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Baptism by Fire - success Bet-at.eu - giving it a try

dionysus said:
It isn't the casino's responsibility to 'cure' the gambler or make sure he doesn't play anywhere else - just that they personally don't contribute to the problem when told by the player they have issues. Like a bar cutting someone off. I won't serve you any more but I'm not following you through the city to make sure you don't drink anywhere else.
Click to expand...

I think we agree it's a problem that will never fully be resolved. I think what I meant is that with a tight network i.e. a casino under an umbrella group would be able to stop it, but in the grand scale it is unworkable, perhaps slightly different views on the way to agree it won't happen :)
 
3 things here (Or maybe only 2 but.......)

Self exclude = Should be 100% complete, no matter what...Forever option. This should have intelligence. Such as doing the minimal to help a CG... blocking card/ewallet, registered address.

Self exclude 2 = as above... but with a time... 6 months to select.... 1 year even? that blacklists as above but for selected time.

Option 3 = "close account" = Close account indefinitely. Void off all mailing lists, promos, then if the player wants to reopen the account at any time.... contact support and good.


We then differentiate from the 2. I know on previous casinos, where I have said "thats enough, this casino aint great", the option has been self exclude = done for good or nothing... I'd rather move elsewhere thus self exclude would be the option especially with only misleading older terms at some casinos "if account is dormant for x amount of days, then you can be charged". No way do I want to forget I had account and then see im billed years later.

At the time it was a player can self exclude and thats it... in the sh!t, details given to other casinos to stop them playing or... they left account open and risked the term of dormant account = casinos can take money.

As Igor says, its good hes sorting the terms. When I thought I couldnt deposit because of the ID factor, I asked to close account... but was given a self exclude email... I'v learnt from before... Self exclude should be avoided unless you are a true CG with a problem.



There should just be a differentiation..... A) you dont want to play there anymore but want your account closed... or B) you have a gambling problem and need your account closed instantly to prevent the chasing losses or becoming worse in debt.

It is up to the gambler (if CG) to avoid any casino but again (not mentioning bet-at specifiaclly here cause as Igor says about the updates)... any general etiquette of a casino should be to blacklist the original details if CG exclusion is met... thus when trying to use the usual card or ebanking account, that should be blocked and refuse deposits.

I know these guys are good and will implement something like this, just originally it was unclear what was the better option for CG's (exclude for 999999999999 days instantly or exclude with "problem gambler" as option and have to wait for support to reply, thus more chances to deposit and lose)...


Where VWM when you need him.... hes an expert on that side of things :D :notworthy:notworthy


edit:

Final moan...

Maybe the instant chat bar is too close to login (on the right)... have clicked twice now by accident when trying to login, it instantly initiates support, maybe putting the popout menu on the left or underneath?
 
dionysus said:
You're assuming these casino guys are all close and keen to share. While some are professional and view others as peers, I'm sure there's as many which simply see anyone else as competition and are thrilled to line their pockets. Some just don't want someone's else's headaches.
Add to this the international scale - it's going to be virtually impossible to get everyone to work together.
Click to expand...

I agree, it is difficult.

The thing as I say before with bet-at, it seems its more person to person orientated than most.

I'm hardly a high roller for instance (at current). In fact iv taken money off them, but with the aid of Igor and support, this has been pain free and never for 1 second have I been in doubt about getting any money.

This is what a lot of casinos lack. No good comms, no willingness to change. Many are right as far as they are concerned.

After research Bet-At are their own unique name. part of "bringit" affiliate group. I forget the LTD name of the company behind it, but its independent.

as you say.... why should they care about someone whos self excluded elsewhere?

But its all awareness. For example someone sends a bank statement for part of ID... they earn £400 a month (on the statement), but in 1 session blew £1000.... thats about awareness, clearly someone taking home that amount and blowing 1k in a few hours, surely cant be a gambler who gambles for a bit of fun.

We shall see how it pans out. I know in my old days of gambling id blow 2k in 1 sitting when I was on the big bucks. £25 a spin basically.... cant afford it now.... so if I started depositing £2k or stuff like that, then it should be clear im giving outside my living means.

