ICE - Player issues and questions

[The Dude]

Hi All,

Well here I am, sitting in my Hotel room getting ready for the ICE. If you don't already know, the ICE is the largest Gaming conference in the world that incorporates iGaming as well. Besides meeting people, my mission is to collect information and ask questions.

This is where your role comes into play. If you have any questions or issues you'd like we to deal with - post 'em here.

Thanks!

Now I'm off to the British Museum

 

[RobWin]

Bryan, how about checking with RTG if they actually show up there and see why they have not replaced Montana yet and what their plans are. Check and see if MG or any of the casino groups are working on getting us "US Players" more payment options and try not to drink too much beer while you're there...

 

[Slotster!]

Enjoy Londinium! I see you've got typical British weather for it!

I'll be the first of many to say...

"If you catch up with the Wagerworks lot -- I want a big, resounding, representative of the WHOLE Casinomeister community... WHERE'S ELVIS!?!?!??!"

Ta

 

[vinylweatherman]

See if you can get Microgaming to come clean about the following:-

1) Weighted old style 5 reel video slots.
2) The multiplayer tournament "connection delays"
3) The long standing unresolved bugs with the software.
4) The issue of "wrong currency" when no bonuses are involved, just WHY is this a big problem, when the random game model says it shouldn't be.
5) Why MiniVegas can accept Neteller deposits, but seem very reluctant to pay out via Neteller.
6) The findings that some progressives pay 90% or less over the long term (assuming they are random), from mathematical analysis and slot simulation software.

RTG

Exactly what scope do operators have to alter the payouts on the games, in particular, how low can it be set for slots, given that the expectation is for around a 95% return.

Playtech

Why do they single out only the BRITISH with their venom, accusing us of all being bad players cheats, and fraudsters.

Spam

Reputable casinos doing nothing to stop affiliate spam - we expect this from the rogues, but not from the stable of accredited casinos here, nor the wider number of reputable casinos in the business.


Poor standards of customer service, including ignored Emails, patronising and/or idiotic replies. CS seemingly unable to read the Email they are responding to, and CS not knowing enough about the casino and promotional rules to give the players correct information.

 

[cheekymonkey]

If MG are there, can you ask them why I've never hit 5 wilds in 7-8 years of almost daily online play on either Ladies Nite, Thunderstruck or Spring Break?

Cheers.

 

[The Dude]

Enjoy Londinium! I see you've got typical British weather for it!

I'll be the first of many to say...

"If you catch up with the Wagerworks lot -- I want a big, resounding, representative of the WHOLE Casinomeister community... WHERE'S ELVIS!?!?!??!"

Ta

Actually, Wagerworks contacted me last week stating that Elvis will be released this week

 

[Matthew23]

If MG are there, can you ask them why I've never hit 5 wilds in 7-8 years of almost daily online play on either Ladies Nite, Thunderstruck or Spring Break?

Cheers.

Remember if you make 100 spins every single day, on average it will take over a hundred years to hit...

 

[Slotster!]

Actually, Wagerworks contacted me last week stating that Elvis will be released this week

RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!



Bye bye all my money!

 

[SlotMonster]

Few questions

I think these questions can be delivered to all software providers (MG, RTG, etc.):

1. What the main goals for future year (and all next)?
2. Are you going to implement any kind of Randomness Control? or "Invariability Control" ?
See my post for more info:
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/betvoyager-com-any-opinion.20483/
I'm still sure that they (SW providers) must provide us with this option. It doesn't require huge code changes. Just another feature in SW.
3. Improving quality of CS
4. Increasing speed of payouts.

I think that's quite enough

 

[Rusty]

All of what VWM says and
All software why do they not put expected payout of each slot in the paytable.

MG

Why are there statistical anomalies in many games involving the scatter symbols especially.
A specific anomaly would be the amount of times scatters appear on either the first Two reels or last Two reels without the feature being triggered/ best example Halloweenies slot.


RTG

Why does the reel animation reset in mid spin for periods of play but not all the time and how is it these periods coincide with low returns.

You may want to rephrase those in a more diplomatic manner but they are valid questions IMHO.

Have fun!

 

[GaryWatson]

Ask the sites if they have any plans to post winning percentages on each game, as they do on real machines in the UK. People generally dont bother reading the signs but it is there for all to see

 

[brianzz]

Ask Rival, if they show up, if they'll ever either fix the paytable and bonus spin information on Wheel Of Cash, which now states free spins are paid at 5X pay when they're really 1X pay

 

[Rob]

Ask about 'reverse withdrawal'.
Many times have I been tempted to do just that, luckily I have not caved into!

