Pulver VS Lock Casino

[Nifty29]

Thanks for the info Max

Funny how some people keep turning every thread about a specific issue into a general 'all online casinos are cheating rogues (but we still play there anyway)' rant.

Are you able to give us any indication of what part of the win is being investigated?

 

[maxd]

1. Thanks for the invite to re-read, but I read it very clearly the first time and it just seems when it is a big win there is always some reason to start questioning the winner(players) authenticity but when they took the deposit(s) they didn't need to do any deep(3+week long) investigation

Yes, unfortunately what you say is sometimes true. But as I've said a few times now, this case is not about stalling or trying to get the player to gamble the winnings or any such thing. In fact AFAIK the player can't currently touch those winnings because that win has been frozen pending the outcome from RTG. This case is what it is: a legit investigation based on a number of relevant factors. Bummer, but there it is.

2. It just seems that CM jumps to side with Lock on a few incidents!

Having been involved in most of those issues myself I believe you're right, we have, and would do so again because based on the facts of the case it was justified. There have also been cases where we've told them "sorry, just pay the player" and they've done so.

If you're wondering why these issues have popped up I don't think you need to look much further than Lock's aggressive bonus policy (recently that's changed a little). Big bonuses like that attract all sorts, and some of them have been shysters, to put it bluntly.

Being an honest person myself, I tend to side with the player ....

I am also an honest person and after 2.5 years handling these issues I believe it is a mistake to side with either player or casino until the facts are on the table. There are shit casinos and there are shit players, no way around it. Siding with anyone as a matter of course is not a balanced view, IMHO and no offense intended.

Are you able to give us any indication of what part of the win is being investigated?

No can do, at least not yet. In fact the Lock people are probably pissed at me already for saying as much as I have.

 

[slotjunkie]

Yes, unfortunately what you say is sometimes true. But as I've said a few times now, this case is not about stalling or trying to get the player to gamble the winnings or any such thing. In fact AFAIK the player can't currently touch those winnings because that win has been frozen pending the outcome from RTG. This case is what it is: a legit investigation based on a number of relevant factors. Bummer, but there it is.



Having been involved in most of those issues myself I believe you're right, we have, and would do so again because based on the facts of the case it was justified. There have also been cases where we've told them "sorry, just pay the player" and they've done so.

If you're wondering why these issues have popped up I don't think you need to look much further than Lock's aggressive bonus policy (recently that's changed a little). Big bonuses like that attract all sorts, and some of them have been shysters, to put it bluntly.



I am also an honest person and after 2.5 years handling these issues I believe it is a mistake to side with either player or casino until the facts are on the table. There are shit casinos and there are shit players, no way around it. Siding with anyone as a matter of course is not a balanced view, IMHO and no offense intended.



No can do, at least not yet. In fact the Lock people are probably pissed at me already for saying as much as I have.

Thanks Max!

 

[jetset]

Just reading through this thread makes me wonder again at Max's patience in trying to keep things balanced and pragmatic.

Kudos, Max :notworthy

 

[maxd]

Thanks, but the truth is that this is what's really in my head most of the time:

I should write a piece on the crazy shit I see come through on these PABs, from both the casino and player side, and in such copious helpings too. Much of it would make your hair curl.

Sad, but true. :nod:

 

[Nifty29]

Just reading through this thread makes me wonder again at Max's patience in trying to keep things balanced and pragmatic.

Kudos, Max :notworthy

Ditto Jet

 

[Cant_Get_Right]

Yeah I was wondering why he would say that too! Why can't it simply be the casino is stalling, hoping he/she will play it back and/or trying to create some kind of nonsense to keep from paying him/her all together??? What is it with CM and Lock Casino

This is why I never post praises for a casino. No matter how fast they withdrawal or good support is. There will always be a time where your praised casino. Will look like a rogue. It's okay to state that XYZ processes cashins in 24hrs or what so. But to Praise a Casino because you're feeling joyful. Due to a nice win. Can be a let down to others down the road. Good support and fast cashouts should be the standard at all casinos, with a long track record. Not some start up company. That tries and win a few players. With so-called fast services. And then drop the ball when the big hits starts coming.

