Credit Cards to be banned for online gambling

[Guntis]

 

[Borgie]

View attachment 121498

I need to unsee this lol

 

[goatwack]

Nightmares a-comin' tonight

 

[Mr_Slot5]

I need to unsee this lol

Unfortunately some things just can't be unseen

 

[bruinsdude]

This is why it will have maybe a marginal effect but in reality won't stop problem gamblers.

1. They can purchase pay vouchers with cards.
2. They can fund webwallets with them.
3. They can get ATM cash advances and but vouchers or pay cash into bank accounts.
4. They can use the online cash-transfer facility/loans that many cards will pay into bank accounts by BACs.
5. They can use cards to funds everyday living costs and use their bank accounts to gamble instead.

A problem gambler is often like a smack addict - devious, determined to get their fix and know every trick in the book to facilitate it.

The point about a card transaction code reflecting a gambling transaction should have been addresses eons ago. If UK payment systems accepted by online casinos had to have the casino's UKGC License number verified and included somewhere in the transaction code before being accepted, i.e. the payment provider had to check the casino before allowing them to use their service for gambling, it would end many (but not all) of the scam casino 1668/JAZ et al transactions from the UK.

In Canada, anyhoo, you cannot use a Credit Card to purchase a Paysafe voucher, as is. The transaction will say ineligible product purchased. You must use a debit card, not a credit card. Also, in the land of pot and maple syrup....they killed credit card gambling long ago.

 

[dunover]

In Canada, anyhoo, you cannot use a Credit Card to purchase a Paysafe voucher, as is. The transaction will say ineligible product purchased. You must use a debit card, not a credit card. Also, in the land of pot and maple syrup....they killed credit card gambling long ago.

You can here though, so it seems the final result is that will eventually happen in the UK too.

 

[paul7388]

Must just be my shops then as all the paypoint outlets near me that sell paysafe etc. are all cash only.

 

[dionysus]

In Canada, anyhoo, you cannot use a Credit Card to purchase a Paysafe voucher, as is. The transaction will say ineligible product purchased. You must use a debit card, not a credit card. Also, in the land of pot and maple syrup....they killed credit card gambling long ago.

I use my CC all the time

 

[bruinsdude]

I use my CC all the time

For which sites? Scotia and TD credit cards are a no go anyways at the likes of 32 Red, Guts and others.

 

[dionysus]

For which sites? Scotia and TD credit cards are a no go anyways at the likes of 32 Red, Guts and others.

BMO/MC/VS

 

[dionysus]

TD is Visa, they're a no-go

 

[Mr_Slot5]

As I said yesterday, never had a CC in my life. However, I am uneasy about this ever increasing nannyism that we're seeing.

Who is anyone to tell someone else what they can and can't get into debt over? I mean seriously. You can get into debt buying a 25k car (that automatically depreciates by THOUSANDS) as soon as you drive it off the forecourt but a couple of hundred in gambling debt is frowned upon??

Makes no sense to me. Debt is debt regardless.

 

[Playford7]

As I said yesterday, never had a CC in my life. However, I am uneasy about this ever increasing nannyism that we're seeing.

Who is anyone to tell someone else what they can and can't get into debt over? I mean seriously. You can get into debt buying a 25k car (that automatically depreciates by THOUSANDS) as soon as you drive it off the forecourt but a couple of hundred in gambling debt is frowned upon??

Makes no sense to me. Debt is debt regardless.

Yeah this nanny state is ridiculous, but comparing buying a car to gambling is very different.
There is evidence and data to prove problem gamblers use credit cards to gamble, and the ukgc acted on it and rightly so.
they don’t always get it correct, but they have on this.
looking at other forums and you will see the majority are for the cc ban, these other forums also don’t have people involved in the industry so to speak, just regular players. Many of which lost a hell of a lot due to gambling with money that’s essentially not yours.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

Yeah this nanny state is ridiculous, but comparing buying a car to gambling is very different.
There is evidence and data to prove problem gamblers use credit cards to gamble, and the ukgc acted on it and rightly so.
they don’t always get it correct, but they have on this.
looking at other forums and you will see the majority are for the cc ban, these other forums also don’t have people involved in the industry so to speak, just regular players. Many of which lost a hell of a lot due to gambling with money that’s essentially not yours.

