How 'Random' Are Slots?

WillPower505

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Mar 2, 2020
Location
USA
After playing online slots for awhile (particularly playngo) I'm noticing that for the most part slots aren't really random. I don't have any 'real' data to back this up, just first hand experience, but maybe someone will agree with what I'm seeing here...

I notice on slots like playngo there seems to be two types of spins.

1. The first type of spin seems to be truly random, In playngo you can tell these spins seem to be random because if you play a slot like rise of olympus for example, they take about a half second longer to actually load. (maybe it's the game calculating the output).

2. The second type of spin seems to be some kind of predetermined spin. Once again on a slot like rise of olympus these spins load really fast. Infact if you watch the game closely these fast spins are the only times the God mini features will trigger. You also will notice that a lot of these predetermined spins have repeating patterns to them. So much so that I can tell with good accuracy when a bonus will trigger or not just by what shows up on a particular reel.

So this leads me to believe that for the most part I think slots (playngo) are not entirely random. If I had to take a guess, I'd say 30-40% of the spins are truly random the rest are predetermined spins that are randomly chosen from a set amount. And this amount doesn't seem that large because I see a lot of repeating screens / reels.

Not sure how I feel about this. On the one hand it kind of makes sense. I don't think a lot of people would play slots if most of the spins were truly random as these games can be quite complicated and the odds of actually hitting a true 'random' bonus might be almost impossible so predetermined spins/out comes make sense. But if they predetermine most of the spins, how truly 'random' can a game be and it makes it that much easier for a slot machine to be 'rigged' not to pay.

The only protection a lot of people seem to hide behind in terms of thinking their casino games aren't rigged is.. "its random". Well what happens when most of the game isnt truly random. What if only 30% is the game is truly random and 70% of the game is predetermined reels. Would you still play slot machines knowing the only random factor in the slot machine is either you have a 70% chance to lose with 30% chance of getting a truly random spin and maybe winning something?
 

dunover

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After playing online slots for awhile (particularly playngo) I'm noticing that for the most part slots aren't really random. I don't have any 'real' data to back this up, just first hand experience, but maybe someone will agree with what I'm seeing here...

I notice on slots like playngo there seems to be two types of spins.

1. The first type of spin seems to be truly random, In playngo you can tell these spins seem to be random because if you play a slot like rise of olympus for example, they take about a half second longer to actually load. (maybe it's the game calculating the output).

2. The second type of spin seems to be some kind of predetermined spin. Once again on a slot like rise of olympus these spins load really fast. Infact if you watch the game closely these fast spins are the only times the God mini features will trigger. You also will notice that a lot of these predetermined spins have repeating patterns to them. So much so that I can tell with good accuracy when a bonus will trigger or not just by what shows up on a particular reel.

So this leads me to believe that for the most part I think slots (playngo) are not entirely random. If I had to take a guess, I'd say 30-40% of the spins are truly random the rest are predetermined spins that are randomly chosen from a set amount. And this amount doesn't seem that large because I see a lot of repeating screens / reels.

Not sure how I feel about this. On the one hand it kind of makes sense. I don't think a lot of people would play slots if most of the spins were truly random as these games can be quite complicated and the odds of actually hitting a true 'random' bonus might be almost impossible so predetermined spins/out comes make sense. But if they predetermine most of the spins, how truly 'random' can a game be and it makes it that much easier for a slot machine to be 'rigged' not to pay.

The only protection a lot of people seem to hide behind in terms of thinking their casino games aren't rigged is.. "its random". Well what happens when most of the game isnt truly random. What if only 30% is the game is truly random and 70% of the game is predetermined reels. Would you still play slot machines knowing the only random factor in the slot machine is either you have a 70% chance to lose with 30% chance of getting a truly random spin and maybe winning something?

There are 2 types of spin - a winning one and a losing one. There is often a delay from the server on losing spins (i.e. Bonanza when you play it at Betfred like I do) or conversely I remember Thunderstruck 2 did the opposite, the 'quick' result would be a losing spin. That is what you are seeing.

The games cannot be random some of the time, and the rest not. You can get different reel maps for certain spins in the bonuses with different odds though. @trancemonkey (runs and hides behind settee)
 

Reelsoffun

When it comes to gambling, timing is everything.
Joined
Feb 24, 2018
Location
UK
rise of olympus like many "grid" slots are most likely to have pre scripted "spins" From the moment you click spin on those sort of games you're seeing a predetermined sequence of events, from a pool of results.
 

Kroffe

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What is random is what spin you are dealt.

You press spin, then this happens.

Slot: Oh crap i dont know how this spin should look, better ask the random number generator
RNG: Yo, take this 4545665
Slot: Thanks, i know exactly how spin #4545665 looks.

Same with most bonuses.
Pay is very often predetermined, and what you are watching is just eyecandy.
 

Playford7

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How random are slots! Great to see a new and original thread.
They have been proven to be.. ‘Random, but with a memory that forgets and also tracks play, may or may not register your last win and possibly count how many d’s you had in the last fortnight.
Apart from all that jazz, not to mention changing RTP’s they are fully random and not to be questioned.
 

goatwack

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I find when playing slots that I get washed over by a monsoon of randomness if anything
 

Harry_BKK

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Balcony
Anyone thinking a piece of software written by humans for profit, AKA with a 3-5% or more house margin, is completely random should stop playing slots immediately.

