North Korea and US politics

[mack341]

You really can’t see any wrong in Trump can you? In your eyes he can do whatever he wants and it will be justified . How many Obama associates were jailed in his 2 terms ? But that doesn’t matter in your eyes , democrats = bad, Trump = good, regardless of what he does.
Pretty pointless trying to debate with someone so blinkered who can’t accept the facts placed in front of them.

I wouldn't say I was a hardcore trump or republican fan. I recognise he overplays his achievements and abilities, but even that could be a side effect of constant bashing by the media, in that he then feels the need to say how great a job he is doing. In truth if the two main parties had done a better job in the last 25 years there never would have been an opportunity for trump.

There has to be something that happened [ in the mass psyche ] for the same electorate that voted in Obama for two terms to then switch to trump, as they're chalk and cheese. And if you consider all the negative media coverage trump had in the 2016 campaign period then the result against hillary was even more ground breaking.

I do read the posts, but I just don't see after all that spying, surveillance and possibly counter intel with mifsud, downer and halper, that the end result in convictions matches the accusations and theories, that's not me being blinkered just realistic.

Trump won the right to be the president, but the media haven't let up. The authorities tried their hardest through the spying operation and then mueller as well to get rid of trump but they were unable to achieve their goal.

If people vote for trump in 2020 I am not sure what they will be getting in 2021 policy wise, obviously the virus adds more complications, it could act as a hard reset for the global economy.

 

[vorcirion]

sorry I thought it was one, I read the

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

article.

I agree the financial stuff has probably not been looked into deep enough, and the media should focus on the more serious issues, and to many they are living up to trump's label 'fake news' with the approach they have taken.

I think he will probably win, his demeanour the other day was totally relaxed, maybe it's because he knows giuliani has got some dirt on biden but they will wait until after biden gets the nomination before releasing.

Polls are starting to stabilize and they say that Trump is bad and Joe Biden is good. It's been like that since Biden started running for the presidency. Biden has a big lead in Arizona (senate race there helps him too), big lead in Pennsylvania. Those two put Biden to 263 in electoral college. Then there are Florida, North Carolina, Michigan, Wisconsin and Georgia.
Michigan gives Biden a big lead too...smaller lead in Wisconsin and Florida and basically a toss-up in Georgia and in North Carolina. Biden needs to win only one of those 5 races and Trump goes to jail. Rudy better start digging up some dirt fast 6 months to go!

 

[vorcirion]

I wouldn't say I was a hardcore trump or republican fan. I recognise he overplays his achievements and abilities, but even that could be a side effect of constant bashing by the media, in that he then feels the need to say how great a job he is doing. In truth if the two main parties had done a better job in the last 25 years there never would have been an opportunity for trump.

There has to be something that happened [ in the mass psyche ] for the same electorate that voted in Obama for two terms to then switch to trump, as they're chalk and cheese. And if you consider all the negative media coverage trump had in the 2016 campaign period then the result against hillary was even more ground breaking.

I do read the posts, but I just don't see after all that spying, surveillance and possibly counter intel with mifsud, downer and halper, that the end result in convictions matches the accusations and theories, that's not me being blinkered just realistic.

Trump won the right to be the president, but the media haven't let up. The authorities tried their hardest through the spying operation and then mueller as well to get rid of trump but they were unable to achieve their goal.

If people vote for trump in 2020 I am not sure what they will be getting in 2021 policy wise, obviously the virus adds more complications, it could act as a hard reset for the global economy.

Oh yeah because Hillary didn't get any negative media. MSM (Fox has the biggest audience) was against Hillary and throwing all kinds of crap at her since forever. And Trump whines about media coverage? Nothing compared to Hillary!

 

[mack341]

Oh yeah because Hillary didn't get any negative media. MSM (Fox has the biggest audience) was against Hillary and throwing all kinds of crap at her since forever. And Trump whines about media coverage? Nothing compared to Hillary!

Hillary had built up her own baggage collection over many years, even many millions of democrats didn't want her so fox didn't need to do much, and until it was looking obvious he was going to win were negative about trump. I think they wanted someone like Jeb or the big ears guy.

