4 common gaming myths

[PlexRep]

1: RTG/Microgaming/Playtech etc. is rigged.

Ok… let’s get this one out of the way to start with. If you’re a long time member here you will no doubt have seen MANY ‘XXX is totally rigged!!’’ posts, and the more seasoned veterans amongst you thankfully take the rants that follow with the pinch of salt they deserve. That’s not to say there are not rogue casinos out there… of course there are… but I think people are too quick to attack the software providers.

A farm can send meat to a dozen different restaurants, but how each one cooks, serves and charges you for it can vary massively. Do you blame the farmer if your steak is undercooked or badly seasoned? In a perfect world the ‘farmer’ would make sure his product is being treated with care so his own reputation does not get affected, but when making accusations of fixing and rogue behavior let’s assign the blame where it’s due. I have personally worked for a few different organizations, with various software providers behind them, and in my opinion the provider had little if any bearing on the integrity and actions of the operator.

2: Casinos are always looking for ‘sneaky’ ways to keep your money

Again, one of the more common myths you’ll see ‘exposed’ here at Casinomeister. In another case of ‘no smoke without fire’ there are a few operators there who just love to hide a sting in the T’s and C’s (or in some cases just hide the T’s and C’s all together!) but the reputable, accredited brands want nothing more than to simplify their bonus offers and increase on them.

Sadly, we cannot. Fraudsters just love to exploit the bonuses offered, and as they get more and more cunning in the way they manipulate the system the ‘house’ must ,in turn, tighten the reins. If everyone was playing for the pleasure and fun of playing in a casino then game restrictions could be lifted… rollover requirements lowered… But while the bonus hunters and fraudsters remain out there, the rules will sadly stay as they are.

Take a look at the spam folder in your e-mail, and count up the number of fraudsters and various ‘Nigerian princes’ looking to make you rich. Now imagine that a hundred or a thousand times over and you’ll understand how careful casinos have to be when exposing themselves to potential bonus abuse. Online casinos are as attractive to fraudsters as little old ladies are to muggers on pension day.

3: The industry is on the verge of collapse

I like to call this one ‘chicken little’ syndrome. Ever since the industry began, people have feared big brother stepping in and ruining the fun for everyone. There will always be political movement in the background, and overzealous politicians trying to decide what their constituents should and should not have access to, from alcohol, to tobacco, to online gaming. Rest assured though folks, this industry is going nowhere. Operators may come and go. Politicians will rise and fall from grace, and every now and again there will be a great deal of sabre rattling.

All I would say is keep your eyes on the forums, and stay informed. Make sure you know the rules where you are and follow them carefully. Choose your method of financing carefully and stay away from the rogues and you’ll be fine. There will be the occasional storm, but don’t worry, it’s not actually the sky falling.

4: Casino’s delay your withdrawal deliberately.

There are two points I’d like to raise in response to this common accusation. Firstly, I mentioned above the political sabre rattling that affects this industry from time to time, and commonly the first place hit is the financial processor. This can cause headaches for the operators as they try to get you your funds. We don’t want your sympathy… this is our job after all.. but we would appreciate your patience and understanding.

The second point I would make would actually be in the form of a suggestion for posters. If your withdrawal is taking longer than you thought, ask yourself this important question: ‘’Is this my first withdrawal here?’’. If the answer is yes, be patient! Those initial security checks take time but once you’re cleared by the system then you should be fine. If this is not your first withdrawal, or if you still feel it’s taking too long (and no, I don’t consider a few days too long for a first withdrawal) then PM the rep and make a polite enquiry.

Casino operators are not fools. If we get you your withdrawal quickly then you are more likely to be a repeat customer. We’d rather you stayed with us as a customer than keep the few cents of interest we make from holding your cash for another week. To suggest otherwise really doesn't give us much credit.


Well that’s my two cents worth. Some of the points have been raised in the forum before, but it does not hurt to provide the alternate viewpoint from time to time. You may or may not agree with all the above, but I hope you at least found it interesting if not useful.

 

[Vegasbum]

How about some of the myths that are true...like casinos lowering the percentages that games payout.....or how free spins payout much less today than in the past.

Anyone who has been around for a few years understand things have changed. I am not saying they cheat but perhaps they just take more of the pie then they used to.

Here is an old link from 2002 when people complained about having to wager 7X the bonus on slots

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/is-bellavegas-nuts.162/

How times have changed

 

[plasticnote]

Slots games are not as fun as it used to be.
Payout is lower.
Free spins are fewer.
Have to spend a lot to get a good win.

Other than that, I agree with OP.

 

[rainmaker]

Plexrep:

This was really a good article! Without saying whether I agree or not, it was just a great post.

 

[BoyleCasino.com]

How about some of the myths that are true...like casinos lowering the percentages that games payout.....or how free spins payout much less today than in the past.

Reducing the payouts of a game already certified by a jurisdiction would be a little counter-productive. Each game costs a great deal of money to produce, test and certify so I don't believe any of the reputable software providers would even consider doing this. The best way to disprove this 'myth' is to publish expected RTP's which Wagerworks do. I've worked in the industry for a long time and have never had to reduce the payout of a specific game.

Free spins and bonuses are tied in to the RTP so their hit frequency and payback is all dependant on this.

 

[Vegasbum]

Reducing the payouts of a game already certified by a jurisdiction would be a little counter-productive. Each game costs a great deal of money to produce, test and certify so I don't believe any of the reputable software providers would even consider doing this. The best way to disprove this 'myth' is to publish expected RTP's which Wagerworks do. I've worked in the industry for a long time and have never had to reduce the payout of a specific game.

Free spins and bonuses are tied in to the RTP so their hit frequency and payback is all dependant on this.

How about RTG casinos who have 3 settings for paybacks. Do you believe any use the highest return setting?

 

[Rick Deckard]

2: Casinos are always looking for ‘sneaky’ ways to keep your money

Fraudsters just love to exploit the bonuses offered, and as they get more and more cunning in the way they manipulate the system the ‘house’ must ,in turn, tighten the reins. If everyone was playing for the pleasure and fun of playing in a casino then game restrictions could be lifted… rollover requirements lowered… But while the bonus hunters and fraudsters remain out there, the rules will sadly stay as they are.

The problem this presents as I see it is the ordinary player new to online gaming becomes the exploited one.

With bonuses designed to deter and stop fraudsters. How genuinely would the ordinary player new to online gaming have the remotest chance of winning something. It's almost as if the once exploited have become the exploiters.

There must be a better way of introducing new customers to online gaming. A think tank or a technological solution to eradicate the fraudsters. Anything would be better than the current way of doing things which IMO leaves new and old players dissapointed and skeptical.

