Betfair Bonus Fiasco

[sweiger]

I miss a official statement from Betfair here in this thread .

I'd be very surprised to see any official statement:

Betfair was a Casinomeister Accredited Casino, but they were removed from the Accredited section as soon as this episode began to unfold. Complaints at Casinomeister began to pile up, and Max forwarded these to Betfair's casino representative. He responded to only the first batch with a blanket response - again - referring to players exploiting the spirit of the bonus. He recommended that players contact the LGA if they had any problem with this.

Malta's LGA is one of the most non-responsive licensing agencies ever. You might as well complain to the mailman.

https://www.casinomeister.com/online-casinos/reviews/betfair/

 

[petro]

It is NOT the AMOUNT that matters… it is the PRINCIPLE…

That’s why I said; While I understand what you are trying to express here.
But your argument still lacks a sense of proportion.

I would like to add something further. We all seem to agree that offering the bonus was a mistake on Betfair’s behalf. Ask yourself how you would want your mistakes treated? Would you want to be punished for them? Or would you want them written off as if it never happened?

I already know which one I would choose.

 

[jetset]

I don't think it's a question of what the hypothetical 'you' would 'want' in a case like this - it's the real world of business, especially a business where trust is so important, and Betfair has made a grievous error of judgement in choosing to handle it in this way.

They would have sustained less reputational damage, and gained more goodwill, by taking their lumps and tightening up on their promotional design system.

 

[petro]

I haven't read too far into this topic but so far what it seems like to me is this; Betfair offered a promotion then about halfway through realised they had miscalculated then reneged on the promotion.

The only issue I feel that needs addressing here is the question of the losing players. Did they get their deposits back?

As it seems to me that if Betfair refunds the winning players deposits, they should also refund the losing players deposits.

 

[vinylweatherman]

That’s why I said; While I understand what you are trying to express here.
But your argument still lacks a sense of proportion.

I would like to add something further. We all seem to agree that offering the bonus was a mistake on Betfair’s behalf. Ask yourself how you would want your mistakes treated? Would you want to be punished for them? Or would you want them written off as if it never happened?

I already know which one I would choose.

WHY should they be allowed to have them written off, when this opportunity is NOT offered to PLAYERS, who are expected to carry the FULL COST of their mistakes.

Betfair should have ENTERED INTO NEGOTIATIONS about this, where there is every possiblity that they could have settled with many players, and the community as a whole, at a price LESS than paying the full amount to everybody, but one that kept their reputation intact.

Instead they took money from eWallets and bank accounts, confiscated winnings, and then said "talk to the hand", and went to ground like a thief in the night. They KEPT money from LOSING players, ALL of it - here they showed NO interest in having the episode "written off", and everyone put back to where they were before. It's like LOSING players bought the telly for £10, it was rung through at that price, but next month they find their card debited with £1000, not £10. Similarly, losing players lost whilst they were NEVER going to get paid had they WON. They would ONLY ever lose, or get their deposit back, whatever the other outcomes.

When this first broke, Betfair SELECTIVELY voided only the WINNING bets, allowing similar, but LOSING bets to stand. THIS is how adjustments created NEGATIVE BALANCES in players' accounts, which they then started pursuing with threats. This is hardly wanting their mistake forgotten about, and starting over. They wanted to KEEP the money from this mistake when it worked in their favour, yet NOT pay out when it didn't.

This made an already bad situation even worse, and is mainly what destroyed the credibility of their case to have this mistake written off, and be allowed to "start over".

 

[sweiger]

I haven't read too far into this topic but so far...

No, obviously not!

 

[raj]

Hi Guys

I have been away from the forum for some time due to work commitments.....having returned to read this I must say I am shocked and appaled.

Betfair were a large professional operation, trusted and respected. They have shafted their players , destroyed their reputation and rogued themselves due to an ill conceived promotion that they failed to fulfil. Do they not have qualified people in Betfair Towers, who look at the maths, the figures and forecast costs before approving and publishing such promos. It doesnt take a genius to work out this promo was heavily weighted in the customers favour.

I cannot really add much to this debate, their shouldnt even be a debate. BF should honour their promise to thier customers. VWM sums up my thoughts pretty much...individual players MUST NOT back down, they should issue court claims either through MCOL or higher courts depending on the amount.

BF CANNOT just dip into peoples bank accounts at their whim....all trust has now gone.