Again we shall see, but we all know, until some system comes in place globally to exclude all CG's in 1 click... but what I wouldnt like is to be a CG, self exclude at any casino, sign up with same details and have them accept bets, until I cashout...... then just claim iv self excluded, void winnings and claim its my fault
 
sparkz said:
I agree, it is difficult.

The thing as I say before with bet-at, it seems its more person to person orientated than most.

I'm hardly a high roller for instance (at current). In fact iv taken money off them, but with the aid of Igor and support, this has been pain free and never for 1 second have I been in doubt about getting any money.

This is what a lot of casinos lack. No good comms, no willingness to change. Many are right as far as they are concerned.

After research Bet-At are their own unique name. part of "bringit" affiliate group. I forget the LTD name of the company behind it, but its independent.

as you say.... why should they care about someone whos self excluded elsewhere?

But its all awareness. For example someone sends a bank statement for part of ID... they earn £400 a month (on the statement), but in 1 session blew £1000.... thats about awareness, clearly someone taking home that amount and blowing 1k in a few hours, surely cant be a gambler who gambles for a bit of fun.

We shall see how it pans out. I know in my old days of gambling id blow 2k in 1 sitting when I was on the big bucks. £25 a spin basically.... cant afford it now.... so if I started depositing £2k or stuff like that, then it should be clear im giving outside my living means.

Again we shall see, but we all know, until some system comes in place globally to exclude all CG's in 1 click... but what I wouldnt like is to be a CG, self exclude at any casino, sign up with same details and have them accept bets, until I cashout...... then just claim iv self excluded, void winnings and claim its my fault
Click to expand...

I agree with a lot of what you are trying to put across but it's like telling someone that goes to a fast food chain quite often that they should cut down on their happy meals, they are the customer and unless they break chairs and give grief to staff then the business versus morals issue cannot even be suggested at.

One could argue that a balanced diet is best for both parties in the long term, a balanced and steady release of calories (cash) but try this with a customer that has the cash (and the need for consumption) to buy what they want, human nature is to go for the fatty and sugary foods first (the big wins). Balance is great (we all strive for it) but sadly some can't do this and need help.

Trying to tell someone that their weekly / monthly wage would give a risk rating after normal expected bills were extracted was something that banks could not police to a great extent, they were and still are complicate to the problem.

I wouldn't expect a business that needs to pay staff and or shareholders to worry too much about morals. I know that the PG's could be helped but this opens a whole new can of worms to all other forms of monitoring and possible control on the way an elected body would choose fit to suggest and let's say tell us what's right.
 
Bonus Wagering Met

Well, I never thought I'd get through the wagering on a $25 deposit. Game play was slow on almost everything, but I did have a little luck on a few games, and with $2600 in wagering, I need some! Most of my bets were $1 or more, started with Megadeath (which I do like a lot!) and ended up playing $4 bets after getting ahead a few bucks since the variance seemed pretty low. If you play the nudge, the betsize jumps from $.80 to $1.60 and then to $4.00, which was pretty hefty for my balance. Made a bet which used part bonus money and hit a bonus round, bonus funds increased, as did cash balance.

Played a long time (too long to be honest, for the number of bets made) at 91% of wagering met (I do LOVE this feature) I had a nice total balance of about $250.

Anxious to get through it, I went to one of my favourites, Reel Thunder, and just about lost it all, with barely a line win or three scatters. Desperate (and tired after about 7 hours of gaming) I upped my bet to $4.50 when I was down to about $30, and made a few modest wins, just to keep me playing. With under $25 left, I hit a nice win of over $300, followed almost immediately with another of around $170, and then $94 to leave me a balance of over $550! What a comeback, only around 5% of wagering left.

Moonshine actually played reasonably quickly, and I met the wagering.

Now I'm wondering if now that wagering is met, and no bonus is active, am I free to play progressives, tables, bets larger than $8? Qualify for the Achievement awards?

