Videoslots source of wealth income etc etc etc

[deepsky2]

I do not think VS cares about us for the reason of them doing what they're doing. Yes maybe Dan and a few employees may be concern for some of us in the way we play, but VS as a whole in a business perspective sure don't. This is sure cutting into there profits. this is making them look good for the UKGC or they would of enforced this long time ago.

I find what they want us to submit is outrages even though it hasn,t affect me as yet but if it does I will take the majority of deposits elsewhere. I won't close my account as if more and more casinos do the same I want to keep my options open maybe go back to land base casinos!

And lets face it we love VS because of Dan, he has made VS what it is on this forum ,and I'm sure he has nothing to do with the changes and I'm sure he wouldn't want to ever submit his personal information in what VS is asking us to do but I'm positive he's trying to make this as smooth as possible for there players, but in saying that Its not right in what they're asking for and think is disgusting in all ways. I hope it all gets sorted out as I love VS.

 

[Mr Wild]

But what you posted was not what was in the guidelines, you edited it to say something different.

Are you still requesting information under AML's then using them for RG?

If its mention in the guidelines as "recommendation" or "you can do". For UKGC that mean should do. If you dont do it, you get in to troubles.

In reality, it dont matter what you, me or Videoslots thinks. It only matters what UKGC thinks in this case. So take the fight to them instead if you want a change. By time, this will be standard on every betting site with a UKGC licence. Lets revert to my post in a year and we will see what will happen, time will tell.

Regarding your other question, Daniel already answered it ( https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...-income-etc-etc-etc.82886/page-14#post-889083 ). Proof of Wealth is checked only when things dont add up. What Im aware of, very few customers have received a follow up around this.

 

[chris87]

Stop taking this fight against Videoslots. Send your complaints to UKGC instead!

Yes, VS can't influence the guidelines, but they can influence the interpretation, the consequent communication to their customers and how they apply the guidelines, all of which IMO hasn't been handled very well for a company of VS's reputation.
I said as much to a gentleman who rang me from VS to ask if I was going to send in my Proof of Wealth documents. He couldn't tell me why "things didn't add up" or indeed what specific documents from the huge list I was supposed to send in. He didn't disagree that things could have been handled better and said he would send in my feedback. He also couldn't tell me what protocols would be put in place to safeguard my documents being secure if I did agree to send them in, as of course there can be no 100% guarantee that they wouldn't fall into the wrong hands. He closed the call by saying that he'd call me in a month to see if I'd changed my mind about providing the docs!

Chris

 

[colinsunderland]

If its mention in the guidelines as "recommendation" or "you can do". For UKGC that mean should do. If you dont do it, you get in to troubles.

In reality, it dont matter what you, me or Videoslots thinks. It only matters what UKGC thinks in this case. So take the fight to them instead if you want a change. By time, this will be standard on every betting site with a UKGC licence. Lets revert to my post in a year and we will see what will happen, time will tell.

Regarding your other question, Daniel already answered it ( https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...-income-etc-etc-etc.82886/page-14#post-889083 ). Proof of Wealth is checked only when things dont add up. What Im aware of, very few customers have received a follow up around this.

Well the UKGC clearly state if you request information under AML's you MUST NOT use them for any other purpose, yet Videoslots took the decision to use them for RG purposes. Can you show me in the guidelines where it states you can do that?

 

[Mr Wild]

Well the UKGC clearly state if you request information under AML's you MUST NOT use them for any other purpose, yet Videoslots took the decision to use them for RG purposes. Can you show me in the guidelines where it states you can do that?

Proof of wealth is an AML check. That is done when things dont add up, which is a requirement to do. But Daniel already explained that here https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...-income-etc-etc-etc.82886/page-14#post-889083 .

 

[colinsunderland]

Proof of wealth is an AML check. That is done when things dont add up, which is a requirement to do. But Daniel already explained that here https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...-income-etc-etc-etc.82886/page-14#post-889083 .