 

[KasinoKing]

Remember if you make 100 spins every single day, on average it will take over a hundred years to hit...

He's not wrong - the odds are just below 4 MILLION to 1 against on those slots!

If you want 5 wilds play Moonshine - only 60,565/1 - so less than 2-years @ 100 spins/day

 

[Simmo!]

All software why do they not put expected payout of each slot in the paytable.

Ask the sites if they have any plans to post winning percentages on each game, as they do on real machines in the UK.

Agreed. No reason not to when you consider audited figures are published anyway. Wagerworks do it! (yeah ok, I know thats an Alderney thing!).

Ask about 'reverse withdrawal'.
Many times have I been tempted to do just that, luckily I have not caved into!

Yeah! User chooses their own time in options

 

[lojo]

Sorry for the 'me too' post but it looks like the crew as all my questions covered except whether the program responds differently depending on bet size on any online slot you happen to be addressing. Thanks

 

[markjacob]

yep, bet small win, bet big lose.

 

[lojo]

yep, bet small win, bet big lose.

Ed Ware has stated it to be untrue in the past. I'd like it from the horse's mouth as far as corporate. Ed has the finest integrity and reputation, but afaik, he doesn't program slots.

 

[RobWin]

Agreed. No reason not to when you consider audited figures are published anyway. Wagerworks do it! (yeah ok, I know thats an Alderney thing!).



Yeah! User chooses their own time in options

Simmo, did you know that 3Dice have this option in their cashier screen now where you can set up what % if any you would like to reverse or if you want it all flushed. The first casino I believe ever to do this....simply amazing...

 

[brianzz]

This is asking alot, but ask RTG why they continue to let known crooks and player cheating casino owners, like Virtual, use their software

 

[Westland Bowl]

I'd like to know when Wager Logic, Playtech, and others are going to come back into the US market, considering that Microgaming and RTG don't have problems with it.

 

[RobWin]

I'd like to know when Wager Logic, Playtech, and others are going to come back into the US market, considering that Microgaming and RTG don't have problems with it.

I second that Westland Bowl, damn good question man !! Please don't forget this one Meister....we will quiz you later you know....

 

[pevangel]

i third that, what westland and rob ask.

pevangel

 

[RobWin]

i third that, what westland and rob ask.

pevangel

Ok Meister, it's a unanimous vote now for this question to be asked of these software and gaming group providers....

 

[SlotMonster]

Ask why they keep sending to us spam e-mails with offers if account was closed/locked/user from restricted country?

 

[vinylweatherman]

Ed Ware has stated it to be untrue in the past. I'd like it from the horse's mouth as far as corporate. Ed has the finest integrity and reputation, but afaik, he doesn't program slots.

We must not forget that Ed is simply a customer of Microgaming, he may not actually know. We should ask Ed what he knew about what forum members have recently discovered about older 5 reel slots using weighted reels, which is not how video slots are supposed to work. We could then ask if Ed knows the individual payout percentage of each slot game, and if there is any reason why players cannot be allowed to know this information. If players ARE allowed to know this, we could ask Ed to release the payouts to the forum "scientists" so that we can verify the recent work by Zoozie and co in first cracking the reels, and then attempting to compute the individual payout percentages.
Crucially, if Zoozie's simulator comes out with the same percentage return as the Microgaming official figures, we will have evidence that prove their later video slots to be truly random, it would actually be to the benefit of Microgaming to have this claim verified by what would be seen by players as an independent team of investigators

 

[The Dude]

Getting ready to head out. Good questions

I'd like to know when Wager Logic, Playtech, and others are going to come back into the US market, considering that Microgaming and RTG don't have problems with it.

That's easy - Wagerlogic (Crypto) and Playtech are publicly traded - MGS and RTG are private companies. A publicly traded company answers to its share holders.

 

[zman]

Getting ready to head out. Good questions



That's easy - Wagerlogic (Crypto) and Playtech are publicly traded - MGS and RTG are private companies. A publicly traded company answers to its share holders.

Can you ask intercasino why i never win there Bryan?

