is romecasino rogue?

sandykauf

Banned User - violation of posting rules 1.1, 1.6,
Joined
May 2, 2011
Location
fort washington
I was just reading on gg how this casino ripped a player off for about $2300. They
Used the tactic of returning the players deposits and keeping the winnings. Thereb
Are about 6 or 7 complaints against them on that site, yet they advertise and promote
Them. That seems very strange to me.

Their not listed on this site as rogue but have some good bonuses. I actually would
Be very nervous about playing there because they sure look rogue to me.
 

Nifty29

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2001
Location
Turn right, then right. then right again
I was just reading on gg how this casino ripped a player off for about $2300. They
Used the tactic of returning the players deposits and keeping the winnings. Thereb
Are about 6 or 7 complaints against them on that site, yet they advertise and promote
Them. That seems very strange to me.

Their not listed on this site as rogue but have some good bonuses. I actually would
Be very nervous about playing there because they sure look rogue to me.


I think your "spidey sense" is working well.

You should follow your gut instinct.

I also think.its odd that GG still promotes them, but they have explained that the GG service is seperate from their advertising, and its their business so good luck to them.

Rome has a history of huge payment delays, which suddenly seem to vanish when a complaint is lodged and they get paid immediately. So, if you win, be prepared to go into battle to get paid.
 

Diane

Ueber Meister
Joined
Dec 20, 2009
Location
WI
I was just reading on gg how this casino ripped a player off for about $2300. They
Used the tactic of returning the players deposits and keeping the winnings. Thereb
Are about 6 or 7 complaints against them on that site, yet they advertise and promote
Them. That seems very strange to me.

Their not listed on this site as rogue but have some good bonuses. I actually would
Be very nervous about playing there because they sure look rogue to me.

There is a rep for Rome casino who follows this forum. Send him a PM with your concerns. I think there were issues a while ago, but I think (check for yourself don't just take my word) things are much better now.

If you like Top Game -- try Diamond VIP casino. I have never played at Rome or Diceland the affiliated Rome casinos. But Diamond VIP is great.

Diane
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
PABinit
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
Rome casino is similar to Rushmore. Its off-on and then off with regard to payments so if you patronise them its a huge gamble in itself. I think GG advertises them because they have successfully mediated with them for several players in the past.
 

sandykauf

Banned User - violation of posting rules 1.1, 1.6,
Joined
May 2, 2011
Location
fort washington
I can understand very infrequent mediations, but romecasino has a lot of them. That
Raises a lot of red flags even if they eventually paid. It seems like their original intent
Is not to pay and hope the player does'nt complain on a public forum.

The top game casinos seem like rtg where there may be some that are good but others bad. I think rome can't be trusted after reading everything. It's just another problem
With online play and lack of consistency. Seems like the entire industry is at all time low in terms of quality, reliability and trust. Personally, I don't see anything getting better
Until one thing happens...regulation.
 

Nate

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
webmeister
CAG
PABinit
Joined
Feb 14, 2007
Location
Cyberspace
https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...asnt-paid-me-in-8-weeks-owes-me-13-200.46591/

The above thread was from a week or two ago. I posed Noah some very straight forward questions and he did not respond to any of them. I also believe that they are rogued at other gaming related websites. Unless Noah can come on and clarify some questions with straight forward answers, I personally WILL NOT Trust them...

Nate
 

sandykauf

Banned User - violation of posting rules 1.1, 1.6,
Joined
May 2, 2011
Location
fort washington
So if you need to be prepared for a "battle" upon cashout, why aren't they rogued on
This website? Gg states that you should'nt even spend a penny there unless you first
Send them all your security documents and wait for them to ok the paperwork. It sounds like this method isn't 100% either.

I guess what I'm trying to findout is how a casino gets on the rogue list here. If I only visited this site there would be no warning against them, but upon further research on other sites they definitely appear dishonest. I guess that's why it's good to do thorough
Research before depositing online anywhere.
 

Mousey

Ueber Meister Mouse
Joined
Sep 12, 2004
Location
Up$hitCreek
There are other Top Game casinos in various sections of the Rogue page. Also Top Game itself is in the Blunders and somethingorother list. Do searches for specific casino names here in the forums.

As to specifics regarding how a casino ends up in the Rogue Pit... maybe a question to Bryan or Max would provide more details for you.
 

maxd

PAB (Complaints) Manager
Staff member
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Location
Saltirelandia
... maybe a question to Bryan or Max would provide more details for you.

Actually I expect we'd have somewhat different answers to that question. Though it's probably safe to say that we'd both tell you that how any given casino is listed on other sites has bugger all to do with how you'll find it listed here. Almost without exception we base our conclusions on our own efforts and/or experiences with the casino in question.

