Fortune Lounge - Phones Down?

[Nicola]

Tried calling Royal Vegas (Fortune Lounge brand) yesterday and today and get the message that the line has been 'disconnected due to non-payment' and on live chat they say 'Something wrong with the International licensing and were trying to get it sorted'.

Should I worry that they are un-contactable by phone as I have a withdrawal pending?

 

[maphesto]

Tried calling Royal Vegas (Fortune Lounge brand) yesterday and today and get the message that the line has been 'disconnected due to non-payment' and on live chat they say 'Something wrong with the International licensing and were trying to get it sorted'.

Should I worry that they are un-contactable by phone as I have a withdrawal pending?

Very strange, but lately there has been an awful lot of things going on with the Fortune Lounge and their affiliate program (Fortune Affiliates).

Some examples:

* They have lost their accreditation here.

* They have somehow migrated with even more MG casinos which now belong to Digimedia (Red Flush, All Slots etc.). All Slots sent an email about changing phone numbers I think.

* The affiliate program suddenly noticed some old chargebacks (from 2011-2012 I think) which means that a lot of affiliates don't earn any money because those old things. Very strange.

I think you'll receive those money but I don't think you should deposit at those casinos in the near time.

 

[randomiam]

how longs it been pending

if its under a grand normally should be no more than 3 working days max from that group. so dont stress till the forth day and if live chat doesn't work

 

[fortunelounge]

Tried calling Royal Vegas (Fortune Lounge brand) yesterday and today and get the message that the line has been 'disconnected due to non-payment' and on live chat they say 'Something wrong with the International licensing and were trying to get it sorted'.

Should I worry that they are un-contactable by phone as I have a withdrawal pending?

Hi Nicola

Our apologies that you could not get hold of us but we were experiencing storage issues that affected our phone lines. We have since rectified it.

There is certainly nothing to be worried about regarding your pending withdrawal and if you PM me your details I can look into it for you

Regards

Wim

 

[vinylweatherman]

Hi Nicola

Our apologies that you could not get hold of us but we were experiencing storage issues that affected our phone lines. We have since rectified it.

There is certainly nothing to be worried about regarding your pending withdrawal and if you PM me your details I can look into it for you

Regards

Wim

From the message the OP received, it is clearly an issue of not paying the bill. In terms of company image, this is VERY bad indeed, and trying to whitewash this by the rather vague "we were experiencing storage issues" just makes things even worse.

Phones are cut off only as a last resort, when the provider has tried everything else to persuade the subscriber to pay the bill.

We need something rather more specific as to how these "storage issues" resulted in the company not paying it's phone bill.

On it's own, it's a concern, but taken alongside everything else that has been happening, it looks like there have been significant changes that are deliberately being kept from players.

For starters, who EXACTLY are "Digimedia", and how come they are related to Fortune Lounge and Jackpot Factory all of a sudden, when experienced players know them as the new company name for Belle Rock, a casino group that should have no connection with the others, and which for a long time was licensed in Gibraltar when the others still held their license from Kahnawake.

All Slots et al change their phone number, and the following week Fortune Lounge gets it's lines cut off for non payment. What's really going on?

Players should have been sent an email explaining that there were "storage issues", and that the phone lines were temporarily unavailable. "Administrative error" could have been used to explain why the provider had put a message up that it was down to non payment. Players who read the email would probably not even try to call as they would know the lines were down.

If the bills HAVE been paid, and the lines are down for another reason, legal action should be taken to get the message removed as it would then be a serious slander that is damaging to the company's reputation.

 

[fortunelounge]

Hi VWM

We are trying to establish why Nicola would have received a message that our lines have been disconnected due to non-payment. Our payments are certainly up to date.

The only message we are aware of is one of "The license limit has been reached and your call can not be transferred"

We experienced a storage issue that forced our system to go down and once it came back online the license could not be activated again. After contacting our service provider they rectified the issue.

This happened in the early hours of this morning and it would have been quite senseless to send a mail to all our players to inform them our phone lines are down when we did not know how long it was going to be down for and when most players were not playing or were sleeping. The lines were only down for a few hours (not days) and players could contact us via live chat or e-mail.

Regards

Wim

 

[parpol]

What's really going on?

In Italy, the market adjusted AAMS, tomorrow "AllSlots" will become part of GM Gaming Ltd, owner of the online casino also "Voglia di Vincere"

Now: AllSlots (Nexigames limited), tomorrow AllSLots (GM Gaming Ltd)!

GM Gaming Ltd= Fortune Lounge.

 

[tinybettor]

Very strange, but lately there has been an awful lot of things going on with the Fortune Lounge and their affiliate program (Fortune Affiliates).

Some examples:

* They have lost their accreditation here.

Looks like I have been out of the loop. Didn't know they lost their accreditation. Always thought they were good to go. Now I sorta regret depositing there in the past week.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Hi VWM

We are trying to establish why Nicola would have received a message that our lines have been disconnected due to non-payment. Our payments are certainly up to date.

The only message we are aware of is one of "The license limit has been reached and your call can not be transferred"

We experienced a storage issue that forced our system to go down and once it came back online the license could not be activated again. After contacting our service provider they rectified the issue.

This happened in the early hours of this morning and it would have been quite senseless to send a mail to all our players to inform them our phone lines are down when we did not know how long it was going to be down for and when most players were not playing or were sleeping. The lines were only down for a few hours (not days) and players could contact us via live chat or e-mail.

Regards

Wim

This message too should never go out to a caller, it is nonsense to any industry outsider, who would not know what to make of it. The "engaged tone" is what callers should get if all lines are "busy" and a call can't be transferred. It's a well understood action by the public, and is interpreted as "they are exceptionally busy, I'll try later".

