Payment Pending Period and Casino Rating

[zippy]

Hi All,

In regards to the operational standards that accredited casino's are measured on I think there needs to be a greater emphasis placed on timely payments.

There really should not be any payment pending period when making a withdrawl. There is no pending period when witdrawing from land based casino's, so why do we tolerate it from online casinos? If you have won the money fairly then there is no absolutely no reason for casino's to place a pending period, other than to encourage you to re-gamble.

I will call out 32Red who have a pending period of 24hrs excluding weekends and no manually flushing, which means if you withdrew money late on a Friday night, then the payment would not be processed until Tuesday (3 days later). Yet this casino has a 9.1 rating....

Any casino that has a payment pending period should have their rating reduced drastically.

What do you guys think?

Thanks
Zippy

 

[Jakestar]

Totally agree! The biggest reason why I switched my main casino to GUTS is their 2 hour withdrawals, and that was from PartyCasino who pay within 24 hours all the time. Still fast compared to most, but even so, the faster the better, the place I will play.

 

[Tirilej]

I guess you must have missed the earlier threads about the exact same subject.
If you search for them you will also get to read his opinions.

Here you have how Bryan are rating accredited casinos.
https://www.casinomeister.com/rating-system-explanation/

 

[zippy]

I guess you must have missed the earlier threads about the exact same subject.
If you search for them you will also get to read his opinions.

Here you have how Bryan are rating accredited casinos.
https://www.casinomeister.com/rating-system-explanation/

Couldn't find Brian's post on the subject, but the fact that nothing has changed makes me question whether he places enough weighting on this issue when accrediting casino's.

 

[Tirilej]

Couldn't find Brian's post on the subject, but the fact that nothing has changed makes me question whether he places enough weighting on this issue when accrediting casino's.

For instance 32Red have lost points because of this, and others too I guess.
Maybe you don't agree with how Bryan rates them but I guess you probably have to accept that he don't look at only payout time but a lot of more things, which you could read about in the link.

He is on the road right now for a few days more so you probably need to wait for a more clear answer until he's back

 

[dunover]

You will notice that aside from 32red due to their safety, customer service and historical achievements that virtually ALL the 9+ rated sites actually DO have very fast withdrawals so obviously Bryan must have factored this in.

 

[AffGency]

totally agree with OP

They take our money right away , but they pay us with a delay

As we see at other Casinos .. it is possible to handle like this

I just hate to wait for the money i won where i put MY OWN money on line which i work hard for

32Red was anyhow the last time i played ... still waiting for my cashout of 12.5k

Its not nice to play with our habit and try to make us play more as we want

I would not say anything if they take the money with a 24hrs delay , where we still break up the payment process


best way shld be escrow payments where casinos get e-wallet payments after they pay us

 

[dunover]

totally agree with OP

They take our money right away , but they pay us with a delay

As we see at other Casinos .. it is possible to handle like this

I just hate to wait for the money i won where i put MY OWN money on line which i work hard for

32Red was anyhow the last time i played ... still waiting for my cashout of 12.5k

Its not nice to play with our habit and try to make us play more as we want

I would not say anything if they take the money with a 24hrs delay , where we still break up the payment process


best way shld be escrow payments where casinos get e-wallet payments after they pay us

Yes. Try going and opening a casino on that basis. Sorry but that's utterly ludicrous.
So, the casino would have no cash-flow. They wouldn't be able to use your deposit to pay the last winner and so-on.
Then imagine the fraud and chargebacks that would occur from losing players. KYC and finances would be effectively removed from the casinos' control.
Then what happens if a player won big (30k) and as per the casino's terms would need paying at say 10k a week for 3 weeks?
The player had deposited 5k so the casino would not be able to use that money for other winners until the 30k had been paid?
Your assumption is that most casinos are inherently dishonest and should not be trusted without nannying. Almost an insult to the casinos and reps on here.

Please for your sake don't try to run an online casino business.

 

[zippy]

For instance 32Red have lost points because of this, and others too I guess.
Maybe you don't agree with how Bryan rates them but I guess you probably have to accept that he don't look at only payout time but a lot of more things, which you could read about in the link.

He is on the road right now for a few days more so you probably need to wait for a more clear answer until he's back

From what I recall 32Red's rating was reduced from 9.5 to 9.1 for implementing a pending period and removing manual flushing.

I'm suggesting that greater emphasis needs to be placed pending periods when rating casino's.
All casino's that have a pending period should not have score above say 8. This would then possibly encourage them to remove pending periods in order to be able have a rating greater than 9.

By giving casino's ratings above 9 for processing payments in 24 hours we are simply accepting that pending period are ok. They're not.
If you deposit money, play, win and then withdraw you should not be forced to wait. Doesn't make sense.

I hope Bryan reviews the rating system in order to encourage change that is in the best interests of players.

Thanks

 

[silcnlayc]

From what I recall 32Red's rating was reduced from 9.5 to 9.1 for implementing a pending period and removing manual flushing.