As to actually listing a site in the Rogue Pit, that's totally Bryan's call. I give him feedback from the PABs I work on but my input generally stops there.
 

Seventh777

RIP Roy
Joined
Sep 28, 2010
Location
Planet Tharg, dark side, where nothing grows.
If you like Top Game slots etc Crazy Slots Club has just re-opened using this software, as you may remember they were part of the English Harbour group and were named just Crazy Slots then. If their integrity is still as it used to be then there should be np`s there, I will personally be keeping a beady eye out on them as imho when TG slots are in loose mode they really take some beating, and would love a 100% trouble free TG site to play at once again ;).

Just wish groups like 32Red would invest (if possible) into some of these rogue enticing software`s - RTG, Rival, Top Game, i`m sure if they did they would corner the market, hell if I was the owner of any of these brands and 32Red wanted to opt in I would give them the licence for free, would be awesome having the option of other brands of slots at 32Red also;).
 

beavo040

Dormant Account
Joined
Jul 4, 2011
Location
Arizona
Personally, I haven't had the same negative experiences getting paid, like so many others out there. That's mostly due to the fact, that shortly(1 day) after I had registered with them, I was locked out. Why? Good question. The day I registered, I asked about a ten dollar free chip that was advertised, they asked me to hold for a 'sec'.....40 minutes later, different rep, he says, 'one moment'.......30 minutes later.....still no reply. Thought maybe I was having issues with my firewall or security settings(as this has happened in the past). Logged back in the following day, told rep what happened, thinking I might actually get somewhere..........lol.........he says, 'hold on a minute', then BAM!, locked out. With customer service like that, I'm glad I didn't just deposit and start playing. Couldn't imagine what it would be like trying to withdrawl without them saying "F-U" and locking you out of the account. Seemed excessively shady to me, which prompted me to not only uninstall the software, but to re-install a clean OS on my PC.(only because I was dumb enough to mess with my firewall while connected to them). Definitely didn't trust them after the way I was treated~
 

Diane

Ueber Meister
Joined
Dec 20, 2009
Location
WI
If you like Top Game slots etc Crazy Slots Club has just re-opened using this software, as you may remember they were part of the English Harbour group and were named just Crazy Slots then. If their integrity is still as it used to be then there should be np`s there, I will personally be keeping a beady eye out on them as imho when TG slots are in loose mode they really take some beating, and would love a 100% trouble free TG site to play at once again ;).

Just wish groups like 32Red would invest (if possible) into some of these rogue enticing software`s - RTG, Rival, Top Game, i`m sure if they did they would corner the market, hell if I was the owner of any of these brands and 32Red wanted to opt in I would give them the licence for free, would be awesome having the option of other brands of slots at 32Red also;).

sent you a PM on my opinion........

Diane
 

Casinomeister

Forum Cheermeister
Staff member
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
So if you need to be prepared for a "battle" upon cashout, why aren't they rogued on
This website? Gg states that you should'nt even spend a penny there unless you first
Send them all your security documents and wait for them to ok the paperwork. It sounds like this method isn't 100% either.

I guess what I'm trying to findout is how a casino gets on the rogue list here. If I only visited this site there would be no warning against them, but upon further research on other sites they definitely appear dishonest. I guess that's why it's good to do thorough
Research before depositing online anywhere.
Could we please stop referring to Gambling Grumbles as GG. GG has always been GoneGambling. Gambling Grumbles was a part of Gambling.com and never its own entity.

Rome casino has had it's share of issues here., but as far as I know most if not all have been resolved. If there are any unresolved or outstanding complaints, then they need to be made known to either the casino reps or me.
 

RomeCasino

Banned User -violation of forum policies of i-Gami
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Location
Costa Rica
From Noah

I was just reading on gg how this casino ripped a player off for about $2300. They
Used the tactic of returning the players deposits and keeping the winnings. Thereb
Are about 6 or 7 complaints against them on that site, yet they advertise and promote
Them. That seems very strange to me.

Their not listed on this site as rogue but have some good bonuses. I actually would
Be very nervous about playing there because they sure look rogue to me.

Hello everyone,

I'm sorry I didn't see this until now. I'd like to first say I'm always available to be PM'd or emailed ([email protected]) should you have any questions.

beavo040 - I'm sorry to hear of the technical difficulties you had. If you give me your user ID at the Casino I can try and find out what the problem was.


OK, so I guess I'm not going to be very popular on this thread, seeing your posts, but I will explain, to the best of my abilities, the Casino's side of things.

