thrills - account locked to provide source of funds. unresponsive and holding my cash

[ThrillsRep]

Hi forgotlogin,

Thank you for your patience, forgotlogin!
We haven't forgotten about you as the dedicated department is looking into your case and we will get back to you as soon as we have some information.
In addition, keep in mind that today is a public holiday and after we are back you will be updated at the earliest.

Best regards,
Thrills rep

thrillsrep thanks for your time but that information personally helps me not at all.
i am still repeatedly being told my case is being looked into but actually i only sent a brief response to the initial email over a week ago, with 2 brief documents that would take all of 10 minutes to check. i asked then if you require anything else more specific as well because i wasnt exactly sure what to send but no reply to that, either.
the fact is my withdrawal was pending 3 days before you even asked this stuff, presumably to give me time to reverse and lose everything..
now it is friday, i expect this to be untouched until next week.
i am very worried about this and nobody at thrills seems to care to help

 

[colinsunderland]

There is an

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.

Essentially what it boils down to is that you are not permitted to say anything that could be interpreted as tipping off someone that they are suspected of money laundering.

Yes, exactly. And in 99.9% of cases that won't apply to this type of situation.

He makes further enquiries of the client, partly to assess whether he is suspicious about possible proceeds of crime, but also to see exactly what advice the client needs. This is entirely unobjectionable. A solicitor can, and should, make enquiries of their client and no issue of tipping off arises.

Obviously that is for solicitors, but that is similar, in that the casino are making further enquiries, but should only be if they are suspicious.

That doesn't mean a casino cannot discuss general rules surrounding money laundering.

Of course, if the police contact a casino, tell them there is a money laundering investigation going on into customer X then the casino cannot tell the customer this, as it would be against the law.

 

[colinsunderland]

I don't think so but that was what he was told to say. If the boss says that is the reason then that is what he have to say.
I'm sure he isn't so pleased with not being able to be more open.

Then we have the fact that dealing with someone so stubborn as you isn't the most easy thing either

Stubborn? By that do you mean asking general questions that there is no reason in law that stop them being answered, so that I can be sure of getting paid in the future, then when I'm ignored or mislead, asking again?

So all he has to do is go to his boss and say, what is the law that stops me answering what the disclosure form asks, or can a client blank out bank transactions from a bank statement before he sends it to us as it contains business information that he doesn't want us to see?

 

[miksaxxx]

keep in mind that today is a public holiday

Best regards,
Thrills rep

This one i hate. Is casino working 24/7 365 days..

Was it yesterday puplic holiday, or monday and tuesday?

Player needs to wait everything and casino doesent.

Like in MGA player needs to submit everything at one time. Casino has then 21 days to respond.

Who this AML reguest really benefit.. In this case only casino, not player

 

[goatwack]

"....uses payment methods generally associated with illegitimate activity and similar activities."

But the casino still accepts them anyway

 

[miksaxxx]

"....uses payment methods generally associated with illegitimate activity and similar activities."

But the casino still accepts them anyway

Accepts until , player make big withdraw

 

[Tirilej]

Stubborn? By that do you mean asking general questions that there is no reason in law that stop them being answered, so that I can be sure of getting paid in the future, then when I'm ignored or mislead, asking again?

So all he has to do is go to his boss and say, what is the law that stops me answering what the disclosure form asks, or can a client blank out bank transactions from a bank statement before he sends it to us as it contains business information that he doesn't want us to see?

As I said, different casinos will ask for different things. Then you need to get an answer from all of them you play at.

Maybe they would be able to answer such a question if you can blank certain details, but they will never do it in public.

I did send a pm to Dan today to see what they can tell and not, or at least that they should in some way answer. I hope they will.

 

[colinsunderland]

As I said, different casinos will ask for different things. Then you need to get an answer from all of them you play at.

Maybe they would be able to answer such a question if you can blank certain details, but they will never do it in public.

I did send a pm to Dan today to see what they can tell and not, or at least that they should in some way answer. I hope they will.

And that is part of the problem, different casinos doing different things, when supposedly following the same law. Like KYC, the UKGC lists what can be used as ID, some casinos refuse to accept them for no reason other than they don't want to.

Thrills in their earlier post did actually explain things pretty properly, now going from Dans post, they should be getting arrested soon for daring to mention AM proceedures, but I will guarantee they won't as they haven't broken any law.

 

[colinsunderland]

Good Afternoon!

Apologies for the delay in response but casinomeister was being updated at the time of the thread so we were unable to respond to messages.
We can see there are some questions around the rationale of the recently introduced 'Source of Wealth" requirement as part of our regulatory responsibilities relating to Know Your Client (KYC) process.

