Grand Duke Casino

guruplay and smartlive

Actually to my knowledge smartlivecasino which has had its share of trouble lately is the parenting company of guruplay, and now grand duke aswell.

Guruplay.com operates as a white label under the license of Smartlive. Guruplay.com is an independent company of Smartlive
 
Acquiring Grand Duke by a group that is already struggling with complaints (offering 30% of legitimate winnings or you get your account locked etc) will only add injury to insult and make Guruplay and Smartlive look worse, rather than make Grand Duke more player friendly.

At least this is my first impression.

Especially with this crazy rule that you have to have winnings from multiple games that I fail to understand. No reply from support also doesn't bode well.

The rule to have winnings from multiple games has been removed.
 
tonnia11

ok hi folks hey if grand duke is on probation well how about a nice good faith no deposit bonus for us at the miesters ???
 
ok hi folks hey if grand duke is on probation well how about a nice good faith no deposit bonus for us at the miesters ???

Welcome to the forum tonnia.

Just an FYI...its not good etiquette to ask for freebies in the forum, especially from the casino rep. Other sites don't seem to mind, but this site isn't about bonuses and freebies.

If they repeal all the stupid terms from the previous owners, you can always take their signup bonuses, which afaik includes a free chip.
 
"Guruplay.com operates as a white label under the license of Smartlive. Guruplay.com is an independent company of Smartlive " So how does this generally work? Because e-wallet deposits go to smart live atleast from neteller. 1 rule was remove but a whole bunch of rules to avoid paying winnings are still there. Im not trying to be rude, but these rules still amaze me.

"Irregular Gaming

Your use of any real money bonuses is subject to Our review for irregular playing patterns. To ensure fair gaming and the proper use of bonuses, We consider low margin betting, equal betting, zero risk bets or hedge betting to be irregular gaming when deployed to exploit bonuses. Further examples of irregular playing patterns also include, but are not limited to: (i) placing single or multiple bets of a value of fifty percent or more of the bonus on any single game, individual hand, or round, building a balance and significantly changing play patterns (bet size, game types, bet structures etc) in order to meet the bonus release requirement; (ii) placing large bets which result in a substantial gain followed by a drop in bet size equal to or more than seventy five percent of the previous average bet size until the bonus release requirements have been met (iii) Wagering based on one specific slot machine, in order to significantly increase a bankroll, in relevance to the initial betting amount, and then switching to another game or request a withdrawal. (iv) if We have good grounds to suspect that you have sought only to exploit a bonus offered by Us in good faith to enhance your entertainment (for example, on acceptance of a bonus, the minimum wagering requirement is met and funds are subsequently withdrawn).
The Casino reserves the right to decide in its sole discretion which activities constitute "irregular play" for Bonus Play through Requirement purposes from time-to-time and to withhold any withdrawals where irregular play has occurred to meet Bonus Play through Requirements."
 
ok hi folks hey if grand duke is on probation well how about a nice good faith no deposit bonus for us at the miesters ???

If they had given free chips to meister members I would be even more wary of them. True, those who won from the free chip will be paid but if an outfit does things to please only a sector of the gambling community how can they be expected to treat others.

Meanwhile what has good faith got to do with free chips? If they want to display good faith they should resolve the old issues first. Given there arent too many reputable playtechs to choose from this will lay a solid player base for them.
 
"Guruplay.com operates as a white label under the license of Smartlive. Guruplay.com is an independent company of Smartlive " So how does this generally work? Because e-wallet deposits go to smart live atleast from neteller. 1 rule was remove but a whole bunch of rules to avoid paying winnings are still there. Im not trying to be rude, but these rules still amaze me.

