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Who else had a problem with Orc vs Elf - getting proper credit?

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by Diane, Feb 3, 2014.

    Feb 3, 2014
  1. Diane

    Diane Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Consultant - HR
    Location:
    WI
    Was playing recently and had a nice win that never got added into my balance.

    Am discussing it now with the Casino tech staff - because fortunately I had saved the screen shot.


    Thanks,
    Diane
     
  2. Feb 3, 2014
  3. maphesto

    maphesto Dormant account

    Location:
    Sweden
    Hi saw this post now when I searched for another thread:

    Do you mean that you yesterday could play with variable bets? I really wonder where you can do that, you can read this thread:

    http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/online-casinos/60273-new-real-time-gaming-slot-orc-vs-elf.html

    I noticed you read it dec 30, but there were some really intersting info after that.

    EDIT: At iNetBet the game is still missing. At what casino is this game live with the option to choose betsize?
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2014
  4. Feb 3, 2014
  5. Diane

    Diane Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Consultant - HR
    Location:
    WI
    Maphesto -
    Thank you for finding the link to the old thread. I had remembered reading it, but couldn't find it - so I appreciate your help. Right now, I am trying to work it out with the Casino Rep so I do not want to name the casino involved. Once that has been resolved I will come back and provide full disclosure as appropriate for the benefit of all.

    Thanks,
    Diane
     
    4 people like this.
  6. Feb 5, 2014
  7. cpdnd31

    cpdnd31 Ueber Meister CAG webmeister

    Occupation:
    -
    Location:
    where the taxes are the highest
    I bet I know the casino involved ROFL !!!!! Told them it still wasn't fixed- :D
     
  8. Feb 5, 2014
  9. Diane

    Diane Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Consultant - HR
    Location:
    WI
    You *may* know the name of the particular casino, maybe not. I had said that I would disclose the name publicly here once I have this resolved and I will. But while I am in active discussions with them regarding this, it is not appropriate for me to comment and name the site.

    I share good and bad here ---- but not until I have exhausted all options on my own first and given the site the time to investigate/resolve. (I have matured in my old age...........not so quick to throw darts right away and "out' the site with a post first off)

    Not sure the " ROFL " is the best way to comment when a fellow CM member is having a problem getting paid correctly --- but given your own bad experience at a particular casino with Orc I can see where perhaps you get a sense of satisfaction that you were right on your assessment of the situation.

    I like the game..............I knew it has some bugs in it, but I played anyhow and watched each spin to ensure it added correctly. This is due to your helpful post back in December about your challenge. So I thank you for sharing that experience to help caution the rest of us. I have a small deposit involved in this transaction ---- not the grocery money. But the principle of getting paid is what makes me tenacious.

    FWIW,
    Diane
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. Feb 5, 2014
  11. cpdnd31

    cpdnd31 Ueber Meister CAG webmeister

    Occupation:
    -
    Location:
    where the taxes are the highest
    I was not laughing at you I promise I would never laugh at the fact a player is not getting paid. See I tried like hell to get anyone to notice that the game was messed up. There was a big scandal because of it. I laugh because you would think after all the problems it would have been fixed by now. Actually I was told 2 times it was. That is why I laugh. Its not even a laugh it more of a HA you said it was fixed and its still messing up. I wish we can get someone to please audit this game. There are way to many problems. I hope you do get paid and if its casino I'm thinking of you probably will.

    Did not mean to offend or insult at all. it's just the whole situation with that game. if you felt insulted I am sorry.
     
  12. Feb 5, 2014
  13. cpdnd31

    cpdnd31 Ueber Meister CAG webmeister

    Occupation:
    -
    Location:
    where the taxes are the highest
  14. Feb 5, 2014
  15. Mousey

    Mousey Ueber Meister Mouse CAG

    Occupation:
    Pencil Pusher
    Location:
    Up$hitCreek
    Kind of a side note here.... If a slot is screwy it's probably an RTG problem and not just a casino problem. Of course, it will fall to the casino to see that they credit players correctly. I strongly advise players to hold off playing this slot. I haven't played in a while so I don't know if Orc has been pulled at all casinos -- as it should be (IMO).
     
  16. Feb 6, 2014
  17. Diane

    Diane Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Consultant - HR
    Location:
    WI
    The casino rep. has told me that he has referred the matter over to the RTG tech team. He reviewed the game history of my play doesn't know why he shows in "his" game history that I accumulated a won of $681 on the feature, yet the the screen shot clearly shows a win of $1,525.

    BTW, it is not Intertops.