I'm suggesting that greater emphasis needs to be placed pending periods when rating casino's.
All casino's that have a pending period should not have score above say 8. This would then possibly encourage them to remove pending periods in order to be able have a rating greater than 9.

By giving casino's ratings above 9 for processing payments in 24 hours we are simply accepting that pending period are ok. They're not.
If you deposit money, play, win and then withdraw you should not be forced to wait. Doesn't make sense.

I hope Bryan reviews the rating system in order to encourage change that is in the best interests of players.

Thanks

I would give all casinos a 10 if they processed in 24 hours. Seriously, you are upset at THIS time frame???? What are you going to do if and when casinos go to 7 day waiting time to process or 30 days to receive funds??? No one thought it would happen but it has started.....called changes.....But seriously....you are upset over 24 hours????.....::::shaking head side to side::::

.

 

[AffGency]

Yes. Try going and opening a casino on that basis. Sorry but that's utterly ludicrous.
So, the casino would have no cash-flow. They wouldn't be able to use your deposit to pay the last winner and so-on.
Then imagine the fraud and chargebacks that would occur from losing players. KYC and finances would be effectively removed from the casinos' control.
Then what happens if a player won big (30k) and as per the casino's terms would need paying at say 10k a week for 3 weeks?
The player had deposited 5k so the casino would not be able to use that money for other winners until the 30k had been paid?
Your assumption is that most casinos are inherently dishonest and should not be trusted without nannying. Almost an insult to the casinos and reps on here.

Please for your sake don't try to run an online casino business.

Sorry but it seems you have no understanding of a healthy run business

Operators who has legal Licences not such as Curacao and Antigua are bond to keep players Balances segregated to their cash flow.

If you are going to open a Playtech Casino than you do not get the deposits anyhow right away as Playtech will distribute them in 4 to 6 weeks. So as you see ... Operators do not have cash anyhow right away after a Players deposit in their hand... So pls DO NOT OPEN a casino anytime, as you would go broke if you think that player deposits helps your cash flow !!!

I have seen over the years many small operators who was thinking exactly the same like you to go bankrupt ... as they counted the deposits Player do into their cash flow

 

[dunover]

From what I recall 32Red's rating was reduced from 9.5 to 9.1 for implementing a pending period and removing manual flushing.

I'm suggesting that greater emphasis needs to be placed pending periods when rating casino's.
All casino's that have a pending period should not have score above say 8. This would then possibly encourage them to remove pending periods in order to be able have a rating greater than 9.

By giving casino's ratings above 9 for processing payments in 24 hours we are simply accepting that pending period are ok. They're not.
If you deposit money, play, win and then withdraw you should not be forced to wait. Doesn't make sense.

I hope Bryan reviews the rating system in order to encourage change that is in the best interests of players.

Thanks

I agree with your sentiments, but it's impractical. It sounds like you think the weighting is too little on casinos with >24hrs pending and not 24/7. You cannot score 32red at 8 behind some far less secure and established sites. You also assume that the accredited casinos will implement these costlier measures based just on CM accredited status and membership - we here are only a tiny minority of their players and sometimes we overestimate our presence as we only see things through this forum.
It may be worth remembering that on here we only see the select casinos and as such the minority of the thousands that exist, so we are judging by a very high mark to start with. Go outside CM and compare 32red or other download MG sites with the tens of Cassava/888 sites with 72-hour pending, or multitudes of Playtech sites with a 96-hour pending, and there are far worse too starting at 10 days for US players.

The fact is we are spoilt here and forget what it's like outside CM.

On here we know the payment scales for the accredited sites. If that's your prime concern, don't play at the 'slower' ones.

 

[Tirilej]

From what I recall 32Red's rating was reduced from 9.5 to 9.1 for implementing a pending period and removing manual flushing.

I'm suggesting that greater emphasis needs to be placed pending periods when rating casino's.
All casino's that have a pending period should not have score above say 8. This would then possibly encourage them to remove pending periods in order to be able have a rating greater than 9.

By giving casino's ratings above 9 for processing payments in 24 hours we are simply accepting that pending period are ok. They're not.
If you deposit money, play, win and then withdraw you should not be forced to wait. Doesn't make sense.

I hope Bryan reviews the rating system in order to encourage change that is in the best interests of players.

Thanks

I wish it was that simple. That casinos would change their payout times after how they are rated here. It doesn't work like that

This isn't the center of the universe and sure they can get a lot of good or bad reputation from here, but keep in mind that most players probably don't read this forum. What you instead would do is to lower the reputation for a great group just because they don't pay fast enough.
I don't think that would be fair either.

 

[zippy]

I would give all casinos a 10 if they processed in 24 hours. Seriously, you are upset at THIS time frame???? What are you going to do if and when casinos go to 7 day waiting time to process or 30 days to receive funds??? No one thought it would happen but it has started.....called changes.....But seriously....you are upset over 24 hours????.....::::shaking head side to side::::

.

I'm not upset. Rather, I want casinomeister to hold casino's to account on this issue.