The report on GG referes to a player who has 3 counts of fraud or attempt to fraud on their credit card.

We as a Casino get AT LEAST 20 fraudsters a day, 90% of those are serial chargebackers that change cards and banks often, change ID's, fake new ones etc. We have to be on guard all the time. That is the purpose of companies like this one. They report fraud activities made by players at other gaming institutes. We have to trust their report otherwise there is no use in using them. We cannot take the risk of accepting players with fraud history because if we did then we'd be defrauded 18 times a day.

So when the risk department gets a report like this one, they cut all connections with the player, return any deposits and yes void winnings. Voiding winnings is the problem here, I understand, but also understand that if any fraudster uses this method they can just play to win and if they win they take it home and if they lose they chargeback. Here the player is saying the opposite, that if she won we would make up her fraud history and if she lost we wouldn't say anything.

Now I know you've seen some complaints about us but honestly, 99% of those are withdrawal delay complaints, because frankly we did have some strong delays lately due to processor complications, as happens with the US banking market at times.

You have not really seen reports of this kind all over the place because this is something that rarely needs to be done, the report is usually much quicker. If the casino did that with every player that won there wouldn't be a casino left. So obviously this isn't a common practice, but we also will not send the message that its ok to defraud and that we will cooperate with any player that does so. The player may maintain her position that no such thing occured, but this company specilizes in this and they are very reliable. Obviously this wasn't a popular decision and of course the player told us she will post everywhere, and she has. It still did not change our policy. and I can only repeat our position, as unpopular as it may have been, and hope I have explained why this occured.

Kind Regards,

Noah
 
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Casinomeister

Forum Cheermeister
Staff member
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
...I guess what I'm trying to findout is how a casino gets on the rogue list here...
"With great power comes great responsibility." Not that I'm Spiderman, but the Rogue pit can have that sort of power, especilly to the smaller operations that depend on affiliate marketing and word of mouth to keep its operation afloat. When a casino gets tossed into the Rogue pit, for whatever reason, I make sure that reason is a good one.

As I mentioned before, Rome Casino has had its problems, but they never made it into the pit. When problems are presented, I do my due diligence to ensure the problems are legit. Only on rare circumstance will I ever base a rogue listing on something that happens elsewhere from Casinomeister. When you assume - you know what happens (ass = u + me)

And can we please refer to Gambling Grumbles as Gambling Grumbles? GG is GoneGambling - an entirely different website. Thanks! :thumbsup:
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
Hello everyone,

I'm sorry I didn't see this until now. I'd like to first say I'm always available to be PM'd or emailed ([email protected]) should you have any questions.

beavo040 - I'm sorry to hear of the technical difficulties you had. If you give me your user ID at the Casino I can try and find out what the problem was.


OK, so I guess I'm not going to be very popular on this thread, seeing your posts, but I will explain, to the best of my abilities, the Casino's side of things.

The report on GG referes to a player who has 3 counts of fraud or attempt to fraud on their credit card.

We as a Casino get AT LEAST 20 fraudsters a day, 90% of those are serial chargebackers that change cards and banks often, change ID's, fake new ones etc. We have to be on guard all the time. That is the purpose of companies like this one. They report fraud activities made by players at other gaming institutes. We have to trust their report otherwise there is no use in using them. We cannot take the risk of accepting players with fraud history because if we did then we'd be defrauded 18 times a day.

So when the risk department gets a report like this one, they cut all connections with the player, return any deposits and yes void winnings. Voiding winnings is the problem here, I understand, but also understand that if any fraudster uses this method they can just play to win and if they win they take it home and if they lose they chargeback. Here the player is saying the opposite, that if she won we would make up her fraud history and if she lost we wouldn't say anything.

Now I know you've seen some complaints about us but honestly, 99% of those are withdrawal delay complaints, because frankly we did have some strong delays lately due to processor complications, as happens with the US banking market at times.

You have not really seen reports of this kind all over the place because this is something that rarely needs to be done, the report is usually much quicker. If the casino did that with every player that won there wouldn't be a casino left. So obviously this isn't a common practice, but we also will not send the message that its ok to defraud and that we will cooperate with any player that does so. The player may maintain her position that no such thing occured, but this company specilizes in this and they are very reliable. Obviously this wasn't a popular decision and of course the player told us she will post everywhere, and she has. It still did not change our policy. and I can only repeat our position, as unpopular as it may have been, and hope I have explained why this occured.

