I've been holding off on publicising this issue partly out of kindness to Rival / Tradition on the very small chance they deserved the benefit of the doubt - and also partly out of deference to Vegas Regal who I previously considered to be one of the good guys, and I did not want the fallout from a likely rogue Rival casino to hurt the good Rival casinos in the way the RTG scandals hurt some very ethical RTG casinos a few years ago.
All my kindness, patience and concerns were unjustified. I have kindly and politely presented my turning cheek to be slapped by them over and over and over and they have obliged. The final straw was my delay in making the evidence of the stunning incidents public waiting on a response from Nicholas [VRC] who requested evidence if the issue "was really as bad as I claimed". I sent him that evidence reiterating that if there was likely to be negative fallout from Tradition's rogue actions, he should please let me know and it would temper all my actions from that point. I do not believe the innocent should suffer with the guilty - and it was my main concern to protect Vegas Regal and other seemingly ethical Rival casinos.
Those concerns were foolishly naive. In gratitude for my kindness, Nicholas did not respond to receipt of the screenshots, instead choosing to thank me by bonus-banning me on VRC [despite a playing history that includes MASSIVE action without any form of bonus included - splashing around on all games including Slots often with no bonus at all]. Thanks Nicholas - it is always wonderful to be slapped when you show someone undeserved kindness.
I am now forced to release all the evidence of Tradition / Rival rogue behaviour and incompetence. And I release this all not in vindictiveness, but with a measure of genuine sadness / despair.
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Over 4 days ago, I was playing Blackjack on Tradition casino for the first time [only the 2nd Rival casino I have tried and purely on recommendations in a thread here on CM - prior to this Vegas Regal had always behaved ethically and I was an ardent fan of theirs until a few hours ago]. I play very fast and I make a lot of mistakes but I play for fun. At one point in the session of lightning fast Blackjack play, I am stunned to notice a Blackjack is sitting there in front of me underpaid at 1:1 instead of 3:2.
I decide I must have entered some exotic variant of Blackjack and I check the rules. Nup, clear as day, Blackjack paid at 3:2. I immediately stop playing and contact Support to inform them there is a bug which is underpaying Blackjacks.
Here is the first Chat Transcript [there will be tiny editing here and there for Chat's and emails but purely to make them more readable as I type fast and ramble - I have the originals to all and can deliver them if required to prove any edits made purely for aesthetic reasons] - [also comments inserted by me now are in BLUE]:
I am confused by the fact he just killed the chat after a few minutes of looking. I obviously open up another Chat box immediately:
I have not seen a Live Chat that bad before. And predict perhaps there is a challenger to the Rome Live Chat of "I soooo likkeee youooo" weirdness.
I am quite concerned by this stage as by the time I was finished checking the rules to ensure I wasn't playing some exotic variant, a betting instruction box had concealed the Blackjack hand meaning I had no evidence if they came back with an attempt at lying just like they had done in Chat.
As they had tried to blatantly lie to me about the result of the hand in Live Chat, I was legitimately very worried they would respond with another attempt at lying - and I had no hard evidence apart from the very embarrassing 180 degree about-face the minute I claimed to have a screenshot as evidence.
About perhaps 5 or so hours, the fact that the cards were conveniently [no doubt coincidentally] concealed above was starting to concern me. So I went about trying to reproduce it if I could. It took only a few hands and I gasped to see another one - and I wondered in nausea how many underpayments had occurred when I'm smashing through hands at a rate most people would think only possible for some kind of robot [and I can YouTube myself doing it if no one believes this]. I was nauseous at that fact, but relieved that I now had a screenshot should they try to lie again.
After I think 10-15 hours where no one contacted me as promised [I assumed it would be their absolute No.1 priority to address such a bug - if indeed it was a bug - and shut down the game until it's fixed]. I opened up Tradition to ask for an update and was flabbergasted to see the Blackjack game was still open and in full operation with god knows how many players playing on a game I had kindly informed them was underpaying so many hours ago.