It was also clearly stated the documents you were requesting under the AML's were being used for responsible gaming checks, even though you didn't mention that anywhere (probably as you aren't allowed to do it).

https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...h-income-etc-etc-etc.82886/page-2#post-888113

https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...h-income-etc-etc-etc.82886/page-8#post-888773

 

[ternur]

3.6. You need to look at household income
3.7. Recommendation to put compulsory limits.
3.11 Its recommended to carry out AML/RG checks on VIP customers.

Actually not. While the guidance may refer to statistics being helpful when making an estimate regarding the player's income level, it does not allow the casino to ask information from or about people who are not customers of the casino.

 

[geordiecolin]

Look on the positive side because Videoslots have just implemented a change that everyone will be cock a hoop over. They have got rid of that blasted woman who very kindly informs you that you have blown your last deposit upon sign in

 

[Mr Wild]

It was also clearly stated the documents you were requesting under the AML's were being used for responsible gaming checks, even though you didn't mention that anywhere (probably as you aren't allowed to do it).

https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...h-income-etc-etc-etc.82886/page-2#post-888113

https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...h-income-etc-etc-etc.82886/page-8#post-888773

I think they are acting accordingly with the guidelines and I believe more casinos will do the same soon.
AML check should be done as soon as there are suspicious activity.

 

[colinsunderland]

I think they are acting accordingly with the guidelines and I believe more casinos will do the same soon.
AML check should be done as soon as there are suspicious activity.

The guidelines are extremely clear, if you request documents for AML checks, that is the ONLY purpose for which those documents can be used.
I think it's clear from this thread that you blanket checked customers, not when there was suspicious activity.

Dan, I got your PM, just trying to work out times

 

[interlog]

Here is one for Dan.

How about a "quid pro quo" in the name of responsible gambling,

How about getting rid of the "cancel" link when you have the notification at the top of the screen that you have a pending withdrawal?

Or even better, have a lock withdrawal function?

 

[Nate]

Here is one for Dan.

How about a "quid pro quo" in the name of responsible gambling,

How about getting rid of the "cancel" link when you have the notification at the top of the screen that you have a pending withdrawal?

Or even better, have a lock withdrawal function?

To be fair, they process faster than any other casino out there - BUT you have a very valid point - It stares you in the face.

Nate

 

[Dan.Videoslots]

Hi interlog,

Thank you for your feedback and will definitely consider this and bring it up. Regarding the pop up with the girl on login that asks you to deposit , we chose to remove it.

Br,
Daniel.

 

[Alsetly]

Just a bit of food for thought, what If things went pear shaped and this info fell into hands it shouldnt and fraud committed as a result.
How much help and sympathy would the victim get from the police, banks,spouse etc when they find out that the player submitted this info to
a casino of all places.

Its just so wrong IMHO.

I agree. If all these details did get to someone they shouldn't you'd struggle to shut it all down! probably take months and create repeat fraud stealing your dollars man!

 

[vinylweatherman]

If this is REALLY driven by the UKGC, and it is expected that every casino will be doing just the same, the UKGC and UK government just shot themselves in both feet. Whilst CM members might debate the issues, the other 95% who suddenly receive a request to send in such exotic documents as the last will and testament of their parents along with probate value, an official letter detailing the last house sale they made, etc are going to run a mile from this entire industry. Since it seems this is a "blanket request" at VS, rather than being targetted at a small number of customers who play outside the learned norm for the majority, VS are likely to be the first to lose customers.

However, there IS a bigger picture, I was playing the fruities at the services last week, and for the FIRST TIME a member of staff came up to me and told me that as I had been there for an hour he was required to prompt me to consider whether or not I was "gambling away my life savings". He told me it was his job to do it, even though he clearly felt a bit silly. This has to be something new that has come from the UKGC regarding land based gambling, as previously "their job" has simply been to enter and check the gaming area every 15 to 30 minutes to ensure that no underage persons were present, and record the visit by using a card swipe machine on the wall.