 

[mack341]

Polls are starting to stabilize and they say that Trump is bad and Joe Biden is good. It's been like that since Biden started running for the presidency. Biden has a big lead in Arizona (senate race there helps him too), big lead in Pennsylvania. Those two put Biden to 263 in electoral college. Then there are Florida, North Carolina, Michigan, Wisconsin and Georgia.
Michigan gives Biden a big lead too...smaller lead in Wisconsin and Florida and basically a toss-up in Georgia and in North Carolina. Biden needs to win only one of those 5 races and Trump goes to jail. Rudy better start digging up some dirt fast 6 months to go!

If biden wins good luck to him, he faced a lot of cheap shots from the other contenders and he's certainly put the years into politics, just a shame he isn't as sharp as he once was.

I wonder who he will choose as his VP?

 

[vorcirion]

Hillary had built up her own baggage collection over many years, even many millions of democrats didn't want her so fox didn't need to do much, and until it was looking obvious he was going to win were negative about trump. I think they wanted someone like Jeb or the big ears guy.

Yes everyone wants Obama! He was just great <3 I assume you meant him since you were talking about big ears

 

[vorcirion]

If biden wins good luck to him, he faced a lot of cheap shots from the other contenders and he's certainly put the years into politics, just a shame he isn't as sharp as he once was.

I wonder who he will choose as his VP?

My guess would be Stacey Abrams (might help with Georgia too) or Warren. But who knows! VP picks have been weird.

 

[Steviedoo]

My guess would be Stacey Abrams (might help with Georgia too) or Warren. But who knows! VP picks have been weird.

stacey abrams has zero experience. This would be a mistake.

 

[vorcirion]

stacey abrams has zero experience. This would be a mistake.

Yeah I have no clue who would be good. What do you think?

 

[Steviedoo]

Hillary had built up her own baggage collection over many years, even many millions of democrats didn't want her so fox didn't need to do much, and until it was looking obvious he was going to win were negative about trump. I think they wanted someone like Jeb or the big ears guy.

QUESTION:

Where are all the rabid, fighting-mad, spitting-fire Republicans who turned the deaths of 4 people in Benghazi into a huge scandal?

Where is their outrage at 93,000 deaths and 40M unemployed?

WHERE IS IT?????

And in the end of all those investigations. Not a shred of evidence Of wrong doing.

 

[Harry_BKK]

QUESTION:

Where are all the rabid, fighting-mad, spitting-fire Republicans who turned the deaths of 4 people in Benghazi into a huge scandal?

Where is their outrage at 93,000 deaths and 40M unemployed?

WHERE IS IT?????

And in the end of all those investigations. Not a shred of evidence Of wrong doing.

Steviedoo, didn't you get the memo?

According to Mr T all is fine and dandy, even with more than 1,500 deaths per day on average.

He realized his WH presser rallies didn't work, so now he's changed course and tries to convince everyone that all is tremendous.

 

[Steviedoo]

Yeah I have no clue who would be good. What do you think?

don’t know but kellyAnne out in the media yesterday saying joe biden wants a woman VP so he can sleep with her....”Biden is like a frat boy at the end of a frat party...yelling I need a woman”

 

[Harry_BKK]

don’t know but kellyAnne out in the media yesterday saying joe biden wants a woman VP so he can sleep with her....”Biden is like a frat boy at the end of a frat party...yelling I need a woman”

Oh, it's gonna be dirty, and KellyAnne is an expert in that!

 

[mack341]

QUESTION:

Where are all the rabid, fighting-mad, spitting-fire Republicans who turned the deaths of 4 people in Benghazi into a huge scandal?

Where is their outrage at 93,000 deaths and 40M unemployed?

WHERE IS IT?????

And in the end of all those investigations. Not a shred of evidence Of wrong doing.

According to trump the US death rate is half that of spain and italy and not far behind germany [I think that's what he said the other day but I haven't looked at the figures myself to check]

that will be a challenge for any president, finding jobs for 40 m, obviously the lockdown has caused unemployment to rise. trump by all accounts wants to lift the lockdown and he said the blue states want to keep it going?

I didn't watch the benghazi hearings, it all passed me by, should have probably been more hearings on the logic of Nato bombing libya backwards.

