Betphoenix experiences?

[Smokeycasino]

I have heard about them before and I was about to try it. Until I read this one. Now I won't try it anymore. Such casino is not worthy for me.

Yes, they've been uninstalled for months now, they're just another crappy RTG site.

 

[deucebag]

CDS?

I hope you mean the Cloth Diaper Service.

At least you would have a chance with them.

I don't know, it doesn't look like they're completely useless all of the time. I received a payment today and was told I will get the remainder next week. So it appears that things are moving again.

 

[Balky]

Cool. Keep us updated please.

Balky

 

[jelsmith]

I don't know, it doesn't look like they're completely useless all of the time. I received a payment today and was told I will get the remainder next week. So it appears that things are moving again.

so how long has it been to get a few payments.....you should not have to jump through hoops to get paid....its effin ridiculous. I would demand PIF today seeing as how any WD limits have acumulated in your favor.....

 

[greasemonkey]

I don't know, it doesn't look like they're completely useless all of the time. I received a payment today and was told I will get the remainder next week. So it appears that things are moving again.

If they respond to you please go back in to the CDS site and try to respond or add to your complaint then hit the "submit" button. Please see if it works for you. It absolutely will not work for me and it drives me crazy.... see here:
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/cds.41931/

 

[Nate]

I don't see them on the Accredited List anymore... Were they even there to begin with?

Can a MOD please clarify?

Nate

 

[The Dude]

Can a MOD please clarify?

Nate

Eh? You don't see them because they never were.

 

[Nate]

Eh? You don't see them because they never were.

Lol... Old age? I though they were on the Accredited list for some odd reason. My Bad. Thanks Bryan.

 

[The Dude]

By the way, has anyone bothered to contact the Casino Rep Nicolas?
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/

We have a policy in the forum that when you post complaints you also PM the casino rep to give him or her a heads up. It's not really an option but a rule which is posted here:
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/help/

You'll find that once a casino rep is made aware of an issue, it is expedited in most circumstances. To go on bitching about an issue and not making the casino rep aware of this is just venting and a waste of most people's time.

If you have contacted a casino rep, and he or she doesn't respond, then of course I or the other moderators should be made aware of this. Thank you.

 

[De Beuker]

I disagree. I won $7-8k last May, and still haven't been paid in full from that. The first payment was quick, but since then it's been a joke. I've contacted Nicolas twice through PM, and the first time it resulted in a payment, but I have not been paid anything in 3 months now.

BetPhoenix haven't responded to emails in months either, and live chat never works (suspect I'm chat banned).

Filed a complaint with CDS today, so let's see how that goes.

If you play there, make sure you don't win more than what will be paid in one installment. They don't like bigger winners.

So yes, he did, twice.

I think that if anyone is waiting TEN MONTHS for a payment, they have all the right to post about it.
No matter if the rep. can solve it now, its beyond ridiculous!

 

[The Dude]

So yes, he did, twice.

I think that if anyone is waiting TEN MONTHS for a payment, they have all the right to post about it.
No matter if the rep. can solve it now, its beyond ridiculous!

Okay - fine, I missed that comment.

Nicolas should be on top of this - I'm unsure why he hasn't responded since he's been good about this in the past.

I've PMd him as well (today).

And yeah - ten months in inexcusable, but as a general comment - casino reps need to be dealing with these issues as soon as they appear in the forum. It's not my responsibility to contact them - it's the complaining member.

@deucebag - if a casino rep is not answering your PMs, please contact me. Thanks!

 

[deucebag]

@deucebag - if a casino rep is not answering your PMs, please contact me. Thanks!

Nicolas has been answering my PMs, so no problem there. After my first PM, I received one payment. I PM'ed again about a month ago, and he said I would get priority, but nothing happened.

As I mentioned, I received a payment on Saturday after contacting CDS.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Nicolas has been answering my PMs, so no problem there. After my first PM, I received one payment. I PM'ed again about a month ago, and he said I would get priority, but nothing happened.

As I mentioned, I received a payment on Saturday after contacting CDS.

Whilst Nicholas seems to be acting on this, we are talking TEN MONTHS, and the first payment ONLY came AFTER a prod from CDS.

THis should have been dealt with internally long ago, and WELL before 10 months, the front like CS should have been escalating this issue to higher management, who should have DONE SOMETHING MUCH EARLIER.

It should NOT be the case that after 10 months of patience, the player finally "loses it" and goes public as well as complaining to CDS, and then "all of a sudden" there isn't a problem any more, and payments start coming.

This points to some serious internal problems, where issues just get "passed around", with no-one wanting to deal with it (or it not being "their job"), so despite repeated complaints, no person has actually taken ownership of the problem, and seen it through to a conclusion.

 

[LHofsdal]

Eventhough I think Nicolas is a great rep, I agree with VWM. But, I also know that Nicolas is only 1 person. I am sure he is quite busy with e-mails and PM's. And lets not forget his own personal life.

I am by no means condoning the 10 month period it took to get things resolved. What bothers me the most, is the fact that CDS and Bryan had to get involved. What is happening here? It is not just with BP, but it has occured with other well known groups also. It is becoming the "norm" for lack of a better word.

Can the restrictions from US government be having this much of a strain on the cash flow at these casinos? Don't they have players from other countries, and do they not have reserves for the downtimes? The US government gave enough waring before they started to enforce these laws, did these casinos just think nothing was going to happen?

I can see the rogues pulling this crap like the Virtual group. Afterall they have been doing this for years. So what else can you expect from them. But I also remember reading somewhere that BP was trying to open a sister casino. I don't think it would be wise to do so right now, seeing as how it has taken so long to pay one player. I am sure he is not the only one.

What I have noticed is alot of these groups that are having payment problems are RTG. Can their player base be falling? It seems to me that they are doing everything they can to run their players off. Example: The cap on wins, that is now at the bottom of page 2 of the rules for just about every game, if not every game. I have to ask this, is that RTG doing it or is it the casinos asking that it be done? Lets not forget all the posts about the hundreds of spins that pay out nothing and the lack of features no matter what game you play. That to me says something right there. It seems to me that it is more than 1 player just having a "run of bad luck" here.

The times have changed, and it is clear to see, with casinos not being able to payout in their own specified terms. And some casinos only paying out a portion of your winnings at a time. And then we even read in these threads that payments are being delayed for 1 reason or another.

It is just not safe for the US player, and I think all US players need to be reading the warning signs, because I don't see things changing for a long time.

Just my 2 cents.

All the best,
LH

 

[takethemoney]

I think there is a lot of smoke and mirrors when it comes to the true financial condition of these casinos. I feel much more at ease these days dealing with my land based casino. I have not been taking constant clobberings there either, like online.