Kind Regards,

Noah


One problem with this is the lack of an appeal process. These fraudsters know what they are doing, BUT they are also likely to be stealing genuine IDs, so how can you be certain the RIGHT person has been caught. Often the first someone knows about their ID being stolen is when something goes wrong. Normally, there is an appeal process provided by their own country through regulations applied to credit reference agencies. This problem is actually quite common, so much so that the UK government has launched various campaigns designed to teach us to be on our guard against our ID getting stolen and used for crime.

It is worryingly easy to get a credit card in someone else's name. I actually met one such fraudster before I was into online gambling. He was on the M6, and had a card in a different name to his own. he said he was able to get it because banks sent a pre-filled application to an address that the intended recipient had vacated, and this chap now had access to. He simply signed the form and the bank sent the card. Since this was down to "junk mail", there was no means for the genuine owner of the ID to place a stop on such mailings, since they are "opt out" rather than "opt in".

Sloppy banks are one reason why fraudsters so easily get cards in fake or stolen names, but the genuine person is just as much a victim as the merchant. Some of these players are therefore likely to be genuine, and have no reason to believe anything other than the casino has deliberately ripped them off. The lack of information, even charges, issued to the player means that they may not even suspect they could be a victim of ID theft, so don't think to check their credit files.

I was careful with this chap I met, because he began to take an unhealthy interest in the design of my card. Despite this, he somehow managed to fraudulently use it even though it never left my sight, and I made sure any receipts were destroyed, even though the full number was not displayed.

The card company couldn't figure out WTF happened, and claimed it was "administrative error" on the part of the service station operator.

It wouldn't surprise me if this chap has now moved on to doing the same with online casinos. Others I met regularly playing the machines were more than happy to "grass" on him.

Of course, the man who used to live at the address was a VICTIM, because this card was in his name, and eventually (after a month or two of non-payment) the bank would track him down for their money.

Those who commit this type of fraud will often make the minimum payments on the cards so as not to arouse the bank's suspicions, and only when they have maxed it out will they ditch it and stop paying. This means a stolen or fraudulent card can last for MONTHS undetected by the banking system.

Within the UK, when someone is suspected of having a black mark against them from a credit reference agency, the company concerned is obliged to name it so that the customer can check their credit file and make sure it is accurate. They are NOT obliged to go into further detail.

Any player who is accused of fraud and believes it is wrong should check their credit files to see if they have become the unwitting victim of ID theft. If they have, ignoring the early signs means the fraudsters can do much more damage in the long run.

Fraudsters will simply let it go and try again, hence the lack of complaints from most of them. Where the sum to be had is significant though, a fraudster will make more of an effort, often resorting to blackmail. They will also be reluctant to allow respected third parties to intervene on their behalf, as they will know they cannot win, and may be "outed" and lose any support gained via campaigns on internet forums.

It seems to me that these Fraudsters are going to Gambling Grumbles rather than CM because they have found out that information that cannot be made public is not used in determining what is placed on the report, and also know that the operator will not give permission for it to be made public. This means that Gambling Grumbles can be used as a tool by fraudsters to further their cause by placing even greater pressure on the operator to give in to the blackmail.

This latest case proves the point, as a PAB would have resulted in him being "outed" and permanently banned from here, but a favourable Gambling Grumbles report will make it seem the casino is behaving in a rogue manner.

The problem is the banking system, it is too easy to get "fake" cards that can be maxed out and ditched. This case seems to be one where the fraudster PRETENDS that their card has been lost, stolen, or misused, so is able to get a chargeback fairly easily on the basis of the money having been stolen, which means the usual dispute resolution process whereby the merchant can dispute a claim, say, for faulty goods or services, is not necessarily applied.

The economic problems have at least made banks more careful about dishing out cards, but this is to save THEIR asses, not those of the merchants.

For casinos, the problem is the delay between the player registering, and them finding out about the fraud reported from elsewhere. This means thay have to void winnings after the fact, rather than lock the player out before they even get a chance to play.
 

sandykauf

Banned User - violation of posting rules 1.1, 1.6,
Joined
May 2, 2011
Location
fort washington

  1. There is no appeal process for the player which makes the casino judge and jury.
    That is one of the most serious problems in online gaming. Rome casino decided this
    Player may be a fraud but doesn't have to prove it. They just take the winnings. I've stopped playing at online casinos because this attitude of the casino doing whatever they want just disgusts me. I deposit now at sportsbooks that I check out on sportsbook review.

    I doubt I will go back to playing online casinos until its regulated. Places like romecasino
    Hurt the entire industry and make people want to just stop depositing due to unethical practices. I have never once heard of a casino refunding a players losses...only will refund the winners! Just fraud in reverse.
 

