WARNING Affiliates Who Target Problem Gamblers

[FruitySlots]

Look, greed overtook ethics, you won't be the first or last. As you say, ultimately YOU bear responsibility and I suspect many reader here will be highly sceptical that a SEO contractor who, if as you say, isn't an industry expect had a brainstorm and suddenly took it upon himself to quite professionally open an affiliate account with a non-GamStop outfit knowing it would monetize those search terms and then pay commission to you.

You're talking to numerous other affiliates on this forum as well as seasoned players, YT viewers and industry professionals and I find this denial insults our intelligence to be frank. It seems to me simply a case of "well, others are doing it so it why should I miss out?

sorry pal but this has peeved me off a bit. Im not trying to insult anyones intelligence but vice versa you accusing us of greed yet we didnt have any affiliation on the said 'non gam stop' page.

Its all a bit pot kettle black but 'you did worse' situation. Your website is called fastpayingcasinos. It says :

Online slots and casino player? Want fast cash-outs? You can at these fast paying casinos!
Fast paying casinos with no pending period or cash-outs in minutes to 24 hours. Get your winnings paid fast!

You have over 70+ casinos listed on the homepage. I dont even know if a handfull of them pay out in minutes or fast. Is that completelty false advertising of your whole entire site? Its such a dangerous game calling out affiliates and then going a step further to try and pressurize there partners to cut ties with them. Its border line bullying.

The deal with Conquestador was nothing to do with greed. We saw them plastered all over Google ads, we thought they had a decent looking product and good games and as a new casino that wasnt saturared amongst the streaming community we got in touch and started working with them. Completely unknowing that they were not on gamstop. I have actually refunded some players losses who were on gamstop and gambled on this casino.

I dont mind debate but wrongful accusations and inaccurate comments and statement are very dangerous and cause more issues because people jump on the back of them and everything spirals.

 

[FruitySlots]

Other than taking down the content, what are you intending to do to set right the damage that has been done by your business?

We can contact everyone who signed up to conquestador through us and find out if they were on Gamstop. If they were we can refund thier losses.

Its not a huge pool of customers as we are not a massive affiliate. This will pretty much cover any/all damage done by working with/promoting a non gamstop casino. I have already done this with 1 customer who reached out to me.

 

[colinsunderland]

We can contact everyone who signed up to conquestador through us and find out if they were on Gamstop. If they were we can refund thier losses.

Its not a huge pool of customers as we are not a massive affiliate. This will pretty much cover any/all damage done by working with/promoting a non gamstop casino. I have already done this with 1 customer who reached out to me.

How are you going to do that?

 

[Supababe]

I love how the community is coming together to tackle such ‘shady’ practice. It is too be commended.

I have avoided commenting so far but felt strongly compelled to add this....

We simply don’t want to appear to be a forum who gang up and bully. We need to be extremely careful of who we string up.

Yes, the guilty parties will make excuses but also there may well be some innocence amongst their replies. It is not our place to play judge and jury. That lies with the tagged casinos affiliate members who, as accredited ones, we should have enough respect to trust the judgements of.

Targeting specifically Conquestador affiliates is detracting from the bigger issues here. It is forgivable in my eyes that sites assumed that this was part of GAMSTOP, or that it would be in the imminent future.

 

[TravellingRecluse]

Here are some basic facts.

You state that:



However, a quick look at the web archieve shows this:

and this

and this

Con******* are one of the few operators left with a UK license that are not participating in the GamStop scheme. So your claim is that an SEO in your employ has put a page up that is specifically intended to drive traffic related to bypassing GamStop and it just so happens that you've also selected to give one of the few remaining operators not participating in GamStop 2 out of 3 top positions on your homepage and by far the greatest click exposure of any operator on your homepage.

For the sake of clarity, I will also highlight that this is at a time when the offending page can be confirmed to have been present on your site:

I could have posted links to Wayback Machine but it is note worthy that someone has had the archieve page for the 'Casinos not on GamStop' page removed from the archieve. This may have been an attempt to clean up this mess, but it also stops verification of what was actually on the page prior to takedown.