 

[vinylweatherman]

The problem is that we DON'T know what is going on in these cases, but we often hear the player's side of the story, and when it comes from someone who has been a member for a while, more weight is given to it.

The OP seems quite taken aback with my suggestion that they might have been "up to something", and pointed out that all they had done was a modified martingale type system on the slots. Now, what exactly is wrong with this, well nothing, so speculation starts to extend to other things, from a stalling tactic to a software malfunction.

I think we can rule out a normal game play audit, this would have been done long ago, and a decision as to whether terms were breached made by now.

Unfortunately, because this is SLOTS play, at least according to the player, we are left wondering just WHAT is both fully justified, and taking so long. The Rushmore investigation was an elaborate fraud involving planted employees supplying copies of other person's documents for use at online casinos to fool the usual verification procedures, and this took a while because the people who allegedly opened the accounts had to be verified IN PERSON by a team of private detectives to ensure it was really them playing, and not some bunch of fraudsters.

The problem here is believing that it is possible that our esteemed fellow member has been a fradster all this time, and has finally been caught out.

Maybe the OP WOULD have been better off using the PAB service, given the size of the win, and the fact that PABs are "unlimited" for accredited casinos.

 

[Nifty29]

This is why I never post praises for a casino. No matter how fast they withdrawal or good support is. There will always be a time where your praised casino. Will look like a rogue. It's okay to state that XYZ processes cashins in 24hrs or what so. But to Praise a Casino because you're feeling joyful. Due to a nice win. Can be a let down to others down the road. Good support and fast cashouts should be the standard at all casinos, with a long track record. Not some start up company. That tries and win a few players. With so-called fast services. And then drop the ball when the big hits starts coming.

With all due respect, did you actually read anything that Max said?

The delay has nothing to do with Lock Casino.....it is RTG where the hold-up is coming from.

Intimating that Lock is 'looking rogue' and 'dropping the ball because of a big win' is drawing a very long bow indeed, and is quite unfair IMO.

Max says the delay is justified. So, you either think Max is full of it or you trust what he says. If its the latter, then Im not sure why you would want to be part of a forum where you dont trust what the people who run it tell you...??

 

[oldtrvlagt]

This is why I never post praises for a casino. No matter how fast they withdrawal or good support is. There will always be a time where your praised casino. Will look like a rogue. It's okay to state that XYZ processes cashins in 24hrs or what so. But to Praise a Casino because you're feeling joyful. Due to a nice win. Can be a let down to others down the road. Good support and fast cashouts should be the standard at all casinos, with a long track record. Not some start up company. That tries and win a few players. With so-called fast services. And then drop the ball when the big hits starts coming.

I respectfully have to say I disagree to a certain point. We all post we when are peeved at a casino for one reason or another....why is it a problem to post a good experience? How are people supposed to know if no one posts a good experience? We can all post disclaimers saying it is "my experience only, don't expect the same results", etc., etc. No one is going to have the same positive as everyone else when it comes to a win. The customer service, withdrawal process, etc., should be the same. People need to take it for what it is worth...the players' own experience.

 

[Pulver]

Feel free to PAB as suits you but I've been in touch with the casino and I believe they have reasonable justification for taking some time to look into this case. They've notified you and the process will take as long as it takes, as these things do. If it all comes out well then you'll be paid. If not ....

As it happens the hold-up isn't at their end, but I'm well aware that that's not really the point.

