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Self Exclusion: 32Red vs. RedBet

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by Balthazar, Aug 22, 2015.

    Aug 22, 2015
  1. Balthazar

    Balthazar The Governor

    Occupation:
    Leader
    Location:
    Woodbury
    Just self excluded from these 2 casinos:

    RedBet: Log into account, click responsible gaming link, click self exclude for 6 months, done. I can no longer log in. Took a few seconds.

    32Red: Find the page through Google, on the page they tell me to send an email along with my name, account number and date of birth. I did that (even though I didn't like the process) and then received a rather long reply from support basically telling me to go fill out another form unlisted on the website (hmm?). It's asking me for my full name, address, postal code, phone number, date of birth and I have to agree to some terms before I'm even able to send that long form.

    I did all that and now I have to wait 48 hrs for "review" (what?)

    This is unacceptable in my book. 32Red is really lagging behind when it comes to self exclusion.
     
    3 people like this.
  2. Aug 22, 2015
  3. aceking123

    aceking123 Ueber Meister CAG PABnononaccred MM

    Occupation:
    chippy
    Location:
    uk
    hmmm seems odd . ive just closed the 32red today ,pi$$ed off with the slots & stuff more of a rage quit though , anyway spoke with live chat it shall be done within 72 hours )

    i think its so they can review your account & proceed via proper channels
     
  4. Aug 22, 2015
  5. Balthazar

    Balthazar The Governor

    Occupation:
    Leader
    Location:
    Woodbury
    What?
    They don't need to review shit, they need to instantly block my account (and yours) on request.
     
    5 people like this.
  6. Aug 22, 2015
  7. aceking123

    aceking123 Ueber Meister CAG PABnononaccred MM

    Occupation:
    chippy
    Location:
    uk
    doesnt make any odds to me i shall wait as i no doubt this is the final closure & wont be going back, now i only have two down loaded casino left & thats with casino rewards , pity i cannot win at red i can claw some funds back but last ten sessions results all the same far to many spins to trigger a feature of crap money. so time to move on )
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2015
  8. Aug 22, 2015
  9. Mark_32Red

    Mark_32Red Affiliate Manager for Accredited Casinos

    Occupation:
    Head of Marketing
    Location:
    32Red Marketing Dpt
    Hi Balthazar,

    Firstly I am sorry to hear you are having difficulty controlling your gambling. Our team can provide you with links to help you, alternatively if you want to drop me a PM I will obtain these for you.

    I am a little concerned by your post as the process you have posted doesn't match our internal policy. Once your self exclusion form has been recieved, the account will be locked immediately. Any self exclusion will then be passed to our responsible gaming team who will follow up with you to provide any assistance, as mentioned above. It is this process, due to them not working 24/7, that can take up to 48hrs. Could this be the confusion? Have you tried accessing the account?

    I would appreciate a PM with your username so I can investigate this for you.

    Take care.
    Mark
     
  10. Aug 22, 2015
  11. dunover

    dunover Unofficial T&C's Editor Staff Member CAG PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABinit mm3 webmeister

    Occupation:
    International Money Launderer
    Location:
    the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
    Yes, 32red don't have an automated system unfortunately. I did it once years ago, on live chat. I had to submit an e-mail with DOB/ac. no etc. I was then told I'd receive an e-mail within 48hours confirming my SE period bah blah, which I did. Yes, the system needs to be self-administered in line with virtually all other sites.
    When the period expires, unlike most sites you are not automatically allowed to log -in and carry on as before, you need to contact them to re-open and make a statement that you don't have any issues and set a DL etc. which is good for RG.
     
    1 person likes this.
  12. Aug 22, 2015
  13. aceking123

    aceking123 Ueber Meister CAG PABnononaccred MM

    Occupation:
    chippy
    Location:
    uk
    just to say thanks to mark for nice e mail ( pm ) shows a good side of 32RED :thumbsup:
     
    1 person likes this.
  14. Aug 22, 2015
  15. Deeplay

    Deeplay New World Order CAG mm1 webmeister

    Occupation:
    Works For Self
    Location:
    The biG Eu
    Got to say that I feel there is no excuse at all these days for not having an automated system where you can with a couple of clicks either SE or initiate a cooling off period. Along with setting deposit limits daily / weekly. WH for example you can only set certain limits and for anything else you have to go through live support. I do not like this at all as it does not place me in direct control of my gambling which is what any worthy company who does see value in having a robust RG policy should allow. So there is no excuse. That has been enough for me to not play further at certain sites inc WH.