 

[Diane]

The problem this presents as I see it is the ordinary player new to online gaming becomes the exploited one.

With bonuses designed to deter and stop fraudsters. How genuinely would the ordinary player new to online gaming have the remotest chance of winning something. It's almost as if the once exploited have become the exploiters.

There must be a better way of introducing new customers to online gaming. A think tank or a technological solution to eradicate the fraudsters. Anything would be better than the current way of doing things which IMO leaves new and old players dissapointed and skeptical.

_________________________________________________
Perhaps more links are needed to this site. CM has it all for those who are willing to take the time to read and benefit from the knowledge of others, especially in regards to the accredited casinos.

 

[De Beuker]

1: RTG/Microgaming/Playtech etc. is rigged.

Ok… let’s get this one out of the way to start with. If you’re a long time member here you will no doubt have seen MANY ‘XXX is totally rigged!!’’ posts, and the more seasoned veterans amongst you thankfully take the rants that follow with the pinch of salt they deserve. That’s not to say there are not rogue casinos out there… of course there are… but I think people are too quick to attack the software providers.

A farm can send meat to a dozen different restaurants, but how each one cooks, serves and charges you for it can vary massively. Do you blame the farmer if your steak is undercooked or badly seasoned? In a perfect world the ‘farmer’ would make sure his product is being treated with care so his own reputation does not get affected, but when making accusations of fixing and rogue behavior let’s assign the blame where it’s due. I have personally worked for a few different organizations, with various software providers behind them, and in my opinion the provider had little if any bearing on the integrity and actions of the operator.

Great post Plexrep!

The only part I highly disagree with is the quoted part above.
You more or less suggest that the softwareprovider has no responsibility to who they licence their software to.

Lets just say I'm a farmer who sells high quality meat to restaurants.
And lets say my meat is well known, a top brand, restaurants are actually advertising they sell the infamous DeBeuker Meat.

But one of those restaurants is making a mess.
Their cooks are urinating in the frying pans, they burn the meat till its all black and are thus dragging MY name through the dirt!!

I would be furious, and no matter how much they paid me, they would be out off my customerbase immediately, go get your meat somewhere else, BASTARDS!

I tink RTG and Rival should do more to protect their customers from rogue operators. These operators are dragging THEIR name through the dirt.
Why can Microgaming do this, and why can other softwareproviders not do this?

 

[ceks79]

PlexRep,

LMFAO....is this a parody post or what?? LOL!!

OMG....LOOOL!!

 

[rainmaker]

PlexRep,

LMFAO....is this a parody post or what?? LOL!!

OMG....LOOOL!!

Oh...it`s you again

 

[all4greed]

4: Casino’s delay your withdrawal deliberately.

There are two points I’d like to raise in response to this common accusation. Firstly, I mentioned above the political sabre rattling that affects this industry from time to time, and commonly the first place hit is the financial processor. This can cause headaches for the operators as they try to get you your funds. We don’t want your sympathy… this is our job after all.. but we would appreciate your patience and understanding.

I agree with most of what you wrote. Casino's DO delay withdrawals deliberately if they have no funds to pay players and make up lame excuses. Even a newb can gather that just by reading the threads. This stall tactic gets further escalated if the casino is going to close shop.

Seen that for over a decade so it's nothing new. Yes, I've been burned once or twice and it had nothing to do with processor problems...

 

[ceks79]

1: RTG/Microgaming/Playtech etc. is rigged.

First of all, all software ARE rigged but with that I dont say its unfair...the fact the software is set to a certain average payout of around 95-98% is a wat of riggage...but you gotta accept that playing, nothing is random though. And we all have seen this strange acting occoring mostly...for ex in the beginnign of a gamesession you hit many free spins features but if you play long enough everything just dies... Ill leave it there...

Take a look at the spam folder in your e-mail, and count up the number of fraudsters and various ‘Nigerian princes’ looking to make you rich

yeah, I wonder where the "Nigerian princes" have got hold of my email adress...?? Probably buying emails from the casino Ive signed up at...

4: Casino’s delay your withdrawal deliberately.

Interseting you bringing this up and defending this act...so you can go on delaying.
Sure, I take it my first withdrawal could take 24 hours... But there is absolutly no need at all to delay a withdrawal from a approved player with an ewallet more than a few minutes. For ex. a player using NETELLER there is no need to go any deeper cause it impossible to cheat the casino it deposites have been made through NETELLER or like.

And its no myth casino saves atleast 70% of any withdrawal when the player reverse the amount while waiting. You probably have coarses to all your casino emplyees that is about "How to keep money goins out from the casino". The worlds biggest online industi is probably more advanced than that!

And there is no security at all whne we come to deposits...a credit card depssit is instantly accepted and have been since I started playing online in 1998...and STILL most casino do not offer instat withdrawals even though many are these days....

Its funny...I go to live support, they are there instanty and have all the time in the world...why not put a cashier in the live support, checking my details as a new player confirming my doc and then hit the transfer button...how hard could it be in 2011??
And this delaying and player often reverse and lose...you casino use players weakness to get tonnes of many back, and dont come say player doin that have problems, it is somethign that is not part of the game and casinos should try to take the people money in the games, not outside the games! If I wanna cashout $10000 and being denyed by the cashier with only allow $3000/week it is my fault if I play away $7000 but I would have $7000 extra on my NETELLER if your rules were fair and had a much higer limit!
Dont talk crap about the processors and so on...its like I said 2011 and mnay casinos offers instant withdrawals, what is the problem with all other casino? Ill tell ya, its all about keeping player money from leaving the casino!

And how could it be so hard for you to keep the so called fraudsters and honter away? In 99% of the cases they will never get any money, why focus on them so much? Sure if they use credit cards they should be investigated but give all us with ewallets a break, threat us with respect! And approved players with old credit cards too. Its sounds you are happy you can blame all this fraudsters trying to get the free $10 with a max cashout of $100 to a fake NETELLER(?) or so so you can delay ALL other withdrawal transactions form the majority of honset players.

Casino operators are not fools

Let me say we players are not fools!! We have seen sooo many unethical promos and threatment of us players and complicated rules just to fool new players....and its still goin on...here, get $2000 signup bonus keep alla your winning* then max transfer is $100 and a min deposit of $25 needed and then 30X playthrough on that and still a max cashout or something...LOL. I can write a book about stupid casino operators...too bad there are soo many stupid, or better word is "unexperienced" players out there that fall in all this wholes in the T&C.
There are stupid unethical rules everywhere and you can clearly see the intenstions behind it....get as much money from player, suck them out, rape the new players as much as possible before they finally understand and so on.