"Irregular Gaming

Your use of any real money bonuses is subject to Our review for irregular playing patterns. To ensure fair gaming and the proper use of bonuses, We consider low margin betting, equal betting, zero risk bets or hedge betting to be irregular gaming when deployed to exploit bonuses. Further examples of irregular playing patterns also include, but are not limited to: (i) placing single or multiple bets of a value of fifty percent or more of the bonus on any single game, individual hand, or round, building a balance and significantly changing play patterns (bet size, game types, bet structures etc) in order to meet the bonus release requirement; (ii) placing large bets which result in a substantial gain followed by a drop in bet size equal to or more than seventy five percent of the previous average bet size until the bonus release requirements have been met (iii) Wagering based on one specific slot machine, in order to significantly increase a bankroll, in relevance to the initial betting amount, and then switching to another game or request a withdrawal. (iv) if We have good grounds to suspect that you have sought only to exploit a bonus offered by Us in good faith to enhance your entertainment (for example, on acceptance of a bonus, the minimum wagering requirement is met and funds are subsequently withdrawn).
The Casino reserves the right to decide in its sole discretion which activities constitute "irregular play" for Bonus Play through Requirement purposes from time-to-time and to withhold any withdrawals where irregular play has occurred to meet Bonus Play through Requirements."

The terms listed above are ROGUE. Pure and simple.

(i) is OK in the sense of a 50% of bonus wager....the rest of it is ridiculous.

(ii) - (iv) are an absolute and total joke and could be applied to just about anyone making a withdrawal.

Unless these terms are removed and replaced with specific and reasonable terms, this casino should NOT be removed from the rogue pit.

I also find the one sentence replies from the rep to be somewhat disturbing. No discussion of why or how, or anything that has been raised. IMO any operator honestly wanting to start afresh wouldn't NEED to be told what to change.

No thanks.
 
The terms listed above are ROGUE. Pure and simple.

(i) is OK in the sense of a 50% of bonus wager....the rest of it is ridiculous.

(ii) - (iv) are an absolute and total joke and could be applied to just about anyone making a withdrawal.

Unless these terms are removed and replaced with specific and reasonable terms, this casino should NOT be removed from the rogue pit.

I also find the one sentence replies from the rep to be somewhat disturbing. No discussion of why or how, or anything that has been raised. IMO any operator honestly wanting to start afresh wouldn't NEED to be told what to change.

No thanks.

those T&C are insane.

(iii) Wagering based on one specific slot machine, in order to significantly increase a bankroll, in relevance to the initial betting amount, and then switching to another game or request a withdrawal.

That one doesn't even make any sense at all....
 
Personally, I'm against seeing them out the rogue pit

I'm against seeing them moving from the rogue pit, but people are free to deposit on this casino at their own risks. Personally, I'd see them in your worst section forever.

I've deposited 28 dollars and with a bonus ( I had more to begin wagering), I got to 16,500 dollars on Grand Duke Casino.

When I came to withdraw, I had to give my banks and billings details, until here, looks ok. (Even if I had to put my banks details few times before ) look:



Date: Mon, 20 Jun 2011 05:35:38 +0200
From: support@grandduke.com
To: myemail@adress.com
Subject: Your Withdrawal Request

Dear (me)

Unfortunately we are unable to process your wire transfer withdrawal request at this time since there are discrepancies between the information you provided in your gaming account and that which you provided about your bank account.

When you submit another withdrawal request please be sure that all details between accounts are the same (names, states, countries…) and that the bank account number - as well as the Swift code or routing number - are all accurate.

If necessary, you can double check this information with your bank.

Next to this, I sent them an email:


Hello,

I thank you for your message below. Perhaps you was unable to process whit my withdrawal request because I could not enter the entire account IBAN-Number online (on your site) because it dit not accept the full IBAN-Number like the bank gives it here in ***********, but I will send you attached to this message


the entire IBAN - Number and bank-adress, this informations comes directly from the ***-Internet site and is the official bank-adress of my account.

my identity card

the energy-bill with my personal adress to confirm you my adress.


You should know that in our country a bank- account-number is not associated with a town or state (the Swift/Bic - no. is in ******, the account (bank-code/clearing-no.) in ******** and I am living since 2 years in *********.

After reading the attached files, please let me know if it will be OK or if you have any other questions.

