Credit Cards to be banned for online gambling

[Dazzauk83]

Its a great move. Gambling with money that is not yours is not right at all.

But i know people who have a credit card linked to a paypal account.
They then have another paypal account,send money using the credit card that is on that paypal account to there other paypal account which has a linked confirmed bank account on .
Then you can instantly withdraw( depends on country ) cash from that paypal account ,then just deposit from the bank account at the casino site.

So you can still use credit from a credit card technically ,just can't directly deposit from it.

 

[dionysus]

Half of them can't even be used to buy petrol ffs.

that seems ridiculous; I wonder why
I havent come across anything where I cant use a prepaid MC a a sub for cash (not to say there arent any - just havent come across any)

 

[Slottery]

Then for example Revolut and others similar services you can top up your account with CC and it's then usable with your debit card, disposable or physical one.
Revolut might state in their terms that it's not to be used for gambling or something (haven't read myself) but i'm using it's virtual CC for my gambling transactions with zero problems so far.

 

[English Begbie]

Must admit I ran up big debts on cc,s gambling many years ago,should never have been allowed but nobodies
fault but my own.The repayments grew to horrendous levels.Somehow I managed to get it sorted and never
used them again,My credit score is flying high now and I only bet with my own funds and within sensible
limits.This is a good move from the UKGC for a change but the report mentions a lot changes coming up
in 2020 which sounds ominous.

Shadow123, you've hit the nail on the head for me - I was also in a lot of CC trouble at one point and was truly swirling in the debt spiral, until fairly recently when I hit a big jackpot (£75Kish) - since then, I've been "Mr Sensible" when it comes to online gambling. Yes, I still use my credit cards,
(for convenience if not reluctance to give any online gambling company access to my current account via a debit card!) but I've gone from a "very poor" credit rating to "Excellent" in a little over 6 months.
Clearly, we're a couple of the fortunate ones. How many thousands of other not-so-lucky ones are there though?! There but for the grace of God and all that, eh?!

 

[colinsunderland]

Then for example Revolut and others similar services you can top up your account with CC and it's then usable with your debit card, disposable or physical one.
Revolut might state in their terms that it's not to be used for gambling or something (haven't read myself) but i'm using it's virtual CC for my gambling transactions with zero problems so far.

You might want to read the terms, I use mine but mainly on Coral where I withdraw cash or to fund a paypal payment which I then withdraw to a different bank. They are completely blocked on a couple of sites, Bet365 being one. @L&L-Jan also mentioned them having problems with withdrawals to Revolut cards.
If you search the net you can find numerous reports of them blocking accounts that have been used for gambling and taking months to release funds.

 

[Slottery]

You might want to read the terms, I use mine but mainly on Coral where I withdraw cash or to fund a paypal payment which I then withdraw to a different bank. They are completely blocked on a couple of sites, Bet365 being one. @L&L-Jan also mentioned them having problems with withdrawals to Revolut cards.
If you search the net you can find numerous reports of them blocking accounts that have been used for gambling and taking months to release funds.

Haven't have any problems with or don't know anyone who have, only heard that around internet, so keep using it until they decide to block it or something.... Quickly count, have used it to deposit and withdraw in 7 places which one didn't want to honor welcome bonus as counted it as pre-paid card for some reason (it's BIN actually is referring to pre-paid if quickly check it in internet).

edit: There are many quite similar services these days who are offering virtual debit card which can be funded with credit card within seconds so circumventing CC ban is not really hard with these.

edit2: Tried quickly to find it from T&C:s but couldn't find anything about LEGAL gambling transactions not allowed, might be that reading wrong T&C:s but under this i couldn't find anything "Are there any restrictions on using the Revolut app or Revolut Card?"

 

[BrianGhattas]

@dionysus

Yeah, Visa Debit worked at VS. I’ll probably play over at Ojo and see if it works.

 

[slot_zombie]

I buy that 100% sure some people do leave under Curacao sunshine if £2 max bet is implemented.

That part of players who don't really don't mind if withdrawal is on your account on same day or after week.
Especially people playing board games, £2 is quite low, even for me if i for some reason decide to have few rounds of blackjack or roulette, these are often played quite much bigger stakes

So - they're going to be happy playing Betsoft and Rival garbage? I think not.

 

[Slottery]

So - they're going to be happy playing Betsoft and Rival garbage? I think not.

