RTG RTP Conspiracy (tin foil hat zone)

[ergopro]

Thanks 4oak
What still bothers me if these are all global settings or if they can alter the settings on an individual player basis then it would surely answer a lot of questions...at least for me

 

[greasemonkey]

Oh geez.

Please produce some evidence, apart from 'someone told me'.

I assume this Super User access allows personal RTP adjustments and the ability to award RJs to selected players , extra cards in blackjack decks, <insert favorite conspiracy theory here>

Its becoming tiresome how you walk into RTG threads, drop a giant 'bombshell', and then walk away without answering any tough questions about it.

I'm not saying you're lying, its just hard to take the word of someone who has always enjoyed the 'ban me if you like' attention-grabbing spotlight and more than a few bogus conspiracy theories.

As someone else alluded to earlier, we dont know what the parameters are for the house edge boxes.

It may well be that the the RTG values are the highest house edge allowed and the operator can only adjustments possible are downwards i.e higher rtp.

It may also be that the operator can only adjust SOME of the games. Just because a data box is there doesn't mean it will accept input. It may have been more convincing if the values had all been changed in the screenshot - in fact I would have thought if the 'super mole' had wanted to really make his point he would have done just that.

Now, these ideas might be wrong, but they are as credible as any other in the absence of an RTG operator to explain its functions.

It's going to be a field day for the conspiracy theorists, but the rest of us should remain calm and see what CM can find out.

YOU are the conspiracy theorist if you believe what you just typed. You are dreaming up possible, far-fetched theories that make little sense ONCE AGAIN, in defense of the operators.

Why would a software system go through the trouble of making data boxes only to allow some of them to be used? Or only used in a disadvantaged way by the operators? Why in the world would an operator make THEIR odds worse than the normal odds???? Think about what the hell your typing.

You simply jumped on another forum peer (4oak this time) half cocked with little or no info as to what you were doing. Now at least can you apologize? Or is it just ok to take shots at other posters then run off to belittle and question the integrity of yet another on some different thread?

I am going to use your own approach on you and shout you down until you have some proof. Otherwise, for all we know you are probably working for RTG and are just a fruadster... probably work along side Nicolas Johnson and are part of the BP team..yadayadayada..

 

[Nifty29]

YOU are the conspiracy theorist if you believe what you just typed. You are dreaming up possible, far-fetched theories that make little sense ONCE AGAIN, in defense of the operators.

Why would a software system go through the trouble of making data boxes only to allow some of them to be used? Or only used in a disadvantaged way by the operators? Why in the world would an operator make THEIR odds worse than the normal odds???? Think about what the hell your typing.

You simply jumped on another forum peer (4oak this time) half cocked with little or no info as to what you were doing. Now at least can you apologize? Or is it just ok to take shots at other posters then run off to belittle and question the integrity of yet another on some different thread?

I am going to use your own approach on you and shout you down until you have some proof. Otherwise, for all we know you are probably working for RTG and are just a fruadster... probably work along side Nicolas Johnson and are part of the BP team..yadayadayada..

LMAO.

"I work for Nicolas Johnson". Someone hasn't been paying attention.

"I'm a fruadster". I'm not sure what a fruadster is but I'm pretty sure I'm not one.

AFAIK Bryan has seen this screenshot some time ago - it's nothing new. Given that he has not taken any action, it means that either the whole thing amounts to nothing, or Bryan is in on the whole scam and he's sitting there laughing as he rakes in the cash. I don't see any other option.

I think it's the former, but that's just my opinion.

The ONLY thing we have is a screenshot. It hasn't been authenticated, and the source has not been revealed. NOBODY KNOWS WHAT IT MEANS.

You may want to hang your hat on that, but I prefer to wait for something more concrete.

(FYI 4oak will get an apology when his theories are proven correct)

 

[Nate]

I seem to recall 4oak mentioning previously that there was more than one screenshot in his posession. Im hoping he cares to share the rest of them.

Nate

 

[reda]

im intrested in more screen shots as well. this was a intresting read.