But the money IS yours. As soon as you borrow you take ownership of that debt. You take the consequences of not being able to pay that debt.

It's the same with any type of credit. The money is yours, the debt is yours. IT'S COMPLETELY THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE CREDITOR TO CHECK YOUR CREDIT WORTHINESS.

For the vast majority of people without gambling issues, putting gambling transactions on the CC is no different to buying a holiday. Both are recreational uses.

Once again, the many are being penalised because of the few.

 

[Playford7]

But the money IS yours. As soon as you borrow you take ownership of that debt. You take the consequences of not being able to pay that debt.

It's the same with any type of credit. The money is yours, the debt is yours. IT'S COMPLETELY THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE CREDITOR TO CHECK YOUR CREDIT WORTHINESS.

For the vast majority of people without gambling issues, putting gambling transactions on the CC is no different to buying a holiday. Both are recreational uses.

Once again, the many are being penalised because of the few.

Look at the data, it’s not a ‘few’ mate whom get into massive trouble with cc when gambling.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

Look at the data, it’s not a ‘few’ mate whom get into massive trouble with cc when gambling.

I know but if they cannot afford the repayments then they should not have access to that level of credit. It's as simple as that. That's the responsibility of the creditor. Not the casinos.

In the case of someone not being able to afford the repayments it's best they default on the loan anyway and get it marked on their credit file, to prevent further borrowing.

The issue is the credit limit people are being given, not the use of the credit card per se. That's my point.

 

[colinsunderland]

It's the same with any type of credit. The money is yours, the debt is yours. IT'S COMPLETELY THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE CREDITOR TO CHECK YOUR CREDIT WORTHINESS.

And that is what i think is wrong with some parts of society today. Are you saying it isn't the person's responsibility to ensure they don't take too much debt on? People should take responsibility for their actions, but they don't, and thats why we have situations like this, where everyone gets banned from something. FWIW I've said for years that credit cards shouldn't be allowed to be used for gambling, and if someone is using one, then a SoW should be carried out. If you are having to borrow money to play slots, then you can't afford it. The few people who have reasons for using credit cards will pass the SoW and no harm done.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

And that is what i think is wrong with some parts of society today. Are you saying it isn't the person's responsibility to ensure they don't take too much debt on? People should take responsibility for their actions, but they don't, and thats why we have situations like this, where everyone gets banned from something. FWIW I've said for years that credit cards shouldn't be allowed to be used for gambling, and if someone is using one, then a SoW should be carried out. If you are having to borrow money to play slots, then you can't afford it. The few people who have reasons for using credit cards will pass the SoW and no harm done.

Of course it's people's responsibility. That's the whole gist of what I'm saying. If they want to put gambling transactions on CC then fine- but they have to accept the consequences of accruing debt as with anything else they choose to purchase on credit.

People can't afford to buy houses, cars, holidays, 50 pairs of designer shoes etc but they still get them. It's a choice to get into debt. I'm saying, it's the credit limit people have that's the issue not the use of credit cards per se.

You could create a list as long as your arm of things people shouldn't buy in accordance with their income, let's be honest. Should we ban all recreation on credit card?

People need to wake the fack up and realise we are being told what is good for us by others. A drip drip of nannyism that will eventually lead to every part of our lives being controlled. Jesus.

 

[colinsunderland]

Of course it's people's responsibility. That's the whole gist of what I'm saying. If they want to put gambling transactions on CC then fine- but they have to accept the consequences of accruing debt as with anything else they choose to purchase on credit.

People can't afford to buy houses, cars, holidays, 50 pairs of designer shoes etc but they still get them. It's a choice to get into debt. I'm saying, it's the credit limit people have that's the issue not the use of credit cards per se.

You could create a list as long as your arm of things people shouldn't buy in accordance with their income, let's be honest. Should we ban all recreation on credit card?

People need to wake the fack up and realise we are being told what is good for us by others. A drip drip of nannyism that will eventually lead to every part of our lives being controlled. Jesus.