I did read theories that the ambassador was overseeing the transfer of libyan arms into syria for the rebels, there was no normal diplomatic work to be done so I don't know why he hadn't been evacuated from a war torn country with factions trying to seize power. I wonder if that question was ever asked why was the ambassador there with fighting going on.

 

[Steviedoo]

According to trump the US death rate is half that of spain and italy and not far behind germany [I think that's what he said the other day but I haven't looked at the figures myself to check]

that will be a challenge for any president, finding jobs for 40 m, obviously the lockdown has caused unemployment to rise. trump by all accounts wants to lift the lockdown and he said the blue states want to keep it going?

I didn't watch the benghazi hearings, it all passed me by, should have probably been more hearings on the logic of Nato bombing libya backwards.

I did read theories that the ambassador was overseeing the transfer of libyan arms into syria for the rebels, there was no normal diplomatic work to be done so I don't know why he hadn't been evacuated from a war torn country with factions trying to seize power. I wonder if that question was ever asked why was the ambassador there with fighting going on.

I’m not gonna debate American foreign policy as they have made some very questionable moves.

but nice try on avoiding the question as to where are all the investigations and questions regarding his response to the coronavirus that could avoided 90k deaths in the USA.

the media is too busy covering his antics on twitter and the crap he says everyday to even ask. but trump is a master at changing the news cycle.

the media should do better. Sadly it doesn’t.

 

[cncas2123]

don’t know but kellyAnne out in the media yesterday saying joe biden wants a woman VP so he can sleep with her....”Biden is like a frat boy at the end of a frat party...yelling I need a woman”

I would think Joe Biden has to be looking on his potential VP as the President in waiting , in my opinion he’s there for 4 years to get politics in the US back on a civilised footing.
Maybe it’s the time for a centre left VP, possibly a woman but I think the political ideology will be more important than the sex of the VP as the primaries showed there’s an appetite for more modern politics and policy in the Democratic Party.
I think Joe’s team will be shrewd enough to grab the opportunity and pick a VP with a fresh outlook as the Trump era politics has sickened so many ordinary decent people.

 

[vorcirion]

I would think Joe Biden has to be looking on his potential VP as the President in waiting , in my opinion he’s there for 4 years to get politics in the US back on a civilised footing.
Maybe it’s the time for a centre left VP, possibly a woman but I think the political ideology will be more important than the sex of the VP as the primaries showed there’s an appetite for more modern politics and policy in the Democratic Party.
I think Joe’s team will be shrewd enough to grab the opportunity and pick a VP with a fresh outlook as the Trump area politics has sickened so many ordinary decent people.

Biden has said that he will pick a woman as a VP and almost certainly someone who black people will like. So Klobuchar is a big no. But yeah I don't know who is there that he could pick. Warren might be the best choice...could easily run for the office after 4 years of Biden.

 

[Kroffe]

@dionysus

 

[sufferinsilence]

 

[sufferinsilence]

I laughed harder than I should've...

 

[Harry_BKK]

@mack341

Still a game-changer? Just released, a 96,000 people observational blind study.

Total HCQ only
137% increased risk of heart problems
34% higher death rate.

Total HCQ with an antibiotic ( e.g. Azitromycine )
411% higher risk of heart problems
45% higher death rate.

Numbers for CQ and CQ with an antibiotic (e.g Azitromycine) were not much better.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

I wish it would have been that game-changer but it looks now more like another snake oil from Mr. T.

 

[mack341]

@mack341

Still a game-changer? Just released, a 96,000 people observational blind study.

Total HCQ only
137% increased risk of heart problems
34% higher death rate.

Total HCQ with an antibiotic ( e.g. Azitromycine )
411% higher risk of heart problems
45% higher death rate.

Numbers for CQ and CQ with an antibiotic (e.g Azitromycine) were not much better.

View attachment 132188

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

I wish it would have been that game-changer but it looks now more like another snake oil from Mr. T.

was this given late, that seems to be a big factor

Dr. William O'Neill, a world-renowned Henry Ford doctor, is leading one of the largest U.S. studies into the drug. He gives us a little more information.

In fact, Dr. O'Neill calls a recent report based on veterans and the dangers of hydroxychloroquine "junk science."

