Whine and Moan Just lost 11k of winnings at 32red due to "pending withdrawals"

[paul7388]

feel sorry for the OP.

But what really does my head in etc. is all the garbage that people that reverse withdrawals have gambling problems etc. and need help, and if they withdrew it they would just gamble it elsewhere.

That is just not always correct. Pending withdrawals are just often treated as different from money in the bank. I have done it myself many a time reversed a withdrawal especially at weekends. Its just a mentality where I deposited only £20 so the say £300 pending was never mine anyway so sometimes I reverse it and waste it. Big difference is that if ive £300 in my bank I don't deposit it into the casino.

 

[dunover]

Can I ask is it the same at other casinos that if you reverse some winnings then the clock stats again?, so say for instance I reverse from 32red 23 hrs into pending time then it goes back to 24hrs

No, the clock DOESN'T reset at 32red as long as you don't reverse ALL the request. You can take part, leave the rest and that will stay to the time you initiated it. Leastways it did when I took £20 quid back at either Nedplay or Golden Lounge a while back.
Unless they've changed that too?

 

[mimi26]

No, the clock DOESN'T reset at 32red as long as you don't reverse ALL the request. You can take part, leave the rest and that will stay to the time you initiated it. Leastways it did when I took £20 quid back at either Nedplay or Golden Lounge a while back.
Unless they've changed that too?

I think they have judging by the Ops initial post, I know they have also stopped paying out twice a day, now it is just once in the afternoon

 

[aceking123]

ah i got sucked in the other day over at 32red so there you go, could of taken £1600 quid but dicked back down to £800 , bahhh i didn't mind ( reversing ) , mind you since then i've played twice & now i wouldn't play over the weekend any longer , the casino may well have had the £800 back but its going to hurt them more than me because my deposits over last week or so have been cut down to a £150 a week & ive had little play this week , so next week another £25 coming off that & so forth until maybe i shall indeed just play a couple of times a month at different casinos.

this months drought hasn't really helped the casinos , its been another brutal month of endless crap unless ive paid for the wins , so thinking about it im going to cut back even more , better things to do like playing pool tonight

ps feel for the OP but hay you know what your doing , just dont do it !

 

[davdav5678]

ah i got sucked in the other day over at 32red so there you go, could of taken £1600 quid but dicked back down to £800 , bahhh i didn't mind ( reversing ) , mind you since then i've played twice & now i wouldn't play over the weekend any longer , the casino may well have had the £800 back but its going to hurt them more than me because my deposits over last week or so have been cut down to a £150 a week & ive had little play this week , so next week another £25 coming off that & so forth until maybe i shall indeed just play a couple of times a month at different casinos.

this months drought hasn't really helped the casinos , its been another brutal month of endless crap unless ive paid for the wins , so thinking about it im going to cut back even more , better things to do like playing pool tonight

ps feel for the OP but hay you know what your doing , just dont do it !

I cut back a lot of depositing from their group too , Same sort of thing

 

[muziq]

guys pls pls pls dont reverse a withdrawal jus dont do it

if you like to play after made a withdrawal just make a deposit some where else preferably with a bonus

so you will get some play time and if you are on a streak u wil get wins reversing a 500 and 5 deposits of 100 is a completely different scenario

when you lost 3 or 4 deposits you will stop depositing and your ca shouts are safe where as if you reverse 500 you will try to make it to 5000 again

and as dunover and others said in the process you will lose it all


so just be stone hearted after making a withdrwal

 

[spintee]

Ive got £295 sitting waiting to be reversed, They can think again (not 32) I just made a mino deposit on BGO with a bonus

 

[davdav5678]

Ive got £295 sitting waiting to be reversed, They can think again (not 32) I just made a mino deposit on BGO with a bonus

lol yer play them at their own game withdraw it and enjoy lol

Ask yourself why do I gamble to win or feed a habit (Not you spintee) this for the first post of the thread

Win anything withdraw it ,Never reserve it looking for a big win that wont happen never does .Be lucky and feel lucky what you get its really that simple :notworthy

You have to think of it this way ,You deposited say £20 quid win big .Why spend it lol you have a problem if you spending massive amounts to be honest .A casino a business at the end of the day .Cant keep blaming this casino's .

You have to make the right choice in life make the right one for your self and stop moaning .:thumbsu

I agree for some of these honest posts some poor sod more then lost for someone to get a win and you flush it down the toilet

I wish I won 11k .Could have done with it lol

 

[hedgehok]

You can just make another deposit and leave the "pending withdrawal"?

