Intercasino??

[caruso]

There is nothing but conjecture and unsubstantiated allegation in this thread, and absolutely no reason for anyone post about "winning streaks" by way of counter balance.

I don't usually take detailed notes of my play, but I decided to run a Crypto test with the intention of posting the results here and putting a stop to the "they must be clawing back that $111,000 Tsunami donation" theorists.

227 hands. Three bet sizes: $5, $30 and 25.

Win: 103
Lose: 107
Push: 17

Dbl win: 15
Dbl lose: 11
Dbl push: 1

Spl win: 2
Spl lose: 2
Spl push: 1

BJ: 14
DBJ: 13

There is absolutely nothing wrong with Crypto.

 

[vgyhnji]

It ain't gonna happen too often but I couldn't agree with Caruso more!

Perhaps you could confirm which Crypto you played at Caruso?

Regardless, and regardless of the sample size 227 hands for Caruso, 623 hands for boogaooga, I posted here the results of over 22,000 Crypto hands which showed a 'fair' result. At any period during those hands a snippet could easily have shown stats like boogaooga's or the other way round, I know they would but I ain't going to trawl through those hands again just to prove it.

We will all experience wacky and wonderful winning and losing sessions, its the nature of the game. Problem is few people concentrate on or post about the 'fair' ones.

 

[vgyhnji]

It might be worth adding that I have recently had bad sessions at other Crypto's, for instance at UKBetting a short and nasty one:

Hands decided = 78
Wins = 27 = 34.62%
Losses = 51 = 65.38%

Double/splits won = 5
Double/splits lost = 9

Blackjacks = 2 = ave 1 in 39!

Awful session but not long and not worth pursuing.

 

[caruso]

Play was at Intercasino US, Intercasino UK, Ritz, Total Bet and William Hill.

I've now added a bit more, from subsequent play. The overall updated figures are:

577 total hands.

Win: 273
Lose: 264
Push: 40

Dbl win: 46
Dbl lose: 16
Dbl push: 4

Spl win: 4
Spl lose: 5
Spl push: 2

BJ: 30
DBJ: 31

Wins: 47% (average 43%)
Losses: 46% (average 49%)
Pushes: 7% (average 9%)

BJs: 5.2% (average 4.8%)

Overall return: 109% (average approx. 99.85%)

"Streaks report" - we love our streaks:

Longest uninterrupted winning streak: 10 (9 wins and a push).
Longest uninterrupted losing streak: 12 (9 losses and 3 pushes).
Most consecutive units won without loss: 10.5.
Most consecutive units lost without win: 9.

Once again, no evidence of any problems at Crypto.

 

[cpgator]

Well, I am happy to report that for me,the long losing streak at Intercasino has ended. I have had several winning sessions in the last week mixed in with a couple of losing ones. As I said before I mostly play blackjack. I usually play the single deck version of the game at $25 a hand and have had sessions where I came out $2000-$5000 thousand ahead a few times over the last couple of years. These recent wins have all been in the $400-$700 range, but I'll take them.
Also, for the first time that I can recall, I have received a Saturday night (EST) withdrawal back in my account this morning (Sunday). In the past any Friday, Saturday, or Sunday withdrawals were not in my Neteller account until Monday Or Tuesday afternoon. Interestingly a larger withdrawal from Friday has not been processed.

 

[boogaooga]

Play was at Intercasino US, Intercasino UK, Ritz, Total Bet and William Hill.

I've now added a bit more, from subsequent play. The overall updated figures are:

577 total hands.

With all due respect, I'm not really sure what you're trying to prove here. The complaint here is about Intercasino specifically, so giving us the stats of a bunch of different casinos muddled together, just because they share the same software, is of no real use. And my stats as listed in my original posted were both for more hands than yours, and all at the same casino (Intercasino US).

Congratulations to you if you've won overall from these casinos (I personally have had my fair share of good luck with William Hill too). But I'm not sure how this is supposed to be some sort of refutation of the statistics I posted.