    Example took a beating at Guts the other day. Have not closed my account but set my deposit limits real low for a while. And I will defo return to them when im ready. Go figure )

    Video slots betspin guts etc all have 1 or 2 click RS functions which i use and it means they dont actually loose me as a customer because when im ready to play again after a break I will choose those sites I feel I have the ability to set my own limits. Think they are a number of big casinos that really need to do more on this issue. Having to email support is simply not good enough today. SE should be instant from the moment a player decides they either need a break or need to quit for good. Anything less is not a true responsible gambling policy in my opinion. Rant over . :cool:
     
    2 people like this.
  16. Aug 22, 2015
  17. incrediblestuff

    incrediblestuff SearchingForTheHolyGrail! CAG webmeister

    Occupation:
    Currently: Self employed, Previously: Manager
    Location:
    Mostly the Netherlands
    Let me say something tongue in cheek here: of course 32Red lags behind in self exclusion, but that is simply because no-one in their right mind would want to self exclude from there :p

    On a more serious note i don't think it really matters: if a player really is fed up/has sever disciplinary issues, i think that even in a scenario where it would take up to those 72 hours, any mistake the player would make in that time, meaning possible deposits during that pending time (if that is even the case, i assume Balthazar hasn't tried to make a deposit during this time?), i bet 32Red would then still end up doing the right thing. I also think that the longer more complicated process is o.k., since it shouldn't be a process you start on a whim, as mrjones gave an example of rage quit, and there are more such instances where players are mad, self exclude, then later are sorry, but aren't taken back.. where it may be good for the Casino to let the player cool off, and submit their info with a clear head, so the decision is more thought through.

    We saw loads of self excluding issues recently with the everymatrix, and a lot of these issues where because players self-excluded way to easily, i.e, not because of problems, but simply because they lost or where mad at support or whatever.. Anyway, there's always a bit of difference in perspective, and i think it's ok to credit a Casino for speedy withdrawals, but less ok to discredit one for having a slow but thorough self exclusion process...
     
    2 people like this.
  18. Aug 22, 2015
  19. dunover

    dunover Unofficial T&C's Editor Staff Member CAG PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABinit mm3 webmeister

    Occupation:
    International Money Launderer
    Location:
    the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
    Yes, a few valid points but nowhere did Balthazar say he had a gambling issue - if a site doesn't have an easy 'take a break' option whereby they can simply let you bar the account for say 30 days and log-in after and carry on as before, then SE is the only way to achieve this. Spin genie have an excellent system which has 2 separate drop-downs clearly marked 'break' (which gives a choice up to 60 days from 1 day IIRC) and 'SE' which goes from 3 months upwards.

    I have never had an online gambling issue but use the break/SE menus to select on a rolling basis which 6-8 sites I play at at any one time. I am currently SE'd from Guts and Bet-at and Grosvenor, 3 sites which I am well ahead on which the reps could confirm. As they become available to deposit at again, I will break/SE from some of those I play at now. For me it's a 'peace of mind' thing knowing I can manage myself which sites I play at, and don't need to worry about any hacking or funny stuff at the sites I'm not currently depositing at. Plus it controls the amount of e-mails I receive.

    I appreciate the 32red rep replying here but I think it's a bit presumptive to state as he did Balt has some sort of issue whereas if Balt could have just used a 'break' menu as described above this thread wouldn't exist and no-one would be the wiser.:)
     
    7 people like this.
  20. Aug 22, 2015
  21. incrediblestuff

    incrediblestuff SearchingForTheHolyGrail! CAG webmeister

    Occupation:
    Currently: Self employed, Previously: Manager
    Location:
    Mostly the Netherlands
    I see what you mean, but let me point out that i didn't imply he had a problem either, i just assumed he did not try to deposit to see if he still could.

    Reason for that is of course, that if he could not, then their system works just as fine as Redbet's, or any other's, but is, like i said more thorough.

    (as i stated above IF he could then i am sure 32Red would refund those depo's)


    I think Mark may have said that because 32Red's system of self exclusion is focused on problem Gamblers, and assumed that if Balthazar closed it for "minor reasons", he may have first sought contact with either Mark or Johnathan or Pat,

    We could delve further into that, but purely based on what's written so far, i think my statement holds up, in terms of being just an opinion anyway ;p

    I also appreciate what you do with those S/E and D/L tools, but i think for that reason 32Red also has deposit limits in place.. if not in the software, then certainly on request. This means that to take a break, he could set his limits to 0, for as long as he didn't want to return.
     
  22. Aug 22, 2015
  23. Mark_32Red

    Mark_32Red Affiliate Manager for Accredited Casinos

    Occupation:
    Head of Marketing
    Location:
    32Red Marketing Dpt
    Hi Guys,

    Just a quick follow-up based on the recent comments.