You seem to merely accept these payment period changes the casino's are implementing.....maybe a senior member you should be questioning them....how else can we get change...::::shaking head side to side::::

If casino's I play at moved to 7 day pending periods I would stop playing and go back to land based casino's.

 

[AffGency]

I do think that casinomeister has a weight here when it comes to reputable Casinos ... just because every casino operator who is listed here is proud of their reputation ... the ones who not are coming with the phrase ... not the center of the universe ... obv. to make them sleep at night

I think you under estemate the power of bryan a bit, if he puts them down to 8.5 he will get a ring in 5 minutes and they will ask him why he did that .... and thats a fact .

You need to remeber that Casinos are not your friend or anything close to that, they want your money and they want you to loose it, in a business like this reputation is worth gold... how many people are just looking to find some infos and they dont register here or take part of any conversation !!!

If we start now to complain about this 24hrs freeze period than we encvourage other casinos who wants their business to change this ...

As this is said, any MG Casino with a cash out of 12 hours max. 24/7 has my business

 

[rshkrn]

I would give all casinos a 10 if they processed in 24 hours. Seriously, you are upset at THIS time frame???? What are you going to do if and when casinos go to 7 day waiting time to process or 30 days to receive funds??? No one thought it would happen but it has started.....called changes.....But seriously....you are upset over 24 hours????.....::::shaking head side to side::::

.

rather than that it should be a % of the withdrawal....in slabs maybe....

 

[zippy]

I agree with your sentiments, but it's impractical. It sounds like you think the weighting is too little on casinos with >24hrs pending and not 24/7. You cannot score 32red at 8 behind some far less secure and established sites. You also assume that the accredited casinos will implement these costlier measures based just on CM accredited status and membership - we here are only a tiny minority of their players and sometimes we overestimate our presence as we only see things through this forum.
It may be worth remembering that on here we only see the select casinos and as such the minority of the thousands that exist, so we are judging by a very high mark to start with. Go outside CM and compare 32red or other download MG sites with the tens of Cassava/888 sites with 72-hour pending, or multitudes of Playtech sites with a 96-hour pending, and there are far worse too starting at 10 days for US players.

The fact is we are spoilt here and forget what it's like outside CM.

On here we know the payment scales for the accredited sites. If that's your prime concern, don't play at the 'slower' ones.

I'm not just scoring 32Red at 8, rather all casino's that have pending periods (this would cover 99.9%)

I understand we have little power, but why reward casino's with a good rating when they have pending periods.

You have to start somewhere.

Maybe Bryan or other senior members have other suggestions on how we can encourage change, rather than simply accept the status quo.

 

[dunover]

Sorry but it seems you have no understanding of a healthy run business

Operators who has legal Licences not such as Curacao and Antigua are bond to keep players Balances segregated to their cash flow.
If you are going to open a Playtech Casino than you do not get the deposits anyhow right away as Playtech will distribute them in 4 to 6 weeks. So as you see ... Operators do not have cash anyhow right away after a Players deposit in their hand... So pls DO NOT OPEN a casino anytime, as you would go broke if you think that player deposits helps your cash flow !!!

I have seen over the years many small operators who was thinking exactly the same like you to go bankrupt ... as they counted the deposits Player do into their cash flow

Yeah, and so were MetroPlay and Purple Lounge with Maltese and UK licenses respectively.
And if Playtech hold for 4-6 weeks where do you think the deposits go after that? The cash flow!

The SOLE cash income of any casino is deposits. This is how they pay players. The deposits at whichever stage form their cash flow.

 

[AffGency]

Yeah, and so were MetroPlay and Purple Lounge with Maltese and UK licenses respectively.
And if Playtech hold for 4-6 weeks where do you think the deposits go after that? The cash flow!

The SOLE cash income of any casino is deposits. This is how they pay players. The deposits at whichever stage form their cash flow.

thanks for prooving my point here ...

MetroPlay has lost their licenced because of that , PurpleLounge went to bankrupt .... there is a bit more to the stories but anyhow ..

You said, first, Players deposit pays the other one ... this indicates that they use deposits right away ... ofc at one point it adds to the cash flow, but not right away ... and as we was talking about delays, it makes your Post not coming even close to the real world of online casinos.

I understand your point too.. but Im not sos ure why you want to protect a Casino which has a 24hrs reverse withdrawl time to encourage you playing more as you want or is good for you ? Dont you want your cash asap ? If yes, why we dont try to push them togheter for this .

I just quit a casino and closed my account because of latw cashouts and i have told them ... need to say I deposit a bit more as avergae and they call me and write me since than to reopen it and they shorten the time from 3 days to 24hrs max. in a week for me ... but im not reopen it as 24 hrs is still way too bad ..

 

[Jono777]

I guess you must have missed the earlier threads about the exact same subject.
If you search for them you will also get to read his opinions.

