The slow death of the online casino bonus

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It's actually up to 45% or even 50% in some cases.

What you forget is that firstly you get special affiliate-tailored deals quite often that award better bonuses than just finding the site. Then you'll be paying somebody else anyway if you don't use the affy links, namely Google quite often. (I pay my taxes, Google tries to avoid them!)

The affiliates earning 45% will usually be the large ones that have had sufficient acquisitions to reach that tier, or maybe have had one or two high-rollers if that tier is cash-triggered.

The most important point here is the bonuses - quite ironic in the context of what you stated above! This is because the affiliate pays for them mostly, NOT the casino! I'll give you two examples. Say Trada where you used to get the bonus as cash feed-in via £2 increments. Those £2's come off of your gross earnings, so if a player makes a dipper of say £100 and makes it last any length of time, after bonus deductions and 'fees' you'd be lucky to see 8 or 10 quid.

Secondly, say I have a gross deposit from a player of £500. The player LOSES it all so you think I've made £125 (25%)? WRONG! The 50% bonus is played, so that's now £250. The affiliate software 'fees' or 'local taxes' will skim about another £50+. My net player income will now be less than £200, of which I'll get 25% so £45-48 or something similar. So yes, the player lost £500, but I'd be lucky on most programs to see 10-16% of it. Then I pay 20% tax on my take-home, or if registered as a business 18%. I have recruited 10-20 players monthly on some casinos, and yet if 90% just visit to take the (Coral for example) 'Deposit £10 play with £60' offers you'll end up with about £1.60 for each ASSUMING they all lose!

So yes, I have felt the same as you especially after losing a ton, bitter that somebody has just made £40 from my loss for 'doing nothing'. How wrong I was now I understand how it all works!

So the fact that much of the casino traffic comes via affiliates is actually BENEFICIAL to the player as the casino pays bonuses from affiliate earnings rather than themselves. Whether it's Google, advertising, marketing companies or affiliates the casino is always paying money out other than to players.

I think some people believe affiliates simply sling a page up then we sit here scratching our scrotums (our own, not each others!) while money falls in our laps.

I believed that in about 2008. I'd met Kasino King through his site, and had been playing online for a few months, and was considering becoming an affiliate.

The hours of work, the return, the casinos that just turn and say fuck our deal, we have new rules.

Probably the most valuable thing I've ever gotten from CM is just how hard this business is. It may have been different somewhat a decade ago, but most months we someone posting about an affiliate program changing terms on lifetime player payments for not sending enough new traffic.

Some affilate site have more value to the player than others. Some will go to bat for the player, or have good contacts, like CM.

Or content you find entertaining or valuable.

Dunover, you've had a signup from me, you probably made at least $2 CAD. You can't even buy me a beer with that. Didn't end up being somewhere I played again.

I try to spread the wealth, and don't always use the same affiliate, as I know so many of you on a "personal" level.

But if a casino is not giving me anything extra for signing up directly, I'd rather it went to those that provide me value and have some ethics vetting their casinos, which usually involves a cost for them, as slot games are not EV plus.

Casinos cannot do all of their marketing on their own, affiliates are an intregal part of this industry. I'm very glad I attended Amsterdam I gaming supershow this summer, and I may yet become one, but I'm in a position where I don't need to make a living, maybe just supplement one, which was not the case a decade ago almost.

But I'd probably make more money scratching my lady-balls on webcam.
 
I think the point that slot_zombie is making is that, if the casinos weren't paying out to up to 40% to affiliates, then there'd be more in the kitty to give bigger and better bonuses to players.

I've only ever signed up through 2 affiliate links, and they were both Casinomeister links, just to do my bit to help fund the site.

There's no way I'd want my money (or at least what was once my money), going to someone who's thrown a website together, just in order to profit from someone else's losses

Exactly right. To be clear, I don't have any problem with people trying to scratch an income on the net, but when the incentive balance is tilted away from the PLAYER, possibly because affiliates have to be paid, it seems a little unfair, because the PLAYER is the one putting up their hard earned at the end of the day, and doing so over and over again...

I also take on board the points about affiliate deductions, which I wasn't aware of. My point still stands though, without affiliate payouts, casinos would be able to offer better reload bonuses, no doubt about it, and if they were doing regular, decent offers with lower WR then they'd still come... Affiliates don't have a monopoly on wisdom about which casinos are good. Aside from Casinomeister, how much value are they actually adding?
 
Exactly right. To be clear, I don't have any problem with people trying to scratch an income on the net, but when the incentive balance is tilted away from the PLAYER, possibly because affiliates have to be paid, it seems a little unfair, because the PLAYER is the one putting up their hard earned at the end of the day, and doing so over and over again...