For sure some decide to play table games where they still are available instead of change their max bet to £2. Many already playing Curacao places even table games still exist in UK without any max bet rules.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

Never had a credit card in my life and I'm 31.

 

[Playford7]

Never had a credit card in my life and I'm 31.

I have one that’s only used for holidays and certain purchases for insurance reasons, always paid in full the end of the month.
Wouldn’t dream of using it to gamble with.
Good move banning them, plenty will use them to gamble, slippery slope.
Also think the £2 cap is a good idea.

 

[colinsunderland]

Haven't have any problems with or don't know anyone who have, only heard that around internet, so keep using it until they decide to block it or something.... Quickly count, have used it to deposit and withdraw in 7 places which one didn't want to honor welcome bonus as counted it as pre-paid card for some reason (it's BIN actually is referring to pre-paid if quickly check it in internet).

edit: There are many quite similar services these days who are offering virtual debit card which can be funded with credit card within seconds so circumventing CC ban is not really hard with these.

edit2: Tried quickly to find it from T&C:s but couldn't find anything about LEGAL gambling transactions not allowed, might be that reading wrong T&C:s but under this i couldn't find anything "Are there any restrictions on using the Revolut app or Revolut Card?"

The stories on the net are enough to make me wary, however Jan saying they get problems with them sealed the deal

 

[dpp00]

nope dont agree at all it will do nothing to help or hinder problem gamblers, and it certainly will drive them

to devise even more ways of gettin there fix and send them to casinos that just wont care how they deposit,

pretty sick of the constant inconvenience and removal of freedoms piled upon the majority of people to

pretend there helping the 2 people who may have a problem (yes being a little facetious here as im sure its a

few more then 2 ill tell you what its not though its not the plucked out of thin air estimate of 800.000,

and breathe and relax,

 

[Guntis]

The most if not all e-wallets can be topped up by a credit card so the ban of credit cards won't make a big difference for those who wish to gamble.

Also, it's easy to transfer a balance from a credit card to the main bank account and make a deposit from there.

 

[Harry_BKK]

It will be interesting to see if e-wallet providers can implement a block for credit cards in the short timescale that we’ve been given. Unless they do, expect Skrill, Neteller, PayPal etc to all be blocked with this change.

Shall I post you a trick to get around restrictions with credit cards at e-wallets?

Supereasy.

 

[chiya]

Whilst I'm not a fan of the government controlling how we spend our money I will say £2 stake cap is great idea. Anyone betting higher has either too much money or has won big and chucking it all back.

Hopefully this also stops those ridiculous streamers do 5 or 10 spins with unlimited cash.

Why does more than 2eur bet need to automatically imply a problem gambler? If you hit big and are on a bonus for example, what's wrong with trying to go for that BIG win with an appropriate bet?

I typically almost never bet even 1, let alone higher as in a low roller. But once in a blue moon I get a decent win on a bonus and those are the times I want to try to chase even a bigger win. It's ridiculous to think someone can regulate how much money you're allowed to spend.

Not that this should affect me, being outside UK and all, but it still is ridiculous.

 

[FargoVIP]

It's really good news! I think that you really don't need to gamble on money you don't have.

 

[Borgie]

When does the 2 pound limit come into effect from?

 

[goatwack]

Of course it looks great, but the £2 cap won't mean anything if players can Fast Play or stop/start the games into oblivion.

"Oh yes about that dear, I lost the shopping money playing Rocket Fellas. But it's alright, I lost it in two minutes rather than the usual five. Beans on toast?"

 

[Borgie]

Of course it looks great, but the £2 cap won't mean anything if players can Fast Play or stop/start the games into oblivion.

"Oh yes about that dear, I lost the shopping money playing Rocket Fellas. But it's alright, I lost it in two minutes rather than the usual five. Beans on toast?"

I love beans on toast fortunately lol

 

[Jono777]

Of course it looks great, but the £2 cap won't mean anything if players can Fast Play or stop/start the games into oblivion.

"Oh yes about that dear, I lost the shopping money playing Rocket Fellas. But it's alright, I lost it in two minutes rather than the usual five. Beans on toast?"

The only real way to play DoA (when there is more than £10 in my balance lol )

 

[Harry_BKK]

The most if not all e-wallets can be topped up by a credit card so the ban of credit cards won't make a big difference for those who wish to gamble.

Also, it's easy to transfer a balance from a credit card to the main bank account and make a deposit from there.