"The report has never been peer-reviewed, meaning that other doctors haven't been able to review the information. And it's an incredibly inaccurate, biased report," he says.

I would like to understand why if it works in vitro why that affect doesn't carry over to real patients; if it doesn't work it doesn't work but I know I witnessed in the media a keeness for it not to work, which is incomprehensible to me.

 

[Harry_BKK]

was this given late, that seems to be a big factor

Dr. William O'Neill, a world-renowned Henry Ford doctor, is leading one of the largest U.S. studies into the drug. He gives us a little more information.

In fact, Dr. O'Neill calls a recent report based on veterans and the dangers of hydroxychloroquine "junk science."

"The report has never been peer-reviewed, meaning that other doctors haven't been able to review the information. And it's an incredibly inaccurate, biased report," he says.

I would like to understand why if it works in vitro why that affect doesn't carry over to real patients; if it doesn't work it doesn't work but I know I witnessed in the media a keeness for it not to work, which is incomprehensible to me.

Read the damn' study mack.

The VA study was not all flawed but neither representative. This one was collected from 96,000 patients from around the world with an average age of 53. But I'll stop now as you can read it for yourself or just keep posting some nonsense.

I can't care less what a doctor says when he implies anyone would have a "keenness for it not to work". Absolute madness to even think something like that.

One more time, why has HXQ or CQ not been established as a treatment on a wide scale if it would simply cure people? We wouldn't have hospital ERs overflowing, 100,000s death and a world shut down. And don't give me any Bill Gates, global pharma or other deep state BS.

 

[mack341]

Read the damn' study mack.

The VA study was not all flawed but neither representative. This one was collected from 96,000 patients from around the world with an average age of 53. But I'll stop now as you can read it for yourself or just keep posting some nonsense.

I can't care less what a doctor says when he implies anyone would have a "keenness for it not to work". Absolute madness to even think something like that.

One more time, why has HXQ or CQ not been established as a treatment on a wide scale if it would simply cure people? We wouldn't have hospital ERs overflowing, 100,000s death and a world shut down. And don't give me any Bill Gates, global pharma or other deep state BS.

That was my words about keeness. And it is true the media [and prob big pharma, gates etc..] are keen to bury it, you can design trials to skew results, give the medicine when it's too late etc..

It is being used all round the world, many trials are being started and carried out...why would do that if it had not showed promise?

A french professor, world reknowned, has been using it from day 1 and is adamant it is helping. You explain to him how he's wrong.

You can call those things BS if you wish that's your right.

 

[Harry_BKK]

That was my words about keeness. And it is true the media [and prob big pharma, gates etc..] are keen to bury it, you can design trials to skew results, give the medicine when it's too late etc..

It is being used all round the world, many trials are being started and carried out...why would do that if it had not showed promise?

A french professor, world reknowned, has been using it from day 1 and is adamant it is helping. You explain to him how he's wrong.

You can call those things BS if you wish that's your right.

Well, that is BS mack, absolute and utter BS.

You still have not answered my question. If it cures COVID as you keep insisting why are doctors not using it on all or at least the majority of patients?

BTW, the French guy has just as much a flawed study as the one at the VA in the US. Overall, that is considered anecdotal evidence (reason enough to try if it works indeed, and that is what's happening).

These latest results are observational evidence from a large worldwide blind study. Are you saying that all doctors from Vietnam to Canada and from Australia to Denmark are all in on a huge conspiracy that would be in total contradiction of the oath they take to save people?

 

[ternur]

 

[pinnit2014]

It's always cat/kittens

Fear not, the Dog will save the day - his ego, not being as great as an evil cats, even allows him to team up with who started the virus (a rogue evil dog, perhaps)

 

[cncas2123]

Well, that is BS mack, absolute and utter BS.

You still have not answered my question. If it cures COVID as you keep insisting why are doctors not using it on all or at least the majority of patients?

BTW, the French guy has just as much a flawed study as the one at the VA in the US. Overall, that is considered anecdotal evidence (reason enough to try if it works indeed, and that is what's happening).

These latest results are observational evidence from a large worldwide blind study. Are you saying that all doctors from Vietnam to Canada and from Australia to Denmark are all in on a huge conspiracy that would be in total contradiction of the oath they take to save people?