I also take on board the points about affiliate deductions, which I wasn't aware of. My point still stands though, without affiliate payouts, casinos would be able to offer better reload bonuses, no doubt about it, and if they were doing regular, decent offers with lower WR then they'd still come... Affiliates don't have a monopoly on wisdom about which casinos are good. Aside from Casinomeister, how much value are they actually adding?

Bad logic if I may say so - many of us here have joined new sites that we first became aware of via CM and had tailored offers in bonus form for us. The reason we first saw them here is that they were start-up casinos and aside from paid advertising on social media or Google Ads (very expensive) they simply could not spread the word in any other way than the forums or affiliate sites. They certainly couldn't afford newspaper or TV ads at the start, so by whom is word spread? Yes, the affiliate sites! And yes, the affiliates get paid but compare that relatively small amount to the colossal cost of TV or press ads, then see how much budget would be left for your bonuses!

Another error here is you greatly overestimate the net cost of bonuses - most will go down the pan back to the casino as they are always EV-. If they don't, they get paid for by the affiliate. Don't forget you probably aren't the affiliate's only player - you two could lose £100 each making the affiliate say £30 net and the third chap wins £300 and wipes it out to put him -£15!

If you think new casinos have budgets to acquire players via expensive ads then they have to be very well-funded. Affiliates provide value for money and are very effective at recruiting players. Perhaps a rep needs to come here and explain that.

As I said I can recall the angry feeling you guys have expressed when I've lost and thought that some b*stard has earned from my loss (assuming their other players haven't won though!) but I know now that's misplaced. I ALWAYS join through another affiliate link on here (you can't use your own) so if I lose at least someone 'in the family' has made a few bob - after all it makes no odds to me, does it?

P.S. Jasminebed, I had a small 250ml bottle of Stella on you over Christmas..;) :thumbsup:
 
100% right, I've never enjoyed the bonus scheme and whilst I welcomed it with optimism and an open mind-set, as you so rightly put, it has tarnished the reputation of online gambling. I was not so long ago in a Q&A reading comments of how they received free 'money' to bet, but the minimum wager was higher and the win threshold before withdrawing from your account made it impossible to genuinely win. It just sums the scheme up, in fact that's probably the best way to describe it... a scheme!
 
Bad logic if I may say so - many of us here have joined new sites that we first became aware of via CM and had tailored offers in bonus form for us. The reason we first saw them here is that they were start-up casinos and aside from paid advertising on social media or Google Ads (very expensive) they simply could not spread the word in any other way than the forums or affiliate sites. They certainly couldn't afford newspaper or TV ads at the start, so by whom is word spread? Yes, the affiliate sites! And yes, the affiliates get paid but compare that relatively small amount to the colossal cost of TV or press ads, then see how much budget would be left for your bonuses!

Completely agree with that. If we don't get paid, then it would be spent on other forms of advertising, it wouldn't be given back to players as extra bonuses. In fact you could argue that affiliates help fund bonuses. Pink Casino currently sponsor celeb BB. I have no idea what it cost them but bet there wasn't much change out of a million. If I send them a customer (which I wouldn't as they are rubbish) it doesn't cost them a penny unless that customer loses, then they pay around 10-15% (after all the deductions) of the loses. Affiliates, as you say, are cheaper than advertising.

Another error here is you greatly overestimate the net cost of bonuses - most will go down the pan back to the casino as they are always EV-. If they don't, they get paid for by the affiliate. Don't forget you probably aren't the affiliate's only player - you two could lose £100 each making the affiliate say £30 net and the third chap wins £300 and wipes it out to put him -£15!

Exactly right. In the past 12 months on one particular casino I have had 263 active customers (active being have made at least one deposit). My income from that casino was roughly £170 a month on average, which included a small amount of CPA.. 39 active players this month so far with over £2700 deposits and my commission is showing as £60.

To give an idea of how little affiliates actually get from it for anyone looking in, this is data from the previous 12 months.

Active Accounts 263
Deposits 81125.12
Gross Revenue 16268.79
Bonuses -7634.08
Manual Adjustments -4527
Net Revenue 4108.66
% Commission 2003.03 (of which half was CPA)

So 263 customers cost them £2003, less than £10 each. You wouldn't get a 30 second TV ad for that, so to suggest if affiliates didn't get their cut people would get larger bonuses is, to be frank, ridiculous. In fact if it wasn't for affiliates I would suggest the bonuses would be lower!
 
Final thoughts: there's no such thing as a free lunch. If you're a smart gambler, you won't take a bonus, because the odds will be stacked against you. Bring on cashback.

