Corona virus - Covid 19 discussion

[sufferinsilence]

Likes all round, it's good to have a chat, so coronavirus is a 2019 respiratory illness, with similar symptoms to influenza, different family but both respiratory illnesses.

Never had flu I don't think, but had covid a little while back and it knocked me for six. I would definitely get vaccinated if I thought they worked, but stand by my own conclusion that something fishy is going on, and has been since the start, leading me back to my vote of no confidence in what is being pumped into people and the way it's being pushed.

Polio vaccine stopped polio, smallpox vaccine stops smallpox, covid vaccine ????????

I'm not debating the fact that one should or shouldn't get vaccinated. I've always made that clear in this thread that people should make their own decisions. Being a novel virus there would always be new discoveries the longer the virus is around. A lot of information we got in 2020 and therapeutics used back then are outdated now. I think that's how science works, minds evolving and all that

Every infection can knock you the f out and have nasty long lasting symptoms. There's plenty of people who catch the flu and feel fine a couple of days later but there's also a whole lot of people who end up in hospital. Luckily flu vaccines are better in preventing disease than covid ones (right now atleast).

I think it's been proven tho that hospitalisation and death have gone way down due to "mass" immunity, be it from being vaccinated or catching the virus.

What is tiring is the disinformation and out-of-context quotes and videos being spread time and time again.

 

[paul7388]

Likes all round, it's good to have a chat, so coronavirus is a 2019 respiratory illness, with similar symptoms to influenza, different family but both respiratory illnesses.

Never had flu I don't think, but had covid a little while back and it knocked me for six. I would definitely get vaccinated if I thought they worked, but stand by my own conclusion that something fishy is going on, and has been since the start, leading me back to my vote of no confidence in what is being pumped into people and the way it's being pushed.

Polio vaccine stopped polio, smallpox vaccine stops smallpox, covid vaccine ????????

Saw you mentioning flu vaccines earlier and how they stop flu.

The flu vaccine like the covid one does not always stop you getting flu.

Many still get flu after the vaccine but it is supposed to make it less severe and last less time. You just have to look at hospilitations and deaths during a major flu outbreak. Mostly elderly but most will have had the flu vaccine. Without the vaccine a severe flu outbreak would be a lot more severe. Tho personally i feel Coronavirus at the moment has mutated to a virus even milder than the flu. Not to say it will not get more severe in a new strain.

Also 10s of thousands die from flu in UK during a major flu outbreak even those fully vaccinated.

A lot of vaccines are produced to limit effects not stop most viruses. As Flu, and all sorts of coronaviruses change all the time it is near impossible to get a vaccine that will erradicate them. Whereas things like Polio, Smallpox etc. are mainly allways the same virus so easier to get a vaccine that will stop them as they will not mutate to new strains easily.

 

[bamberfishcake]

I'm not debating the fact that one should or shouldn't get vaccinated. I've always made that clear in this thread that people should make their own decisions. Being a novel virus there would always be new discoveries the longer the virus is around. A lot of information we got in 2020 and therapeutics used back then are outdated now. I think that's how science works, minds evolving and all that

Every infection can knock you the f out and have nasty long lasting symptoms. There's plenty of people who catch the flu and feel fine a couple of days later but there's also a whole lot of people who end up in hospital. Luckily flu vaccines are better in preventing disease than covid ones (right now atleast).

I think it's been proven tho that hospitalisation and death have gone way down due to "mass" immunity, be it from being vaccinated or catching the virus.

What is tiring is the disinformation and out-of-context quotes and videos being spread time and time again.

We are most definitely on opposite sides of the fence with our views on covid. Perhaps we should swap news sources for a week and see if it changes our opinions.

But, like you, I am also tired of disinformation and out-of-context quotes, like those peddled by the CDC, Fauci, MSM and politicians.

It's a shame we can't go back to the days when politics and big business feared journalists.

Changing the subject, but kind of linked to the misinformation and trust, the Jeffrey Epstein case is a first of its kind - the first case involving sex trafficking on such a scale where the perpetrators have not been named or faced trial.

I sometimes wonder if I am suffering the yesteryear generation curse, where the older you get the more distrusting and disgruntled you get with society. But these times are very different to what many generations before have seen. Society seems to have less and less grip on those that rule over them, and those that rule over, seem to have less and less scrutiny or consequences for their actions.

 

[bamberfishcake]

Saw you mentioning flu vaccines earlier and how they stop flu.

The flu vaccine like the covid one does not always stop you getting flu.

Many still get flu after the vaccine but it is supposed to make it less severe and last less time. You just have to look at hospilitations and deaths during a major flu outbreak. Mostly elderly but most will have had the flu vaccine. Without the vaccine a severe flu outbreak would be a lot more severe. Tho personally i feel Coronavirus at the moment has mutated to a virus even milder than the flu. Not to say it will not get more severe in a new strain.