Now, this pales into insignificance compared to the further confusion just started by another poster.

In Italy, the market adjusted AAMS, tomorrow "AllSlots" will become part of GM Gaming Ltd, owner of the online casino also "Voglia di Vincere"

Now: AllSlots (Nexigames limited), tomorrow AllSLots (GM Gaming Ltd)!

GM Gaming Ltd= Fortune Lounge.

This is farcical.

Only last week it was Digimedia, and even this was a surprise because Digimedia is a well known operator, but of the old Carmen Media/Belle Rock casinos, nothing whatsoever to do with Fortune Lounge, Jackpot Factory etc. Now it's not Digimedia, but GM gaming, but at the SAME ADDRESS as Digimedia

I don't think it's just experienced players, but the taxman that is wondering WTF is going on here.

Part of what is going on was revealed when Purple Lounge went under taking players' money with them. It turned out that what was behind all of this in their case was a scheme to dump the liabilities into a shell company with no assets, whilst all the money went to a different legal entity. It meant that players had to claim against the shell company with no assets, whilst what was left of their money was out of reach in a parent company, that then USED this players' money in an attempt to climb out of the pit it had found itself in by trying to fund a new venture with it.

Now, is GM Gaming yet another of these shell companies with no assets?

We all trusted that our money was safe in Purple Lounge, backed by the LGA via a regulation that it must be kept separate from company funds. We also thought that it was "impossible" for such a highly regarded casino to simply evaporate overnight with all the money.

Many probably now think it inconceivable that Fortune Lounge, Digimedia, GM gaming, with all those interconnected and successful operations would suddenly collapse and leave no assets, but we have been bitten once already, and nothing has happened to inspire confidence that the LGA have actually done anything to stop this from ever happening again, and if the LGA haven't put in safeguards, no one else will have.

When things go wrong, and then we are reassured by the casino operator that all is well, and it's just a minor glitch that has now been fixed, it's a case of "heard it all before". The problem is that no casino operator will tell the truth if it's bad news, so we cannot 100% trust that such a statement is true unless it is backed up independently, such as by eCogra or the LGA. Even eCogra isn't completely reliable, as it failed to warn players at TUSK owned casinos that they had 2 weeks before it collapsed and took their money with it, worse, eCogra allowed fake reassurances from the operator fool players into depositing even more money into a group that was already insolvent at the time.

As for another high profile failure, it's more a case of "when" rather than "if", and that is what keeps players on alert for the most minor signs that something is about to go very wrong. It is also why it is important that the RIGHT information is given out when there is a technical glitch. Whilst a short lived glitch in the small hours might only get noticed by one or two players, the problem comes if it gets posted about and seen by a much wider audience, and there has been no official statement at the time from the operator to it's customers, such as an email explaining that they may have experienced odd symptoms overnight, and that it was down to a short lived technical glitch that has now been dealt with.

I don't buy this excuse that it would clog up players' emails to send just this one additional email about something most players had not noticed, after all, players are deluged with emails making an offer that they are not eligible for at one or another FL casino, more than one email about the SAME promotion, whether or not they are eligible.

I suspect that the lack of an email was a decision made on the basis that no one would have noticed there had been a glitch, and so it would be better to keep quiet about anything ever having gone wrong and needed fixing.

Naturally, given the nature of the glitch, no players will be experiencing unexpected delays in receiving their withdrawals, so this at least is reassuring, and would be unlike the "technical glitch" that afflicted Purple Lounge that DID create weeks of delays in players receiving payment for about a month, before the final curtain fell on the operation.

There is also the matter of some very long term "maintenance" being undertaken by Microgaming which meant a couple of dozen games getting abruptly taken offline without notice nor explanation. Did someone else not pay their bill?

There has been one hell of a lot of odd manoeuverings going on recently in the industry, so clearly there is SOMETHING going on that is not merely a "minor technical glitch". More likely, it's these manoeuverings that have occasionally CAUSED these odd glitches that have afflicted players.

 

[Azzurri]

Looks like I have been out of the loop. Didn't know they lost their accreditation. Always thought they were good to go. Now I sorta regret depositing there in the past week.

I would stay away.

Before I found this site and educated myself, I deposited over $30,000 in less than 2 months across a couple of their sites. Each time I closed my account their vip manager would email me and offer me a bonus to return, which I accepted. I never made a withdrawal ever, and recently worked out that I received just under 10% in loyalty bonuses, but these all came with x60 wagering, so obviously I never had a chance.

I then found this site and wisened up to the fact that that's not how vips are treated, hence closed all accounts and play elsewhere now.

Funny thing is I recently had one vip manager email with a 50% match offer to return, lol. So maybe they are struggling to pay their bills, lol. Needless to say I told the manager I'm worth more than that and politely declined. Sad thing is I now find it very hard to trust any casino fully now because of this group. Lesson learnt I guess. Thanks to many on here.

 

[Dinahnana]

This message too should never go out to a caller, it is nonsense to any industry outsider, who would not know what to make of it. The "engaged tone" is what callers should get if all lines are "busy" and a call can't be transferred. It's a well understood action by the public, and is interpreted as "they are exceptionally busy, I'll try later".

Now, this pales into insignificance compared to the further confusion just started by another poster.




This is farcical.

Only last week it was Digimedia, and even this was a surprise because Digimedia is a well known operator, but of the old Carmen Media/Belle Rock casinos, nothing whatsoever to do with Fortune Lounge, Jackpot Factory etc. Now it's not Digimedia, but GM gaming, but at the SAME ADDRESS as Digimedia

I don't think it's just experienced players, but the taxman that is wondering WTF is going on here.