All I do know, and I am sure I speak for many players and affiliates, is that I will have nothing to do with Betfair again, and I wasnt even affected by this offer. The more that shun BF the stronger the message will be that there is no plac for this type of behaviour in the gaming world.

oh yes and well done BF for confiscating any winnings, what about those that lost money after participating in this promo.....will they be reimbursed their losses?? After all it would seem they were playing in a game which they COULD NOT ever win??

Its probably still not too late for BF to apologise, pay every one up and put things right.....but will they?? It doesnt look like they will does it.

Rant over...

Raj

 

[same_old]

I haven't read too far into this topic but so far what it seems like to me is this; Betfair offered a promotion then about halfway through realised they had miscalculated then reneged on the promotion.

The only issue I feel that needs addressing here is the question of the losing players. Did they get their deposits back?

As it seems to me that if Betfair refunds the winning players deposits, they should also refund the losing players deposits.

Hiya Petro,

What I think you may be missing is the amount of people who actually work in the marketing department at Bet Fair- I can assure you it wouldnt be any less than say 5-6 people.

They sit there an think of the next great promotion to offer the clients- As soon as this one was released you could see form the get go it could be abused to make a profit for the player. Now who's fault is that, not the players I can tell you.

Bet Fair are massive and I admit it was one hell of a stuff up but they needed to bite the bullet on this one and pay out the clients who were affected.

They seem to blame the clients for there own short comings which is just not on.

Plus the extent they went to to obtain the money back such as contacting banks of the clients to get the funds back etc.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Hiya Petro,

What I think you may be missing is the amount of people who actually work in the marketing department at Bet Fair- I can assure you it wouldnt be any less than say 5-6 people.

They sit there an think of the next great promotion to offer the clients- As soon as this one was released you could see form the get go it could be abused to make a profit for the player. Now who's fault is that, not the players I can tell you.

Bet Fair are massive and I admit it was one hell of a stuff up but they needed to bite the bullet on this one and pay out the clients who were affected.

They seem to blame the clients for there own short comings which is just not on.

Plus the extent they went to to obtain the money back such as contacting banks of the clients to get the funds back etc.

Someone said that FIVE people had to sign off on this promo before it was released, so this was FIVE people, ALL of whom failed to spot this very SERIOUS flaw. These were SENIOR people too.

 

[Rhyzz]

Petro what you're referring to is commonly known as a Rule 4 in bookmaking - an obvious mistake in a line which does not have to be honoured under gambling terms. Everyone abides by this rule, even arbitrators. Such a rule does not apply to a promotion offer since a player has no way of comparing it to anything else, therefore cannot be seen as an obvious mistake.

I'm sure plenty of places have offered reload bonuses with similar wagering conditions before, they just weren't hit as hard. Betfair would have a tough job proving that this was a clear mistake infront of a licensing jurisdiction.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Petro what you're referring to is commonly known as a Rule 4 in bookmaking - an obvious mistake in a line which does not have to be honoured under gambling terms. Everyone abides by this rule, even arbitrators. Such a rule does not apply to a promotion offer since a player has no way of comparing it to anything else, therefore cannot be seen as an obvious mistake.

I'm sure plenty of places have offered reload bonuses with similar wagering conditions before, they just weren't hit as hard. Betfair would have a tough job proving that this was a clear mistake infront of a licensing jurisdiction.

Given that 5 senior people signed this off, it will be seen that the offer went out as intended, no "mistake". It was RETROSPECTIVELY declared a mistake because of the OUTCOME, rather than the offer itself. It's the same as the player who seeks his money back AFTER having a bad run, rather than because he believed he was "ripped off" at the time of deposit.

Had Betfair NOT lost heavily in this promo, it would have gone out the following week with the SAME rules.

They need to be careful, as a court case might involve them being asked to produce some of their INTERNAL memos regarding the design and implementation of this promo, and this would probably reveal this was NO mistake at all, just incompetent design because they strayed outside their core business without the knowledge or experience to fully understand how such offers should be evaluated.

 

[jetset]

Good point regarding the management approval chain for the promo.

 

[daywalker]

Petro what you're referring to is commonly known as a Rule 4 in bookmaking - an obvious mistake in a line which does not have to be honoured under gambling terms. Everyone abides by this rule, even arbitrators. Such a rule does not apply to a promotion offer since a player has no way of comparing it to anything else, therefore cannot be seen as an obvious mistake.

I think you mean palpable error.