Also 10s of thousands die from flu in UK during a major flu outbreak even those fully vaccinated.

A lot of vaccines are produced to limit effects not stop most viruses. As Flu, and all sorts of coronaviruses change all the time it is near impossible to get a vaccine that will erradicate them. Whereas things like Polio, Smallpox etc. are mainly allways the same virus so easier to get a vaccine that will stop them as they will not mutate to new strains easily.

I also mistrust the flu vaccine, probably should have said

The kids and me are not vaccinated against flu either.

Would be nice to know the percentage of vaccines that worked, and see if these ones that don't are a recent thing, maybe I can ask Fauci and the CDC, they would know

p.s. sorry, I kind of missed the smallpox thing. But isn't Monkeypox a variation, or new strain of Smallpox? I'm off to google before you can answer, then I will come back and delete this p.s. as if it never existed.

p.p.s. It is from the same family, but I get what you mean about new strains of flu, covid and such. There tend to be more variants and mutations.

 

[Kroffe]

I think its still the case that natural infection + vaccine or booster offers best protection, but i think the difference is pretty small.
80+ and the ones at high risk for other reasons probably still benefit from that, but for under 50s that are otherwise healthy i dont really see a point with these new variants.

Imo it was different when it hit, because the vaccine even if it turned out to be a shit vaccine was doing a good job of keeping people out of the hospital.
But with the newer variants vaccinated & unvaccinated seem to be ending up in the hospital at about the same rate (counted per 100k pop) last time i checked. I dont really keep updated so its possible thats not the case any longer.
Even if the risk of side effects are small, if it no longer offers any meaningful protection against severe illness, what good is it?

I took the first 2 shots and a sore arm the day i took them is my extent of side effects (so far, knock on wood)
Impossible to say if i had any benefit from the vaccines, ive had Covid twice, first time was while the 2 shots still 'counted', second time was long after the 'best before date' had passed.
Symptoms were identical more or less, other than the fatigue that was much worse than from your average cold i just had mild cold symptoms, sniffles and sore throat.

It did feel very different than normal colds, i got so tired from walking DOWN the stairs to get some ice cream from the basement that i seriously considered just staying down there for the night.
Like how the hell was i supposed to get up the stairs if i was this tired from walking down.
Dont worry, i realized theres lots of spiders in the basement and the energy boost that provided carried me all the way back to the couch upstairs.
Thanks spiders, you helped me solve the problem that you caused, you all suck and my basement would be better place without you.

 

[sufferinsilence]

We are most definitely on opposite sides of the fence with our views on covid. Perhaps we should swap news sources for a week and see if it changes our opinions.

But, like you, I am also tired of disinformation and out-of-context quotes, like those peddled by the CDC, Fauci, MSM and politicians.

It's a shame we can't go back to the days when politics and big business feared journalists.

Changing the subject, but kind of linked to the misinformation and trust, the Jeffrey Epstein case is a first of its kind - the first case involving sex trafficking on such a scale where the perpetrators have not been named or faced trial.

I sometimes wonder if I am suffering the yesteryear generation curse, where the older you get the more distrusting and disgruntled you get with society. But these times are very different to what many generations before have seen. Society seems to have less and less grip on those that rule over them, and those that rule over, seem to have less and less scrutiny or consequences for their actions.

I think the biggest issue is that a pandemic was highly politicised.

Like I said in my previous reply we now know more about the virus than we did when it just emerged. Ofcourse the CDC and other instances are going to update their guidance and policies around it when they get more information and knowledge. It seems to me too many people want to compare what we're doing 2 and a half years into a pandemic to what we were doing in March 2020.

Have mistakes been made? I'm sure there were and still are. Has science gotten everything right on other diseases in the past? Pretty sure they didn't. It's way too easy to criticise those that research and try to provide the most accurate information at that time years later.

And if you think I don't read/watch different news sources or don't (skim)watch John Campbell's videos you're mistaken. Even tho a lot of these news sources are just opinion makers. Most shows (let's call them that) on Fox News, CNN, NewsMax, MSNBC,... are mostly opinions from whatever side they're on. Same goes for those that yell their opinions on Youtube.

 

[bamberfishcake]

And if you think I don't read/watch different news sources or don't (skim)watch John Campbell's videos you're mistaken

Didn't mean it the way it sounded. Think we are all influenced by what we see and who we watch, plucking out what we think is the truth and forming ideas.