Part of what is going on was revealed when Purple Lounge went under taking players' money with them. It turned out that what was behind all of this in their case was a scheme to dump the liabilities into a shell company with no assets, whilst all the money went to a different legal entity. It meant that players had to claim against the shell company with no assets, whilst what was left of their money was out of reach in a parent company, that then USED this players' money in an attempt to climb out of the pit it had found itself in by trying to fund a new venture with it.

Now, is GM Gaming yet another of these shell companies with no assets?

We all trusted that our money was safe in Purple Lounge, backed by the LGA via a regulation that it must be kept separate from company funds. We also thought that it was "impossible" for such a highly regarded casino to simply evaporate overnight with all the money.

Many probably now think it inconceivable that Fortune Lounge, Digimedia, GM gaming, with all those interconnected and successful operations would suddenly collapse and leave no assets, but we have been bitten once already, and nothing has happened to inspire confidence that the LGA have actually done anything to stop this from ever happening again, and if the LGA haven't put in safeguards, no one else will have.

When things go wrong, and then we are reassured by the casino operator that all is well, and it's just a minor glitch that has now been fixed, it's a case of "heard it all before". The problem is that no casino operator will tell the truth if it's bad news, so we cannot 100% trust that such a statement is true unless it is backed up independently, such as by eCogra or the LGA. Even eCogra isn't completely reliable, as it failed to warn players at TUSK owned casinos that they had 2 weeks before it collapsed and took their money with it, worse, eCogra allowed fake reassurances from the operator fool players into depositing even more money into a group that was already insolvent at the time.

As for another high profile failure, it's more a case of "when" rather than "if", and that is what keeps players on alert for the most minor signs that something is about to go very wrong. It is also why it is important that the RIGHT information is given out when there is a technical glitch. Whilst a short lived glitch in the small hours might only get noticed by one or two players, the problem comes if it gets posted about and seen by a much wider audience, and there has been no official statement at the time from the operator to it's customers, such as an email explaining that they may have experienced odd symptoms overnight, and that it was down to a short lived technical glitch that has now been dealt with.

I don't buy this excuse that it would clog up players' emails to send just this one additional email about something most players had not noticed, after all, players are deluged with emails making an offer that they are not eligible for at one or another FL casino, more than one email about the SAME promotion, whether or not they are eligible.

I suspect that the lack of an email was a decision made on the basis that no one would have noticed there had been a glitch, and so it would be better to keep quiet about anything ever having gone wrong and needed fixing.

Naturally, given the nature of the glitch, no players will be experiencing unexpected delays in receiving their withdrawals, so this at least is reassuring, and would be unlike the "technical glitch" that afflicted Purple Lounge that DID create weeks of delays in players receiving payment for about a month, before the final curtain fell on the operation.

There is also the matter of some very long term "maintenance" being undertaken by Microgaming which meant a couple of dozen games getting abruptly taken offline without notice nor explanation. Did someone else not pay their bill?

There has been one hell of a lot of odd manoeuverings going on recently in the industry, so clearly there is SOMETHING going on that is not merely a "minor technical glitch". More likely, it's these manoeuverings that have occasionally CAUSED these odd glitches that have afflicted players.

I certainly would like to know since Digimedia which is connected to FL owns quite a lot of real estate. I for one will be staying away from casinos connected until I find out whats going on. Being burned by Purple Lounge makes me extra cautious.

 

[tinybettor]

Would just like to also add that I have asked this group multiple times to send me the form to close my account but they have never done so.

Edit: And now their agent on chat has gone AWOL. Replied once and now waiting 10 mins and ticking.

 

[Captain Chaos]

A thought, having read parts of the Purple Lounge disaster (first I had hears about it was joining up here). This may seem like a daft question. But is there no actual way of determining who the true owner of a company is and who is actually liable for player balances etc? It would be nice to avoid another Purple Lounge. Yet sadly, as VWM said it will most likely happen again.

People need to be held accountable and the industry cannot, and is not, going to change until the people in charge can be held accountable for the actions and decisions that they make.

The industry desperately needs proper protection for players and operators alike, with proper regulation and an authority who can actually take proper action. What form this could take, I have no idea. I keep thinking of the banking sector as a possible model with deposits guaranteed etc. But how could this work on a global scale? The last thing we want it for every country to go the way of the US.

I just find it incredible that despite all the wonderful advances in technology, the ability to play where you want, whenever you want, that after around 2 decades the industry is still a bit if a mess when it comes to accountability etc, etc. There has to be an answer, surely?

 

[fortunelounge]

Would just like to also add that I have asked this group multiple times to send me the form to close my account but they have never done so.

Edit: And now their agent on chat has gone AWOL. Replied once and now waiting 10 mins and ticking.

Hi tinybettor

I sent you a PM.

Regards

Wim

 

[dunover]

Hi tinybettor

I sent you a PM.

Regards

Wim

So Wim, who do you work for, who pays your wages?

 

[Azzurri]

Hi tinybettor

I sent you a PM.

Regards

Wim

Tinybettor, depending on how much you deposited, this should now mean in around 24-48 hours you'll be contacted by a vip rep offering you a bonus of $100-$200 as an incentive to return and reopen your account. Worked for me until I found out the wagering was x60 and the bonuses were out of proportion to the amounts I was depositing, which was often thousands per day, lol. Never used a deposit bonus either. These guys are way behind guys like guts and Leo Vegas.

Just a heads up.

 

[Nicola]

Wim,

Thanks for the response. I spoke with Erin and Ronaldo in VIP today for some reassurance. It is with regret that I had to request closure of my account after being a VIP player for nearly 4 years but I got burned badly with Purple Lounge and I don't hesitate getting out early these days at the first sign of bother.

