Crystal Palace: Crystal Clear Their Criminals!!

[whitteyford]

I against all my instincts decided to try playing Crystal Palaces sign up offer as I am a big fan of RTG software, and felt like gambling, not only at the games, but also whether I would get paid if I won. Knowing that most RTG's despise flat betting, I was throwing around bets ranging from 5$ to 25$ to 50$ thinking that this would classify me as a true gambler. Fortunately I won at the games, but as far as actually getting paid I think I'm gonna take a beating. After wager miles beyond their requirements for cashing out and not breaking any game playing rules or any other rules at this trash casino I cashed out a modest win only to have my account locked the next day. It has been about 3 weeks since the locking and about 5 phone calls to their support which have gone nowhere, other then finding out the account is under investigation, for what they wont disclose. So just a little reminder to all, CRYSTAL PALACE IS A PIECE OF CRAP who wont even payout the smallest of wins. These guys should be on the rogue list of every website ever made. To conclude, CRYSTAL PALACE IS RUN BY THIEVING LOWLIFES. Now that I have vented I feel somewhat better, hey its only 150$ and I shoulda known better...my bad.

 

[The Dude]

Crystal Palace, are you monitoring this? I'm available in Montreal if you want to discus...

 

[glodge]

Another RTG why am I not surprised.
Apart from Inetbet, ( even though they are RTG software ) I haven't heard of any dramas from this group. The fact still remains that these casino's are not licensed.

All the same, I'm sorry to hear you got screwed whitteyford.

 

[OliverCurran]

Dear Mr x and Mr xyz (a.k.a. whitteyford et. al.),

The information you have posted here is a blatant fraud, just like the fraud you attempted to conduct at Crystal Palace Casino.

Unfortunately for you, you were not able to get away with your attempt to defraud Crystal Palace, and I will not allow you to post your false allegations on this site without some clarification with regards to the facts.

The facts are that our highly specialized fraud department detected a clear link between the times you downloaded and registered with the casino, the location of the IP servers, and the gaming patterns used.

As far as your claim to have wagered miles beyond the wagering requirements, this is categorically false.

It is perfectly clear that this is an attempt by two bored youths who instead of studying, have decided to try and make a quick buck by committing bonus abuse. Perhaps if you were studying a bit more, then you would be a bit cleverer about tactics and would not try to commit such a transparent abuse.

Crystal Palace ALWAYS pays out legitimate players in a timely fashion.

However, we have learnt from previous experience that there are many rotten apples out there trying to defraud us. We have to be vigilant when it comes to fraud. Without maintaining these high levels of vigilance, we would not be able to offer our legitimate players the generous bonuses they deserve on a regular basis.

Many online casinos can no longer afford to offer players regular bonuses. This is because they have found the level of fraud to be so high each time they run such promotions. At Crystal Palace we strongly take the view that it is not fair to punish legitimate players by denying them regular promotional bonuses. It is precisely for this reason that we will not allow people such as Mr x and Mr xyz to deny legitimate players what they deserve.

We make no apologies for this whatsoever.

Oliver Curran
Customer Relations Manager
Crystal Palace Casino

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[email protected]
US Toll Free: 1 800 824 3175




(Message edited by admin on June 18, 2003)

(Message edited by admin on June 19, 2003)

 

[fortunecookie]

This is to update interested parties that Crystal Palace finally paid my cashin.

It was an experience I rather do without.

 

[glodge]

oliver_curran,

I view your release to a public forum, personal details of which were intrusted to Crystal Palace Casino; Crystalpalacecasino.com T&C's ( 7. Personal identity and details of all members will remain confidential. )

As a blatent disregard in security of personal data. Having displayed this form of contempt, anything after this stated in the casino's defense is not worth JS IMHO.

 

[fortunelounge]

Crystal Palace did not release any personal information.

There is no difference between the information supplied in their posting and the information about the evil Rhonda X in the "Evil Players" section.

 

[glodge]

fortunelounge,

There is a BIG difference, especially when there is no proof to justify the claim that whitteyford, is guilty of fruad.

Are you saying that the fortunelounge ( I asume you represent this casino group ) would display the same type of contempt given, if they were in Crystal Palace Casino's place? I hope not!

If the casino feels so strongly towards their claims of fruad, have they credited back whitteyford orginal deposit, I doubt it!