 

[deucebag]

Just to update, I've now received the final payment.

But I can't get the "submit" button to work at CDS so I can't update my complaint.

 

[Balky]

I managed to complete the WR from one of those huge sticky bonuses ending up with another cashout, after having had plenty of good hits at several slots - in fact they paid insanely well - among others had gottten 720xbet on Loose Caboose and 500xbet on T-Rex. Hope I will be able to post positive news regarding the withdrawal.

Cheers

Balky

 

[Nifty29]

Sigh.

I just don't understand what possesses members to go back here again given the month long delays recently and deucebag who had to wait TEN MONTHS to get paid and only AFTER complaining to CDS.

Wake up and smell the flowers people!

 

[Balky]

I agree with you, Nifty. I played there because I had the impression that they are trying to improve, because they were always responsive to me and because their rep Nicolas Johnson has a very good reputation in this forum. The deposit I made was only 25 bucks anyway with a max cashout - not a big risk either way. I am not trying to recommend the casino or to encourage other members to play, only explaining why I personally deposited there.

Peace

Balky

 

[NicolasJohnson]

Hi Guys and Gals,

There has been a lot of speculation, and few active cases on this thread. For time constraint reasons, I will try to briefly address those cases involving specific issues:

deucebag's case
It has been settled. It was a complicated issue. We committed some mistakes with this user, several under past management (Dean is no longer with us). However, we are confident that the reasons for the issues arising in this case have been settled and will no longer affect our users.

Balky's case
You had contacted me and we paid you. I'm sorry if there is something I'm missing, but I checked your account and see no pending payouts. Please PM me and I'll be glad to provide you with satisfaction to the best of my ability.

@ Everyone,
I know there have been some small, but admittedly unfortunate issues which have negatively effected a very small percentage of our players. Over the next month or two you will see a major change in our business, which we hope will allow us to provide a better, more competitive experience. Something that will not only match your expectations, but surpasses them.

If you wish to wait and see until this promise is fulfilled, I will completely understand. I even encourage you to do so if you have any doubts, since ease of mind when gambling is something essential. You should sweat the hand/spin/roll; not the payout.

Kind Regards,
Nicolas Johnson
Bet Phoenix Casino Affiliates Manager

 

[vinylweatherman]

Hi Guys and Gals,

There has been a lot of speculation, and few active cases on this thread. For time constraint reasons, I will try to briefly address those cases involving specific issues:

deucebag's case
It has been settled. It was a complicated issue. We committed some mistakes with this user, several under past management (Dean is no longer with us). However, we are confident that the reasons for the issues arising in this case have been settled and will no longer affect our users.

Balky's case
You had contacted me and we paid you. I'm sorry if there is something I'm missing, but I checked your account and see no pending payouts. Please PM me and I'll be glad to provide you with satisfaction to the best of my ability.

@ Everyone,
I know there have been some small, but admittedly unfortunate issues which have negatively effected a very small percentage of our players. Over the next month or two you will see a major change in our business, which we hope will allow us to provide a better, more competitive experience. Something that will not only match your expectations, but surpasses them.

If you wish to wait and see until this promise is fulfilled, I will completely understand. I even encourage you to do so if you have any doubts, since ease of mind when gambling is something essential. You should sweat the hand/spin/roll; not the payout.

Kind Regards,
Nicolas Johnson
Bet Phoenix Casino Affiliates Manager

A small number of cases should be easy to deal with, and should not take 10 months unless there is a problem with internal communications. When Dean left, did someone take ownership of any "unfinished business" that he was dealing with, or did players find they had to start right from the beginning with front line CS.

What's with the "submit button" problem with CDS. More and more players have complained about this, making it clear the error is THEIRS, yet despite complaints from players, and a "heads up" direct from Bryan, CDS have done NOTHING, and players CANNOT properly pursue complaints. Worse is the fact that when players cannot reply due to the problem, CDS just assume the issue has been resolved to the player's satisfaction, and close the case.

This looks VERY BAD for the RTG brand as a whole, as if they NEED something to make them look worse.

With all the odd things happening with RTG, the speculation will continue, and we now KNOW that a number of payment issues at RTG sites WERE the result of cashflow problems, initially triggered by the actions of the DoJ.

RTG casinos also rely heavily on the US market, some more than others, and the problems here, without much income from non-US players, only serves to amplify the consequences of DoJ actions.

The EWX incident, and the several weeks of pretence that it was just a "technical glitch", has made players VERY wary of ANY "technical glitch" that holds up their money, even the GENUINE ones (there is no way to tell the difference).

 

[gaydave]

I have never played at bet phoenix and I am sure not about to start. It's too big of a risk, IMO. All of these delays make no sense.
I told a friend of mine to join up and PaB and I hope he does. Apparently he cashed out in September and got a few small partial payments over the months then they took the money out of his casino account yesterday and said he broke a term 6 months after the initial cashout but they won't send him his play history for proof either. I was already doubtful but now there is no way I play here.

 

[anniemac]

Wow, Dave. Your friend really does need to join and PAB. Doesn't sound good to me.

 

[jod5413]

I am confused. Nicholas is the affiliate manager for BetPhoenix? Doesn't that mean he handles all the affiliates out there who run banners for them? Why are we dealing with him rather than an actual Casino manager? Does he wear both hats? Just curious.

 

[NicolasJohnson]

A small number of cases should be easy to deal with, and should not take 10 months unless there is a problem with internal communications. When Dean left, did someone take ownership of any "unfinished business" that he was dealing with, or did players find they had to start right from the beginning with front line CS.

What's with the "submit button" problem with CDS. More and more players have complained about this, making it clear the error is THEIRS, yet despite complaints from players, and a "heads up" direct from Bryan, CDS have done NOTHING, and players CANNOT properly pursue complaints. Worse is the fact that when players cannot reply due to the problem, CDS just assume the issue has been resolved to the player's satisfaction, and close the case.

This looks VERY BAD for the RTG brand as a whole, as if they NEED something to make them look worse.

With all the odd things happening with RTG, the speculation will continue, and we now KNOW that a number of payment issues at RTG sites WERE the result of cashflow problems, initially triggered by the actions of the DoJ.

RTG casinos also rely heavily on the US market, some more than others, and the problems here, without much income from non-US players, only serves to amplify the consequences of DoJ actions.

The EWX incident, and the several weeks of pretence that it was just a "technical glitch", has made players VERY wary of ANY "technical glitch" that holds up their money, even the GENUINE ones (there is no way to tell the difference).

Thanks for your contribution to the thread. Please allow me to try and reply to the different topics covered in your post:

deucebag's case
This was complicated. I'd rather not go into all the details unless the player would like to.