I fully understand Erin's comments today that you have taken on-board a lot more support calls in recent weeks due to acquisitions but please do not let this be your downfall. You have (or had) something really good going with your group which put you at the top of my list.

 

[spintee]

Looks like I have been out of the loop. Didn't know they lost their accreditation. Always thought they were good to go. Now I sorta regret depositing there in the past week.

Same as, Giggle bingo looks like its been took of also, I see it there the other day, Unsure about there casinos as did not play there, Looks like somethings kicked off?

 

[dunover]

Wim,

Thanks for the response. I spoke with Erin and Ronaldo in VIP today for some reassurance. It is with regret that I had to request closure of my account after being a VIP player for nearly 4 years but I got burned badly with Purple Lounge and I don't hesitate getting out early these days at the first sign of bother.

I fully understand Erin's comments today that you have taken on-board a lot more support calls in recent weeks due to acquisitions but please do not let this be your downfall. You have (or had) something really good going with your group which put you at the top of my list.

If in doubt, get out! Can't blame you, especially with some of the screenies you've posted which must have resulted in substantial withdrawals.
I have had nothing but good experiences in the past with FL, but the dust definitely needs to settle.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Wim,

Thanks for the response. I spoke with Erin and Ronaldo in VIP today for some reassurance. It is with regret that I had to request closure of my account after being a VIP player for nearly 4 years but I got burned badly with Purple Lounge and I don't hesitate getting out early these days at the first sign of bother.

I fully understand Erin's comments today that you have taken on-board a lot more support calls in recent weeks due to acquisitions but please do not let this be your downfall. You have (or had) something really good going with your group which put you at the top of my list.

What

So, there has been some buying out of casino groups, and it was company policy to keep players in the dark!

It now appears that it is Fortune Lounge that is doing the buying, and that some weaker casinos were in a spot of bother, yet quite happily operating "business as usual" and taking players' deposits, and maybe at a time when it was not certain that the deal would go through.

Exactly HOW close to another Purple Lounge/TUSK/whatever did we just get?

From the emails I have received, it looks like the group in distress was the old Jackpot Factory lot, which curiously INCLUDED Wild Jack, even though the rep assured Bryan that they were not connected to Wild Jack, and thus could not deal with PABs related to Wild Jack.

However, a further complication is that the end product is "Digimedia", which was not Fortune Lounge, but the old Belle Rock group, so if Fortune Lounge is now Digimedia, it implies that they too have been bought, so is it really Fortune Lounge that has been buying, or Digimedia that has swallowed both Fortune Lounge and Jackpot Factory, all this without any press release, although it seems the VIP hosts know what is going on.

Incidentally, has Jorn been fired, as all of a sudden my last email to my freshly allocated host has remained unanswered, which is highly unusual.

If there has been a rescue takeover on the quiet, it would explain the numerous technical issues, and may have lead to administrative errors that resulted in some external service providers not receiving payment when due, emails going astray, and issues left hanging in mid air.

 

[The Dude]

What

So, there has been some buying out of casino groups, and it was company policy to keep players in the dark!

It now appears that it is Fortune Lounge that is doing the buying, and that some weaker casinos were in a spot of bother, yet quite happily operating "business as usual" and taking players' deposits, and maybe at a time when it was not certain that the deal would go through.

Exactly HOW close to another Purple Lounge/TUSK/whatever did we just get?

From the emails I have received, it looks like the group in distress was the old Jackpot Factory lot, which curiously INCLUDED Wild Jack, even though the rep assured Bryan that they were not connected to Wild Jack, and thus could not deal with PABs related to Wild Jack.

However, a further complication is that the end product is "Digimedia", which was not Fortune Lounge, but the old Belle Rock group, so if Fortune Lounge is now Digimedia, it implies that they too have been bought, so is it really Fortune Lounge that has been buying, or Digimedia that has swallowed both Fortune Lounge and Jackpot Factory, all this without any press release, although it seems the VIP hosts know what is going on.

Incidentally, has Jorn been fired, as all of a sudden my last email to my freshly allocated host has remained unanswered, which is highly unusual.

If there has been a rescue takeover on the quiet, it would explain the numerous technical issues, and may have lead to administrative errors that resulted in some external service providers not receiving payment when due, emails going astray, and issues left hanging in mid air.

Please VWM - this sort of speculation is in the tin foil hat league. Keep it real, man.

 

[ChillBill]

I spent an hour on Google and came up with the following.

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There was once a time where Microgaming, and founder family the Moshal’s, were rumoured to own, or at least control, roughly 35% of the online casino industry. This included an untold number of smaller casinos effectively operating with the same product and a slightly different skin. It also included some of the bigger name casinos.

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Who is Martin Moshal? Martin Moshal is the son of John Moshal and brother of David Moshal Between the 3 of them they control roughly 35% of the world's online gaming market. Martin is based in Durban, South Africa and Gibraltar. They control companies like Dericvo, Forwardslash, Datacash, Microgaming and Carmen Media, Spin3 and Spiral Solutions. David started the whole thing in 1994, with Martin and John coming aboard later.

If this is true, then Fortune Lounge Group, Carmen Media (ex Bella Rock Entertainment), Spiral Solutions (Jackpot Factory Group), Microgaming, (possibly also eCOGRA) and who know what other casinos, were or still are all controlled by the Moshal family.

And if this is true, then imo players and everyone else has been led to believe these casinos, companies and entities are operated by non-connected persons, when that's anything but the case.

Old / Expired Link

Digimedia Limited is licensed by the Lotteries and Gaming Authority of Malta LGA/CL1/542/2008 and LGA/CL3/542/2008 issued on 16 June 2010.