    Diane
     
  18. Feb 6, 2014
  19. cpdnd31

    cpdnd31 Ueber Meister CAG webmeister

    Occupation:
    -
    Location:
    where the taxes are the highest
    I had same problems game log does not match what game tells you.

    from orc vs elf thread -- page 3
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2014
  20. Feb 6, 2014
  21. Finn

    Finn Senior Member MM

    Occupation:
    Engineer
    Location:
    Finland
    What was the average bet size of your session? At first, the feature paid based on the bet size of the round when the feature was launched. Because the feature was cumulative by nature, this could be exploited by the players, one forum member managed to exploit €300k this way, but obviously he was busted when the casinos and RTG took a closer look to his play log.

    http://www.casinomeister.com/forums...acredited-casino-intertops-12.html#post599498

    To prevent exploiting the cumulative nature of the feature, the feature should pay based on the average bet size of the gaming session. Don't know if they have fixed it yet. So it might be that the displaying of the feature win is still bugged, so that it showed that $1,525 based on the current bet size, but it paid based on the average session bet size $681. So if your bet size during the spin when the feature was launched was considerably higher than the session average bet, about 2.24 times higher, that $681 win could be actually be correct. Or maybe it is totally bugged still and that $681 is too small win.

    Anyway even if it just shows the feature win wrongly, and calculates it correctly, this bug should be enough reason for the casino to make the bet size invariable, like $1, or totally take the game down from their site, it just confuses customers and increases customer support work burden.
     
  22. Feb 6, 2014
  23. maphesto

    maphesto Dormant account

    Location:
    Sweden
    @Dogboy:

    Can you please explain this slot machine? :)I know you are online and you are reading this thread. :thumbsup:
     
  24. Feb 6, 2014
  25. Diane

    Diane Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Consultant - HR
    Location:
    WI
    You are correct that my bets varied considerably as I was accumulating the various stages of the journey. From what I can tell it averages out the bets made along the way and uses that average for the features and the there is a separate bonus average bet used for when the 3 fight symbols line up along the way and ORC fights ELF.

    It is similar I believe to how "Dream Run" works as you accumulate an average bet size that gets used when you are waiting for the accumulated racers to trigger the bonus race. It does create the argument for a fix bet game as we have seen adopted at several sites.

    Diane
     
  26. Feb 6, 2014
  27. cpdnd31

    cpdnd31 Ueber Meister CAG webmeister

    Occupation:
    -
    Location:
    where the taxes are the highest
    Here is my problem with this situation. For how many months is this gonna go on with this game? Now we all know Diane here, will she be tagged as a player who tried to cheat a casino so said casino does not have to pay her? This game has been broken and repaired how many times? How many times did I post email saying they said it was fixed, and me screaming to the world its not. This situation is so wrong that I can't even come up with a word for it. How many times do people have to go through this before this game gets audited. How many people have gone through this. I am so disappointed in RTG right now. I mean if they new the average bet was screwed up why did they not fix bet it or pull it? I say she gets every penny that her screen shot shows. This time it's their fault no matter what. They had the chance to fix this dam game and they didn't.

    RTG get it together enough already. Just because we are from USA does not mean the quality of games and integrity of games has to be below standard.

    Diane I do feel for you, I'm getting angry again reliving this ordeal over and over again. How many good people have to jump through hoops and wait to find out what the hell is going on.

    just sad :mad:
     
    3 people like this.
  28. Feb 6, 2014
  29. Diane

    Diane Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Consultant - HR
    Location:
    WI
    Thank you.

    I had a lengthy conversation with the VIP Manager on the phone last night following many emails back and forth. Bottom line ---He said I got paid the correct amount I had accumulated during my feature spins -----even though the screen shot was 'wrong". I told him I am really struggling with his explanation. How am I supposed to just take his comments at face value on "blind faith" versus my hard evidence of the screen shot????

    As players, there is no way we can calculate for ourselves in the midst of a game bonus round/features round how much is being accumulated accurately as a win -- we HAVE to be able to trust the software. To simply tell me the screen shot was not correct is not easy to swallow and I am not done with this yet.

    VIP Manager indicated he is going to his casino "management" for some additional consideration for me given the disappointment of his response to me from RTG technical support. On one hand while I am upset with the almost $900 shortfall between what RTG Tech + casino says I won versus the screen shot ------ I am thinking the casino is a bit of a victim here also.

    They lease/license the software from RTG they don't program it themselves, right?. If their vendor (RTG) doesn't deliver ---- the casino has a problem + a very unhappy customer. The game was screwed up at Intertops, it was screwed up at my casino, CWG pulled it from their offerings due to technical problems and so did some other sites. It is a known problem as you pointed out in that earlier thread.

    Game should have been pulled. And to be fair, I have responsibility here too, since I knew it was prone to glitches and I played anyhow. Classic case of me taking a flyer ............which I do once in awhile. But the casino has to be held accountable as well for the work of its "vendor". If I sell a TV in my store that does not work, I have to be able to go back to the manufacturer for "relief" and credit, because I have to take care of MY customers who were wronged by the faulty TV.