 

[Jd666]

If this is REALLY driven by the UKGC, and it is expected that every casino will be doing just the same, the UKGC and UK government just shot themselves in both feet. Whilst CM members might debate the issues, the other 95% who suddenly receive a request to send in such exotic documents as the last will and testament of their parents along with probate value, an official letter detailing the last house sale they made, etc are going to run a mile from this entire industry. Since it seems this is a "blanket request" at VS, rather than being targetted at a small number of customers who play outside the learned norm for the majority, VS are likely to be the first to lose customers.

However, there IS a bigger picture, I was playing the fruities at the services last week, and for the FIRST TIME a member of staff came up to me and told me that as I had been there for an hour he was required to prompt me to consider whether or not I was "gambling away my life savings". He told me it was his job to do it, even though he clearly felt a bit silly. This has to be something new that has come from the UKGC regarding land based gambling, as previously "their job" has simply been to enter and check the gaming area every 15 to 30 minutes to ensure that no underage persons were present, and record the visit by using a card swipe machine on the wall.

Really, Im visiting AGC's tomorrow.
Will be interesting to see if this starts happening.
Then what next..... 6 year old changing a quid up for 2p's at the coast to play the pushers getting questioned where they got their money from

 

[vinylweatherman]

Really, Im visiting AGC's tomorrow.
Will be interesting to see if this starts happening.
Then what next..... 6 year old changing a quid up for 2p's at the coast to play the pushers getting questioned where they got their money from

We never know what's next, a SoW request in arcades can't be far off.

Another thing I have noticed is that the Motorway services have the PERFECT money laundering setup. You can feed dirty money into one of the £500 JP slots, they spit out a redemption ticket, which you then take to a different machine to get it converted back into cash. They DO have a sign that says the transactions are monitored for suspicious transactions, but how WELL is this done given that this is a service station, not a dedicated casino, and most visitors come and go by car, and so could move throughout the entire network.

I have used this method to cash up AWP £100 jackpots. I put the coins into a £500 machine, collect the ticket, and get back notes. This is far better than having holes in pockets due to all the £1 coins. However, not once has a member of staff asked me what I am doing.

A very small number of AWPs will actually " pay winnings back to the deposit method", as instead of paying coins, they give back the notes I originally fed into it. This is a pretty good anti ML measure, so why so few AWPs with it implemented?

 

[deepsky2]

This, however, can be really bad for a plaer if they win big. Astall practice by a casino. Imagine making a deposit and have a good run and win a huge amount and on withdrawal that's when they ask for all these documents. How is a player protected from a casino using this to stall or void a winning?

Casinos should be forced to do this when a deposit is made or before, not let a player play for hrs, make multiple deposits to get burned in the end. If a deposit is accepted in good faith by a casino a casino should pay the player in same respect if they are lucky to get a withdrawal.

I'm sure this practice wouldn't be used by VS but how are we guaranteed that? as I'm 100% sure other casinos will use this to stall a payout hoping a player reverses.

 

[DreamRJ]

This, however, can be really bad for a plaer if they win big. Astall practice by a casino. Imagine making a deposit and have a good run and win a huge amount and on withdrawal that's when they ask for all these documents. How is a player protected from a casino using this to stall or void a winning?

Casinos should be forced to do this when a deposit is made or before, not let a player play for hrs, make multiple deposits to get burned in the end. If a deposit is accepted in good faith by a casino a casino should pay the player in same respect if they are lucky to get a withdrawal.

I'm sure this practice wouldn't be used by VS but how are we guaranteed that? as I'm 100% sure other casinos will use this to stall a payout hoping a player reverses.

Won't happen at VS. VS never stall winnings and even if a new player did run into this issue. If they just come on CM and PM Dan, He will sort it out for ya and process the withdraw and then just get you to do the SoW afterwards.

This is why you should always verify your new account before you deposit and play. That is what I do always now. So that way there is no delays when you do win and withdraw at any casino you play at!

SoW will be used in some rogue casinos. To stall and delay payments because they will always find new ways to do that! And not just rogue casinos. But casinos that just want to hold onto our money for longer even if those casinos have a UKGC license. But on a whole, most casinos will not use SoW to delay a withdraw!