Rule 4 is a deduction made when a runner is withdrawn before the start of the event and after the market has been formed and only applies to live markets and not ante post markets.

 

[Mousey]

I just live in fear of the day that one of the bag boys from my grocery throws open my front door, and marches straight to my kitchen pantry, begins tossing cans of soup into a bag, mumbling something about the owner of the grocery thinking they lost money on the 2 for 1 soup sale and he's taking it back.

 

[Rhyzz]

I think you mean palpable error.

Rule 4 is a deduction made when a runner is withdrawn before the start of the event and after the market has been formed and only applies to live markets and not ante post markets.

You know for the past 8 years I've been getting those mixed up, I think i'm special...

But yes you know what I mean! Horse racing is one of those things I know about but don't really involve myself with, hence the school boy error

 

[petro]

It was RETROSPECTIVELY declared a mistake because of the OUTCOME, rather than the offer itself.

If what you’re meaning to say is that this bonus was not a mistake at its inception. Then what you are saying goes against all the rules of common sense.

I think I am done with this Betfair issue anyway. As I know that Betfair did not label this as a mistake on their behalf. What any decent person would have done in a situation like this is to tell the truth; that they made a mistake and go from there. This as far as I know Betfair has not done. Instead they have labelled everyone as bonus abusers and mentioned nothing about the mistake.

Betfair belongs in the Rogue section.

 

[pokeraddict]

This seems to have gotten quiet. Nobody has reported getting paid yet it seems. So....

1. Betfair has paid some people but were told to keep quiet
2. People have pursued this in the courts and have been advised to stay quiet
3. People have given up

Let's hope it is 1 or 2. Let's hear from some people that have prevailed sooner rather than later.

 

[jetset]

Their corporate woes continue.

From the Daily Mail:

"With shares of the international online betting exchange Betfair on Monday trading 33pc below October's flotation price of £13 at a low of 859p, a top management team led by chief executive David Yu saddled up for a City roadshow in an effort to stop the rot.

"They have this week banged the drum in the offices of old 'friends' Morgan Stanley and Goldman Sachs, the two giant US houses which were joint sponsors of the £1bn-plus IPO.

"The team's presentations must have struck a chord with investors because the shares have since bounced back. Yesterday, they touched 947p before closing 2.50p easier at 922.50p."

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[Nifty29]

I just live in fear of the day that one of the bag boys from my grocery throws open my front door, and marches straight to my kitchen pantry, begins tossing cans of soup into a bag, mumbling something about the owner of the grocery thinking they lost money on the 2 for 1 soup sale and he's taking it back.

NO SOUP FOR YOU!!!!

 

[Webzcas]

I've never promoted Betfair nor played at their casino, however I have been asked to meet with them, or should I say meet with the head of their Affiliate Program at the upcoming LAC.

I have agreed, and I know that other affiliates are meeting with them.

Hopefully the concencus will be that for them to start working with affiliates again, Betfair need to right this fiasco and pay out the players owed from this promotion.

I am also on the Round Table Discussion, Affiliate Panel at the London Affiliate Conference and no doubt Betfair will be brought up. If not, I will ensure they are

 

[vinylweatherman]

This is pretty interesting in that piece:-

A Daily Mail report that Culture Secretary Jeremy Hunt is planning a dramatic crackdown on online gambling firms which could lead to hundreds of foreign operators being forced out of the UK, had shares in online gaming groups pulling up lame.

Hunt apparently is planning to stop companies based overseas from advertising in the UK amid growing concern that millions are becoming addicted to gambling.

It looks like the free ride foreign operators have had since the new gambling act is at risk of being brought to a halt.

There are MANY adverts around now, not just on TV, but on posters, sports grounds (including players). Some TV programmes are also sponsored by casinos, poker, and betting firms.

If the government looks into this further, they may find out about the widespread ripping off that players have been exposed to, with little redress because the firms are based in unresponsive jurisdictions.

The current rules allow any whitelisted jurisdiction to qualify a firm for advertising rights in the UK. Maybe this could be changed so that firms have to have some kind of additional UK license in order to be allowed to advertise.


What the operators should REALLY worry about is the introduction of enforcement measures that will stop these firms from TRANSACTING with UK players without prior approval. Whilst it is likely to have no more success than the UIGEA, the CULTURE is different, and this will NOT be a blanket ban, but a TARGETTED one, which will allow players to belive that unlike the UIGEA, it really IS about separating the rogues from the reliable, and only letting the reliable firms access to UK players.

