LeoVegas Affiliates - intrusive new terms

LeoVegas have been in contact with me over the past several weeks asking to see if I will work with them. On light of the above, the answer will be a resounding no.

These terms are ridiculous to the extreme. It seems that many affiliate programs feel they can get their affiliates to bend over in which ever position they desire. What is so bad about these terms are they are trying to 'legally' act criminally.

The thing is, these terms will force a number of affiliates to close their accounts because they are way too intrusive, and they threaten their "partners" with fines of €50K if they are non-compliant. If this is the case, the casino program should be forced to close the accounts of the affiliates referred players and placed on a never-contact list. That would be the fair and reasonable thing to do.

And at the same time they are enabling trademark theft. I should be fining them.
 
Leo Vegas is reviewed at Casinomeister
Gets Better

To prove compliance I've been advised that I need to take screen shots of every page where Leo Vegas is mentioned and send them to their Legal Dept.

For me this will amount to 100's of pages!!

I'm trying to get them to consider a more sensible approach. If not my days of promoting them will be over.
 
Hey Bryan,

We have now been removed from the site referenced in the thread.

@Colinsunderland - To say we don't care is kind of tough, we have done a lot to clean up our act in the last few months, as you know.

With regards to the URL's you sent to me, we did contact those affiliates but an oversight on my part meant we did not follow up. Accept my apologies, I am now on it.

Best Regards
Stephen
 
Like Neil, I was also asked to send screenshots of every place I am promoting LeoVegas. WTF?

I sent them a complete list of URLs, but I guess they didn't like that I was able to comply so quickly. I guess they really want to close my account and steal my players.

Ridiculous requests, ridiculous new terms -- time to start preparing their rogue listing.
 
Back to the main issue at hand, how am I (or any other affiliate) supposed to agree to these invasive terms? Why am I forced to agree to these terms to even check my stats?

What gives them any legal precedence or rights to "inspect my books" or threaten me with a Euro 50k fine?

I am asking them to respond to this thread.
 
No private business is ever going to agree to these types of terms. They're demanding access to highly sensitive company performance information and giving themselves the right to act as judge and jury with regard to imposing fines on another business.

These are a 100% no-go terms - some of the worst I've seen over the last few years and I've reviewed a LOT of aff program terms and conditions.

Does anyone want to take wagers on the likes of Catena Media agreeing to these terms? (Wait, I'd need a gambling license to offer any sort of book......)

TP
 
Does anyone want to take wagers on the likes of Catena Media agreeing to these terms? (Wait, I'd need a gambling license to offer any sort of book......)

TP

I wouldn't worry about the license. Pay them enough money and Catena will advertise your book anyway, for €5,000 you can even have a featured post on the AskG homepage for a day ;-)
 
I wouldn't worry about the license. Pay them enough money and Catena will advertise your book anyway, for €5,000 you can even have a featured post on the AskG homepage for a day ;-)

I'm passing no comment on the advertising policies in place for Catena Media properties. I've little doubt LeoVegas will continue to be listed at AG. However, I would wager our site's gross income for the month (and feel very comfortable about doing so) that said listing will continue without these terms. The point is that the contract will be modified for the big players that would simply tell the operator where to get off.

TP
 
Hi All.

Hope everyone is well and apologies on the delay in response.

In regards to issues raised with our new affiliate terms, we take all feedback from our partners very seriously. Although we suggest, that if you want a quick and individual response to your concerns you can reach out to your appointed Affiliate Manager or to affiliateteam@leovegas.com.

Regarding t&c’s Clause 4.2 regarding the audit right is there in order to ensure that you comply with any requests that we may have for information on your practices which we as partners may require throughout the business relationship, for instance information on your data protection routines which we may have to disclose to the relevant authorities, among others. In relation to the imposition of a fine – naturally we have no intention of applying this fine unless absolutely necessary and even in these cases we see the fine as a deterrent rather than something we will impose arbitrarily. If you have any concerns we advise you to reach out to your affiliate manager that can set you into contact with our legal department who will be happy to answer any further questions you may have.

