North Korea and US politics

[mack341]

The military complex doesn't care what weapons they make as long as they can make them. E.g. the missile treaty was actually good for the industry as they had to produce longer range missiles which are more costly.

Yes, but as you said it kept a lid on the arms race, now perhaps the lid has been removed, so govt expenditure will rocket to keep up with the ruskies? The russians tend to get more bang for their buck..I think one of their recent 'tests' went wrong though, but it shows they're not sitting idly by.

 

[mack341]

No mack. It is because there are firm rules and guidance policies in place to prevent grave misconduct and if it happens that it is detected and investigated.

Why would Horowitz not point out if there was grave misconduct?

Because you don't do that, I doubt an example can ever be remembered of high up govt officials ever going after former high up govt officials, it's a club.

The other report(s) will also be limp, some low order may face a charge, but no trial as they'll plead guilty and get a lighter sentence. the ohr's [nellie?] came on my radar, the press seemed to be attracted to them, that's what normally happens in a situation like this, the public is informed of a culprit's name early on, so when they're named/indicted later on, it makes sense and closes the story. [basically a scapegoat has got to be found, the public will think it a total whitewash otherwise]

 

[Harry_BKK]

Yes, but as you said it kept a lid on the arms race, now perhaps the lid has been removed, so govt expenditure will rocket to keep up with the ruskies? The russians tend to get more bang for their buck..I think one of their recent 'tests' went wrong though, but it shows they're not sitting idly by.

It rocketed already. Mr T increased it from some $650B to over $700B. I don't think Democrats are much better when it comes to the military.

 

[mack341]

It rocketed already. Mr T increased it from some $650B to over $700B. I don't think Democrats are much better when it comes to the military.

I guess it provides jobs and technology transfers too to silicon valley; I think there are enough nuclear bombs now to blow the world up several times over. If you make weapons for a living to sell to governments, they've got to have enemies.

I think the US govt is due soon to run out of funding again, so will need that debt ceiling raised once more ...it's never going to end, 20 trillion, 30, 40 and on...the only politician I've heard concerned about the debt is rand paul, and he is rather more sensible about russia too.

 

[Harry_BKK]

@mack341

Gotta admit listening for over 50 minutes to Mr T's rambling is very nauseating. Luckily we have some programs who can give us a good summary. Look at how even the FF hosts are cringing. And these are people who finish every show with brown noses.

The world is laughing but also wondering, what is wrong with him!

 

[Kroffe]

Left-biased site, but still.

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Also, stealing a comment i saw in the thread that i thought was a bit funny, and on point.

"
The Reds spent tons of time, money, and political capital getting Hilary’s emails, and they sold their souls getting in bed with Russia. That’s why they are so pissed that they got caught and that she was never indicted. They bet everything on it and won’t shutup about it as a result. It’s kinda like an idiot who blows their life savings on a sports car and can’t stop complaining that it never got him laid.

This is all happening again. After they lost big in 2018, they realized that they would have to play dirty to win again. The Reds, once again, spent all their time, money, and political capital trying to get investigations into Joe and Hunter and Burisma, and they sold their souls getting in bed with a corrupt Ukranian administration - one that was in cahoots with Russia.

Their plan imploded when Zelensky got elected. They were caught off guard and misread the complicated machinations of politics in another country and culture. Zelensky was elected on an anti-corruption campaign, and his first move was to get rid of the corrupt officials from the previous administration, which included the corrupt Ukranian prosecutor who had already agreed to play along a whole year ago in these meetings with Nunes. When Zelensky dragged his feet, their last desperate ploy was to use the Congressionally approved aid and WH meeting as a bargaining chip to force his hand in time to tank Biden before the election.

THIS is why they won’t shutup about Joe and Hunter Biden and Burisma. They bet the farm and their careers, possibly their freedom on this and they were caught by some lowly government employees. It ended up going nowhere and blowing up in their faces. This is fucking huge. Beyond huge, and Schiff set Nunes up for this beautifully."

 

[Kroffe]

This is how someone looks when they get caught with the hand in the cookie-jar.

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[Harry_BKK]

This is how someone looks when they get caught with the hand in the cookie-jar.

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or maybe in the honey jar

I had read about it and was watching it live thinking when will someone mention it. It didn't take too long, an epic moment of "mud in the face".

 

[Harry_BKK]

Left-biased site, but still.

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Also, stealing a comment i saw in the thread that i thought was a bit funny, and on point.