 

[Gaz237]

This, however, can be really bad for a plaer if they win big. Astall practice by a casino. Imagine making a deposit and have a good run and win a huge amount and on withdrawal that's when they ask for all these documents. How is a player protected from a casino using this to stall or void a winning?

Casinos should be forced to do this when a deposit is made or before, not let a player play for hrs, make multiple deposits to get burned in the end. If a deposit is accepted in good faith by a casino a casino should pay the player in same respect if they are lucky to get a withdrawal.

I'm sure this practice wouldn't be used by VS but how are we guaranteed that? as I'm 100% sure other casinos will use this to stall a payout hoping a player reverses.

It's all about the timing. plenty of people are now finding they can't deposit until they have passed checks. me included. Was sorted out in a couple of hours.

 

[TheAddict]

"However, there IS a bigger picture, I was playing the fruities at the services last week, and for the FIRST TIME a member of staff came up to me and told me that as I had been there for an hour he was required to prompt me to consider whether or not I was "gambling away my life savings". He told me it was his job to do it, even though he clearly felt a bit silly. This has to be something new that has come from the UKGC regarding land based gambling, as previously "their job" has simply been to enter and check the gaming area every 15 to 30 minutes to ensure that no underage persons were present, and record the visit by using a card swipe machine on the wall."

Shit man, 15-30 mins is a short window to allow the time for both plug & noise lol.
More serious note, at least he has been given somewhat more active roles though

Edit. Edited an accidental double qoute and made it even worse. Only with a bloody tablet.

 

[deepsky2]

Won't happen at VS. VS never stall winnings and even if a new player did run into this issue. If they just come on CM and PM Dan, He will sort it out for ya and process the withdraw and then just get you to do the SoW afterwards.

This is why you should always verify your new account before you deposit and play. That is what I do always now. So that way there is no delays when you do win and withdraw at any casino you play at!

SoW will be used in some rogue casinos. To stall and delay payments because they will always find new ways to do that! And not just rogue casinos. But casinos that just want to hold onto our money for longer even if those casinos have a UKGC license. But on a whole, most casinos will not use SoW to delay a withdraw!

Yes your right won't happen at VS they have truly been great for me just made 3 cash outs in last few days and had winnings in minutes, but in whole, it could give the industry a bad wrap if other casinos do and there should be something in place to prevent this, but I agree to stick to accredit casinos like VS is the best route to go but saying that its not to say other accredit casinos haven't used stall practices prob not many but there's no guarantee they wouldn't.

 

[DreamRJ]

Yes your right won't happen at VS they have truly been great for me just made 3 cash outs in last few days and had winnings in minutes, but in whole, it could give the industry a bad wrap if other casinos do and there should be something in place to prevent this, but I agree to stick to accredit casinos like VS is the best route to go but saying that its not to say other accredit casinos haven't used stall practices prob not many but there's no guarantee they wouldn't.

Yep. there might be a select few that might as I said use SoW to stall delay. But even if you have doubts then the best approach would be to not deposit and play at those casinos you have doubts with! So be it if they are accredited or not!

 

[amourgirl]

Wel appears it's not just the gambling industry who are having to deal with this new legislation.

My hubby is a finance director in Higher Education.
They are currently putting directives in place to obtain source of wealth information for all of their fee paying students.
When I told him about the request I got he said that was pretty much the type of questions they will have to be asking their students. but did say that they are being careful not to be a jobsworth with this. He feels that the criminals who I would be trying to launder money through the system would easily be able to obtain any paperwork and proof requested, the only ones who would suffer from over-zealousness would be the students with genuine income backgrounds that may hard to prove.

 

[vinylweatherman]

"However, there IS a bigger picture, I was playing the fruities at the services last week, and for the FIRST TIME a member of staff came up to me and told me that as I had been there for an hour he was required to prompt me to consider whether or not I was "gambling away my life savings". He told me it was his job to do it, even though he clearly felt a bit silly. This has to be something new that has come from the UKGC regarding land based gambling, as previously "their job" has simply been to enter and check the gaming area every 15 to 30 minutes to ensure that no underage persons were present, and record the visit by using a card swipe machine on the wall."

