VirtualCasino/Spin2Win
Here's my account of recent experiences with VirtualCasino/Spin2Win/virtualted. Sorry it's rather long, but my therapist has advised me to write it all down. I've divided it into parts, so if you don't want to wade through all the detail just scroll down to "Part 4 My issues with virtualted".
Part 1 Paying in, winning, withdrawal denied, being ignored.
At
I then received an email from Mathew confirming that the documents I had sent were in order, but he also needed a Detailed Transaction Sheet (DTS) form. I replied that according to his earlier email a DTS was only necessary for credit card users, and that as I had used NETeller it didn't apply to me, but if he sent me a DTS I'd fill it in and return it anyway.
I received no reply, so I took a screenshot of my account at Spin2Win, plus another filled in faxback form, and sent them to Mathew, saying that I hadn't received the DTS form, and that if he needed one please send it to me so I could fill it in and return it.
My next email from Spin2Win read:
" Your payout request has been denied because of one or more of the following reason(s):",
1. No DTS form
2. WR not met
3. WR for "free chip" not met
4. Amount requested is less than original deposit
5. Faxback form not received
The form was an entirely impersonal standard reply and gave me no clue as to which of the reasons applied to me, I didn't think any of them did.
I replied to accounts as follows:
I attach my correspondence with Mathew below, which shows that you have received all necessary documentation except the DTS. If you want me to sign a DTS then send me one, as I requested in my last email.
This reply was greeted with silence, so I wrote to Mathew:
Is this what you need? (attached word document). I haven't received a sheet from you to sign, so I can't return one! Didn't your first email say a DTS is only for credit cards? I use NETeller. If I need to sign anything else, please send me a copy of the document to sign.
More silence. So I wrote again:
I attach the faxback form (again). If there is anything you still need would you let me know specifically what it is? A list of 4 things it could be isn't much help, because I don't think any of them apply to me.
More silence, so I tried to withdraw again. I received the standard impersonal annoying "5 reasons" denial email again.
Part 2 Phone and Livechat
Their livechat is supposed to be 24 hours. I tried it a few times, and either nobody came on to chat with me, or the livechat window just showed a message saying "send an email to ...".
So I tried phoning the numbers on their website. They have a USA number, and International number and a UK number. The UK number didn't ring. The USA number and International number rang, but no-one picked up.
I then came to Casinomeister and found an email link to virtualted, the Spin2Win/Virtual Casino representative. I sent an email, no reply.
I phoned again and finally managed to get through, to an employee who confirmed that I had met WR and that she didnt know why my withdrawal had been denied. She said her manager wasn't there, and I couldnt talk to accounts, but I should try to withdraw again and this time it should work.
I tried to withdraw again, got the standard impersonal annoying "5 reasons" denial email.
I tried livechat again and this time someone came on, Pam. She said my emails weren't being ignored, they just hadn't answered them yet. She didn't know why my withdrawal was refused and her manager wasn't there, but he should be there in a few hours. I told her that if I didn't speak to someone who could give me some answers within the next 5 minutes I was going to pitch a bitch at casinomeister. I didn't get any answers within 5 minutes, so I closed livechat and went to casinomeister, 10 minutes later my bitch had been pitched.
Part 3 virtualted Speaks
About 5 seconds after I had pitched, my email "pinged", and there was an email from virtualted (I thought he was out of the office for the next few hours?). He said the withdrawal was denied because:
1. I had only wagered 6680, not the required 7000.
2. "We also did not receive your photo with the documents that were sent, to verify that it is a passport."
I replied:
1. I wagered 7030, his employee had confirmed that I had met the WR on the phone. Also, even if I hadn't, the WR at
2. My scanned passport didn't have a very good photo, but it was the photo on my passport so it would have to do. I had a copy of the email I sent with attachments, and an email from his employee Mathew saying that all documents were received satisfactorily.
I also told him that I had just sent a complaint about him to casinomeister and attached a copy of it, as I don't like talking about people behind their backs and thought he had a right to see it.
Ted replied as follows:
"This was a signup bonus, you did not use it as sign up bonus, you had previously signed up and used another bonus and played with that. So in actuality you are only entitled to your deposit back since you claimed a bonus that you were not entitled to. I was making the exception in your case and to allow you to still cash out on that bonus, that you did not qualify for. I see it is just better to send you your original deposit back and stick by the rules that you violated and not make an exception. I had replied to the e-mail you sent me less than 5 minutes from the time it was received, and had you checked your e-mail you would have seen I replied back to you well before you logged in to chat and spoke to Pam, and told her that you were going to post . Again, you did not wager 7030 you wagered a total of 6880 with us. 200.00 on your first deposit and 6680.00 on your second. So as I said before, when you complete your wagering go ahead and cash out."