Whether or not you had advertisements on that particularly page, your SEO strategy was clearly intended to bring traffic to your site from search terms related to bypassing GamStop. Saying that you have not financially benefitted from this traffic because their were no advertisements on that page is to ask everyone to naively believe that all of the traffic only visited that page and left.

Personally I find it a little difficult to believe that not only has an SEO been given entirely unsupervised access to post whatever they like, but that your selection of premium partner just so happened to be one that could take advantage of the vulnerable traffic your SEO was specifically tapping into. I note that this brand appears to have been removed as well, so it seems likely you are aware that they weren't participating with GamStop.

Moving on you also state:



If you are genuine in your position of being held accountable for this issue you'll understand that you have brought in vulnerable traffic looking to bypass GamStop, then presented them with your '#1 pick', an operator that doesn't participate in GamStop. Other than taking down the content, what are you intending to do to set right the damage that has been done by your business?

You also understand that there's a good possibility that operators found to have been involved with affiliates engaging these practices could face regulatory sanction? Are you prepared to take responsibility for any subsequent negative consequences for your partners that come from your actions?

TP

One of the most credible and thorough demolitions of business integrity I have seen. I tip my hat to you.

 

[FruitySlots]

How are you going to do that?

The majority of users are signed up through our giveaways which they need to register on our website to take part in so we have there contact information. I'll speak to conquestador about the remaining players.

 

[FruitySlots]

Targeting specifically Conquestador affiliates is detracting from the bigger issues here. It is forgivable in my eyes that sites assumed that this was part of GAMSTOP, or that it would be in the imminent future.

thanks for that sensible post. i also agree its detracting from the thread.

 

[colinsunderland]

The majority of users are signed up through our giveaways which they need to register on our website to take part in so we have there contact information. I'll speak to conquestador about the remaining players.

just be careful you or the casino aren't breaching any laws - not having a go, just a little advice. The GDPR is far reaching and certainly conquestador won't be able to legally give you any customer information.

 

[FruitySlots]

My last post before i go an try and enjoy my holiday. This was our traffic stats for 'said page'. As stated we have tiny traffic and i genuinly believe there was zero damage done. We removed immediately and again the page had NO affiliate links on it. We will work on making right the Conquestador partnership seperately.

But seriously guys. 22 visits with a 81% bounce rate and 23 sec av duration. The rhetoric and stuff that has been thrown towards us simply does not warrant the 'crime'.

 

[FruitySlots]

just be careful you or the casino aren't breaching any laws - not having a go, just a little advice. The GDPR is far reaching and certainly conquestador won't be able to legally give you any customer information.

correct they wont but they may be able to communicate with are tagged players themselevs and we can communicate with the ones on our site which is the majority.

 

[dunover]

sorry pal but this has peeved me off a bit. Im not trying to insult anyones intelligence but vice versa you accusing us of greed yet we didnt have any affiliation on the said 'non gam stop' page.

Its all a bit pot kettle black but 'you did worse' situation. Your website is called fastpayingcasinos. It says :

Online slots and casino player? Want fast cash-outs? You can at these fast paying casinos!
Fast paying casinos with no pending period or cash-outs in minutes to 24 hours. Get your winnings paid fast!

You have over 70+ casinos listed on the homepage. I dont even know if a handfull of them pay out in minutes or fast. Is that completelty false advertising of your whole entire site? Its such a dangerous game calling out affiliates and then going a step further to try and pressurize there partners to cut ties with them. Its border line bullying.

The deal with Conquestador was nothing to do with greed. We saw them plastered all over Google ads, we thought they had a decent looking product and good games and as a new casino that wasnt saturared amongst the streaming community we got in touch and started working with them. Completely unknowing that they were not on gamstop. I have actually refunded some players losses who were on gamstop and gambled on this casino.

I dont mind debate but wrongful accusations and inaccurate comments and statement are very dangerous and cause more issues because people jump on the back of them and everything spirals.