 

[The Dude]

I've never promoted Betfair nor played at their casino, however I have been asked to meet with them, or should I say meet with the head of their Affiliate Program at the upcoming LAC.

I have agreed, and I know that other affiliates are meeting with them.

Hopefully the concencus will be that for them to start working with affiliates again, Betfair need to right this fiasco and pay out the players owed from this promotion.

I am also on the Round Table Discussion, Affiliate Panel at the London Affiliate Conference and no doubt Betfair will be brought up. If not, I will ensure they are

You'll be wasting your time, Dave. Betfair's affiliate program is outsourced. They have no say-so in Betfair's policies and management. If Betfair thought this episode was serious enough to resolve, they would have resolved it by now.

 

[Webzcas]

You'll be wasting your time, Dave. Betfair's affiliate program is outsourced. They have no say-so in Betfair's policies and management. If Betfair thought this episode was serious enough to resolve, they would have resolved it by now.

Thanks for the heads up. I will email them back on Monday, stating that it is pointless wasting my time, if they have their hands tied.

 

[sambaEah]

This seems to have gotten quiet. Nobody has reported getting paid yet it seems. So....

1. Betfair has paid some people but were told to keep quiet
2. People have pursued this in the courts and have been advised to stay quiet
3. People have given up

Let's hope it is 1 or 2. Let's hear from some people that have prevailed sooner rather than later.

Court action will still be ongoing, it definitely won't have been sorted yet.

 

[jetset]

The threat to white listing advertising appears to be a credible one and is being increasingly picked up by UK media, quoting senior government sources and the Culture Secretary himself.

Months back the Brit government back then intimated that it might have to take action on offshore outfits accessing the Brit market by advertising yet avoiding UK taxation; they were clearly irritated by Ladbrokes and Will Hill taking their online ops to Gibraltar to get a more competitive tax deal. As it turns out, Gibraltar has subsequently hiked its tax trate, but it's still more operator-friendly that the Brit one.

All the reports currently going the rounds have senior government people suggesting that 'white listed' companies interested in accessing the UK market will have to meet the requirements of the UK Gambling Commission and take out a 'secondary' licence....the operators aren't going to like the additional costs, but it's a big market that they will be reluctant to let go, even given the wide nature of internet advertising potential as an alternative to bring in UK punters.

Latest report are suggesting this new regime could be in place as early as within the next two months - around the end of March 2011.

 

[raj]

The threat to white listing advertising appears to be a credible one and is being increasingly picked up by UK media, quoting senior government sources and the Culture Secretary himself.

Months back the Brit government back then intimated that it might have to take action on offshore outfits accessing the Brit market by advertising yet avoiding UK taxation; they were clearly irritated by Ladbrokes and Will Hill taking their online ops to Gibraltar to get a more competitive tax deal. As it turns out, Gibraltar has subsequently hiked its tax trate, but it's still more operator-friendly that the Brit one.

All the reports currently going the rounds have senior government people suggesting that 'white listed' companies interested in accessing the UK market will have to meet the requirements of the UK Gambling Commission and take out a 'secondary' licence....the operators aren't going to like the additional costs, but it's a big market that they will be reluctant to let go, even given the wide nature of internet advertising potential as an alternative to bring in UK punters.

Latest report are suggesting this new regime could be in place as early as within the next two months - around the end of March 2011.

WOW!! That is major!! and by end of March, would like to think they will follow through with this though I really cant see it happening.

Cue.....loads of industry bods taking MPs out to dinner and on expensive junkets to explain after a few bottles of top notch champagne why its not such a good idea...

Raj

 

[raj]

Back to the topic though....

Is there any indication of BF doing the right thing, or indeed anything to resolve the situation.

Mistakes happen, and can be put right with a bit of honesty and a willingness to accept that smoothing things over may mean biting the bullet and parting with some of the company profits for the long term benefit.

Reputation is everything in this game. I have a feeling if BF choose to continue to bury their head in the sand, cease winings and blame players they may regret making that decision for many years to come. BF are now being blacklisted, warnings against playing issued and shunned by affiliates left right and centre.
That sort of thing will stay online forever and most players are a lot more careful these days where they play and deposit.

I wouldnt want to be BFs affiliate manager right now!!

BF CEO "why are we getting no new sign ups?"

