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another useless casino id system - luckynetwork

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by sparkz, Jun 3, 2009.

    Jun 3, 2009
  1. sparkz

    sparkz Senior Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Earth
    time for my latest rant, it mainly focuses on the id factors of this...


    i saw luckynetwork on a site and signed up not so long ago, upon signup it asked for passport number or id number... i dont have either of these because in the uk id's are not issued to everyone (the only chance of getting an id is via getting a provisional but paying in excess of 50 for 1 which i wouldnt use as i have no intention of driving and never get id'd in shops/pubs here so it would be a waste of money) and i have never been abroad so havent ever bothered to get a passport (even now theres even less point because to get a 1st passport you have to go to some other city for an nterview so this again could be costly and possibly 100+)

    so anyway in this box i did put "dont have any", because my main intention was to use the no deposit money to play as i had heard some good things about the fun, new and exciting slots they have there, and if i met wagering requirements/wanted to deposit i would contact support and explain this to them.

    I played and i met wagering requirements and really loved the games. I also read and noticed on the net that this casino has been paying people with no problems. So i get in touch with live support explaining everything to them, how i would of liked to cashout the no deposit winnings (max cashout of 40) and of course started to make real deposits. I told them how i have many other documents to proove who i am such as wage slips, government issued income support forms, my yearly taxcode/amount, bank statements, utility bills, national insurance card, possible pictures of my bank card, which overall all of them state my name and most of them state my address and date of birth,

    i also explained how there would be no difference between a passport/id and the documents i do have because they all proove fully that i am who i say i am and no "fraudster" could possibly have all of them documents of mine..

    the only constant reply i had off them was saying they couldnt process any withdrawl without a copy of my passport or photo id, once again i said to them i had neither and they went on to say exactly the same and also something along the lines of "the id cards are issued by the government in the country you are a resident of", in the end i gave up and emailed support but with no reply to date


    this irritates me, some casino support staff/managers dont have a clue, how can i get hold of a government issued id card when they dont issue them in the uk and whats the point of paying all that money and travelling distances to get a passport which takes weeks and a fair bit of money just to send a copy to the casino to get myself verified in order to cashout 40?

    im hoping my email is responded to soon, hopefully the person who reads that email wont be as stupid and incompetant as the person i spoke to in live support
     
  2. Jun 3, 2009
  3. silcnlayc

    silcnlayc Just one more spin pleez! CAG MM PABnonaccred PABaccred

    Occupation:
    IT Director of Operations
    Location:
    Left Hungary
    Go to any place that makes photo ID cards. You can request this here in the USA from the DMV when you do not have any other form of ID except a birth certificate. That should be simple enough. How does one prove who they are if you have no photo ID?? Just curious. What happens if you got stopped by the police and you had no ID?

    .
     
  4. Jun 3, 2009
  5. funky_seagull

    funky_seagull Dormant account

    Occupation:
    unemployed, on incapacity benefit.
    Location:
    scotland
    The UK isn't the USA.

    We don't have a place that makes photo ID cards. Not everybody drives or is allowed to drive due to medical conditions. Not everyone wants to travel abroad, and these ID's cost a lot of money, fuck that.

    I guess someone could create a pretend photo ID using photoshop, some casinos don't seem to have a clue how things work here in the UK, so maybe they wouldn't know, and it would teach them to be such wankers.

    I was stopped once by the police when I was homeless. They asked me questions about my identity. Used their walkie talkies to verify the information I supplied them with their HQ, searched me for drugs, then said that all the information I had given them was verified on their computer and I was a real person... didn't give me any money to buy a cup of tea though, stingy fuckers.

    I do agree about this whole photo ID thing, it is a load of bollox. There are many other ways to prove a person's ID. The photo ID thing seems to me to be a way to stall processing withdrawals and a gamble by the casino that the person won't possess photo ID and so the casino will keep the money. Total scam if you ask me. There are plenty of paper documents that prove who you are, what fucking difference does a photo make?
     