 

[dickens1298]

With all due respect, I'm not really sure what you're trying to prove here. The complaint here is about Intercasino specifically, so giving us the stats of a bunch of different casinos muddled together, just because they share the same software, is of no real use. And my stats as listed in my original posted were both for more hands than yours, and all at the same casino (Intercasino US).

Congratulations to you if you've won overall from these casinos (I personally have had my fair share of good luck with William Hill too). But I'm not sure how this is supposed to be some sort of refutation of the statistics I posted.

I believe the overriding assumption is that the same software works the same across casinos, and that casinos cannot "tweak" the software accordingly. If that assumption is true, then caruso's play at the aforementioned IS relevant, since it reflects play at Crypto casinos (the same software used by Intercasino) and is almost equal to your number of hands (roughly 600).

Personally, I take umbrage whenever someone cries "foul!" at the fairness of online casinos. The simplest answer is to not play. Crypto casinos are undeniably streaky, and learning to live with such streaks are part of the learning process. My results are equally streaky - I can lose my entire stake just as easily as winning $3000 (as I did last month).

 

[mac_user]

You can't assume anything when it comes to software-based games. If you think that just because a casino (online or land-based) has a good reputation it can't be cheating players, think again. Do a little research on the American Coin slot machine scandal before you risk any serious money on any computer driven game offered by any casino.

Here's an update on the lawsuit against Cryptologic:

LITIGATION AGAINST CRYPTOLOGIC SETTLED (from online-casinos.com)

Multi-million dollar Websports case dropped

Litigation by WebSports Technologies against Cryptologic has been settled out of court for an undisclosed sum, according to its president, Nick Murphy.

Following press releases from the company, Online-Casinos.com has been following the long-running story since the court action was filed in Toronto on November 22, 2002.

Court File No. 02 CV 240094 CM alleged that Cryptologic Inc. a TSX, Nasdaq and AIM listed company, breached a contract and in order to do so attempted to falsify the outcome of a software testing procedure being conducted by TST Testing systems North America to certify the ProSportsTrade Exchange Game created by WebSports Technologies Inc. to Tasmanian gaming standards.

The case, scheduled for hearing on June 20 this year has now been withdrawn.

Cryptologic had earlier dismissed the claims as "frivolous and without merit," and stated that it would vigorously contest the allegations.

This week Murphy said that WebSports was now moving forward and planned to launch its Pro Sports Exchange product in time for the upcoming NFL season.

 

[Gluten]

After that I switched to single-hand BJ at the $2 minimum and crashed out completely a few hundred hands later - but that's not surprising, considering by that point I only had a 13-bet stake.

I thought the minimum at Inter's SD BJ was 25$?

 

[jpsartre]

He's talking about single-hand BJ, not singe-deck.

 

[KasinoKing]

With all due respect, I'm not really sure what you're trying to prove here. The complaint here is about Intercasino specifically, so giving us the stats of a bunch of different casinos muddled together, just because they share the same software, is of no real use. And my stats as listed in my original posted were both for more hands than yours, and all at the same casino (Intercasino US).

Congratulations to you if you've won overall from these casinos (I personally have had my fair share of good luck with William Hill too). But I'm not sure how this is supposed to be some sort of refutation of the statistics I posted.

I don't want to add too much to the 'conspiracy theories' but I do tend to agree with the above.
I regularly play both Intercasino & Will Hill and definitely feel I get a fairer game at Will Hill.
I don't know for sure, but my guess is Intercasino is owned by Cryptologic (or the other way around?), because they always have the new games first. And I agree that just because they are very big and 'reputable', does not mean they would not tweak the software a tiny bit in their favour. With very clever software (as it undoubtedly is) it would be virtually impossible for us mere players to detect/prove. Just a tiny % on the house edge would means $1,000's for them! Think about it....

Have fun - be careful

 

[gfkostas]

This conversation about online casinos cheating will keep going on till armaggedon visit us.If there are no factual evidence i find it a bit 'cowboy attitude' to throw allegations at casinos.Maybe a person gets notified everytime I high roller comes in so he can mainipulate some of his hands..... .You can never know as long as the nature of the games is online.Maybe the online Live casinos will put an end even though I hear rumours that they dont shuffle the decks properly etc. etc.