"
The Reds spent tons of time, money, and political capital getting Hilary’s emails, and they sold their souls getting in bed with Russia. That’s why they are so pissed that they got caught and that she was never indicted. They bet everything on it and won’t shutup about it as a result. It’s kinda like an idiot who blows their life savings on a sports car and can’t stop complaining that it never got him laid.

This is all happening again. After they lost big in 2018, they realized that they would have to play dirty to win again. The Reds, once again, spent all their time, money, and political capital trying to get investigations into Joe and Hunter and Burisma, and they sold their souls getting in bed with a corrupt Ukranian administration - one that was in cahoots with Russia.

Their plan imploded when Zelensky got elected. They were caught off guard and misread the complicated machinations of politics in another country and culture. Zelensky was elected on an anti-corruption campaign, and his first move was to get rid of the corrupt officials from the previous administration, which included the corrupt Ukranian prosecutor who had already agreed to play along a whole year ago in these meetings with Nunes. When Zelensky dragged his feet, their last desperate ploy was to use the Congressionally approved aid and WH meeting as a bargaining chip to force his hand in time to tank Biden before the election.

THIS is why they won’t shutup about Joe and Hunter Biden and Burisma. They bet the farm and their careers, possibly their freedom on this and they were caught by some lowly government employees. It ended up going nowhere and blowing up in their faces. This is fucking huge. Beyond huge, and Schiff set Nunes up for this beautifully."

The problem with such witnesses is one credibility and two they usually have more dirt hidden under the rug. Once in a hearing, you don't know what he is going to tell. He would probably say anything to save his skin at this point.

I would only put them on the stand if he had verifiable proof, like messages, recordings, emails or such, something that puts a trail together back when it all started, which was probably somewhere in 2018.

 

[Kroffe]

The problem with such witnesses is one credibility and two they usually have more dirt hidden under the rug. Once in a hearing, you don't know what is going to tell. He would probably say anything to save his skin at this point.

I would only put them on the stand if he had verifiable proof, like messages, recordings, emails or such, something that puts a trail together back when it all started, which was probably somewhere in 2018.

Yeah, i agree on that.
But from the little i have seen, Swalwell dont seem stupid enough to accuse Nunes like that without anything to back it up with.
Time will tell.

The comments on the thread are pretty funny.

"What happens if Nunes is forced to give testimony? Who can we trust to give misleading, incoherent closing statements in his absence? "

 

[sufferinsilence]

@mack341

Gotta admit listening for over 50 minutes to Mr T's rambling is very nauseating. Luckily we have some programs who can give us a good summary. Look at how even the FF hosts are cringing. And these are people who finish every show with brown noses.

The world is laughing but also wondering, what is wrong with him!

His Adderall had just kicked in

 

[Harry_BKK]

Left-biased site, but still.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

Also, stealing a comment i saw in the thread that i thought was a bit funny, and on point.

"
The Reds spent tons of time, money, and political capital getting Hilary’s emails, and they sold their souls getting in bed with Russia. That’s why they are so pissed that they got caught and that she was never indicted. They bet everything on it and won’t shutup about it as a result. It’s kinda like an idiot who blows their life savings on a sports car and can’t stop complaining that it never got him laid.

This is all happening again. After they lost big in 2018, they realized that they would have to play dirty to win again. The Reds, once again, spent all their time, money, and political capital trying to get investigations into Joe and Hunter and Burisma, and they sold their souls getting in bed with a corrupt Ukranian administration - one that was in cahoots with Russia.

Their plan imploded when Zelensky got elected. They were caught off guard and misread the complicated machinations of politics in another country and culture. Zelensky was elected on an anti-corruption campaign, and his first move was to get rid of the corrupt officials from the previous administration, which included the corrupt Ukranian prosecutor who had already agreed to play along a whole year ago in these meetings with Nunes. When Zelensky dragged his feet, their last desperate ploy was to use the Congressionally approved aid and WH meeting as a bargaining chip to force his hand in time to tank Biden before the election.

THIS is why they won’t shutup about Joe and Hunter Biden and Burisma. They bet the farm and their careers, possibly their freedom on this and they were caught by some lowly government employees. It ended up going nowhere and blowing up in their faces. This is fucking huge. Beyond huge, and Schiff set Nunes up for this beautifully."

Some organisation got through a FOIA request the call logs and it shows Pompeo talked to Giuliani (arranged by the White House) who then handed over the fabled file on Mr T hotel stationery with alleged proof about the Bidens and the 2016 election (at this point, Rudy was working already with Parnas for a few months). Pompeo has then later a call log with...... Nunes!