And you you cant processing people/cashiers work weekends? Live support can, I can...everybody can like at some casinos. Thre is only one reason! To delay withdrawal...and/or maybe the casino personal is totally uninterested in running their casino with good service...they are tired..fat and lazy and dont give a damn and rather sit home and drinking beer then giving players their money whe nthey finally have won...that is why they dont work weekends!

I can write 100X more about this but Ill spare you that...give us our money and start working!

 

[ksech]

First of all, all software ARE rigged but with that I dont say its unfair...the fact the software is set to a certain average payout of around 95-98% is a wat of riggage...but you gotta accept that playing, nothing is random though. And we all have seen this strange acting occoring mostly...for ex in the beginnign of a gamesession you hit many free spins features but if you play long enough everything just dies... Ill leave it there...



yeah, I wonder where the "Nigerian princes" have got hold of my email adress...?? Probably buying emails from the casino Ive signed up at...



Interseting you bringing this up and defending this act...so you can go on delaying.
Sure, I take it my first withdrawal could take 24 hours... But there is absolutly no need at all to delay a withdrawal from a approved player with an ewallet more than a few minutes. For ex. a player using NETELLER there is no need to go any deeper cause it impossible to cheat the casino it deposites have been made through NETELLER or like.

And its no myth casino saves atleast 70% of any withdrawal when the player reverse the amount while waiting. You probably have coarses to all your casino emplyees that is about "How to keep money goins out from the casino". The worlds biggest online industi is probably more advanced than that!

And there is no security at all whne we come to deposits...a credit card depssit is instantly accepted and have been since I started playing online in 1998...and STILL most casino do not offer instat withdrawals even though many are these days....

Its funny...I go to live support, they are there instanty and have all the time in the world...why not put a cashier in the live support, checking my details as a new player confirming my doc and then hit the transfer button...how hard could it be in 2011??
And this delaying and player often reverse and lose...you casino use players weakness to get tonnes of many back, and dont come say player doin that have problems, it is somethign that is not part of the game and casinos should try to take the people money in the games, not outside the games! If I wanna cashout $10000 and being denyed by the cashier with only allow $3000/week it is my fault if I play away $7000 but I would have $7000 extra on my NETELLER if your rules were fair and had a much higer limit!
Dont talk crap about the processors and so on...its like I said 2011 and mnay casinos offers instant withdrawals, what is the problem with all other casino? Ill tell ya, its all about keeping player money from leaving the casino!

And how could it be so hard for you to keep the so called fraudsters and honter away? In 99% of the cases they will never get any money, why focus on them so much? Sure if they use credit cards they should be investigated but give all us with ewallets a break, threat us with respect! And approved players with old credit cards too. Its sounds you are happy you can blame all this fraudsters trying to get the free $10 with a max cashout of $100 to a fake NETELLER(?) or so so you can delay ALL other withdrawal transactions form the majority of honset players.


Let me say we players are not fools!! We have seen sooo many unethical promos and threatment of us players and complicated rules just to fool new players....and its still goin on...here, get $2000 signup bonus keep alla your winning* then max transfer is $100 and a min deposit of $25 needed and then 30X playthrough on that and still a max cashout or something...LOL. I can write a book about stupid casino operators...too bad there are soo many stupid, or better word is "unexperienced" players out there that fall in all this wholes in the T&C.
There are stupid unethical rules everywhere and you can clearly see the intenstions behind it....get as much money from player, suck them out, rape the new players as much as possible before they finally understand and so on.

And you you cant processing people/cashiers work weekends? Live support can, I can...everybody can like at some casinos. Thre is only one reason! To delay withdrawal...and/or maybe the casino personal is totally uninterested in running their casino with good service...they are tired..fat and lazy and dont give a damn and rather sit home and drinking beer then giving players their money whe nthey finally have won...that is why they dont work weekends!

I can write 100X more about this but Ill spare you that...give us our money and start working!

Is it me or do you just need this forum and the online casinos to take your frustrations out on? You're very derogatory and insinuating in your posts. Believe it or not, you DO have a choice. You can choose NOT to play if you feel you are being "mistreated", but then you wouldn't have anything to whine about.

@PlexRep, that was one of the most informative posts BY a rep I have read in a while, thank you for that! Hopefully, members will keep this civil and some good debates can evolve from it.

 

[max1mike]

2: Casinos are always looking for ‘sneaky’ ways to keep your money

no. nothing sneaky about it.

they just keep changing the timeframe they set as to when we are supposed to get paid.

first its of course, the mandatory 48 hours just "because" cause.

then, you'll get your money within 3-7 "working days".

then of course is the "processor problem" problem, which will no doubt add another week or so to your wait.

don't forget that the "guy who told you 3-7 days was incorrect", its actually 7-14 working days.

nope, nothing sneaky there at all, they just keep it until they are ready to send it out.

anyone EVER get an exact answer to the question "can you give me a date when i will have my money?"

 

[The Dude]

PlexRep,

LMFAO....is this a parody post or what?? LOL!!

OMG....LOOOL!!

Excuse me, but we're having a conversation here.

There are stupid unethical rules everywhere and you can clearly see the intenstions behind it....get as much money from player, suck them out, rape the new players as much as possible before they finally understand and so on...

Whatever. Seems like someone needs to quit gambling. How about a seven day suspension for being a troll?

See you next week. Bye.

 

[The Dude]

Great thread - thanks for getting it started

Just to chime in:
4: Casino’s delay your withdrawal deliberately.

I would say that this was true a number of years ago. There were scores of casinos holding back on funds hoping that the player had that "itch" and would play those funds back. But since the competition is so fierce, casinos will lose players in droves since so many casinos can either flush accounts upon request, have no holding period (Crypto), or pay within 24 hours. I think that it's the opposite now. The quicker one pays its players and affiliates, the word will get out and the business will (should) thrive.

US facing operations: I don't think players (and many affiliates for that matter) understand the complexities of serving the US player. Operators need to monitor all of their transactions 24/7. Those that do will stay on top of everything, those that let it slide will end up as no pay/slow pay casinos that you see showcased in this forum

 

[Deeplay]

PlexRep,

LMFAO....is this a parody post or what?? LOL!!

OMG....LOOOL!!

Damn you are a pain in the ass! Now run along and sit back in your corner.

 

[ksech]

If the various platforms became more strict in who/how they provide licenses, perhaps we would see less roguish operations. I'm not 100% positive that it's so much the software providers as it is the operators. The operators are the ones who make the choices of sometimes ridiculous T&Cs, weird bonuses with whacked out WR and the choice on how quickly they can/will process a withdrawal. The software providers don't make these decisions.