Angry at the thought of people getting ripped off by a game that should have been shut down INSTANTLY, I opened Live Chat for a third time to try and impress upon them their need to stop screwing around with this:
A very long period of time passes with zero attempts at contact from Tradition Casino or Rival. When I finally get an email from Tradition, only to discover they don't even mention the incidents or the fact that the game is still open and underpaying, I was stunned:
My politeness in my reply to the above is really quite surprising to me reading it now:
They did not. Dig. Some long period of time passes without any incoming contact from Tradition or Rival and I am now 100% certain that something very shady is going on. And my thoughts turn now to how I should handle release of such info when doing so will undoubtedly and unfairly damage "innocents" like Vegas Regal [who had done nothing but behave ethically until a few hours ago].
I decided I would PM Nicholas [VRC] with my concerns about potential damage to "the good guys using Rival software" and await his advice. Nicholas I am sorry for posting PM's but I am also sorry that my overt kindness and empathy was repaid in such a shocking way. I am also sorry that I cannot see how the situation can be other than a huge internal mess at Rival which affects all Rival casinos to the point of being rogue. It's just devastatingly sad more than anything else.
I was slightly disappointed in this response as I don't really have a huge problem - I am not a 'victim' here - I was very much worried about VRC being a victim if I posted the evidence of Tradition / Rival's shocking behaviour. But I realised for all Nicholas knew, I could just be a quack and let's face it, I'm making some pretty shocking allegations which would appear unlikely to an objective listener. Still, I would have thought he would show more concern about protecting VRC and get proactive to protect his brand. I decide to send him the evidence so he knows that something serious is going on.
In the meantime, furious that I've deposited into YET ANOTHER ROGUE CASINO and furious with the sheer blanket of silence in response to my continued polite requests for information to the point where I'm almost flirting with unethical behaviour in not publishing the evidence, I log on to my Tradition account to get more screenshots and burn away the [obviously worthless due to Tradition being rogue] accessible balance. I lose the $1000 in a few hands and only see one spot which is messed up - no Double option offered when I split 7's:
Nicholas never responded to my submitting all of the evidence to him with the kind offer of being sympathetic to any concerns he may have about unfair negative fallout on his brand. He thanked me by bonus-banning me on Vegas Regal Casino.
Thank you Nicholas. That is one effective way of shooting yourself in the foot when a friend attempts to assist you.
After 3 days of ignoring me whilst I attempt to help them and ask politely for explanations as to the errors themselves, the initial attempt to lie to me, and why they keep the game open when it's so obviously underpaying, I finally receive this insulting response from Tradition Casino - their FIRST mention of the incident since it first occurred and was reported to them:
At this point, my ability to be shocked by this whole thing was reaching it's climax. I could not believe - that - was their answer for all my questions and for the many incidents and it took them 3 days to come up with it. Again, reading my polite response written whilst exhausted, frustrated and half-asleep...surprises me now:
If I thought before I could no longer be surprised by these clowns, I was - in fact - proven wrong with their response an hour or 2 ago. Prepare to be shocked:
Expired Image
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I do not know whether they were actively attempting to steal only from me, or whether the "configuration problem" underpaid many thousands of Blackjack players in the last 3-4 days whilst they left it open in the face of my demands they close it until it's fixed, or if they are all crooks or perhaps just some crooks mixed up with some incompetents - and I'm not sure I really care all that much anymore.
I'm exhausted, I'm out of pocket, I've been lied to more often than if they were a Virtual casino, I've been punished with losing all bonuses and comps at the one casino who had always done the right thing by me and was my favourite online casino [in return for trying to help them] - and if the above is not Rogue, then we need to put Virtual back on the Accredited List. Because if the above is not Rogue....very little is.