The tangled web we weave.....

 

[mack341]

I doubt the dems will go after nunes, for him to have been chairman of the intel committee means he is 'trusted' by those powerful agencies, fbi, cia etc..

Just watched or rather listened to Giuliani's interview on fox today, he didn't sound overly anxious, a bit cantankerous maybe that the media focus is on him and not biden.

He seemed to be saying parnas was acting as a transalator, which does make sense to some degree.

What was noticeable was the fox presenter not really listening or engaging with what giuliani was saying, I've noticed this before, either the presenters are super intelligent or they only want the conversation to go in one direction, which isn't normal in an organic conversation.

I suppose they have pre-rehearsed questions which they have to stick to. I get the sense a plan 'B' may have been hatched to dump the **** on rudy's doorstep, but he say's he has insurance if this were to happen and kept mentioning working for his client (i.e. trump) so obviously meaning 'I was following my client's directions'

 

[Kroffe]

I doubt the dems will go after nunes, for him to have been chairman of the intel committee means he is 'trusted' by those powerful agencies, fbi, cia etc..

Just watched or rather listened to Giuliani's interview on fox today, he didn't sound overly anxious, a bit cantankerous maybe that the media focus is on him and not biden.

He seemed to be saying parnas was acting as a transalator, which does make sense to some degree.

What was noticeable was the fox presenter not really listening or engaging with what giuliani was saying, I've noticed this before, either the presenters are super intelligent or they only want the conversation to go in one direction, which isn't normal in an organic conversation.

I suppose they have pre-rehearsed questions which they have to stick to. I get the sense a plan 'B' may have been hatched to dump the **** on rudy's doorstep, but he say's he has insurance if this were to happen and kept mentioning working for his client (i.e. trump) so obviously meaning 'I was following my client's directions'

Maybe they were tired of pretending to be presenting real news.

 

[sufferinsilence]

I doubt the dems will go after nunes, for him to have been chairman of the intel committee means he is 'trusted' by those powerful agencies, fbi, cia etc..

Just watched or rather listened to Giuliani's interview on fox today, he didn't sound overly anxious, a bit cantankerous maybe that the media focus is on him and not biden.

He seemed to be saying parnas was acting as a transalator, which does make sense to some degree.

What was noticeable was the fox presenter not really listening or engaging with what giuliani was saying, I've noticed this before, either the presenters are super intelligent or they only want the conversation to go in one direction, which isn't normal in an organic conversation.

I suppose they have pre-rehearsed questions which they have to stick to. I get the sense a plan 'B' may have been hatched to dump the **** on rudy's doorstep, but he say's he has insurance if this were to happen and kept mentioning working for his client (i.e. trump) so obviously meaning 'I was following my client's directions'

Rudy tweeted again tonight:

TRUTH ALERT: The statement I’ve made several times of having an insurance policy, if thrown under bus, is sarcastic & relates to the files in my safe about the Biden Family’s 4 decade monetizing of his office. If I disappear, it will appear immediately along with my RICO chart.

This guy's clearly feeling the pressure.

 

[sufferinsilence]

Maybe they were tired of pretending to be presenting real news.

View attachment 118295

Fox News primetime hosts like Carlson, Ingraham or Hannity aren't journalists but pundits. They're opinion makers, they don't care about the truth but only about ratings.

Chris Wallace and Neil Cavuto are decent journalists.

 

[Kroffe]

Rudy tweeted again tonight:


This guy's clearly feeling the pressure.

Yeah, because if he was to "disappear", it would surely be Biden, and not Trump behind it.

I get that they are opinion-makers pretending to be journalists, but theres a difference to putting a right leaning twist on news and just outright lying about what happens.

 

[mack341]

From Vox: [ a pro dem, deep state defending site ]

In Sondland’s testimony, he openly confirmed that there was a “quid pro quo” offered to Ukraine: Zelensky would get the White House meeting he badly wanted, as long as the Ukrainians publicly announced investigations.

Yet that was only the first quid pro quo at the heart of this scandal. Sondland’s account of the

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and even more scandalous quid pro quo — releasing hundreds of millions of dollars in blocked military aid for Ukraine, in exchange for Ukrainians — is far murkier.