UK general Regarding the UK regulations recently, as outlined in our UK guidance email, we are as operators, held fully responsible for everything our partners communicate in our name. That means that we need to do a due diligence of our partners and ensure that we only work with the ones that share our commitment to compliance, and that we can trust are totally compliant now and going forward. That also includes having a close and trustworthy relationship with our partner an ongoing dialogue regarding these matters. Our partners will still be rewarded for existing players in rev share deals, but we have paused the accounts for new traffic. To us, this is the most fair and pragmatic way of acting in light of the changing regulatory landscape in the UK.

Regards,
James
 
Hi All.

Hope everyone is well and apologies on the delay in response.

In regards to issues raised with our new affiliate terms, we take all feedback from our partners very seriously. Although we suggest, that if you want a quick and individual response to your concerns you can reach out to your appointed Affiliate Manager or to affiliateteam@leovegas.com.

Regarding t&c’s Clause 4.2 regarding the audit right is there in order to ensure that you comply with any requests that we may have for information on your practices which we as partners may require throughout the business relationship, for instance information on your data protection routines which we may have to disclose to the relevant authorities, among others. In relation to the imposition of a fine – naturally we have no intention of applying this fine unless absolutely necessary and even in these cases we see the fine as a deterrent rather than something we will impose arbitrarily. If you have any concerns we advise you to reach out to your affiliate manager that can set you into contact with our legal department who will be happy to answer any further questions you may have.

UK general Regarding the UK regulations recently, as outlined in our UK guidance email, we are as operators, held fully responsible for everything our partners communicate in our name. That means that we need to do a due diligence of our partners and ensure that we only work with the ones that share our commitment to compliance, and that we can trust are totally compliant now and going forward. That also includes having a close and trustworthy relationship with our partner an ongoing dialogue regarding these matters. Our partners will still be rewarded for existing players in rev share deals, but we have paused the accounts for new traffic. To us, this is the most fair and pragmatic way of acting in light of the changing regulatory landscape in the UK.

Regards,
James

Why exactly would you want to examine my books?
 
Our partners will still be rewarded for existing players in rev share deals, but we have paused the accounts for new traffic. To us, this is the most fair and pragmatic way of acting in light of the changing regulatory landscape in the UK.

James
What does that bolded part mean???
Sounds like you are saying that if the affiliate has not agreed to your new terms, that any players they send will NOT be linked to their affy account...! :eek:

KK
 
Hi All.

Hope everyone is well and apologies on the delay in response.

In regards to issues raised with our new affiliate terms, we take all feedback from our partners very seriously. Although we suggest, that if you want a quick and individual response to your concerns you can reach out to your appointed Affiliate Manager or to affiliateteam@leovegas.com.

Regarding t&c’s Clause 4.2 regarding the audit right is there in order to ensure that you comply with any requests that we may have for information on your practices which we as partners may require throughout the business relationship, for instance information on your data protection routines which we may have to disclose to the relevant authorities, among others. In relation to the imposition of a fine – naturally we have no intention of applying this fine unless absolutely necessary and even in these cases we see the fine as a deterrent rather than something we will impose arbitrarily. If you have any concerns we advise you to reach out to your affiliate manager that can set you into contact with our legal department who will be happy to answer any further questions you may have.

UK general Regarding the UK regulations recently, as outlined in our UK guidance email, we are as operators, held fully responsible for everything our partners communicate in our name. That means that we need to do a due diligence of our partners and ensure that we only work with the ones that share our commitment to compliance, and that we can trust are totally compliant now and going forward. That also includes having a close and trustworthy relationship with our partner an ongoing dialogue regarding these matters. Our partners will still be rewarded for existing players in rev share deals, but we have paused the accounts for new traffic. To us, this is the most fair and pragmatic way of acting in light of the changing regulatory landscape in the UK.

Regards,
James

James, to be blunt, extremely blunt, this is complete BULLSHIT. Forget taking this to PM, Email, or anywhere else but a public forum like CM. Let's keep this out in the open, as many many affiliates visit this forum and will want to know exactly what Leo Vegas's thinking is with these terms.

Clause 4.2: This is not down to an individual operator to decide. If you are talking about GDPR Compliance, which I expect you are. This is down to the ICO to police. Affiliates need to be compliant of course, if they handle any data of players, but it is not down to individual affiliate programs to police.

The only people other than the accountant of an affiliate who has the right to audit their books, or the books of any other company, is the taxman of the jurisdiction where the affiliate is based. Leo Vegas and any other programme can talk to the hand.