Here you have how Bryan are rating accredited casinos.
https://www.casinomeister.com/rating-system-explanation/

Soon as I saw this thread title I saw (32) Red and jumped for the 'reply to thread' button, guess I'll have to get out of bed earlier - Nice 1

 

[citizenx]

Totally agree! The biggest reason why I switched my main casino to GUTS is their 2 hour withdrawals, and that was from PartyCasino who pay within 24 hours all the time. Still fast compared to most, but even so, the faster the better, the place I will play.

Guts are *normally* very good with withdrawl times - although they should be as they charge you for them.

However, yesterday I was required to send documents as i'd withdrawn over 2,300 EUR (I play in sterling).

Anyway, I sent them and nearly 24 hours later i'm still waiting. I checked yesterday how long this would take and was told that it would probably be tomorrow (i.e. today) and having just checked again was told "we'll get back to you today".

I'm really not very happy about this. All it takes is a few moments for someone to ensure they're satisfied with what they've been sent (and all other casinos have always been satisfied with my documents so have no reason to think Guts won't be).

 

[AffGency]

Guts are *normally* very good with withdrawl times - although they should be as they charge you for them.

However, yesterday I was required to send documents as i'd withdrawn over 2,300 EUR (I play in sterling).

Anyway, I sent them and nearly 24 hours later i'm still waiting. I checked yesterday how long this would take and was told that it would probably be tomorrow (i.e. today) and having just checked again was told "we'll get back to you today".

I'm really not very happy about this. All it takes is a few moments for someone to ensure they're satisfied with what they've been sent (and all other casinos have always been satisfied with my documents so have no reason to think Guts won't be).

problem is , it is easter monday in Malta and there is no way anyone is working .. bad timing a bit, but they normally pay you very fast even on weekends and public holidays

 

[pmutts]

I agree 100 Percent.

Hi All,

In regards to the operational standards that accredited casino's are measured on I think there needs to be a greater emphasis placed on timely payments.

There really should not be any payment pending period when making a withdrawl. There is no pending period when witdrawing from land based casino's, so why do we tolerate it from online casinos? If you have won the money fairly then there is no absolutely no reason for casino's to place a pending period, other than to encourage you to re-gamble.

I will call out 32Red who have a pending period of 24hrs excluding weekends and no manually flushing, which means if you withdrew money late on a Friday night, then the payment would not be processed until Tuesday (3 days later). Yet this casino has a 9.1 rating....

Any casino that has a payment pending period should have their rating reduced drastically.

What do you guys think?

Thanks
Zippy

I completely agree with this post. I know Bryan factors in pending periods on ratings--but in my view, any pending period in excess of 2 hours is excessive--especially when "manual flush" is not an option. As an American, I have never had the privilege of being FLUSHED.

All I know is that every hour it sits in pending/reversible status I'm less likely to ever see the money. Sure, blame it on me. Call me weak. Tell me I have a gambling problem. Well, I have NEVER had a problem taking 5 to 10K off the Blackjack Tables at Caesars Palace or the Mirage--to name two of my favorites--taking it to the Cage, and walking out with it--and yes, bringing it back to Texas. The same holds true for hitting a Royal in Louisiana, or Oklahoma and I've hit a few worth from 1K to 4K and I take the money and RUN.

I have stated MANY times in this forum that the reversal period is by far the biggest weapon the online casinos have in their arsenal to massively increase their profits to obscene levels. I doubt 75% of the casinos operating online today would still be in business if they were unable to employ this tactic.

 

[Matti]

totally agree with OP

They take our money right away , but they pay us with a delay

As we see at other Casinos .. it is possible to handle like this

I just hate to wait for the money i won where i put MY OWN money on line which i work hard for

32Red was anyhow the last time i played ... still waiting for my cashout of 12.5k

Its not nice to play with our habit and try to make us play more as we want

I would not say anything if they take the money with a 24hrs delay , where we still break up the payment process


best way shld be escrow payments where casinos get e-wallet payments after they pay us

I think you got this wrong. Casinos, like most merchants, has to wait for the credit card deposits to be available to them. This can take up to a week before they are released from the bank and end up in the casinos account.

 

[dunover]

thanks for prooving my point here ...

MetroPlay has lost their licenced because of that , PurpleLounge went to bankrupt .... there is a bit more to the stories but anyhow ..

You said, first, Players deposit pays the other one ... this indicates that they use deposits right away ... ofc at one point it adds to the cash flow, but not right away ... and as we was talking about delays, it makes your Post not coming even close to the real world of online casinos.

I understand your point too.. but Im not sos ure why you want to protect a Casino which has a 24hrs reverse withdrawl time to encourage you playing more as you want or is good for you ? Dont you want your cash asap ? If yes, why we dont try to push them togheter for this .

I just quit a casino and closed my account because of latw cashouts and i have told them ... need to say I deposit a bit more as avergae and they call me and write me since than to reopen it and they shorten the time from 3 days to 24hrs max. in a week for me ... but im not reopen it as 24 hrs is still way too bad ..