Yes, and my site states the criteria for the bolded text:

"The casinos on here offer varying reversal times. On some you cannot reverse, on others a few hours or even minutes only. I consider fast-paying to be instant to 24 hours. I do have a section of casinos which pay in 24-48 hours and that is the absolute limit of my tolerance as a player, 2 working days isn’t great but not uncommon. If it’s in excess of 48 as standard then the casino won’t be on here. These figures are assuming you have already KYC’d (submitted and had documents approved if required to do so). If it’s your first withdrawal or the amount is over around 1800 they may ask regardless."

In other words when KYC'd, how I personally define 'fast paying' and in the context of large amounts of casinos offering Playtech with standard 96-hours pending, or Cassava sites with 72 hours - which you'll see therefore aren't promoted! The majority DO process in minutes to 24 hours and some 24-48 which is stated but as I said that assumes KYC and aimed at UK market where slow withdrawals are being discouraged by the UKGC anyway, and if reversals are banned to UK players I'll have the problem of thinking up a new USP lol....

I don't see any mention of non-Gamstop sites, using non-Gamstop as an enticement nor rogue casinos by the way!

If you consider arguing the toss about my definition of fast-paying as 'you did worse' than targeting problem gamblers, you are in the wrong industry. It shows you're clutching at straws.

It's good if what you say is kosher and you're putting it right to affected players at that casino who were on Gamstop but doesn't that in itself exemplify the whole issue here? The fact you had this copy in Google SEO, even for a relatively brief period, is now proven to have enticed problem gamblers to play again through YOUR site and set back their recovery which may have been succeeding for who knows how many months or years before being suckered in? The buck stops with you mate.

Getting affiliate accounts terminated is quite a mild outcome considering many now have terms stating that serious breaches COULD result in legal action and fines for the affiliate up to 50k. And whomever is really responsible, you or an anonymous 'SEO man' it doesn't get more serious than what's gone on here.

For the record, I don't believe for one moment you are of the same magnitude of vileness as those affiliate sites that have not only aimed SEO at PG's, but then proceeded to direct them to shithole 1668/JAZ casino sites to boot. I also appreciate you entering this shitstorm to reply to the flak, as I doubt others will.

 

[dunover]

just be careful you or the casino aren't breaching any laws - not having a go, just a little advice. The GDPR is far reaching and certainly conquestador won't be able to legally give you any customer information.

Glad you said that, I thought the same.

 

[trancemonkey]

View attachment 113041

So @FruitySlots denies knowledge of doing anything wrong and blames some nameless SEO guy? And yet this article is quite explicit in its advice for players looking to avoid GamStop...

This makes me really angry.. there are words for people like this that i will not use in a public forum.

 

[ThePOGG]

correct they wont but they may be able to communicate with are tagged players themselevs and we can communicate with the ones on our site which is the majority.

FruitySlots is correct in this respect - Conquestador could easily identify any UK players registered via their links during the impacted period and assuming that the operator is prepared to cooperate action this to ensure no vulnerable player has been harmed. That would be a very positive step forward in this regard.

However, that doesn't prevent the UKGC stepping in and sanctioning licensees over the action of their affiliate partner. Taking responsibility for the situation means not leaving your partners to take the hit for your actions.

As I've said to a couple of operators this morning - in their shoes this situation would have me losing sleep. While the operators have likely been unaware of the activity they now face undue regulatory attention and the regulator has made absolutely clear that they can and will hold licensees responsible for their advertising partner's actions.

TP

 

[Supababe]

Yes, and my site states the criteria for the bolded text:

"The casinos on here offer varying reversal times. On some you cannot reverse, on others a few hours or even minutes only. I consider fast-paying to be instant to 24 hours. I do have a section of casinos which pay in 24-48 hours and that is the absolute limit of my tolerance as a player, 2 working days isn’t great but not uncommon. If it’s in excess of 48 as standard then the casino won’t be on here. These figures are assuming you have already KYC’d (submitted and had documents approved if required to do so). If it’s your first withdrawal or the amount is over around 1800 they may ask regardless."

