Rado16 believed had won has been paid in full and added to his account balance.

2) As the money was won using our Slots Welcome Bonus, these winnings will need to be wagered according to the Terms and Conditions that were in place(and being displayed) at the time that the bonus was credited. We will not retrospectively apply the corrected Terms and Conditions that are effective from 28th May.

3) We are now in the process of removing all Live Dealer games from our Casino offerings.

I think that this solution is a fair one given the difficulties that we faced in proving our case beyond reasonable doubt.
Rado16 can now enjoy a much more reliable gaming experience at the hands of our RNG powered Slots games and I hope that he doesnt have too long to wait to experience our fast payouts!

Cheers for now
Pat

Although I have never had the opportunity to play at 32Red, Pat's unwavering politeness, sense of fairness and reliability in making himself accessible to his customers, makes me long for the day I CAN play there!

Kudos, Pat and 32Red!!! :thumbsup:
 
Obviously there is a serious issue with the live dealer games and I think the fact 32Red have taken the decision to remove these games both shows this to be the case and that they are a Casino that cares about their reputation and will do the right thing in order to protect it.

I think VWM is probably right when he stated most of the blame for this mess probably lies with MGS.

So fair play to 32Red and good luck Rado16.

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Rusty yes there does seem to be an issue with live games, you can win at them!, william hill has fantastic live games, and I would play them with ease and have no issue with them at all, I have played so called random number generated casino games for years and the live ones are fairest as far as I am concerned.

I read down through the posts and I was shocked at some of the peoples aggression towards a person who claimed to be ripped off, 2 weeks and very suspect reply's by 32red would make my blood boil if I have 3 months wages on the line, Just thinking off the top of my head here, I wonder if some of the posters on here actually work for 32red?, I know if I owned a casino I would be posting on here big time, such a great line, best casino award, so many fish waiting to be caught:)......
 
I wonder if some of the posters on here actually work for 32red?, I know if I owned a casino I would be posting on here big time, such a great line, best casino award, so many fish waiting to be caught......

Damn. You caught us out. We all work for 32Red here and we take every opportunity to promote them directly, even in threads that have little or no relevance.

In fact, 32Red paid me $500 just last month.

All I had to do was hit 4 Aces.

:rolleyes:
 
All i'm saying is the player was obviously dicked around big time with a big money bet, a huge amount where he came from and people started giving him stick for been angry, would you not be angry if you where owed 3 months wages?, why would some people start in on him when he was the victim?.

If had a casino I would defo employ someone to post on here, its a no brainer I think, thats all i'm saying.
 
I think you could be right in saying that some casinos employ people to post here or at least give freebies to loyal players so that they can post good experiences with this casino. Whenever a thread comes out against certain casinos, there is bound to be a new thread claiming what great services he/she has enjoyed to counter it. I have seen this myself on several occasions where a poster comes out of the blue to post a positive experience to ensure there is no harm done.

Having said all that, though I reiterate that I cannot play at 32 RED now due to local gambling restrictions, this casino is tops especially in terms of customer service. That's what I gathered when I could still play there 2 years ago. Actually, I sometimes think Pat has been too nice to players who dont have too much of a case by giving in to their demands. Unlike Nifty, I cannot receive any wages from them as my company does not allow me to perform paid outside work and that is a contractual obligatuion.:D
 
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Just thinking off the top of my head here, I wonder if some of the posters on here actually work for 32red?, I know if I owned a casino I would be posting on here big time, such a great line, best casino award, so many fish waiting to be caught:)......

Yes , of course I do work for them.
But if I could get the money back that I lost at 32Red since about 4 years that I play there, I would stop working for them immediately:lolup:

Although you don't like to hear it, I repeat :
They are the best online casino and Pat is the best online casino manager.
If the people who complain here would contact Pat before writing here, most problems would have been solved immediately.
 
All i'm saying is the player was obviously dicked around big time with a big money bet, a huge amount where he came from and people started giving him stick for been angry, would you not be angry if you where owed 3 months wages?, why would some people start in on him when he was the victim?.

If had a casino I would defo employ someone to post on here, its a no brainer I think, thats all i'm saying.


Good point, pmclough. Actually , 32red has shown their quality by acknowledging their initial mistake. So they are basically fair.
Unfortunately , many of this forum users has tried to do everything to prevent the casino to pay me. Many accused me of rudeness, impoliteness and one senior member has even called me an a**hole (later he has edited his post). Don't think that these users are paid by any casino. But still their behavior was somewhat strange (to say the least).
 