Shit man, 15-30 mins is a short window to allow the time for both plug & noise lol.
More serious note, at least he has been given somewhat more active roles though

Edit. Edited an accidental double qoute and made it even worse. Only with a bloody tablet.

Plug & noise will get you noticed. I would also be surprised if something so basic a flaw still worked on the modern AWP.

I did manage to find a "noiseless" way to do the Pie Factory trick, take £1 rather than simply let the feature time out for nothing. It was an extra £1 from the run, and it didn't cause the reset that taking nothing did.

 

[TheAddict]

Plug & noise will get you noticed. I would also be surprised if something so basic a flaw still worked on the modern AWP.

I did manage to find a "noiseless" way to do the Pie Factory trick, take £1 rather than simply let the feature time out for nothing. It was an extra £1 from the run, and it didn't cause the reset that taking nothing did.

Jus jokin about m8. Dont bother with servos personally. Last few i visited you could hear a loud noise for ages from 200mtrs away, and 2 guys happened to be standing around playin off 25p on a RR slowly lol... just sprung to mind is all

 

[Jasminebed]

Does the UK require accounts be locked pending receipt of these documents? I know VS took this approach, but I'm unsure if it's legislated. If an account must be locked, then a player would not be able to spend the win, and would lose value as a stalling technique.

If you need to provide documents like wills, deeds, income statements from a business, it may not be immediately available. Maybe your sister in New Zealand has the paperwork from your parents' estates.

I read the guidelines. Found it interesting that the use of RG measures by the player, especially to avoid playing back a win, are a sign a player may have an RG issue. If you have no gambling issues at all, you don't need to use the RG measures I suppose.

While I do realize they want casinos to have contact with their players, no where does it say the casino should decide what your limits should be.

 

[slot_zombie]

If this is introduced at all UKGC casinos, then the minority who play outside of their means will just spread their spending around different casinos - if they end up deposit limited.

 

[dionysus]

If this is introduced at all UKGC casinos, then the minority who play outside of their means will just spread their spending around different casinos - if they end up deposit limited.

true
if X casino says I can't afford 500 I'd just deppo 100 at V,W,X,Y and Z casino

 

[DreamRJ]

true
if X casino says I can't afford 500 I'd just deppo 100 at V,W,X,Y and Z casino

Until they introduce a system that is global. Similar to the new gamstop system set to be introduced this year in the UK. Where a global server stores that data for all casinos to use and abide by. So it wont make any difference then which casinos you deposit and play at.

What would then be the case would be you would then deposit and play in casinos that do not have a UKGC license and are not accredited! Which I do not recommend at all. But sometimes gamblers get desperate. I for sure am not desperate!

 

[dionysus]

Until they introduce a system that is global. Similar to the new gamstop system set to be introduced this year in the UK. Where a global server stores that data for all casinos to use and abide by. So it wont make any difference then which casinos you deposit and play at.

What would then be the case would be you would then deposit and play in casinos that do not have a UKGC license and are not accredited! Which I do not recommend at all. But sometimes gamblers get desperate. I for sure am not desperate!

Possibly
I can't see it happening however as I'd simply play at non UK compliant casinos and mandated by own own local government. Which while not CM accredited are regulated

 

[gtpaul]

Yes dionysus, Ive been playing at many other casinos all UK licensed since this fiasco with no problems.
Im sure they have been following this thread with much interest.

I dont see any other casinos apart from Rizk who have come remotely close to this situation.

 

[slot_zombie]

My turn this afternoon for SOW declaration + copy of bank statement.

I have provided the information because I'm a good little player

Hopefully there won't be any further service interruptions. Incidentally the 100 quid in my account (which was just sitting there, no WD request) is frozen until the process has been satisfied, per the email received.

 

[gtpaul]

Got you by the b***s no bank statement no withdrawal.

No way Im going to be blackmailed.