CDS issue
I don't have direct control over that, nor am I a representative of RTG. Therefore I don't have any authority to comment on this issue. I do believe they will fix this.

EWX and Other Issues,
I completely understand the position many players are currently in after recent issues. I completely understand all players who wish to wait until processing issues settle down. In fact, if you ever doubt whether to gamble or not, I'd say choose not. Simply, gambling is about fun, and if you aren't comfortable, you won't have fun, and if there is no fun in it, there is no sense in engaging in any form of wagering.

While we can't guarantee the proper functioning of related 3rd party providers, our own players can rest assured we are well backed, and can handle market fluctuations that will adversely affect our short term financial positions. Again, I will understand those player who do not feel comfortable gambling right now, and even encourage players who are considering it yet feel uncomfortable to avoid gambling, as gambling should be an activity one only engages in if one is comfortable.

I have never played at bet phoenix and I am sure not about to start. It's too big of a risk, IMO. All of these delays make no sense.
I told a friend of mine to join up and PaB and I hope he does. Apparently he cashed out in September and got a few small partial payments over the months then they took the money out of his casino account yesterday and said he broke a term 6 months after the initial cashout but they won't send him his play history for proof either. I was already doubtful but now there is no way I play here.

I know who your friend is. Please have him PAB here. He is an advantage player and part of a gambling syndicate at that. Which, in and of itself is nothing illegal or in-moral. However, we have rules to discourage this type of behavior, and your friend broke them.

He has so far threatened to slander us unless we follow his demands. To which I have replied if he believes he has been truly wronged, then please PAB, since I have full faith in Brian and Max to handle any resolutions in a fair and impartial manner. However, I doubt it will get to that because our evidence against that player is very conclusive, and I believe your friend knows quite well what he did, even though he is reluctant to acknowledge it.

If you have the same username as on the advantage player forum called blackjackguy that is hosted on websitetoolbox, then I'm sure you will know why we have the rules that we have, and why your friend broke them.

Wow, Dave. Your friend really does need to join and PAB. Doesn't sound good to me.

I'd love to have a quiet and impartial PAB process where I'm confident a just resolution will be found, rather than deal with a slander campaign.

I am confused. Nicholas is the affiliate manager for BetPhoenix? Doesn't that mean he handles all the affiliates out there who run banners for them? Why are we dealing with him rather than an actual Casino manager? Does he wear both hats? Just curious.

I'm am primarily an affiliate manager, however I also serve as a Casino Representative. Our casino manager is named Sam. I tend to work as a representative whenever I provide affiliate management services, since affiliate conversions and retention are very closely linked to the casinos PR and general administration efforts.

Basically, the way it works is: a good casino = happy players = players that come back again and again and play more = happy affiliates. So if I'm working on the affiliate side, I also end up working on all the aspects of a casino, trying to ensure an optimal player experience, so affiliates will line up at the door, instead of me having to chase after them.

Kind Regards,
Nicolas Johnson
Bet Phoenix Casino Affiliates Manager

 

[jod5413]

Thanks for the explanation, Nicolas.

 

[mbart64]

Quote Originally Posted by gaydave View Post
I have never played at bet phoenix and I am sure not about to start. It's too big of a risk, IMO. All of these delays make no sense.
I told a friend of mine to join up and PaB and I hope he does. Apparently he cashed out in September and got a few small partial payments over the months then they took the money out of his casino account yesterday and said he broke a term 6 months after the initial cashout but they won't send him his play history for proof either. I was already doubtful but now there is no way I play here.


I know who your friend is. Please have him PAB here. He is an advantage player and part of a gambling syndicate at that. Which, in and of itself is nothing illegal or in-moral. However, we have rules to discourage this type of behavior, and your friend broke them.

He has so far threatened to slander us unless we follow his demands. To which I have replied if he believes he has been truly wronged, then please PAB, since I have full faith in Brian and Max to handle any resolutions in a fair and impartial manner. However, I doubt it will get to that because our evidence against that player is very conclusive, and I believe your friend knows quite well what he did, even though he is reluctant to acknowledge it.

There are a few things that do not seem quite right. You have completely ignored the most glaring issues here.

Firstly, may I ask as to why your casino delays for months and months the player cashouts? This makes now several players that have reportedly had to wait months. Secondly, you were giving small partial payments to this player? is this accurate? Again, why is it that you will not just pay players in a timely fashion? That is the real issue and makes your other claims seem like a farce. If so, why would you string payments out over half a year period? Why would you still owe the player money and why now would you find a rule that the player broke and not back when this first happened? It appears that you are just searching for ways to not pay people at this point. All else is irrelevant. The relevancy is that the player claims to have cashed out in September. That is an incredibly long time and no excuse in the world is sufficient for that. You have completely ignored that point and redirected the attention.

These are the big issues that jump out at me. If your casino were more interested in paying timely then this would not even be an issue and you would not have to be here all the time playing the nice guy and trying to smooth out the roguish behaviors. Odd that you would find a reason not to pay someone after you had already started making payments - too odd for me to buy what your peddling. Also, is it true that you would not give them the play history? What purpose does this serve?

I think it will take more than a few smooth words to ever convince me to play at bet phoenix. None of this sounds like it is legitimate at all to be quite frank.

 

[4 of a kind]

Not that anyone asked; but my personal opinion about this three month old thread and BetPhoenix, is just another example of how ridiculously low online casinos are prepared to go , and the endless amount of bullshit their willing to throw around trying to squeeze every dime they could for as long as they can from the players.

I’d have more faith in getting paid back making a loan to a known strung out crack head, then trying to cash out here. Their starting to make Virtual look good.

I’m surprised Bryan is willing to let such ridiculous bullshit go on for so long without putting his foot down. Other then players making all the noise here, it would appear almost as though the normally opinionated loud voices from the veterans of this site were told hands off, since not one of them after 3 months made a single post or opinion in this thread. What’s even stranger is this site is not even on the accredited list here.

 

[Nifty29]

Not that anyone asked; but my personal opinion about this three month old thread and BetPhoenix, is just another example of how ridiculously low online casinos are prepared to go , and the endless amount of bullshit their willing to throw around trying to squeeze every dime they could for as long as they can from the players.

I’d have more faith in getting paid back making a loan to a known strung out crack head, then trying to cash out here. Their starting to make Virtual look good.

I’m surprised Bryan is willing to let such ridiculous bullshit go on for so long without putting his foot down. Other then players making all the noise here, it would appear almost as though the normally opinionated loud voices from the veterans of this site were told hands off, since not one of them after 3 months made a single post or opinion in this thread. What’s even stranger is this site is not even on the accredited list here.