 

[vinylweatherman]

RTG are not going to be happy, but THEIR official explanation was about a risk to their commercial secrets, rather than anything to do with malpractice being hidden.

The other screenshots would be VERY interesting, even though in the end they may prove nothing other than what we have already learned about RTG.

Of far more interest would be the USER MANUAL for this back end application, where the functionality of all these settings will be explained.

Data boxes can be programmed to accept only certain values, or certain ranges, and this by no means proves that 60% could be typed in, and this actually being set as the RTP of the game in question.

The MGS autoplay has data boxes, but only CERTAIN values are accepted, even though almost ANYTHING can be typed in. You can type 9999999 in the "no of spins" box, but as soon as you try to "save" that value, it is rejected and replaced by one of the default values. The highest value that you can type in and have SET is "9999".

It might be that anything can be typed in, but the "set" process will change the value to the nearest of the three (91.5%, 95%, 97.5%) that the slot has alternate reelstrips for.

The most there is evidence for is that the RTP for coupon play can be set differently to that for non-bonus play.

 

[silcnlayc]

Just wondering....

LMAO.

"I work for Nicolas Johnson". Someone hasn't been paying attention.

"I'm a fruadster". I'm not sure what a fruadster is but I'm pretty sure I'm not one.

AFAIK Bryan has seen this screenshot some time ago - it's nothing new. Given that he has not taken any action, it means that either the whole thing amounts to nothing, or Bryan is in on the whole scam and he's sitting there laughing as he rakes in the cash. I don't see any other option. I think it's the former, but that's just my opinion.

The ONLY thing we have is a screenshot. It hasn't been authenticated, and the source has not been revealed. NOBODY KNOWS WHAT IT MEANS.

You may want to hang your hat on that, but I prefer to wait for something more concrete.

(FYI 4oak will get an apology when his theories are proven correct)

Why are you ALWAYS bringing in Bryan to your reponses and assuming what Bryan is thinking or knows??? Just curious...Maybe you are his sargeant at arms and speak for him?

.

 

[silcnlayc]

YOU are the conspiracy theorist if you believe what you just typed. You are dreaming up possible, far-fetched theories that make little sense ONCE AGAIN, in defense of the operators.

Why would a software system go through the trouble of making data boxes only to allow some of them to be used? Or only used in a disadvantaged way by the operators? Why in the world would an operator make THEIR odds worse than the normal odds???? Think about what the hell your typing.

You simply jumped on another forum peer (4oak this time) half cocked with little or no info as to what you were doing. Now at least can you apologize? Or is it just ok to take shots at other posters then run off to belittle and question the integrity of yet another on some different thread?

I am going to use your own approach on you and shout you down until you have some proof. Otherwise, for all we know you are probably working for RTG and are just a fruadster... probably work along side Nicolas Johnson and are part of the BP team..yadayadayada..

It doesn't matter ho much proof one has for a select few. You have hit the nail on the head...thank you for that.

.

 

[Smokeycasino]

wow change thread title to RTG Conspiracy

 

[Nifty29]

Why are you ALWAYS bringing in Bryan to your reponses and assuming what Bryan is thinking or knows??? Just curious...Maybe you are his sargeant at arms and speak for him?

.

This thread is not the place to re-ignite past unpleasantness and personal agendas.

I'm not going to play your games.

 

[gaydave]

This thread is not the place to re-ignite past unpleasantness and personal agendas.

I'm not going to play your games.

I see. So you are allowed to make any comment and stir the pot then you take the "high road" when others respond to you in the same way or call you out on your annoying posts. pathetic. If you like dishing it then enjoy eating it.

 

[slotplayer]

did any notice the folder at the very bottom "top depositors"?

 

[Nifty29]

I see. So you are allowed to make any comment and stir the pot then you take the "high road" when others respond to you in the same way or call you out on your annoying posts. pathetic. If you like dishing it then enjoy eating it.

I like to challenge peoples opinions and debate the issues.

Unlike yourself, I can do so without describing others as 'pathetic' or labelling their posts 'annoying'.

I refused to get into a slanging match with Silc because I dont believe it was appropriate and would further derail an already meandering thread - but I guess such things don't bother you since you felt you needed to fuel the fire.