Good point, pmclough. Actually , 32red has shown their quality by acknowledging their initial mistake. So they are basically fair.
Unfortunately , many of this forum users has tried to do everything to prevent the casino to pay me. Many accused me of rudeness, impoliteness and one senior member has even called me an a**hole (later he has edited his post). Don't think that these users are paid by any casino. But still their behavior was somewhat strange (to say the least).

Come on Rado, having read this thread from start to finish now, I cannot believe that you view your previous postings as being polite, concise and entirely without fault in aggravating some members.

I think the lesson to be learned from this is to just take it slowly, stick to the facts and take out your frustrations somewhere other than in public (I have a punchbag in the garage that does just the job...you're welcome to use it if you're ever in South Wales!).

As for 32red, apart from the time issue, which they did apologise for a number of times, they have investigated it, obviously credited you with your money, and taken steps to prevent similar problems happening again. A very responsible attitude and move in my view.
 
Unfortunately , many of this forum users has tried to do everything to prevent the casino to pay me.

If you can provide specific examples of this then please post them, otherwise you owe everyone who has posted in this thread an apology.

Many accused me of rudeness, impoliteness and one senior member has even called me an a**hole (later he has edited his post).

Mainly because you ARE rude, impolite and **edited my post**

You admitted it yourself when you apologised to 32Red for 'being abusive'. :confused:

Yes, it took longer than it should have to get to a solution (IMO), but if you actually READ the posts by 32Red you will see that they were completely at the mercy of Microgaming here and this is where the delays occurred (no great surprise). You were asked to be patient and that 32Red has to wait for MGS to get back to them, but you continued to carry on like a 3 year old who didnt get his lollipop from mommy at the supermarket.

And, just so you know Im not making any of this up and trying to 'make forgeries', here are some direct quotes from you that you posted after.......and I highlight AFTER.......you acknowledged that you were in PM discussions with Pat and he stated that he was waiting on information from Microgaming:

I was robbed and now you try to support the robber without even knowing the case

32red representatives started to invent the new and irellevant things in order not to pay me.

They don't know their own rules or what?

I can see that Path is using this time amending the bonus rules and inventing the new and irellevant reasons no to pay me.

you will never agree to aknowledge the fact that he made a winning bet and will try to do everything just not to pay him.

And only now they say that that hand was a TIE! And I assure you that
this is an absolute lie! Player won that hand! Pat knew that if they aknowledge the fact that
the Player won - then they will have to pay me! So the only way not to pay was to say
that that hand finished as a TIE or I even lost it

And the hand that 32red presented - it is a totally different hand. They lie!

what 32 red is doing is a forgery!

So now the guys like
Pat are trying their best not to pay me

then presenting a forged gameplay video

These are just some of the little gems I found Rado.

After all those unfounded accusations and smearing Pat's good name by straight up calling him a liar and a forger (a personal insult), you are so remorseful about your behaviour that you were moved to say:

Again I am sorry for being abusive.

Well I didnt see the first time you apologised for being abusive, but anyway....

If you cant see from this that you owe Pat and 32Red AND many of the posters in this thread a sincere apology, then IMO you dont deserve anyone's help.

If I were Pat and 32Red, I would have invoked the malfunction rule, refunded your bet, and said 'dont come back'. Its just lucky for you that it was 32Red as most operators would have done just that - so consider yourself fortunate given your childish behaviour.
 
Hold on a second here, this man was ignored for 2 weeks, for a huge bet in his country, then some stuff about bonus rule was pulled out, a software malfunction, and them they said it was a drawn bet so he would have lost it anyway, i would be extremely annoyed and yes abusive if i got that treatment, who would not?, I mean he sent 20 emails as I recall, maybe I have got some of the fasts incorrect here but to keep calm when 3 months wages are on the line and have the above mentioned facts thrown at me, the editing of the rules was a complete gem in my book, maybe its just me I suppose, some people are polite up to a point and this is correct, then there comes a point when the gloves come off in my book, and the above issues would not only have the gloves off but I would burn the dam things!, its lucky he was sharp enough to have the answers because he could have got shafted very easily, rant over.
 
Hold on a second here, this man was ignored for 2 weeks, for a huge bet in his country, then some stuff about bonus rule was pulled out, a software malfunction, and them they said it was a drawn bet so he would have lost it anyway, i would be extremely annoyed and yes abusive if i got that treatment, who would not?, I mean he sent 20 emails as I recall, maybe I have got some of the fasts incorrect here but to keep calm when 3 months wages are on the line and have the above mentioned facts thrown at me, the editing of the rules was a complete gem in my book, maybe its just me I suppose, some people are polite up to a point and this is correct, then there comes a point when the gloves come off in my book, and the above issues would not only have the gloves off but I would burn the dam things!, its lucky he was sharp enough to have the answers because he could have got shafted very easily, rant over.