I pretty much agree with you here 4OAK.

A few of us have had our say along the way (myself, vinyl,jod etc) about just how ridiculous the whole payment delay issue has been at BetPhoenix, so not everyone has been ignoring it. In fact, I've copped some flak over the months for being vocal about how badly they treat players.

I've read what Nicolas posted (twice) and I have to agree that most of it is just a re-hash of the same old "Yes we know we have made mistakes and we are going to fix them and we are going to pay people faster blah blah blah" that he posts whenever a fresh complaint rears it's head. Sorry Nicolas, but actions speak louder than words and there have been a LOT of words - and that's all. Nothing personal.

What I would like to know is what the 'complicated issue' was with deucebag?? He was paid some instalments over the past 10 months, so obviously he was not a scammer or he wouldn't have been paid anything at all! So what the hell is so 'complicated' about paying a legitimate player his winnings???. What is even MORE amazing is that the minute he goes to CDS, he gets paid!! So why couldn't this be done 10 months ago?? If it looks like BS and smells like BS......

BP has always had a 7-10 business day payout time, which is absolutely disgusting in itself - but we have had player after player at various times over the past year having to wait a month or more to be paid. For goodness sake, if you can't organise to pay a player in 7-10 working days then you have no business taking deposits.

I think Bryan should consider issuing a warning based on past history, and look into this latest "syndicate scam" claim mentioned earlier. It may well be he is an advantage player, but if he didnt break any terms and just played in a way they didn't like, then do what they do in Vegas - pay him and tell him never to come back. Of course if he is a scammer, then feed his liver to the dogs!!

 

[Cabrair32]

Before I even post let me tell you FWIW that I currently have a PaB with another casino that claims that I am a Scammer or cheater (I am actually not sure which). Either way, you can take that information into account when I add this little factoid.

I also should perhaps not share too much in case I can PAB, but since I have a current one I am guessing that I cannot anyways.

I cashed out back in early November. I then received the following email later in the month.

Dear Customer,

This e mail is to inform you that your payout request has been declined; the reason is because you did not comply with our rules and regulations; from our terms and conditions:

"No wager shall exceed 50% of the original bankroll of a player. Wagers exceeding 50% of the player’s original bankroll may be deemed as bonus abuse and winnings forfeited. This with the exception of players whose current bankroll is 3x the original bankroll"

Luckily, I got them to send me my play history and then I could prove that there was no violation of this term. Finally, they agreed and put my money back. I was an EWX user and that is the time that they shut down. So I requested payments via MG, WU and QT........................................... and nothing ever came. I would go on live chat and complain constantly and would keep being told to be patient. Sam would call me and tell me to be patient then finally on Feb 15th (yep, thats right) I got a lousy payment worth only 1/8 of my cashout. I think I bothered them too much because then I got another email stating that I had broken the same rule that I proved that I didn't before and that they were keeping my money. This time I went to live chat and Sam told me that I was a member at too many casinos and that I was an advantage player and now he is on to me and should be happy to get what little I did. How he knows which casinos I am a member at is a bit puzzling. The bottom line is I am waiting to hear back from CDS on this (yeah, fat chance I know) and I have little doubt I will win in the end. Whether it be by a ruling in my favor and getting my money or Karma. I would play at the virtual group long before ever considering this place again.

 

[Nifty29]

Before I even post let me tell you FWIW that I currently have a PaB with another casino that claims that I am a Scammer or cheater (I am actually not sure which). Either way, you can take that information into account when I add this little factoid.

I also should perhaps not share too much in case I can PAB, but since I have a current one I am guessing that I cannot anyways.

I cashed out back in early November. I then received the following email later in the month.

Luckily, I got them to send me my play history and then I could prove that there was no violation of this term. Finally, they agreed and put my money back. I was an EWX user and that is the time that they shut down. So I requested payments via MG, WU and QT........................................... and nothing ever came. I would go on live chat and complain constantly and would keep being told to be patient. Sam would call me and tell me to be patient then finally on Feb 15th (yep, thats right) I got a lousy payment worth only 1/8 of my cashout. I think I bothered them too much because then I got another email stating that I had broken the same rule that I proved that I didn't before and that they were keeping my money. This time I went to live chat and Sam told me that I was a member at too many casinos and that I was an advantage player and now he is on to me and should be happy to get what little I did. How he knows which casinos I am a member at is a bit puzzling. The bottom line is I am waiting to hear back from CDS on this (yeah, fat chance I know) and I have little doubt I will win in the end. Whether it be by a ruling in my favor and getting my money or Karma. I would play at the virtual group long before ever considering this place again.

Interesting.

If they decided it was ok to pay your cashout, then they should have PAID you - not decided three months later that it WASN'T ok.

I'm also interested that you have been accused of scamming two different casinos....talk about amazing bad luck! It must be tough being accused by a casino of cheating - I wouldnt know as I've never been accused in 12 years. You must REALLY be unlucky

 

[Cabrair32]

Interesting.

If they decided it was ok to pay your cashout, then they should have PAID you - not decided three months later that it WASN'T ok.

I'm also interested that you have been accused of scamming two different casinos....talk about amazing bad luck! It must be tough being accused by a casino of cheating - I wouldnt know as I've never been accused in 12 years. You must REALLY be unlucky

Absolutley. And they should have paid me 3 months ago. Not in Feb. and they should pay the entire amount. Not an 8th.

I'm not sure but i feel that you are being a bit sarcastic with me. Congratulations on not being ever being considered a fraud. Congratulations also on living in Australia and not having to play at places like this. When I could play at Intercasino and 32 Red I was never accused of being a fraud either. It only happens to me at RTG casinos, which I am basically forced to play since I live in the US. I'm also confident in my complaints because I can provide any bit of documentation that is needed to prove that I am not a fraud. It doesn't help to get comments like yours though.
Hopefully you have never been accused of breaking rules either then having to get your play history to prove your innocence like me. Accused and guilty are quite different and i am pretty certain that many of these RTG's are just yelling "scammer" when somebody plays intelligently and wins.

 

[NicolasJohnson]

Hi,

I'm going to answer everyone's comments.

First, I'm going to expose something that has happened, and may answer a point that several people have mentioned, which basically relates to the legal concept of statute of limitations.

We had a syndicate from Pennsylvania hit us. There were around a half a dozen players from within a 100 mile radios in Pennsylvania. They all were the same age (+/- 1 year). They all took the same bonus. Played the same games (they have 3-4 games they like to play and rotate between so as to throw us off). They all bet very large at first, and then grind out the wagering requirements with low bets.