Anyone got the address to send docs to?
 
welcome

I tried last weekend some slots - there are nice ones, I got fun and some cool winnings (unfortunatly no cash-out before fullfilling the wagerrequirements;-)))

cheers
schnuggi
 
schnuggi said:
I tried last weekend some slots - there are nice ones, I got fun and some cool winnings (unfortunatly no cash-out before fullfilling the wagerrequirements;-)))

cheers
schnuggi
Click to expand...

Hey schnuggi -

You can cash out before fulfilling WR but your bonus will be invalidated. If you hit big early on while using real money you don't need to wait for WR - drop the bonus balance and go home large :) Deposits don't get tied into the bonus.
 
dionysus said:
my bad
that was where I set mine (was still quick though)

and d'oh...shoulda cashed out lol -hit this 14th spin in
Click to expand...


was a nice lil hit early in -didnt make WR, but gave me hope
 

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Jasminebed said:
Well, I never thought I'd get through the wagering on a $25 deposit. Game play was slow on almost everything, but I did have a little luck on a few games, and with $2600 in wagering, I need some! Most of my bets were $1 or more, started with Megadeath (which I do like a lot!) and ended up playing $4 bets after getting ahead a few bucks since the variance seemed pretty low. If you play the nudge, the betsize jumps from $.80 to $1.60 and then to $4.00, which was pretty hefty for my balance. Made a bet which used part bonus money and hit a bonus round, bonus funds increased, as did cash balance.

Played a long time (too long to be honest, for the number of bets made) at 91% of wagering met (I do LOVE this feature) I had a nice total balance of about $250.

Anxious to get through it, I went to one of my favourites, Reel Thunder, and just about lost it all, with barely a line win or three scatters. Desperate (and tired after about 7 hours of gaming) I upped my bet to $4.50 when I was down to about $30, and made a few modest wins, just to keep me playing. With under $25 left, I hit a nice win of over $300, followed almost immediately with another of around $170, and then $94 to leave me a balance of over $550! What a comeback, only around 5% of wagering left.

Moonshine actually played reasonably quickly, and I met the wagering.

Now I'm wondering if now that wagering is met, and no bonus is active, am I free to play progressives, tables, bets larger than $8? Qualify for the Achievement awards?

Anyone got the address to send docs to?
Click to expand...


Hey Jas :)

Really happy you hit lucky! We're still being haunted with game lag - really working on it. All these comments coming from different geo-regions and PM's with information really help get to the bottom of things.

Send your docs to payments@bet-at.eu we'll push the WD straight away :)

Igor
 
I played last night with the lovely bonus Igor gifted to me (thank you Igor for sorting this out :notworthy )

I had fun and managed to make the £25 last quite a long time.

However....I found the games lagging quite badly at times, which unfortunately was a pain.

Once this has been resolved, I will be back!
 
Self Exclusions vs Closing of Account

Hi All,

Cant quote all of your posts but i wanted to explain a bit about SE and closure.

Responsible gambling page is getting updated to be more efficient and slightly more clear in its terminology, however:

Self exclusions for a limited time generally mean: I don't want to play so don't entice me back but we can keep in touch on important things. Sometimes we give % of losses pushed out as a withdrawal for really bad runs for example and it gives us an option to communicate to the player on one to one basis.

Opting for self exclusion will kick you out there and then, and you wont be able to log in - check your account details, or any such thing and we cant let you in by law. However timed exclusions are easier to handle with the regulators and the communication with the player is less frowned upon. I'm not talking about fishing here, i'm talking about honest transparent communication on the basis of the experience.

We segregated the indefinite closure because that is a complete disconnection from the casino. "Don't bother me and don't communicate to me on anything". Gambling issues are a "forever exclusion" as well - we don't mess about with that.

That said - indefinite exclusion (account closure) happens frequently when a player simply had a bad run or got sub-par CS experience. I get copies of those requests directly and while I'll be including a message box to the director on there, for now its only way to get a handle on an angry customer that deserves to be helped and through who's experience our own process can be improved.

The process with the exclusion is to block game play and contact the customer for clarification. It gives us an option to salvage a relationship that can be salvaged and to ensure right systems are notified in case of gambling problems as to ensure complete disconnection form us.

As for centralised database - i agree its almost impossible to make one work. Works well in theory but the human nature can never allow something like that to perform as intended.