 

[aceking123]

guys guys guys , hay lets just get back to the thread plz as that is more important than tit for tat )

 

[Casinomeister]

Hi all,

Here we go again with the tin hats.

What 4 of a kind is posting are screenshots of the backend of the coupon codes. This has nothing to do with the RTP with which some of you are mildly confused.

From an RTG operator concerning the screenshot referenced here:
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/rtg-rtp-conspiracy-tin-foil-hat-zone.43528/

Regarding the screen shot of supposed percentage changes that has been posted up, whilst I appreciate it may look to the members that subscribe to the conspiracy theories as if it is a piece of damming evidence (which I understand) it is simply not so.

This is quite simply a tool that allows us to edit/setup default variables on coupons. It even says this at the top of the screenshot "Coupon Defaults".
You can set:

The standard allowed games on coupons.
The % of wagering per $1 bet.
It also shows the expected RTG return per game.
In the last box you can adjust this. You enter the more accurate return that you are actually seeing in your casino.

All this information is pre-populated every time a coupon is being created.

As an example if we did a promo deposit $50 get $50 bonus 100% coupon with $2000 turnover for Slots
With the standard RTG default setting of 5% return, this would show an expected win of $100.
However if our Casino was only returning 2.5% (and this had been entered) on Slots we would enter the 2.5% in the Slots return section and we would get a re-calculated win of $50.

This tool simply enables your promo guys to have some idea of the expected win/loss we may experience when they create a coupon.

To be honest it is not a tool we have ever used, as it is for the Casinos that offer the more 'creative large' bonus offers..

Further reference material about RTG's RTP has been repeated and regurgitated more times than you can shake a stick at. For further reading, please read the following threads.

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/rtg-and-rtp-the-official-word.38348/

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/rtg-software-backend-issues-rtp-etc.41825/

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/corrupt-online-gaming.40838/

It seems to me that a small handful of members keep bringing up the same issue instead of referring to the vast amount of reference material at hand. I would really appreciate a little bit of consideration when it comes making me repeat myself.

Further, if you wish to publish what is considered privileged information (like screenshots of someone's back-end), either you get permission to post this or post it on your own website and reference it from here. We have strict rules about this; you can refer to the FAQs and rules about posting privileged information. If we are requested to take it down - we take it down. That'll take the wind out of your sails pretty damn quick.

 

[silcnlayc]

wow change thread title to RTG Conspiracy

Where did you get my picture??? Do you like my hat?

.

 

[X-Raided]

I like to challenge peoples opinions and debate the issues.

Unlike yourself, I can do so without describing others as 'pathetic' or labelling their posts 'annoying'.

I refused to get into a slanging match with Silc because I dont believe it was appropriate and would further derail an already meandering thread - but I guess such things don't bother you since you felt you needed to fuel the fire.

Clever little wombat.

 

[X-Raided]

This isn't anything to bite your nails about or make your heart skip any beats, IMO.

RTG is a business and as a business it is allowed to make profits.
This screen shot provided by 4Oaks really just does appear to be a coupon code program (like Bryan posted)
that gives players who decide to take the bonus a see-saw of equality between the player and the casino.

I've checked the winner's screen shots page and have seen people recently winning RJ's and money on RTG casinos.
Do I think RTPs can be set by the operator whenever they feel like it? No. My opinion.

P.S. And this is coming from a guy who dislikes RTG's software and style. FYI

 

[DarkMage]

So why is this tool needed for table games? I would assume there are hundreds of players per day playing dozens/hundreds/thousands of hands daily and in a fair random game you always have the game floating right around the statistical normal + or - 1 or 2%. So why are RTG's table games so far off from the statistical average that you need a tool like this to calculate how much a casino might win or lose on a bonus, unless the table games are not random in the first place and are a type of slot machine with a manually set payout %

If the screenshot only showed slot machine's and not table games I would not be concerned but including the table games makes you think twice.