I think we are, or almost all, are in agreement that if one casino can payout in under 24 hrs, then why can't they all? Okay, so different withdrawal methods mean different timeframes for withdrawals, can't the casinos post in their banking that say, if you with draw using an ewallet you will have your money in X amount of hrs, if you withdraw using wire transfer you must wait X amount of days, etc. This would give the players some idea of how long they need to wait to receive their money. I don't think it an absurd assumption that it can be done, when we see testimony every day of such and such casino pays out in under 24/48 hrs to XXX method.
To me, this would show the casino WANTS to assure it's loyal players, they aren't being "dicked" around when it comes to withdrawal time.

I am awaiting the day when US players have regained their freedom of choice for which platform they want to play at (and have the choice of ALL available games). It seems it may be a pipe-dream right now the way things are going. But, it seems that more and more countries are trying to stifle their citizens when it comes to online gaming. US players aren't the only ones "suffering" from restrictions, but perhaps MORE restrictions than others. Of course, we can only go by what OUR experiences are, as no others can walk in our shoes.

I don't think we will ever see online gaming disappear, but it would be nice to see vast improvements to player recognition with all of the technology available.

 

[Deeplay]

Great thread - thanks for getting it started

Just to chime in:
4: Casino’s delay your withdrawal deliberately.

I would say that this was true a number of years ago. There were scores of casinos holding back on funds hoping that the player had that "itch" and would play those funds back. But since the competition is so fierce, casinos will lose players in droves since so many casinos can either flush accounts upon request, have no holding period (Crypto), or pay within 24 hours. I think that it's the opposite now. The quicker one pays its players and affiliates, the word will get out and the business will (should) thrive.

US facing operations: I don't think players (and many affiliates for that matter) understand the complexities of serving the US player. Operators need to monitor all of their transactions 24/7. Those that do will stay on top of everything, those that let it slide will end up as no pay/slow pay casinos that you see showcased in this forum

True or at least it should be however I know of 1 of 2 accredited MG casinos that have done a U-Turn in the past year switching from allowing players to flush to no flush, and no withdraws over weekends. Not going to name them as dont want this very good thread to become a bash. Just pointing out that not all casinos adhere to what you said above (which I as a player fully agree with) in the cases where a casinos policy of flushing shifts to a no flush rule along with dropping cashouts being processed at the weekend has to be for 1 reason only - the hope that as many players as possible will reverse.

But still they are some great outfits who do flush and who do pay 7 days a week. US facing casinos I can understand are having a hard time processing wise, but this should not really affect payout times especially for regular customers.

 

[Da_Gambla]

Definition of Myth (closest to usage context here):

• any invented story, idea, or concept
• an imaginary or fictitious thing
• an unproved or false collective belief

3 of the 4 things you have listed are NOT myths. They might be things the industry is focused on, or committed to make better, but they are far from myths.

If they were myths, this website wouldn't exist for the purpose it currently exists for.

I appreciate the spirit of your post. Things are a helluva lot better today than they were just 5 years ago. I do believe that if it wasn't for all the govt. entities trying to figure out a way to control internet gambling, things would be even further along, for the better, than they are.

The games under your control might not be rigged, but there are certainly casinos open for business as we speak who do. This is no myth.

Casinos with sneaky T&C's absolutely do exist. This is laughable if presented as a 'myth'.

The industry on verge of collapse? This is the only myth in the list. It cannot collapse for the simple reason that for any casino that closes down, there is a new one opening. The odds are better for curing cancer than seeing this industry evaporate or collapse.

There are many reasons why payments COULD be delayed. Some of the reasons are completely out of control of the casino, but this is far from a myth, otherwise the 'not recommended' list for 'slow pays' would not exist here. There are STILL casinos that intentionally delay.

If you are speaking directly for an individual casino, or your group, that's one thing. If you are speaking for the industry, then LOL no, these problems are anything but myths.

I am not a player advocate no matter what. I clearly understand that there are people who commit fraud and have really stirred the pot to the detriment of the rest of us who just want to enjoy ourselves. There are also people who are sore losers, and will trot out all the abuse allegations possible to create a punching bag out of the casino they lost money to. We get all that, but the industry still has so many unscrupulous, shady, and uncaring businesses within it, that your list will more than likely never achieve 'myth' status in our lifetime.

Money does that. Nothing personal.

- Keith

 

[Kenny Lingus]

Wow!

At the time of this posting, 8 forum members have nominated the thread-starting post for post of the fortnight, including CM himself. I gotta tell ya, if this post is worthy of nomination for anything but "overall shill of the year for online casinos", then what passes for a good post on this site has taken quite a fall from previous standards.

All that this post consists of are a bunch of statements that basically exhort the position that "casino operators are actually good guys" by claiming that some commonly held beliefs regarding online casinos are not true. The poster does not identify or qualify themselves in any way, and every statement is candy-coated and vague. No proof for any assertion is offered. So what makes this worthy of nomination?

For what it's worth, count my vote as a minus one toward the nominating process.

 

[silcnlayc]

Kenny Lingus: No proof for any assertion is offered

There are times "proof" is not a required prerequisite for belief/statements/ideas/thoughts posed as truths....unlike other times when one gets "hammered" for proof of the same prose...

.

 

[petro]

In a perfect world the ‘farmer’ would make sure his product is being treated with care...

In this world actually. What your suggesting here is illegal in most developed parts of the world. It's the equivalent to the farmer (software provider) supplying meat with foreknowledge that it will be used by the restaurants (casinos) to poison and kill its patrons. It does depend on the severity but a casino that steals money is the restaurants equivalent to poisoning its customers.

 

[Nifty29]

There are times "proof" is not a required prerequisite for belief/statements/ideas/thoughts posed as truths....unlike other times when one gets "hammered" for proof of the same prose...

.

I think that most of what was posted is widely accepted as fact anyway -i can't see anything particularly controversial. I don't agree with all of the opinions expressed, but opinions don't necessarily require proof. You can offer an opinion without proof or factual basis - you just can't expect many people to take you seriously.

What the OP is saying is not the same as saying "bonus round payouts have been reduced " or "RTP is really 60% not 95%" etc. The OP was providing the point of view from an operators perspective which is rare (hence the nominations IMO ). The examples I provided above are simply unsubstantiated complaints which can be be easily explained away with cold hard facts and other factors such as variance.

