Official Energy Casino - Swedish licensing questions

Slottery

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Was almost going to register but as a principle don't want to support casinos that don't respect countries legislations and regulations. Energy as well hasn't bothered to get a Swedish license but have no issues to accept Swedish players with MGA license and makes it possible for problem gamblers registered in Spelpaus (similar than Gamstop in UK) to gamble even they have excluded themselves through national exclusion system.

Going to very same level than "Non Gamstop casinos". Technically it's a gray area and these operators are allowed to operate but still it's exactly same than you would accept UK players without UK license. Just don't wanna support operations that encourage players to unregulated market when there is license and regulation in country, these operators just are big step back to "wild wild west" where everyone does what they want without giving shite for countries regulations who try to make some rules.

Usually casinos who offer "illegal gambling" to regulated markets are called rogue operators (at least when it's coming to Curacato casinos who accept UK players), don't know why this is ok for everyone.

Many other casinos who operate in Sweden are happy to pay these higher costs (license, taxes) and try to be bit more ethical by following Sweden quite strict restrictions in deposit limits, very limited bonuses etc... as they want to respect these regulations, then there always are few who rather not follow these rules and just do what you are doing because it's possible (then you can list all normal excuses that it's players responsibility to know and follow regulations, we don't offer their currency, our site is not in that language etc...).
 

MarcoEnergy

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Was almost going to register but as a principle don't want to support casinos that don't respect countries legislations and regulations. Energy as well hasn't bothered to get a Swedish license but have no issues to accept Swedish players with MGA license and makes it possible for problem gamblers registered in Spelpaus (similar than Gamstop in UK) to gamble even they have excluded themselves through national exclusion system.

Going to very same level than "Non Gamstop casinos". Technically it's a gray area and these operators are allowed to operate but still it's exactly same than you would accept UK players without UK license. Just don't wanna support operations that encourage players to unregulated market when there is license and regulation in country, these operators just are big step back to "wild wild west" where everyone does what they want without giving shite for countries regulations who try to make some rules.

Usually casinos who offer "illegal gambling" to regulated markets are called rogue operators (at least when it's coming to Curacato casinos who accept UK players), don't know why this is ok for everyone.

Many other casinos who operate in Sweden are happy to pay these higher costs (license, taxes) and try to be bit more ethical by following Sweden quite strict restrictions in deposit limits, very limited bonuses etc... as they want to respect these regulations, then there always are few who rather not follow these rules and just do what you are doing because it's possible (then you can list all normal excuses that it's players responsibility to know and follow regulations, we don't offer their currency, our site is not in that language etc...).
Many thanks for your feedback @Slottery.

We understand your curiosity on the operation of our Casino for Swedish players and would like to clarify your statement.

Kindly note that as per our licenses, that can be found in our footer, we operate and follow the regulations required on a UKGC and MGA license. Therefore as per our T&C, which the customer agrees to during registration, we always ask that players also ensure that they are following the law of their residential country when agreeing to sign up to our casino.

That effectively means that an operator that doesn't have the Swedish gaming license can open their website to Swedish users as long as those users are not targeted in any way (e.g. no Swedish language on the website, no Swedish customer support, no SEK as a currency, no affiliate targeting directed to Swedish players, no .se domains, etc.).

As previously stated, we are licensed and regulated by the MGA and therefore continue to follow the directives applicable. It is in the customer's interest to check whether they are comfortable registering with that casino.

Should you require the tailored terms & conditions related to this subject please send me a private message and I will forward them to you accordingly.

We hope to have informed you sufficiently on the subject!

Best wishes,

Marco from Energy
 
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Slottery

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Many thanks for your feedback @Slottery.

We understand your curiosity on the operation of our Casino for Swedish players and would like to clarify your statement.

Kindly note that as per our licenses, that can be found in our footer, we operate and follow the regulations required on a UKGC and MGA license. Therefore as per our T&C, which the customer agrees to during registration, we always ask that players also ensure that they are following the law of their residential country when agreeing to sign up to our casino.

That effectively means that an operator that doesn't have the Swedish gaming license can open their website to Swedish users as long as those users are not targeted in any way (e.g. no Swedish language on the website, no Swedish customer support, no SEK as a currency, no affiliate targeting directed to Swedish players, no .se domains, etc.).

As previously stated, we are licensed and regulated by the MGA and therefore continue to follow the directives applicable. It is in the customer's interest to check whether they are comfortable registering with that casino.

Should you require the tailored terms & conditions related to this subject please send me a private message and I will forward them to you accordingly.