Buying a house is a little different to playing at a casino though. Someone loses a months wages at casinoxyz, then chases losses at 3am while drunk banging another couple of grand onto credit cards is preventable. I've never heard of someone buying a house, then buying another 10 when they were drunk.

There is a massive concentration of affordability questions being fired at casinos at the moment. Being allowed to deposit using money they don't have is obviously going to be looked at, and frowned upon.

It's also impossible for a credit card company to accurately be able to tell what someone can afford. That is down to the person applying. Is credit given out too easily? Yes, I would certainly agree with that, but the customer doesn't have to say yes.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

I've never heard of someone buying a house, then buying another 10 when they were drunk.

No but I've heard of people spending £1000+ on amazon etc when drunk. But again, being drunk is not a way of escaping accountability for one's actions.

Again, it would be easy to turn around and say to people trying to purchase anything on a CC 'sorry but you obviously can't afford that'. That's not the way credit works. Credit is granted and a certain amount of money becomes accessible to you. We start going down a slippery slope once conditions are placed on money that you now have ownership of.

I feel that if people are happy to see the demise of online gambling in the UK then fair enough, get fully behind the UKGC and its interference.

You know how it'll end up eventually- banks hesitant to even handle gambling transactions at all ala Canada and Norway. Waiting weeks for withdrawals.

 

[mack341]

I doubt many folk will feel penalised, it would be nice if the nanny state approach wasn't required but in this instance I think it is. The trade off in harm prevention is potentially significant in the areas that need it most, it's far more useful for RG than ever limiting the number of auto spins to 100 would be, which strangely the ukgc prioritised over bigger issues like this.

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Thatcher deregulated borrowing and credit cards in the 80's and it boomed, along with personal levels of debt.

Restrictions on hire purchase offers were relaxed, stores offered credit, credit cards boomed. Consumer borrowing tripled during the 1980s.

The Bank of England did not control the expansion of credit and there are those who see the roots of the current financial crisis in the credit boom of the Thatcher years.

Personal responsibility has gone by the wayside to a large degree in modern britain, and elsewhere, the 'live now forget tomorrow' idea is paramount for consumerism on borrowed money. Combine that idea with gambling and big problems quickly develop, as indeed they have.

 

[colinsunderland]

No but I've heard of people spending £1000+ on amazon etc when drunk. But again, being drunk is not a way of escaping accountability for one's actions.

Again, it would be easy to turn around and say to people trying to purchase anything on a CC 'sorry but you obviously can't afford that'. That's not the way credit works. Credit is granted and a certain amount of money becomes accessible to you. We start going down a slippery slope once conditions are placed on money that you now have ownership of.

I feel that if people are happy to see the demise of online gambling in the UK then fair enough, get fully behind the UKGC and its interference.

You know how it'll end up eventually- banks hesitant to even handle gambling transactions at all ala Canada and Norway. Waiting weeks for withdrawals.

And the next morning when they think, oh shit, wtf did I buy 10 x dog cages from amazon for, they can cancel them or return them when delivered and get their money back. Try that with a casino.

If you have to borrow money for something, you cannot afford it. It is as simple as that. You might be able to afford the repayments, but at that point you cannot afford what you are buying, be it a £10 deposit at a casino, or a £2.5 million house.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

it's far more useful for RG than ever limiting the number of auto spins to 100

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On the subject of autospins, @Mark_32Red would it be possible to get the autospins back on Bonanza and WWTBAM pretty please

 

[Mr_Slot5]

If you have to borrow money for something, you cannot afford it. It is as simple as that. You might be able to afford the repayments, but at that point you cannot afford what you are buying, be it a £10 deposit at a casino, or a £2.5 million house.

Well quite. But take credit out of the equation and the whole economy collapses.

 

[lockinlove]

Hmm i think its ok i guess. Sure people can get around it if they really want but it will stop some tilt deposits and give the person time to chill out while they drive to do cash advance to buy a prepaid card or paysafe. Sucks for people who are responsible though. Casinos have always found a way around blocks and i am sure they will find a way to offer deposits to a 3rd party to transfer it through them