I’m short , yes it’s a worldwide conspiracy by every country to blacken the name of Trump as he’s the one who discovered that HCQ would cure Covid, and the French doctor brke ranks ...... haven’t you been reading the Deep State Daily Times lately as it’s front page news........
@Harry_BKK you are wasting your time debating , Mack has his mind made up and no matter what facts you place in front of him he’s not for changing. I wish I had his blind faith in HCQ but unfortunately I live in the real world.

 

[cncas2123]

was this given late, that seems to be a big factor

Dr. William O'Neill, a world-renowned Henry Ford doctor, is leading one of the largest U.S. studies into the drug. He gives us a little more information.

In fact, Dr. O'Neill calls a recent report based on veterans and the dangers of hydroxychloroquine "junk science."

"The report has never been peer-reviewed, meaning that other doctors haven't been able to review the information. And it's an incredibly inaccurate, biased report," he says.

I would like to understand why if it works in vitro why that affect doesn't carry over to real patients; if it doesn't work it doesn't work but I know I witnessed in the media a keeness for it not to work, which is incomprehensible to me.

If my understanding of the French study of 1061 patients treated with HCQ is correct they were treating symptomatic and asymptomatic patients and not just patients that were being treated in hospital. If thats the case then the study is completely flawed as roughly 900 of these patients can have been expected to have fully recovered with no treatment needed as 85% of infected people have mild symptoms. If this is the case, how can this study be taken seriously?

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

 

[dionysus]

for some levity, things on FB you wish you could unsee, for $100 Alex

 

[mack341]

Well, that is BS mack, absolute and utter BS.

You still have not answered my question. If it cures COVID as you keep insisting why are doctors not using it on all or at least the majority of patients?

BTW, the French guy has just as much a flawed study as the one at the VA in the US. Overall, that is considered anecdotal evidence (reason enough to try if it works indeed, and that is what's happening).

These latest results are observational evidence from a large worldwide blind study. Are you saying that all doctors from Vietnam to Canada and from Australia to Denmark are all in on a huge conspiracy that would be in total contradiction of the oath they take to save people?

Looking at the figures accompanying the study, there are a great many comorbidities in the patients, I think the study said most were from north america, if HCQ is given late it will not help as much as if given early, that is my understanding.

For example:

Hypertension

21 437 (26·4%)

560 (30·0%)

1095 (28·9%)

891 (29·5%)

1827 (29·4%)

this also stood out to me, the far right is patients who received HQC with a macrolide:

Mechanical ventilation

6278 (7·7%)

403 (21·6%)

814 (21·5%)

616 (20·4%)

1243 (20·0%)

Doesn't being put on a ventilator carry risks of it's own?

wikipedia:
Mechanical ventilation is often a life-saving intervention, but carries potential complications including

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

, airway injury, alveolar damage,

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

, and

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

Other complications include diaphragm atrophy, decreased cardiac output, and oxygen toxicity. One of the primary complications that presents in patients mechanically ventilated is acute lung injury (ALI)/acute respiratory distress syndrome (ARDS). ALI/ARDS are recognized as significant contributors to patient morbidity and mortality.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

The chloroquine only group has a 7.4% lower mortality rate than HCQ +macrolide, that doesn't make sense to me, antibiotics don't kill and HCQ is safer than chloroquine.

 

[cncas2123]

Looking at the figures accompanying the study, there are a great many comorbidities in the patients, I think the study said most were from north america, if HQC is given late it will not help as much as if given early, that is my understanding.

For example:

Hypertension

21 437 (26·4%)

560 (30·0%)

1095 (28·9%)

891 (29·5%)

1827 (29·4%)

this also stood out to me, the far right is patients who received HQC with a macrolide:

Mechanical ventilation

6278 (7·7%)

403 (21·6%)

814 (21·5%)

616 (20·4%)

1243 (20·0%)

Doesn't being put on a ventilator carry risks of it's own?

wikipedia:
Mechanical ventilation is often a life-saving intervention, but carries potential complications including

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

, airway injury, alveolar damage,

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

, and

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

Other complications include diaphragm atrophy, decreased cardiac output, and oxygen toxicity. One of the primary complications that presents in patients mechanically ventilated is acute lung injury (ALI)/acute respiratory distress syndrome (ARDS). ALI/ARDS are recognized as significant contributors to patient morbidity and mortality.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

The chloroquine only group has a 7.4% lower mortality rate than HCQ +macrolide, that doesn't make sense to me, antibiotics don't kill and HCQ is safer than chloroquine.