Thank you in advance and kind regards,

***

Then look at the actual publicity on Grand Duke Casino, dating from ? 14 June, 2011, about "Dave":
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And look back the email date and subject:
Date: Mon, 20 Jun 2011 05:35:38 +0200
Subject: Your Withdrawal Request

Don't you see something wrong? 20 June 2011, still wondering about when I'll get paid, 14 June 2011, "Dave won 16,500 dollars from 28 dollars deposits".

I waited about 1 month or more and latestcasinobonuses.com's admin had to deal with them, putting them under pressure , as an article talking about me under their website before I saw one cent from it:
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Wich was a report from Grand Duke Casino's "News".

It was first posted before I saw one cent, but when I told the latestcasinobonuses.com administrator about it, oh, suddently the article was removed as the administrator of this website started dealing with them.

That's how I could get finally paid.

In this month, I've done everything to not to play it again, but usually, I waited maximum 7 to 11 days to get my money, here, I got the same answer, delaying, until one month, the day I was really paid.

As they allowed to withdraw 9.999 dollars a month, I had 6,5k remaining, yea, I should not have play them back, but I played them the day the 9,999 dollars was really on my bank account, I was made aware of this after getting the 6,500 dollars balance to zero.

So, if I'm supposed to be responsible to have play this amount, I must wait one month (or more) to get paid (with Grand Duke under pressure, when no other choices), and the withdrawal is max 9,999 a month, this gives 3 or 4 months to see it all getting paid. I just think about if Grand Duke paid the 9,999 dollars in one week, would it have been such a mess?
I know I would not have wager the remaining amount if they paid in one week (as I did not play when waiting for the first winning until the day payment, about 30 days) it would have been no such as a big deal as emailing them about "What is going on" and as an answer "You know, it's a big amount". Alright, big amount, big luck, the most horrible month in my life, I had to tell myself everyday, WHEN am I gonna be really paid, am I even gonna be paid?

I asked the lcb admin to help, and as he must have get them under pressure and remove their article talking about me, relayed from grandduke website: "Dave", playing "Irish Luck" slots and saying how "support is great" and "quick registration", latestcasinobonuses.com relayed this nice story of someone depositing only 28 dollars and winning 16,500 dollars, but I had not see one cent when I saw this article, all this is fake, support was horrible, they always gave me an answer to delay the payment, I'm not Dave, I didn't play on Irish Luck but that's where I loosed my 6,500 dollars remaining after this article was out. See, even when trying to make them feel credible, I can't, because I loosed 6500 dollars in this slot! ;)

I'm sure that if you, or Grand Duke, don't believe me, just look with Bryan who asked me, 3 months ago, about if I finally got my withdrawal paid, I can write my real name or email adress with I exchanged emails with Brian, if you think that being paid having to wait 1 month when they maximise their withdrawal "per month", you will have to wait 2 months if they keep acting like fools, and 3 or 4 months if your winnings exceed 9,999 of your currency. One month between two payments is fair, waiting one month and having to get you under pressure to get paid , how fair it is, as I waited one month to get the first winnings paid? He (Bryan) asked me 3 months ago if "I got the winnings", and look at when did I win? 8 months before the email asking me if I finally got paid, I answered yes, because I got 9,999 dollars paid, with a big BUT.

A part of the email I sent to casinomeister, At 04:50 7/2/2011: (2 of July 2011)

"I received an email 10 days ago from the casino manager saying I would have to wait as long as 7 days for my payment to go out of the pending section.It's still on the pending section. They say too "I will send an email again to the management departement" "You will get news soon". It's been 10 days, I got no news, except that I could see on latestcasinobonuses, and grandduke.com, that I am "Dave" and "won 16,5k dollars" and that I said "support is great" "registration is easy and quick".....I didn't say anything at all, I didn't get 1 cent of that money yet."

This I wrote about the past 10 days dealing with them, in the email, I did not mention, you can look by yourself, the 14th June 2011: Dave hit the jackpot!
2 of July 2011: Dave is still wondering about when he is seeing a cent from it!
14th June was when this article came, and I was just beginning to wonder "hey, why am I mentionned now, is it fair?" It is not even legal , as I did not touch one cent at this time, but had done this days or weeks before. To get players to come and loose to be able to pay me ?