We have a duty of care to ensure our customers are protected and able to enjoy our casinos responsibly. At this stage we feel it is important to explain why we are introducing these simple but important steps.
KYC processes are required in order to comply with Anti-Money Laundering laws and regulations. Gambling Operators became obliged entities under the Prevention of Money Laundering Act (Malta)/Proceeds of Crime Act (UK) for the very first time following the implementation of the Fourth Anti-Money Laundering Directive implemented by the European Union in June of 2017. This means that Gambling Operators have a legal obligation to know more on who they are dealing with, to verify their age, their identity and also their address.
For customers that interact with our brands more regularly, or perhaps carry out certain transactions with the businesses exceeding system generated parameters we are also obliged to gain an understanding of how our customers acquired his/her net worth and whether the same justifies the transactional activity being made using our casino. For players that do not pose a high risk to the business, Source of Wealth will not require a forensic exercise and general information, providing it is truthful, is generally considered satisfactory.
We will only need proof demonstrating the declared source of wealth where a customer’s risk status elevates, and this would typically be in cases where a customer logs-in from high-risk jurisdictions, has irregular and excessive depositing patterns, deposits using cards belonging to third parties, uses payment methods generally associated with illegitimate activity and similar activities.
To give you further confidence, we shall not be requesting any additional documentation until any of our risk based triggers are reached, and in the event they do, we can assure you that as a reputable and conscientious Gambling Operator, licenced by the Gambling Commission and the Malta Gaming Authority, we treat personal data with the highest standard of care and confidentiality and take all steps necessary to ensure that your privacy is protected.
Our customer experience is our primary commitment and we appreciate you taking the time to speak with us, if you require any further details please do not hesitate to contact us again. We are ready to help.

Trills rep

Thank you very much for that long and detailed post, you are the first rep to answer questions on this and you have done so in a pretty clear way

I do stand by my earlier statement that a risk based trigger shouldn't be triggered on withdrawal, and I feel that is backed up by what you have said above, as most of what you have mentioned is IP, deposit and payment method related.

 

[jimbler]

well no the account is locked..

Update?

 

[forgotlogin]

Update?

finally got a reply acknowledging the documents i sent, which were basically proof of wins on other casinos but now they asking proof of where my deposits at those casinos many months ago... i dont know what to send as its just money i had in bank. they want income statements proving a regular high salary etc.. i actually think they are just want to steal my money i am very depressed it has made me gambling away all my money i had left at other sites in frustration. only savings i got are now in thrills.com account and i dont know what to do

 

[Mouche12]

Thank you very much for that long and detailed post, you are the first rep to answer questions on this and you have done so in a pretty clear way

I do stand by my earlier statement that a risk based trigger shouldn't be triggered on withdrawal, and I feel that is backed up by what you have said above, as most of what you have mentioned is IP, deposit and payment method related.

Very well put. The OP is a highroller so large deposits were coming in on a regular basis, right? If they indeed suspected he was a risk in terms of money laundering or other criminal activities, they should have investigated and possibly closed his account earlier, and not have accepted all his deposits. It's unethical IMO that this investigation only occurs after a substantial withdrawal was made, and why does it take so long?

 

[Missmeow81]

maybe challenge them with a proof of paying out depositors - unbelieveable no problem taking your oney but giving a portion back big problem , I always found thaat with microgaming casinos I just wish i found/deposited in videoslots only and never went to any microgaming casino ever or at least only played it at videoslots (since sept 14 i have cashed out more from them these 3-4 months than i ever did in the 10-15 yrs ******* grr

 

[colinsunderland]

finally got a reply acknowledging the documents i sent, which were basically proof of wins on other casinos but now they asking proof of where my deposits at those casinos many months ago... i dont know what to send as its just money i had in bank. they want income statements proving a regular high salary etc.. i actually think they are just want to steal my money i am very depressed it has made me gambling away all my money i had left at other sites in frustration. only savings i got are now in thrills.com account and i dont know what to do

I'm sorry but you have shown them the money came from wins at other casinos, but now they want proof of where you got the money from to make those deposits? I'm not sure they have a right to do an audit trail like that. You have shown a legitimate source of the funds that were used to deposit at Thrills, that should be enough to satisfy their obligations under the act. The casinos you won from previously could have asked for proof of income for those deposits if they were required.

I said this would cause problems and also questioned this type of thing, but the rep (another thread & rep) ignored my question. I had a house that I sold, I said that if a casino wanted to check I could show the money coming in, but what would happen then? Would they want to see mortgage payments for the 15 years I owned it, then where that came from, then where I got the deposit from 15 years previously, then mortgage payments from my previous house (which is where the deposit came from), and the deposit from that 10 years previous to that etc etc.