I wonder if my own opinion would be different if I had watched the stuff that you do is probably a better way of putting it. I have gravitated toward stuff that some would say is 'conspiracy theory', and John Campbell may have pulled that Thai study out of his arse for all I know, but it just seemed so compelling and fact-based that I'm all in that there are concerns over side-effects, coupled with other concerns from other sources that seem to have no objective but fact.

Wish I knew more about it all really. My opinions are only formed by the stuff I take in as being factual.

 

[sufferinsilence]

Didn't mean it the way it sounded. Think we are all influenced by what we see and who we watch, plucking out what we think is the truth and forming ideas.

I wonder if my own opinion would be different if I had watched the stuff that you do is probably a better way of putting it. I have gravitated toward stuff that some would say is 'conspiracy theory', and John Campbell may have pulled that Thai study out of his arse for all I know, but it just seemed so compelling and fact-based that I'm all in that there are concerns over side-effects, coupled with other concerns from other sources that seem to have no objective but fact.

Wish I knew more about it all really. My opinions are only formed by the stuff I take in as being factual.

I like Dr. John's way of making videos, he's very factual and presents a variation of studies and opinions from throughout the world. If only more of those were around...

 

[mack341]

Plenty of vaccinated and not vaccinated people have caught covid more than once tho. Even those that had it in 2020.

Once more: Dr. Fauci is talking about the flu in this video, not covid. Everything else is what you want to make of what he says.

Come on you full well know I'm aware he's talking about the flu.

[This is not about whether uninfected people with no protection should get a covid vax or not]

Just suppose the interviewer asks instead "a lady has had covid for 14 days mr Fauci should they now get the vaccine?", the logic of his reply re protection should still apply.

But because the authorities wanted everyone to be vaccinated, regardless of need, they turned the advice on its head, fauci included.

People with antibodies from natural infection were treated as though it counted for nothing as opposed to people with antibodies from the vaccine, scientifically it made no sense.

 

[sufferinsilence]

Come on you full well know I'm aware he's talking about the flu.

[This is not about whether uninfected people with no protection should get a covid vax or not]

Just suppose the interviewer asks instead "a lady has had covid for 14 days mr Fauci should they now get the vaccine?", the logic of his reply re protection should still apply.

But because the authorities wanted everyone to be vaccinated, regardless of need, they turned the advice on its head, fauci included.

People with antibodies from natural infection were treated as though it counted for nothing as opposed to people with antibodies from the vaccine, scientifically it made no sense.

Not true. At least not here. People who had a natural infection and had tested positive got a recovery certificate after 10 days and it was valid just the same as a vaccination certificate. As far as I remember most countries, in Europe, accepted that for travel.

The reason they still recommended 1 vaccination after an infection is because apparently it made the immunity stronger.

I don't know the current guidelines, I guess most are dropped right now.

 

[mack341]

Not true. At least not here. People who had a natural infection and had tested positive got a recovery certificate after 10 days and it was valid just the same as a vaccination certificate. As far as I remember most countries, in Europe, accepted that for travel.

The reason they still recommended 1 vaccination after an infection is because apparently it made the immunity stronger.

I don't know the current guidelines, I guess most are dropped right now.

Ah well that may have been different in Belgium and Europe.

I never saw anything on the NHS, BBC, ITV or in the papers etc... mentioning the protection from natural infection. Maybe they didn't want to complicate the message.

Covid has become milder thank goodness.

If I were getting a vaccine, the bottomline I'm interested in is: does it protect me, not whether Mavis down the road is also vaccinated otherwise mine won't work as well.

 

[Kroffe]

Ah well that may have been different in Belgium and Europe.

I never saw anything on the NHS, BBC, ITV or in the papers etc... mentioning the protection from natural infection. Maybe they didn't want to complicate the message.

Covid has become milder thank goodness.

If I were getting a vaccine, the bottomline I'm interested in is: does it protect me, not whether Mavis down the road is also vaccinated otherwise mine won't work as well.

What the hell man, dont bring Mavis into this.

 

[mack341]

This is concerning, Labs working on viruses with 50% mortality trying to make them more transmissible, it's madness!

I know it is far fetched but I can see some people in power being tempted to unleash something like that [in the future], to depopulate the world in the name of protecting the environment/planet.

Their defence is they are doing 'gain of function' research to better understand and fight such a virus were it to occur naturally, must be a high risk way of learning.

 

[bamberfishcake]

Funny how one of the worst things about covid is that it is highly contagious. You would think it was engineered in a lab experimenting on making viruses more transmittable if we didn't know better.

Glad we can trust in our leaders and systems.

 

[goatwack]

The long-delayed Government Covid Inquiry begins in earnest today, as it is beamed live now as I type.

Will be interesting to see how much blame is apportioned, and to whom, even if by and large, the UK's restrictions and so forth were comparatively modest in relation to other countries', when all's said and done.