In other words when KYC'd, how I personally define 'fast paying' and in the context of large amounts of casinos offering Playtech with standard 96-hours pending, or Cassava sites with 72 hours - which you'll see therefore aren't promoted! The majority DO process in minutes to 24 hours and some 24-48 which is stated but as I said that assumes KYC and aimed at UK market where slow withdrawals are being discouraged by the UKGC anyway, and if reversals are banned to UK players I'll have the problem of thinking up a new USP lol....

I don't see any mention of non-Gamstop sites, using non-Gamstop as an enticement nor rogue casinos by the way!

If you consider arguing the toss about my definition of fast-paying as 'you did worse' than targeting problem gamblers, you are in the wrong industry. It shows you're clutching at straws.

It's good if what you say is kosher and you're putting it right to affected players at that casino who were on Gamstop but doesn't that in itself exemplify the whole issue here? The fact you had this copy in Google SEO, even for a relatively brief period, is now proven to have enticed problem gamblers to play again through YOUR site and set back their recovery which may have been succeeding for who knows how many months or years before being suckered in? The buck stops with you mate.

Getting affiliate accounts terminated is quite a mild outcome considering many now have terms stating that serious breaches COULD result in legal action and fines for the affiliate up to 50k. And whomever is really responsible, you or an anonymous 'SEO man' it doesn't get more serious than what's gone on here.

For the record, I don't believe for one moment you are of the same magnitude of vileness as those affiliate sites that have not only aimed SEO at PG's, but then proceeded to direct them to shithole 1668/JAZ casino sites to boot. I also appreciate you entering this shitstorm to reply to the flak, as I doubt others will.

As someone who has an affiliate site and streams/makes videos please try to avoid hasty replies where you perhaps:

1. Appear to be the judge/ jury /prosecution.
2. Appear to be bitchin’ and discrediting competition.

I’m sure neither is the case but that’s how it MAY appear to us ‘non industry’ Readers.
This thread and issue is very very important, not an opportunity to pick at another’s site.

 

[Supababe]

So @FruitySlots denies knowledge of doing anything wrong and blames some nameless SEO guy? And yet this article is quite explicit in its advice for players looking to avoid GamStop...

This makes me really angry.. there are words for people like this that i will not use in a public forum.

Did you actually read anything fruity man wrote today? Where did he not accept responsibility? Where has he not taken steps to rectify?

Try ACTUALLY zooming in and reading the article in the picture. It is talking about AFTER a Gamstop period has ended!!!! Ffs.

Why are we chasing people away with pitchforks?

 

[nutnut]

Can't help but smell a witch hunt here, affiliate trying to cut each other throats. Hence my point previously just a greedy industry with people trying to compete for crumbs.

No clue who fruityslot is but as outsider hes calmly explained himself very well given how some have made some rather bold accusations about himself.

 

[dunover]

As someone who has an affiliate site and streams/makes videos please try to avoid hasty replies where you perhaps:

1. Appear to be the judge/ jury /prosecution.
2. Appear to be bitchin’ and discrediting competition.

I’m sure neither is the case but that’s how it MAY appear to us ‘non industry’ Readers.
This thread and issue is very very important, not an opportunity to pick at another’s site.

Nope. I've never streamed, simply 'vlogged' and do not recruit players through YT. I do not see these affiliate sites promoting to problem gamblers as 'competition' at all, rather a danger to vulnerable individuals and the industry as a whole. And yes, like most I will happily judge those who target PG's and encourage their removal from the industry because if this activity prevails it will affect everyone - players, casinos, responsible affiliates and the already-tarnished reputation of late the online gambling world has. I didn't even know of this person's existence until this thread began.

As you say, the issue is hugely important for obvious reasons and if a site has been found to be breaching CAP regulations like this, pray tell us how it's feasible to discuss the topic without reference to the origins of it viz-a-viz the offending website(s) of which alas there are many more posted in this topic than just this person's??

This forum can and will name and shame rogues and that goes for affiliates as well as casinos and dishonest players.

Unless you believe a quick apology and hasty removal of offending content has brushed the whole matter under the carpet?