But you are ignoring the fact that 900 of these patients could have reasonably been expected to recover with no intervention?
Why do you ignore that, but when real data based on 96,000 patients shows that there is no noticeable effect you just brush it to the side?
Or am I reading the French study incorrectly?

 

[mack341]

But you are ignoring the fact that 900 of these patients could have reasonably been expected to recover with no intervention?
Why do you ignore that, but when real data based on 96,000 patients shows that there is no noticeable effect you just brush it to the side?
Or am I reading the French study incorrectly?

I was talking about the study harry posted; I posted a chart a page back or so, showing the death rate across france, the marseille column with HCQ and AZ has the lowest rate and yet it covers france 2nd biggest city.

I think the in vitro study showed it has an antivral effect against covid-19, plus the cytokines and ace 2 inhibition. It would be surprising if it didn't help, to what degree could be debated.

I think possibly in the american study they've given HCQ to the worse patients, maybe late in the day after their lungs are already damaged. It wouldn't take a worldwide conspiracy, just a decision to only give those most severly ill and reacting to the virus the medicines, milder cases would get conservative treatment.

 

[cncas2123]

I was talking about the study harry posted; I posted a chart a page back or so, showing the death rate across france, the marseille column with HCQ and AZ has the lowest rate and yet it covers france 2nd biggest city.

I think the in vitro study showed it has an antivral effect against covid-19, plus the cytokines and ace 2 inhibition. It would be surprising if it didn't help, to what degree could be debated.

I think possibly in the american study they've given HCQ to the worse patients, maybe late in the day after their lungs are already damaged. It wouldn't take a worldwide conspiracy, just a decision to only give those most severly ill and reacting to the virus the medicines, milder cases would get conservative treatment.

My mistake, I didnt read the reply correctly.
But how can you shoot down this study but you support a study in which up to 80% of the patients could expect to fully recover without any treatment whatsoever? Or is my reading of the French study wrong?

 

[mack341]

My mistake, I didnt read the reply correctly.
But how can you shoot down this study but you support a study in which up to 80% of the patients could expect to fully recover without any treatment whatsoever? Or is my reading of the French study wrong?

Je n'regret I don't know, I'm getting to the point of past caring to be honest, my problem is I cannot compute all these countries and doctors/hospitals using it, but it's worse than useless.

To get to the rank of professor you have to be a real expert, years of study required and highly intelligent, if he's got it wrong at least I was following somebody who knows his stuff. It would be good if he took part in a debate with fauci or somebody who is a sceptic of HCQ.

If it is proven to work think of the embarrassment for govt's like the uk's who could've been using it for at least 2 months, there is a lot at stake, I expect a consensus to form and it will be buried even if it does help.

 

[cncas2123]

Je n'regret I don't know, I'm getting to the point of past caring to be honest, my problem is I cannot compute all these countries and doctors/hospitals using it, but it's worse than useless.

To get to the rank of professor you have to be a real expert, years of study required and highly intelligent, if he's got it wrong at least I was following somebody who knows his stuff. It would be good if he took part in a debate with fauci or somebody who is a sceptic of HCQ.

If it is proven to work think of the embarrassment for govt's like the uk's who could've been using it for at least 2 months, there is a lot at stake, I expect a consensus to form and it will be buried even if it does help.

He could have used Aspirin in his study, it would have had the same affect on the results. How can you even consider this a real study when most of the patients were going to recover whatever happened?
Every proper study has shown it doesnt work, there's no conspiracy, it just doesnt work on Covid.
Greater Belfast has two thirds of the population of Marsielle and has had less than 250 deaths. Not one person has undergone the HCQ treatment and looking at the figures i would say we compare favourably with Marsielle.
Lies, damn lies and statistics. You can interpret them any way you want.

