Take Note and be warned your MAC is tracked

[Fridayhigh]

No.

A good read even on the newest devices

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[trancemonkey]

Tracemonkey you are correct the game engines of leading software are not rigged and most PRNG are of a nature to be random to fit the purpose.

And I have heard you hammer that out for eternity and rightfully so as a coder.

But how often does anyone from the UKGC oversee the servers in Malta?

Without a par sheet, it would be difficult to determine if one's results after a huge win are within reason.

But as I stated in another post,, there are court cases going on in Malta now with regard to the servers.

The game engine can remain intact, as can the RNG, a temporary switch to a non tagged server, that's a whole new ballgame.

With a par sheet it would also be impossible - so i assume you don't really understand what PAR sheets show...
And how would this switch work? Bearing in mind that all the spin requests are logged.... suddenly you're pinging a different server? And what? This server does what exactly?

 

[trancemonkey]

And knowing the MAC address, a particular result can be made to be discarded.

Ahh yes, of course - the MAC address conspiracy. As opposed to using your account details, which you're logged in with.
You realise you can log in to your account from any device right? So your MAC address can change. Your account details can't.
And yet for some misguided. unfathomable reasons, you think that if it WERE tracking something to change your RTP, it would use a MAC address?! Lol

 

[trancemonkey]

Yes it can be read most definitely, most new devices have randomized MAC address, but they too can be targeted. That is why owning a smartphone is the stupidest thing in the world. All governments track your every move 24/7. . . . . as can your wife : )

Owning any phone means you can be tracked... you're phone can be triangulated whether it's smart or dumb.

 

[trancemonkey]

Well very long time no speak...
I’m sure as usual a lot will take exception to my return, I promised and didn’t deliver, that I’ll not deny one iota...
it was due originally to a personal circumstance, that I did inform the boss about and I’m hopeful if any doubters appear he will put them straight...
I’ve always read the forum, it’s a fantastic place of different people and ideas, and total different mindsets.
Hence why it’s the only real go to place for decent opinion and discussion... not to mention advice...
I missed the place a lot, and certain members.
Whether I’m welcomed back or not it remains to be seen, but I’ve thrown my hat back in the ring and I’ll accept and take what the majority say, also the boss...
Anyways, probably wrong thread to say that (apologies) if needs be move my post admin.
Reading this thread after a long hiatus is rather saddening in many ways, as where certain political threads earlier in the year...
I’ve read peoples accounts banned and closed down, temporarily banned folks... but really a lot didn’t deserve that... it takes away the value of this forum... the only decent and credible well used place on on the net for fact and discussion..
I can barely remember trance, sure he’s a great stand up guy, no question... I’ve read lots and lots of his input and it’s factual and great to read, that said however he isn’t the casinomeister voice of all opinion, now I mean that with utter respect, he’s giving his point from what he knows and works in and has many years, he didn’t have to... sure the guy gains zero for being here...
that said, it can’t just be his opinion that holds weight, as seemed on this thread...
I’m no foil hatter, no believer of stats and facts, nor am I a believer the online casino world is all Wings, roses, cash and camels (goat)
To be banning people in the nature I’ve seen was never the casinomeister of old, it was hardly abusive nor threatening in anyway...
again, not a boss or admin, just a long time member and massive fan of casinomeister putting his opinion forward... missed the place , and goat... you ever sell them camels for us?....

Hey playford7 - i don't expect everyone to believe me. That's not the point - but the issue was the dogshead1 was getting more and more irate and was just simply not answering any question posed to him. That's not a debate, that's just a refusal to accept others opinions.

The difference with me (i think!) is that i accept people have that opinion, and i try and educate them with facts, figures, and questions designed to enable them to look at what they believe in a different light and at the very least consider whether what i'm saying holds any weight or not. If they still decide, after considering the questions and evidence i provide, that they don't agree, then fine. But if they continue to spout the same rubbish, i believe i'm allowed to continue to try and help them see that they could possibly be wrong.