OK, we agree that deposits DO form a casino's cash flow - it's just a question of how long the delay is before these deposits go in the pot. No arguments there from me. I mentioned Metroplay and Purple Lounge because you insinuated Costa Rica and Curacao were less safe than European LGA's. It turns out that ALL LGA's are effectively toothless, as these events show that despite their rules NO player's money is totally safe!
Yes, these casinos did lose their licences but what was the point? The crooks had already done a runner with the players' funds anyway so there were effectively no safeguards in place.

As for 24 hour pending, you know the rules before depositing. It's a free market. If a player doesn't like it, don't deposit there. A 24-hour pending site may have lower costs therefore better and more frequent bonuses. Tournaments too. I agree I'd like every site to pay fast 24/7 but it just isn't going to happen. 32red for example will have been hit far harder than other sites by the UK gaming tax, as they have at least 50% UK player base.

 

[AffGency]

I think you got this wrong. Casinos, like most merchants, has to wait for the credit card deposits to be available to them. This can take up to a week before they are released from the bank and end up in the casinos account.

why ? what did i get wrong ?

i never use CC to make a deposit , i use e-wallets

 

[pmutts]

Yes. Try going and opening a casino on that basis. Sorry but that's utterly ludicrous.
So, the casino would have no cash-flow. They wouldn't be able to use your deposit to pay the last winner and so-on.
Then imagine the fraud and chargebacks that would occur from losing players. KYC and finances would be effectively removed from the casinos' control.
Then what happens if a player won big (30k) and as per the casino's terms would need paying at say 10k a week for 3 weeks?
The player had deposited 5k so the casino would not be able to use that money for other winners until the 30k had been paid?
Your assumption is that most casinos are inherently dishonest and should not be trusted without nannying. Almost an insult to the casinos and reps on here.

Please for your sake don't try to run an online casino business.

With all due respect, I think you are way off on this one. If they do not have the money to cover immediate payment (within reason -- with max weekly withdrawals) they have NO business operating an Online Casino. If they do have to pay in installments, the player should be able to insist that the withdrawal be removed from pending status and irreversible until paid in full.

And yes dunover, we know what we are getting into when we deposit. Although with very few exceptions (Club World Group sometimes) here in the States do we EVER see a withdrawal pulled from "Pending/Reversible" status within 24 hours. In my view, this is not the point the OP is attempting to make. He's stating what he feels and what most other players feel--especially from the US. ONE REASON ALONE--In hopes it will be played back and sadly it so often is.

 

[AffGency]

OK, we agree that deposits DO form a casino's cash flow - it's just a question of how long the delay is before these deposits go in the pot. No arguments there from me. I mentioned Metroplay and Purple Lounge because you insinuated Costa Rica and Curacao were less safe than European LGA's. It turns out that ALL LGA's are effectively toothless, as these events show that despite their rules NO player's money is totally safe!
Yes, these casinos did lose their licences but what was the point? The crooks had already done a runner with the players' funds anyway so there were effectively no safeguards in place.

As for 24 hour pending, you know the rules before depositing. It's a free market. If a player doesn't like it, don't deposit there. A 24-hour pending site may have lower costs therefore better and more frequent bonuses. Tournaments too. I agree I'd like every site to pay fast 24/7 but it just isn't going to happen. 32red for example will have been hit far harder than other sites by the UK gaming tax, as they have at least 50% UK player base.

Yes, i didnt check 100% before, i just read they pay in few hours in few threads, but they changed it all... anyhow its a free market but still if its possible to change this .. it would be great, i never take any Bonus anyhow .. as i lost few times big wins


Anyhow .. another question, the Forum does not let me post before i read all my private messages in my Inbox ... how can I change this ?

thanks for any help

 

[zippy]

Once Bryan is back is it possible to get his updated view (if any) / leadership on this issue?

 

[citizenx]

problem is , it is easter monday in Malta and there is no way anyone is working .. bad timing a bit, but they normally pay you very fast even on weekends and public holidays

Fully appreciate that but they do have staff in. I think it would have been better if i'd been able to send my documents months ago to be honest.

You're right, they do always pay out quickly normally. I just feel a bit narked that its now approaching 24 hours which i think is excessive at any point in the year.

 

[pmutts]

To have even a prayer at 24 Hours . . .

I must be:

1) Playing at a Club World Casino
2) I must be playing on Sun, Mon, Tue, or early Wednesday.

It seems like no matter what it always manages to get held in pending over the weekend. A couple of Cocktails. The decision is made to just reverse $100. Another cocktail and another $100. Before you know it it's GONE. Just Sayin'

.

 

[Matti]

why ? what did i get wrong ?

i never use CC to make a deposit , i use e-wallets

OK, sorry. This of course doesn't apply for e-wallets. You however didn't state that the post was just about e-wallet deposits.

 

[Tirilej]

Once Bryan is back is it possible to get his updated view (if any) / leadership on this issue?