Now these casinos are all part of the Digimedia Limited...
I personally don't buy into the excuses given, that it saves on licensing fees and that's why these casinos now share the same Malta Gaming License.

 

[Silana80]

I want to add that Redflush group of casinos (Redflush, CasinoLavida, Major Tom casino) is also now part of Fortune Lounge. They changed their license to Digimedia at the same time as Jackpotfactory (the very beginning of March 2014). So I suppose that now all 4 Jackpotfactory casinos (Allslots, Alljackpots, Wildjack and First web) and all 3 Redflush casinos should also be removed from an accredited list since they are now a part of Fortune Lounge.

 

[maphesto]

I want to add that Redflush group of casinos (Redflush, CasinoLavida, Major Tom casino) is also now part of Fortune Lounge. They changed their license to Digimedia at the same time as Jackpotfactory (the very beginning of March 2014).

Exactly so!

Redflush group
Bellerock
Jackpot Factory
Fortune Lounge (Even Wintingo are using this affy program... , which began when Jackpot Factory changed)

All Digimedia...

 

[Silana80]

Exactly so!

Redflush group
Bellerock
Jackpot Factory
Fortune Lounge (Even Wintingo are using this affy program... , which began when Jackpot Factory changed)

All Digimedia...

I am not sure about Bellerock. They also have Digimedia license but they seem to have an independent support. On the contrary Jackpotfactory and Redflush now have the same support as FL. FL representative could easily deny the fact Fortune Lounge added 7 more casinos to its portfolio but he did not. Which means there is nothing to deny )

 

[parpol]

The same argument can be made for the group: "Megapixel Ent. Ltd." (Roxy and Splendido). For the Italian market is the xxLuckyClic.it (AAMS).

If I search google with any casino group's "Vegas Partner Lounge" I am directed to xxLuckyClic.it (Megapixel Ent. Ltd).

 

[ChillBill]

What also concerns me are my personal details. Are these being shared amoung all Digimedia casinos, likely go a long to explain all the spam I get from these casinos. Rogue affiliates yeah right!

 

[Dinahnana]

I for one would like Digimedia or whoever owns the vast majority of the accredited MGS casinos to actually make a statement and let us know exactly what is going on I think our community can accept a reasonable explanation however this cloak and dagger BS is really pissing us off. Sorry for the potty mouth but I too was burnt by that whole Purple Lounge implosion so I get very nervous when I see shenanigans such as these occurring. So for heaven's sake just tell us whats going on?

I doubt well get an answer but I live in hope.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Please VWM - this sort of speculation is in the tin foil hat league. Keep it real, man.

The Digimedia website contains much of this information.

The rest, speculation based on a curious incident where All Slots were unable to pay my £5800 withdrawal in one go a short while back. It took a fortnight and prodding the rep to get any action, and although I got the payment, I got no explanation of what had gone wrong.

This looks very much like the first signs of trouble with Purple Lounge, where players who were patient were paid very slowly, but as soon as they made a fuss, the rep sorted out the problem and gave vague excuses.

It fits, and if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, one should assume it's a duck even if it's hidden behind a bush.

A month or so on, and Jackpot Factory are bought out by Fortune Lounge, and the process seems a little rushed as normally players are given about a month's notice of such changes.

It seems that Fortune Lounge (Digimedia) are the strong group, Jackpot Factory the close shave, and Belle Rock no longer able to go it alone, so come on board with Digimedia to share costs whilst retaining their independence in managing the casinos.

Since we can never be certain till it's too late, it's better to play it safe when the signs are pointing towards danger.

This has already revealed the lie regarding Wild Jack having nothing to do with Jackpot Factory, as it formed part of the transfer, which would not have been the case were it really independent.

I find it even harder to believe that entirely independent companies are allowed to share gambling licenses, anyone who believes that this fits with the model of responsible regulation that the LGA claims to be achieving is the one needing the tin foil hat.

If Red Flush now use this same license, then at the very top level, they are now part of the same company that owns Fortune Lounge, and thus it's the same beneficial owners. The casinos can appear independent if middle management are given enough leeway to make their own decisions without having to refer matters up the chain of command.

They may well share player info between them as this would no longer be "sharing with a third party" as they are all part of the same company.

The UK licensing regime is a little different, individuals are granted licenses, not so much companies. In practice, this means that there will be designated and named individuals who are held personally responsible for the conduct of the gambling company. The OWNERS also have to pass vetting to ensure that organised crime is kept out of the industry. In practice, it will be easier to find out who owns what than is currently the case.

If the Moshal brothers really do own much of the industry as rumoured, this will become clearer as UK licenses are granted for 2015 and onwards.

I also remember years ago that Jackpot Factory was "ultimately owned by two secretive Israeli brothers". We now have two not so secretive Israeli brothers who in the past pretty much dominated the industry, so it seems likely that the mystery owners of Jackpot Factory back in 2005/6 and the Moshal brothers are one and the same.

If the people at the top are going to duck and dive behind front companies, subsidiaries, shells, etc, they are asking for people to start digging because they are behaving as though they have something to hide. The excuse that this is done to throw the DoJ off the scent no longer applies when it comes to the big software providers like Microgaming, so it wasn't the only reason they had for staying in the shadows.

 

[dunover]

What I want to know is WHY the veil of secrecy, the furtive behaviour?
IF they have merged operations then surely at least they could notify CM as it's relevant to their accredited status.
It's obvious by where the CS phone service is based and the people answering in S.Africa that many of these sites shared services anyway.
I can't see that a PL is going to occur as this group combined is much bigger. These sites are all MG Viper download sites, which are almost antiquated now in terms of games and features/promos and it wouldn't be a shock if revenues were going down year on year with the rise of the new and better-bonused multi-platform sites. This may be why it makes good business to amalgamate the sites under one umbrella group.
Are player funds ring-fenced though???