For the record, It is not true that he replied to my email within 5 minutes. I sent my email from the casinomeister website early in the morning, his reply arrived at 22.28 at night, at least 12 hours later, curiously just after I'd threatened Pam with complaining to casinomeister. My computer is connected to the internet all day, and I actually heard the ping from outlook express when his email arrived, and 22.28 is the time on his email.
Also, this was my first payment into Spin2Win. The only other time I have made a payment to virtual casino was a 50 payment to WinIt where I claimed the signup bonus. I lost the deposit and bonus there.
Part 4 My issues with virtualted/virtualcasino
virtualted/virtualcasino is determined not to pay me my winnings, and so far these are the tricks they have tried:
1. Claiming I needed to send a DTS when I didn't.
2. Ignoring emails, not communicating why the withdrawal was denied.
3. Not answering the phone or attending 24 hour livechat. When I finally got through on the phone or livechat, both times I was told that the employee couldn't help and there wasn't a manager present who could.
4. Claiming that my passport photo was somehow a reason not to pay me, even though it had previously been confirmed that my documents were satisfactory.
5. Creating confusion about the WR, which is variously described as x15 or x20, depending where you look.
6. Claiming I hadn't met the higher WR, when I had and their employee had previously confirmed it on the phone. There is no record of wagering history available to the player at virtual casino.
7. Saying that I was not entitled to the bonus in the first place, it had only been granted out of the goodness of virtualted's heart, and now that I've complained to casinomeister he's having it back.
8. Saying it's only one bonus per group. This is not mentioned anywhere in his T&Cs, it's just another excuse invented to avoid paying me.
Part 5 virtualted's argument about one bonus per group.
At
"In the event that you have not made a deposit at this or any other Casino Rewards member casino, you may not redeem more than one sign up bonus within the Casino Rewards network, regardless of the individual casino offering the sign up bonus."
At the Spin2Win T&Cs
there is no warning about claiming bonuses at each casino in the group. The only part that could remotely be considered to apply is this:
"Only one promotion may be applied at one time to any player and promotions cannot be combined, unless otherwise stated. If a customer has a free chip or cash back due to them from a previous deposit, this bonus will be forfeited, if customer makes another deposit before using this bonus."
This looks like it's referring to the various bonuses offered at Spin2Win, there is no mention of the group, and also "at one time" means you can't claim them all together, but have to claim them one after the other.
Another difference between casinorewards and virtualcasino is that if you do claim a bonus from a second casino in the casinorewards group, you don't get it and they tell you why. If you claim a bonus from a second casino in the virtualcasino group they give it to you, hoping you'll lose it and your deposit with it. Only when you try to leave with any winnings do they suddenly inform you that it's only one bonus in the group, even though this isn't anywhere in their T&Cs. and as the last in a long line of invented excuses for not paying you.
Part 6 Returning my deposit
From virtualted's email:
" in actuality you are only entitled to your deposit back since you claimed a bonus that you were not entitled to. ... I see it is just better to send you your original deposit back and stick by the rules that you violated and not make an exception. Again, you did not wager 7030 you wagered a total of 6880 with us. 200.00 on your first deposit and 6680.00 on your second. So as I said before, when you complete your wagering go ahead and cash out."
So what he's saying is that he's taking back the bonus (it's sticky anyway) and my winnings from it, but if I want my deposit back he expects me to complete the wagering requirement on the bonus. Even though I'm not getting it or my winnings from it. This is ridiculous, he's just trying to get me to gamble again in the hope I'll lose my deposit. I've no intention of placing another bet at virtualcasino because:
1. I don't trust them
2. I shouldn't have to, I've met the 15x WR and the 20x WR already.
3. They won't pay the bonus or any winning from it so shouldn't have to meet the WR for them.
4. Even if I do and my deposit remains in tact, I'm quite sure virtualted will then find another reason not to pay me. All he's done so far is lift up various hoops and expect me to jump through them.
Part 7 the current situation
Virtualted owes me 265. This is my balance of 515 minus the sticky bonus of 250. He won't pay, but rather ignores me and then invents one false excuse after another. I've been had. Be warned, he belongs back on the Rogue List he somehow managed to crawl off a while ago. Don't trust him with your money.
Here's my account of recent experiences with VirtualCasino/Spin2Win/virtualted. Sorry it's rather long, but my therapist has advised me to write it all down. I've divided it into parts, so if you don't want to wade through all the detail just scroll down to "Part 4 My issues with virtualted".
Part 1 Paying in, winning, withdrawal denied, being ignored.