Our past fraud control did not pick up on it. However, after implementing new fraud investigation procedures, we found them. Several of our staff, including myself, were fooled by the stories the players came up with (and the vehement denial of facts). However, as is the case with most unsavory activity, it came to light and their payout was denied. Most had already been paid some, if not all of their winnings.

Now some will say that because we didn't catch it at first, then we should be responsible for not having acted on them earlier, basically, the legal appeal of "Statute of Limitations" should be applied, and the player paid in full.

This is a very valid argument, if the case was from years ago. But for cases that are a few months old, appealing to Statute of Limitations is kinda stretching it. For reference, most fraud related statute of limitations are counted in years, and general from the time of discovery, not from the time the actual act was committed (in the USA varying from 2 years of discovery to up to 10 years)

...
I’d have more faith in getting paid back making a loan to a known strung out crack head, then trying to cash out here. Their starting to make Virtual look good.
...
I’m surprised Bryan is willing to let such ridiculous bullshit go on for so long without putting his foot down.
...
What’s even stranger is this site is not even on the accredited list here.

We are not accredited, and Brian would not allow fraud to go on unchecked.

While you have made your opinion that we are worse than the devil very clear, fortunately the people who are in charge of being industry watch dogs tend to base themselves more on facts than opinions.

I'm not saying all the facts are perfect. By no means. We have made mistakes. But the way you describe them is grossly exaggerated. While there have been some delays (a small % of payouts were affected) there isn't a single case of a legit player not getting paid.

I pretty much agree with you here 4OAK.

A few of us have had our say along the way (myself, vinyl,jod etc) about just how ridiculous the whole payment delay issue has been at BetPhoenix, so not everyone has been ignoring it. In fact, I've copped some flak over the months for being vocal about how badly they treat players.

I've read what Nicolas posted (twice) and I have to agree that most of it is just a re-hash of the same old "Yes we know we have made mistakes and we are going to fix them and we are going to pay people faster blah blah blah" that he posts whenever a fresh complaint rears it's head. Sorry Nicolas, but actions speak louder than words and there have been a LOT of words - and that's all. Nothing personal.

You are right, we haven't done as much action as we should have. :notworthy

What I would like to know is what the 'complicated issue' was with deucebag?? He was paid some instalments over the past 10 months, so obviously he was not a scammer or he wouldn't have been paid anything at all! So what the hell is so 'complicated' about paying a legitimate player his winnings???. What is even MORE amazing is that the minute he goes to CDS, he gets paid!! So why couldn't this be done 10 months ago?? If it looks like BS and smells like BS......

I can't share the players case. The player is welcome to post further details if the player so wishes, but it would be unethical for me to do so.

BP has always had a 7-10 business day payout time, which is absolutely disgusting in itself - but we have had player after player at various times over the past year having to wait a month or more to be paid. For goodness sake, if you can't organise to pay a player in 7-10 working days then you have no business taking deposits.

There have been some delays, but they don't always last as long as players claim. Generally, from my experience 75% when a player says "I haven't been paid since XXX" that means, "I hit the cash out button on XXX".

Docs, fraud verification, players requesting payout with incorrect payment information, etc all cause delays which are out of our control and we do get blamed for.

I'm not denying we have had some cases where we were to blame 100%, but as a % of our overall business, they have been a small number of cases.

I think Bryan should consider issuing a warning based on past history, and look into this latest "syndicate scam" claim mentioned earlier. It may well be he is an advantage player, but if he didnt break any terms and just played in a way they didn't like, then do what they do in Vegas - pay him and tell him never to come back. Of course if he is a scammer, then feed his liver to the dogs!!

I agree with you, if they didn't break our rules, they should get paid. I'm sure if they go to Brian, he will make sure that is the case. And we will of course cooperate with any reputable mediation mediums the players choose to pursue.

Before I even post let me tell you FWIW that I currently have a PaB with another casino that claims that I am a Scammer or cheater (I am actually not sure which). Either way, you can take that information into account when I add this little factoid.

I also should perhaps not share too much in case I can PAB, but since I have a current one I am guessing that I cannot anyways.

I cashed out back in early November. I then received the following email later in the month.

Luckily, I got them to send me my play history and then I could prove that there was no violation of this term. Finally, they agreed and put my money back. I was an EWX user and that is the time that they shut down. So I requested payments via MG, WU and QT........................................... and nothing ever came. I would go on live chat and complain constantly and would keep being told to be patient. Sam would call me and tell me to be patient then finally on Feb 15th (yep, thats right) I got a lousy payment worth only 1/8 of my cashout. I think I bothered them too much because then I got another email stating that I had broken the same rule that I proved that I didn't before and that they were keeping my money. This time I went to live chat and Sam told me that I was a member at too many casinos and that I was an advantage player and now he is on to me and should be happy to get what little I did. How he knows which casinos I am a member at is a bit puzzling. The bottom line is I am waiting to hear back from CDS on this (yeah, fat chance I know) and I have little doubt I will win in the end. Whether it be by a ruling in my favor and getting my money or Karma. I would play at the virtual group long before ever considering this place again.

Absolutley. And they should have paid me 3 months ago. Not in Feb. and they should pay the entire amount. Not an 8th.

I'm not sure but i feel that you are being a bit sarcastic with me. Congratulations on not being ever being considered a fraud. Congratulations also on living in Australia and not having to play at places like this. When I could play at Intercasino and 32 Red I was never accused of being a fraud either. It only happens to me at RTG casinos, which I am basically forced to play since I live in the US. I'm also confident in my complaints because I can provide any bit of documentation that is needed to prove that I am not a fraud. It doesn't help to get comments like yours though.
Hopefully you have never been accused of breaking rules either then having to get your play history to prove your innocence like me. Accused and guilty are quite different and i am pretty certain that many of these RTG's are just yelling "scammer" when somebody plays intelligently and wins.

We have already sent the necessary information to CDS. You aren't a normal player just trying to have fun. You are part of a syndicate trying to mathematically milk online casinos, which fine, there is nothing wrong about that. But there is nothing wrong that we have rules to stop that activity. You broke several.

Interesting.

If they decided it was ok to pay your cashout, then they should have PAID you - not decided three months later that it WASN'T ok.

I'm also interested that you have been accused of scamming two different casinos....talk about amazing bad luck! It must be tough being accused by a casino of cheating - I wouldnt know as I've never been accused in 12 years. You must REALLY be unlucky

I hear you on the part of the timing. However, please read my comment on statute of limitations for fraud cases.

Kind Regards,
Nicolas Johnson
Bet Phoenix Casino Affiliates Manager

 

[Cabrair32]

Nicolas Johnson you are so full of crap and lies and distortion.