Now if the casino had posted that their fraud department had dectected anomalies in
whitteyford casino account, and due to their fruad prevention methods, they have closed the account, & issued a refund of the deposit made, Crystal Palace Casino would have probably walked away from this, without any scars, couple of sneers maybe.

However the release of personal information given on the pretext that it will remain confidential to Crystal Palace Casino, has been released.
Then to follow this with an attempted character assination, is BS & in my book anything this casino posts in future, trashes any credibility & or integrity they had before this post.

In regards to your quasi justifaction of Evil Rhonda fiasco, if you'd like to discuss this in a seperate topic, be my guest post away & I'll give you my thoughts.

 

[caruso]

Reading glasses on please, Fortunelounge:

"Dear Mr TXXXXX and Mr. MXXXXX (a.k.a. whitteyford et. al.)"

This is blatant discloure of confidential information, and tells us just about all we need to know about "Oliver Curran". It should also be removed by the board mods post haste.

To Oliver Curran, a.k.a. Warren Cloud, a.k.a Richard Brooks - you were defrauding players within a day of opening. There are more threads across the boards about theft on the part of your casinos than any other group - even Virtual, if that's possible.

The only wrongdoing on the part of "Whitteyford" was depositing with you in the first place.

For those who don't know - Oliver Curran a.k.a. Warren Cloud a.k.a. Richard Brooks is possibly THE most notorious cyber-crook currently in the business. If you make deposits into either of his current operations - High Rollers Lounge or Crystal Palace, which he opened up after the Casino Extreme group kicked him out - you have absolutely only yourselves to blame.

 

[glodge]

Thanks for the heads up on this one caruso

The name rang a bell but couldn't tie it in.

Casinomeister Forum where would we be without it!

(Message edited by glodge on June 17, 2003)

 

[jpm]

I'd have to agree with fortune lounge on this one. Crystal Palace posted two names that 'whitteyford' apparently used at their casino, but we don't know if either of those names are real people. We don't have first names and don't know even what country these two 'people' are from.

As far as their reason for banning this person (people?), they are pretty specific about it this time. I haven't seen them post anything this specific in previous threads on problems with Crystal Palace. The previous things were more like accusations of 'advantage play', etc. This is very specific and thus makes it difficult for me to tell whom to believe.

Crystal Palace has its tainted past, but this is a very specific accusation against whitteyford. I'll leave it to the c'meister to sort this one out!

I do have to take issue with the statement that "Many online casinos can no longer afford to offer players regular bonuses. This is because they have found the level of fraud to be so high each time they run such promotions.". Why is it then that groups such as Fortune Lounge and Crown Vegas can offer its players bonuses every weekend? Sometimes even twice a week. And Fortune's playthru requirements are far less than most (5x deposit+bonus as opposed to CV's 15x or 20x if playing bj or vp). What are they all doing differently that prevents the high level of fraud the Crystal Palace refers to?

 

[whitteyford]

Actually, my friend brought this to my attention so I told him I'd post the info for him about the amazing ability of Crystal Palace to be rogue as it gets as he knows I spend time on the net checking out these forums. Unfortunately instead of trying to make good of the situation, Crystal Palace has gone and broken the level of confidentiality between a casino and player.
The player I am speaking on there behalf is from an area of Canada which shares the same IP server with about 500 000 people, thus the first 5 numbers of the address are the same. Now as I see it Crystal Palace is linking these accounts on the fact that 2 of 500 000 people where out to defraud there casino, and did not consider that within these 500 000 people it may be a coincidence that 2 people decided to play their casino on the same day. (Eventhough I'm surprised anyone would play at there crap hole casino)Now jumping to the conclusion of fraud based on IP and play behavoir seems to be a little extreme, espeicially since my friend has no idea of this other player, which has so caliously been revealed by these morons. I hope they make an attempt to right this situation and pay the players the money thier owed as well as a public apology for the way they have been publically treated. I vote Crystal Palace to be placed on the rogue list due to this terrible handling of this situation.

 

[cipher]

I'm more than a little concerned as to the commentary by "fortunelounge."

According to the information available here at Casinomeister on "fortunelounge" he or she claims to be a V.P. of Casino Operations with a Homepage URL of:

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

And that in and of itself makes me feel great about the decision that I made some time ago to stay clear of anything having to do with the Fortune Group.

 

[jetset]

Whilst I agree that privacy is a critical element that should never have been breached by Mr Curran earlier today, I think it is going off at a tangent to start lambasting Fortune Lounge for one possibly ill-advised post agreeing with Currans actions.