BF affiliate manger "Sir, our name is mud , its all over any respected internet forum, no one will touch us with a barge pole"

BF CEO "damn ....we would have gotten away with it if it were't for those pesky kids"

Raj

 

[Webzcas]

Latest report are suggesting this new regime could be in place as early as within the next two months - around the end of March 2011.

Have you got any information on how this affects sites if it indeed does, which are hosted in the UK which carry advertisements for casinos?

 

[raj]

This whole new legislation issue is probably worthy of a thread of its own for discussion rather than tagged onto the Betfair fiasco where it may be missed.

Raj

 

[daywalker]

Back to the topic though....

Is there any indication of BF doing the right thing, or indeed anything to resolve the situation.

From what I can see Betfair consider the matter closed and are happy with their actions.

Lets just hope anyone who is taking them to court is successful. I think anyone taking them on deserves a lot of credit for doing so and I wish the the best of luck.

 

[jetset]

Have you got any information on how this affects sites if it indeed does, which are hosted in the UK which carry advertisements for casinos?

The media reports thus far have been centred mainly on conventional (ie non-Internet) media, but logically digital advertising too would have to be covered to make the new legislation effective.

A lot of the pressure is coming from Brit companies themselves, who are resentful that competitors in other (white-listed) jurisdictions can access 'their' market without any of the disadvantages in terms of UK Commission licensing hassles and Brit taxation/levies.

It's a competitive thing, because many of the offshore jurisdictions have more tax-friendly rates.

I can understand the concern of UK webmasters who take on internet advertising from online gambling companies, but it is not at present clear how the drafters will treat that sector. Perhaps they will initially focus on the main media, penalising the big gambling companies that refuse to indulge in 'secondary' licensing.

But I would imagine in terms of equal treatment for all, and in the interests of making the new legislation water-tight, the role of online gambling websites based in the UK would have to be examined.

And even if they are considered, I'm sure the legal drafters appreciate that the Internet is a big place serviced by companies everywhere, and Brits freely access it for information, making any sort of restriction farcical at best.

On the positive side for webmasters, those companies that decide not to cooperate with this new Brit initiative could well have to rely more on affiliate activity to promote themselves if they are excluded from advertising in the UK.

One also wonders what the white listed jurisdictions are going to do about this - I suspect there'll be some special pleadings coming from them, too because at least part of their appeal is the white listing status they enjoy.

 

[pokeraddict]

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Quite a few players are complaining that Betfair has been stealing money out of their poker accounts and it has been going on since Jan 11.

 

[ergopro]

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Quite a few players are complaining that Betfair has been stealing money out of their poker accounts and it has been going on since Jan 11.

They're just probably raising money to pay Joaopc56

 

[hitobito2005]

2. People have pursued this in the courts and have been advised to stay quiet

Court action takes months and months. I doubt there have even been any hearings over this yet, assuming people have submitted a claim to the courts.

I will be doing this myself, but i'm unable to until the Spring.

 

[pokeraddict]

Court action takes months and months. I doubt there have even been any hearings over this yet, assuming people have submitted a claim to the courts.

I will be doing this myself, but i'm unable to until the Spring.

Right, I meant that the lawyers have advised the victims not to discuss the case until it is resolved.

 

[vinylweatherman]

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Quite a few players are complaining that Betfair has been stealing money out of their poker accounts and it has been going on since Jan 11.

It's a completely different issue, but is being handled badly, and the "Bonus fiasco" is now coming back to bite Betfair in the ass because people are quoting the issue as reference material in the wider discussion of "fairness" from Betfair in resolving such issues.

 

[henritabo]

Hello fellas. Just found casinomeister doing a search on google. I was looking for a place where I can report what happened to me yesterday in Betfair. I was shocked reading this entire thread and would like to tell my story.

So yesterday I deposited 1000€ in betfair casino, awarding their 500€ bonus as they advertise on their website. Everything ran fine. I played the usual games I prefer. Blackjack, some slot machines and casino holdem. It wasn´t long until I could withdraw my money because I made huge bets. The bonus is very good and I stoped loosing money on ladbrokes and thought about give betfair a try (I wish I knew this thread and this site before I deposited 1000 euro in there).

I withdrew 1532€ from their casino and then 1532€ from their sportsbook to my moneybookers account. However today I received an e-mail from betfair asking for my documents again. That´s ok, just some security measurement I thought. I sent them my documents again, they re-opened my account and sent me an e-mail saying the 500€ casino bonus was debited from my balance, so my balance is now 1032€. They said I played using unnaceptable patterns (?)... what´s this? If I lost money would them give it back? Just to let you know my story, not a big deal but it´s another one.