It won't jeoperdize any pending winnings - and if your budget is gone - thats it.

 

[dunover]

You can just make another deposit and leave the "pending withdrawal"?

It won't jeoperdize any pending winnings - and if your budget is gone - thats it.

True, but some sites won't permit deposits while w/d's are pending. 32red will, but be sure before you deposit you will get a nice big reminder that you have '£xxx.xx available for reversal'..........

 

[goatwack]

I think one of the main problems I've encountered in the past is actually having won more from reversed funds and increasing my initial withdrawal amount.

This lucky occurrence will make you believe that reversing is ok and thereby one more reversal can't hurt. I believe that dipping into your 'winnings' once is generally acceptable but any more than that is seriously asking for trouble.

Even worse than this is when you process a withdrawal and leave yourself a healthy amount to play with, only to lose that too. This is what can cause us to reverse more often than not as it not real money as yet, having not hit the old magical bank account.

Trying to end that dopamine fix and calling it a day on a good session is bloody hard and I commend those that have the resolve to see out such a long pending period & my sympathies to the OP.

 

[chayton]

I've been there OP - I actually wrote a blog post about reversing a withdrawal awhile back. My experience has been with smaller amounts, but still it's money that should have ended up in my pocket and not in the casino.

One of the things that helps me (not all the time, but sometimes ) to keep from reversing is to get out of the mindset that my winnings aren't real until the balance is safe in the bank. I have blithely reversed and lost $500 on several occasions, when the thought of depositing and risking $500 of my own money makes me feel a little queasy.

Anyhow what I do now, if I have a big win I think about what I'm going to use it for, and I make a list. I stick the list to my monitor and if I get the urge to reverse, I have to sacrifice something on my list, because chances are good that I'm going to lose that money back. I don't know if it will work for everyone, but for me having an actual physical something there helps the money feel more like mine and the idea of crossing off something you want and can now (thanks to this win) afford, is a good deterrent.

 

[Harry_BKK]

Just as predicted

I think they have judging by the Ops initial post, I know they have also stopped paying out twice a day, now it is just once in the afternoon

Exactly what i predicted as next move just about 4 weeks ago. So in the past 12 months 32RED has changed these (values they started their casino more than 10 years ago):

- no more weekend payouts
- no automatic flushing, manual on request for Club Rouge members and a few chosen ones.
- massive downgrades from top loyalty tiers at all 4 casinos
- no more manual flushing
- mandatory 24hr pending period
- from 2 payment runs to 1/day

Can everybody see this slice by slice tactic happening to keep the shock/protest for/of players at the lowest possible?

An Pat has the cheek to call this improving the player experience (in an email message to me)

next on the list:
- lower bonus amounts (already happening with at least 1 x 10% & 2 x 25% DOTD/week, more to come or better said less)
- live chat only during business hours, Mo-Fr
- charges for withdrawals (not very probable)

Yet 32RED still sits on a 9.1 grading, it should be closer to 8 IMO as the only things they have to offer now is half decent promotions and reliable payments.

Seen exactly the same happening at The Palace Group & Fortune Lounge after becoming big outfits...and yet they are still in business as there are plenty of players among some 6.5B people on this planet. Same goes for 32RED, they reached a certain size where losing a few players over some changes won't matter anymore.

 

[goatwack]

I've been there OP - I actually wrote a blog post about reversing a withdrawal awhile back. My experience has been with smaller amounts, but still it's money that should have ended up in my pocket and not in the casino.

One of the things that helps me (not all the time, but sometimes ) to keep from reversing is to get out of the mindset that my winnings aren't real until the balance is safe in the bank. I have blithely reversed and lost $500 on several occasions, when the thought of depositing and risking $500 of my own money makes me feel a little queasy.

Anyhow what I do now, if I have a big win I think about what I'm going to use it for, and I make a list. I stick the list to my monitor and if I get the urge to reverse, I have to sacrifice something on my list, because chances are good that I'm going to lose that money back. I don't know if it will work for everyone, but for me having an actual physical something there helps the money feel more like mine and the idea of crossing off something you want and can now (thanks to this win) afford, is a good deterrent.

When I see bank notes lying around the house it does make you wonder at the flippancy and general disregard I have when it comes to gambling on occasion.