 

[mack341]

He could have used Aspirin in his study, it would have had the same affect on the results. How can you even consider this a real study when most of the patients were going to recover whatever happened?
Every proper study has shown it doesnt work, there's no conspiracy, it just doesnt work on Covid.
Greater Belfast has two thirds of the population of Marsielle and has had less than 250 deaths. Not one person has undergone the HCQ treatment and looking at the figures i would say we compare favourably with Marsielle.
Lies, damn lies and statistics. You can interpret them any way you want.

Not sure you are reading my replies, I was actually comparing parts of france, doesn't seem an unscientific thing to do in the situation, you know for someone to explain the massive difference in mortality rates within france and relating to different treatment regimes.

[If everyone had belfast's results maybe we wouldn't need to vaccinate the whole planet.]

I've been reasonable in all my posts, but it's a two way street. These back-and-forths with you and harry etc... have been decidely toxic in nature, angling for a ruckus to my mind.

 

[pinnit2014]

 

[cncas2123]

Not sure you are reading my replies, I was actually comparing parts of france, doesn't seem an unscientific thing to do in the situation, you know for someone to explain the massive difference in mortality rates within france and relating to different treatment regimes.

[If everyone had belfast's results maybe we wouldn't need to vaccinate the whole planet.]

I've been reasonable in all my posts, but it's a two way street. These back-and-forths with you and harry etc... have been decidely toxic in nature, angling for a ruckus to my mind.

Not in the slightest bit interested in a ruckus, all I am doing is putting forward hard facts.
What I am trying to show you is that statistics can be interpreted in any way you want, but you have to look at the facts behind it.
In the Greater Belfast area, and in Northern Ireland as a whole the social distancing was well observed meaning a population of around 1.6 million people there are only 500 deaths. How was the lock down etc observed in Marsielle compared to the rest of France? If it was better observed than other parts of France then its going to lead to less deaths. What I am trying to get across is that there may have been reasons that Marsielle did better than Paris for example.
But to say a test were over 80% of the subjects would never have needed the treatment administered proves the HCQ works and that its the reason the Marsielle had such low death rates is nonsensical. If the health of Maresielle is down to the use of HCQ then the majority of the population would have needed to take it, not just 1000 test subjects.
But this is the normal, you cherry pick your data and present in a way that you hope will back up your argument of a conspiracy theory against Trump that this is all down to big pharma, Bill Gates, a lab in Wuhan, Obama, the Democrats and the Deep State.

 

[Kroffe]

Where are the Nature documentaries at?

 

[paul7388]

Where are the Nature documentaries at?

Well since it is your Birthday and you won't be getting cake till family visit.

 

[vorcirion]

Where are the Nature documentaries at?

Happy birthday!

 

[mack341]

Not in the slightest bit interested in a ruckus, all I am doing is putting forward hard facts.
What I am trying to show you is that statistics can be interpreted in any way you want, but you have to look at the facts behind it.
In the Greater Belfast area, and in Northern Ireland as a whole the social distancing was well observed meaning a population of around 1.6 million people there are only 500 deaths. How was the lock down etc observed in Marsielle compared to the rest of France? If it was better observed than other parts of France then its going to lead to less deaths. What I am trying to get across is that there may have been reasons that Marsielle did better than Paris for example.
But to say a test were over 80% of the subjects would never have needed the treatment administered proves the HCQ works and that its the reason the Marsielle had such low death rates is nonsensical. If the health of Maresielle is down to the use of HCQ then the majority of the population would have needed to take it, not just 1000 test subjects.
But this is the normal, you cherry pick your data and present in a way that you hope will back up your argument of a conspiracy theory against Trump that this is all down to big pharma, Bill Gates, a lab in Wuhan, Obama, the Democrats and the Deep State.

But not everyone in marseille did take it and the death rate is higher in those that didn't, which makes me wonder whether you have actually looked at the chart:

The two colours relate to dates, but the figures are 5% and 8.6% for marseille patients who did not take HCQ + AZ compared to 0.4 and 0.5% who did.

Why should I dismiss this, I realise statistics can be fixed and manipulated, is that the sole reason, and the low mortality rate has nothing to do with his treatment plan?