In countries where CCs are restricted for gambling, Neteller and Skrill make you tick "for gambling" or "for non-gambling" purposes. The code they send to your bank is then different between the two and the transaction gets declined if you chose the gambling option. Been like that forever in my country of residence.

But there are tricks around it, as usual.

 

[Guntis]

In countries where CCs are restricted for gambling, Neteller and Skrill make you tick "for gambling" or "for non-gambling" purposes. The code they send to your bank is then different between the two and the transaction gets declined if you chose the gambling option. Been like that forever in my country of residence.

But there are tricks around it, as usual.

...Neteller ➝ Skrill

A mad gambler instead of doing these different tricks and transactions would take all the money out of his credit card and deposit into his bank account.

 

[Harry_BKK]

...Neteller ➝ Skrill

or Neteller --> Neteller --> Neteller

 

[irish-ranger]

Well looks like none of the 800.000 users are members on casino Meister what a lovely wee law abiding forum.
(Bullshit)

 

[Guntis]

 

[Borgie]

View attachment 121498

I need to unsee this lol

 

[goatwack]

Nightmares a-comin' tonight

 

[Mr_Slot5]

I need to unsee this lol

Unfortunately some things just can't be unseen

 

[bruinsdude]

This is why it will have maybe a marginal effect but in reality won't stop problem gamblers.

1. They can purchase pay vouchers with cards.
2. They can fund webwallets with them.
3. They can get ATM cash advances and but vouchers or pay cash into bank accounts.
4. They can use the online cash-transfer facility/loans that many cards will pay into bank accounts by BACs.
5. They can use cards to funds everyday living costs and use their bank accounts to gamble instead.

A problem gambler is often like a smack addict - devious, determined to get their fix and know every trick in the book to facilitate it.

The point about a card transaction code reflecting a gambling transaction should have been addresses eons ago. If UK payment systems accepted by online casinos had to have the casino's UKGC License number verified and included somewhere in the transaction code before being accepted, i.e. the payment provider had to check the casino before allowing them to use their service for gambling, it would end many (but not all) of the scam casino 1668/JAZ et al transactions from the UK.

In Canada, anyhoo, you cannot use a Credit Card to purchase a Paysafe voucher, as is. The transaction will say ineligible product purchased. You must use a debit card, not a credit card. Also, in the land of pot and maple syrup....they killed credit card gambling long ago.

 

[dunover]

In Canada, anyhoo, you cannot use a Credit Card to purchase a Paysafe voucher, as is. The transaction will say ineligible product purchased. You must use a debit card, not a credit card. Also, in the land of pot and maple syrup....they killed credit card gambling long ago.

You can here though, so it seems the final result is that will eventually happen in the UK too.

 

[paul7388]

Must just be my shops then as all the paypoint outlets near me that sell paysafe etc. are all cash only.

 

[dionysus]

In Canada, anyhoo, you cannot use a Credit Card to purchase a Paysafe voucher, as is. The transaction will say ineligible product purchased. You must use a debit card, not a credit card. Also, in the land of pot and maple syrup....they killed credit card gambling long ago.

I use my CC all the time

 

[bruinsdude]

I use my CC all the time

For which sites? Scotia and TD credit cards are a no go anyways at the likes of 32 Red, Guts and others.

 

[dionysus]

For which sites? Scotia and TD credit cards are a no go anyways at the likes of 32 Red, Guts and others.

BMO/MC/VS

 

[dionysus]

TD is Visa, they're a no-go

 

[Mr_Slot5]

As I said yesterday, never had a CC in my life. However, I am uneasy about this ever increasing nannyism that we're seeing.

Who is anyone to tell someone else what they can and can't get into debt over? I mean seriously. You can get into debt buying a 25k car (that automatically depreciates by THOUSANDS) as soon as you drive it off the forecourt but a couple of hundred in gambling debt is frowned upon??

Makes no sense to me. Debt is debt regardless.

 

[Playford7]

As I said yesterday, never had a CC in my life. However, I am uneasy about this ever increasing nannyism that we're seeing.

Who is anyone to tell someone else what they can and can't get into debt over? I mean seriously. You can get into debt buying a 25k car (that automatically depreciates by THOUSANDS) as soon as you drive it off the forecourt but a couple of hundred in gambling debt is frowned upon??

Makes no sense to me. Debt is debt regardless.