The problem lies with most gamblers' see that number to the bottom left of their screen as merely credits and therefore not real, a means to an end. When you gamble you go in the zone and detach yourself not just emotionally but physically in the sense that - like you stated- you don't realize what you are actually risking from a winning position. At least till it dawns on you when there is a big fat zero

I had to go to my bank the other day to get a statement printed and quipped about a few minor casual deposits I had made in that calendar month.
The cashier responded by saying 'you have to speculate to accumulate'.

What's the world coming to when strangers are encouraging you to gamble too LOL

 

[Harry_BKK]

The last thread didn't result in any reversal of decision(s), so perhaps speaking-up directly to those at the casino, rather than in an anonymous forum would prove more effective(?).

I wrote to Pat, Ed and Jonathan... all the answers i got were: "These changes are in no way related to our share price nor made because of financial necessities but to improve the player experience. The downgrading from top loyalty tiers is to reflect better the players patronage and benefits for lower tiers will be improved".

I don't think i was the only one who wrote to them, so they are clearly not listening. The only thing left now is to protest/write in a forum and hope that the "noise" will be one day loud enough for them to hear it.

 

[syntynyt]

In other words, they know damn well over a year they will save a small fortune by isolating the weak from the strong-willed. They know damn well that when a player hits big, they'll be on a high, leave their PC happy thinking they are on a winning streak. They know after cooling down for a few hours, the player will hit a psychological comfort zone and think along the lines of "I have got £5,000 on the way to me, I'm £4900 better-off than this morning, so if I play another £400 I can't lose, I'll still be £4,500 better-off than I was when I woke up."

Repeat this above thought process until the whole lot is spunked back. The casinos are fully aware of gamblers' psychology.

I WOULD PUT THIS QUOTE IN MY SIG. SO WELL SAID! AND SO ME

 

[Greigssy]

Since the UKGC appear to be so hot on responsible gaming with deposit limits etc. I wonder if they're fully aware of situations and business practices like these? maybe it needs mentioned to them

Where someone could have a deposit limit of say £500, fulfil that limit, get a big win of say £10k, 'attempt' to withdraw that £10k, and then effectively be able to 're-deposit' that whole 10K over the next 3 or 4 days, bypassing any safety limits.

This couldn't happen at a casino where there's no pending period, EVEN AFTER the payment has reached their bank because of the deposit limit they'd previously set.

If a casino needs or wants to have pending period, for their 'customers convenience' then the amount reversible should be tied to any deposit limits that might have been set by a customer. Or alternatively a separate 'reversal limit' should be available.

Anything else is NOT responsible gaming

This is maybe for a different thread or new discussion but this is definitely not responsible. At some casinos and I'm positive Betsafe do or did do this, is they have deposit limits and withdrawals calculated as a net value.

For example:
If I deposit £50 and my limit is £100 per month and I make a withdrawal for £300, my deposit limit would now be £350 until it resets. So any time you make a withdrawal you are always able to deposit it back.

This is wrong on so many levels.

 

[cncas123]

This is the whole reason WHY casinos have pending periods. Not for cost, not for customer 'convenience' (as they all know without fear of contradiction customers prefer quick withdrawals as their prime convenience) but to play the percentage game...

In other words, they know damn well over a year they will save a small fortune by isolating the weak from the strong-willed. They know damn well that when a player hits big, they'll be on a high, leave their PC happy thinking they are on a winning streak. They know after cooling down for a few hours, the player will hit a psychological comfort zone and think along the lines of "I have got £5,000 on the way to me, I'm £4900 better-off than this morning, so if I play another £400 I can't lose, I'll still be £4,500 better-off than I was when I woke up."

Repeat this above thought process until the whole lot is spunked back. The casinos are fully aware of gamblers' psychology.

Simple answer to the OP and others like them, do your homework and find out the casinos like Guts/bet-at, Sky, Grosvenor etc. and STICK TO THEM.

KK - I think you are being unfair in suggesting the OP would have spunked it all back by re-depositing if paid fast. When they saw the glow of that in their bank account, how do you know they wouldn't have gone up the local garage and bought a new motor? Being weak-willed when the money is in the casino account is a very different matter from being weak-willed when seeing it on the display of your bank's ATM......

This hits the nail on the head, and its the reason that some sites will push out the pending period as long as they can - I have seen 4 day pending periods, and the norm would generally be 2 days in my experience. And there is no such thing as responsible gambling on any sites that have these pending periods, as every time you log in to your account, you have a big flashing message to remind you that you have a pending withdrwawal that can still be reversed...........................

 

[silcnlayc]

Just curious

Why would a player reverse a withdrawal that they worked so hard to get?