One month to make them quit playing with "We will pay you, but not now" (in about 30 days or more, I got my first winnings paid. Congratulations! )
Another to be able to withdraw what will remain (the max per month), and again having to go to ask them to PAY and not to just say "it's a big amount" (count one more month).
I'm almost sure that it was more than 30 days for my only and first (and last) winning on Grand Duke, and it must have been totally fair to get paid (9,999) the day I wagered the remaining amount (6,500), yes, I was tired with it, Grand Duke won on this, I did not want to enter in another month about "pay me? No, we are a casino, not people having money..." Then quit running a casino if you don't have money, and quit ruining the players experience if they dare winning.

I can even give the possibility to have been paid when they saw me playing the remaining amount, not sure, but even if not, nothing fair in waiting for my biggest win of my life in doubt, more than 30 days
When thinking back about it, I was made aware of the payment right after I finished to wager the remaining amount, and the "pending balance" were shown all the month, I'd like to know "when" did you choose to remove it from the pending balance, and why? Just to be nice? :) You had me under an enough hard month to be almost sure I would not be strong enough to begin another full of "bullshit" month?


That's a funny excuse coming from a casino, if I come into a real one in my country, and if I hit a 1 million jackpot, if I find the casino's director coming to me "Guy, it's a big amount".

You (Grand Duke) and every casinos are CASINOS, if you have to wait one full month (and false publicity one me) to pay a first and unique 9,999 dollars amount, you have no such good excuse like "It's a big amount." If not, should I run one by myself then?

When I loose on online casinos, it's obvious, I don't ask the casino "Can I know what is your bank details, billing adress, are you a cheater, do you have money?" before depositing, well it's not so fake now to wonder when playing onlines casinos, but my first guess was "If you are an official named casino, you must be fair then." Well, no, unfortunatly.

Let's say I'm starting a casino, will I even tell myself "If someone win big, I'm in trouble". That's not a casino then, just about stealing people, and if they win, like me, on slots only, as you have no excuses from your terms, you know you will have to pay, still you choose the unfair way "Big amount" "we are looking into it" "we will pay". Ok, what about telling everyone that winning here (if not 200 dollars but a big win) you have to wait 30 days to finally get paid, supposing you had made enough money meanwhile, on the winner (false publicity)?
That is what I experimented here, I'm not sure if it was even more than 30 days, so if you play here, be warn , don't win too much, they have no real money behind, they'll wait until they got enough depositors that loosed to be able to pay you, doing everything to push you on the "wondering", "are they going to pay?". Then you'll be angry and ask for big websites making their publicity on you to get them under pressure, I don't call this a casino, just rogues, or worst, rogues having no rules, my worst casino experience in 7 years, and my biggest win of ever, transformed into a nightmare.

Thanks Grand Duke! That was my personal experience on Grand Duke Casino. If Grand Duke Casino wants to say how am I not "Dave" on your publicity, tell me who is this person ;)
Lastly, false publicity, lying still, because I transformed my balance into a higher balance, "winnings" are when you see the cash. Say someone gets his balance to 20'000 and then to 0, will you say "he won 20'000?" ;)

Look at when they write something around, even here you can make your own judgement.
 
Kain.

You had a bad slowpay experience with grand duke. I'm sorry to hear that, and its their fault.

You also blew back $6500 to the casino.....that is your fault.

It's a shame you had to play there in the first place, but if you signup with casinos via bonus whore sites like LCB then you're taking your chances. Sites like that don't care who they promote as long as THEY get paid.

Stick with CM in the future and the accredited casino list. There's more to life than bonuses.

You could also have said all of this in a much shorter post. You'll find many people will just give up and ignore a post that long that keeps repeating the same things.

just be happy you got your $10k at least....you are luckier than some.
 