Yeah this nanny state is ridiculous, but comparing buying a car to gambling is very different.
There is evidence and data to prove problem gamblers use credit cards to gamble, and the ukgc acted on it and rightly so.
they don’t always get it correct, but they have on this.
looking at other forums and you will see the majority are for the cc ban, these other forums also don’t have people involved in the industry so to speak, just regular players. Many of which lost a hell of a lot due to gambling with money that’s essentially not yours.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

Yeah this nanny state is ridiculous, but comparing buying a car to gambling is very different.
There is evidence and data to prove problem gamblers use credit cards to gamble, and the ukgc acted on it and rightly so.
they don’t always get it correct, but they have on this.
looking at other forums and you will see the majority are for the cc ban, these other forums also don’t have people involved in the industry so to speak, just regular players. Many of which lost a hell of a lot due to gambling with money that’s essentially not yours.

But the money IS yours. As soon as you borrow you take ownership of that debt. You take the consequences of not being able to pay that debt.

It's the same with any type of credit. The money is yours, the debt is yours. IT'S COMPLETELY THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE CREDITOR TO CHECK YOUR CREDIT WORTHINESS.

For the vast majority of people without gambling issues, putting gambling transactions on the CC is no different to buying a holiday. Both are recreational uses.

Once again, the many are being penalised because of the few.

 

[Playford7]

But the money IS yours. As soon as you borrow you take ownership of that debt. You take the consequences of not being able to pay that debt.

It's the same with any type of credit. The money is yours, the debt is yours. IT'S COMPLETELY THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE CREDITOR TO CHECK YOUR CREDIT WORTHINESS.

For the vast majority of people without gambling issues, putting gambling transactions on the CC is no different to buying a holiday. Both are recreational uses.

Once again, the many are being penalised because of the few.

Look at the data, it’s not a ‘few’ mate whom get into massive trouble with cc when gambling.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

Look at the data, it’s not a ‘few’ mate whom get into massive trouble with cc when gambling.

I know but if they cannot afford the repayments then they should not have access to that level of credit. It's as simple as that. That's the responsibility of the creditor. Not the casinos.

In the case of someone not being able to afford the repayments it's best they default on the loan anyway and get it marked on their credit file, to prevent further borrowing.

The issue is the credit limit people are being given, not the use of the credit card per se. That's my point.

 

[colinsunderland]

It's the same with any type of credit. The money is yours, the debt is yours. IT'S COMPLETELY THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE CREDITOR TO CHECK YOUR CREDIT WORTHINESS.

And that is what i think is wrong with some parts of society today. Are you saying it isn't the person's responsibility to ensure they don't take too much debt on? People should take responsibility for their actions, but they don't, and thats why we have situations like this, where everyone gets banned from something. FWIW I've said for years that credit cards shouldn't be allowed to be used for gambling, and if someone is using one, then a SoW should be carried out. If you are having to borrow money to play slots, then you can't afford it. The few people who have reasons for using credit cards will pass the SoW and no harm done.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

And that is what i think is wrong with some parts of society today. Are you saying it isn't the person's responsibility to ensure they don't take too much debt on? People should take responsibility for their actions, but they don't, and thats why we have situations like this, where everyone gets banned from something. FWIW I've said for years that credit cards shouldn't be allowed to be used for gambling, and if someone is using one, then a SoW should be carried out. If you are having to borrow money to play slots, then you can't afford it. The few people who have reasons for using credit cards will pass the SoW and no harm done.

Of course it's people's responsibility. That's the whole gist of what I'm saying. If they want to put gambling transactions on CC then fine- but they have to accept the consequences of accruing debt as with anything else they choose to purchase on credit.

People can't afford to buy houses, cars, holidays, 50 pairs of designer shoes etc but they still get them. It's a choice to get into debt. I'm saying, it's the credit limit people have that's the issue not the use of credit cards per se.

You could create a list as long as your arm of things people shouldn't buy in accordance with their income, let's be honest. Should we ban all recreation on credit card?

People need to wake the fack up and realise we are being told what is good for us by others. A drip drip of nannyism that will eventually lead to every part of our lives being controlled. Jesus.

 

[colinsunderland]

Of course it's people's responsibility. That's the whole gist of what I'm saying. If they want to put gambling transactions on CC then fine- but they have to accept the consequences of accruing debt as with anything else they choose to purchase on credit.

People can't afford to buy houses, cars, holidays, 50 pairs of designer shoes etc but they still get them. It's a choice to get into debt. I'm saying, it's the credit limit people have that's the issue not the use of credit cards per se.