 

[StaceyLee]

QUOTE: Fraudsters just love to exploit the bonuses offered, and as they get more and more cunning in the way they manipulate the system the ‘house’ must ,in turn, tighten the reins. If everyone was playing for the pleasure and fun of playing in a casino then game restrictions could be lifted… rollover requirements lowered… But while the bonus hunters and fraudsters remain out there, the rules will sadly stay as they are.

Take a look at the spam folder in your e-mail, and count up the number of fraudsters and various ‘Nigerian princes’ looking to make you rich. Now imagine that a hundred or a thousand times over and you’ll understand how careful casinos have to be when exposing themselves to potential bonus abuse. Online casinos are as attractive to fraudsters as little old ladies are to muggers on pension day.


Excuse my ignorance on bonuses as I personally haven't used any yet. My query, though, is why should the whole community of players be penalised because of the fraudsters. Generally in society when muggers are predominant, the community engages tighter protection plans for the citizen - it does not penalise/curfew the citizen from going out and enjoying their community.

One would imagine there are more players than fraudsters, as there are more old ladies than muggers. Why can the casino's not "think tank" ways to tighten the reins for identifying, capturing and preventing fraudsters instead of adopting the attitude that "they are there", "we cannot stop them", so they win and all non-fraudsters lose?

Sure, you will never completely prevent them from entering your world, but surely you could offer your citizens better protection without making them pay for what the muggers steal.

Cheers
StaceyLee

 

[jetset]

Wow!

At the time of this posting, 8 forum members have nominated the thread-starting post for post of the fortnight, including CM himself. I gotta tell ya, if this post is worthy of nomination for anything but "overall shill of the year for online casinos", then what passes for a good post on this site has taken quite a fall from previous standards.

All that this post consists of are a bunch of statements that basically exhort the position that "casino operators are actually good guys" by claiming that some commonly held beliefs regarding online casinos are not true. The poster does not identify or qualify themselves in any way, and every statement is candy-coated and vague. No proof for any assertion is offered. So what makes this worthy of nomination?

For what it's worth, count my vote as a minus one toward the nominating process.

Whilst I do not agree with everything Plexrep says in the originating post on this thread, I do uphold his/her right to provide an alternative perspective on issues that so often arise on this forum, and I do not believe he/she should be denigrated for providing same.

Plexrep expressed his/her views in a courteous manner, and the post, whilst not revealing anything really new, has generated rational discussion and nominations.

Nothing wrong with that at all imo.

I do believe that the post tended to be biased toward the good operators, of which there are many, despite the often negative views expressed here...but there are undoubtedly also too many bad operators, and this industry is still far from being as honest and ethical as we would all like it to be.

The bottom line is that this thread reminds me again of the importance of research before playing - make sure you end up with one of those good operators in order to minimise the risk of being stuffed around!

 

[Diane]

Whilst I do not agree with everything Plexrep says in the originating post on this thread, I do uphold his/her right to provide an alternative perspective on issues that so often arise on this forum, and I do not believe he/she should be denigrated for providing same.

The bottom line is that this thread reminds me again of the importance of research before playing - make sure you end up with one of those good operators in order to minimise the risk of being stuffed around!

<snipped for brevity>


Part of the problem though, is that its not just "research". Look how many accredited casinos have fallen from grace? If research was done on Rushmore/Slots Oasis a few months back, all was fine. Now fast forward to early 2011 and even Bryan is saying not to deposit there. Things change very quickly. So you can just rely on research but need to really stay on top of things.

IMO

Diane

 

[greasemonkey]

<snipped for brevity>


Part of the problem though, is that its not just "research". Look how many accredited casinos have fallen from grace? If research was done on Rushmore/Slots Oasis a few months back, all was fine. Now fast forward to early 2011 and even Bryan is saying not to deposit there. Things change very quickly. So you can just rely on research but need to really stay on top of things.

IMO

Diane

That is absolutely correct. There isn't any fail-safe casino. There is no governing body to insure that funds get paid out correctly.

I mean if you buy something and the store that you bought it from doesnt give you the product than you have recourse. You can sue them and get your money back or your product.

In the online world, Lock, Rushmore, betfair.... they can just steal your money and all you can do is hope that someone like Bryan is nice enough to exert their pressure on the casino to make them pay. There is no court, no gaurantee of payment. Nothing. Until there is it is a bit like the wild west and you are foolish to trust an online casino until that time, no matter their reputation.

 

[The Dude]

Wow!

At the time of this posting, 8 forum members have nominated the thread-starting post for post of the fortnight, including CM himself. I gotta tell ya, if this post is worthy of nomination for anything but "overall shill of the year for online casinos", then what passes for a good post on this site has taken quite a fall from previous standards.

All that this post consists of are a bunch of statements that basically exhort the position that "casino operators are actually good guys" by claiming that some commonly held beliefs regarding online casinos are not true. The poster does not identify or qualify themselves in any way, and every statement is candy-coated and vague. No proof for any assertion is offered. So what makes this worthy of nomination?...

It's worthy of a nomination solely for its merit as a thread starter that generates a lively, informative, and provocative discussion. The nomination function is not designed to be a super-duper "I agree" button (even though some people think it is), it's function is to give members a chance to show their appreciation for good, solid, enlightening posts that benefit this forum.

Operators, like webmasters and affiliates, can show other sides of the coin that you don't normally see; players can offer the same insight to them. That's what makes for a well-rounded discussion. Many of us value the input given by operators and aff managers. It's not about "shilling"; it's about talking about gambling without getting beat up for offering your opinion. I thought that this is what this forum is all about.

/derail

Back to myth versus reality.

 

[PlexRep]

Thanks for all the nominations. Glad I managed to stir up a lively debate.

I got the ball rolling, so I'd like to address some of the points raised in the responses.

Regarding my first point, I certainly didn't mean to imply anything illegal Petro. Sticking with the restaurant analogy, if the farmer knew ahead of time that the restaurant was planning to serve bad food then of course they should never supply the meat. I was referring more to the cases where the bad behavior comes as a surprise and customers respond with: ''This meat is bad... therefore all the meat that farmer supplies is bad''. I hope that helps to clarify what I was saying. Bottom line is the providers could certainly do more to police their product once out there, but accusations of roguishness are best directed at the sites themselves, and not the software providers behind them.

Moving on, Rogue casinos are not the bogeyman. They're very real boys and girls and I never meant to imply otherwise, so sorry if it sounded at all like that. They are out there, and they WILL put stings in their T's and C's, and they WILL delay your withdrawal just in the hope you will give up and reverse it. My advice remains the same as in my first post though. Stick to accredited casinos, stay informed, have a little patience and you should be just fine.