Just remember what has been preached to us for years - game suppliers do not know the bet size we are using. That was until trancemonkey confirmed that they know but it is not used for the spin result. How long will we believe that? Another 20 or so years? :rolleyes:
 
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Playford7

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Anyone thinking a piece of software written by humans for profit, AKA with a 3-5% or more house margin, is completely random should stop playing slots immediately.

Just remember what has been preached to us for years - game suppliers do not know the bet size we are using. That was until trancemonkey confirmed that they know but it is not used. How long will we believe that? Another 20 or so years? :rolleyes:
What ever happened to him harry? And are you telling me slots are rigged or random mate?..
 

neon claws

Experienced Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2020
Location
Australia
I find that if I exit the game after each spin, change computers, ip address, mac address, underwear, hard reset my router (out the window) and take a nap then I largely forget what I was talking about at least 50% of the time.
 

neon claws

Experienced Member
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Jan 5, 2020
Location
Australia
But seriously, to answer the actual question; yes winning game rounds can take longer than losing ones due to more data (cascading spins) being transmitted I presume (I notice this on temple tumble), everything else is just your mind clinging frantically to over active pattern recognition in the chaotic, churning waves of randomness engulfing everything we hold dear as we cry into the void for order, I reckon.
 

bamberfishcake

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Essex
Anyone thinking a piece of software written by humans for profit, AKA with a 3-5% or more house margin, is completely random should stop playing slots immediately.

Just remember what has been preached to us for years - game suppliers do not know the bet size we are using. That was until trancemonkey confirmed that they know but it is not used for the spin result. How long will we believe that? Another 20 or so years? :rolleyes:

Great comment Harry.

The RNG's used in gaming are not 'true' random number generators and are a computer program designed to generate a number within a range.

They are random but not true random.

I reckon Yoda would have a better way of saying it maybe like this.....'Random true not random it is. Computer program it is number random creating'

True random number generating is based on a physical process. Everything else is a program and not true RNG.

Now if i can just work out how to use this information for my financial fun gain.........
 

neon claws

Experienced Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2020
Location
Australia
Since my other thread got shut down by THE MAN because they couldn't handle "the truth" and are in the pocket of big random, here it is again:

I was playing a slot and it seemed pretty random, but then I started thinking about how it could stand to be more random.

Some ideas:
1. The bet size should change randomly each spin
2. Sometimes your balance should change from a string of numbers to letters instead, and sometimes it should increase
3. The Double Up feature should make you choose, instead of between red or black whether you feel you truly deserve to be happy or not
4. The machine should use, instead of a set up pre-created homogeneous graphics, rather only images from random YouTube thumbnails
5. It should mine (or steal?) Bitcoins
6. You should be able to get negative features, where you just get berated for wasting your time
7. Ultra-features: if you get one of these you own the casino now
8. The whole thing should run in reverse, so you start at $0.03 balance and work your way backwards to your initial deposit
9. The screen should be inverted so you have to play looking into a mirror

These are just some Original Ideas™ do not steal
 

dionysus

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Since my other thread got shut down by THE MAN because they couldn't handle "the truth" and are in the pocket of big random, here it is again:
or, just use the currently running threads with similarly named titles like you're supposed to. Simples. :thumbsup:
 

Kroffe

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Im going to make a boardgame-slot that will re-define what high volatile means.
Just like in any boardgame there will be event/chance-cards, but just like when playing real boardgames, not all of them will be good.
"You got caught speeding, pay 35x stake"
"You got a divorce, 1-3 on the dice gives you prenup-protection, 4-6 means you lose 50% of your balance"

It will run at 98% rtp.
Max win 1 000 000x stake, and no bs like all the slots released today wich never come close to their so called potential.
The megawins are sponsored by all the cards&symbols that cost players extra money.

I just need to learn the coding,math&design part of making a slot, and its as good as done.
Slot will be called "Are you feeling lucky, punk- the boardgame"
Eta 2050
 

dionysus

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Im going to make a boardgame-slot that will re-define what high volatile means.
Just like in any boardgame there will be event/chance-cards, but just like when playing real boardgames, not all of them will be good.
"You got caught speeding, pay 35x stake"
"You got a divorce, 1-3 on the dice gives you prenup-protection, 4-6 means you lose 50% of your balance"

It will run at 98% rtp.
Max win 1 000 000x stake, and no bs like all the slots released today wich never come close to their so called potential.
The megawins are sponsored by all the cards&symbols that cost players extra money.

I just need to learn the coding,math&design part of making a slot, and its as good as done.
Slot will be called "Are you feeling lucky, punk- the boardgame"
Eta 2050
have you played Game Changer by the way?
 

Harry_BKK

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Dec 18, 2014
Location
Balcony
I dont play slots with scatters only showing on 3 reels.
Worst designchoice anyone could make for a slot, and providers doing it should be banned from licensed casinos.

Re. board game, Heroes Gathering from Relax comes to my mind. You'll get a mini-feature when you hit only 2 scatters :D

Did you try Treasure Heroes from Rabcat/Microgaming? Funny reel mechanic, thought it was interesting.
 
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