Oh my goodness, I got tired just from reading all the rules and regulations. I do not want to play at a place, even if I could, where I had to be scared of doing the wrong thing (e.g. don't play this game for too long, don't switch around too much). I know there has to be rules but must a player print them out, highlight the particulars, and have an anxiety attack wondering if you did, did not, or may have done something that will keep you from withdrawing :p Thanks...but no thanks!

I think you can be pretty sure, that if you win a substantial amount, you HAVE done something wrong.
They SERIOUSLY need to clean up their so called terms and conditions.
 
I'll try making shorter and constructive way:

I was honest and did not mean to lie but did not realise the "boring" post I've made. Nifty29, sorry and thanks. :oops:

The whole winnings were in the "pending section" (meaning "playable again") , during approx. 1 month. May it look fair, I don't know. :eek:
I may have not been blowing the remaining amount, for sure! :) They paid, I was lucky, right and I'm thanksful.
Everything that is not about "me", only what is "how this casino did", behind my own responsabilty, that was my first intention to point out.
I've done it wrong when thinking "mine" again in it, it looks confusing. (blowing the remaining amount and saying it's only their fault.)

It was an horrible experience on my side, being weak on my mind sometimes, moody, so this was accentuated by my own troubles.
I'm sure they've been not fair, I'm sometimes naive, so this is being me too, I think they have played with it, me not knowing enough the laws, my rights, trusting their good will too much.
Got paid only when they've been under pressure, that is a fact and not me.
But Grand Duke can change, we never know, one bad experience (Hello!! ) doesn't make it all (Bye!!), as written before this.

Sorry if this was boring, I'm out! ZzzZZzz....*winning....a....little....bit...of...love* :what:
 
Kain.

You had a bad slowpay experience with grand duke. I'm sorry to hear that, and its their fault.

You also blew back $6500 to the casino.....that is your fault.

It's a shame you had to play there in the first place, but if you signup with casinos via bonus whore sites like LCB then you're taking your chances. Sites like that don't care who they promote as long as THEY get paid.

Stick with CM in the future and the accredited casino list. There's more to life than bonuses.

You could also have said all of this in a much shorter post. You'll find many people will just give up and ignore a post that long that keeps repeating the same things.

just be happy you got your $10k at least....you are luckier than some.

I found it rather too brief - I would like more detail:D
 
ok hi folks hey if grand duke is on probation well how about a nice good faith no deposit bonus for us at the miesters ???

Why? With the current T&C you'd not be able to cash out, so what's the point? Play in free mode... somewhere else.
 
Guruplay & Smart Live

"So how does this generally work? Because e-wallet deposits go to smart live atleast from neteller.": this is always the case if a gaming company operates under the license of another gaming company.


"Guruplay.com operates as a white label under the license of Smartlive. Guruplay.com is an independent company of Smartlive " So how does this generally work? Because e-wallet deposits go to smart live atleast from neteller. 1 rule was remove but a whole bunch of rules to avoid paying winnings are still there. Im not trying to be rude, but these rules still amaze me.

"Irregular Gaming

Your use of any real money bonuses is subject to Our review for irregular playing patterns. To ensure fair gaming and the proper use of bonuses, We consider low margin betting, equal betting, zero risk bets or hedge betting to be irregular gaming when deployed to exploit bonuses. Further examples of irregular playing patterns also include, but are not limited to: (i) placing single or multiple bets of a value of fifty percent or more of the bonus on any single game, individual hand, or round, building a balance and significantly changing play patterns (bet size, game types, bet structures etc) in order to meet the bonus release requirement; (ii) placing large bets which result in a substantial gain followed by a drop in bet size equal to or more than seventy five percent of the previous average bet size until the bonus release requirements have been met (iii) Wagering based on one specific slot machine, in order to significantly increase a bankroll, in relevance to the initial betting amount, and then switching to another game or request a withdrawal. (iv) if We have good grounds to suspect that you have sought only to exploit a bonus offered by Us in good faith to enhance your entertainment (for example, on acceptance of a bonus, the minimum wagering requirement is met and funds are subsequently withdrawn).
The Casino reserves the right to decide in its sole discretion which activities constitute "irregular play" for Bonus Play through Requirement purposes from time-to-time and to withhold any withdrawals where irregular play has occurred to meet Bonus Play through Requirements."
 