I should also then dismiss the fact HCQ is a very cheap generic, that gates is obsessed with vaccines and has funded digital ID solutions, and fauci has funded 'gain of function' virus research in wuhan even though the US had stopped doing it for fears of the risks.

At the moment it's not possible to say whether any of this matters or points to probable cause, it depends [in my mind] what the 'new normal' life will be like, what changes are brought in etc...

It could be a manipulated virus that got out by accident from that lab or was deliberately released, that's not impossible imo. Can I prove it from sitting in my living room looking at web pages on google, no I cannot.

 

[cncas2123]

But not everyone in marseille did take it and the death rate is higher in those that didn't, which makes me wonder whether you have actually looked at the chart:

View attachment 132226

The two colours relate to dates, but the figures are 5% and 8.6% for marseille patients who did not take HCQ + AZ compared to 0.4 and 0.5% who did.

Why should I dismiss this, I realise statistics can be fixed and manipulated, is that the sole reason, and the low mortality rate has nothing to do with his treatment plan?

I should also then dismiss the fact HCQ is a very cheap generic, that gates is obsessed with vaccines and has funded digital ID solutions, and fauci has funded 'gain of function' virus research in wuhan even though the US had stopped doing it for fears of the risks.

At the moment it's not possible to say whether any of this matters or points to probable cause, it depends [in my mind] what the 'new normal' life will be like, what changes are brought in etc...

It could be a manipulated virus that got out by accident from that lab or was deliberately released, that's not impossible imo. Can I prove it from sitting in my living room looking at web pages on google, no I cannot.

To quote you, if the whole world could be like Marsielle then there wouldnt be a need for a vaccine.
Cherry picking again, same old BS, time for me to drop out of this thread as its a waste of time posting when you are so blinkered and chose not to look at the facts.
I am glad I have the intelligence to look at all the facts presented to me, rather than living my life believing everything is a conspiracy and the deep state is watching me all the time.

 

[Borgie]

To quote you, if the whole world could be like Marsielle then there wouldnt be a need for a vaccine.
Cherry picking again, same old BS, time for me to drop out of this thread as its a waste of time posting when you are so blinkered and chose not to look at the facts.
I am glad I have the intelligence to look at all the facts presented to me, rather than living my life believing everything is a conspiracy and the deep state is watching me all the time.

I agree it must be exhausting trusting nothing or anybody. Seeing stuff that really isn't there .

 

[mack341]

To quote you, if the whole world could be like Marsielle then there wouldnt be a need for a vaccine.
Cherry picking again, same old BS, time for me to drop out of this thread as its a waste of time posting when you are so blinkered and chose not to look at the facts.
I am glad I have the intelligence to look at all the facts presented to me, rather than living my life believing everything is a conspiracy and the deep state is watching me all the time.

You almost got it in one, if the whole world had mortality rates as raoult has achieved using HQC and AZ then there would be no need for 7 billion vaccines, or ID tracking etc..

I could quote parts from several of your posts today where you make these snide comments and insinuations, you have either been angling for a row or more hive mind, group think to pat you on the back. It'll come too.

You may not realise this is a forum for debate and different opinions, but you come across to me as a rather obnoxious shill who will only accept the msm narrative and views.

'same old BS' yeah you are certainly full of it.

 

[paul7388]

Oh this thread is getting interesting just in time for the weekend.

 

[Borgie]

You almost got it in one, if the whole world had mortality rates as raoult has achieved using HQC and AZ then there would be no need for 7 billion vaccines, or ID tracking etc..

I could quote parts from several of your posts today where you make these snide comments and insinuations, you have either been angling for a row or more hive mind, group think to pat you on the back. It'll come too.

You may not realise this is a forum for debate and different opinions, but you come across to me as a rather obnoxious shill who will only accept the msm narrative and views.

'same old BS' yeah you are certainly full of it.

Where did that come from? A personal attack totally unjustified.

 

[mack341]

Where did that come from? A personal attack totally unjustified.

keep stirring borgie

 

[cncas2123]

Where did that come from? A personal attack totally unjustified.

Kind of reminds me of what happens when Mr Trump wants to ignore a debate that he can never win , go on the attack and make it personal .... oh well when people troll and have no sensible argument to make they often go down to the lowest level......