    1 person likes this.
  6. Jun 3, 2009
  7. sparkz

    sparkz Senior Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Earth

    theres nothing like this here sadly, as mentioned provisionals can be obtained at a cost but useless paying that money when im not going to learn how to drive,

    photo id's shouldnt matter in a way with casinos because the picture on the id could be of anyone, they will never know what you look like,

    im not sure to be honest what happens if police stop someone, rubish uk me thinks :(, the only time in my life have i been given an id card was only a proof of age card (just like college students cards) back at school 6 years+ ago, however when i went to use it in a shop about 4 years ago they told me it couldnt be accepted and i ended up losing that card lol

    edit: oh and couldnt agree with you more funky seagull
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2009
  8. Jun 3, 2009
  9. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    THIS is what makes me mad, even though this issue doesn't affect me (yet). This kind of reply is like CS saying "Hey there player - look how THICK we are here at xxxxxx casino." This can put of even players who DO have the ID they want, as it gives the impression that dealing with their CS is going to be like dealing with a bunch of robots, with simple issues becoming a nightmare. Oddly enough, in my own experience, dealing with front line CS is JUST LIKE THIS on many an occasion.

    IF casinos want the photo ID, they should provide a way for players to obtain one from a respected industry body, such as eCogra - one that casinos will trust.

    Considering how careless the UK government has been with data recently, and the fact that a reporter managed to apply for a driver's license for David Blunkett (who is blind, and was well known at the time, as a government minister) without David's knowledge - I would think an eCogra sourced ID would be more secure than a government one for what the casinos want it for.

    Players are only going to go for the provisional drivers license option if their level of play is going to make the 50 expense worthwhile, and only a high roller is going to bother getting a passport purely to satisfy a new casino he was looking to play at.

    The ONLY other photo ID cards available here in the UK are issued by private organisations, and are obtained mainly for the purpose of granting some kind of pass to a customer. These WILL SATISFY the purpose that casinos want them for, preventing multiple account frauds, since they can check the details with their records.

    Where a registration field simply asks for ID number, a UK player can put in their National Insurance number, although only if the site can be trusted, since our National Insurance number is similar to the US Social Security number, and may cause problems for the player if it got into the wrong hands.
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. Jun 4, 2009
  11. sparkz

    sparkz Senior Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Earth
    relating to this casino, yet again they have been useless,


    i got 1 email saying because i had requested 100 that it would not be processed and that i would have to choose 40 as thats max cashout via a no deposit bonus, and also they explained how bankers draft would take a month to process but if i selected neteller then it would be processed asap,

    so i went onto my account, reversed the withdraw, selected 40 cashout and neteller,


    today got this reply...


    "Well done on winning with us. Unfortunately our system will not allow you to successfully process a withdrawal. If we dont have a valid ID number from you then your account will automatically be banned when we approve your withdrawal. We require a valid number ID from all players that wish to use any type of money transactions within our casino. "

    1stly how can i change the "dont have any" i entered to an "id number" and i have explained no less than 7 times to them via live support and email that i have none, and as you rightly said vinylweatherman i could of put national insurance number in the box, but they could use that in fraudulent ways such as claiming a benefit i am not entitled to using my national insurance number which could end up with me getting a fine or into serious crap, and as they arent yet established its not a risk im willing to take


    i have explained yet again about how things like my bank statement, wage slip, yearly tax code/taxed amount form, benefit forms and utility bills are more than equivilant to say a US Government issued ID Card or a passport so im awaiting the reply but somehow im not confident it will be anything i want to hear :(
     
  12. Jun 4, 2009
  13. sparkz

    sparkz Senior Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Earth
    omfg n its like talking to a brick wall

    just got anotehr reply

    "Thank you for your reply. We apologize for the inconvenience you are experiencing. We are looking into this matter. Do you have a drivers license that you can send to us as proof of indentification?"


    lmao, yawnsss
     
  14. Jun 5, 2009
  15. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    It seems they will pay your 40, and then ban your account without an ID number.

    Try accepting this, and telling them you will contact a government office for advice as to which number is required to be given to foreign businesses when they require an ID number to process financial transactions.

    If enough players did this when in receipt of this kind of bullsh1t from casinos, these casinos might review this at a higher level, not wishing various governments to be receiving this kind of enquiry as routine from it's citizens.

    Hopefully, they will then devise a more sensible way to verify that they are paying the correct player.

    I get the impression that quite a bit of this is "stalling", and hoping they can catch out players who win & can't jump through all the hoops, meaning they only have to refund the deposits.
    What SHOULD be concerning casinos is that they are paying the SAME person who made the deposits, and that this is also the SAME person who registered the account, and that the details given are valid. NONE of this checking requires a thing from the player, it can all be done in the background through the electoral roll data, and Experian, who offer ID checking for businesses, as well as credit scoring. All the casino would then need to do is send a PIN to the address registered with them, and require the player to enter it to prove they are at the address.
     