--------------

Sondland texted Taylor:

Bill, I believe you are incorrect about President Trump’s intentions. The President has been crystal clear: no quid pro quo’s of any kind. The President is trying to evaluate whether Ukraine is truly going to adopt the transparency and reforms that President Zelensky promised during his campaign. I suggest we stop the back and forth by text. If you still have concerns, I recommend you give Lisa Kenna or S a call to discuss them directly. Thanks.

That is quite a strong piece of contemporaneous evidence [ I did a bit of legal stuff once, civil, and that term came up in my research ]

I think Trump may have started the ball rolling then had an abrupt change of mind, it was a bluff to see if he could get something out of zelensky and the ukrainians, but he had no real intention of doing a real quid pro quo regarding the military aid, he couldn't hold it up until he got the announcement of investigations he wanted.

It was a poker bluff that failed effectively, is that a high enough crime to be impeached and kicked out of office before his term is over? [ I know: 'yes it is! '] but think about it from the other side, of people who voted trump and believe he's not doing too bad a job leading the country.

Giuliani also said the witnesses in the ukraine wouldn't talk to the cia/doj etc...there was fear or a lack of trust. But they'd talk to rudy, maybe with parnas vouching for him too. I don't think it is far fetched in the real world, but of course it could be rudy making excuses, I don't rule it out either way.

 

[mack341]

Fox News primetime hosts like Carlson, Ingraham or Hannity aren't journalists but pundits. They're opinion makers, they don't care about the truth but only about ratings.

Chris Wallace and Neil Cavuto are decent journalists.

No, they're basically never trumpers and preferred hillary or a rino. They are still biased in how they do interviews and ask questions/ and what their assumptions are, but the bias is in the opposite direction.

I think given a bit less encouragement to attack trump at every opportunity, some of the cnn, abc nbc presenters could do a decent job of being a journalist. As I said to Harry I am all for trump being debated on his policies and record, but instead we mainly get the dumbed down, soap opera for the short attention spans of viewers, which serves no one.

 

[mack341]

Rudy tweeted again tonight:


This guy's clearly feeling the pressure.

Oh right I didn't see that post, that is the problem with rudy and donald they talk in riddles or can be interpreted in several ways. It could be a deliberate tactic, so they can backtrack, or make a implied threat and then say 'oh no, you've read that wrong'
It wouldn't surprise me, they don't like to be tied down and committed to one idea/plan. Which is trump all over regarding NK, the turks, china etc..

Giuliani is keeping some of his cards to himself and waiting for the other side to act first and show their hand.
The other side could be either the dems and the republicans if they try to throw him under the bus

 

[Kroffe]

No, they're basically never trumpers and preferred hillary or a rino. They are still biased in how they do interviews and ask questions/ and what their assumptions are, but the bias is in the opposite direction.

I think given a bit less encouragement to attack trump at every opportunity, some of the cnn, abc nbc presenters could do a decent job of being a journalist. As I said to Harry I am all for trump being debated on his policies and record, but instead we mainly get the dumbed down, soap opera for the short attention spans of viewers, which serves no one.

For people not liking trump they sure have their noses awfully far up his butt.

And if what you say is true, that just means they have zero integrity, and are willing to spread whatever lies they are told as long as they get paid.
Great people.

 

[Harry_BKK]

From Vox: [ a pro dem, deep state defending site ]

In Sondland’s testimony, he openly confirmed that there was a “quid pro quo” offered to Ukraine: Zelensky would get the White House meeting he badly wanted, as long as the Ukrainians publicly announced investigations.

Yet that was only the first quid pro quo at the heart of this scandal. Sondland’s account of the

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and even more scandalous quid pro quo — releasing hundreds of millions of dollars in blocked military aid for Ukraine, in exchange for Ukrainians — is far murkier.

--------------

Sondland texted Taylor:


That is quite a strong piece of contemporaneous evidence [ I did a bit of legal stuff once, civil, and that term came up in my research ]

I think Trump may have started the ball rolling then had an abrupt change of mind, it was a bluff to see if he could get something out of zelensky and the ukrainians, but he had no real intention of doing a real quid pro quo regarding the military aid, he couldn't hold it up until he got the announcement of investigations he wanted.

It was a poker bluff that failed effectively, is that a high enough crime to be impeached and kicked out of office before his term is over? [ I know: 'yes it is! '] but think about it from the other side, of people who voted trump and believe he's not doing too bad a job leading the country.

Giuliani also said the witnesses in the ukraine wouldn't talk to the cia/doj etc...there was fear or a lack of trust. But they'd talk to rudy, maybe with parnas vouching for him to. I don't think it is far fetched in the real world, but of course it could be rudy making excuses, I don't rule it out either way.