With regards to a fine from Leo Vegas. Please get out of town with that one. I am currently in litigation with an affiliate programme and that there you are trying to impose in your T & C's is the kind of crap as to why I am taking a programme to court. It is complete bollocks, unfair and predatory.

As to your last point. If affiliate programs such as your own one had even bothered to police their affiliates in the first place, perhaps, the UKGC would not have been handing out massive fines. Sorry, but a lot of the programs have brought this on themselves. After all you guys were listed on that site Bryan referenced ripping off his trademark. Some due diligence there!

Sorry but your actions on this are nothing short of rogue.
 
I can't log in anyway - getting this error when I click on "Log-In":

"Server Error in '/affiliates' Application.
Runtime Error
Description: An exception occurred while processing your request. Additionally, another exception occurred while executing the custom error page for the first exception. The request has been terminated.
"

KK :(
 
If affiliate programs such as your own one had even bothered to police their affiliates in the first place, perhaps, the UKGC would not have been handing out massive fines. Sorry, but a lot of the programs have brought this on themselves.

I'm not an affiliate in any shape or form. But I couldn't agree more.

It seems like casinos have previously been willing to take on absolutely anyone who could throw a webpage together.

Maybe it's time for casinos to start running their affiliate programs by the standards set by the UKGC, for ALL affiliates, NOT just the UK facing ones.
 
And James, why is the LeoVegas legal department asking for screenshots of every point of exposure instead of visiting the URLs to see for themselves? I sent my list of URLs to Martin and Gloria, and then Martin told me that I need to take screenshots and send that to him instead. That's hundreds and hundreds of screenshots -- gigabytes of data.

Why are you asking for that? Why aren't you able to visit the URLs and do a quick check like literally every other program that has asked me to see where they are being promoted?

Edited to add: I can't log in now, either.
 
On the 1st of November I emailed your team with question regarding compliance.
No response.
I have emailed a few time since but am getting nowhere.

Furthermore it is now 29th of November and still I have not been provided with the holy grail T&C link that has been talked about for months.

Perhaps you want to get off your high horses at Leo Vegas and start complying to the rules yourselves. It is inexcusable that t&c links are not there yet.
 
Hi All.

Hope everyone is well and apologies on the delay in response.

In regards to issues raised with our new affiliate terms, we take all feedback from our partners very seriously. Although we suggest, that if you want a quick and individual response to your concerns you can reach out to your appointed Affiliate Manager or to affiliateteam@leovegas.com.

Regarding t&c’s Clause 4.2 regarding the audit right is there in order to ensure that you comply with any requests that we may have for information on your practices which we as partners may require throughout the business relationship, for instance information on your data protection routines which we may have to disclose to the relevant authorities, among others. In relation to the imposition of a fine – naturally we have no intention of applying this fine unless absolutely necessary and even in these cases we see the fine as a deterrent rather than something we will impose arbitrarily. If you have any concerns we advise you to reach out to your affiliate manager that can set you into contact with our legal department who will be happy to answer any further questions you may have.

UK general Regarding the UK regulations recently, as outlined in our UK guidance email, we are as operators, held fully responsible for everything our partners communicate in our name. That means that we need to do a due diligence of our partners and ensure that we only work with the ones that share our commitment to compliance, and that we can trust are totally compliant now and going forward. That also includes having a close and trustworthy relationship with our partner an ongoing dialogue regarding these matters. Our partners will still be rewarded for existing players in rev share deals, but we have paused the accounts for new traffic. To us, this is the most fair and pragmatic way of acting in light of the changing regulatory landscape in the UK.

Regards,
James

Hi James,

I appreciate that there's been big shifts in what is deemed acceptable behaviour for operators in the last few months and that operators are having to alter the way they're managing affiliates to meet these new requirements. I'm broadly in support of tightening up the affiliate operator relationship as some operators have been working with affiliates that are frankly shockingly immoral in their practices.

That said, some degree of common sense has to be used in the determination of what the new rules are. The terms highlighted in this thread are knee-jerk in nature, not mirrored by your competition and look to give you as the operator such sweeping powers that no business in their right mind would choose to enter into such an agreement.

You're right to put in place terms to ensure that affiliates engage reasonable procedures to ensure the DPA is adhered to. If an affiliate is found to have failed in that duty you're right to terminate said contract. Demanding blanket rights to review the books of every business that works with you is a long way off reasonable.