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the offer for Spin2Win casino is pay in $100, get $250 bonus. If you click on the link you go to Spin2Win, and if you then click on "promotions" you go to
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. Beneath the offer it says that the WR is 15x, although in the terms and conditions it says 20x. I paid in $100, got the bonus and wagered x20 ($7030) to avoid any misunderstandings. I finished on $515 and withdrew. I received an email about my withdrawal, and sent ID docs (scanned in passport) and their standard faxback form, filled in as requested.I then received an email from Mathew confirming that the documents I had sent were in order, but he also needed a Detailed Transaction Sheet (DTS) form. I replied that according to his earlier email a DTS was only necessary for credit card users, and that as I had used NETeller it didn't apply to me, but if he sent me a DTS I'd fill it in and return it anyway.
I received no reply, so I took a screenshot of my account at Spin2Win, plus another filled in faxback form, and sent them to Mathew, saying that I hadn't received the DTS form, and that if he needed one please send it to me so I could fill it in and return it.
My next email from Spin2Win read:
" Your payout request has been denied because of one or more of the following reason(s):",
1. No DTS form
2. WR not met
3. WR for "free chip" not met
4. Amount requested is less than original deposit
5. Faxback form not received
The form was an entirely impersonal standard reply and gave me no clue as to which of the reasons applied to me, I didn't think any of them did.
I replied to accounts as follows:
I attach my correspondence with Mathew below, which shows that you have received all necessary documentation except the DTS. If you want me to sign a DTS then send me one, as I requested in my last email.
This reply was greeted with silence, so I wrote to Mathew:
Is this what you need? (attached word document). I haven't received a sheet from you to sign, so I can't return one! Didn't your first email say a DTS is only for credit cards? I use NETeller. If I need to sign anything else, please send me a copy of the document to sign.
More silence. So I wrote again:
I attach the faxback form (again). If there is anything you still need would you let me know specifically what it is? A list of 4 things it could be isn't much help, because I don't think any of them apply to me.
More silence, so I tried to withdraw again. I received the standard impersonal annoying "5 reasons" denial email again.
Part 2 Phone and Livechat
Their livechat is supposed to be 24 hours. I tried it a few times, and either nobody came on to chat with me, or the livechat window just showed a message saying "send an email to ...".
So I tried phoning the numbers on their website. They have a USA number, and International number and a UK number. The UK number didn't ring. The USA number and International number rang, but no-one picked up.
I then came to Casinomeister and found an email link to virtualted, the Spin2Win/Virtual Casino representative. I sent an email, no reply.
I phoned again and finally managed to get through, to an employee who confirmed that I had met WR and that she didnt know why my withdrawal had been denied. She said her manager wasn't there, and I couldnt talk to accounts, but I should try to withdraw again and this time it should work.
I tried to withdraw again, got the standard impersonal annoying "5 reasons" denial email.
I tried livechat again and this time someone came on, Pam. She said my emails weren't being ignored, they just hadn't answered them yet. She didn't know why my withdrawal was refused and her manager wasn't there, but he should be there in a few hours. I told her that if I didn't speak to someone who could give me some answers within the next 5 minutes I was going to pitch a bitch at casinomeister. I didn't get any answers within 5 minutes, so I closed livechat and went to casinomeister, 10 minutes later my bitch had been pitched.
Part 3 virtualted Speaks
About 5 seconds after I had pitched, my email "pinged", and there was an email from virtualted (I thought he was out of the office for the next few hours?). He said the withdrawal was denied because:
1. I had only wagered 6680, not the required 7000.
2. "We also did not receive your photo with the documents that were sent, to verify that it is a passport."
I replied:
1. I wagered 7030, his employee had confirmed that I had met the WR on the phone. Also, even if I hadn't, the WR at
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below the offer says 15x = 5250, which I had easily met.2. My scanned passport didn't have a very good photo, but it was the photo on my passport so it would have to do. I had a copy of the email I sent with attachments, and an email from his employee Mathew saying that all documents were received satisfactorily.
I also told him that I had just sent a complaint about him to casinomeister and attached a copy of it, as I don't like talking about people behind their backs and thought he had a right to see it.
Ted replied as follows:
"This was a signup bonus, you did not use it as sign up bonus, you had previously signed up and used another bonus and played with that. So in actuality you are only entitled to your deposit back since you claimed a bonus that you were not entitled to. I was making the exception in your case and to allow you to still cash out on that bonus, that you did not qualify for. I see it is just better to send you your original deposit back and stick by the rules that you violated and not make an exception. I had replied to the e-mail you sent me less than 5 minutes from the time it was received, and had you checked your e-mail you would have seen I replied back to you well before you logged in to chat and spoke to Pam, and told her that you were going to post . Again, you did not wager 7030 you wagered a total of 6880 with us. 200.00 on your first deposit and 6680.00 on your second. So as I said before, when you complete your wagering go ahead and cash out."
For the record, It is not true that he replied to my email within 5 minutes. I sent my email from the casinomeister website early in the morning, his reply arrived at 22.28 at night, at least 12 hours later, curiously just after I'd threatened Pam with complaining to casinomeister. My computer is connected to the internet all day, and I actually heard the ping from outlook express when his email arrived, and 22.28 is the time on his email.