Perhaps we should remember that over the past few weeks the person posting as Fortune Lounge and VP of their Ops has been making what appears to be a sincere effort to redress hassles and take a more player sensitive course.

 

[whitteyford]

FL has definitely been going through some vast improvements in their casinos over the last little while. This being said we should stick to the topic at hand, that is, the unacceptable manor with which they (Crystal Palace) are handling this matter. Divulging player info is a direct violation of their own site:
"CRYSTAL PALACE T&C
7. Personal identity and details of all members will remain confidential. Crystal Palace.com will not report wagering information on behalf of any member."

Mr Curran, not only are you making a gross error in assuming player fraud, but are violating your own T and C's. If the casino manager doesnt have to follow the rules of the casino then the rules are meaningless are they not? Anyone who is considering playing this casino beware, if they require you to send ID you may see it posted on public websites.

As well the casino assumed fraud based on IP addresses to which the high speed provider offers to over 500 000 people...I bet they have a few other players within this IP range, have you locked there accounts and stolen there money as well Oliver? Perhaps you should get your head out of your ass and accept the fact that in casinos some players win and some lose and if you dont play the players that win you will feel their rath and suffer the consequences of all this negative publicity. Perhaps you can save what little face you have left and pay up you crooked prick.

 

[cipher]

JetSet I couldn't disagree more.

Anyone who holds him or herself out as a Vice President of Operations for any casino let alone a group of casinos, should be engaging his or her brain before engaging his or her mouth.

I've been on the end of an RTG casino posting my personal information over the internet as well as RTG casinos sending goons to my office, when I refused back down from them over $10,000.00 that was owed to me.

Additionally, Jetset you might choose to consider my conduct towards Fortune Lounge to be that of "lambasting" as well it should be, but until such time as you've been in such a position you would be well advise to re-think your commentary.

Anytime any player gives as much as an inch to casino operators the likes of any RTG casino with regards releasing private and personal data they are only encouraging even more serious things to come about.

 

[The Dude]

Jeesus,

I go away for a day, and look what happens.

Crystal Palace? Disclosing player info in this forum is VERY uncool. Unless you had express permission from this player to disclose this information, I don't want to see it.

Fortune Lounge? Dude, I understand your thoughts, but this can not be compared to how Rhonda's X case was handled. Her real name was never discloded during my expose.

One of the things that players expect from online casinos is that player info is to be kept confidential.

Frustrated Crystal Palace may be, but it is no excuse that these names were posted (they have been removed). Bad casino practice comes to mind; please don't do things here that will bite you in the ass later.

 

[glodge]

For the record, FL & I have discussed our views, via e-mail. Without out pissing in anyone's pocket, it is IMO that the poster FL is as jetset has said

" over the past few weeks the person posting as Fortune Lounge and VP of their Ops has been making what appears to be a sincere effort to redress hassles and take a more player sensitive course."

I found FL to be very polite & accommodating, nothing like the old version I had dealt with in the past. IMO time again will tell.

 

[jpm]

I can personally attest to that glodge. They addressed and corrected not just the issue I posted about here last week, but also one I had subsequently that involved a cashin. Both were corrected within a day and with extreme courtesy and apologies.

FL is the only MG casino group that I will play at regularly from now on, and won't mind so much if I lose.

 

[glodge]

Yes that is certainly a good sign jpm

Now if they can work at getting PCS to process their payouts quickly, that would be a BIG +. Fortunately I now have a gaming card ( 48 hour payouts ) , but I know what is was like when I didn't. If FL could get the edge here on the payouts, I think we may all be plesantly surprised in their new customer releationship services.

 

[jpm]

Is neteller not available to you in Oz? That's the best, fastest method that I've found for getting paid from virtually every casino.

 

[glodge]

Yes neteller is available out here, however it's really a hassle. Most payment systems are set up for the USA player. My bank is really tight on Credit Card payments to online gambling. Hence the only other way I can fund neteller is via WU or a bank wire.

Which is cool, but then getting the funds is another hassle in itself. Lets just say that if I get a check, ( even by DHL or Fedex it can take 7 - 10 days to arrive, normal air mail 3 - 5 weeks ) then I have to place it in my bank account. It takes a further 21 working days to clear. Sure I can have the funds wired form neteller but it's more stuffing around.

I find with the gaming card, it is hooked up to my infinia card & I just got the the ATM here in OZ and pull the cash out. Only problem I can only use this at MG casino's.