I've said it before: given the facts in this case investigation is justified, indeed necessary. So, there it is: the investigation will run its course and produce its results.

maxd: Since you say that investigation in this case is justified and necessary I am wondering if they showed you the documentation I sent in and you found them dodgy? I can do whatever it takes to prove my identity to you if that helps the case. Can I send you the scans I sent Lock so you can look at them? I can also give you a call with my cellphone and you can check it up against the phonerecords in Norway? Can I provide you with any other picture or scan of some kind?


The reason I did not PAB was that I not want to "jump to my guns" or whatever it is called, and after reading this:

Feel free to PAB as suits you but I've been in touch with the casino and I believe they have reasonable justification for taking some time to look into this case. They've notified you and the process will take as long as it takes, as these things do

it sounded to me that you were already on the case. But I will certaintly PAB if you recomend me to do that?

vinylweatherman:

Unfortunately, because this is SLOTS play, at least according to the player, we are left wondering just WHAT is both fully justified, and taking so long.

What are you insinuating with "according" to the player? Lock casino or maxd are more then welcome by me to post my entire gameplay here if that helps to bring clarity to the case. I won on the slotscoupon "singlemalt". The game I played and won big on was Paydirt. I then finished the WR of around 70 000 with playing a variety of slots. Ofcourse I am taken aback of your insinuation that im up to something. I just had the biggest win of my life by far, and then three weeks go by, all I hear is that I am under investigation. No word of for what. How do you think it makes my stomach feel to have $21 000 hanging in the blue and "beeing investigated" for unknow reasons and then have other members implying that "there has to be more to the story then what is known".


Now I don't know what I am beeing investigated for. The only way I see it is that they don't belive that I am a "genuine" person or how I should say it, they belive that I broke the T%C of the bonus (this should surely not require a 3 week investigation) or they belive that I have somehow hacked the slot (that is just absurd). Could perhaps you max confirm that I did not break any of the T&C so we have that out of the way?

And just a last note. Did Lock or RTG give any estimated timeframe on this? Are we talking days, weeks or months? And is there any way that Lock casino can lift the IP? ban they placed on my livechat service so that I can regulary check in to see if there has been any updates? Why did they place this ban anyway? Was it to annoying for them to have to answer to me a couple of times a week? (I was very polite, respectfull and used a short time each time). Could you please ask them this max?

 

[maxd]

... Can I send you the scans I sent Lock so you can look at them? ... Can I provide you with any other picture or scan of some kind?

If this were a PAB issue then I could and would get involved to that degree but since you've opted for a non-PAB approach on this I'm not inclined to get any further involved than I already am. I have PABs to work on.

But I will say this: you posted on the boards, I checked with Lock, they explained what was up and where things were at, it all sounded reasonable to me so ... there you are. You're just going to have to wait and see what happens, though I see no reason to be concerned that this is going to take an inordinate amount of time to work itself through.

That said, you going the non-PAB route doesn't give you leave to beat the shit out of Lock here on the boards either. You've said your piece and now you're pretty much going to have to sit on your hands until they get back to you. C'est la vie. Not to put too fine a point on it but next time I'd suggest you think twice before you discard the PAB option so readily.

If you've changed your mind though and are thinking now that the PAB thing might not be such a bad idea then yes, by all means, read the Pitch-A-Bitch FAQ and proceed. Because this has gone on as far as it has there are a lot fewer options available to us than would otherwise have been the case but you've been an active member for a while now so I'll happily accept your PAB, especially since this is an Accredited casino. Keep in mind though that the usual rules apply: once you PAB there is a lock-down on making forum posts regarding your case. It's the PAB or the forums, not both.

And either way this thread title needs to change: as amply demonstrated they are not "stalling" anything.

 

[Pulver]

If this were a PAB issue then I could and would get involved to that degree but since you've opted for a non-PAB approach on this I'm not inclined to get any further involved than I already am. I have PABs to work on.

But I will say this: you posted on the boards, I checked with Lock, they explained what was up and where things were at, it all sounded reasonable to me so ... there you are. You're just going to have to wait and see what happens, though I see no reason to be concerned that this is going to take an inordinate amount of time to work itself through.