The 'Myth' (although I take your point DaGambla and perhaps I could have selected a better word) I was referring to in point (2) was the false collective belief that ALL casinos operate in this way, like a bunch of Carnies at a state fair looking for the fastest way to separate you from your cash and ethics be damned. Simply not true IMO.

I totally agree with you Rick, in that one of the worst affected groups are new, honest players. Almost like a dolphin in a tuna net, they must be careful to navigate the T's and C's casinos are forced to implement to combat the fraudsters. This is something I and the rest of the industry would love to resolve. @ StaceyLee - identifying who are the honest players and who are the fraudsters ahead of time is a lot harder than actually spotting that dolphin in the net, but we are trying. Casinos will spend tens if not hundreds of thousands annually to combat fraud.

@ all4greed - Yes financial problems will also lead to slow/no pays, but again sticking to the accredited casinos should keep you safe. Accredited casinos may fall, but (and correct me if I'm wrong) none have ever closed their doors due to financial woes without paying their players first, have they?

@max1mike - I've seen both scenarios you describe. Yes I've seen the WD delays and certainly wont deny they happen, but by the same token I have seen many cases where a fair time frame has been both offered and met. I'm sorry if you've only experienced the former. Without looking to double check, I'm guessing you're in the states, yes?

I'm glad most of you took my post in the manner I intended it. I knew the post would attract some negative comments, but that's what makes a good debate and I never wanted people to think I was stating my opinion as fact. For those who disagree with me, I'm thick skinned enough to take the criticism and smart enough to accept the merits of opposing viewpoints, so bring it on

It was certainly not my intention to 'shill' so sorry if it came across like that Kenny. Bryan is right in that what I was hoping to achieve was a healthy debate about the points raised .. so mission accomplished.



PS: I'd like my De Beuker steak medium rare please... hold the urine

 

[dazlazz]

Nice thread.

1. Ive not worked with a casino software provider (MG,Crypto,Orbis,Chartwell, Boss, Tain) who have changed the RPTs (payout rates) as this would compromise the RNG and the reputation of the software provider - this is a player myth, that certain are games are rigged. Its simply not true.

2. Some software providers i.e. MG,Playtech and Chartwell will sell their software to pretty much anyone. Other providers like Boss Media for example, go through stict security and financial checks on the people buying their software - also making sure they are licensed by a decent regulatory authority such as Malta.

Regards,

Daz

 

[KasinoKing]

Not having a go at you Daz, as I normally agree with most of your posts, but...

1. Ive not worked with a casino software provider (MG,Crypto,Orbis,Chartwell, Boss, Tain) who have changed the RPTs (payout rates) as this would compromise the RNG...

How would changing the RTP compromise the Random Number Generator...?
Me no understand!

- also making sure they are licensed by a decent regulatory authority such as Malta.

I think many people will be laughing their ass off at that comment, and trying to work out if you meant it or were deliberately trying to make a joke...

KK

 

[The Dude]

How about myth #5 - Bonuses are obligatory.

If more players played without bonuses, they would have a better playing experience since they wouldn't be locked into a nearly impossible playthrough requirement. I would bet that many players never thought to go bonus free - like me

 

[Da_Gambla]

How about myth #5 - Bonuses are obligatory.

If more players played without bonuses, they would have a better playing experience since they wouldn't be locked into a nearly impossible playthrough requirement. I would bet that many players never thought to go bonus free - like me

After following CM for several years, I'd never deposit to take a bonus.

- Keith

 

[ksech]

I, personally, never understood why players take some of these bonuses. I was always (psychologically) scared I'd win a RJ (only in my dreams apparently ) and would lose it all because of some max cashout rule. The same goes with free chips, yes they are nice when it happens, but some of the RTG casinos have such a low cashout on them, it just doesn't seem to worthwhile.

As for my nominating this post, I thought it was a refreshing change for an OPERATOR to START a well versed thread. Go back through and see how many threads operators have started in the last 5 years. I considered the post well thought out and worded so the layman could understand without having to figure out technical wording, which so often turns off a reader.

So many "cry wolf" because more reps don't get involved, and when one finally does, people still aren't happy. What gives? And this has turned into a well rounded CONVERSATION, imo. What a nice change from the pissing and moaning that's been going on lately.

So, thank you again PlexRep!

 

[max1mike]

@max1mike - I've seen both scenarios you describe. Yes I've seen the WD delays and certainly wont deny they happen, but by the same token I have seen many cases where a fair time frame has been both offered and met.

yes, I am in the states, and i too have seen cases where a timeframe has been met.

as you say, you have seen the delays and wont deny they happen.

my question is this: why does it happen?

i've had w/d be processed in less than 5 days (including the weekend), and now, i'm still waiting for a w/d i made on december 28th.

 

[vinylweatherman]

I am still concerned at this idea of "fraud" also including mere "playing to win", rather than "playing for fun".

WHY is it considered "fraud" to play the best possible strategy with a bonus that is allowed by the rules set by the casino.

WHY is a "player syndicate" always such a big problem? In a casino, each player plays the machine, so I can't see how it makes the slightest difference whether or not these players know each other. It has been pointed out that the strategy information as to the best way to play bonuses is freely available, even in this forum. I can't see why it is such a problem when players discuss strategy in private (considered fraud by the casinos), or on internet forums (considered OK).

Take Kasino King's site - stuffed with best strategy advice on a number of different bonuses, and written with the aim to allow others to "consistently profit" from these casino bonuses. Clearly NOT a problem for the industry, yet a group of 6 friends meeting up and working out between them essentially what is on KK's site, and then going home to try it themselves, is considered a serious fraud by operators.

This serves to trivialise the matter of "fraud", and I mean REAL fraud, such as depositing money that doesn't belong to you; depositing with the intent to chage back any losses, yet keep any wins; use of a casino account to launder money, etc.. . I would also consider using someone else's details to play as "fraud", since this is identity theft, and can also be considered as the offence of "obtaining pecuniary advantage through deception" where it is done in order to have extra attempts at a "one per person" offer.

Operators always say they cannot say exactly what they mean by "fraud" because of "security concerns", yet it is clear that from some of the cases, operators ARE saying "fraud" when they mean "skilled/disciplined play".

 

[blacklabrador]

I have no problem other than ALL casinos across the board have cut their payout percentages over the last 8 months, and thats a fact jack. This board is the proof in the pudding. Yes I still have nice wins, but no where near like I use to.

 

[all4greed]

@ all4greed - Yes financial problems will also lead to slow/no pays, but again sticking to the accredited casinos should keep you safe. Accredited casinos may fall, but (and correct me if I'm wrong) none have ever closed their doors due to financial woes without paying their players first, have they?