 

[Dinahnana]

What I want to know is WHY the veil of secrecy, the furtive behaviour?
IF they have merged operations then surely at least they could notify CM as it's relevant to their accredited status.
It's obvious by where the CS phone service is based and the people answering in S.Africa that many of these sites shared services anyway.
I can't see that a PL is going to occur as this group combined is much bigger. These sites are all MG Viper download sites, which are almost antiquated now in terms of games and features/promos and it wouldn't be a shock if revenues were going down year on year with the rise of the new and better-bonused multi-platform sites. This may be why it makes good business to amalgamate the sites under one umbrella group.
Are player funds ring-fenced though???

A statement from Digimedia would surely put players minds at ease. I just hope the vague FU clause that got Fortune Lounge Group kicked off the accredited list doesn't get adopted by all these casinos across the board. If that happens we would have a sparse accredited section. Thank God for 32Red and lets pray they stay independent.

 

[spintee]

A statement from Digimedia would surely put players minds at ease. I just hope the vague FU clause that got Fortune Lounge Group kicked off the accredited list doesn't get adopted by all these casinos across the board. If that happens we would have a sparse accredited section. Thank God for 32Red and lets pray they stay independent.

If the likse of 32 red jump on the wagon train than thats me done for gambling

 

[Azzurri]

What I want to know is WHY the veil of secrecy, the furtive behaviour?

My guess is their recent history on this site would suggest they couldn't care less about their customers and see them only as purely a revenue raiser and dollar signs. My history with all their sites proved to me over time that they could not care less about me as a loyal customer, and were only concerned with how much I'd be depositing next. That's why the highly rated casinos on this site are so well respected because they prove time and time again that they want our regular feedback and input when making decisions that may affect we the players.

We don't need to know everything, but when questions are raised, there should be no need or reason to dance around straight up answers, and this is why this industry struggles to grow into the transparent, well respected industry it should be by now, just like any other consumer service sector. I bet you'd never see Guts or Betat behave in this manner, because it's obvious they pride themselves on offering a personalized service to their players, and as a result they gain trust and loyalty from the true players amongst us, and ultimately our continued business.

I've been following this thread, but honestly don't care less, as I have already voted with my wallet, and blacklisted all in this group since finding so many more superior options, mainly thanks to this site.

I urge you all to take a good hard look at what's happening with FL, and make a conscious decision regarding whether you continue your relations with any casinos within this group. I think there is more than enough clear evidence here on CM to suggest their intent is only to satisfy their selfish agenda, and their customers are nothing more than an after thought to fund their plans and fatten their pockets. As harsh as this may sound, I have not seen anything so far to suggest this group care what we think, nor what Bryan thinks, hence I have come to this conclusion.

Anyone who has ever worked in a customer service role at any capacity, knows the first golden rule is, we strive to do whatever we can to satisfy our customers, and ensure the best possible experience, value for money, and most importantly clear transparency of the organisations practices and ethics. There is no excuse why a group the size of FL have decided to ignore this motto, other than the fact that customer satisfaction has taken a back seat to more important plans of consistent growth and profits. The longer players continue to accept this from them, and continue to play at their casinos, the longer FL will continue to adopt this behavior; as why would they want to change things when their customers are showing no signs of unrest or abandonment? Players have an obligation to smarten up if we truly want to legitimize this industry and rid it of the criminals and cowboys.

To do this we have to make our opinions and voice count, and this will never happen if we continue to standby comfortably or lazily, whilst expecting change through someone else's efforts on a forum or other medium. Whilst this is a great start, if some of us choose to be passengers and observers, there will never be any pressure on groups such as FL to change their current position whilst the money continues to roll in. This is obvious by their lack of concern at being removed from the accredited list and choosing to ignore Bryan's attempts at engaging in active resolution and communication. We all need to fight smart if we truly seek change and positive resolution, and as the consumer, we ultimately hold the most powerful of weapons, that when combined collectively has the power to win the war in the consumer's favor with immediate effect and little bloodshed; whilst ultimately ensuring any casino or group who chooses to resist our request for transparency, will have no choice but to concede defeat and engage in ethical practices with the players best interests in mind. This weapon is the one thing these businesses can't survive without.

This weapon is our funding.

Force change, vote with your wallets, and have the will power to walk away and break all relations with these groups. Respect yourselves and the game enough to actively make decisions that only contribute to empowering and increasing the growth of the casinos who we know value and respect the consumer, and constantly prove their worth by their actions, and in the process we will all benefit collectively, and individually, but more importantly the industry as a whole will be able to finally break through the negative stigmas that have continued to lurk in the shadows consistently breeding the same cancers that have plagued it for years and hurt all involved.

CM proves there is enough of us within the community who care enough to make this happen, and finally band together to proactively make a difference by demanding change through something as simple as closing an account and instead supporting those that are always doing the right thing by us and the industry. Collectively and continually complaining about the same issues over and over is not enough, hence I think repeated threads regarding the same culprits is a pointless exercise, other than maybe the initial op that raises a concern with the intent to notify the masses of a potential issue that could affect other fellow punters.