Yeah, of course I try to win when I play at a casino! That is why I play. I am trying to win money. Is there something wrong with that? You say you have rules to prevent that? What the hell are you talking about?

Now you are saying that I am part of a "syndicate"? What does that mean??? I have done nothing wrong and you damn well know it. I have not cheated. I have not broken one rule (you say I have broken several, there isn't ONE that I have though and I keep proving it) I am not a fraud, I have provided you with every shred of documentation that you asked for and more. Any game that I played and any bet that I made were completely within your terms and conditions. It is not ok to just say I am a cheat because I won. This is becoming too common for RTG casinos to claim. They have a bonus, players take the bonus and win, they claim cheats or frauds.

Let me give the exact time line of this entire debacle. You tell me how your casino in any way is acting appropriately:

1). November 12th I play, I win, I sent in documents after chatting with Omar.

2) November 13th I go round and round with your casino. You kept finding odd things to find to not accept. Like wanting me to include a voided check at one point and saying that I needed to put my banking information in even though I used ewalletxpress and didn't send any wires... etc, etc. until finally after another phone conversation and several emails all the hoops were dropped and I was able to cashout on the 19th. It was a ridiculous process but I did it and assumed payout would be within a week or two based on their terms.

3) November 27th I got an email stating that I had broken a rule in which I supposedly bet over 50% of my bankroll (which is what you are talking about as using math to milk your casino I assume). Luckily I had my play history and I could give exact hand numbers and such and proved that any bet that I made was NEVER above 50% of my starting bankroll until I was 3x that amount. I obeyed your terms perfectly as you wrote them and you were forced to put my money back into my account. I know you hated that.

4) That was November 27th. Dean promised me payments that didn't come. Sam actually called me after I complained several times to him and promised me payments would be coming soon............. and they never did. Until finally on FEBRUARY 15th you sent me 1/8th of my cashout amount! I contacted to complain and ask for the rest of course.

5) The following week you sent me another email. This time again citing the 50% rule. I immediately contacted Sam and that is when he said that I played at too many casinos and I was a pro and that I had already been paid enough.

so you can try to spin this however you want. You can try to come up with any corny story you like. The only facts are that you are grossly negligent with your payments and you will come up with anything to not pay. You tried several ways with me and none of them are correct. I didn't break any of your terms even though you tried to say that I did (thank goodness I had my play history for proof!!). I am not a professional (last time I ever even played at a casino was January 8th at club world and I lost $1200 - yeah, real pro that I am, funny that they never thought of me as a cheat. That is why they are accredited and you will never be). and I am sure the hell not a part of a syndicate. I don't appreciate your lies, distortions or your slander. I'm from PA allright - you got one fact straight. I am in no way connected to any group nor have I ever cheated. Your casino cannot claim the same. Now go make up some nice story about how you will be better someday while at the same time stealing from players you currently do have.

By the way. I think that you keep forgetting that I have my play history. Your lies wont work. Here is your quote.

They all bet very large at first, and then grind out the wagering requirements with low bets.

Ummmmm.. yeah NOT. I didn't break your 50% term as I was forced to prove so I didn't bet "very large" at first. On top of that, your statement is a complete lie. I will post my history if need be to prove your dishonesty. I played 175 hands of blackjack. Rarely going below $20 per bet ( a handful were $10 bets but not many and none below that.) Most much more than that. Actually, the last 10 bets were all over $50 with the last 3 being for $100 per bet. I made several bets over $100 throughout. Yeah, good one. I really "grinded it out with low bets". I also played a few other games. One of them was tri card. Only twice did I ever bet below $20 per hand and most were between $30 and $75 bets. Again, your distortion of the truth will do you know good when I actually have the proof in my hand.

 

[NicolasJohnson]

Nicolas Johnson you are so full of crap and lies and distortion.

Yeah, of course I try to win when I play at a casino! That is why I play. I am trying to win money. Is there something wrong with that? You say you have rules to prevent that? What the hell are you talking about?

Now you are saying that I am part of a "syndicate"? What does that mean??? I have done nothing wrong and you damn well know it. I have not cheated. I have not broken one rule (you say I have broken several, there isn't ONE that I have though and I keep proving it) I am not a fraud, I have provided you with every shred of documentation that you asked for and more. Any game that I played and any bet that I made were completely within your terms and conditions. It is not ok to just say I am a cheat because I won. This is becoming too common for RTG casinos to claim. They have a bonus, players take the bonus and win, they claim cheats or frauds.

Let me give the exact time line of this entire debacle. You tell me how your casino in any way is acting appropriately:

1). November 12th I play, I win, I sent in documents after chatting with Omar.

2) November 13th I go round and round with your casino. You kept finding odd things to find to not accept. Like wanting me to include a voided check at one point and saying that I needed to put my banking information in even though I used ewalletxpress and didn't send any wires... etc, etc. until finally after another phone conversation and several emails all the hoops were dropped and I was able to cashout on the 19th. It was a ridiculous process but I did it and assumed payout would be within a week or two based on their terms.

3) November 27th I got an email stating that I had broken a rule in which I supposedly bet over 50% of my bankroll (which is what you are talking about as using math to milk your casino I assume). Luckily I had my play history and I could give exact hand numbers and such and proved that any bet that I made was NEVER above 50% of my starting bankroll until I was 3x that amount. I obeyed your terms perfectly as you wrote them and you were forced to put my money back into my account. I know you hated that.

4) That was November 27th. Dean promised me payments that didn't come. Sam actually called me after I complained several times to him and promised me payments would be coming soon............. and they never did. Until finally on FEBRUARY 15th you sent me 1/8th of my cashout amount! I contacted to complain and ask for the rest of course.

5) The following week you sent me another email. This time again citing the 50% rule. I immediately contacted Sam and that is when he said that I played at too many casinos and I was a pro and that I had already been paid enough.

so you can try to spin this however you want. You can try to come up with any corny story you like. The only facts are that you are grossly negligent with your payments and you will come up with anything to not pay. You tried several ways with me and none of them are correct. I didn't break any of your terms even though you tried to say that I did (thank goodness I had my play history for proof!!). I am not a professional (last time I ever even played at a casino was January 8th at club world and I lost $1200 - yeah, real pro that I am, funny that they never thought of me as a cheat. That is why they are accredited and you will never be). and I am sure the hell not a part of a syndicate. I don't appreciate your lies, distortions or your slander. I'm from PA allright - you got one fact straight. I am in no way connected to any group nor have I ever cheated. Your casino cannot claim the same. Now go make up some nice story about how you will be better someday while at the same time stealing from players you currently do have.