  16. Jun 5, 2009
  17. sparkz

    sparkz Senior Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Earth
    i did explain something like that to them last night... the 1 reply was:

    "It is highly unlikely that the aforementioned documents you described in your previous email will be used as a form of identification here at Lucky Network. I have taken the matter up with my manager and he will see if we can solve the problem by tomorrow and then get back to you with an email. As far as rules and regulations go a form of identification such as an ID document, passport, drivers license, social security card etc. is needed to make a payout."

    what gets me is originally it was just passport or government id they wanted, now they dont mind a social security card (pretty much the same as a national insurance card right? but im not gonna risk that) after me keeping on that them.

    At least now they are being a bit more smarter by contacting management n "trying" to sort it lol


    thats the thing with a lot of online casinos nowadays, with a lot of the useless checks n as you say "hoops" that are around, many potential players could end up with nothing, they make a deposit and win...... but only see their deposit back and winnings voided, or they lose it and see nothing
     
  18. Jun 5, 2009
  19. sparkz

    sparkz Senior Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Earth
    todays update:

    they emailed saying they will contact the "directors" about this, whoever/whatever they are lol
     
  20. Jun 5, 2009
  21. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Told ya:D

    They are crappin' their pants over what our GOVERNMENT will make of these demands.

    It is the PASSPORT that will worry government, since it is copies of the ID page of passports that is fuelling the entry of "illegals" into the country using fake passports.

    Clearly, they have never thought of what GOVERNMENTS, concious of NATIONAL security, are going to make of the wall of colour copies of ID going to support centres in unnamed countries, with varying levels of security (or even none).

    What you are being told you must provide goes against home office rules, which is probably what you will be told if you did write to the government departments involved.

    This issue needs to be brought to a head though, even if this means using governments to put pressure on the industry to come up with a workable ID verification scheme that works for ALL players, AND does NOT place us at risk of ID theft, NOR goes against what our governments intend these documents to be used for.

    There needs to be a way for players to get their ID verified centrally by an organisation of enough standing that both players and casinos can trust them, and whose operations are carried out in a jurisdiction with strict data protection laws, so that governments are happy for sensitive raw ID data to be processed there.
    The player would be issued with a "casino license", which will carry enough data for casinos to verify against their databases, but that will NOT carry irrelevant data that could be used in ID theft.
    eCogra would be ideal at present, having sufficient standing for both casinos and players, and also being based here in the EU, with it's strict data protection laws. Players are likely to have to pay for the service though, unless casinos decide to fund it, as they usually do for our deposits and withdrawals.
     
    1 person likes this.
  22. Jun 6, 2009
  23. sparkz

    sparkz Senior Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Earth
    yeh i think i couldnt agree more,

    the idea about an organisation where players can get verified sounds 100% right. After all what happens to a player who deposits at a new casino and then sends copies of documents to get a withdraw, then 3 months later that casino starts acting rogueish and scams people out of money? if they arent afraid to scam people then surely they wont be afraid to use the information contains in the documents in an illegal way.

    I was actually watching something the other day about illegal immigrants and they were saying the amount of fake passports they use are ever increasing, some get caught out but some dont.


    I reckon LuckyNetwork may now be trying to "scam" me out of my winnings, i zero'd the account because i had excess bonus money that would of been removed anyway once the 40 was fully withdrawn. Before i played slots until it was zero'd i checked in the account and of course the 40 was still pending (as i thought it would pend until the "directors"..lol... have sorted the problem out), once my account was zero'd i checked a few hours later and there was no pending withdraw, no history of it at all :O

    i got in touch with them again and all support could tell me is that withdraw was denied until the id issue was sorted then i could withdraw the 40 and it would be processed normally... i explained to them how there is no money in the account to "withdraw" once the id issue was sorted and they just repeated theirself with what they had said before,

    i know it wasnt reversed because i reversed some of the withdraw before (to change the withdraw amount from 100 to 40 as they had said) and i had an automated email confirming it had been reversed, so the only possibly explanations is that they have taken it away so i wont get it or once the id matter is solved (if it ever is lol) the 40 will be automatically sent to my neteller account


    i hate the way that there emails dont contain a support member name just

    "Kind Regards
    Lucky Network Support"

    because theres no way for a member to give feedback on whos doing their job correctly and probably no way for management to check whos sent what (unless its a 1 man casino :p)
     
  24. Jun 6, 2009
  25. sparkz

    sparkz Senior Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Earth
    great... just got email from them

    "With regard to your withdrawal request being denied it is company policy to deny any such request without any proper identification as per terms, conditions and policies within Lucky Network. After the ID problem has been sorted out you will not be able to withdraw the 40GBP bonus as you have already zeroed your balance."

    im not bothered about the money but if this isnt rogueish behaviour i dont know what is.... a no deposit with a max cashout limt is EXACTLY that, you can have a bonus with say 80 amx cashout, if you reach bang on 80 then they dont turn around and say "you have 0 in you account after so wont get this money"

    their other reply was also...