I see you are still looking for excuses for Mr T's behaviour. The answer is a clear YES, he had all the intention to pull it through.

The entire thing is going back to Firtash, Zlochevsky, Yanukovitch, Poroshenko, Sholkin, Kulyk and Lutsenko. They and their cronies (a few more Russian-Ukrainian and Ukranian oligarchs) controlled what was happening in Ukraine, and still have quite a grip on it today.

Parnas and Lev are buddies of Firtash, who is fighting an extradition order from the US DOJ. The money which was donated to the Republicans, including Mr T's Reelection Fund as well as Rudy's payment came from Firtash.

Do you see the reason why they wouldn't talk to CIA/DOJ? Criminals prefer to talk to other criminals, not law enforcement.

 

[Harry_BKK]

Rudy tweeted again tonight:


This guy's clearly feeling the pressure.

It is amazing how often these people, including Mr T, spout stuff out and then later say..... just a joke, sarcastic etc.

 

[Harry_BKK]

From Vox: [ a pro dem, deep state defending site ]

In Sondland’s testimony, he openly confirmed that there was a “quid pro quo” offered to Ukraine: Zelensky would get the White House meeting he badly wanted, as long as the Ukrainians publicly announced investigations.

Yet that was only the first quid pro quo at the heart of this scandal. Sondland’s account of the

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

and even more scandalous quid pro quo — releasing hundreds of millions of dollars in blocked military aid for Ukraine, in exchange for Ukrainians — is far murkier.

--------------

Sondland texted Taylor:


That is quite a strong piece of contemporaneous evidence [ I did a bit of legal stuff once, civil, and that term came up in my research ]

I think Trump may have started the ball rolling then had an abrupt change of mind, it was a bluff to see if he could get something out of zelensky and the ukrainians, but he had no real intention of doing a real quid pro quo regarding the military aid, he couldn't hold it up until he got the announcement of investigations he wanted.

It was a poker bluff that failed effectively, is that a high enough crime to be impeached and kicked out of office before his term is over? [ I know: 'yes it is! '] but think about it from the other side, of people who voted trump and believe he's not doing too bad a job leading the country.

Giuliani also said the witnesses in the ukraine wouldn't talk to the cia/doj etc...there was fear or a lack of trust. But they'd talk to rudy, maybe with parnas vouching for him too. I don't think it is far fetched in the real world, but of course it could be rudy making excuses, I don't rule it out either way.

You do know that there were 5 hours between Taylor saying it is crazy to hold back the aid and Sondland sending back the answer with "no quid pro quo". In that time he called Mr T who told him exactly what to say.

Here are the messages the amigos and others involved sent to each other. You tell me how that sounds to you?

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FYI, the Whistleblower report became public knowledge on the 9th September! And the WH and Mr T knew it would! They quickly released the aid on 11th September.

 

[mack341]

What is being overlooked slightly is that poroshenko was close to the americans, so when zelensky won the presidency on the basis of doing things differently, those state dept officials would be busy trying to find out about zelensky, he was an outsider, a stand-up comedian, what did he believe in that was different to his predecessor? [who had a cosy relationship with the west/usa ] so a lot of these calls/meetings could've been about sounding him out re geopolitical issues

The deep state would be disappointed if he got on with trump and saw eye to eye on things, they want the ukraine to confront russia, zelensky may not think that is his priority, he may want to do more of a deal via merkel, remember trump isn't really in favour of going to war with russia or forcing them to leave the crimea, well he wasn't in the 2016 campaign. Fiona hill iirc mentioned something about that, that crimea must be returned to the ukraine, which russia will never agree to while putin is there.

 

[Harry_BKK]

What is being overlooked slightly is that poroshenko was close to the americans, so when zelensky won the presidency on the basis of doing things differently, those state dept officials would be busy trying to find out about zelensky, he was an outsider, a stand-up comedian, what did he believe in that was different to his predecessor? [who had a cosy relationship with the west/usa ] so a lot of these calls/meetings could've been about sounding him out re geopolitical issues

The deep state would be disappointed if he got on with trump and saw eye to eye on things, they want the ukraine to confront russia, zelensky may not think that is his priority, he may want to do more of a deal via merkel, remember trump isn't really in favour of going to war with russia or forcing them to leave the crimea, well he wasn't in the 2016 campaign. Fiona hill iirc mentioned something about that, that crimea must be returned to the ukraine, which russia will never agree to while putin is there.