Henrique Taborda

 

[vinylweatherman]

Hello fellas. Just found casinomeister doing a search on google. I was looking for a place where I can report what happened to me yesterday in Betfair. I was shocked reading this entire thread and would like to tell my story.

So yesterday I deposited 1000€ in betfair casino, awarding their 500€ bonus as they advertise on their website. Everything ran fine. I played the usual games I prefer. Blackjack, some slot machines and casino holdem. It wasn´t long until I could withdraw my money because I made huge bets. The bonus is very good and I stoped loosing money on ladbrokes and thought about give betfair a try (I wish I knew this thread and this site before I deposited 1000 euro in there).

I withdrew 1532€ from their casino and then 1532€ from their sportsbook to my moneybookers account. However today I received an e-mail from betfair asking for my documents again. That´s ok, just some security measurement I thought. I sent them my documents again, they re-opened my account and sent me an e-mail saying the 500€ casino bonus was debited from my balance, so my balance is now 1032€. They said I played using unnaceptable patterns (?)... what´s this? If I lost money would them give it back? Just to let you know my story, not a big deal but it´s another one.

Henrique Taborda

This shows they just don't care about proper behaviour. They didn't like the result of these wagers, so decided to "charge back" their €500 offer. It shows they have learned NOTHING from the earlier fiasco, and are perfectly willing to do the same thing over and over again.
They believe that by splitting off the casino division, and hosting it in Malta, they can snub their noses at the law. This is how they dealt with the earlier issue, they said it had to be pursued through Malta, who are in it for the money, and do NOT have a proper system in place for ensuring PLAYERS get a fair deal.

Unfortunately, the new UK government have decided this "scam" needs looking into - not just Betfair, but the whole "abuse of the system" perpetrated by operators who have decided to hole up in offshore havens, yet gain full access and acceptance to the UK market whilst NOT being bound by UK laws and regulations, many of which are designed to protect the consumer from "sharp practice". Naturally, the BIGGEST incentive for the government is the TAX AVOIDANCE nature of this arrangement, profits are generated from UK players, but NOTHING makes it to the UK treasury by way of consumption and profit taxes, yet the UK government has to pick up the costs when things turn sour for players, who need help for gambling addiction, and help when they are scammed out of their money.

 

[henritabo]

Ok, I see your point but isn´t betfair the most accredited gambling site around? I mean, everyone say good things about betfair, pinnacle for example. How can them act like this? If you loose good luck next time, we take your money. If you win, sorry you can´t win give us our money back. I think it´s unnaceptable. What they mean by "patterns"? Is it some game in wich we can´t wager the bonus? that´s fine, but at least say wich games we can´t play. I looked into their terms and you can wager the bonus in black jack and slot machines, each one with his own percentage. I just can´t understand.

 

[pokeraddict]

All of this negative press is finding its way into SERPs. It's just a matter of time before this finds its way into major searches for Betfair. Also if UK forces the issue that casinos can't run and hide in tax havens I would imagine this issue will cause some major problems as I doubt UK players will be quiet there. These guys have become as scummy as it gets and it won't be long before the whole world knows.

 

[raj]

Its all kinda puzzling, certainly from a sports book point of view there is no better place to bet than Betfair.....why are they doing this ?? They HAD quite a good reputation but it is quickly crumbling away thanks to a couple of bad decisions.

You kinda expect this kind of attitiude from some lil clip joint casino in Costa Rica , but an established and reputable firm like Betfair should know better.

Raj

 

[Mousey]

They said I played using unnaceptable patterns

Ok... who kidnapped the Betfair management and dumped a roomful of Rival flunkies into the Betfair offices?

This whole Betfair thing is so... well... bizarre....

 

[hausse222]

I see that betfair continues to act as rouge as a casino can act.
As a consequence i will cashout my betting-role and will give another site, like
betdaq a chance.
I have the feeling that my money is not longer safe at betfair.

 

[uki]

Originally Posted by pokeraddict
This seems to have gotten quiet. Nobody has reported getting paid yet it seems. So....

1. Betfair has paid some people but were told to keep quiet
2. People have pursued this in the courts and have been advised to stay quiet
3. People have given up

Let's hope it is 1 or 2. Let's hear from some people that have prevailed sooner rather than later.