 

[Fridayhigh]

Please elaborate on the bold text - as if it means what I think it means -i.e a rogue gimped server sending up a rogue game result back the the player, that is pretty damning.

Trance - would that be technically possible?

I did not say the game would change in anyway, rogued or otherwise. As to the original poster concerned over his MAC address, the process would work somewhat like a pokerstars deal -a switch in layer 2 would block certain results thrown out by means of a bridging hub by means of a blocked MAC address, that result would go on as normal to a white masked MAC address. keeping the results of the game integrity intact. Not much different than a class 2 to class 3 distinction. That is possible and done with everything online, unrelated to gaming.

 

[budskap]

A good read even on the newest devices

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This has absolutely nothing at all to do with the topic of if a casino website can get your computer's MAC address.

 

[Fridayhigh]

Owning any phone means you can be tracked... you're phone can be triangulated whether it's smart or dumb.

Only to the nearest cell phone tower and only if its on, and only(?) if the police/government agency serves the service provider with a warrant. Because old dumb phones- as you say, are not tracked on a constant basis by "third parties" in real time and all the time. Tracked yes, but misleading your response.

 

[TheresNoDInBonanza]

Only to the nearest cell phone tower and only if its on, and only(?) if the police/government agency serves the service provider with a warrant. Because old dumb phones- as you say, are not tracked on a constant basis by "third parties" in real time and all the time. Tracked yes, but misleading your response.

It's not to the nearest tower, it's within x metres range, that's the whole point of triangulation.

Also yes of course it needs to be on... ?

Anyway just another bizarre derail.

 

[Fridayhigh]

This has absolutely nothing at all to do with the topic of if a casino website can get your computer's MAC address.

it has everything to do with it, because a network switch works off MAC address, NOT your IP, nor name or any other number a casino might assign to you.

 

[TheresNoDInBonanza]

Um.. That's because a network switch is the one that has to assign you an IP via DHCP... So it would be kinda difficult to do that without any other identifying information?

 

[TheresNoDInBonanza]

This is just argument for the sake of argument now.. Anyway I'm retiring from slots after a disastrous night last night so I can sell you my MAC address as it's now due for a corresponding huge increase in RTP.

 

[budskap]

it has everything to do with it

No, it still has absolutely nothing at all to do with it.

because a network switch works off MAC address, NOT your IP, nor name or any other number a casino might assign to you.

Yes, a switch forwards frames based on MAC address, which also has nothing to do with the topic.

-

MAC addresses are used on the local link for delivering frames on the network you're directly connected to. At every hop (router) along the way to the casino, including at your home router, your ISPs router etc. the source and destination MAC addresses will change (while source and destination IP addresses will stay the same of course).

Can you give one example or scenario in which the casino will get your computer's MAC address and how?

 

[dunover]

LOL.....

 

[brianmon]

With a par sheet it would also be impossible - so i assume you don't really understand what PAR sheets show...
And how would this switch work? Bearing in mind that all the spin requests are logged.... suddenly you're pinging a different server? And what? This server does what exactly?

If nothing dodgy could be done within the servers. Why do they need to be checked, certified and sealed ?

 

[trancemonkey]

If nothing dodgy could be done within the servers. Why do they need to be checked, certified and sealed ?

I didn't say nothing dodgy could be done - something dodgy can be done with anything... but just because something CAN be done, doesn't mean it has been or is being. You can murder someone if you choose to, so by the same logic, you therefore must have murdered someone.

(That's a "royal you" - not directed at you specifically)

 

[goatwack]

Flatearthers & murderers. This could get interesting

 

[pinnit2014]

Are both mutually exclusive or can you be both? Just deciding what group I fall into.

 

[goatwack]

Are both mutually exclusive or can you be both? Just deciding what group I fall into.

You're just cuckoo, so flatearther

Not a violent bone in your body

 

[SpinUk]

If nothing dodgy could be done within the servers. Why do they need to be checked, certified and sealed ?