I know , I finally wised up many years ago and have about 20 casinos in different platforms that I play at and I think the second time I reversed a good withdrawal many moons ago, and lost the lot..I was so disgusted with myself, I decided that day, to never reverse again.

This has been many years ago. To this day, I have not reversed a withdrawal since. I haven't even had one bit of need to reverse a pending withdrawal, even having to wait for a 15 day pending period in the cashier window and I am even able to wait the 30 days at the given casino it takes to process. The key for me was numerous casinos in the same platform.

Once I make a withdraw...I write it down on my list and move to another casino if I still feel the need to play. At any given time, I would have between 3-5 withdrawals pending (reason the need for the list to keep track of who owes me). It now is fun to see how many I can put on the list for my withdrawals. The most so far was 6 at any given time..working for ten now!

I play almost every day, that is why I need so many casinos, to be able to continue to play while my pending go to approvals..give it a try next time. Stop thinking about it as if it was there to play with once you hit that withdraw button. Think like, if you touch that button again, it will shock you (the reversing)...You can also try to think of it as if it was not longer there ...just a tip to help become a little stronger from reversing...

.

 

[hoff1985]

If you have a big problem with pending withdrawals you dhould only stik casinos that offer you to flush. i know how much it sucks if you loose a pending deposit, i was also not always strong, but either way you are very strict with yourself or ir this is not possible only play casinos that flush.

 

[simon1316]

I have the exact same stories as the OP with 32Red.. but for me it's 16K (from a 150$ deposit) that was lost back .. 32Red account closed, and will think and think again of the 32red e-mail of 'we didn't flush anymore, and pending period of at least 24h..

 

[Tropicana50]

I think it would be fairly easy to create an application which could block any reverse withdrawal buttons on the casinos. You could leave it running on your taskbar and the only way to get rid of it would be to wait X amount of days. Similar to a NetNanny style program JUST for removing this reverse button option. Then as others have said, it is no longer an issue.

I may look into making such an application, I don't think it would be too difficult or time consuming to create if there was a genuine interest for it...

- T

 

[Harry_BKK]

I think it would be fairly easy to create an application which could block any reverse withdrawal buttons on the casinos. You could leave it running on your taskbar and the only way to get rid of it would be to wait X amount of days. Similar to a NetNanny style program JUST for removing this reverse button option. Then as others have said, it is no longer an issue.

I may look into making such an application, I don't think it would be too difficult or time consuming to create if there was a genuine interest for it...

- T

Nice thought T, would certainly help. To my knowledge MG has this option build into the software already, operators just need to activate it but certainly will not do so unless dictated by the LGA or other legislation as this is their best cashcow. I remember when Fortune Lounge introduced the pending period some 3 years ago their profits jumped by over 30%, so I don't see 32RED doing anything which would jeopardise this extra profit.

 

[Perc]

Going back to the original post, you didn't really lose 11k due to this policy... If they would have flushed/processed your original withdrawal of 4k, that would have been the end of it.

Instead, after all the reversing and withdrawing, you ended up with 2k. Still a loss from the original amount, but only 2k was lost due to your first withdrawal not being processed quickly or flushed.

You could have quit at 11k, and then you would have been quite happy that you were able to reverse some of your first withdrawal...

If they didn't have the reverse option and you got your 4k, you could get upset about the potential 7k "loss"...

There's a bunch of ways you can look at it, with all sorts of possible outcomes, some good some bad. It all comes down to the player and the choices he/she makes, nobody is forced to reverse just because the option is there.

If you can't control the urge to reverse a withdrawal, how can you control the urge to deposit money that you can't afford? That's why people get worried that you may have a gambling problem in these types of situations.

I will agree that the money doesn't really feel like "real money" until it's in your bank, you just have to remind yourself that it is very real, and it's yours as soon as you hit that withdrawal button.

 

[Tropicana50]

Nice thought T, would certainly help. To my knowledge MG has this option build into the software already, operators just need to activate it but certainly will not do so unless dictated by the LGA or other legislation as this is their best cashcow. I remember when Fortune Lounge introduced the pending period some 3 years ago their profits jumped by over 30%, so I don't see 32RED doing anything which would jeopardise this extra profit.

It would be nice to create an application that could cover any casino, web based or download based. Making an app search for a reverse button and then modifying the output would be pretty simple. Could even make it casino specific. It would just nullify the button to make it inactive. (You would still see it but not be able to click it).

- T