By the way. I think that you keep forgetting that I have my play history. Your lies wont work. Here is your quote.

Ummmmm.. yeah NOT. I didn't break your 50% term as I was forced to prove so I didn't bet "very large" at first. On top of that, your statement is a complete lie. I will post my history if need be to prove your dishonesty. I played 175 hands of blackjack. Rarely going below $20 per bet ( a handful were $10 bets but not many and none below that.) Most much more than that. Actually, the last 10 bets were all over $50 with the last 3 being for $100 per bet. I made several bets over $100 throughout. Yeah, good one. I really "grinded it out with low bets". I also played a few other games. One of them was tri card. Only twice did I ever bet below $20 per hand and most were between $30 and $75 bets. Again, your distortion of the truth will do you know good when I actually have the proof in my hand.

Can you please PM me your casino user ID? I'll double check to make sure you aren't getting wrongly lumped into the wrong category. I'll be terribly sorry if you have been. If you haven't broken any rules, I'll be glad to make sure you get paid. :notworthy

Kind Regards,
Nicolas Johnson
Bet Phoenix Casino Affiliates Manager

 

[greasemonkey]

I'm from PA allright - you got one fact straight. I am in no way connected to any group nor have I ever cheated. Your casino cannot claim the same. Now go make up some nice story about how you will be better someday while at the same time stealing from players you currently do have.

By the way. I think that you keep forgetting that I have my play history. Your lies wont work. Here is your quote.

Ummmmm.. yeah NOT. I didn't break your 50% term as I was forced to prove so I didn't bet "very large" at first. On top of that, your statement is a complete lie. I will post my history if need be to prove your dishonesty. I played 175 hands of blackjack. Rarely going below $20 per bet ( a handful were $10 bets but not many and none below that.) Most much more than that. Actually, the last 10 bets were all over $50 with the last 3 being for $100 per bet. I made several bets over $100 throughout. Yeah, good one. I really "grinded it out with low bets". I also played a few other games. One of them was tri card. Only twice did I ever bet below $20 per hand and most were between $30 and $75 bets. Again, your distortion of the truth will do you know good when I actually have the proof in my hand.

I would fill out a PAB. You will do a lot better than CDS, IMHO. This seems like an automatic win for you if that is true about your play history. That kind of play is exactly what casinos should want. You should be a VIP if you are playing like that! No way that is fraud or cheating unless you were playing non allowed games or somehow manipulating software.

You should probably stop posting about this now though as you are jeopardizing your chances at a PAB if you keep posting about it. Just file a PAB form and let them do the talking for you.

Interesting about the Pennsylvania thing. You know I have been falsely accused of being a fraud or involved with cheating and I am from Pennsylvania. I have been accused by Virtual casino (like I would ever play there again anyways). I have been accused at cleopatra's palace (again, thank you for the favor) I have been accused by all 4 mainstreet casinos even though they had paid me and I was in good standing for a looooong time before that. I have been accused by Bryan himself (though he found otherwise and quickly apologized). I have also been accused by Lock casino. That leads me to believe that possibly there really is/was a group from PA that were frauds and I was thrown into that group because of my proximity OR it is just more roguish BS from RTG sites. I have never had this happen on non RTG casinos. I won at CDS vs. Virtual and I was a loser at all the others and didn't need to file any complaints.

 

[Cabrair32]

I have sent a PM to both Nicolas Johnson and Greasemonkey.

@Greasemonkey. You make some reallygood points. I appreciate the advice about stop posting so i will stop completely while I wait to hear back from Nicolas Johnson and I double check the rules of the PAB process.

 

[The Dude]

Nicolas Johnson you are so full of crap and lies and distortion.

Try flaming someone one more time and see what happens.

Yeah, of course I try to win when I play at a casino! That is why I play. I am trying to win money. Is there something wrong with that? You say you have rules to prevent that? What the hell are you talking about?

Now you are saying that I am part of a "syndicate"? What does that mean??? I have done nothing wrong and you damn well know it.

Well to nip this in the bud, you are part of a syndicate - you are playing with either a group of players or one or two who have multiple accounts, and Max and I have seen the proof for the past several months since your first PAB last summer.

You have casino accounts(s) that have been identified as fraudulent accounts at Lock Casino and Slots Plus - and now Bet Phoenix. The more you PAB the more info we have on you and your playmates (this would be your third), so please do.

I'll be working on the plugin to allow you to PAB sometime later today. I'd rather have you PAB instead of turning the forum into your own private circus. Thanks!

 

[The Dude]

You can PAB here:
Link Outdated / Removed

 

[4 of a kind]

While you have made your opinion that we are worse than the devil very clear, fortunately the people who are in charge of being industry watch dogs tend to base themselves more on facts than opinions.

I want to start out by saying I can no longer sit on the sidelines and read all this crap about Bet Phoenix being thrown around by Nicolas, not only here but all over the different forums. I also realize it would be smarter of me to just shut up, but my emotions have gotten the best of me again and I refuse to remain silent.

Your quote above is probably the most accurate statement you ever made here. For one my opinion that your casino is worse then the devil is dead on. I certainly can’t understand how you could possibly work for someone this long and not know the same things I do about your boss. Based on the sympathetic and apologetic posts you make all over the place about Bet Phoenix, either you are one of the most ill informed employees ever on this earth, or are one of the best salesmen I’ve ever come across in my lifetime. I can’t help but believe you know exactly what I’m talking about Nicolas. In the past on this forum I threw a few curve balls at you, and I suspect you knew where I was coming from, since your responses were always clever and followed with an “I don’t know for sure” explanation releasing you if it became a fact later on.

I can’t help but think you know everything I do. In fact I’m sure you even know who I am, how I know, and exactly where to find me.

I know what I’m saying is vague and that everyone here and especially Bryan will attack me for such allegations without submitting proof. So before the onslaught begins, let me make it clear that I will never submit any proof.

Most people here have been brainwashed into believing what a few say justifying the legitimacy of online casinos with no proof ever since its beginning, and yet want to lynch the few that have the balls to step forward.

Of course when it comes to online casinos the argument could be made that everything said from either side being the casinos or the player’s needs to be sorted out, evaluated, and hopefully the right conclusion, (in most cases being a guess) is constantly being done without proof.

I’m sure this post will also be evaluated and probably removed and I’ll probably be tossed. But, the few of you that get to read this be certain to stay away from Bet Phoenix.

 

[Nate]

I think Betphoenix are running into financial difficulties. All the signs are there. There would be no reason to delay payments like they are currently doing....

Nicolas would obviously not admit this as it would be detrimental to the business.

Question: Does Betphoenix also run a Sportsbook?