I personally have played tens of thousands of hands of RTG blackjack I do not find evidence that it is rigged in any way it feels pretty fair but I would stop playing in an instant if I learned it was a slot machine type card game with a set payout %

 

[silcnlayc]

Random Jackpot button (box)?

I can't see the screenshot so well...but it's got to be there somewhere IMO..

If there are that many boxes and choices for a casino to make on the backend..do you really think they would leave off the RJ one...yep..I still believe in the star "theory" of a few chosen to win the randoms..while this actually shows the "checkmark" theory is true!


.

 

[Papa-ya]

My play or lack thereof needs no evidence of concrete foul play, but for many it is necessary to actually see the proof positive.
The return to me during any session is proof enough as to house fairness/unfairness to make me stay with a casino or leave.

I personally won't play their game, so if they depended on my deposits they would have been broke a long time ago.

Whether the screenshot is evidence or not, to me it doesn't matter as actuall experience speaks louder than words or evidence presented and I do listen. But couple this together with the fact that wins are also capped, first rule win is dissregarded in favor of a secondary rule win, in RTG's favor of course and a player such as myself just honestly can't take the whole online gaming thing serious anymore.

 

[greasemonkey]

Why would it say "reset to RTG values" and why would that box be checked prior to sending to 4oak?

Moreover, why does it say "set the default value for Excluded games, Playthrough and HOUSE EDGE %???????

if you can change allowed games and change playthrough it is only logical that you can change the house edge%. There is even a box for it. I am not buying the other explanations.

btw, anyone heard hide nor hair from Nicolas Johnson the past few days about all this?

 

[silcnlayc]

Why would it say "reset to RTG values" and why would that box be checked prior to sending to 4oak?

Moreover, why does it say "set the default value for Excluded games, Playthrough and HOUSE EDGE %???????

if you can change allowed games and change playthrough it is only logical that you can change the house edge%. There is even a box for it. I am not buying the other explanations.

btw, anyone heard hide nor hair from Nicolas Johnson the past few days about all this?

This thread has been split off from the other...we are now in :RTG RTP Conspiracy (tin foil hat zone)

I kinda like the title myself...
.

 

[PenDragyn21]

Why would it say "reset to RTG values" and why would that box be checked prior to sending to 4oak?

Moreover, why does it say "set the default value for Excluded games, Playthrough and HOUSE EDGE %???????

if you can change allowed games and change playthrough it is only logical that you can change the house edge%. There is even a box for it. I am not buying the other explanations.

btw, anyone heard hide nor hair from Nicolas Johnson the past few days about all this?

If what CM posted is true it means, the last set of boxes are descriptive and not prescriptive. What does that mean? The last box is where you tell the software what you're seeing (either by typing in or automatically?). It not an entry field for telling the software what you want. The RTG section says this what you should see. So it would mean one column is telling you what you should see in theory and the other column is the reality. If that is the case then, "Reset to RTG values" simply means I don't care about actual values, just use what RTG says.

The bolded statement is logically flawed.

 

[greasemonkey]

If what CM posted is true it means, the last set of boxes are descriptive and not prescriptive. What does that mean? The last box is where you tell the software what you're seeing (either by typing in or automatically?). It not an entry field for telling the software what you want. The RTG section says this what you should see. So it would mean one column is telling you what you should see in theory and the other column is the reality. If that is the case then, "Reset to RTG values" simply means I don't care about actual values, just use what RTG says.

The bolded statement is logically flawed.

So why is this tool needed for table games? I would assume there are hundreds of players per day playing dozens/hundreds/thousands of hands daily and in a fair random game you always have the game floating right around the statistical normal + or - 1 or 2%. So why are RTG's table games so far off from the statistical average that you need a tool like this to calculate how much a casino might win or lose on a bonus, unless the table games are not random in the first place and are a type of slot machine with a manually set payout %

If the screenshot only showed slot machine's and not table games I would not be concerned but including the table games makes you think twice.

This post sums it up. It would be a pointless box to put in what you are seeing.

BESIDES, you cannot see anything until AFTER the play has happened. This box is for setting up coupons. How do you know what your going to see with the coupons? It is not a logical function if you cannot do what the words say... and that is set house edge.