Actually the smart gambler would always play with a bonus (well maybe not the truly awful ones). Most bonuses offered are still EV+ or better than playing without one. Most of the cashback offers are quite bad and can't really compete against bonuses when it comes to value.

And some about affiliates and how it affects bonuses. Can only speak for myself but when I have signed up directly and negotiated my own deal the amount of bonuses have been much higher, but I have known beforehand that they offer this "perk".
 
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Hi interesting post thanks for that ... i think some here would take the "smart gambler" ... "noob" comments as a bit of an insult as I know a few people here who only play on bonuses or as much as they can and seem happy with that. But that aside I agree with pretty much all you said especially the part of the odds stacked against you. Which soon as you step into a casino either online or off , they are.:

I agree with the opinion that the bonuses are necessary, and I think that for the cashback in the gambling future.

At the moment, almost all banks issue cards with cashback and many people actively use this type of service. Plastic cards are actively displace cash. I think that the casino can also go to this kind attract players that can help attract new players. It remains only to establish the process and get the result.
 
I dont know how creative it is because some casinos already do it.

But cashback would be good. Get a certain percent of your losses back.

Or the races are fun. But have different ones. High roller and low roller. because most of us know we wont place in any races because no one can compete with the high rollers. So have some for the little guys.

Or for every 500 spins you get 10 free spins. No wagering of the winnings either.

That's true, and it seems you are not the only one to think so! eGamingOnline is actually doing something like that (cashback) with their new PlayOJO brand. I think its a pretty cool concept personally and it might work out very well!

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douchebag tried to sneak in a link
 
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The thing about a fixed deposit with no early cash out ability is that for me I am liable to win more if things go well.

When I play without a bonus I am often happy to withdraw,say 4 times my deposit if that is close to my peek balance. However with no ability to withdraw at any point I have often finished the play through with many times more my deposit.

The thing about casino's offering deposit bonuses is that they are only likely to win the deposit while we could possibly withdraw infinitely more.
 
Casino cashbacks are mostly crap in my opinion. Some offer something like 10% or 20% back only if you lose so there is little incentive if you are a low roller. Other casinos like Videoslots offer cashback on every slot but you either have to have one hell of a good session or be a high roller before you see any decent returns. I am not bashing them because Videoslots is one of my favourite casinos. Play OJo and Slotty offer similar cashback programmes but they do seem a bit weak again if you are a low roller.

I like bonuses especially the ones that do not tie in your deposit to your bonus should you get lucky early on you can cashout. In the last year or so I have been playing more with straight cash and the vast majority of my cashouts have come from this. The biggest cashouts I have had in the past have always been while a bonus is in play so I agree with Geordiecolin on this one.

To me bonuses are a way to lengthen a play session and gives a better chance of a profit. If I am flush I will always deposit without a bonus but if I only have my usual one or two deposits a week I do prefer a bonus.

Thursday is my birthday and I intend to try and take on the 32Red 200% Club Rouge birthday bonus for a starting balance of €750 as I never get a chance to start off with a balance that high. The wagering is 15k so chances are I am going to bust out but hopefully I will have hours of fun and be able to play at stakes a smidgen higher than I normally would.

So in the end I have mixed feelings about bonuses or no but enjoying playing it each way. I think it's a personal choice but I don't see casinos doing away with bonuses just yet,
 
I was thinking of joining a casino that I believe lockinlove recommended to me but after seeing their bonus requirements, I balked. 40x on the total deposit and bonus is way too high considering the limited library.
 
The thing about a fixed deposit with no early cash out ability is that for me I am liable to win more if things go well.

When I play without a bonus I am often happy to withdraw,say 4 times my deposit if that is close to my peek balance. However with no ability to withdraw at any point I have often finished the play through with many times more my deposit.

The thing about casino's offering deposit bonuses is that they are only likely to win the deposit while we could possibly withdraw infinitely more.

If I play without a bonus I am very conscious of the fact that I am likely to lose because I'm playing a game which is designed to take my money eventually

When I play with bonus funds I know I can just enjoy the gambling without that nagging question of maybe I should cashout now. Plus the casino has given you some extra money to gamble with so it's a boost to your bankroll and your playing time and there's the chance that you can beat the casino and keep the money they gave you plus win at the slots as well .