My message is long, yet very clear, and I have based it on the evidence I have read within this and other threads regarding this group. I think I have made the correct assumptions regarding what many of you are trying to achieve by raising these concerns, so I confidently and wholeheartedly urge you all to digest it, and accept it for the black and white opinion it is, as not an ounce of arrogance leads me to finally say, this should be the final word regarding all issues related to this group, and any other group who decide to exhibit similar behaviors and disrespect towards those that support them either financially, or via the very generous free advertising and equally influential endorsement that sites like Casinomeister offer, and the massive audience they reach worldwide. The disrespect they have shown Bryan and Max alone is such a slap in the face, and a driving force behind my decision to address this at length, as I was shocked FL would show such hubris in their response to many of the issues raised, after the ongoing support they have received in return.

In such a saturated market, CM as a one stop tool and information desk for consumers is absolutely invaluable, and equally so, it is an invaluable resource for the casinos to use as a direct connection between casino and player, and any group who choose not to take full advantage of that is at the very least, choosing to engage in poor business practices and ignore the unlimited potential it has to reach your target audience directly, whilst enhancing your business from a marketing perspective, and the huge power word of mouth referrals, and visual recommendations have in contributing to any businesses future growth financially, and from a clientele perspective.

Remember, it's easy to excuse those who knew no better, and as a result remained dormant, and oblivious to the fact that the solution to their problem was always readily accessible and easy to implement all along.

We are well educated, well informed, and have many experienced minds and industry contacts at our disposal, so it begs the question;

What's our excuse?

 

[Dinahnana]

If the likse of 32 red jump on the wagon train than thats me done for gambling

I doubt that would happen 32Red are way too classy for that

 

[dunover]

My guess is their recent history on this site would suggest they couldn't care less about their customers and see them only as purely a revenue raiser and dollar signs. My history with all their sites proved to me over time that they could not care less about me as a loyal customer, and were only concerned with how much I'd be depositing next. That's why the highly rated casinos on this site are so well respected because they prove time and time again that they want our regular feedback and input when making decisions that may affect we the players.

We don't need to know everything, but when questions are raised, there should be no need or reason to dance around straight up answers, and this is why this industry struggles to grow into the transparent, well respected industry it should be by now, just like any other consumer service sector. I bet you'd never see Guts or Betat behave in this manner, because it's obvious they pride themselves on offering a personalized service to their players, and as a result they gain trust and loyalty from the true players amongst us, and ultimately our continued business.

I've been following this thread, but honestly don't care less, as I have already voted with my wallet, and blacklisted all in this group since finding so many more superior options, mainly thanks to this site.

I urge you all to take a good hard look at what's happening with FL, and make a conscious decision regarding whether you continue your relations with any casinos within this group. I think there is more than enough clear evidence here on CM to suggest their intent is only to satisfy their selfish agenda, and their customers are nothing more than an after thought to fund their plans and fatten their pockets. As harsh as this may sound, I have not seen anything so far to suggest this group care what we think, nor what Bryan thinks, hence I have come to this conclusion.

Anyone who has ever worked in a customer service role at any capacity, knows the first golden rule is, we strive to do whatever we can to satisfy our customers, and ensure the best possible experience, value for money, and most importantly clear transparency of the organisations practices and ethics. There is no excuse why a group the size of FL have decided to ignore this motto, other than the fact that customer satisfaction has taken a back seat to more important plans of consistent growth and profits. The longer players continue to accept this from them, and continue to play at their casinos, the longer FL will continue to adopt this behavior, as why would they want to change things when their customers are showing no sign of unrest or dissatisfaction? Players have an obligation to wisen up if we truely want to legitimize this industry and rid it of the criminals and cowboys.


To do this we have to make our opinions and voice count, and this will never happen if we continue to standby comfortably or lazily, whilst expecting change through someone else's efforts on a forum or other medium. Whilst this is a great start, if some of us choose to be passengers and observers, there will never be any pressure on groups such as FL to change their current position whilst the money continues to roll in. This is obvious by their lack of concern at being removed from the accredited list and choosing to ignore Bryan's attempts at engaging in active resolution and communication. We all need to fight smart if we truely seek change and positive resolution and answers, and as the consumer, we ultimately hold the most powerful of weapons that when combined collectively, has the power to win the war in the consumer's favor with immediate effect and little bloodshed, whilst ultimately ensuring any casino or group who choose to resist transparency, will have no choice but to concede defeat and engage in ethical practices with the players best interests in mind. This weapon is the one thing these businesses can't survive without.

This weapon is our funding.

Force change, vote with your wallets, and have the will power to walk away and break all relations with these groups. Respect yourselves and the game enough to actively make decisions that only contribute to empowering and increasing the growth of the casinos who we know value and respect the consumer, and constantly prove their worth by their actions, and in the process we will all benefit collectively, and individually, but more importantly the industry as a whole will be able to finally break through the negative stigmas that have continued to lurk in the shadows consistently breeding the same cancers that have plagued it for years and hurt all involved.

CM proves there is enough of us within the community who care enough to make this happen, and finally band together to proactively make a difference by demanding change through something as simple as closing an account and instead supporting those that are always doing the right thing by us and the industry. Collectively and continually complaining about the same issues over and over is not enough, hence I think repeated threads regarding the same culprits is a pointless exercise, other than maybe the initial op that raises a concern with the intent to notify the masses of a potential issue that could affect other fellow punters.

My message is long, yet very clear, and I have based it on the evidence I have read within this and other threads regarding this group. I think I have made the correct assumptions regarding what many of you are trying to achieve by raising these concerns, so I confidently and wholeheartedly urge you all to digest it, and accept it for the black and white opinion it is, as not an once of arrogance leads me to finally say, this should be the final word regarding all issues related to this group, and any other group who decide to exhibit similar behaviours and disrespect towards those that support them either financially, or via the very generous free advertising and equally influential endorsement that sites like Casinomeister offer, and the massive audience they reach worldwide. The disrespect they have shown Bryan and Max alone is such a slap in the face, and a driving force behind my decision to address this at length, as I was shocked FL would show such hubris in their response to many of the issues raised, after the ongoing support they have received in return.