That said, you going the non-PAB route doesn't give you leave to beat the shit out of Lock here on the boards either. You've said your piece and now you're pretty much going to have to sit on your hands until they get back to you. C'est la vie. Not to put too fine a point on it but next time I'd suggest you think twice before you discard the PAB option so readily.

If you've changed your mind though and are thinking now that the PAB thing might not be such a bad idea then yes, by all means, read the Pitch-A-Bitch FAQ and proceed. Because this has gone on as far as it has there are a lot fewer options available to us than would otherwise have been the case but you've been an active member for a while now so I'll happily accept your PAB, especially since this is an Accredited casino. Keep in mind though that the usual rules apply: once you PAB there is a lock-down on making forum posts regarding your case. It's the PAB or the forums, not both.

Why didn't you just word it that way the first time around.
I will PAB right away!

 

[TonyT]

Max can twist it up, tie it in a knot all he wants.

The fact is the casino has not kept in touch with the player.

You may know what the semi-facts are but it is plain and simple as to what side you are on Max, Bryan

These casinos help but food on the table for Bryan and help pay for the bills for the mods here.

I know i am outta here after this but know how it works "behind" the scene.

Good luck.

Pulver won legit!

 

[takethemoney]

Max can twist it up, tie it in a knot all he wants.

The fact is the casino has not kept in touch with the player.

You may know what the semi-facts are but it is plain and simple as to what side you are on Max, Bryan

These casinos help but food on the table for Bryan and help pay for the bills for the mods here.

I know i am outta here after this but know how it works "behind" the scene.

Good luck.

Pulver won legit!

I'm sure that's why Max works tirelessly to resolve issues between players and casinos. Next I suppose you would be douchey enough to suggest that the casinos also buy their accreditation here?

Tony, why do you hate this place so much and why are you so ungrateful to Bryan and Max? I hope you don't ever find yourself needing their services, especially after burning bridges.

 

[TonyT]

I'm sure that's why Max works tirelessly to resolve issues between players and casinos. Next I suppose you would be douchey enough to suggest that the casinos also buy their accreditation here?

Tony, why do you hate this place so much and why are you so ungrateful to Bryan and Max? I hope you don't ever find yourself needing their services, especially after burning bridges.

I don't burn bridges, i just know how this game goes.

Bryan hates me for my remark to this casino and thats a fact. I will never need there services as i have more money then brains.

Its just a FACT that CM and the workers here take the side of the casino as they PAY to be here. takethemoney? You only know this side of it NOT the REALLLLLLL side of casino forums., you have been a member here long enough to know whats up.

Plain and simple........... forums make there $$$$$$$$$$ from casinos. Hate me or not its the TRUTH.

 

[lost2much]

Hey Tony, not to fan any flames or anything, but can you produce proof of what you say? I'm sure they have lots of business arrangements with the casinos (running a forum like this takes $$$), but I would hope that they would not stoop to simply shilling for their paying customers. Innocent until proven guilty in my eyes, so it is up to you to produce the proof now Tony.

 

[kakata]

I don't burn bridges, i just know how this game goes.

Bryan hates me for my remark to this casino and thats a fact. I will never need there services as i have more money then brains.

Its just a FACT that CM and the workers here take the side of the casino as they PAY to be here. takethemoney? You only know this side of it NOT the REALLLLLLL side of casino forums., you have been a member here long enough to know whats up.

Plain and simple........... forums make there $$$$$$$$$$ from casinos. Hate me or not its the TRUTH.

....well from your posts,... you dont seem to be THAT MUCH RICH ....JMO

 

[jod5413]

Wow, lots of sarcasm going on here. This entire thread is making my snark-o-meter run off the chart!!

Tony, why do you hate this place so much and why are you so ungrateful to Bryan and Max? I hope you don't ever find yourself needing their services, especially after burning bridges.