You do know that Poroshenko is one of the oligarchs? In his case, Ukrainian.

If you look at the country, it is divided between Russian-Ukrainian oligarchs (South and East) and Ukrainian oligarchs (West and North). The latter were of course pro-EU but that didn't make them much better.

I don't know how much you read about Ukraine. It is a complicated case which goes back to the "Wild West" years after the wall came down in the 1990s. Anyone in some position grabbed what was possible. Untangling it all is virtually impossible.

Mr T stepped into the bee nest with both feet (thinking it would benefit him) and will now pay the price for it.

 

[mack341]

For people not liking trump they sure have their noses awfully far up his butt.

And if what you say is true, that just means they have zero integrity, and are willing to spread whatever lies they are told as long as they get paid.
Great people.

wallace and cavuto have attacked trump quite a few times, which I don't object to if it's unbiased, but wallace just echoes the talking points of the new york times or rino opposition to trump like mitt romney.

I think carson has no time for the career politicians and deep state, tricking the public; deep down I don't think he admires or likes trump personally, the brashness and boasting etc.. but he supports the america first idea, sort out the problems closer to home rather than focusing energy, money and effort abroad in places such as afghanistan, ukraine etc..

 

[mack341]

You do know that Poroshenko is one of the oligarchs? In his case, Ukrainian.

If you look at the country, it is divided between Russian-Ukrainian oligarchs (South and East) and Ukrainian oligarchs (West and North). The latter were of course pro-EU but that didn't make them much better.

I don't know how much you read about Ukraine. It is a complicated case which goes back to the "Wild West" years after the wall came down in the 1990s. Anyone in some position grabbed what was possible. Untangling it all is virtually impossible.

Mr T stepped into the bee nest with both feet (thinking it would benefit him) and will now pay the price for it.

That is true Harry and I know you have a much better take on it than me, what will happen eventually to the eastern part, the donbass is it? Will it connect up to russia and sever ties with the rest of the ukraine, kind of become independent due to the number of pro russians and russian speakers?

The UN won't recognise it I guess as a breakaway state, also assuming the gas pipes get built between russia and germany, doesn't this give russia a stronger hand as they can bypass the ukraine?

edit: those years after 1990 were mad really, for the collapse in systems, the break down in law and order, mafias and oligarchs fighting to get their hands on the assets and dough.

 

[Kroffe]

wallace and cavuto have attacked trump quite a few times, which I don't object to if it's unbiased, but wallace just echoes the talking points of the new york times or rino opposition to trump like mitt romney.

I think carson has no time for the career politicians and deep state, tricking the public; deep down I don't think he admires or likes trump personally, the brashness and boasting etc.. but he supports the america first idea, sort out the problems closer to home rather than focusing energy, money and effort abroad in places such as afghanistan, ukraine etc..

So them bashing trump is ok as long as its not biased.
Are we then pretending them attacking Obama,Biden,Hillary etc is done without bias?
Or is bias ok one way but not the other?

 

[mack341]

So them bashing trump is ok as long as its not biased.
Are we then pretending them attacking Obama,Biden,Hillary etc is done without bias?
Or is bias ok one way but not the other?

good question, but you know why fox's ratings are good, because they're basically the only channel that caters for the republican viewer. There's enough channels blowing smoke up obama's and hillary b****m, would be odd for fox to sing their praises as well.

But I kind of agree with you, the mad ranting in the opposite direction is just as unappealing to me, bill o'reilly, hanitty have always struck me as a bit over the top, deceiving viewers when there is a topic to debate.

But the dems by going further to the left [or to pursue more obscure ideas not necessarily classic liberal or left] is making it easier for fox, for example, there should be a good debate on healthcare on all the channels, but it seems bernie and warren have made up their minds how they're going to do it, without having a proper debate/analysis. Then the public mistrust their plans and ask where's the catch? what was the flaw with obamacare, could that not be fixed?

 

[Harry_BKK]

That is true Harry and I know you have a much better take on it than me, what will happen eventually to the eastern part, the donbass is it? Will it connect up to russia and sever ties with the rest of the ukraine, kind of become independent due to the number of pro russians and russian speakers?

The UN won't recognise it I guess as a breakaway state, also assuming the gas pipes get built between russia and germany, doesn't this give russia a stronger hand as they can bypass the ukraine?

edit: those years after 1990 were mad really, for the collapse in systems, the break down in law and order, mafias and oligarchs fighting to get their hands on the assets and dough.