All my kindness, patience and concerns were unjustified. I have kindly and politely presented my turning cheek to be slapped by them over and over and over and they have obliged. The final straw was my delay in making the evidence of the stunning incidents public waiting on a response from Nicholas [VRC] who requested evidence if the issue "was really as bad as I claimed". I sent him that evidence reiterating that if there was likely to be negative fallout from Tradition's rogue actions, he should please let me know and it would temper all my actions from that point. I do not believe the innocent should suffer with the guilty - and it was my main concern to protect Vegas Regal and other seemingly ethical Rival casinos.
Those concerns were foolishly naive. In gratitude for my kindness, Nicholas did not respond to receipt of the screenshots, instead choosing to thank me by bonus-banning me on VRC [despite a playing history that includes MASSIVE action without any form of bonus included - splashing around on all games including Slots often with no bonus at all]. Thanks Nicholas - it is always wonderful to be slapped when you show someone undeserved kindness.
I am now forced to release all the evidence of Tradition / Rival rogue behaviour and incompetence. And I release this all not in vindictiveness, but with a measure of genuine sadness / despair.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Over 4 days ago, I was playing Blackjack on Tradition casino for the first time [only the 2nd Rival casino I have tried and purely on recommendations in a thread here on CM - prior to this Vegas Regal had always behaved ethically and I was an ardent fan of theirs until a few hours ago]. I play very fast and I make a lot of mistakes but I play for fun. At one point in the session of lightning fast Blackjack play, I am stunned to notice a Blackjack is sitting there in front of me underpaid at 1:1 instead of 3:2.
I decide I must have entered some exotic variant of Blackjack and I check the rules. Nup, clear as day, Blackjack paid at 3:2. I immediately stop playing and contact Support to inform them there is a bug which is underpaying Blackjacks.
Here is the first Chat Transcript [there will be tiny editing here and there for Chat's and emails but purely to make them more readable as I type fast and ramble - I have the originals to all and can deliver them if required to prove any edits made purely for aesthetic reasons] - [also comments inserted by me now are in BLUE]:
Tradition / Rival Live Chat said:
I am confused by the fact he just killed the chat after a few minutes of looking. I obviously open up another Chat box immediately:
Tradition / Rival Live Chat said:
I have not seen a Live Chat that bad before. And predict perhaps there is a challenger to the Rome Live Chat of "I soooo likkeee youooo" weirdness.
I am quite concerned by this stage as by the time I was finished checking the rules to ensure I wasn't playing some exotic variant, a betting instruction box had concealed the Blackjack hand meaning I had no evidence if they came back with an attempt at lying just like they had done in Chat.
As they had tried to blatantly lie to me about the result of the hand in Live Chat, I was legitimately very worried they would respond with another attempt at lying - and I had no hard evidence apart from the very embarrassing 180 degree about-face the minute I claimed to have a screenshot as evidence.
About perhaps 5 or so hours, the fact that the cards were conveniently [no doubt coincidentally] concealed above was starting to concern me. So I went about trying to reproduce it if I could. It took only a few hands and I gasped to see another one - and I wondered in nausea how many underpayments had occurred when I'm smashing through hands at a rate most people would think only possible for some kind of robot [and I can YouTube myself doing it if no one believes this]. I was nauseous at that fact, but relieved that I now had a screenshot should they try to lie again.
After I think 10-15 hours where no one contacted me as promised [I assumed it would be their absolute No.1 priority to address such a bug - if indeed it was a bug - and shut down the game until it's fixed]. I opened up Tradition to ask for an update and was flabbergasted to see the Blackjack game was still open and in full operation with god knows how many players playing on a game I had kindly informed them was underpaying so many hours ago.