Yes. Whats the server do exactly - anyone? And why the security/certification if it does not impact fairness? Not pointing the finger just interested what it does

 

[SpinUk]

I didn't say nothing dodgy could be done - something dodgy can be done with anything... but just because something CAN be done, doesn't mean it has been or is being. You can murder someone if you choose to, so by the same logic, you therefore must have murdered someone.

(That's a "royal you" - not directed at you specifically)

By that anology in relation to this it seems to be conceeded that altering this remote Maltese server is indeed possible and could temporarily skew results in favour of the casino.

Whether or not casino’s do this is an entirely differant debate, im asking whether this is technically possible?

 

[trancemonkey]

By that anology in relation to this it seems to be conceeded that altering this remote Maltese server is indeed possible and could temporarily skew results in favour of the casino.

Whether or not casino’s do this is an entirely differant debate, im asking whether this is technically possible?

Of course dodgy shit CAN be done - the technology is not impossible to create. But to do so you need many complicit people, you need the hardware, you need complicit game studios, you need complicit casinos and more importantly you need a reason to make some extremely complex system to do exactly what the slot maths will do anyway - which is make a known amount of money over a period of time.

So, as i can't think of anything better to say in this thread any more, if anyone is still questioning the rigged / non-random / compensated ideology, please go back a few pages and just answer in here, or just in your head, all the questions i posed. And then if you still think the same, or change your mind, at least i gave you reason to think

 

[trancemonkey]

Flatearthers & murderers. This could get interesting

I like my crazy analogies and similes

 

[trancemonkey]

Are both mutually exclusive or can you be both? Just deciding what group I fall into.

Well, i could murder a pizza right now - and that looks a bit like a flat earth....

 

[trancemonkey]

Yes. Whats the server do exactly - anyone? And why the security/certification if it does not impact fairness? Not pointing the finger just interested what it does

The server is where the game software (back end - game logic) is stored. It's where the spin requests are handled - where the RNG is.

 

[goatwack]

The server is where the game software (back end - game logic) is stored. It's where the spin requests are handled - where the RNG is.

Just why does a server need to spew out numbers when RNG can be replicated offline?

And what pizza are you having?

 

[trancemonkey]

Just why does a server need to spew out numbers when RNG can be replicated offline?

And what pizza are you having?

Pepperoni Passion with extra Chorizo...

And can you clarify what you mean? Are you saying why the RNG can't be local to your computer, rather than on a server?

 

[goatwack]

Pepperoni Passion with extra Chorizo...

And can you clarify what you mean? Are you saying why the RNG can't be local to your computer, rather than on a server?

Sounds delicious

-and yes, in essence

Much like any type of video game software

 

[trancemonkey]

Sounds delicious

-and yes, in essence

Much like any type of video game software

Because then it would be super easy to hack the RNG - and also, then you'd still have to have a server to log all the spins...
It would be super unsafe...

 

[goatwack]

Because then it would be super easy to hack the RNG - and also, then you'd still have to have a server to log all the spins...
It would be super unsafe...

Of course, but can casinos not have software that reviews game logs and any anomalies? They'd log anything untoward when it comes to irregular betting patterns etc

The software surely doesn't have to be online in order to function, apart from aforementioned reverse-engineering.

 

[Playford7]

Hey playford7 - i don't expect everyone to believe me. That's not the point - but the issue was the dogshead1 was getting more and more irate and was just simply not answering any question posed to him. That's not a debate, that's just a refusal to accept others opinions.

The difference with me (i think!) is that i accept people have that opinion, and i try and educate them with facts, figures, and questions designed to enable them to look at what they believe in a different light and at the very least consider whether what i'm saying holds any weight or not. If they still decide, after considering the questions and evidence i provide, that they don't agree, then fine. But if they continue to spout the same rubbish, i believe i'm allowed to continue to try and help them see that they could possibly be wrong.