I mean I'm not a player looking for an edge . I don't generally care about the WR like EnergyCasino has a high WR but I've had some fun exciting sessions on there getting a £100 deposit up to over £1500 and still having £1000s of wagering to go so end up playing Novos on highstakes and it's fun . And if I lose all the money well I only feel like I lost my £100 deposit (which I expected anyway) whereas if it had been real money I would feel that I had lost that £1500 of my peak bankroll
 
There is no secret that we are living among the financial crisis. So online casinos are have to withstand these troubles to maintain their practice. It can't be imagined without bonuses, suggestions and so on. Casinos fight for every gambler, and bonuses help them to attract more and more people. Our mind is created so that we are agree to any free lunch ;)

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Completely agree with that. If we don't get paid, then it would be spent on other forms of advertising, it wouldn't be given back to players as extra bonuses. In fact you could argue that affiliates help fund bonuses. Pink Casino currently sponsor celeb BB. I have no idea what it cost them but bet there wasn't much change out of a million. If I send them a customer (which I wouldn't as they are rubbish) it doesn't cost them a penny unless that customer loses, then they pay around 10-15% (after all the deductions) of the loses. Affiliates, as you say, are cheaper than advertising.



Exactly right. In the past 12 months on one particular casino I have had 263 active customers (active being have made at least one deposit). My income from that casino was roughly £170 a month on average, which included a small amount of CPA.. 39 active players this month so far with over £2700 deposits and my commission is showing as £60.

To give an idea of how little affiliates actually get from it for anyone looking in, this is data from the previous 12 months.

Active Accounts 263
Deposits 81125.12
Gross Revenue 16268.79
Bonuses -7634.08
Manual Adjustments -4527
Net Revenue 4108.66
% Commission 2003.03 (of which half was CPA)

So 263 customers cost them £2003, less than £10 each. You wouldn't get a 30 second TV ad for that, so to suggest if affiliates didn't get their cut people would get larger bonuses is, to be frank, ridiculous. In fact if it wasn't for affiliates I would suggest the bonuses would be lower!

You are forgetting about the super affiliates of course who are basically holding the casinos to ransom. €5,000 to €10,000 per month just to be listed plus 40-50% rev share plus CPA. Plus all the extra little fees add-ons to make complaints or bad reviews disappear, boost ratings, etc etc. Oh yes, and the €hundreds per DAY for the really top listings.....

It is no wonder a lot of casinos go out of business when they think they have no choice but to work with these giant media corporations.
 
Very interesting thread and article

Very interesting read! I think that casinos are already trying to find new ways to promote themselves. For example, there's a No Bonus Casino, I think it has been launched last year. It's addressed specifically to all those players who don't trust the bonuses anymore.
 
Very interesting read! I think that casinos are already trying to find new ways to promote themselves. For example, there's a No Bonus Casino, I think it has been launched last year. It's addressed specifically to all those players who don't trust the bonuses anymore.

The 'no bonus' makes it an intriguing USP within itself. What's your connotations on that? Do you thik that they're more trsutworthy as a result?
 
Is this the definition of "shilling"?

For the record they are very decent, even paid me out without documents before I hit the 2300 eur mark.
 
The 'no bonus' makes it an intriguing USP within itself. What's your connotations on that? Do you thik that they're more trsutworthy as a result?

That's what they claim. Their message is "You've tried bonuses and seen that they are usually not as convenient as they say. We don't want you to lose time with that. We are a good casino and we're honest with players. We don't use tricks to attract them"
 
Is this the definition of "shilling"?

For the record they are very decent, even paid me out without documents before I hit the 2300 eur mark.

Bonuses are "shilling" too, right?

Anyway, I haven't tried it yet, but they have above average reviews. I'm not sure I can link them, since I'm a new member, but I'll try:

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Very interesting read! I think that casinos are already trying to find new ways to promote themselves. For example, there's a No Bonus Casino, I think it has been launched last year. It's addressed specifically to all those players who don't trust the bonuses anymore.

that's their strategy with that casino, they have lots of other ones, like the Free Spins Casino, which targets Free Spin lovers, and No Bonus casino targets VIP/ Cashback players. They also have All Australian Casino and All British Casino, so you can figure out the USP there. But I like the idea of a casino with no bonuses or promotions. At least players cannot be spammed, low-balled, or taken for a bunch of idiots by non-existent bonus offers
 
that's their strategy with that casino, they have lots of other ones, like the Free Spins Casino, which targets Free Spin lovers, and No Bonus casino targets VIP/ Cashback players. They also have All Australian Casino and All British Casino, so you can figure out the USP there. But I like the idea of a casino with no bonuses or promotions. At least players cannot be spammed, low-balled, or taken for a bunch of idiots by non-existent bonus offers

I didn't know they had other similar casinos, interesting. I like their segmentation strategy, it probably gives very good results. And they have nice games too :)
 
Bonuses are "shilling" too, right?

Anyway, I haven't tried it yet, but they have above average reviews. I'm not sure I can link them, since I'm a new member, but I'll try:

stuff

It's considered poor form to link to another affilliate
 
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