Of course you will. Either by sending him a pm with a link to this thread or by reporting one of the posts and ask that he respond.
People do often want his responce but forget to tell him where or why

 

[dunover]

With all due respect, I think you are way off on this one. If they do not have the money to cover immediate payment (within reason -- with max weekly withdrawals) they have NO business operating an Online Casino. If they do have to pay in installments, the player should be able to insist that the withdrawal be removed from pending status and irreversible until paid in full.
And yes dunover, we know what we are getting into when we deposit. Although with very few exceptions (Club World Group sometimes) here in the States do we EVER see a withdrawal pulled from "Pending/Reversible" status within 24 hours. In my view, this is not the point the OP is attempting to make. He's stating what he feels and what most other players feel--especially from the US. ONE REASON ALONE--In hopes it will be played back and sadly it so often is.

I'm not disagreeing with either of those points I bolded. In fact I wrote a much-thanked piece on exactly the philosophy behind reverse-periods:
https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...gs-at-32red-due-to-pending-withdrawals.65664/

My argument is solely that cash-flow regardless of delays is vital to any viable business casinos included. The deposits are their income, sole income. There has to be some provision for the unexpected, like a string of big hits and withdrawals therefore aside from deposits in hand there should be cash reserves made from previous profits on the balance sheet. This is obviously why many have instalments in their terms. Often the pending period allows for a casino that has been hit with large wins to accumulate the funds to pay. I think many would be surprised at how tight the margins are at some sites.

 

[zippy]

Of course you will. Either by sending him a pm with a link to this thread or by reporting one of the posts and ask that he respond.
People do often want his responce but forget to tell him where or why

I've sent Bryan a PM. Hopefully get a response and see what his view is....

 

[citizenx]

Guts are *normally* very good with withdrawl times - although they should be as they charge you for them.

However, yesterday I was required to send documents as i'd withdrawn over 2,300 EUR (I play in sterling).

Anyway, I sent them and nearly 24 hours later i'm still waiting. I checked yesterday how long this would take and was told that it would probably be tomorrow (i.e. today) and having just checked again was told "we'll get back to you today".

I'm really not very happy about this. All it takes is a few moments for someone to ensure they're satisfied with what they've been sent (and all other casinos have always been satisfied with my documents so have no reason to think Guts won't be).

Account now verified and payment received. Thank you Guts!

 

[hedgehok]

SLOW DOWN PLEASE:

honestly this thread grows so rapidly.

To the subject: There is no easy way to handle this because it's highly subjective.

A player who is not prone to reversals will weight a pending-period very little another (maybe compulsive) gambler will weight much more. It's up to everyone else to read how the rating-system works and if you don't like reversal times just don't play at that casino.
All MG-download casinos like 32red have a pending period and process their withdrawals after the pending period elapsed and then flush the withdrawal, then it often takes another day or two until the withdrawal is processed. That's at least inconvenient but it should not have an impact like over 1 rating-point when you try to be objective.

We are all old enough to gamble, let us also be old enough to do our necessary researching before start playing.
Moaning after reversals are done are not the way this works.

 

[citizenx]

SLOW DOWN PLEASE:

honestly this thread grows so rapidly.

To the subject: There is no easy way to handle this because it's highly subjective.

A player who is not prone to reversals will weight a pending-period very little another (maybe compulsive) gambler will weight much more. It's up to everyone else to read how the rating-system works and if you don't like reversal times just don't play at that casino.
All MG-download casinos like 32red have a pending period and process their withdrawals after the pending period elapsed and then flush the withdrawal, then it often takes another day or two until the withdrawal is processed. That's at least inconvenient but it should not have an impact like over 1 rating-point when you try to be objective.

We are all old enough to gamble, let us also be old enough to do our necessary researching before start playing.
Moaning after reversals are done are not the way this works.

I tend to agree. Personally, I only play casinos with a prompt payout record. Not just because of the possibility of reversing - if you do it, don't moan about it - its your choice.

I remember when I won $8,500 on Aladdinsgold last summer and reversed more of it than i'd have liked to on balance. That was my own fault but as a general rule, I don't do it.

I prefer fast payouts as I don't feel like i've really won til its in my neteller account (i.e. available for use as cash, for purchases or to deposit elsewhere).

Ultimately, the information is available in the casino listing. The only concern I have about that is - how up to date is the information? I can't seem to find a "last updated" field and I think that would be helpful.

 

[zippy]

SLOW DOWN PLEASE:

honestly this thread grows so rapidly.

To the subject: There is no easy way to handle this because it's highly subjective.

A player who is not prone to reversals will weight a pending-period very little another (maybe compulsive) gambler will weight much more. It's up to everyone else to read how the rating-system works and if you don't like reversal times just don't play at that casino.
All MG-download casinos like 32red have a pending period and process their withdrawals after the pending period elapsed and then flush the withdrawal, then it often takes another day or two until the withdrawal is processed. That's at least inconvenient but it should not have an impact like over 1 rating-point when you try to be objective.

We are all old enough to gamble, let us also be old enough to do our necessary researching before start playing.
Moaning after reversals are done are not the way this works.