Lately I have not been gambling too much, trying to save to buy an appartment.

On the bright side it could be worse.

Thanks for the heads up anyway jpm, much appreciated

 

[whitteyford]

Perhaps we should start a thread on how much FL is improving, (which they are) but you are detracting attention away from the scumbags at Crystal Palace and how they are divulging player info publicly and claiming players are fraudulent with virtually no evidence!!!

 

[glodge]

sorry for derailing the topic

 

[jetset]

Latest from Montreal is that NetTeller will be available in UK from September 2003 (its on their GIGSE stand)

 

[glodge]

Ok jetset, seeing your there ( Montreal ) how about digging up some gambling news regarding us aussies? Over 700,000 of us gamble online each month.

For instance, Boss Media casino's, used to have a e-commerce suite that allowed me to send money to their webdollar account here at an Australian bank.

The new version of software does not allow this anymore, I'd be interested in knowing why?

Would a pretty please with sugar on top help

 

[glodge]

Ooops I did it again!

 

[whitteyford]

My friend just talked to casino support, Im assuming, Mr. Curran, he was rudely told that the casino will be keeping his money, not only winnings but also his original deposit. This coupled with their posting personnel information on a public website definitetly solidifies the fact that these guys are absolute criminals and that there casino should be placed on the rogue list of casinos. Casinomeister, I ask, are these behaviors not worthy of rogue status.

 

[The Dude]

This is totally unacceptable. I'll be speaking to RTG about this (again) tomorrow.

 

[whitteyford]

Thanks a lot Meister, as much as 150$ isnt a big sum of money, the way my freind has been treated is just beyond comprehension for such a small sum. This shows the true colours of these criminals.

 

[jetset]

Regret couldnt find Boss Media here!

 

[thesmacker]

I am the friend of Whitteyfords whos name has been posted on this site as a fraudulent player. Not only am I disallusioned that the casino would claim that I have comitted fraud, but posting my name in this forum seems like the lowest form of customer service since I have done nothing wrong. Being from Canada and using the largest high speed internet provider in my area I believe would have similar IPs for a tremendously large number of people, being that all people in this area would have the same starting 5 numbers in their IP, thus making it possible that a number of people from within that region may have signed up at a casino at any one given time. And being how the bonus is structured at Crystal Palace, I would imagine that most players would play it fairly similarly, being that you must cashout an amount over the amount of the deposit and sign up bonus. This is why I cannot understand the lengths that Crystal Palace is taking in order to steal a modest win at their casino, which in no way was fraudulent, but mere coincidence. Then to speak with this casino on the phone and be given nothing but disrespect and attitude, and then to have my name posted on an online forum seems just obscene to me. I cannot understand the business practices undertaken by this shady group, definitely making them look terrible in the eyes of other players, thus decreasing the amount of business that they will generate. I only hope this ugly situation will divert any future possible clients of Crystal Palace casino to go play eleswhere as there are many fine casinos to play at where you will recieve payment and not suffer breach of confidentiality. Casinomeister thankyou for allowing me to use your medium as a means of getting the message out that Crystal Palace Casino is not worthy of any business and has stolen money from me and thus will probably continue to steal from others. The goings on here with my account, I would say being unprecedented definitely makes Crystal Palace worthy of being on the Rogue casino list.

 

[imswhite]

My experience with Crystal Palace was mixed.

I had very good luck with video poker and tried to withdraw the deposit and bonus, leaving my winnings in the account, after finishing my first deposit bonus wagering. I always do that to see how well the casino pays cash-ins and to officially end the promotion with all of it's restrictions. Some casinos keep their bonus play restrictions as long as the bonus funds are still in your account... even after the wagering requirements have been met!!

Two times during the next month, the cash-in was reversed back into my account and (based on comments in this forum) I suspected that I would never see any money. During this time, I went to the casino to check on the withdrawal status and play video poker with the balance of my winnings.

After the first reversal, they said to try it again. After the second one, they said that it had to be for MORE than the sum of the deposit plus bonus, to show a profit from wagering. (Some casino's will not pay out the bonus if you have lost any part of it.)

OK... The third time I requested my full account balance and soon found that I could no longer get into the casino to gamble. (I have never had an account locked before.) Oliver Curran gave this reason:
---------------------------------
Unfortunately your account has been closed by the management due to the nature of your wagering.

As you have wagered just over the minimum requirements, your account will not be kept open and you will not be authorized to partake in any future bonuses.