Good point, Takethemoney. Tony seems to be a self destructive twit, IMO.

I don't burn bridges, i just know how this game goes.

Bryan hates me for my remark to this casino and thats a fact. I will never need there services as i have more money then brains.

Bryan could care less about you or your self centered posting, and the general all around noise you make. He cares about members that contribute to the forum, not people that just mouth off because they like to "see" themselves speak. IMO

Its just a FACT that CM and the workers here take the side of the casino as they PAY to be here. takethemoney? You only know this side of it NOT the REALLLLLLL side of casino forums., you have been a member here long enough to know whats up.

Plain and simple........... forums make there $$$$$$$$$$ from casinos. Hate me or not its the TRUTH.

Then why don't you end your membership here and spare others having to read your drivel.

Sorry Max, I warned ya though!

 

[slotjunkie]

With all due respect, did you actually read anything that Max said?

The delay has nothing to do with Lock Casino.....it is RTG where the hold-up is coming from.

Intimating that Lock is 'looking rogue' and 'dropping the ball because of a big win' is drawing a very long bow indeed, and is quite unfair IMO.

Max says the delay is justified. So, you either think Max is full of it or you trust what he says. If its the latter, then Im not sure why you would want to be part of a forum where you dont trust what the people who run it tell you...??

With all due respect, does he have to like everything the people who run the forum say??? Maybe he likes reading and chiming in on some of the post!
Who trust everything someone in virtual world says anyway!

 

[Antonia1953]

I don't burn bridges, i just know how this game goes.

Bryan hates me for my remark to this casino and thats a fact. I will never need there services as i have more money then brains.

Its just a FACT that CM and the workers here take the side of the casino as they PAY to be here. takethemoney? You only know this side of it NOT the REALLLLLLL side of casino forums., you have been a member here long enough to know whats up.

Plain and simple........... forums make there $$$$$$$$$$ from casinos. Hate me or not its the TRUTH.

What was the remark? Tell me, so I can decide if I hate you too.

 

[jod5413]

What was the remark? Tell me, so I can decide if I hate you too.

Funny one, Antonia!!

Slotjunkie,

I agree that you can not trust everyone in the internet world. But, if you do not trust this forum's owner and mods, there is not much reason to invest your time here. IMO.

 

[Nifty29]

With all due respect, does he have to like everything the people who run the forum say??? Maybe he likes reading and chiming in on some of the post!
Who trust everything someone in virtual world says anyway!

Someone else who isnt taking the time to read.

I was talking about trusting what Max and Bryan say......not liking it. If you think they are lying (and if you dont trust what they say then that is the implication), then what he hell are you doing here???

Trust is very much about past experience and reputation and, in the case of Max and Bryan, they are pretty much beyond reproach when it comes to resolving legitimate player issues.

 

[maxd]

Max can twist it up, tie it in a knot all he wants.

Such as? Spell it out! Be specific, with quotations.

You're a real piece of work you know that? You have no clue what the details of this case are yet you are magically able to state what the truth at the bottom of it really is and that I'm screwing the OP over cause you know "who's side I'm on". All that and I haven't even started to handle the OP's case yet. That's pretty acute insight you've got there, or perhaps you are just talking out of your arse, again.

How many hundreds of player issues do you resolve each year? How many millions of dollars do you get back into player's hand in the process. About sweet FA, yes? Right, well when you do then you can start making pronouncements about who's corrupt and manipulative and who's cheating whom.

You narrowly escaped the chop last time and were oh so grateful for it for about 15 minutes. Now this crap, and the old "casino calls the tune" rubbish to boot.

At least you could try to be a little imaginative with your smears and innuendo. I've been hearing that bullshit whinge for over a decade and it is the same thing now as it has ever been: the piss and moan of belligerent ignorance.

 

[bernynhel]

...Indeed, the delays are the reason this thread exists, but as stated earlier that delay is basically beyond Lock's control at the moment...