Court action takes months and months. I doubt there have even been any hearings over this yet, assuming people have submitted a claim to the courts.

I will be doing this myself, but i'm unable to until the Spring.

I'm taking the court route and they are planning to defend themselves.

'taking months'.

Nop. If you are in the UK you can use something called Money Claim On Line (google it). This it the new version of Small Claims Court. Apply on line, pay £100 fee (and thats it) an they have 14 days to respond.

Don't need to get solicitors etc involved.

For anyone who is still chasing this, then fill in an MCOL. easy peasy.

 

[GrandMaster]

I'm taking the court route and they are planning to defend themselves.

'taking months'.

Nop. If you are in the UK you can use something called Money Claim On Line (google it). This it the new version of Small Claims Court. Apply on line, pay £100 fee (and thats it) an they have 14 days to respond.

Don't need to get solicitors etc involved.

For anyone who is still chasing this, then fill in an MCOL. easy peasy.

If the defendant files a defence, it can take months before your case goes to court, and even if you win you may have to spend further time and effort to enforce the judgment.

 

[henritabo]

Betfair sent me this e-mail regarding the situation.

"Dear Sir/Madam

Please be advised that following an investigation into your activity in the Betfair Casino, we have concluded that your bets were carried out with the express purpose of abusing the bonus offered.

This is in accordance to the bonus terms and conditions which states that “Betfair also reserves the right not to pay any bonus to customers that it suspects to be abusing this promotion.”

Please be advised that your €1,000 has been returned to your card but the rest of the funds will not be provided as these are bonus money which was obtained against our Terms and Conditions.

We will not be entering into any further correspondence with you.

Kind Regards


Investigations Team"

So we can´t make profit in betfair casino? ok... I thought betfair was the most accredited ones.

 

[sambaEah]

How did you play your funds?

Large blackjack hands and then slots?

 

[uki]

If the defendant files a defence, it can take months before your case goes to court, and even if you win you may have to spend further time and effort to enforce the judgment.

Well small claims does not take that long. Even if it is 6 months then well worth it to get my 4 grand back and to demonstrate to the world that they were in the wrong and stole money.

 

[threescatters]

This is a very sad turnout of this whole thing, betfair are now acting mega rogue to everyone. UK accrediation means nothing...I hope their staff are not so cocky that they work for a great firm now.....betfair are nothing but thieves.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Betfair sent me this e-mail regarding the situation.

"Dear Sir/Madam

Please be advised that following an investigation into your activity in the Betfair Casino, we have concluded that your bets were carried out with the express purpose of abusing the bonus offered.

This is in accordance to the bonus terms and conditions which states that “Betfair also reserves the right not to pay any bonus to customers that it suspects to be abusing this promotion.”

Please be advised that your €1,000 has been returned to your card but the rest of the funds will not be provided as these are bonus money which was obtained against our Terms and Conditions.

We will not be entering into any further correspondence with you.

Kind Regards


Investigations Team"

So we can´t make profit in betfair casino? ok... I thought betfair was the most accredited ones.

Are these terms compliant with the unfair Business practices legislation of 2008? If not, they stand to LOSE these court cases. This act outlaws a number of business practices, and this is regardless of whether they are "clearly stated in the T & C" or not.

A vague "bonus abuse pattern" term would NOT stand up in court as it is "unfair" because it does not specify WHAT the player can & cannot do, and allows the casino to void winnings after the result for whatever reason it wants.

The court may decide that such a bonus term is merely a device for making it against the rules to win when playing with a bonus, and this would be a problem because of the way bonuses and payouts are advertised, with considerable emphasis on the winning, rather than the playing.

They are going to say they will defend the case, since if they don't they lose automatically. Saying they will defend buys them time, and a chance to consider their options, and get advice. If they think they stand to lose, they will probably try to negotiate a settlement.

If they think they will win, but are wrong, they are in BIG trouble. Losing a court case WILL make this story go "mainstream", and they will lose control of the situation.

Take a look at how the banks "shat themselves" during the arguments over charges, and first tried settling out of court to everybody who called their bluff and served them with a small claims summons. Eventually, it got out of control, and a "supercomplaint" was brought by the regulators. This actually turned out quite well for the banks, since a compromise was reached, new laws, but no liabilty to pay back past charges under most circumstances.

The UK government is already considering blocking offshore casinos that don't meet UK standards, and losing a court case against a player could cause Betfair to be "kicked out of the UK" under any new rules. This would be a total disaster for them.