However as you have met the terms for the initial sign-on bonus, your current withdrawal will be processed to you shortly.
-------------------------------------------

OK... it's their casino... they make the rules! I did not argue about it and found that Oliver Curran was responsive to my email and was very courteous. Three weeks later, I did find my full account balance in my NETeller account.

Steve

 

[thesmacker]

Casinomeister, just wondering how your conversations with RTG were on this matter. Any updates?

 

[thesmacker]

After one last call to the casino, the customer support said never to call back and that I wont see my deposit back ever....I guess this has become acceptable practice for casinos these days. There is obviously no recourse, I guess you just have to avoid these rogue places, and all of this to steal a measley 150$, very pathetic!!!

 

[glodge]

thesmacker,

Yes unfortunately you are 100% right!

$150 buck times this by all the other players that have been screwed; not everyone know's about the Meister or posts about their misfortune.

 

[spearmaster]

If their phone number is a 1-800 number, I would call them back and tell them that you are going to keep calling until you get your $150 back. Like once an hour.

Each call probably costs them a couple of bucks. If anything, you will always have the satisfaction in knowing that they never got to spend any of the $150 that they unfairly took from you.

Needless to say, there is little hope that I will ever promote them - and if this is what they do to players, then it would serve them right to have massive phone bills.

 

[jpm]

I would charge back my deposit as this sounds like a clear case of theft.

 

[thesmacker]

Oh trust me if I didnt deposit with neteller I would have chargedback a while ago, the only downfall of neteller. On the upside I played a great casino yesterday, Supervegas, as per the recommendatin on this site and wow, I dont think I've ever been paid so fast. As well, their live chat is more then helpful and pleasant. So there are good casinos out there, unfortunately I played Crystal Palace which is run by thieving lowlifes.

 

[thesmacker]

Casinomeister, I was just wondering what these guys said to you when, (if you did) you talked to them in Montreal? As well, have you thought about placing these guys in the "not recommended" list or "rogue" list of casinos on this site?

 

[divine]

I am owed several thousands dollars by this group as well. They are giving me the blowoff at the moment.

I deposited 150 and received a 150 bonus.

I am not sure what to do

Jessica

 

[The Dude]

Hey smacker,

Forward me your username at Crystal Palace, real name, amount owed, how much is the deposit/winnings, and since when.

I'm going in about ten directions right now, since I'm going on vacation tomorrow. But if you get this to me right away, I'll try to get it to the right individuals before I leave.

 

[rainman]

vacation again? wow. ANyways I tried checking log viewer and no activity at all comes up. Do you know any way I can view this for blackjack?

 

[The Dude]

vacation again?

This is my first vacation since last June!

 

[jpm]

Umm, Bryan, you did not check with all of us before planning this vacation, so I'm sorry but you can't leave.

 

[ionizer]

I'm owed about 400.00 from this place as well. They make up excuse after excuse

 

[thesmacker]

I just pitched a bitch to casinomeister. I dont expect any miracles because they wont even pay their other debts with TVS group. Either way I think they belong in the rogue section for 1 stealing money and 2 breaching the player casino confidentiality agreement.

 

[dizzyd]

2/15/03dep$150for$150x7=$2100
wagered $987.50 2's W
wagered $830 $10 BJ
wagered $665 $5 BJ
total $2482
bal 551
2/17 cashout $550
2/18 fax form sent
2/26 acct locked
money back to neteller 4/26

I recvd an email stating my acct. was locked for varying bet size in BJ. They stated that this showed bonus abuzer tendencies. It took 2 1/2 months but they finally paid.
I sent emails once a week after the first month.

 

[skidmark]

Smacker, what were you thinking playing at this casino. It is the biggest shame on the net. Perhaps do your homework before depositing next time and you wont run into these problems. If Bryan can get money back out of this casino whether the account is fraudulent or not I will eat my own crap . These guys are notorius for theft, the manager is a lowlife wacko.

 

[thesmacker]

I realize skidmark that playing at this casino was a mistake, but that gives the casino no right to do what they did to me.

1) Stealing my money. Including deposit.
and
2) Putting my name in this site and WOL thus breaking casino/player privacy aggreement which is stated in their terms.

Casinomeister I have not heard from you since I pitched a bitch, is their any progress? Not that Im expecting any money back from this sleazy casino but I would just like to know if you have contacted them? As well have you considered putting them in the rogue category?
Thnx