My comment, "No matter the outcome, this thread only exists because Lock has been dicking the OP around for 3 weeks. If a casino can't be completely forthcoming with a customer regarding the status of the cashout, on a daily basis, if it so pleases the customer, then the casino deserves to have its business put out in the street and embellished by all of the paranoia, fully warranted by the ample time the OP has had to develop it." , was in reference to Pulver's complaint that Lock was not doing anything to keep open a clear channel of communications, not the seemingly, unusually long time the investigation is taking. It's one thing that the issue required escalation to RTG for assessment, and if it requires this amount of time, fine, but quite another for Lock to give Pulver the impression that his daily anxiety over this isn't worth their time on a daily basis and I have no reason to doubt Pulver's word that this has been his experience, as it would be mine, also. The OP only knows he deposited, played and cashed out at Lock, not at RTG, and it' Lock's responsibility to appease the OP. Again, if Lock had been on their J.O.B. in this respect, I can't fathom that this thread would exist.

...I realize that may not be what you want to hear -- soooo much easier and more satisfying to blame Lock -- but if you want to deal with the reality of the situation...

Again, within the criteria I explained where Lock owns responsibility - keeping the OP posted on what is transpiring, even if only to say, "WE don't know, RTG hasn't got back to us since last time you called.", there is no place else to pass the buck beyond Lock.

I know you deal in huge volumes of this kind of sitch, Max , but geez, we don't and it is enough money to have any member do a little nail-biting over, given the time frame and assuming the OPs complaint of the lack of communication on Lock's park is not disingenuous.

And if it were me in the same situation, there are individuals posting to this thread I would hope would just not post to mine if they can't give a fellow player the fkn support of the benefit of doubt vs the house, fer crissake!!!

@ Pulver: Assuming you've presented yourself fair and square in this forum, whatever the outcome of this "investigation", you have not been treated properly by any stretch of the imagination during the course of it by the people at Lock. And until such a time anyone can prove differently, I'm 100% with you.

...How do you think it makes my stomach feel to have $21 000 hanging in the blue and "being investigated" for unknown reasons and then have other members implying that "there has to be more to the story then what is known"...

I feel ya! And I'm, to be perfectly honest, I am more than just a little embarrassed that there aren't more of our fellow CM members that do, as well.

Why didn't you just word it that way the first time around.
I will PAB right away!

Again, I know you do this all day Max, and I appreciate what you do, but, given the language differences, I had doubted that Pulver could have fully understood your exact position on the urgency to PAB at this point in the thread. IMO a little more firmness and a little less ambiguity than in post #11 might have been more helpful to Pulver. Of course, I had to wait for Pulver to confirm my thoughts on this (above) before mentioning it as I didn't want to assume how Pulver might have been reading you. Again, I know you do a lot and it's not unreasonable for you to take certain aspects of the process for granted, but for Pulver, this is, understandably, a very big deal.

...The fact is the casino has not kept in touch with the player...Pulver won legit!

Whether or not I agree with your other statements or opinions, I support your right to express them and I applaud that you are definitely down for Pulver on this, right or wrong. If you are, indeed, "outta here after this", and it's not your own decision, I would be surprised as I can't see any justification for it in this thread, at least.


I consider all the posts which are little more than member's opinions of what their fellow members post and their opinions that go so far as to judge whether or not their fellow member's posts have a right to even exist, appalling. They are certainly not helpful and if I were the kind of petty SOB prone to "neg rep" posts, I am unhappy to say I see a few I might consider. "Thanks" to posts that do nothng but bag on another member fall into this category, as well, and more closely mimics the behavior of a member of a mob than a member of a forum. Sometimes I think there are those, here, who would be happier in a real mob vs a virtual one, complete with hoods over their heads and torches and shit. I'm not going to quote anyone or name names but to whomever it may concern: Please keep my name out of your mouths. TY.