I would not sympathise with the OP simply because the win amounted to 3 months wages. Remember, he could easily have lost 2100 Euros if the result had been Banker. Betting extravagantly and then claiming that the bet size is equivalent to several months wages is just crazy imo..

The gloves came straight off in Rado's first post. 32RED or not, most posters will not have a good impression of someone who attacks the a casino without waiting for a resolution and then those who dont side with him. Yes, he could have already been waiting for 2 weeks but we just knew about the issue then and to go ape-shit doesnt exactly endears him to us.

Rado said we accused him of rudeness and impoliteness. That's not an accusation. It's a fact. He came here for help and this forum is probably the best in ensuring that everyone gets a fair deal.
 
If had a casino I would defo employ someone to post on here, its a no brainer I think, thats all i'm saying.

'No brainer' or not it's called being a 'shill' and shills get stomped on pretty quickly around here. Pretty much everyone has their eyes peeled for such deceitful activity and they get called out quite quickly. Search the forums for 'shill' and see for yourself, 10 or 15 pages of hits last time I looked.

So, if you did have a casino and you did do the 'no-brainer' thing your shills would soon be tossed off the forum and the reputation of your casino would be in the toilet. Once all that had come to pass it might not look like such a good idea any more: the cost to you in the long run would vastly exceed any temporary benefits you might gain. Fortunately most casinos know this and skip the 'no brainer'.
 
... many of this forum users has tried to do everything to prevent the casino to pay me.

I've just re-read this entire thread and from what I see that statement is simply false. If you had read what people were saying instead of just reacting to the fact that they weren't saying "ya! go Rado!" you'd see that most of the posters agreed there was an issue worth looking into and that you should tone down the belligerent accusations. So ...

Many accused me of rudeness, impoliteness ....

... and quite rightly so! Because you were being exactly that! You can get your issue addressed without constantly saying "fraud", "cheat", "liar" every time you post. Again, if you read the posts you'll see that folks were basically saying "they'll do the right thing, chill out".

I see what the problem is: you don't get it that your belligerent posts had anything to do with the issue you were trying to raise. Well, that's the problem! It has everything to do with it! Player issue + abusive attitude = two problems, not just one.

Folks were trying to tell you to cut it with the bad attitude and save yourself some headache. If you choose to interpret that as a mission by "many of this forum users" to somehow "prevent the casino to pay" you then that says a lot more about you than it does about the members who posted here.

My suggestion is to stop assuming everyone is out to screw you over. I seriously think that that was the root of most of your problems here.
 
What i am wondering is why this thread is still going? I haven't been on the forums in a few weeks but the dispute seems to have been resolved satisfactorily to both parties ages ago so why not just move on? :what:
Because newbie user pmclough77 decided to bump up a three month old thread and accuse 32red of using shills. :rolleyes:
 
Because newbie user pmclough77 decided to bump up a three month old thread and accuse 32red of using shills. :rolleyes:

I see, well that's not a very good way to introduce yourself to a forum. :rolleyes:

Well maybe just as a suggestion, threads should automatically be locked once the issue has been resolved and their has been a period of inactivity on the thread of maybe a few weeks? I think this would be particularly useful for threads relating to casino complaints as it would prevent this sort of thing from happening.
 
It's true, locking would prevent something like this happening. But on the other hand often there are very legit reasons for coming back to post on a thread that's been dormant for a while (updates, promises not fulfilled, etc). In the end it's pretty much a 50/50 situation, there are good arguments on both sides.
 
It's true, locking would prevent something like this happening. But on the other hand often there are very legit reasons for coming back to post on a thread that's been dormant for a while (updates, promises not fulfilled, etc). In the end it's pretty much a 50/50 situation, there are good arguments on both sides.

Well maybe you could lock it to all but the relevant parties involved once it gets to this stage and then if and when the "(update, promises not fulfilled, etc)" issues come up a decision can be made whether to open up the thread to public discussion or remain it locked to the relevant parties. Just another idea?

I just don't like the notion or idea of players not involved in the dispute to bring up old topics to the forefront with wild accusation and therefore putting reputable casinos back on the defensive i mean most new people wouldn't bother reading the post at all and just see Rado16 v 32Red dispute title and automatically assume something is up with 32Red which is the last thing we want people to think about any CM accredited casino.
 
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