We hope to have informed you sufficiently on the subject!

Best wishes,

Marco from Energy

No need to explain, as said, you use this gray area and not to target Swedish players BS jargon what is exact the same as what Curacao licensed rogue casinos do, they don't target anyone anywhere where license would needed, but of course accept players everywhere like in UK. You just give people lesson how to circumvent regulations with intetion to do so for own benefit. Blaming players is really lame, that it's their responsibility etcetc... you seriously think that somebody who signed up to nationwide exclusion have that much self-discipline that they don't register with you because they read all your T&C:s.... they usually have set that exclusion for reason they can't control themselves.

It just make it worse when you trying to explain black to white. You could also just close registration and stop accepting Swedish customers or even do the same as what honest operators are doing, get a license to a regulated market if you want to operate there. Instead, you decided take this low morale way and just keep circumventing these rules with that BS jargon which you could have saved, heard so many times from similar not so high morale operators who don't mind taking customers from a regulated country without a license (even you well know that you could get one but it, of course, makes it more expensive and would have to follow SGA regulations).

Happy that most of operators do honor countries own regulations and apply licenses there and follow rules, then there always are some who just want to take deposits from regulated countries without following regulations or paying any fees for licenses and taxes (which partly are used to help problem gamblers) but instead you give the option to players who have excluded themselves nationwide to gamble again and now they don't even have to go to Curacao licensed brands as here are few rotten apples who offer the option for these problem gamblers to gamble under European license.

You just make shite to the whole industry, now when there start to be regulations in multiple countries to make gambling more clear and transparent, this kind of "only care of my own income" operators just wanna keep it "wildwildwest" like it used to be on old days. Majority of operators have stop operating in regulated countries or got license there, some only wanna cherry-pick deposits without paying licenses, taxes and other fees and then we keep wondering why gamling is so often categorized very shady intrustry.

Would really hope that respected sites like @Casinomeister would set some rules for casinos they cooperate, one very good to be not to allow this rogue behavior with same old excuses and keep doing this just because they can. This is no anything different than Curacao operator happily take UK Gamstop players. Operating in regulated marked without license and using these same tricks is really low and "We don't mean to do that but we close our eyes and let it happen because we make money" attitude can tell something about company itself.

There's of course also websites that do promote "casinos not in Spelpaus" for these problem gamblers:

1632664432147.png
Can't really have any understanding to your decision and low morale (or like you said yourself, you don't care, you don't target them by offering language or currency but you happily welcome their deposits). No need to reply, know already all of that same jargon you keep repeating, you know it quite well that you could respect these regulated countries and operate there legally like the majority of others but you chose different, very well knowing what you doing.

edit: Most of casinos who don't have German license have also now removed German players from registration and blocked their accounts, you naturally haven't because you just don't care/honor these regulations like majority of other casinos. Happy that you belong to minority with your moral level and majority even want to try to follow regultions instead of trying to circumvent them like you.
 
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Casinomeister

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Moving these posts to their own thread here.

@Slottery - comparing this behavior to the clip shot joints in Curacao is not really comparable. Those bunches of casinos with a cup-o-coacoa license that are tarketing UK players are using bent software - using their own servers and choosing who to pay and who not to pay. Energy casino is letting players make a decision - which is just fine. This is how the industry was for years - players did their due diligence, made smart decisions, and in most cases all was good except for the occassional rogue activity or two.

The industry has changed now with "every one and their brother" trying to come up with their own licensing agency and getting a peice of the pie - and all posturing themselves as doing this to protect players. That is where the load of BS comes in since no licensing jurisdiction cares about their players. If they did, each one would set up their own complaints department with skilled arbitrators and problem solvers. Please show me a licensing jurisdiction that does that. Kahnawake did, but unfortunately their primary problem solver passed away this year. :(

So in essence, I wouldn't compare how Energy casino is treating its players with a Curacao clip-shot-joint. Besides, the UKGC and MGA licenses require a number of hoops for the casino peeps to jump through - which is somewhat of a litmus test for the players, as opposed to a JAZ/1668 casino where there are apparently no checks whatsoever.
 
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danofthewibble

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Location
UK
I wonder if other casinos will start looking at it the same way for the increasingly restrictive UKGC licence. Don’t target the UK, accept registration and play in Euros.

Eventually, a dam always bursts. Just needs a small leak first.
 

Tirilej

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Thanks @Slottery for letting me know about another casino I can sign up to, where I don't need to be bothered with following the Swedish rules.