RomeCasino

Banned User -violation of forum policies of i-Gami
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Location
Costa Rica
From Noah


  1. There is no appeal process for the player which makes the casino judge and jury.
    That is one of the most serious problems in online gaming. Rome casino decided this
    Player may be a fraud but doesn't have to prove it. They just take the winnings. I've stopped playing at online casinos because this attitude of the casino doing whatever they want just disgusts me. I deposit now at sportsbooks that I check out on sportsbook review.

    I doubt I will go back to playing online casinos until its regulated. Places like romecasino
    Hurt the entire industry and make people want to just stop depositing due to unethical practices. I have never once heard of a casino refunding a players losses...only will refund the winners! Just fraud in reverse.


  1. Hi Sandykauf,

    There WAS an appeal process after Joyce approached us again with the help of gambling grumbles. We r- checked all facts for days, making sure we got it straight.

    The fact is that its amazingly easy to make new ID's or get new credit cards or change your name a bit on the account. We usually don't get any prior warning that we're dealing with fraud, and when we do its usually just the tip of a very large iceberg. So when we find a history of fraud in most cases its a part of a much bigger history. We want no dealings with anyone who has committed fraud against other gambling establishments or at all for that matter.

    Kind Regards,

    Noah
 

sandykauf

Banned User - violation of posting rules 1.1, 1.6,
Joined
May 2, 2011
Location
fort washington
Did you ever present these so called findings of fact to the winning player so that
They could present their case? Don't bother to answer because I already know you didn't...none of the casinos do this because they're in an unregulated environment.

In the u.s., you would be sued and have to present evidence in your defense. Online you do not have to present a thing. Just take the winnings and case closed.
 

taysh075

Non-Gambler
Joined
Jul 23, 2010
Location
New Zealand
I think this situation is why we are so lucky to have the PAB system. Here we have CM and Max (who know the online gambling industry well) to actually look into this for us, including requesting to see evidence. Without that evidence it's hard to know who to believe. I'm pretty sure just as much as the casino is not going to share private information with the forum, someone who is committing fraud is not going to front up to a forum such as gambling grumbles (not GG - for you CM ;)) and admit the evidence stacked up against them. Again I am thankful for the system CM provides because when such cases are presented here we can await a more official finding with the help of Max. Now I'm not plugging Rome casino as I have personally never played there but I do think it was great of Noah to enter into this forum when the tone was decidedly anti-Rome casino. I do always appreciate it when reps take the time to reply.
 

RomeCasino

Banned User -violation of forum policies of i-Gami
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Location
Costa Rica
From Noah

Did you ever present these so called findings of fact to the winning player so that
They could present their case? Don't bother to answer because I already know you didn't...none of the casinos do this because they're in an unregulated environment.

In the u.s., you would be sued and have to present evidence in your defense. Online you do not have to present a thing. Just take the winnings and case closed.

And how do we sue the 20-odd players that fraud us every day? Or is that not a concern? we don't. And yes, the player got the report and disregarded it. We did not.

Consider, also, that her win is not a major one in our eyes. Yes 2600 is a lot of money but we have 20k winners every day and more. Why has none of them come forth with a similar story if this is a tactic of ours to disqualify winnings? This isn't about money, its about fraud and risk. Our risk, her history of fraud. There is a very good reason for this policy.

Noah
 
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4 of a kind

Repeated violations of forum rule 1.16 - troll
Joined
Mar 11, 2009
Location
New York
There was $8.6 Billion dollars recorded in credit and debit card fraud in 2010.

Of course no merchant could possibly scrutinize every single transaction taking place. Yet, one would assume that online gaming would be where a merchant should go the extra yard prior to accepting one the first time.

I think that online casinos are all to ambitious to except credit and debit cards out of the gate knowing that the majority will lose. If the fraud players lose their is no skin coming off their backs. I think their real investigating don't begin till a player wins. It would also be interesting to know how much online casinos gained with ill-gotten transactions. If merchants are paid by the banks even during fraud purchases that went undetected they do get to keep the funds.

Charge backs are a completely different issue.
 

sandykauf

Banned User - violation of posting rules 1.1, 1.6,
Joined
May 2, 2011
Location
fort washington
It's very easy for any casino to claim fraud as soon as the player
Wins. They would'nt say anything if player lost...probably would hope there was no chargeback. Rome casino alowed the player to deposit twice enticing her with 2 large bonuses.

They used the fraud card after she won. She stated she sent in security docs, etc. These casinos lose so much potential business by not paying winners. If. I managed a casino, i'd make sure I paid all winners. If for some reason I didn't want their future business then I would communicate that respectfully.

Iwould never handle the situation like romecasino did.
 
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