Why even accept the fact there a reversal periods? Why not challenge them and say they are fundamentally unfair if you have won the money fairly. It's your money why do you have wait for it? Why should we be inconvenienced when withdrawing, when the casino is not when depositing.

This shouldn't be an issue about whether we can hold off long enough to not re-gamble during pending periods. There should be no pending periods, and if a casino does have them then their rating should be reduced.

It's easy to say don't play there if you don't like it. This attitude simply allows casino's to do what like...i.e. 32Red started with no weekend withdrawls, then pending periods, then no manual flushing, what next?

Why stand for things which work against the player?

 

[AffGency]

Why even accept the fact there a reversal periods? Why not challenge them and say they are fundamentally unfair if you have won the money fairly. It's your money why do you have wait for it? Why should we be inconvenienced when withdrawing, when the casino is not when depositing.

This shouldn't be an issue about whether we can hold off long enough to not re-gamble during pending periods. There should be no pending periods, and if a casino does have them then their rating should be reduced.

It's easy to say don't play there if you don't like it. This attitude simply allows casino's to do what like...i.e. 32Red started with no weekend withdrawls, then pending periods, then no manual flushing, what next?

Why stand for things which work against the player?

I think you are right Sir

If we don't act before it gets out of hand and why not reducing their rate if it helps ?

otherwise 32Red and all other Casinos should come and say, Guys if we don't do it we need to close down !!! Which i think it's not the case

 

[Jono777]

My withdrawal has sat pending at 32 Red since Thursday and until now this is the 1st time I've even thought about it.

What a good boy I am

 

[zippy]

My withdrawal has sat pending at 32 Red since Thursday and until now this is the 1st time I've even thought about it.

What a good boy I am

Don't log in...you'll probably end up playing and losing....

 

[Valhalla]

The only reason any casino has a pending period is in the hope players will reverse their withdrawal and subsequently lose.
Because they've already been mentioned here, I'll say - 32Red stopped doing weekend payouts, but then realised they still weren't making enough money, so stopped manual flushing, but still decided it wasn't earning them enough and finally added a 24-hour pending period as well (I'm not sure what order those last 2 changes were made because I jumped ship long before that).

I can't imagine how much they've earned on the strength of "weak" players who still love the site but don't have the willpower to wait out the pending period, and often the entire weekend and even holidays as well.

I don't blame 32Red of course. They were the standard bearer for years, but the casino industry has reached a saturation point with countless browser-based multi-platform casinos, many of whom payout before 32Red have even looked at a player's withdrawal.
I'm sure that alone cost them a lot of customers, what with them being MG-only and well behind the times. So they had to make changes to cut costs and increase revenue. What better way than to implement an archaic payment system that sees the players do the cost-cutting for them? Saves them improving the casino and trying to move forward with the times.
That sort of thing would only cost them money, after all

 

[dunover]

The only reason any casino has a pending period is in the hope players will reverse their withdrawal and subsequently lose.
Because they've already been mentioned here, I'll say - 32Red stopped doing weekend payouts, but then realised they still weren't making enough money, so stopped manual flushing, but still decided it wasn't earning them enough and finally added a 24-hour pending period as well (I'm not sure what order those last 2 changes were made because I jumped ship long before that).

I can't imagine how much they've earned on the strength of "weak" players who still love the site but don't have the willpower to wait out the pending period, and often the entire weekend and even holidays as well.

I don't blame 32Red of course. They were the standard bearer for years, but the casino industry has reached a saturation point with countless browser-based multi-platform casinos, many of whom payout before 32Red have even looked at a player's withdrawal.
I'm sure that alone cost them a lot of customers, what with them being MG-only and well behind the times. So they had to make changes to cut costs and increase revenue. What better way than to implement an archaic payment system that sees the players do the cost-cutting for them? Saves them improving the casino and trying to move forward with the times.
That sort of thing would only cost them money, after all

As I said unlike many multi-platform sites 32red have a majority UK player base so have been hit harder by the UK's new revenues tax. Shareholders demand maintaining the value of their shares and the dividends. Therefore to nullify the effects of the tax they do that. No need for expensive weekend payment teams on weekend rates.
Reading on from the above facts, removal of flushing is the big tell here rather than ending weekend cash-outs - that could be done by CS who are there at weekends anyway so would have incurred no extra expense. Thus the ONLY benefit must be that a proportion of those whom would have flushed indeed ARE losing their pending withdrawals back.

 

[hedgehok]

As I said unlike many multi-platform sites 32red have a majority UK player base so have been hit harder by the UK's new revenues tax. Shareholders demand maintaining the value of their shares and the dividends. Therefore to nullify the effects of the tax they do that. No need for expensive weekend payment teams on weekend rates.
Reading on from the above facts, removal of flushing is the big tell here rather than ending weekend cash-outs - that could be done by CS who are there at weekends anyway so would have incurred no extra expense. Thus the ONLY benefit must be that a proportion of those whom would have flushed indeed ARE losing their pending withdrawals back.

Bingo!