    Apologies for assuming that the OP had a problem with gambling. It's just that's how we classify a SE internally. We have take a break and you can also set your own limits so usually when a player goes down the SE route - it's a serious reason.

    This seriousness of SE will become more prevalent in the future when the UKGC will be introducing a central database blocking you from all licensed casinos if you SE from one. A welcome introduction but it may see a few players who use SE for other reasons being blocked from playing all together.

    Regards
    Mark
     
    1 person likes this.
  24. Aug 22, 2015
  25. dunover

    dunover Unofficial T&C's Editor Staff Member CAG PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABinit mm3 webmeister

    Occupation:
    International Money Launderer
    Location:
    the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
    Therefore given what you've just said above it is ABSOLUTELY VITAL that ALL UKGC sites have a clear and easy-to-distinguish option of breaks and SE to avoid problems for both players and casinos. Given the large proportion of revenues, like it not, that come from problem gamblers then this could seriously affect the UKGC-licensed sites' revenues if not administered correctly.
     
    4 people like this.
  26. Aug 22, 2015
  27. Deeplay

    Deeplay New World Order CAG mm1 webmeister

    Occupation:
    Works For Self
    Location:
    The biG Eu
    If true which I do not doubt your source I feel this will be a really positive step forward insomuch as Protecting problem gamblers. Sure fall out can come in the initial stages for those suddenly finding themselves not able to play. But overall I feel so long as it is clear if you SE from 1 site under the UKGC license you will be blocked from all sites. This for me would see me choosing "cool off" periods or deposit limits. Both of the latter I do use as and when I want to. I rare SE now as I see the implications. And see this is for those who really need to steer clear of just 1 bet. More reason that ever for the legit casinos to really get there in house RS settings readily available without the need to contact CS.

    A bold and quite radical move by the UKGC which I think can help many who really do struggle with online gaming. In the end though its down the person as if a person really wants to gamble they will even if it means getting the fix at a clip joint registered at godknowswhere . com
     
  28. Aug 22, 2015
  29. Mark_32Red

    Mark_32Red Affiliate Manager for Accredited Casinos

    Occupation:
    Head of Marketing
    Location:
    32Red Marketing Dpt
    A positive introduction indeed. As you say though it needs to be transparent what is happening.

    Could this potentially drive problem gamblers to black market (non UKGC licensed) sites though?

    Mark
     
  30. Aug 22, 2015
  31. Deeplay

    Deeplay New World Order CAG mm1 webmeister

    Occupation:
    Works For Self
    Location:
    The biG Eu
    I think its a clear yes that it will. But thats why such things such as SE should always be seen as just part of the solution to a much bigger personal problem. In the end its down to the person to really work at quitting. I know guys who have had gamblock installed vowing never to bet again but found a way. And same with this ruling it will alas mean some will go the darker areas of online gaming no doubt.

    But overall I think it shows that if they do implement this that the UKGC is taking this issue seriously which many gambling addiction resources have felt up until now that they have not. Its like the shop wide SE from the high street bookies. You can still find a place to bet if you really want to. But overall it would be a good tool. Maybe giving some time to pause which can make all the difference. But yeah I rekon some will find that being SE from all legit Uk casinos will end up playing at places they normally never would have.
     
  32. Aug 22, 2015
  33. interlog

    interlog Senior Member MM webmeister

    Occupation:
    Manager
    Location:
    London
    It potentially could. But to put it bluntly - that is not of your concern. You, as casino that abides by the rules, have done your bit. It takes two to tango and the player that self excludes should also share the responsibility of the gambling problem.
     
  34. Aug 22, 2015
  35. Mark_32Red

    Mark_32Red Affiliate Manager for Accredited Casinos

    Occupation:
    Head of Marketing
    Location:
    32Red Marketing Dpt
    A bit harsh I think, we have a concern about any player that has a problem. My comment was more to prompt a discussion on how the licensed operators and the UKGC can prevent this, rather than any other reason.
     
    2 people like this.
  36. Aug 22, 2015
  37. Deeplay

    Deeplay New World Order CAG mm1 webmeister

    Occupation:
    Works For Self
    Location:
    The biG Eu
    Would be interesting for sure to see other peoples pov on how and what can be done by the UKGC and casinos in relation to these on going issues which lets face it are not going to go away.
     
  38. Aug 22, 2015
  39. interlog

    interlog Senior Member MM webmeister

    Occupation:
    Manager
    Location:
    London
    Not harsh at all. There is only so much that you can do. If a player with a gambling problem that he is unable to control wants to keep on gambling, then he will do that.

    I appreciate that you as a casino want to do all that you can. And by not letting a player in that is self excluded, you have done your bit. You can't control the whole of the internet, and neither can other licensed operators and the UKGC to answer your question.
     

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