I had the same thoughts as you in the start of 2019, I even started a thread about it, but not anymore. It's the same people who get addicted now as it would have been without a license. The only difference is that some money stays in Sweden. I doubt thought that any of that money goes to help those in need.
 

Mr Wild

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Malta
Moving these posts to their own thread here.

@Slottery - comparing this behavior to the clip shot joints in Curacao is not really comparable. Those bunches of casinos with a cup-o-coacoa license that are tarketing UK players are using bent software - using their own servers and choosing who to pay and who not to pay. Energy casino is letting players make a decision - which is just fine. This is how the industry was for years - players did their due diligence, made smart decisions, and in most cases all was good except for the occassional rogue activity or two.

The industry has changed now with "every one and their brother" trying to come up with their own licensing agency and getting a peice of the pie - and all posturing themselves as doing this to protect players. That is where the load of BS comes in since no licensing jurisdiction cares about their players. If they did, each one would set up their own complaints department with skilled arbitrators and problem solvers. Please show me a licensing jurisdiction that does that. Kawnawake did, but unfortunately their primary problem solver passed away this year. :(

So in essence, I wouldn't compare how Energy casino is treating its players with a Curacao clip-shot-joint. Besides, the UKGC and MGA licenses require a number of hoops for the casino peeps to jump through - which is somewhat of a litmus test for the players, as opposed to a JAZ/1668 casino where there are apparently no checks whatsoever.
It is one thing to accept players with an MGA license, but another thing to advertise on a site that target problem gamblers.
1632834663342.png
 

Casinomeister

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It is one thing to accept players with an MGA license, but another thing to advertise on a site that target problem gamblers.
View attachment 158942
Yes, of course. And we've done a lot of things trying to combat this, but most of this falls on deaf ears. Like I mentioned, the licencing jurisdictions don't care, so the deck of cards fall into the casino's lap - they need to be proactive and adamant on keeping their affiliates in line. They also need to ensure that they are not connected with affiliates who are knowingly targeting problem gamblers. But with my expereince, if a casino is earning from these affiliates, they will turn a blind eye. I have seen this happen ad naseum.
 

Slottery

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Moving these posts to their own thread here.

@Slottery - comparing this behavior to the clip shot joints in Curacao is not really comparable. Those bunches of casinos with a cup-o-coacoa license that are tarketing UK players are using bent software - using their own servers and choosing who to pay and who not to pay. Energy casino is letting players make a decision - which is just fine. This is how the industry was for years - players did their due diligence, made smart decisions, and in most cases all was good except for the occassional rogue activity or two.

The industry has changed now with "every one and their brother" trying to come up with their own licensing agency and getting a peice of the pie - and all posturing themselves as doing this to protect players. That is where the load of BS comes in since no licensing jurisdiction cares about their players. If they did, each one would set up their own complaints department with skilled arbitrators and problem solvers. Please show me a licensing jurisdiction that does that. Kawnawake did, but unfortunately their primary problem solver passed away this year. :(

So in essence, I wouldn't compare how Energy casino is treating its players with a Curacao clip-shot-joint. Besides, the UKGC and MGA licenses require a number of hoops for the casino peeps to jump through - which is somewhat of a litmus test for the players, as opposed to a JAZ/1668 casino where there are apparently no checks whatsoever.

That just in general don't make much good for industry as long there are these ones who don't want to follow regulations set by countries, some Curacao licensed ones who do accept UK players are very legit and not use any pirate softwares etc... can't really see much difference there. As you probably know, most of casinos have chosen to operate legally in regulated markest like UK, Sweden, Germany and many others, then some just "don't target them but accept players from them" without paying any fees like legally operating ones who then at least leave some money to country to deal with problem gamblers. All respected and responsible operators follow this route, there just is no any reason (except wish to make more money without following same rules and paying same expenses than most of others) why these few rogue ones couldn't stop accepting players from regulated countries or getting license.

Why anyone then bother to apply any licenses to UK, Sweden, Germany or any other countries who are willing to try to give chance for casinos to operate there (instead of trying to keep their own gambling monopolies) if they pay fees and follow regulations, now when some of these less moral operatos don't want to follow regulations of countries, they just make shite for whole industry and make it easier to some countries to start block their internet traffic and payments instead of coming up with licenses, now they can say that it doesn't make any difference as there still are these "illegal" operators who don't care and accept players anywhere.

That's also one reason why MGA license really start to be near of Curacao ones, because of these operators who have intention to use it exactly same way than Curacao license is used it's worse.