The only reason any casino has a pending period is in the hope players will reverse their withdrawal and subsequently lose.
Because they've already been mentioned here, I'll say - 32Red stopped doing weekend payouts, but then realised they still weren't making enough money, so stopped manual flushing, but still decided it wasn't earning them enough and finally added a 24-hour pending period as well (I'm not sure what order those last 2 changes were made because I jumped ship long before that)

Of course reversals of "weak" players are a big factor, but certainly not the only one.
Instant flushing often leads to players making just a new deposit a couple of hours later because they are bored leading to increasing transaction costs with payment providers.
And as dunover mentioned they were somewhat forced to compensate for increasing tax-payments.

 

[Valhalla]

those whom would have flushed indeed ARE losing their pending withdrawals back.

I would have been one of those players mate
I don't have the patience to wait out a pending period, and certainly not a weekend and holiday (like this weekend).
But then, because so many casinos do payments better, I don't have to. I just play elsewhere

EDIT - dunover and hedgehok; yes of course the increased tax payments, I failed to mention those to begin with.
I just think the extra cost would be covered by the increased revenue coming from happy and returning players. Pick your poison from 32Red's point of view I guess, but they've gone with the one that "apparently" hurts the player.

 

[horseplayer]

SLOW DOWN PLEASE:

honestly this thread grows so rapidly.

To the subject: There is no easy way to handle this because it's highly subjective.

A player who is not prone to reversals will weight a pending-period very little another (maybe compulsive) gambler will weight much more. It's up to everyone else to read how the rating-system works and if you don't like reversal times just don't play at that casino.
All MG-download casinos like 32red have a pending period and process their withdrawals after the pending period elapsed and then flush the withdrawal, then it often takes another day or two until the withdrawal is processed. That's at least inconvenient but it should not have an impact like over 1 rating-point when you try to be objective.

We are all old enough to gamble, let us also be old enough to do our necessary researching before start playing.
Moaning after reversals are done are not the way this works.

I see no reason that highlighting withdrawal pending times for Accredited casinos cannot be implemented. I'm certain that withdrawal policies are one of the most important aspects looked at before any of our members decide to make a deposit, compulsive gambler or not.

I mentioned before that I'd like to see an Accredited Plus section ranking our casinos by pending periods. That doesn't penalize Accredited casinos for their BOGUS pending times but does recognize those that aren't abusing the predatory practice. It has become especially bad for those of us in the states.

 

[hedgehok]

I see no reason that highlighting withdrawal pending times for Accredited casinos cannot be implemented. I'm certain that withdrawal policies are one of the most important aspects looked at before any of our members decide to make a deposit, compulsive gambler or not.

I mentioned before that I'd like to see an Accredited Plus section ranking our casinos by pending periods. That doesn't penalize Accredited casinos for their BOGUS pending times but does recognize those that aren't abusing the predatory practice. It has become especially bad for those of us in the states.

It is mentioned at their review:

Cons
-No weekend payouts
-No manual flushing

Still, I tend to agree, it would be even more clear to state how long this pending period (reversal time) actually is. It is a big difference to wait from Thursday to Monday just for the flushing or a couple of hours like in many browser-based casinos.

 

[Simmo!]

You will notice that aside from 32red due to their safety, customer service and historical achievements that virtually ALL the 9+ rated sites actually DO have very fast withdrawals so obviously Bryan must have factored this in.

Just wanted to chime in here as I devised the original ratings system for my sites and Bryan applied it to CM with a couple of modifications. But essentially it is the same so here is a bit of an explanation.

Firstly, it is intended as a comparative rating. IE: compared to other casinos. So by saying one has a 8.9 rating and one has a 9.1 rating simply means that one is seen as ever so slightly better than the other. It can never be too exact, not least because where a player lives can often dictate what they get from a casino.

Secondly, the rating system is automated based on a formula. Every casino starts with 10.0 and then points are removed depending on what they offer. So a casino with a 48hr pending will have more points removed that one with a 24 hour pending period.

These are the factors that affect the formula rating:

Licensing jurisdiction
No of Years Operating
Advertised Cashout time
Average Pending time
Weekend cashouts
Weekly/Monthly cashout limits
Manual flushing
Range of games offered.

In Bryan's case I think he also adds a manual adjustment for the number of PABS and how they are resolved.

Hope that adds some clarification.

One last note: we all know most players hate reverse pending and the reasons are obvious. FYI I also agree with the OP in that this should not exist - or at least be a choice - and I choose to play casinos that don't impose this. But just to help understand why these are common, it has a side-effect for the casinos in that it offers a substantial saving by reducing processing costs, most notably on players who constantly deposit and withdraw small amounts and use bonuses. These players are often not profitable for a casino as the costs become more significant (up to 10% of the deposit and 10% of the withdrawal depending on the method).

 

[pmutts]

I posted this on the wrong thread. . .

I copied it over to the correct thread:

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/ddos-threats-and-attacks.66669/?t=66669

Moderator, please delete this posting.

Thanks!