I wouldn't even try to answer that as I don't know if there were accredited casinos here years ago that fell from grace and stiffed players. I appreciate the response though.

 

[Nifty29]

I have no problem other than ALL casinos across the board have cut their payout percentages over the last 8 months, and thats a fact jack. This board is the proof in the pudding. Yes I still have nice wins, but no where near like I use to.

Sorry Jack, that ain't a fact. It's an opinion obviously based on your own play (at only a few selected casinos if I recall ) and the complaint/rant/loser posts here. Your own results might be worse, but others are claiming theirs is better - so how do explain that?

The forum has always had it's share of 'the games have been tightened' posts for years going back to 2003 when I was lurking. If you take all those as 'proof' as you are now then the RTP would be somewhere between 10 and 15% by now. You may refer to there being more posts about it nowadays, but the membership has increased and more people are posting as a result .... I suspect the ratio is still the same though.

I know there are horrible sessions and bad streaks and there always will be,but losing constantly and 'never cashing out' is more to do with bankroll management and game selection rather than continual downward adjustment of RTP.

 

[petro]

But while the bonus hunters and fraudsters remain out there, the rules will sadly stay as they are.

Many advanage players are good people. Advantage players don't break the law. And as far as I can tell they are not doing anything wrong. I don't think it is fair that their name gets put besides "fraudsters" which is something illegal.

 

[johnsteed]

***

Vinylweatherman: I am still concerned at this idea of "fraud" also including mere "playing to win", rather than "playing for fun".

WHY is it considered "fraud" to play the best possible strategy with a bonus that is allowed by the rules set by the casino.

WHY is a "player syndicate" always such a big problem? In a casino, each player plays the machine, so I can't see how it makes the slightest difference whether or not these players know each other. It has been pointed out that the strategy information as to the best way to play bonuses is freely available, even in this forum. I can't see why it is such a problem when players discuss strategy in private (considered fraud by the casinos), or on internet forums (considered OK).

Take Kasino King's site - stuffed with best strategy advice on a number of different bonuses, and written with the aim to allow others to "consistently profit" from these casino bonuses. Clearly NOT a problem for the industry, yet a group of 6 friends meeting up and working out between them essentially what is on KK's site, and then going home to try it themselves, is considered a serious fraud by operators.

This serves to trivialise the matter of "fraud", and I mean REAL fraud, such as depositing money that doesn't belong to you; depositing with the intent to charge back any losses, yet keep any wins; use of a casino account to launder money, etc.. . I would also consider using someone else's details to play as "fraud", since this is identity theft, and can also be considered as the offense of "obtaining pecuniary advantage through deception" where it is done in order to have extra attempts at a "one per person" offer.

Operators always say they cannot say exactly what they mean by "fraud" because of "security concerns", yet it is clear that from some of the cases, operators ARE saying "fraud" when they mean "skilled/disciplined play".

This is a great post.



I was thinking about this topic a couple of days ago. I can clearly understand when a group of people are playing poker (using Skype/Messenger/etc), and working together in that arena, coming away as profit players, but in all of the years I've been coming here, I've yet to read about any solid/clearer-than-mud reason as to why it works on casinos. And if it did work (I'm not sure how it would), wouldn't that indicate that their RNG/software has some holes in it? Knowledgeable people (within the industry) will say that there's no skill when playing a game like slots, so then there can't be any advantage play if that were true.



I also never quite understood why it would matter if someone bet the max while using a bonus, because, after all, the house has the edge (over time), and that person is willing to gamble the whole lot right then and there. If they're willing to do that, why would it matter in the grand scheme of things? The casino will still come away the victor at the end of the day/month/year.

petro: Many advantage players are good people. Advantage players don't break the law. And as far as I can tell they are not doing anything wrong. I don't think it is fair that their name gets put besides "fraudsters" which is something illegal.

Agreed.


***



I have a hard time glorifying anybody within the industry, in as much as I have a hard time calling somebody a criminal (or treating them like one) just b/c they broke a T&C; that's there to be broken because the software (and those who operate it) didn't exactly do its (their) best to prevent it in the first place. The LAW within the industry doesn't exactly promote/induce confidence, so I have a very difficult time endorsing what's being said as truth/fact when it might all just be smoke and mirrors (with tidbits of truth to build a case with). I'd simply look at the way T&Cs are designed, bonuses with tons of traps, and withdrawal times that aren't 'instant', and are obviously (with most casinos) set up in a way to play off the gamblers' weakness of being impatient and needing to play more.



Here's my dollar, and thank you for giving me back .95 cents. Awesome! I bow down to you.



I guess that because I was a player, I value the opinion of a player more than I appreciate the opinion of someone who's working on the right side of variance. It's almost coming to the point now where we're siding with the casinos for having to deal with those not-so-good players who are always frustrated because they're losing. Heaven forbid. If they - the operators - have no patience, or aren't wanting to deal with that kind of heat, then they have to also realize that they're in the wrong business. The idea is presented as give-and-take, only that the player finally wakes up to the reality that it's really give-give-give-give-take-give-give-give-give-give-give-give-take-give-give-give... broke.



I'm sure that there are quality people that work within the industry, in as much as there are quality people who lose and complain about it. You can't have a truly thought-provoking discussion unless it's not being controlled/steered in a certain way. Trolling is one thing, but asking hard questions should always have a place (as long as it's done right).



***

 

[jetset]

<snipped for brevity>


Part of the problem though, is that its not just "research". Look how many accredited casinos have fallen from grace? If research was done on Rushmore/Slots Oasis a few months back, all was fine. Now fast forward to early 2011 and even Bryan is saying not to deposit there. Things change very quickly. So you can just rely on research but need to really stay on top of things.

IMO

Diane

Thanks for that post, which I think reinforces my view that research is important "...to minimise the risk of being stuffed around." Perhaps we're talking at cross-purposes here; my definition of research includes participation in informed forums such as this one, and searching out previous problems with an establishment before giving it any business.

 

[jetset]

Many advanage players are good people. Advantage players don't break the law. And as far as I can tell they are not doing anything wrong. I don't think it is fair that their name gets put besides "fraudsters" which is something illegal.

Good point - it too often appears that some operators regard successful players as fraudsters...and I too have a problem with the pejorative use of phrases like "advantage player" and "bonus hunter", neither of which are wrong provided (as VWM says earlier here) no actual fraud or deception is involved.

My perception is that on too many occasions the operator screws up on defining a particular promo as he/she attempts to pull in the punters...and when it bites him or her, points accusingly at the players who have only taken advantage of badly constructed T&Cs.

Betfair, anyone?