I don't know much more but I have experienced it in my home country (and that has no natural gas). Although, I probably spent on aggregate 5 months in Ukraine and have seen a few things there too. You realize what is going on when a company owner has bodyguards with Uzis and Kalashnikovs.

The Donbass has been a hotspot for centuries. It actually goes back to the Don Cossacks. Very much like the Kurds, they have been thrown between one and the other side multiple times.

Plus, the region together with Crimea changed hands a few times, IIRC the last time after WWI where Crimea was given to Ukraine. Historically, it was part of the Russian Empire, who in turn had close ties to the German royal house. Overall, not really that easy to predict how it will pan out.

 

[mack341]

You realize what is going on when a company owner has bodyguards with Uzzis and Kalaschnikows.

yeah that does rather put things into perspective

the cossacks were always quite loyal to the russians, well in the films on tv that's how they were portrayed, they always liked a good battle and fight...no wonder the pro west ukrainains can't easily beat them, they'll probably be willing to make sacrifices to fight to the end.

The ukraine as an issue hasn't been on our tv news much, the last time was the election of zelensky and obviously the impeachment story now, but not the civil war, maybe there's a ceasefire ongoing.

 

[sufferinsilence]

No, they're basically never trumpers and preferred hillary or a rino. They are still biased in how they do interviews and ask questions/ and what their assumptions are, but the bias is in the opposite direction.

I think given a bit less encouragement to attack trump at every opportunity, some of the cnn, abc nbc presenters could do a decent job of being a journalist. As I said to Harry I am all for trump being debated on his policies and record, but instead we mainly get the dumbed down, soap opera for the short attention spans of viewers, which serves no one.

I'd love to see a healthy interview between Trump and a non-Fox News journalist. With Trump actually answering hard hitting questions instead of avoiding them or trailing off.

 

[Kroffe]

Checkmate @mack341

And since i figured you might not believe it was real, i even got him to sign the tweet!

 

[mack341]

Skeletor [bloomberg] is now officially entering the presidential race for the dems, I can't see him having much of a chance, but like trump his success in the real business world could give him an edge over the other contenders.

And on the dem debate stage he may have a freshness and impetus because he's new, and there's an interest from the public to find out his policy ideas, plus he's got lots of money for campaigning and adverts.

If all the other dem candidates gang up on him in the debates he might struggle, I bet they're pissed off he can enter at this late stage, after they've been slogging it for months.

 

[sufferinsilence]

I'd call Bloomberg the Trump of the democrats when we're talking about the vast amount of capital that's behind him. He might just be what they need to beat Trump next year.

But to be honest here, I have this feeling that Trump might just drop out very late in seeking re-election. I really wonder at this point if his health can handle the pressure of all the meetings, rallies and debates next year.

 

[vorcirion]

Skeletor [bloomberg] is now officially entering the presidential race for the dems, I can't see him having much of a chance, but like trump his success in the real business world could give him an edge over the other contenders.

And on the dem debate stage he may have a freshness and impetus because he's new, and there's an interest from the public to find out his policy ideas, plus he's got lots of money for campaigning and adverts.

If all the other dem candidates gang up on him in the debates he might struggle, I bet they're pissed off he can enter at this late stage, after they've been slogging it for months.

Except he won't be able to be in the debates 'cause of donor thresholds. I don't see him having any chances to win the nomination. Might even help Sanders/Warren since moderates will be splitting the votes between Biden/Buttigieg and now Bloomberg. I hope he just goes away asap.

If Warren wins the nomination...Trump might have a chance to get re-elected. Otherwise I think Trump is screwed.

 

[mack341]

Except he won't be able to be in the debates 'cause of donor thresholds. I don't see him having any chances to win the nomination. Might even help Sanders/Warren since moderates will be splitting the votes between Biden/Buttigieg and now Bloomberg. I hope he just goes away asap.

If Warren wins the nomination...Trump might have a chance to get re-elected. Otherwise I think Trump is screwed.

With the way things normally work out [and also the kind of hollywood storyline] it'll be trump vs biden. I agree Trump may think 'you know I've had enough of all this' and retire to play golf, but if biden is the dem's nominee, then I can't see him walking away after all that has been said. Biden has been looking a bit sharper recently, not mixing his words up so much, more focus.