In such a saturated market, CM as a one stop tool and information desk for consumers is absolutely invaluable, and equally so, it is an invaluable resource for the casinos to use as a direct connection between casino and player, and any group who choose not to take full advantage of that is at the very least, choosing to engage in poor business practices and ignore the unlimited potential it has to reach your target audience directly, whilst enhancing your business from a marketing perspective, and the huge power word of mouth referrals, and visual recommendations have in contributing to any businesses future growth financially, and from a clientele perspective.

Remember, it's easy to excuse those who knew no better, and as a result remained dormant, and oblivious to the fact that the solution to their problem was always readily accessible and easy to implement all along.

We are well educated, well informed, and have many experienced minds and industry contacts at our disposal, so it begs the question;

What's our excuse?

Crikey! Borrowed Vinyl's keyboard?
Seriously a good post, and you'll be delighted to know that I have closed Red Flush now as well as major Tom and Lavida previously. But I still get RF and LaVida promo mails........

I think that the accreditation of the lot should be suspended until it becomes clear just who actually is pulling the strings with these casinos and their future licensing, and whether most importantly they have a provable separate account for player funds across ALL their sites.

 

[Dinahnana]

Crikey! Borrowed Vinyl's keyboard?
Seriously a good post, and you'll be delighted to know that I have closed Red Flush now as well as major Tom and Lavida previously. But I still get RF and LaVida promo mails........

I think that the accreditation of the lot should be suspended until it becomes clear just who actually is pulling the strings with these casinos and their future licensing, and whether most importantly they have a provable separate account for player funds across ALL their sites.

I agree 100%.

 

[Azzurri]

Crikey! Borrowed Vinyl's keyboard?
Seriously a good post, and you'll be delighted to know that I have closed Red Flush now as well as major Tom and Lavida previously. But I still get RF and LaVida promo mails........

I think that the accreditation of the lot should be suspended until it becomes clear just who actually is pulling the strings with these casinos and their future licensing, and whether most importantly they have a provable separate account for player funds across ALL their sites.

I was his teacher.

Not exactly sure what you mean by that last comment dunover, but I have previously discussed multiple casino accounts of mine with only the one CS agent of an individual casino of the group, including the gathering of exact stats and figures such as YTD transactions across all sites. Is this what you are referring too, and are you against this practice? Just want to make sure I understand you.

 

[Tirilej]

@ Azzurri
That is a half book in English for me, and probably most outside English spoken countries.
If you want to reach us all with your posts then please make it a little easier and especially with fewer words.

I try read it again another day...

 

[Dinahnana]

I was his teacher.

Not exactly sure what you mean by that last comment dunover, but I have previously discussed multiple casino accounts of mine with only the one CS agent of an individual casino of the group, including the gathering of exact stats and figures such as YTD transactions across all sites. Is this what you are referring too, and are you against this practice? Just want to make sure I understand you.

No he means segregated players funds from casinos operating costs which is what the license (Malta) requires. This means that if God forbid the casino goes under players will be paid.
In 2012 Purple Lounge went bust and it was discovered shortly after they failed to segregate players funds. The LGA did squat since they had already cancelled the license.

 

[dunover]

No he means segregated players funds from casinos operating costs which is what the license (Malta) requires. This means that if God forbid the casino goes under players will be paid.
In 2012 Purple Lounge went bust and it was discovered shortly after they failed to segregate players funds. The LGA did squat since they had already cancelled the license.

Yes, that's exactly what I meant Azzuri.

Now the Maltese LGA are about as useful as chocolate fireguards, but weren't RF group Kannawake licensed? This LGA by all accounts is more reliable and keener to enforce fair play and good financials.
It will interesting to see where this group subsequently licence their product.

 

[Silana80]

A statement from Digimedia would surely put players minds at ease. I just hope the vague FU clause that got Fortune Lounge Group kicked off the accredited list doesn't get adopted by all these casinos across the board. If that happens we would have a sparse accredited section. Thank God for 32Red and lets pray they stay independent.

Back in the beginning of March this year Jackpotfactory casinos and Redflush casinos changed their bonus rules and now they are pretty similar to those of Fortune Lounge.

 

[ChillBill]

I doubt that would happen 32Red are way too classy for that

IMHO no casino can be trusted 100%.

32Red Plc are, in most cases, heads and shoulders above what's out there. Though, lets not forget, they pulled their seven day processing, on the claim (err excuse), to members here, it was due to UK Banking etc etc. A lot of members doubted that story. I myself was told by a 32Red pitboss, it had nothing to do with UK Banking accounts. 7 day a week processing was yanked because 25% of all withdrawals over the weekend are likely to be reversed because they no longer process 7 days a week. I'm sure over this years four day Easter Break, they paid out a lot less in withdrawals.

Classy as they maybe, when the bottom line spells cash, imo it's fool-hardy to give blind faith to anyone

 

[243 lines=daft]

Of all the Viper MGS casinos right now I'd say Jackpot City are the best. While their T&Cs could be tidied up a bit, in practice they are faster paying than 32 Red and the CS is excellent, friendly and pro-active.

32 Red are good but I don't think the cult of uncritical worship that has sprung up around them is particularly healthy and hopefully for the sake of constructive competition the Belle Rock group continue to offer their own thing and don't end up getting sucked into an unsatisfactory ubergroup with Fortune Lounge / Jackpot Factory et al.

Mind you the last withdrawal I made from Jackpot City reads 'DIGIMEDIA' on my statement... Hmm