You have shown a legitimate source of funds for money you have deposited there. By asking for proof of deposits to other casinos, they are just delaying paying you out, and quite possibly asking for business information that they don't really have the right to. They are asking for details of your private transactions to rival casinos. I would honestly refuse to provide this and start a PAB. I don't see anything in the act (although I am happy to be corrected if I missed it) that says a casino can hold onto a withdrawal while these requests are ongoing. I would also mention in the PAB that these requests are unfair and unreasonable due to them only being requested on withdrawal, and draw attention to the reps reply earlier in the thread that says the trigger would usually be on deposit etc. None of them mention the trigger would be a withdrawal.

In my view, and from whats posted in the thread, I think they are using the AML's to delay/refuse paying you.

 

[ThrillsRep]

Hey everyone,

We contacted again with the related department about this case to make sure that this is a priority one. They are communicating with forgotlogin with further steps. At this stage, we cannot share more details here in public about this specific case, however, please be assured that all the actions that have been taken are necessary. We are a fully licenced and responsible casino operator, we are required to comply with certain regulatory requirements, as per our obligation to both EU and national requirements.

This is not only valid for Thrills but also with all other brands of ours as the group. Delaying or refusing winnings with random excuses is not in the least what we want.

Thrillsrep

 

[Harry_BKK]

Hey everyone,

We contacted again with the related department about this case to make sure that this is a priority one. They are communicating with forgotlogin with further steps. At this stage, we cannot share more details here in public about this specific case, however, please be assured that all the actions that have been taken are necessary. We are a fully licenced and responsible casino operator, we are required to comply with certain regulatory requirements, as per our obligation to both EU and national requirements.

This is not only valid for Thrills but also with all other brands of ours as the group. Delaying or refusing winnings with random excuses is not in the least what we want.

Thrillsrep

With all due respect and understanding that you cannot disclose all details, but I would really like to hear once a viable explanation as to why no red flags ever came up when he deposited 25K in a rather short period but did so instantly the soon he tried to withdraw. Had he lost his last deposit, you would have said 'thank you very much" for all the money but would have never asked him for "proof of wealth" or whatever you call it. I call it HYPOCRISY!

In essence, your compliance works only when money is due to leave your house, but you hardly give a damn' as long as it comes in and a player is losing it!

 

[chiya]

Every post here by Thrills has been more or less some mumbojumbo just to protect their own image of that consists of explaining them only following the rules and laws set in place, while dodging every relevant question that they COULD answer. For example, I still don't know why and how they can request proof of how the money was earned that earned those winnings in the other casino, that then allowed this win. Not to mention they want proof of a regular high salary? Excuse me? Not everyone even has a job and that doesn't mean they don't have money, and having money without a job doesn't automatically make you a money launderer.

Let's say a player inherits a large sum, or wins such sum several years back. Then he starts gambling online and as he wins, his bets get higher and higher. For past ten years he's played with the money he's won here and there, and then plays and wins at Thrills. Based on this you'll just confiscate his money because he has no salary and likely no proof where he earned that money TEN YEARS AGO. That's absurd and you know it. And of course, their deposits are completely fine with you even if the money was obtained illegally, as long as he doesn't win. Doesn't seem fair now does it?

Frankly it should be none of your business where the OP obtained the money to play at casinos that are not even affiliated to you. There is no way you can consider it money laundering when playing with money you'd won in another casino.

I sincerely hope forgotlogin makes a PAB about this. And to think this is an accredited casino too.

Ps. I wish there was a dislike button in the new forum software.

 

[miksaxxx]

Hey everyone,

We contacted again with the related department about this case to make sure that this is a priority one. They are communicating with forgotlogin with further steps. At this stage, we cannot share more details here in public about this specific case, however, please be assured that all the actions that have been taken are necessary. We are a fully licenced and responsible casino operator, we are required to comply with certain regulatory requirements, as per our obligation to both EU and national requirements.

This is not only valid for Thrills but also with all other brands of ours as the group. Delaying or refusing winnings with random excuses is not in the least what we want.

Thrillsrep

Hole group ( GIG )..

nice move from GIG

He doesent need to say nothing where money comed in to other casinos. He proved to Thrills that he winned other casinos and deposit them Thrills.

What law gives Thrills permission to ask earlier different casino deposits. ?

Then lets move on to AML guestion to Thrills , why GIG has adress in USA. Have you operation in there ? I dont think so.. Do you try to avoid tax ? nice box office if you go to see it in google map

10700 Stringfellow Road

Suite 10

Bokeelia, FL 33922

 

[ThrillsRep]

With all due respect and understanding that you cannot disclose all details, but I would really like to hear once a viable explanation as to why no red flags ever came up when he deposited 25K in a rather short period but did so instantly the soon he tried to withdraw. Had he lost his last deposit, you would have said 'thank you very much" for all the money but would have never asked him for "proof of wealth" or whatever you call it. I call it HYPOCRISY!