Absolutely, and it’s great you do.
I’ve enjoyed the ‘ask me anything’ thread immensely. Totally eye opening, hope my post didn’t come across the wrong way as wasn’t intended.
Also get it must be so frustrating to keep repeating yourself and nobody listening, but when people are losing they will only see the bad, people rarely remember a raise of stake where they hit big, normally only the time they have 10p left and hit 300x plus.
Keep your posts coming, your a fantastic asset to the forum.

 

[colinsunderland]

awww man, I came back to see dogboys evidence from the packet sniffing I asked him to do early in the thread to see him prove all the fraud allegations he was making but he's been banned On the upside he now has 30 extra days to get more data

What was the massive poker company that was found to be cheating years ago, was it absolute poker, I think they were running super accounts that could see everyones hands or something, I'm not a poker player so not 100% what went on.

There were also russian hackers who were doing offline machines for a lot of money at one point.

They are the only 2 cheats I'm aware of - apart from fake games/casinos.

What other ones has there been (not talking about expoiting poorly written code)?

 

[Harry_BKK]

On another note, we now know that complex forms of live on earth has existed for 550 mio. years, while life itself goes back nearly 4 billion. Will we make it another 550, let alone 550 million?

This is one they found in arctic Russia where they were able to extract enough DNA to assert that it was indeed an animal and not a plant. Rigged or not?

 

[goatwack]

On another note, we now know that complex forms of live on earth has existed for 550 mio. years, while life itself goes back nearly 4 billion. Will we make it another 550, let alone 550 million?

This is one they found in arctic Russia where they were able to extract enough DNA to assert that it was indeed an animal and not a plant. Rigged or not?

View attachment 95322

Man that's 100% rigged. Or ridged? Who really knows!

 

[slotmaster]

awww man, I came back to see dogboys evidence from the packet sniffing I asked him to do early in the thread to see him prove all the fraud allegations he was making but he's been banned On the upside he now has 30 extra days to get more data

What was the massive poker company that was found to be cheating years ago, was it absolute poker, I think they were running super accounts that could see everyones hands or something, I'm not a poker player so not 100% what went on.

There were also russian hackers who were doing offline machines for a lot of money at one point.

They are the only 2 cheats I'm aware of - apart from fake games/casinos.

What other ones has there been (not talking about expoiting poorly written code)?

Yes absolute/ub. Full tilt owners stealing money and going way back there was a program that could read pokerstars deal with close accuracy.

 

[trancemonkey]

awww man, I came back to see dogboys evidence from the packet sniffing I asked him to do early in the thread to see him prove all the fraud allegations he was making but he's been banned On the upside he now has 30 extra days to get more data

What was the massive poker company that was found to be cheating years ago, was it absolute poker, I think they were running super accounts that could see everyones hands or something, I'm not a poker player so not 100% what went on.

There were also russian hackers who were doing offline machines for a lot of money at one point.

They are the only 2 cheats I'm aware of - apart from fake games/casinos.

What other ones has there been (not talking about expoiting poorly written code)?

Yeah the Russian hackers basically cracked a poorly coded RNG....

 

[snorky510238]

On another note, we now know that complex forms of live on earth has existed for 550 mio. years, while life itself goes back nearly 4 billion. Will we make it another 550, let alone 550 million?

This is one they found in arctic Russia where they were able to extract enough DNA to assert that it was indeed an animal and not a plant. Rigged or not?

View attachment 95322

David Attenborough likes this.

 

[LoopsterAU]

If you want to avoid your MAC being linked everywhere just create a virtual machine for each casino... I did that at one point back years ago when my tin foil hat was at its peak lol

But as others have already suggested here tracking is much easier to obtain via other ways such as your ACCOUNT that you use to log in from.

Going by previous research I think that the main reason you are pointing to the MAC address is because it is a constant element in what they call RNG seeding, from experience changing these seeding elements tends to give you short term rewards but long term pain as in the end the house always wins and some system they have on account management detects these things. These things are already mentioned in much older threads but seeds can be things like mac, IP, time of day, date, deposit size, screen resolution plus the list goes on.