Good luck....

 

[slot_zombie]

Got you by the b***s no bank statement no withdrawal.

No way Im going to be blackmailed.

Good luck....

Verified and activated within 30 minutes. Back in play.

 

[gtpaul]

Yes thats freedom of choice if your happy to release personal details thats fine.
I on the other hand prefer to keep my details private.

Im playing at other casinos and if they request the same simples bye bye.

 

[miksaxxx]

My turn this afternoon for SOW declaration + copy of bank statement.

I have provided the information because I'm a good little player

Hopefully there won't be any further service interruptions. Incidentally the 100 quid in my account (which was just sitting there, no WD request) is frozen until the process has been satisfied, per the email received.

I cant understand how they can froze the money.

VS cant be court judge ( who can froze money )..

It is casino , not judge..

 

[nikantw]

I believe a healthy life is the 1st line of defense against addiction. So the next thing a casino will ask for RG is full-body naked selfie (to make sure we take good care of our body and monitor changes) and a video of the last 5 times we had sex (to make sure we are happy and satisfied)!

 

[dionysus]

I believe a healthy life is the 1st line of defense against addiction. So the next thing a casino will ask for RG is full-body naked selfie (to make sure we take good care of our body and monitor changes) and a video of the last 5 times we had sex (to make sure we are happy and satisfied)!

phew thankfully the last 5 times I had anything resembling sex was with my own naked body

 

[geordiecolin]

I believe a healthy life is the 1st line of defense against addiction. So the next thing a casino will ask for RG is full-body naked selfie (to make sure we take good care of our body and monitor changes) and a video of the last 5 times we had sex (to make sure we are happy and satisfied)!

Unfortunately the last five times I had sex was recorded on Betamax when I was known by the name of Colin the rampant ramrod so I'm fecked

 

[bigbear]

Source of Wealth request received today from Leo Vegas.So this process is gathering momentum.

 

[goatwack]

Source of Wealth request received today from Leo Vegas.So this process is gathering momentum.

Pre- deposit? Post deposit? Withdrawal stage? Do fill us in old chap! Because I play there quite a lot and am bricking my britches just thinking about it

 

[bebo67]

I went to the Riu in Bahamas a few years ago, decided to pop over to the Atlantis next door. They allow kids in the casino there! Saw Dustin Hoffman too. But seriously, kids? I said something and they said " there is no law against it".

 

[bigbear]

Pre- deposit? Post deposit? Withdrawal stage? Do fill us in old chap! Because I play there quite a lot and am bricking my britches just thinking about it

Thankfully pre deposit and no pending withdrawals.Will wait to see what level of proof they are happy with before i make any further deposits however it does not appear to be as stringent as Videoslots.

 

[pinnit2014]

Thankfully pre deposit and no pending withdrawals.Will wait to see what level of proof they are happy with before i make any further deposits however it does not appear to be as stringent as Videoslots.

I had a pending w/d and they processed it. I sent in a redacted payslip, per their email, so waiting to see if that's sufficient. I'm approx level 40 with about 8k deposits there a year (ish)

Edit - nothing from Royal Panda where i play more (though think they're still on sep licences

 

[amourgirl]

I trust videoslots with my information i'm not so sure I would trust many others.

 

[bebo67]

I trust videoslots with my information i'm not so sure I would trust many others.

Me too.

 

[pinnit2014]

For info-Had confirmation from LV that SOW accepted. No bank statements sent, payslip only. Don’t know if all others will be as hassle free.

 

[Jono777]

Not happy sending payslips, don't mind telling em all where it comes from but no pay slips, full bank statements or anything TOO personal, I've managed to keep a roof over my head last 14 years, car on road fully legal, held down job etc etc etc.

I'd rather quit, problem lies at the source of this request and how it is being handled - far more sensible ways of addressing problem gamblers and AML.

 

[goatwack]

Bank statements are one thing, and already fairly intrusive. I draw the line at payslips - no thanks.

And what if someone's unemployed? Are they to govern who can/ can't gamble, based on their 'judgement'?