Angry at the thought of people getting ripped off by a game that should have been shut down INSTANTLY, I opened Live Chat for a third time to try and impress upon them their need to stop screwing around with this:
Tradition / Rival Live Chat said:
A very long period of time passes with zero attempts at contact from Tradition Casino or Rival. When I finally get an email from Tradition, only to discover they don't even mention the incidents or the fact that the game is still open and underpaying, I was stunned:
Tradition Casino email said:
My politeness in my reply to the above is really quite surprising to me reading it now:
My Email reply to the above said:
They did not. Dig. Some long period of time passes without any incoming contact from Tradition or Rival and I am now 100% certain that something very shady is going on. And my thoughts turn now to how I should handle release of such info when doing so will undoubtedly and unfairly damage "innocents" like Vegas Regal [who had done nothing but behave ethically until a few hours ago].
I decided I would PM Nicholas [VRC] with my concerns about potential damage to "the good guys using Rival software" and await his advice. Nicholas I am sorry for posting PM's but I am also sorry that my overt kindness and empathy was repaid in such a shocking way. I am also sorry that I cannot see how the situation can be other than a huge internal mess at Rival which affects all Rival casinos to the point of being rogue. It's just devastatingly sad more than anything else.
My initial PM to Nicolas Johnson said:
PM reply from Nicholas said:
I was slightly disappointed in this response as I don't really have a huge problem - I am not a 'victim' here - I was very much worried about VRC being a victim if I posted the evidence of Tradition / Rival's shocking behaviour. But I realised for all Nicholas knew, I could just be a quack and let's face it, I'm making some pretty shocking allegations which would appear unlikely to an objective listener. Still, I would have thought he would show more concern about protecting VRC and get proactive to protect his brand. I decide to send him the evidence so he knows that something serious is going on.
In the meantime, furious that I've deposited into YET ANOTHER ROGUE CASINO and furious with the sheer blanket of silence in response to my continued polite requests for information to the point where I'm almost flirting with unethical behaviour in not publishing the evidence, I log on to my Tradition account to get more screenshots and burn away the [obviously worthless due to Tradition being rogue] accessible balance. I lose the $1000 in a few hands and only see one spot which is messed up - no Double option offered when I split 7's:
My 2nd and final PM to Nicholas said:
Nicholas never responded to my submitting all of the evidence to him with the kind offer of being sympathetic to any concerns he may have about unfair negative fallout on his brand. He thanked me by bonus-banning me on Vegas Regal Casino.
Thank you Nicholas. That is one effective way of shooting yourself in the foot when a friend attempts to assist you.
After 3 days of ignoring me whilst I attempt to help them and ask politely for explanations as to the errors themselves, the initial attempt to lie to me, and why they keep the game open when it's so obviously underpaying, I finally receive this insulting response from Tradition Casino - their FIRST mention of the incident since it first occurred and was reported to them:
Tradition Casino email said:
At this point, my ability to be shocked by this whole thing was reaching it's climax. I could not believe - that - was their answer for all my questions and for the many incidents and it took them 3 days to come up with it. Again, reading my polite response written whilst exhausted, frustrated and half-asleep...surprises me now:
My response to the above - a final attempt to give them the benefit of the doubt and my final email to Tradition management said:
If I thought before I could no longer be surprised by these clowns, I was - in fact - proven wrong with their response an hour or 2 ago. Prepare to be shocked:
Expired Image
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I do not know whether they were actively attempting to steal only from me, or whether the "configuration problem" underpaid many thousands of Blackjack players in the last 3-4 days whilst they left it open in the face of my demands they close it until it's fixed, or if they are all crooks or perhaps just some crooks mixed up with some incompetents - and I'm not sure I really care all that much anymore.
I'm exhausted, I'm out of pocket, I've been lied to more often than if they were a Virtual casino, I've been punished with losing all bonuses and comps at the one casino who had always done the right thing by me and was my favourite online casino [in return for trying to help them] - and if the above is not Rogue, then we need to put Virtual back on the Accredited List. Because if the above is not Rogue....very little is.
] and all the Rivals turn out to be [as it so clearly - at least to me - appears likely or probable] simply rogue or incompetent. And that is still really sad....
I was actually completely sober for most of my 'drunk' SamD posts last couple days. I was just having some creative writing fun. 