 

[RobWin]

We must not forget that Ed is simply a customer of Microgaming, he may not actually know. We should ask Ed what he knew about what forum members have recently discovered about older 5 reel slots using weighted reels, which is not how video slots are supposed to work. We could then ask if Ed knows the individual payout percentage of each slot game, and if there is any reason why players cannot be allowed to know this information. If players ARE allowed to know this, we could ask Ed to release the payouts to the forum "scientists" so that we can verify the recent work by Zoozie and co in first cracking the reels, and then attempting to compute the individual payout percentages.
Crucially, if Zoozie's simulator comes out with the same percentage return as the Microgaming official figures, we will have evidence that prove their later video slots to be truly random, it would actually be to the benefit of Microgaming to have this claim verified by what would be seen by players as an independent team of investigators

Good luck on getting an honest answer to that one...I personally think you're pissing in the wind if you really think MG will ever fess up to letting players know the real truth behind how their slots actually work, I don't believe IGT has ever released that kind of info to the general public in all the years that they have been in business...

 

[vinylweatherman]

Good luck on getting an honest answer to that one...I personally think you're pissing in the wind if you really think MG will ever fess up to letting players know the real truth behind how their slots actually work, I don't believe IGT has ever released that kind of info to the general public in all the years that they have been in business...

It would be enough to have the individual payout figures, this should be enough to determine if the game is really a random slot, or some kind of lottery game with wins displayed as a slot combination (as is the case with many of the new breed of UK arcade 5 reel video slots).

It may be "pissing in the wind", but a powerful PC can eventually do enough "pissing" to get a sample big enough to compare with the figures calculated by the forum scientists. The older video slots, the "cheating" weighted ones, have short reels, and the sample needed to get a pretty accurate payout percentage is a good deal smaller. Slots such as Thunderstruck though, would require a very big sample to get a figure accurate enough to show any possible cheating, probably north of 10 million spins! I have certainly found that samples of several tens of thousand spins are still too small to get any meaningful payout data for Thunderstruck.

 

[tristan727]

I'd like to know when Wager Logic, Playtech, and others are going to come back into the US market, considering that Microgaming and RTG don't have problems with it.

Because, of those outfits who do, a good % of directors keep forgetting not to go to America on holiday. You'd think they could remember that 'America=prison', but I guess their wives need to shop.

 

[RobWin]

It would be enough to have the individual payout figures, this should be enough to determine if the game is really a random slot, or some kind of lottery game with wins displayed as a slot combination (as is the case with many of the new breed of UK arcade 5 reel video slots).

It may be "pissing in the wind", but a powerful PC can eventually do enough "pissing" to get a sample big enough to compare with the figures calculated by the forum scientists. The older video slots, the "cheating" weighted ones, have short reels, and the sample needed to get a pretty accurate payout percentage is a good deal smaller. Slots such as Thunderstruck though, would require a very big sample to get a figure accurate enough to show any possible cheating, probably north of 10 million spins! I have certainly found that samples of several tens of thousand spins are still too small to get any meaningful payout data for Thunderstruck.

I agree with you Vinyl that this would be great info to have, so we would all know for sure if they are truly random. I would love to see the results after all you brainiacs and rocket scientists decipher all that info. Lets just assume that you can get your hands on the info and you get all the data input into a super powerful PC, if MG has not already run north of 10 million spin samples then you are going to be running this test sample for 347.22 days assuming that you run 10 million test spins 24/7 around the clock which works out to 3 seconds per spin and hopefully you won't get cut off from the server during the test run, or you take MG's already run data at face value.

Then a year later, give or take a month or two you might have a 90 something percent accurate test sample. To me that's pissing in the wind, what's the point ? Just hit the button and spin the reels, pop the top on your favorite beer, kickback and enjoy your time playing and try not to put so much heavy thought into a process to where it is no longer fun...JMHO...

 

[Westland Bowl]

Because, of those outfits who do, a good % of directors keep forgetting not to go to America on holiday. You'd think they could remember that 'America=prison', but I guess their wives need to shop.

I wasn't referring to the sportsbetting operations but the regular casinos offering blackjack, slots, craps, etc. The US is/has been going after those offering sportsbetting services, as the US Wire Act specifically mentions, not those of regular casino games.

 

[GrandMaster]

There is no guarantee that the Attorney General of Louisiana or a sheriff in Kansas has not obtained a sealed warrant for violation of state law. I would not risk my luck if I were the director of a company which has been involved in online gambling in any form (other than the exempt special interests).

 

[Rusty]

Sorry OT, but just have to say that if the payout does match the expected return of the new 5 reel slots this does NOT mean they are truly random and NOT weighted. It helps but it in no way would be conclusive proof the slots are not rigged in any way.

It is not just the return that is important but how it is arrived at, in-fact that is crucial to the games integrity.

OK, don't wish to derail the thread so any replies PM me.