    "We apologize for any inconvenience or misunderstanding in the previous emails, we are the first company using this software internationally and will speak to the developers as to why that denied withdrawal cannot be seen."


    well they need to get their fkin act together, i played with a no deposit bonus, won, and cashed it out at the max of 40, end of it was taken from my balance, then i play with the rest of the bonus money and now aint entitled to anything...

    think its time i shoved a huge pile of evidence in their face on how hopeless they really are
     
  26. Jun 6, 2009
  27. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom

    Call their bluff, actually WRITE to the government, through your local MP. You now have more of a "story", since you ended up gambling everything away since it looked unlikely you would ever get the issue resolved. This falls foul of MORE regulations, those for responsible gambling. You WANTED to quit with a small withdrawal, but couldn't. Given the tiny amount involved, the ID requests were certainly over the top given that eCogra sealholder guidelines only require concrete verification when total withdrawals reach 1000

    In effect, your money is being held ransom UNTIL you send in a passport, this "ransom" element is what will worry the government, since it will effectively prevent players from following home office guidelines, and it only needs the passport to be sent ONCE to the wrong outfit to create a problem with your ID details.

    They may not INTENTIONALLY be trying to scam you, but this is what they are effectively doing to many UK players with old paper driving licenses, or even none at all, and no passport, or who do not want to send passport copies against home office guidelines.
     
  28. Jun 6, 2009
  29. silcnlayc

    silcnlayc Just one more spin pleez! CAG MM PABnonaccred PABaccred

    Occupation:
    IT Director of Operations
    Location:
    Left Hungary
    I really didn't know this. Here in the USA you can get one made with an address and photo and an ID number.

    Sorry to hear you have had such an awful time of it.

    .
     
  30. Jun 6, 2009
  31. lee_bumble

    lee_bumble Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Adminstration
    Location:
    UK
    sparkz

    hey sparkz,

    It sounds to me that you are a bit of a bum.

    Let's be fair you are on the dole bro. Your skint and cant even afford a passport. Your in last chance hotel.

    I say, get a job and stop fucking about on the internet.

    Regards

    Lee_bumble
     
  32. Jun 6, 2009
  33. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    This is just so simple, but we don't even HAVE an "ID number" as such, the nearest to these being "entitlement" numbers. Our National Health number entitles us to free healthcare, and our National Insurance number tracks us from the age of 16 for tax and benefit purposes. Both are unique to an individual, and would serve as an ID number, but NEITHER can be officially made up into a photo ID card - unless we do it ourselves in Photoshop from component parts - doubt casinos would accept this:rolleyes:

    We can also get a European health insurance card for free, with yet another unique ID number, but AGAIN, these are NOT issued with a photo.
     
  34. Jun 6, 2009
  35. sparkz

    sparkz Senior Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Earth
    hmmm now that could be a great idea :D :thumbsup: ;)


    i wonder if they even bother reading my essays because there never seemed to be the right reply, still pretty puzzled with it since the 40 no deposit winnings were withdrawn from my overall balance and havent been put back on my account at all just mysteriously disapeared with no history of it (even tho there was not so long ago) and they even said its been "denied" not "reversed"


    il send em the bill for my paracetemol too cause theyve managed to give me a headache :lolup::lolup::lolup::lolup::lolup:
     
  36. Jun 6, 2009
  37. Kenny Lingus

    Kenny Lingus Tard Counter

    Occupation:
    Mortgage Industry
    Location:
    Near Chicago, Illinois
    That was SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO F*CKING MEAN, and yet I laughed for at least ten minutes before I could type this reply. LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  38. Jun 6, 2009
  39. sparkz

    sparkz Senior Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Earth
    LMFAO


    well im guessing your nothing less than the "upper class" in this country, especially with the colins chav dictionary for kids you clearly use :p, next time i leave "last chance hotel" and visit cardboard alley i'll pay you a visit and buy you the 2009 edition.
     
    1 person likes this.

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