Nate

 

[The Dude]

...I’m sure this post will also be evaluated and probably removed and I’ll probably be tossed...

<sigh> not this again

I've been running this forum for thirteen years and we've always have had a strict policy on removing/editing posts -
https://www.casinomeister.com/forum-faq/forum-policies/

- and on booting members.
https://www.casinomeister.com/forum-faq/forum-policies/

Please read.

 

[Balky]

My cashout went smoothly and the funds arrived in my MB yesterday.

Cheers

Balky

 

[anniemac]

Nate,

In answer to your question, yes they have a sportsbook. It was first and then the casino.

 

[Nate]

Thanks Anniemac ,

The reason I asked was because I saw several complaints regarding 'Slow Pay' at a Betphoenix Sportsbook. Just wanted to ensure that I actually have the correct brand.

From what I can currently ascertain, there are a number of forums that hold 'Slow Pay' issues with Betphoenix. I don't know how far back, but I saw some that were dated early 2010.

Cause for concern? I think so.

Nate

 

[anniemac]

You are correct, Nate. As for money issues, can't say about that but there are other postings about payout issues at both.

 

[hausse222]

Betphoenix downgraded at sportsbooksreview.com from B+ to B- due to several slow payment reports.

 

[NicolasJohnson]

I want to start out by saying I can no longer sit on the sidelines and read all this crap about Bet Phoenix being thrown around by Nicolas, not only here but all over the different forums. I also realize it would be smarter of me to just shut up, but my emotions have gotten the best of me again and I refuse to remain silent.

Your quote above is probably the most accurate statement you ever made here. For one my opinion that your casino is worse then the devil is dead on. I certainly can’t understand how you could possibly work for someone this long and not know the same things I do about your boss. Based on the sympathetic and apologetic posts you make all over the place about Bet Phoenix, either you are one of the most ill informed employees ever on this earth, or are one of the best salesmen I’ve ever come across in my lifetime. I can’t help but believe you know exactly what I’m talking about Nicolas. In the past on this forum I threw a few curve balls at you, and I suspect you knew where I was coming from, since your responses were always clever and followed with an “I don’t know for sure” explanation releasing you if it became a fact later on.

I can’t help but think you know everything I do. In fact I’m sure you even know who I am, how I know, and exactly where to find me.

I'm a little dumbfounded by your statement. I'll try to keep it short. This is how I make a living. And as an employee, not owner. I do have other things in life.

I can guarantee you I don't know who you are, how you know me, or where to find you.

I'm not sure what in my postings makes you think I could know all this, as I do not try to give an air of knowing all, rather trying to help in all ways possible.

Am I apologetic sometimes? Sure, but what is wrong with that? Every company makes mistakes. We try to beat our competition by jumping on them, recognizing them, and constantly improving. Also, keeping clear and open lines of communication.

I know what I’m saying is vague and that everyone here and especially Bryan will attack me for such allegations without submitting proof. So before the onslaught begins, let me make it clear that I will never submit any proof.

Most people here have been brainwashed into believing what a few say justifying the legitimacy of online casinos with no proof ever since its beginning, and yet want to lynch the few that have the balls to step forward.

Of course when it comes to online casinos the argument could be made that everything said from either side being the casinos or the player’s needs to be sorted out, evaluated, and hopefully the right conclusion, (in most cases being a guess) is constantly being done without proof.

I’m sure this post will also be evaluated and probably removed and I’ll probably be tossed. But, the few of you that get to read this be certain to stay away from Bet Phoenix.

You have your right to your opinion. I respect it. But, just to expand on your logic, then all slots, everywhere, are rigged. Because if you believe all RNGs are rigged, then that would also imply land based slots, since they use RNGs just like online casinos do (the reputable ones)

Of course, this wouldn't necessarily apply if you are speaking of specific rogue software, but based on your innuendos, the above would apply.

In any case, to think that all casinos cheat is a bit of a stretch, since they already have the house edge, no need to do anything illegal, they make plenty of money.

I think Betphoenix are running into financial difficulties. All the signs are there. There would be no reason to delay payments like they are currently doing....

Nicolas would obviously not admit this as it would be detrimental to the business.

Question: Does Betphoenix also run a Sportsbook?

Nate

The sportsbook and the casino are owned by the same company, but run independently.

My cashout went smoothly and the funds arrived in my MB yesterday.

Cheers

Balky

Nate,

In answer to your question, yes they have a sportsbook. It was first and then the casino.

That is 100% correct.

Thanks Anniemac ,

The reason I asked was because I saw several complaints regarding 'Slow Pay' at a Betphoenix Sportsbook. Just wanted to ensure that I actually have the correct brand.

From what I can currently ascertain, there are a number of forums that hold 'Slow Pay' issues with Betphoenix. I don't know how far back, but I saw some that were dated early 2010.

Cause for concern? I think so.

Nate

You are correct, Nate. As for money issues, can't say about that but there are other postings about payout issues at both.

Betphoenix downgraded at sportsbooksreview.com from B+ to B- due to several slow payment reports.

Well, just to put all this into perspective, other books that are rated B- at SBR:
PartyBets (from PartyPoker)
Expekt
betsson

In fact NordicBet is a C+

What is more, taken from the horses mouth, the SBR site:
B- to B+ Good, minimal risk to players funds. Top 10% of all books.

You have every right to interpret the events and facts as you all see fit. I know the only way we can gain trust is with time. Always paying winners, cutting payout times down, and keeping up good promos and CS. I'm confident that with time, we will prove to be a great casino.

Kind Regards,
Nicolas Johnson
Bet Phoenix Casino Affiliates Manager

 

[maxd]

FYI, the entire Guffe/pipersniper derail has been moved to Guffe/pipersniper derail - pruned from original thread. Needless to say the troll has been sent on his way.

 

[jetset]

<sigh> not this again

I've been running this forum for thirteen years and we've always have had a strict policy on removing/editing posts -
https://www.casinomeister.com/forum-faq/forum-policies/

- and on booting members.
https://www.casinomeister.com/forum-faq/forum-policies/

Please read.

There are times when I get the feeling that certain posters are seeking martyrdom to give themselves a particular internet profile or rep. It seems to happen from time to time.

I've been a member of this forum for a long time, and in my personal experience departure orders are few and far between... and usually very well deserved. To imply that a ban is likely on such flimsy grounds as 4 of a Kind appears to be suggesting here is imo plain mischievous at best and malicious at worst.

Well done Nicholas J for sticking around despite a few almost personalised attacks and maintaining a civil and logical tone in your posts - especially those drawing attention to criticism that is admittedly based on zero proof.

I thought the riposte on the SBR rating values was useful in putting these into perspective.