You could create a list as long as your arm of things people shouldn't buy in accordance with their income, let's be honest. Should we ban all recreation on credit card?

People need to wake the fack up and realise we are being told what is good for us by others. A drip drip of nannyism that will eventually lead to every part of our lives being controlled. Jesus.

Buying a house is a little different to playing at a casino though. Someone loses a months wages at casinoxyz, then chases losses at 3am while drunk banging another couple of grand onto credit cards is preventable. I've never heard of someone buying a house, then buying another 10 when they were drunk.

There is a massive concentration of affordability questions being fired at casinos at the moment. Being allowed to deposit using money they don't have is obviously going to be looked at, and frowned upon.

It's also impossible for a credit card company to accurately be able to tell what someone can afford. That is down to the person applying. Is credit given out too easily? Yes, I would certainly agree with that, but the customer doesn't have to say yes.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

I've never heard of someone buying a house, then buying another 10 when they were drunk.

No but I've heard of people spending £1000+ on amazon etc when drunk. But again, being drunk is not a way of escaping accountability for one's actions.

Again, it would be easy to turn around and say to people trying to purchase anything on a CC 'sorry but you obviously can't afford that'. That's not the way credit works. Credit is granted and a certain amount of money becomes accessible to you. We start going down a slippery slope once conditions are placed on money that you now have ownership of.

I feel that if people are happy to see the demise of online gambling in the UK then fair enough, get fully behind the UKGC and its interference.

You know how it'll end up eventually- banks hesitant to even handle gambling transactions at all ala Canada and Norway. Waiting weeks for withdrawals.

 

[mack341]

I doubt many folk will feel penalised, it would be nice if the nanny state approach wasn't required but in this instance I think it is. The trade off in harm prevention is potentially significant in the areas that need it most, it's far more useful for RG than ever limiting the number of auto spins to 100 would be, which strangely the ukgc prioritised over bigger issues like this.

---------

Thatcher deregulated borrowing and credit cards in the 80's and it boomed, along with personal levels of debt.

Restrictions on hire purchase offers were relaxed, stores offered credit, credit cards boomed. Consumer borrowing tripled during the 1980s.

The Bank of England did not control the expansion of credit and there are those who see the roots of the current financial crisis in the credit boom of the Thatcher years.

Personal responsibility has gone by the wayside to a large degree in modern britain, and elsewhere, the 'live now forget tomorrow' idea is paramount for consumerism on borrowed money. Combine that idea with gambling and big problems quickly develop, as indeed they have.

 

[colinsunderland]

No but I've heard of people spending £1000+ on amazon etc when drunk. But again, being drunk is not a way of escaping accountability for one's actions.

Again, it would be easy to turn around and say to people trying to purchase anything on a CC 'sorry but you obviously can't afford that'. That's not the way credit works. Credit is granted and a certain amount of money becomes accessible to you. We start going down a slippery slope once conditions are placed on money that you now have ownership of.

I feel that if people are happy to see the demise of online gambling in the UK then fair enough, get fully behind the UKGC and its interference.

You know how it'll end up eventually- banks hesitant to even handle gambling transactions at all ala Canada and Norway. Waiting weeks for withdrawals.

And the next morning when they think, oh shit, wtf did I buy 10 x dog cages from amazon for, they can cancel them or return them when delivered and get their money back. Try that with a casino.

If you have to borrow money for something, you cannot afford it. It is as simple as that. You might be able to afford the repayments, but at that point you cannot afford what you are buying, be it a £10 deposit at a casino, or a £2.5 million house.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

it's far more useful for RG than ever limiting the number of auto spins to 100

---------

On the subject of autospins, @Mark_32Red would it be possible to get the autospins back on Bonanza and WWTBAM pretty please

 

[Mr_Slot5]

If you have to borrow money for something, you cannot afford it. It is as simple as that. You might be able to afford the repayments, but at that point you cannot afford what you are buying, be it a £10 deposit at a casino, or a £2.5 million house.

Well quite. But take credit out of the equation and the whole economy collapses.

 

[lockinlove]

Hmm i think its ok i guess. Sure people can get around it if they really want but it will stop some tilt deposits and give the person time to chill out while they drive to do cash advance to buy a prepaid card or paysafe. Sucks for people who are responsible though. Casinos have always found a way around blocks and i am sure they will find a way to offer deposits to a 3rd party to transfer it through them