In essence, your compliance works only when money is due to leave your house, but you hardly give a damn' as long as it comes in and a player is losing it!

Totally understand that it doesn't seem good. But some certain details were kept hidden such as the registration day, deposits and withdrawal are on the same day, within the same hour actually. Our intention was protecting the player here, however, this post getting out of control since not everything given to you in the beginning. We would like to keep the rest of the conversations between the dedicated team and forgotlogin.

Thank you for your understanding on this.

Then lets move on to AML guestion to Thrills , why GIG has adress in USA. Have you operation in there ? I dont think so.. Do you try to avoid tax ?

We believe you are looking for the wrong GIG Our headquarter is in Malta

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

Thrillsrep

 

[colinsunderland]

Hey everyone,

We contacted again with the related department about this case to make sure that this is a priority one. They are communicating with forgotlogin with further steps. At this stage, we cannot share more details here in public about this specific case, however, please be assured that all the actions that have been taken are necessary. We are a fully licenced and responsible casino operator, we are required to comply with certain regulatory requirements, as per our obligation to both EU and national requirements.

This is not only valid for Thrills but also with all other brands of ours as the group. Delaying or refusing winnings with random excuses is not in the least what we want.

Thrillsrep

So this is a priority case, but has taken 2 weeks so far. Well I hope anyone reading this doesn't deposit a single penny with you or Rizk, Guts, Superlenny etc as I dread to think how long it would take if it was being dealt with at a normal speed.

Perhaps you could link me to the section of the act that forbids you from processing a withdrawal in a case like this please?

If you could also link to the section where it says once the source of funds is proven to be from a legitimate source, then you have the right to go further back, and how long for?

Thank you

 

[colinsunderland]

Totally understand that it doesn't seem good. But some certain details were kept hidden such as the registration day, deposits and withdrawal are on the same day, within the same hour actually. Our intention was protecting the player here, however, this post getting out of control since not everything given to you in the beginning. We would like to keep the rest of the conversations between the dedicated team and forgotlogin.

Thank you for your understanding on this.

So its a responsible gaming issue not an inquiry under the anti money laundering laws?

It sounds to me like you are using AML's to protect yourself from the possibility of a chargeback.

 

[Harry_BKK]

Totally understand that it doesn't seem good. But some certain details were kept hidden such as the registration day, deposits and withdrawal are on the same day, within the same hour actually. Our intention was protecting the player here, however, this post getting out of control since not everything given to you in the beginning. We would like to keep the rest of the conversations between the dedicated team and forgotlogin.

Thank you for your understanding on this.

Thrillsrep

I do not want you do disclose any specifics to this case. It was meant in general, I will try again.

How on earth can you explain that somebody depositing 25K in a matter of hours does not have all sirens sounding "AML check" and you blocking the account while he is still depositing, but those sirens sure going off immediately and very loud when he tried to take 83K out. Is that a proper procedure for AML regulations???

Again, in essence he could have deposited 100K and you would still have just accepted it while he was losing! And that is in my view hypocrisy.

 

[colinsunderland]

I do not want you do disclose any specifics to this case. It was meant in general, I will try again.

How on earth can you explain that somebody depositing 25K in a matter of hours does not have all sirens sounding "AML check" and you blocking the account while he is still depositing, but those sirens sure going off immediately and very loud when he tried to take 83K out. Is that a proper procedure for AML regulations???

Again, in essence he could have deposited 100K and you would still have just accepted it while he was losing! And that is in my view hypocrisy.

Exactly. Surely casinos have automated systems in place that would detect if a brand new registered player deposits over xx amount in a certain time period, but of course, locking an account immediately will cost the casino income. Plus, the OP says his KYC docs were verified, so presumably someone manually looked at the account then, yet allowed him to continue playing, only the following day was his account locked. Just waiting now for the 'this is now sorted out, we have returned the players deposits to his bank account under our responsible gaming proceedures' post.

 

[Steviedoo]

This is terrible....I mean...they can ask for whatever they want under the guise of the new laws.

How far back do they want to go....he showed them the source of income....what's the hold up?

 

[miksaxxx]

Totally understand that it doesn't seem good. But some certain details were kept hidden such as the registration day, deposits and withdrawal are on the same day, within the same hour actually. Our intention was protecting the player here, however, this post getting out of control since not everything given to you in the beginning. We would like to keep the rest of the conversations between the dedicated team and forgotlogin.

Thank you for your understanding on this.



We believe you are looking for the wrong GIG Our headquarter is in Malta

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

Thrillsrep

gaming Innovation Group Inc. is a US corporation with operations on Malta.

Inc is USA firm. like your CEO is " inc " corporatin CEO. not ltd like in Malta