But there was certainly a litany of failings and overreaction, and so we'll see what comes of it. Personally, I think it'll be passed off as having done everything to the letter, it was unavoidable etc

But certainly worth seeing, if only to watch Boris testify, Chris Whitless, Matt Handcock etc

 

[goatwack]

Feels somewhat quaint to be the only one left in these highly decorated pages!

ECHO

ECHO

ECHO

That aside, Bwoston Uni scientists have been hard at work creating an 80% fatality efficacy strain of Covid, though obviously tested on mice beforehand.

Also worth noting that strains of numerous diseases are tested here, so in itself is nothing new. Ebola, SARS and diseases of that ilk, highly virulent, dangerous etc

One could also argue that in order to find the most effective way of countering a disease's most dangerous form that it would aid in negating its potency, via perfecting antidotes, vaccines and so forth. 'Beat' it at its most dangerous, and it becomes under some form of control.

Yet the possibility remains that dabbling in such highly concentrated variants could just as easily lead to another human error, another type of lab leak, and so begins the world's being in the grip of fear, again.

Necessary, or reckless and irresponsible?.....

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[dionysus]

Gosh, I'm so behind the curve.
I though the conversation was now monkey pox and w/e new kitty kisses gave a new strain of herpes

 

[mack341]

Feels somewhat quaint to be the only one left in these highly decorated pages!

ECHO

ECHO

ECHO

That aside, Bwoston Uni scientists have been hard at work creating an 80% fatality efficacy strain of Covid, though obviously tested on mice beforehand.

Also worth noting that strains of numerous diseases are tested here, so in itself is nothing new. Ebola, SARS and diseases of that ilk, highly virulent, dangerous etc

One could also argue that in order to find the most effective way of countering a disease's most dangerous form that it would aid in negating its potency, via perfecting antidotes, vaccines and so forth. 'Beat' it at its most dangerous, and it becomes under some form of control.

Yet the possibility remains that dabbling in such highly concentrated variants could just as easily lead to another human error, another type of lab leak, and so begins the world's being in the grip of fear, again.

Necessary, or reckless and irresponsible?.....

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I have to agree with my new political chum old Dom

 

[bamberfishcake]

I have to agree with my new political chum old Dom

Although it made me laugh. That is exactly what they should be doing with these labs.

Why are we creating deadly diseases in the name of research?

Is it like the nuclear deterrent? Where we have to have a nuclear bomb to end the world, just in case someone else ends the world with a nuclear bomb?

Just one weaponised mistake, nuclear or biological, and we could wreck the earth. Shouldn't have this kind of stuff. It's an unnecessary risk and I just cannot see the point of such research.

 

[bamberfishcake]

 

[bamberfishcake]

And it gets better - A new strain of Covid is being tested that kills 80% of lab rats/mice.

 

[mack341]

 

[mack341]

If true the pharma people were clearly nuts [and up to no good], a requirement for a 3 monthly booster would fit nicely alongside a digital pass, denying you access to services etc... if you didn't comply each quarter.

The Govt ministers did at one point reassure shops and essential things like banks would always remain access for all, but other things would require the covid pass.

Possibly the vaccine just didn't work well enough at preventing transmission for this covid pass policy to roll out, the logic of the unvaccinated being the only spreaders couldn't stand up.

 

[goatwack]

Overhearing the missus talk to a receptionist merely the other day, it was brought up how amazingly, influenza had all but disappeared during the height of the pandemic.

"Well, the masks you see, they prevented its spread!" - receptionist

I did facepalm internally for a second, before trying to drown out their conversation by pacing the room wildly. But to no avail, as I couldn't un-hear it!

Fact is it would be foolhardy to assume that'd be the end of the Covid drive, as Pharma seeks to replicate what went before. They may not cause populations to be in the same grip of panic as previously, nor will politicians and 'experts' on all sides think they're not completely knowledgeable about the whole thing, but I expect the 'Vaxxer vs Anti-vaxxer' lines to have long been drawn, and more societal splits to follow for

.....the next 'wave' of Covid

 

[mack341]

In one way I find it hard to believe the uk govt thought they could successfully bring in a vax pass society, but other european countries were further down the road, people having a coffee outside in the fresh air having their phones checked by gendarmes to ensure they were vaxxed and the worse Austrian politicians bringing in a law that would fine unvaxxed people thousands each month until they complied.

They're apparently dozens of labs around the world doing coronavirus research, incl gain of function, the most alarming one recently in the news being in Boston where they created a covid strain with an 80% mortality rate.

We only need a lab leak from one of these and we're back where we were, the only difference most govts could not financially afford now to bring in a lockdown.