Seriously these 1 line responses from the casino rep are pretty uncool and unprofessional. Im not trying to badmouth the casino in any way, but the 1 liners are becoming a trend in this thread so ill post a couple myself.

1. I was generally asking how do you differentiate what funds are guruplay:s and what smart lives if e-wallet deposits go directly to smartlive?

2. If the parenting company is having these "issues" how does being a white label of smart live make you somewhat better and more trustworthy?
 
white labels

Seriously these 1 line responses from the casino rep are pretty uncool and unprofessional. Im not trying to badmouth the casino in any way, but the 1 liners are becoming a trend in this thread so ill post a couple myself.

1. I was generally asking how do you differentiate what funds are guruplay:s and what smart lives if e-wallet deposits go directly to smartlive?

2. If the parenting company is having these "issues" how does being a white label of smart live make you somewhat better and more trustworthy?

To reply to your questions:

1. funds always go to the accounts of the company holding a gaming license. The differentiation of funds is a purely accounting issue. Backoffice and reports show which funds go to which gaming account and site. This is common practice and audited by the regulators.

2. White labels are not the "parent" company and might operate differently. They might have different bonus policies, customer service, promotions...Having a player problem with the main license holder does not mean that the same might occur with the white label holder, and vice versa.
 
how aout that golden cherry it has been great to me cashed out a cool grand this week

Acquiring Grand Duke by a group that is already struggling with complaints (offering 30% of legitimate winnings or you get your account locked etc) will only add injury to insult and make Guruplay and Smartlive look worse, rather than make Grand Duke more player friendly.

At least this is my first impression.

Especially with this crazy rule that you have to have winnings from multiple games that I fail to understand. No reply from support also doesn't bode well.

i belive it is a tax rule if you win over 600. on one game tax man steps in but if it is won at several then you dont have to claim the taxes at least in the usa
 
This https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...innings-cited-self-contradictory-terms.47087/ thread was the last straw in the Grand Duke case. The Casinomeister's announcement of placing them in the Rogue Pit is right there on the second page.

I am the OP in that thread. After reading about Grand Duke changed the management and placed on probation, I decided to email them and ask whether they are willing to reconsider my issue. To my astonishment, they appeared to be more than happy to cooperate. I posted the detailed info in my thread and will keep you updated.
 
i belive it is a tax rule if you win over 600. on one game tax man steps in but if it is won at several then you dont have to claim the taxes at least in the usa
All gambling winnings are taxable, but casinos only have to issue a W2-G if the win exceeds a certain amount depending on the type of the game. Smaller wins do not generate paperwork, so most people "forget" to declare them.
 
Some bad news at Grand Duke. They owe me £35,650 from a win from July 2011 that they didn't pay me. I can give full details here or I'll start another thread if appropriate. I had a win on their slots (first and only win- before that, I'd lost thousands with them). What they did, was to change the terms and conditions a month later inserting bet size restrictions but tried to rewrite history by keeping the same date of 15th July 2011 on the terms, thereby trying to retrospectively apply them to my win and voiding it.

Fortunately, I'd saved a copy of the terms and conditions from the website when I had my win, which I presented to them and for which, naturally, they had no answer (two different terms and conditions but with the same date and version number!) Eventually they just ignored my emails.

Having been been repeatedly emailed by them again, inviting me to play, I have been in correspondence with the new VIP manager there and sent them all the details of the win, the terms and conditions and fully appraised them of the situation and they are still refusing to pay out, saying it's nothing to do with them. To quote their last email:

"This issue was prior to the new management and ownership, this issue had been closed last year in our system. We are unable to resolve this previous issue with Grand Duke. I can assure you such cases will no longer occur due to improvements made to Grand Duke Casino and recent changes in the terms and conditions."

So this goes completely contrary to the rationale for them wanting to be removed from the rogue list.

Any advice?
 
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