 

[vorcirion]

With the way things normally work out [and also the kind of hollywood storyline] it'll be trump vs biden. I agree Trump may think 'you know I've had enough of all this' and retire to play golf, but if biden is the dem's nominee, then I can't see him walking away after all that has been said. Biden has been looking a bit sharper recently, not mixing his words up so much, more focus.

I don't see Trump just walking away. His presidency is keeping him away from all the legal troubles that will come. He'll be there until the end unfortunately.

 

[Harry_BKK]

I don't see Trump just walking away. His presidency is keeping him away from all the legal troubles that will come. He'll be there until the end unfortunately.

Yeah, you're right.

"I have absolute immunity"
"Article 2 lets me do what I want"

Him saying that you can see that he loves that immunity.

In my view, he will only drop out when he sees that the Senate is going to remove him after being impeached in the house. If he goes early he will do it on health grounds (bone spurs 2.0) so the next president (Pence) can give him a full pardon. He will then retreat to Mar-a-Lago and keep tweeting nonsense like a manchild until his last breath.

 

[Kroffe]

What even is that nonsense?
Presidential pardon i mean.

"Oh, i dont want my buddies to pay for their crimes, please let them go"

Or are there some limits/qualifications that needs to be met to get a pardon?
Just sounds so bizarre.

 

[Harry_BKK]

What even is that nonsense?
Presidential pardon i mean.

"Oh, i dont want my buddies to pay for their crimes, please let them go"

Or are there some limits/qualifications that needs to be met to get a pardon?
Just sounds so bizarre.

The US president can pardon anyone. The constitution gives him the power.

No limits and no qualifications needed.

EDIT: vorcirion stated correctly, state law is excluded.

 

[vorcirion]

What even is that nonsense?
Presidential pardon i mean.

"Oh, i dont want my buddies to pay for their crimes, please let them go"

Or are there some limits/qualifications that needs to be met to get a pardon?
Just sounds so bizarre.

There are some limits. He can't pardon people who have broken state laws (which are different from federal laws). But beyond that he can pardon about anyone for anything I guess. Including war criminals it seems.

 

[Kroffe]

The US president can pardon anyone. The constitution gives him the power.

No limits and no qualifications needed.

Thats just about the dumbest thing i have ever heard,
So he can just set all his criminal buddies free before he leaves or are forced to leave his post as president?

Wonder if he can pardon debt.
Would probably be a popular move to pardon the countless of people that have their life ruined because of the insanse hospital bills they get over there.

Must be a good move to befriend a doctor if you live in the usa and cant afford healthcare.
Maybe you can run over to him to get your appendicitis removed in his garage or something instead of going into lifelong debt.

And half the country is fighting to keep things as they are.
Insane.

 

[mack341]

Oh he's just sacked the head of the navy

 

[Kroffe]

Speaking of navy, or marines more like it, or wait, marine life.
They found a biiiig Great white shark recently.
6 meters, or if you are using an inferior system, 20 feet.

 

[mack341]

Speaking of navy, or marines more like it, or wait, marine life.
They found a biiiig Great white shark recently.
6 meters, or if you are using an inferior system, 20 feet.

Is that real footage or CGI ? How comes the shark didn't attack when she touched it's fin

I've always been terrified of sharks after watching Jaws. I think the sharks in dinosaur times were huge, unbelievable!:

 

[Kroffe]

Is that real footage or CGI ? How comes the shark didn't attack when she touched it's fin

I've always been terrified of sharks after watching Jaws. I think the sharks in dinosaur times were huge, unbelievable!:

View attachment 118339

Its real footage.
Sharks dont like eating humans, they prefer seals. =)
Most shark attacks are due to their shitty eyesight, they confuse us for prey, mostly seals.

That being said, according to the comments on the reddit thread, swimming that close, and touching Sharks is not good. Partly because its dangerous, but also the whole "dont disturb the wildlife while filming" bit. That goes for most all nature-filming, you are not supposed to intervene/interact with the wildlife.

 

[dionysus]

Is that real footage or CGI ? How comes the shark didn't attack when she touched it's fin

I've always been terrified of sharks after watching Jaws. I think the sharks in dinosaur times were huge, unbelievable!:

View attachment 118339

ya it's been on a few news outlets as well

 

[dionysus]

Is that real footage or CGI ? How comes the shark didn't attack when she touched it's fin

I've always been terrified of sharks after watching Jaws. I think the sharks in dinosaur times were huge, unbelievable!:

View attachment 118339

id have to look, but while the megadalon is huge, I think the blue whale is roughly 3 buses long