 

[Supababe]

Unless you believe a quick apology and hasty removal of offending content has brushed the whole matter under the carpet?

Have We evidence of this ‘offending content’ for FS? I have followed this thread since it started and don’t recall... apologies if we have this of couse.

 

[colinsunderland]

Have We evidence of this ‘offending content’ for FS? I have followed this thread since it started and don’t recall... apologies if we have this of couse.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

 

[nutnut]

Posting slot reviews and general videos related to gambling on YouTube. Many would argue is more a threat to promoting to the vulnerable than any other platform. Titles with MASSIVE WIN etc and it's never a normal player always got a website or sign up link conveniently below.

End of the day gambling is like smoking least it should be. Advertisements should be very strict and if someone takes up smoking so be it.

But gambling is rammed down our throats 24/7. Social media ads, sports sites. YouTube, text messages and emails daily even letters through the post. Half the time I'm not even a member of the casino spamming me.

This all exists because people make money off sign ups, you ban it and it solves half the problem of ramming it down your face.

 

[ThePOGG]

Have We evidence of this ‘offending content’ for FS? I have followed this thread since it started and don’t recall... apologies if we have this of couse.

WARNING - Affiliates Who Target Problem Gamblers

The actual content itself has now been removed but others have screen captures:

WARNING - Affiliates Who Target Problem Gamblers


FS is in a position that is better than the other sites involved here. There's no question about that. They haven't been working with the proper rogues that the other sites have (unlicensed and highly problematic for players). They only had a single partner that could benefit from this traffic. And it is to their credit that they are here. There is scope to view this as a mistake. But mistake or not the affiliate has to take action to actually take responsibility. That means UK players who signed-up during this campaign are refunded and their partners cannot be left to face sanction for their actions if that were to happen.

TP

 

[dunover]

Have We evidence of this ‘offending content’ for FS? I have followed this thread since it started and don’t recall... apologies if we have this of couse.

Yes, you do have proof but Colin's beat me to it. This evidence has also been hastily removed from the WayBack machine but I can attest it was indeed there.

 

[irish-ranger]

Can't help but smell a witch hunt here, affiliate trying to cut each other throats. Hence my point previously just a greedy industry with people trying to compete for crumbs.

No clue who fruityslot is but as outsider hes calmly explained himself very well given how some have made some rather bold accusations about himself.

I couldn’t agree more they are all no worse than each other as I’ve said before the online gambling industry is corrupt to the core and it is a cut throat business due to the money involved.

There’s one affiliate posting on this thread who’s site I visited on Sunday night who has a highly rated casino listed I went ahead and made a deposit.

Busted out on the deposit and bonus had some free spins checked out the terms with regards to these spins which were also tied in with no deposit spins so I hit live chat who informed me they reserve the right to cap free spins winnings to £50 yet on the affiliate site it states £100 max cash out when I informed chat of this she stuck by her guns stating it’s £50.

On top of that they have a 48 to 72 pending time before processing then can take another 5 days to hit account (maybe) as they wouldn’t accept KYC before processing.

Anyhow that’s the first and last time I will be getting steered to open an account via affiliate including CM.

 

[dunover]

Posting slot reviews and general videos related to gambling on YouTube. Many would argue is more a threat to promoting to the vulnerable than any other platform. Titles with MASSIVE WIN etc and it's never a normal player always got a website or sign up link conveniently below.

End of the day gambling is like smoking least it should be. Advertisements should be very strict and if someone takes up smoking so be it.

But gambling is rammed down our throats 24/7. Social media ads, sports sites. YouTube, text messages and emails daily even letters through the post. Half the time I'm not even a member of the casino spamming me.

This all exists because people make money off sign ups, you ban it and it solves half the problem of ramming it down your face.

If you see a video with a casino affiliate sign-up link below, report it as it will get the poster a strike, expressly not allowed any more. You can place your web url, RG urls but not directly promote gambling via links. I also agree YT is out of control, which may surprise you as I post regularly but only demo slot reviews now. And just for you, got over 1100x on Bonanza last week.