That's when players get the "spirit of the bonus" and similar claptrap trotted out.

Operators are responsible for devising and controlling their promos...they need to meet their obligations in terms of their own rules, not penalise players for meeting their requirements and actually winning.

 

[felicie]

QUOTE: Fraudsters just love to exploit the bonuses offered, and as they get more and more cunning in the way they manipulate the system the ‘house’ must ,in turn, tighten the reins. If everyone was playing for the pleasure and fun of playing in a casino then game restrictions could be lifted… rollover requirements lowered… But while the bonus hunters and fraudsters remain out there, the rules will sadly stay as they are.

Take a look at the spam folder in your e-mail, and count up the number of fraudsters and various ‘Nigerian princes’ looking to make you rich. Now imagine that a hundred or a thousand times over and you’ll understand how careful casinos have to be when exposing themselves to potential bonus abuse. Online casinos are as attractive to fraudsters as little old ladies are to muggers on pension day.


Excuse my ignorance on bonuses as I personally haven't used any yet. My query, though, is why should the whole community of players be penalised because of the fraudsters. Generally in society when muggers are predominant, the community engages tighter protection plans for the citizen - it does not penalise/curfew the citizen from going out and enjoying their community.

One would imagine there are more players than fraudsters, as there are more old ladies than muggers. Why can the casino's not "think tank" ways to tighten the reins for identifying, capturing and preventing fraudsters instead of adopting the attitude that "they are there", "we cannot stop them", so they win and all non-fraudsters lose?

Sure, you will never completely prevent them from entering your world, but surely you could offer your citizens better protection without making them pay for what the muggers steal.

Cheers
StaceyLee

Hi StacyLee Here in the states we are constantly all punished or penalized for the bad deeds of others in one way or another. It's one of my biggest pet peeves. LOL It starts in the schools and ends in the nursing homes.

Re: Bonus abuse Maybe the casinos should stop giving them altogether except for first deposit or new player lst time only. Then maybe a good depositing player would be afforded one now and then at the casino's discretion. just an idea. Like my favorite casino just emailed me a 100% bonus but they only do it a few times a year so I'll play it and enjoy it and i doubt there will be any problems from me or them. cheers.

 

[De Beuker]

Ha, the bonus abusers.
I'm a bonus abuser myself, didn't know until I got labelled as one.

Its a myth that the software is rigged, or not truly 100% random, right?
To me 'rigged' and 'not 100% random' are 2 different things, but lets just put them on the same level for now.
Its the casinos themselves who are feeding my suspicion that the games are not as random as they want us to believe they are, by bonusbanning or even chasing away (closing accounts of) succesful (lucky!!) players.

Nicholas Johnson recently stated in the BetPhoenix thread that it IS possible to exploit a huge, non-cashable slots only bonus and that this is the reason we (Dutch players) are banned from them because we are really good at it. (I just wish I was)

Tom from CWC once stated that he could understand players frustration about beeing bonusbanned from their, again, non-cashable slots only bonuses, because they (the banned players) were now missing out on a part of their income.

Now me only has a basic understanding of maths, but how taking a non-cashable slotsbonus with 25-35x D+B WR can lead to an all time RTP of more than 100% on a truly random game with a 5-9% house edge is beyond me.
Ofcourse casinos cannot reveal due to 'security reasons'. (You bet!)
But to me it sounds even more ridicoulous than stating that Martingale can give you an all time profit on Roulette.

Unless ofcourse, the games are in a way, to a certain point, predictable?

Or maybe I just utterly suck at maths.

 

[Diane]

Thanks for that post, which I think reinforces my view that research is important "...to minimise the risk of being stuffed around." Perhaps we're talking at cross-purposes here; my definition of research includes participation in informed forums such as this one, and searching out previous problems with an establishment before giving it any business.

No, we are not at cross purposes -- but my point was that things can go "south" in a hurry and you have to stay current, since even the accredited casinos can lose status in a hurry.

Diane

 

[dazlazz]

To KK

Hi KK,

As regards Malta authority being a joke...mmmm...do not agree. The Malta LGA has considerably tightened up the last 2 years, difficult now for companies to even get a Letter of Intent before a full license is given.

As regards the RNG, (The payout percentage, is audited on a monthly basis by one of the leading international testing and auditing firms). If you know the basis of what the RNG is, then to add a variable into the algorythm, to "influence", the outcome - this would appear on the audit, maybe not immediately, but certainly within a few months.

I know a lot of players think the RNG can be modified in the Casino interest, but Ive never seen this in over 12 years online experience at a senior level.

 

[PlexRep]

my question is this: why does it happen?

Hi Max1Mike,

I don't work for your casino of choice, so I can't say why specifically you've been waiting so long, but what I can do is tell you a story dating back a few years of another casino who had delays, and explain why it happened to them at the time. Then, at least, you may have an insight into the kind of thing that could be happening.

I did not work for the casino in question myself but I am close friends with a person who was, so am confident the facts below are accurate. I wont name the casino for obvious reasons.

cue the wavey lines of nostalgia....

The casino was having difficulties with it's primary payments processor for U.S. facing customers. Apparently they had been getting cold feet for a while, and eventually decided to stop doing business with them entirely. The casino already had a back-up processor in place, but they could not handle the volume well enough and a small backlog started to build

Just before the final contracts were signed with the new replacement processor, they also pulled out, and the casino had to move to Plan C
Meanwhile customers were still withdrawing, but the back-up processor was still going and things looked OK. A resolution seemed imminent.
Customers were asked to be patient. The backlog grew.

On to replacement processor number three.
They were unable to meet their own promises regarding transaction timeframes, but this took a while to come to light.
Meanwhile customers were still withdrawing, but the back-up processor was still going and things looked OK. A resolution seemed imminent.
Customers were asked to be patient. The backlog grew.

By the time processor number 4 was in place the backlog was dating back a few weeks, and the customers waiting the longest were understandably getting vocal on forums, which in turn prompted a flood of new requests. Accusations and rumours of the casino not having the cash (wildly untrue) began to circulate.

One question that some of you may be wondering is: ''Why was the casino not totally honest and just tell customers the full truth?''

The main reason was the fact that at almost every stage of the process management honestly believed they only had to hold on a little longer and didn't want to cause a panic. Also, payments WERE being sent throughout the process, just not fast enough. They did eventually clear the backlog, but by then the damage to their reputation had been done.

Like I said above, I have no idea the scenario currently facing your choice of casino. They may be having problems with their processor... or maybe something more ominous (I hope it's the former and your cash gets to you soon) but I hope this at least gives you some insight into of the type of thing that could be happening.