Been working enough years for regulations and been happy to see that most of these old "wildwildwest" operations start to be gone and more and more countries regulated, these few low moral ones just make it harder for whole industry while enjoying their freeride and leave others to pay bills.

Wouldn't have to make this as own thread, just left my opinion there as comment as some members might be still interested for operators who follow regulations instead of circumventing them.

But will naturally respect your decision, your site and choice what you accept as ok and what's not.

Let this be my last post to this forum, had loads of great time and great members here but just don't wanna be part of community that support this type of operations which makes it just harder and harder for gambling ever to get bit better reputation instead of 100% shady which this is good example "We don't do that but we are happy it's happening and we even removed some language and currency".

Have a great time all! :)
 

Casinomeister

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Wouldn't have to make this as own thread, just left my opinion there as comment as some members might be still interested for operators who follow regulations instead of circumventing them.

But will naturally respect your decision, your site and choice what you accept as ok and what's not.

Let this be my last post to this forum, had loads of great time and great members here but just don't wanna be part of community that support this type of operations which makes it just harder and harder for gambling ever to get bit better reputation instead of 100% shady which this is good example "We don't do that but we are happy it's happening and we even removed some language and currency".

Have a great time all! :)
I created a new thread because the other thread was about the bonuses at Energy Casino - this is about something else entirely, and in my opinion much more interesting.

No need to bail on the community - I was explaining things as they are, not endorsing anything. There are plenty of members here that will agree with me, and plenty that don't.

The main point that I was trying to make is that licensing jurisdictions are primarily set up to tax the casinos. They have nothing to do with protecting players. The UKGC is a little bit different since they are more concerned in posturing themselves politically - thus the massive fines they dish out. Like I said in my above post, if they truly cared about their UK players, they would have organized and managed their own complaints department. They don't and probably never will since they lack the will and expertise to do so.
 
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dunover

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Well from my experience Energy are a good lot in all ways. I see the gist of this thread is them taking Swedish players without the new Sweden License. As an affiliate, when the new Swedish regulation came into force I received numerous e-mails from casino groups telling me to remove references to Sweden (i.e. flags, name etc.) from any advertising as they were not intending to get a Sweden license and would therefore stop taking Swedish registrations. While being a good casino, if what I read above is correct, I am surprised that they are still taking Sweden under the old cover of a MGA license as that is now insufficient. Have I got this right?
 

danofthewibble

Senior Member
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Jan 2, 2018
Location
UK
That's their position, yup. But their position is ultimately - they're not targeting Swedish players, they're just not rejecting them, they will just treat them as players with the rules of the MGA license.

Isn't it the case that the MGA license is really only applicable in Malta anyway? Anyone else playing under it may ultimately not have full protection, so I don't really see much issue here. And I maintain that at some point, some casino will drop their UKGC license and simply quietly accept UK players under MGA instead, playing in Euros.

It's a shame we've lost Slottery over this though. Good member, that chap.
 

danofthewibble

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Location
UK
Actually, on a related note - @MarcoEnergy - is there a reason why you've taken this stance with Sweden in particular, rather than the UK? Given you could be having UK players going all in on bonus buys, but you've chosen not to rock that boat.

Not accusing, just curious!
 

MarcoEnergy

EnergyCasino Representative
Joined
Mar 15, 2018
Good morning @danofthewibble - I believe we have explained enough based on the above statement.

Just wanted to clarify one thing: My prime purpose on this forum is to help solve your complaints, publish exclusives promotions for all of you, and attend your queries - sometimes even on weekends if the matter requires great urgency. I am not here to answer any legal queries. For that we have a dedicated team which you can contact via this email: [email protected]

I hope to have informed you sufficiently.

Marco from Energy
 
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danofthewibble

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Good morning @danofthewibble - I believe we have explained enough based on the above statement.

Just wanted to clarify one thing: My prime purpose on this forum is to help solve your complaints, publish exclusives promotions for all of you, and attend your queries - sometimes even on weekends if the matter requires great urgency. I am not here to answer any legal queries. For that we have a dedicated team which you can contact via this email: [email protected]

I hope to have informed you sufficiently.

Marco from Energy

No worries, it was just an idle curiosity than a huge concern to me. Others may choose to follow up :)
 

SpinUk

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UKGC has stronger links to the financial insitutions (and their regulators) which HQ in London - so as Energy no doubt value using the Visa etc payments systems for deposits its definately not going to be on the cards.
 
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