The longer you haven't changed each of these things the more likely that changing them will result in a short win streak, but as I mentioned earlier something in account management detects you changing this and after the short win streak comes a lot of pain and losing no matter what you do.

My theory is that slots are not random as they say they are, they are controlled by the casinos account management API which is why both big win and loss streaks happen. We don't complain when luck seems to just stick around (rigged in our favor) but its torture when they want it all back + more.

 

[dunover]

If you want to avoid your MAC being linked everywhere just create a virtual machine for each casino... I did that at one point back years ago when my tin foil hat was at its peak lol

But as others have already suggested here tracking is much easier to obtain via other ways such as your ACCOUNT that you use to log in from.

Going by previous research I think that the main reason you are pointing to the MAC address is because it is a constant element in what they call RNG seeding, from experience changing these seeding elements tends to give you short term rewards but long term pain as in the end the house always wins and some system they have on account management detects these things. These things are already mentioned in much older threads but seeds can be things like mac, IP, time of day, date, deposit size, screen resolution plus the list goes on.

The longer you haven't changed each of these things the more likely that changing them will result in a short win streak, but as I mentioned earlier something in account management detects you changing this and after the short win streak comes a lot of pain and losing no matter what you do.

My theory is that slots are not random as they say they are, they are controlled by the casinos account management API which is why both big win and loss streaks happen. We don't complain when luck seems to just stick around (rigged in our favor) but its torture when they want it all back + more.

Over to you Trance...…

 

[trancemonkey]

My theory is that slots are not random as they say they are, they are controlled by the casinos account management API which is why both big win and loss streaks happen. We don't complain when luck seems to just stick around (rigged in our favor) but its torture when they want it all back + more.

And you don't think random games can create hot / cold streaks? Again, you misunderstand statistics if you think this...
Big Win streaks, or loss streaks, are not proof of anything. In fact, they are (as i've said before) more proof of random than anything else.
In compensated games (which i've made) you go all out to try and make sure you disguise the compensator - ok sometimes you can't avoid forcing a big win if someone plays like a muppet and forces the machine, and if someone gets a big win when the comp can't really afford it (normally via manipulation) you might have to force some losing games, but you simply don't do this as the norm. The whole point of compensating is that we CAN control the experience - so given that you're alleging we (or the casinos) can do this - which is simply untrue if they are using legit software - then what you are suggesting is that we make it damn obvious by putting you on a losing streak.

That is so the exact opposite of what we do try to do with compensated Cat C, B4 games that it's just a ridiculous thing to even suggest. I mean, given they are SUPPOSED to be random, do you honestly think we would try and make them look "not random" by rigging them?!

 

[LoopsterAU]

And you don't think random games can create hot / cold streaks? Again, you misunderstand statistics if you think this...
Big Win streaks, or loss streaks, are not proof of anything. In fact, they are (as i've said before) more proof of random than anything else.
In compensated games (which i've made) you go all out to try and make sure you disguise the compensator - ok sometimes you can't avoid forcing a big win if someone plays like a muppet and forces the machine, and if someone gets a big win when the comp can't really afford it (normally via manipulation) you might have to force some losing games, but you simply don't do this as the norm. The whole point of compensating is that we CAN control the experience - so given that you're alleging we (or the casinos) can do this - which is simply untrue if they are using legit software - then what you are suggesting is that we make it damn obvious by putting you on a losing streak.

That is so the exact opposite of what we do try to do with compensated Cat C, B4 games that it's just a ridiculous thing to even suggest. I mean, given they are SUPPOSED to be random, do you honestly think we would try and make them look "not random" by rigging them?!

So weighted rheels are a myth that only anyone with a tin foil hat dares mention ?

Its strange that a few months before my my mega 177k win on Immortal Romance at 32red their support advised me that my lifetime RTP was sitting on around 91% over millions of dollars worth of spins across my account.

RTP long term average is across your account and not individually by game.

 

[Jono777]

177K on IR and you're STILL playing

I'd have sailed off into the sunset the minute the withdrawal hit and never hit 'Spin' again, lifetime!