    Is there a way to contact RTG and discuss the problem with someone there? There is no i-Gaming Rep listed for RTG that I can see. Other than avoiding new games that get rolled out------ how do we regain confidence that the software is legit and has been fully tested/vetted before it gets rolled out and playable by customers?

    Diane
     
    2 people like this.
  30. Feb 6, 2014
  31. cpdnd31

    cpdnd31 Ueber Meister CAG webmeister

    Occupation:
    -
    Location:
    where the taxes are the highest
    I get what you are saying however the CASINO KNOWINGLY LEFT THAT GAME UP !!! They knew there were issues and still let players play. Why did they not pull it or make it a fixed bet? I get you being nice for I was as well and I give you props however after all this time they are still using the excuse of oh its rtg I would have an issue with that. the casino left it up for you to play. The casino told customers it was fixed. How are we suppose to trust other games now. This blind faith crap needs to stop. You want us to deposit and play then show us how trustworthy and honest you are. I have an issue with this big time. Sorry Diane I know this is a lot for you but my point is they knew of everything they left it up now once again a player is to suffer the consequences because of their lack of respect for the player. I call BS>>:mad:
     
    4 people like this.
  32. Feb 6, 2014
  33. zreb

    zreb Experienced Member

    Location:
    currently in US
    The fact that the slot was released to the public in its original state paints RTG in a negative light and calls into question the competence of their testing and development team. The slot is flawed in at least two ways - one, it was exploitable since it didn't use the average of the triggering bets for the feature - and two, whatever this "display" issue is. From what I recall, the "display issue" was present even before the correction of the exploit, so I don't know whether or not it's as simple as something related to the bet averaging.

    But RTG has now known for a while that the game has had several problems, and they still haven't either fixed it or taken it off the line altogether. This goes beyond just poor treatment of customers and shoddy development - it's flat out pathetic. If they can't even fix the simplest of problems with their games, there's definitely a chance that other, more subtle aspects of their games might be broken. I'm personally a bit suspicious of some aspects of the "feature guarantee" triggers, but I wouldn't want to risk time/money (or even possible winnings confiscation) to test it out.
     
    3 people like this.
  34. Feb 7, 2014
  35. LHofsdal

    LHofsdal Ueber Meister MM

    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    NY
    I really hope things work out for you Diane, I remember reading the thread a while ago, and to think this game still has not been fixed or pulled at ALL RTG casinos, really does get my panties in a bunch.

    What I am having a hard time "digesting" is the fact the casinos are asking us to take their word that the machine did payout correctly, no matter what the screenshot shows. But how the hell are we supposed to take their word, knowing this game has had issues in the past for the EXACT SAME THING? In Diane's case, it is a difference of 900 USD, that isn't chump change folks!

    Kudos to you Diane, for stating that you take some of the responsibility here, but in all honesty, If an accredited casino has that game up and running, I would have been in the frame of mind, thinking that it was fixed. When the thread was started by cpdnd, look at all the casino reps that read it. Some places pulled the slot, others did not. Why all RTG casinos did not pull it is something that still makes me wonder.

    Cpdnd is right, just because we are from the USA, doesn't mean we should be subject to below standard games, and in my opinion, they should be paying Diane exactly what her screen shot shows, because it is the casinos fault for still having that game up and running for players to play, and it clearly shows that no extensive testing was done on that game, or was it fixed.

    Just my 2 cents.
    LH
     
    4 people like this.
  36. Apr 15, 2014
  37. dreamguardian1

    dreamguardian1 Senior Member MM PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    Grad Student, Peer Counselor, Org. Ambassador/Pres
    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    Orc Vs Elf

    Hiya Diane,

    Sorry to heart your having problems with this game but your not the only one good news is the casino i play with fixed the issue i was having, ALl Star Slots. I have found myself totally addicted to this one lol Its fun its different and I hope they come out with new ones of it. I hope to have some HIGHER win screen shots too ranther than the usual wins im getting off it it, between $150 and $200. But on a plus note ive been playing with my same deposit on this game for about a month now. YAAAA

    I hope yours gets resolved soon.
     
  38. Apr 15, 2014
  39. Diane

    Diane Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Consultant - HR
    Location:
    WI
    Thanks for the note and follow up.

    I never got the "credit" it was showing..........went to RTG technical support and they showed me the history of what I had accumulated vs what the screen showed. I gave up. Site I was playing at gave me $250 credit towards future play and I wrote it off.

    Good luck to you - it IS a very fun slot, especially if you can vary your bets up and down as you go.

    Diane
     

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