Fines - you're now asking your partners to subject themselves to your judgement of whether or not rules have been adhered to when you also give yourselves a massive financial incentive to find affiliates in breach? I appreciate your legal team may view this as a protectionist measure that will help protect your business, but your asking affiliates to take on massive risk to meet that.

When putting in place these sorts of policies attention and care has to be taken to ensure that they are reasonable and balanced. In their present incarnation I'm not sure any objective observer would view these terms in that manner.

I'm actually in the process of trying to clear an old complaint issue that has prevented us working with LeoVegas for the last few years, but as long as these terms remain in their current format resolving the complaint won't make any difference....

TP
 
Hi All.

Hope everyone is well and apologies on the delay in response.

In regards to issues raised with our new affiliate terms, we take all feedback from our partners very seriously. Although we suggest, that if you want a quick and individual response to your concerns you can reach out to your appointed Affiliate Manager or to affiliateteam@leovegas.com.

Regarding t&c’s Clause 4.2 regarding the audit right is there in order to ensure that you comply with any requests that we may have for information on your practices which we as partners may require throughout the business relationship, for instance information on your data protection routines which we may have to disclose to the relevant authorities, among others. In relation to the imposition of a fine – naturally we have no intention of applying this fine unless absolutely necessary and even in these cases we see the fine as a deterrent rather than something we will impose arbitrarily. If you have any concerns we advise you to reach out to your affiliate manager that can set you into contact with our legal department who will be happy to answer any further questions you may have.

UK general Regarding the UK regulations recently, as outlined in our UK guidance email, we are as operators, held fully responsible for everything our partners communicate in our name. That means that we need to do a due diligence of our partners and ensure that we only work with the ones that share our commitment to compliance, and that we can trust are totally compliant now and going forward. That also includes having a close and trustworthy relationship with our partner an ongoing dialogue regarding these matters. Our partners will still be rewarded for existing players in rev share deals, but we have paused the accounts for new traffic. To us, this is the most fair and pragmatic way of acting in light of the changing regulatory landscape in the UK.

Regards,
James

Hi James,

You really haven't addressed what is going on here. You want your affiliates to agree to something no one in their right mind would agree to.

This is not being dealt with fairly in any sense of the word. This is a binding contract - so it claims to be. And the language is more than just aggressive, it is insulting to those affiliates who have been adhering to ethical business standards since day one. You can save terms like these for the affiliates who have been screwing up this industry for the past couple of decades. Your company, along with numerous others, should take blame for lackadaisical vetting of your affiliates. This is your doing, not ours.

You say that the Euro 50K fine is there to deter violators of your terms - how about doing some due diligence instead? It's a lazy way out. And the whole idea that you would be granted access to our database, "books", or anything else here is not only laughable but is just plain arrogant in my opinion.

Sites like Casinomeister are putting reputations at stake for promoting companies like yours. This is not how we are to be treated.
 
Regards, James

James,

Your team have provided no feedback for a month.

Your team have refused to comply with ASA and UKGC regulations regarding providing the necessary T&C links.

Your team refuses to provide any response to the request for such T&C links.

Your team only sends the link to the UKGC page and provide no comments at all regarding compliance.

It is blatantly obvious that you are not checking any websites for compliance and simply want to pull a fast one on affiliates. And let us not forget that without affiliates your company would have never grown to where it is today. But now you are huge you have clearly decided just to dump your partners uncerimoniously. There is clearly very little difference between the actions of Leo Vegas and the controversial actions of the likes of Sky. It is just that Leo is pretending to be even higher and mightier and holier than thou.
 
James,

There is clearly very little difference between the actions of Leo Vegas and the controversial actions of the likes of Sky.

Oh there is. The actions of Leo Vegas is worse in my opinion. Not only do they want to shut down the accounts of affiliates, but they also want to be able to fine them €50k as well. :mad:
 
Oh there is. The actions of Leo Vegas is worse in my opinion. Not only do they want to shut down the accounts of affiliates, but they also want to be able to fine them €50k as well. :mad:

Agreed.
Sky were rogued for putting a min quota of 6 customers or commission would be dropped to 5%, I would suggest a £50k fine would cost most affiliates more than the 20% drop would. Add to that the fact they also want the right to inspect your books, and you can guess where I think they belong if they don't change these new terms.
 

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