Ig
 
IMPORTANT QUESTION

Hi, whoever still keeps track of this thread and its 20 pages :eek2: can you please help me with some more info:

Whoever played the casino on the PC and has a smart phone - can you try the games on mobile and let me know the game performances?

Ask and ill drop an NDB to try it out.

Many thanks!

Igor
 
Ok, summary:

Played the mobile app on the ipad and on the phone...games ran smooth no hiccups (and INCREDIBLY fast on the ipad ..I mean, better than casinos in general)

So, if you're a mobile player, I say thumbs up :thumbsup: If you're depping and playing on the go, the mobile's good to go ;)
 
sparkz said:
3 things here (Or maybe only 2 but.......)

Self exclude = Should be 100% complete, no matter what...Forever option. This should have intelligence. Such as doing the minimal to help a CG... blocking card/ewallet, registered address.

Self exclude 2 = as above... but with a time... 6 months to select.... 1 year even? that blacklists as above but for selected time.

Option 3 = "close account" = Close account indefinitely. Void off all mailing lists, promos, then if the player wants to reopen the account at any time.... contact support and good.


We then differentiate from the 2. I know on previous casinos, where I have said "thats enough, this casino aint great", the option has been self exclude = done for good or nothing... I'd rather move elsewhere thus self exclude would be the option especially with only misleading older terms at some casinos "if account is dormant for x amount of days, then you can be charged". No way do I want to forget I had account and then see im billed years later.

At the time it was a player can self exclude and thats it... in the sh!t, details given to other casinos to stop them playing or... they left account open and risked the term of dormant account = casinos can take money.

As Igor says, its good hes sorting the terms. When I thought I couldnt deposit because of the ID factor, I asked to close account... but was given a self exclude email... I'v learnt from before... Self exclude should be avoided unless you are a true CG with a problem.



There should just be a differentiation..... A) you dont want to play there anymore but want your account closed... or B) you have a gambling problem and need your account closed instantly to prevent the chasing losses or becoming worse in debt.

It is up to the gambler (if CG) to avoid any casino but again (not mentioning bet-at specifiaclly here cause as Igor says about the updates)... any general etiquette of a casino should be to blacklist the original details if CG exclusion is met... thus when trying to use the usual card or ebanking account, that should be blocked and refuse deposits.

I know these guys are good and will implement something like this, just originally it was unclear what was the better option for CG's (exclude for 999999999999 days instantly or exclude with "problem gambler" as option and have to wait for support to reply, thus more chances to deposit and lose)...


Where VWM when you need him.... hes an expert on that side of things :D :notworthy:notworthy


edit:

Final moan...

Maybe the instant chat bar is too close to login (on the right)... have clicked twice now by accident when trying to login, it instantly initiates support, maybe putting the popout menu on the left or underneath?
Click to expand...

Here:D

This fear that casinos will send you a bill for a dormant account is overrated. They can only take money from any balance you have left behind. If you are sensible, you will not leave anything behind where you have decided not to play for a prolonged period (other than sticky bonus funds, or the odd few pence). Once the balance is zero, no more money is billed. The whole thing is a mechanism for casinos to steadily zero a dormant account so that they no longer need to support it. Other casinos simply confiscate the balance after the account has been dormant for some time, but many will reinstate it if the player returns. Casinos licensed in Malta send the dormant account funds to the LGA if they are unable to contact the player. The LGA will then return them to the player if asked, but knowing their incompetence on other matters (such as policing their own regulations), one should not let things get this far.

Asking for account closures often seems to get players added to a "problem gambler" database if no specific reason other than this is given to the casino. I just let accounts go dormant, but they are emptied first so I can't lose money through dormancy fees.
 
How come you don't get any cash balance again after getting above the original bonus amount?? Not really happy about that. Also looking at suddenly achievement does not count despite i had some nice hits on IM Immortal Romance :mad:

I made £25 got £50 bonus. Went very low. Then got up to almost £75. But everything is now Bonus only.

I have not seen this at any microgaming casinos. When going above bonus should always be cash balance again. :confused:
 

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