 

[vedat]

there is no way of a cheating software at cryptologic

hello as i am sure of willhill and intercasino is a very large and big companys they would not damage their reputaions with a bad software there is no other online casinos that you are insured when you win they pay fast no bullshit plus they give monthly bonus every month so if you had some bad sessions its very easy to blame casino

 

[jamiester]

"streaky" = "cheating"

Crypto casinos are undeniably streaky, and learning to live with such streaks are part of the learning process. My results are equally streaky - I can lose my entire stake just as easily as winning $3000 (as I did last month).

I have seen a lot of people say this type of thing in my short time on this forum, and it seems strange. If software is "streaky" then it is not behaving randomly. Even if the overall payout % is correct, if certain results are more likely at certain times than others, this is not random. Fair software would be no more or less streaky than honest and real life situations. If someone proved to me that a casino had "streaky" software, I would not play there.
Don't get me wrong, I know there are streaks in gambling, it is just that if there are two fair casinos, there is no way one could tend to be more streaky than another. At least, no way I can think of.

 

[mitch]

Why would any casino alter generic software which gives them an edge on every bet made?

Ever heard of the Golden Goose?

I wish there really was a casino with software set up to be streaky, whilst still delivering overall results in line with probability.

I would guarantee to make a million in no time at all playing there. Plenty of other players would do the same.

Casinos aren't stupid, they don't need to cheat to win, they are automatic winners, as long as they have a large enough mass of players gambling there.

Mitch

 

[Tdoggy]

Agree

Got to agree. Ever here of "the house edge" Yeah in most cases they are going to win. Now as far as fixed software yeah I believe there is some out there indeed

 

[jamiester]

Not all are fair

Why would any casino alter generic software which gives them an edge on every bet made?

I don't know, to give them more of an edge? We hear about it all the time. Also, if you have streaky games, you can create winning streaks which are more memorable even if you are taking a few points. I am not saying this latter point happens, only that it is a potential rationale.

But my main point is that if it is a fair casino, their games couldn't be any more streaky than any other fair casinos. This "streakiness" is most likely just being imagined by the gambler.

 

[toofast4u]

I am on the 'conspiriacy' side of things. While playing at crypto casinos I have seen things happen that just seem to be a little too ironic for me. Think about it, you really think a casino wouldn't fix software to make an extra buck or two?? While there has been so many people analyizing the data I still think there is something deeper that we are missing. The only real way to find out is to have someone with some inside information. But if there is such information out there I think whoever stepped up and said something would get shut up really quick.

You can scream 'fair game' all you want, but I trust my gut feeling, and its telling me 'stay away'. If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck then it must be a duck.

I am leaning a little more towards the 'win' being based off of previous results. It would be fairly easy to program the software to make player X lose Y of Z units over a given# of games.

In my experience with crypto, usually you can win, sometimes a substantial amount right after you create an account and make your first few deposits. But then a time afterwards you will consistently be losing 10+ hands in a row, it does seem to be very on and off. I remember that when I was playing, if I were making sizable bets, after a few hands a 10+ hand losing streat would start, but after dropping the bet down to a small amount it definitely loosened up. My best strategy was to vary the bets a great deal, which always seemed to initate maybe a 2-3 win in a row. Don't ask me how this was effective but it seemed to work. Its when you start making say $25 bets and never change, then you hit a brick wall. I did notice something of interest too, when hitting that X number of losses in a row, drop down to a low bet and count how many times in a row you lose. usually that # of losses would leave you with $0 in the account if you stay at that higher betting level, infact almost exactly the number of hands needed to clean house in most cases, the first win would have been the hand after the hand that would have cleaned you out. Just something to chew on Not something I will ever experiment with but you guys can have at it.

 

[mac_user]

"The only real way to find out is to have someone with some inside information. But if there is such information out there I think whoever stepped up and said something would get shut up really quick."

That's true and it's already happened. It did not involve an online casino, but the principle is the same. To find out what happened to a programmer who talked, read this story:

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