Also, this was my first payment into Spin2Win. The only other time I have made a payment to virtual casino was a 50 payment to WinIt where I claimed the signup bonus. I lost the deposit and bonus there.
Part 4 My issues with virtualted/virtualcasino
virtualted/virtualcasino is determined not to pay me my winnings, and so far these are the tricks they have tried:
1. Claiming I needed to send a DTS when I didn't.
2. Ignoring emails, not communicating why the withdrawal was denied.
3. Not answering the phone or attending 24 hour livechat. When I finally got through on the phone or livechat, both times I was told that the employee couldn't help and there wasn't a manager present who could.
4. Claiming that my passport photo was somehow a reason not to pay me, even though it had previously been confirmed that my documents were satisfactory.
5. Creating confusion about the WR, which is variously described as x15 or x20, depending where you look.
6. Claiming I hadn't met the higher WR, when I had and their employee had previously confirmed it on the phone. There is no record of wagering history available to the player at virtual casino.
7. Saying that I was not entitled to the bonus in the first place, it had only been granted out of the goodness of virtualted's heart, and now that I've complained to casinomeister he's having it back.
8. Saying it's only one bonus per group. This is not mentioned anywhere in his T&Cs, it's just another excuse invented to avoid paying me.
Part 5 virtualted's argument about one bonus per group.
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all group casinos are listed with bonuses advertised. When I see such a page I assume I can get each bonus at each casino. This is the case with other casino groups such as Trident Lounge, Vegas Partner Lounge, Belle Rock, Golden Palace group etc. etc. It is the norm. If a group does only allow one bonus per group, eg casino reward, it is clearly stated in the t&cs of each casino, eg this from Blackjack Ballroom:"In the event that you have not made a deposit at this or any other Casino Rewards member casino, you may not redeem more than one sign up bonus within the Casino Rewards network, regardless of the individual casino offering the sign up bonus."
At the Spin2Win T&Cs
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there is no warning about claiming bonuses at each casino in the group. The only part that could remotely be considered to apply is this:
"Only one promotion may be applied at one time to any player and promotions cannot be combined, unless otherwise stated. If a customer has a free chip or cash back due to them from a previous deposit, this bonus will be forfeited, if customer makes another deposit before using this bonus."
This looks like it's referring to the various bonuses offered at Spin2Win, there is no mention of the group, and also "at one time" means you can't claim them all together, but have to claim them one after the other.
Another difference between casinorewards and virtualcasino is that if you do claim a bonus from a second casino in the casinorewards group, you don't get it and they tell you why. If you claim a bonus from a second casino in the virtualcasino group they give it to you, hoping you'll lose it and your deposit with it. Only when you try to leave with any winnings do they suddenly inform you that it's only one bonus in the group, even though this isn't anywhere in their T&Cs. and as the last in a long line of invented excuses for not paying you.
Part 6 Returning my deposit
From virtualted's email:
" in actuality you are only entitled to your deposit back since you claimed a bonus that you were not entitled to. ... I see it is just better to send you your original deposit back and stick by the rules that you violated and not make an exception. Again, you did not wager 7030 you wagered a total of 6880 with us. 200.00 on your first deposit and 6680.00 on your second. So as I said before, when you complete your wagering go ahead and cash out."
So what he's saying is that he's taking back the bonus (it's sticky anyway) and my winnings from it, but if I want my deposit back he expects me to complete the wagering requirement on the bonus. Even though I'm not getting it or my winnings from it. This is ridiculous, he's just trying to get me to gamble again in the hope I'll lose my deposit. I've no intention of placing another bet at virtualcasino because:
1. I don't trust them
2. I shouldn't have to, I've met the 15x WR and the 20x WR already.
3. They won't pay the bonus or any winning from it so shouldn't have to meet the WR for them.
4. Even if I do and my deposit remains in tact, I'm quite sure virtualted will then find another reason not to pay me. All he's done so far is lift up various hoops and expect me to jump through them.
Part 7 the current situation
Virtualted owes me 265. This is my balance of 515 minus the sticky bonus of 250. He won't pay, but rather ignores me and then invents one false excuse after another. I've been had. Be warned, he belongs back on the Rogue List he somehow managed to crawl off a while ago. Don't trust him with your money.
) at one of these casinos.
I thought at least he probably did have a water tight (if unethical) case for denying winnings as somewhere hidden in the T&Cs it would say you could only play at one Virtual Casino. Having checked again now it seems it isn't stated clearly anywhere. As you say, the website actively encourages playing at more than one of the casinos.
) and he was last here in the forum on Friday before this thread was initiated. I'm sure he'll join the party sometime soon.