 

[LoopsterAU]

My point is iv tried everything in gambling n my money clearly shows where my mouth is... wouldn't be surprised if my lifetime spins across all casinos in last 8 years is $30+ million with bet sizes from minimum to as crazy as $500 a spin.

Slots and casinos in general are not 100% random as claimed, i can say that confidently after my experiences.

 

[snorky510238]

My point is iv tried everything in gambling n my money clearly shows where my mouth is... wouldn't be surprised if my lifetime spins across all casinos in last 8 years is $30+ million with bet sizes from minimum to as crazy as $500 a spin.

Slots and casinos in general are not 100% random as claimed, i can say that confidently after my experiences.

I take it you don’t clean the sewers then.

 

[Jono777]

My point is iv tried everything in gambling n my money clearly shows where my mouth is... wouldn't be surprised if my lifetime spins across all casinos in last 8 years is $30+ million with bet sizes from minimum to as crazy as $500 a spin.

Slots and casinos in general are not 100% random as claimed, i can say that confidently after my experiences.

Something I've said to myself time and again over the years and until recently posted various thoughts and even examples about and yes there are sessions (sometimes too many) where it feels this is the case. My experiences also (15 years online) had me thinking this has to be the case.....Until....

Thing is although it "feels" like this is the case, there is zero proof. There is however plenty of reassurances from people in the industry whom I genuinely trust to the contrary that the slots are random.

Hard to take in give some sessions yes But I for one have been converted away from all foil hat theories and now stand by fair play and nothing untoward.

By now someone /thing, somewhere would have happened to expose any "dodgyness" and just one tiny instance or proof would back up these thoughts. There has, however to my knowledge and from what I read here not been one single instance!

 

[goatwack]

Something I've said to myself time and again over the years and until recently posted various thoughts and even examples about and yes there are sessions (sometimes too many) where it feels this is the case. My experiences also (15 years online) had me thinking this has to be the case.....Until....

Thing is although it "feels" like this is the case, there is zero proof. There is however plenty of reassurances from people in the industry whom I genuinely trust to the contrary that the slots are random.

Hard to take in give some sessions yes But I for one have been converted away from all foil hat theories and now stand by fair play and nothing untoward.

By now someone /thing, somewhere would have happened to expose any "dodgyness" and just one tiny instance or proof would back up these thoughts. There has, however to my knowledge and from what I read here not been one single instance!

How much have they paid you

Spit it out

 

[Jono777]

How much have they paid you

Spit it out

Lol, very good!

Regular bank transfers and Paysafe codes from Trance, Dunover and Bryan

Have a contract until 2050 for never using 'that' word on here again

 

[goatwack]

Lol, very good!

Regular bank transfers and Paysafe codes from Trance, Dunover and Bryan

Have a contract until 2050 for never using 'that' word on here again

Honesty is always the best policy

Just be sure to sleep with one eye open

 

[trancemonkey]

So weighted rheels are a myth that only anyone with a tin foil hat dares mention ?

Its strange that a few months before my my mega 177k win on Immortal Romance at 32red their support advised me that my lifetime RTP was sitting on around 91% over millions of dollars worth of spins across my account.

RTP long term average is across your account and not individually by game.

Who said weighted reels are a myth?

 

[trancemonkey]

Something I've said to myself time and again over the years and until recently posted various thoughts and even examples about and yes there are sessions (sometimes too many) where it feels this is the case. My experiences also (15 years online) had me thinking this has to be the case.....Until....

Thing is although it "feels" like this is the case, there is zero proof. There is however plenty of reassurances from people in the industry whom I genuinely trust to the contrary that the slots are random.

Hard to take in give some sessions yes But I for one have been converted away from all foil hat theories and now stand by fair play and nothing untoward.

By now someone /thing, somewhere would have happened to expose any "dodgyness" and just one tiny instance or proof would back up these thoughts. There has, however to my knowledge and from what I read here not been one single instance!

Jono... You're a rare breed on here if you listen to cogent arguments and then change your mind